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Experienced PBN Guys -- This Happen To You Yet?

by momoneyman
21 replies
  • SEO
    • |
I've registered four deleted domains over the past two days only to notice this morning that godaddy has refunded and locked all the accounts I made for each site I registered.

Im using the arguably safest method for pbns by creating 1 registrar account per domain, using old owners info, and using paypal as payment.

Here is the message I recieved from godaddy:

Originally Posted by hatedaddy

To complete this verification request, please take a few moments to provide the payment method account holder's identification. Acceptable forms of identification are government issued photo documents, such as a driver's license or passport.

This process is not intended to implicate involvement in unauthorized purchase activity. Providing the requested documentation ensures the integrity of your payment method is preserved through substantial validation.
Now I dont exactly want to send them a scan of my ID, not just because I'm registering domains under real peoples names, but also because I don't like the idea of emailing my ID for any reason to anybody.

Has this happened to anyone and they found a way around it? Can I call/email and do the ole, "im registering on behalf of a client who's paying me to take care of all of this for him" kinda deal? Or should I let these domains die and not pursue this before they find out what I'm really doing?

This also makes me wonder if all registrars are going to start doing this eventually -- basically locking all accounts where paypal doesnt match registrant info.
#experienced #guys #happen #locked #pbn
  • Profile picture of the author kindsvater
    It has happened before:

    http://www.warriorforum.com/off-topi...give-them.html

    The request is directed at the ID for payment, not who the registered owner is.

    In the future use a different registrar. Personally, I wouldn't provide this information, but the question may be what triggered the red flag on your payments.

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  • Profile picture of the author Kingfish85
    I don't see what the problem is. When you go to the store and they ask for ID when using a credit card do you tell them no? This is up to the company, they are protecting themselves by verifying you are who you say you are. There's too much fraud in the domain & hosting industry, pretty much every company does it, at least "real" businesses.

    You also have just as much right to refuse the requested documents as they do to refuse service.
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  • Profile picture of the author nettiapina
    Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

    Now I dont exactly want to send them a scan of my ID, not just because I'm registering domains under real peoples names, but also because I don't like the idea of emailing my ID for any reason to anybody.
    I think it's likely that your payment was flagged for some reason. Perhaps because you've registered several accounts, and using the same payment information across them? I'd consider that a red flag.

    However, the thing you describe here might be a problem too. As far as I know ICANN requires that the domain registrars try to make sure that the registrant information is accurate. Most of the time registrants got no way to know that, but if you're using "real peoples names" from old orders it seems like something that could be an issue.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    This kind of thing is why I have been telling people to stay away from registering domains with fake information. ICANN is cracking down on this.

    You were lucky it was just deleted domains. If it had been auctioned domains, you might be out a lot more money.
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    • Profile picture of the author godoveryou
      Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

      This kind of thing is why I have been telling people to stay away from registering domains with fake information. ICANN is cracking down on this.

      You were lucky it was just deleted domains. If it had been auctioned domains, you might be out a lot more money.
      Yep ^^^

      Plus, how did you think buying a bunch of products in different people's names from a single vendor but having them all tied to the same form of payment would work anyways? I mean, that's just idiotic... unless phrases like asset protection, fraud prevention and loss prevention are all new terms to you.
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      • Profile picture of the author momoneyman
        Originally Posted by godoveryou View Post

        Yep ^^^

        Plus, how did you think buying a bunch of products in different people's names from a single vendor but having them all tied to the same form of payment would work anyways? I mean, that's just idiotic... unless phrases like asset protection, fraud prevention and loss prevention are all new terms to you.
        Well, thats what may happen if you had many clients and ran a website creation service.

        What is the alternative? Using your name behind whois protecction in one big registrar account that holds 50 domains each or something per registrar.....I can only assume that is a massive google footprint either now or in the future.
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        • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
          Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

          What is the alternative? Using your name behind whois protecction in one big registrar account that holds 50 domains each or something per registrar.....I can only assume that is a massive google footprint either now or in the future.
          Actually, if it is with GoDaddy or Namecheap, I would say that is not a large footprint.

          First of all, privacy is being used more and more by people not building networks just to avoid a lot of the spam that comes with domain ownership. For the domains that I do not have privacy on, I get a shit-ton more spam email as well as a bunch snail mail constantly. So it is becoming a pretty common thing for a site to have whois privacy on it.

          If you are using large privacy providers like the ones GoDaddy and Namecheap use, it won't look all that uncommon. If you are using smaller registrars which use tiny privacy companies most people have never heard of, then yes, having 50 sites with that same tiny privacy company linking to your domain could be a footprint.

          Having 50 that all use GoDaddy, which if I am not mistaken is the largest registrar in the world, is not a footprint unless those are the only 50 links you have. You mix those up with a bunch of other links, and it is not a footprint.
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          • Profile picture of the author Edwards WOrld
            Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

            Actually, if it is with GoDaddy or Namecheap, I would say that is not a large footprint.

            First of all, privacy is being used more and more by people not building networks just to avoid a lot of the spam that comes with domain ownership. For the domains that I do not have privacy on, I get a shit-ton more spam email as well as a snail mail constantly. So it is becoming a pretty common thing for a site to have whois privacy on it.

            If you are using large privacy providers like the ones GoDaddy and Namecheap use, it won't look all that uncommon. If you are using smaller registrars which use tiny privacy companies most people have never heard of, then yes, having 50 sites with that same tiny privacy company linking to your domain could be a footprint.

            Having 50 that all use GoDaddy, which if I am not mistaken is the largest registrar in the world, is not a footprint unless those are the only 50 links you have. You mix those up with a bunch of other links, and it is not a footprint.


            Master Mike...
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          • Profile picture of the author Winning34
            Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

            Actually, if it is with GoDaddy or Namecheap, I would say that is not a large footprint.

            First of all, privacy is being used more and more by people not building networks just to avoid a lot of the spam that comes with domain ownership. For the domains that I do not have privacy on, I get a shit-ton more spam email as well as a bunch snail mail constantly. So it is becoming a pretty common thing for a site to have whois privacy on it.

            If you are using large privacy providers like the ones GoDaddy and Namecheap use, it won't look all that uncommon. If you are using smaller registrars which use tiny privacy companies most people have never heard of, then yes, having 50 sites with that same tiny privacy company linking to your domain could be a footprint.

            Having 50 that all use GoDaddy, which if I am not mistaken is the largest registrar in the world, is not a footprint unless those are the only 50 links you have. You mix those up with a bunch of other links, and it is not a footprint.
            I'm confused as to why OP thinks that 50 domains all with the same registrar and with private whois could be linked together at all. OP is saying that he thinks it leaves a footprint because there is the same owner. But if they all have private whois, then you don't get to see the owner is anyway. (Or have I misunderstood completely?!)

            Like you said, I know loads of people who use private whois for the very reason it was created. - They don't want nosy people looking up where they live, calling them, trying to scam them etc etc.
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            • Profile picture of the author momoneyman
              Originally Posted by Winning34 View Post

              I'm confused as to why OP thinks that 50 domains all with the same registrar and with private whois could be linked together at all. OP is saying that he thinks it leaves a footprint because there is the same owner. But if they all have private whois, then you don't get to see the owner is anyway. (Or have I misunderstood completely?!)

              Like you said, I know loads of people who use private whois for the very reason it was created. - They don't want nosy people looking up where they live, calling them, trying to scam them etc etc.
              There are two reasons for concern:

              1. There is an idea that google is a registrar and can therefore see through private whois. Then if not, there is also the idea on whether they have a deal with big brand registrars to see this information. Unless it is illegal, with the vast amount of wealth and power google has it doesnt seem all that farfetched to assume this may be happening--especially considering all the other privacy sniffing they do.

              2. It is uncommon for real companies to use private whois. Most companies will even have their full address details in contact info as well.

              My biggest concern is option 1.

              Ideally using proxies and a 1 account per 1 domain would be the safest, but it is getting tiresome and now causing some issues for me. Therefore, I am trying to figure out if doing what Mike says is okay or not. Clearly for him its working so far.
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              • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
                Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

                There are two reasons for concern:

                1. There is an idea that google is a registrar and can therefore see through private whois. Then if not, there is also the idea on whether they have a deal with big brand registrars to see this information. Unless it is illegal, with the vast amount of wealth and power google has it doesnt seem all that farfetched to assume this may be happening--especially considering all the other privacy sniffing they do.
                I have hundreds of domains of my own plus another few hundred I have helped others to setup. This has never been a problem.

                Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

                2. It is uncommon for real companies to use private whois. Most companies will even have their full address details in contact info as well.
                It is not as uncommon as you think. Yes, it is uncommon for huge companies like Amazon, Wal-Mart, Best Buy, etc. to use privacy, but they don't care about spam. They have drones to handle it. Smaller companies do care though.

                Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

                My biggest concern is option 1.

                Ideally using proxies and a 1 account per 1 domain would be the safest, but it is getting tiresome and now causing some issues for me. Therefore, I am trying to figure out if doing what Mike says is okay or not. Clearly for him its working so far.
                Proxies plus 1 account per 1 domain? Jesus that would be time consuming. It will not work though. If you want to do that, you need 1 account and 1 payment method per domain. If you are using the same payment method over multiple accounts, the registrar will catch you every single time.

                Just use 1 account. If you really want to take the risk with fake registration information, you can do that for each domain within the same account. Then you won't run into problems with the payment issue.

                For the proxy, I don't know why you think you need those. Google cannot see what IP you were using when accessing GoDaddy, Namecheap, or any other registrar. If you are using the proxies because you think it keeps you safe from the registrar realizing you are the same person, again the payment method is your real problem.
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            • Profile picture of the author yukon
              Banned
              Originally Posted by Winning34 View Post

              But if they all have private whois, then you don't get to see the owner is anyway.
              That's debatable, my spidey sense says Google takes a peak behind the curtain on whois info, with or without privacy.
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              • Profile picture of the author Winning34
                Originally Posted by yukon View Post

                That's debatable, my spidey sense says Google takes a peak behind the curtain on whois info, with or without privacy.
                Yeah, I see your point
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              • Profile picture of the author momoneyman
                Originally Posted by yukon View Post

                That's debatable, my spidey sense says Google takes a peak behind the curtain on whois info, with or without privacy.
                I can't tell if you're being a smartass or not

                If you're being serious then this is why I have avoided the master account with alternative WHOIS info -- simply because the master accounts email is always displayed for contact info on every new domain you register.

                On the other hand if you go through the trouble of creating a new email for every domain you register in the master account, then you might as well just create new accounts all together, as the multiple emails are the real time issue and annoyance with a 1:1 regsitrar account to domain ratio that I talked about in OP.
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        • Profile picture of the author nettiapina
          Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

          Well, thats what may happen if you had many clients and ran a website creation service.

          What is the alternative?
          He's talking about registering several accounts. Just have the domains or sites under your main one. Open several web hotels under that account if you need to. That should be fine with them, but registering multiple accounts with the same payment information seems fishy.

          Originally Posted by momoneyman View Post

          Ideally using proxies and a 1 account per 1 domain would be the safest, but it is getting tiresome and now causing some issues for me.
          Stop for a moment to consider what you're doing. That's exactly what a spammer or scammer would do. If you're behind proxies it's only going to make it look worse from the registrant's point of view. GoDaddy is just trying to protect your credit card. That's what they're supposed to do.

          In my opinion you're a bit too paranoid. I think it's more likely that Google's algorithms are going to find your PBN.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mr Lim
    He's thinking you're trying to spam or scam or bad stuff you're working on.
    Just work on a private whois, what's the deal with so many account.
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  • Profile picture of the author CPABeyondNetwork
    I bought a domain name on Godaddy a year ago and they asked me to send ID, passport, drivers license and picture of my CC, I sent them ID and drivers license but they wanted CC picture.. Lol. I didn't send them, I just bought domain with other registrar.


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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    One guy doesn't know what he's doing so they're cracking down.

    Duh, Obviously Godaddy is looking at OPs IP & payment method spread out over multiple accounts [yawn].

    Even If you forget PBNs, Godaddy sucks.
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  • Profile picture of the author SEOWizard417
    Sounds like they flagged for using same ip or payment method with multiple accounts. Try going with namecheap or getting privacy like others have recommended.
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  • Profile picture of the author l1one
    Why don't you just stay away from Godaddy and use Namesilo.com or Dynadot.com . Better pricing and interfaces too in my opinion.
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    • Profile picture of the author wedreamseo
      Banned
      People are as paranoid as they can be, even if you don't use whois information and leave all the information out in the open it's not a footprint Google's algorithm looks at.

      Sure if they are after your network then it would be easy to detect obviously, but Google isn't going after every smallish network out there so what most are doing is a complete overkill, even whois privacy would be overkill for small network owners.
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