Is This Standard For Writers To Do? Capitalizing words

by nik0 Banned
30 replies
  • SEO
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I am ordering a lot of content at iWriter lately using the elite writers and provide the title as used on Amazon so they can easily find the product to do some research.

A title would look like:

Graco Secure Coverage Digital Baby Monitor with 1 Parent Unit

What the writers do is repeat that exact phrase 2 or 3 times throughout the content, capitalized all the way

Looks very spammy to me.

Isn't it basic English 101 that words as digital, baby, monitor, parent, unit shouldn't be capitalized, despite me providing it in that way as I simply copy the page title from Amazon for their reference as there are often many variations. But I would expect Elite and Elite+ writers, sometimes with rates as high as 4.9 (max 5) understand that concept automatically.

Seriously wonder who's wrong here? Them or me? It's not like they are terrible writers but this seems pretty much like a classic beginners mistake.
#capitalizing #standard #words #writers
  • Profile picture of the author italk
    --> What the writers do is repeat that exact phrase 2 or 3 times throughout the content, capitalized all the way.

    Writers do it in the title, but you are saying
    the words are capitalized in the body part?

    Well, then, you are clearly hiring the
    wrong set of writers.
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    • Profile picture of the author Icematikx
      It's a tricky one. Words like "Baby" and "Monitor" could rightfully be capitalized if those belong to the ACTUAL product name, and are not descriptive words.

      When they register their product, they will give an official name. For example:

      1) Niko Monitor
      2) Niko Digital Baby Monitor

      In case #2, the whole product name can be capitalized. In instance #1, Digital and Baby would be non-capitalized as it is not part of the product name, but instead descriptive words.
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      • Profile picture of the author nik0
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Icematikx View Post

        It's a tricky one. Words like "Baby" and "Monitor" could rightfully be capitalized if those belong to the ACTUAL product name, and are not descriptive words.

        When they register their product, they will give an official name. For example:

        1) Niko Monitor
        2) Niko Digital Baby Monitor

        In case #2, the whole product name can be capitalized. In instance #1, Digital and Baby would be non-capitalized as it is not part of the product name, but instead descriptive words.
        What is a product name?

        Example:

        Foscam FBM3501 Wireless Digital Video Baby Monitor - Pan/Tilt, Nightvision and Two-Way Audio with 3.5" LCD

        That's not a product name, that's a page title.

        And exactly these titles they repeat fully capitalized in the body of the content.

        And not just one, all of those writers there do it.

        I had some discussions about it with 4.95 rated elite writers that also receive $55 per article orders, and they hide behind "most customers want it like that", which is utter nonsense of course or they come up with: "It stands out better that way", for what.

        I have this other theory that they play games and outsource it to cheaper writers.

        Even after rewrite requests about half didn't get it, so I had to reject as I don't keep on wasting time on such individuals, and this were $2/100 words writers, left me completely stunned.
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        • Profile picture of the author Icematikx
          Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

          Foscam FBM3501 Wireless Digital Video Baby Monitor - Pan/Tilt, Nightvision and Two-Way Audio with 3.5" LCD
          That's rightfully capitalized as it is a title. There is no definitive right/wrong answer for titles I imagine.

          In terms of using it in the content, I personally would stick to "Foscam FBM3501" here, and keep the rest of the words non-capitalized unless they deserve one.

          English is a hard language to comprehend for some, and it takes a lot of mind power to compute correct capitalization.

          I've found the best way to find decent writers is to write an article yourself, and then give that as a guide for them to go off. I never expect new writers to just write. I will write one, or give them an example of my previous work, and expect them to match the level of competency. I'm awful for punishing poor grammar and spelling when it comes to formal articles that are supposed to be read.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
            Originally Posted by Icematikx View Post

            That's rightfully capitalized as it is a title. There is no definitive right/wrong answer for titles I imagine..
            More or less right but you could make the argument that everything after the dash is not.

            At any rate I don't think they are wrong as much as is claimed.- the name of a product is capitalized.

            I"v e found a few good writers at hirewriters but you have to be ready to reject like crazy until you find some keeper.but yeah iwriters was the pits regardless .
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        • Profile picture of the author AmanD
          Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

          What is a product name?


          I have this other theory that they play games and outsource it to cheaper writers.

          This definitely happens. You can see the stats of some of their most profilic elite writers, and they're writing about 20 articles a day. There's no way they are doing it themselves.

          In fact, I seem to remember a WSO that was released here at some point that was teaching people to do exactly that kind of arbitrage.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stevie C
    Yes I've had some writers do this, I think some of them tend to write reviews like it was still 2011! I normally find my self rewriting and adding to reviews that are written for me anyway. Normally about 10-15 minutes to add a bit more and get it up to scratch, sometimes I am pleasantly surprised and it is a good review right of the bat.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Stevie C View Post

      Yes I've had some writers do this, I think some of them tend to write reviews like it was still 2011! I normally find my self rewriting and adding to reviews that are written for me anyway. Normally about 10-15 minutes to add a bit more and get it up to scratch, sometimes I am pleasantly surprised and it is a good review right of the bat.
      Funny enough all writers I know from personal contacts never do it like this but at sites like iWriter they all do it. A dozen different ones in a row, I'm not kidding or exaggarating here, pissed me off as hell, my whole plan and day was ruined lol.

      I think thats the way to go yes as most of the reviews were actually pretty good except for that thing, however there were also quite a few real high rated writers that were clearly lazy as hell, for example some sentences they just copied from review one to review two, how absurd is that and that was the highest rated writer I ever had.
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  • Profile picture of the author BlackGecko
    I would not capitalize anything. This strategy is based on the Adwords Ad Quality score, I guess google try's to implant the same "practices" within its SEO algorithm..
    And when you think about it Capital Letters is naturally spammy so.. Makes sense Google wouldn't like it...
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  • Profile picture of the author Kevin Maguire
    Originally Posted by nik0 View Post


    iWriter

    Elite and Elite+ writers.
    See there's your mistake, right there.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Kevin Maguire View Post

      See there's your mistake, right there.
      I know many suggest Textbroker but I just can't stand their margins, client pays $2,40, writer receives $1,40. Doesn't feel right, not that I feel sorry for the writer but would make me feel stupid.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    I think this is about the 3rd or 4th thread I have seen you post complaining about iWriter.

    So here's a question.... Why do you keep going back?

    They suck for content. Everyone knows they suck for content.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      I think this is about the 3rd or 4th thread I have seen you post complaining about iWriter.

      So here's a question.... Why do you keep going back?

      They suck for content. Everyone knows they suck for content.
      Only the second thread.

      Yesterday I tested their elite writers for the first time and I was very happy at first, Now I placed an order for 70 articles and found out each of them contained these basic mistakes.

      I always have to try for myself.

      I don't expect hire writers to be any better, here at this forum I get scammed over and over or they outsource it to these places, and the textbroker margins feel like a huge ripoff, I emailed them for bulk discount though and they got back to me but wanted to call me 3am at night to discuss, when I requested a different time cause I live in thailand I never heard from them again.

      My own writers are too busy and most are not that great either.

      So one last place to look are freelancer sites like oDesk.
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      • Profile picture of the author EdwardDennis
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        My own writers are too busy and most are not that great either.
        And yet you're gonna launch a content writing service. Surely you've got a long way to go Nik.
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Originally Posted by EdwardDennis View Post

          And yet you're gonna launch a content writing service. Surely you've got a long way to go Nik.
          I build it up slowly, there's no urge, first I need tons of content for myself, once that is done I should have a healthy amount of decent writers.

          My SEO service changed to a lease model so once everyone has their links (we're reaching the final stage now) I won't need much new content and when my authority sites are complete in 2, 3 months I'll have anoher batch of writers available for my new project.

          And the good thing, those are tested writers, I don't follow iWriters / HireWriters concept, which means you can't get $3/500 word articles at my platform. We do the pre-filtering and proof reading instead wihout charging huge margins like textbroker so I think we're able to fill some gap.

          It's a long term project for me and I don't have to live from it, though I do expect it to turn in a profit of $10k+/month in 3 years time. Realistic? No idea but we just try. I'm already happy if it breaks-even in the first year. I also have 3, 4 oher services and when people purchase that they receive free credits at our writing platform to give it a try.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    You know that course of mine that you liked to bash and claim you got nothing out of...

    There's a pretty solid method in there for finding good, yet affordable writers.

    It's not something you can do overnight, but long-term it is the way to go for a business such as yours.

    And I'm not about to say it publicly because the more people know about it, the harder it will be for all of us to find the good ones.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      You know that course of mine that you liked to bash and claim you got nothing out of...

      There's a pretty solid method in there for finding good, yet affordable writers.

      It's not something you can do overnight, but long-term it is the way to go for a business such as yours.

      And I'm not about to say it publicly because the more people know about it, the harder it will be for all of us to find the good ones.
      Point is I'm in a hurry, as always, and I need huge amounts of content.

      I want to scale big time, looks like I just have to hire some proofreaders.

      As for your guide, yes I did read that before somewhere on this very forum, point is I truly hate how sites like oDesk work, on top of that they locked my account again due to being idle for x monhs, hit up their chat, told the support employee that I was aware of the reason why I was locked and the ****** just left the chat, after that I was really done wih them.

      Anyway have to accept things won't go as easy as I wish for.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    Yeah, if you are in a hurry, you are screwed. I would probably spend the extra cash and go to Text Broker then. If it is a long-term project, you'll make the money back.

    iWriter is just awful.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      Yeah, if you are in a hurry, you are screwed. I would probably spend the extra cash and go to Text Broker then. If it is a long-term project, you'll make the money back.

      iWriter is just awful.
      Gonna try turn some people into proofreaders, and then order the cheaper content from iwriter/hirewriter, as it go's to much against my will to enrich Textbrokers without any guarantee that they don't do the same (outsource to cheap and proofread it).

      Exaclty that happened many times to me on his forum as well.

      People are lazy, always looking for shortcuts, some say SEO is scammy, writing niche is 10 times worse and the main reason is that one person can only write so much, lack of growth for most mediocre writers. I do have some very decent writers though, but volume is a big issue with them.

      Content is needed for 3 purposes, link building content which doesn't have o be great, just free of spelling/grammar issues. Feeder site conent, eg small Amazon sites to rank and sell as well (15-30 pages large), some build on expired high PR domains, and 100-150 page authority sites for the long run but right now it's going way too slow for my likings, especially if I want to sell such sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author trevord92
    Why not specify how you want it in the special instructions section in iWriter?

    Most writers there (even the basic level ones) follow the instructions you give.

    The clearer you are with them on what you want, the better the results you'll get.
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by trevord92 View Post

      Why not specify how you want it in the special instructions section in iWriter?

      Most writers there (even the basic level ones) follow the instructions you give.

      The clearer you are with them on what you want, the better the results you'll get.
      I will not provide Amazon titles anymore and I have rewritten my instructions as well.

      Feels kind of lame to have to explain to an Elite writer that only brands, models, city's, places, names should be capialized, as that's about the first thing I learned at school during our basic English lessons when I was 12 years old, but like Yukon said, it's jus ignorance of them, easy to copy/paste the title a few times to reach kw densitys that I didn't ask for.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

    What the writers do is repeat that exact phrase 2 or 3 times throughout the content, capitalized all the way
    Maybe The Writer Is Ignorant?
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      Maybe The Writer Is Ignorant?
      So that is what the 'i' stands for...
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  • Profile picture of the author Craig B
    Although I find the quality better overall at HireWriters than iWriter, sometimes it can take a while to get an article written as there are not nearly as many writers on that site.

    Seems like each writing site has its own set of pros and cons.
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    • Profile picture of the author cbwarrior
      Originally Posted by Craig B View Post

      Although I find the quality better overall at HireWriters than iWriter, sometimes it can take a while to get an article written as there are not nearly as many writers on that site.

      Seems like each writing site has its own set of pros and cons.
      I'm a bit late to post a reply in this thread, but I thought I would anyways. I run HireWriters.com.

      The reason we may not have as many writers as other sites, is that we are pretty selective when it comes to accepting writers.

      - We only accept writers from a handful of countries (US, UK, AU, CA, NZ and Ireland)
      - We perform several checks on the prospective writers to verify their writing ability
      - We manually review all writers

      Also keep in mind, in order to compete in the space I'm in, you have to keep your rates pretty low, so sometimes it can be a challenge to retain writers.

      Over time we have built up a great group of thousands of talented writers however.

      Our goal is to have the best possible writers at the lowest possible cost. So while it may take a bit longer for a job to be completed on average compared to some other sites, you are probably more likely to get quality content from us compared to our competitors.
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  • Profile picture of the author seoboyz01
    What it looks like to me is a situation where a writer might have written the article/review using a generic 'keyword' (for instance, 'baby monitor', that's just an example). And, then after the review/article was completed, they went back and inserted the phrase you provided using the search/replace function of the word processor. I can't think of another way to justify how every writer is doing that from the same site though, except maybe how it's part of the guidelines writers must comply with there.
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  • Profile picture of the author Hemanth Malli
    Capitalization is not a good friend to the Google as we know capitalization must be done according to the sentence other then that if you are using at inappropriate way then it wont be a positive thing to the Google.
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    • Profile picture of the author seoboyz01
      Originally Posted by Hemanth Malli View Post

      Capitalization is not a good friend to the Google as we know capitalization must be done according to the sentence other then that if you are using at inappropriate way then it wont be a positive thing to the Google.
      Google could care less if you capitalize or all caps every word in a sentence. You could rank with or without proper use of capitals. At this point, Google is more focused on specific word combinations used and context of words.
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  • Profile picture of the author paulch65
    Try Craigslist .

    I hear guru is good for writers.

    Also reddit jobs board --- as lots of colleague students who can write well with guidance.
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  • Profile picture of the author WDR
    I've used iWriter a few times. Although I can write my own content, I get stuck for ideas sometimes and they usually produce something that gets me past the slump. I rewrite and add to pretty much everything I get from iWriter, but it still helps to have that to start with. I've only tried an Elite + writer once, and I won't do that again. The results were no better than what I got from the standard writers and then he sent me hate mail because I didn't give him a perfect rating.
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