43 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}
43 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}

Is keyword research realy this simple?

by Joe Ray
40 replies
  • SEO
    • |
I was never interested in SEO, but now that we are developing a new website for our company, I decided to learn a little bit about keywords.

I basically don't know much about this stuff, I just watched a couple of videos on Youtube, and I am familiar with the google keyword planner tool. That's it. That said, being a software engineer, I will want to automate this process for my self.

So, my question is:
When selecting keywords, my goal should be to look for keywords with the highest Estimated Impressions & Clicks and the lowest Competition?

Is this it? Is the principle really this simple?
#keyword #realy #research #simple
Avatar of Unregistered
  • Profile picture of the author expmrb
    In one sentence you can put it like that yeah. But its not that easy to find low competition and high demand keywords.
    Signature
    SEO Motionz Forum & Blog- Digital Marketing Forum & Blog,
    Forum Management & Promotion, SEO Tips, Money Making tips etc.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221769].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Joe Ray
      Thanks for your answer.

      So, if I type a keyword in the keyword planner tool, then 1) download the CSV file with all the data for that keyword 2) write a code to looks for high impression and low competition keywords, then that should do the trick, right?

      What about Estimated Clicks, should I consider this as well?
      Signature

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221774].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author expmrb
        Originally Posted by Joe Ray View Post

        Thanks for your answer.

        So, if I type a keyword in the keyword planner tool, then 1) download the CSV file with all the data for that keyword 2) write a code to looks for high impression and low competition keywords, then that should do the trick, right?

        What about Estimated Clicks, should I consider this as well?
        Yeah you should consider clicks too.
        Signature
        SEO Motionz Forum & Blog- Digital Marketing Forum & Blog,
        Forum Management & Promotion, SEO Tips, Money Making tips etc.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221821].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author st0nec0ld
    Not that easy, for me up until now keyword research is still a puzzle for me. On the other hand, as far as I know keyword research are most likely to work on businesses/sites that are involved in paid ads campaign. But yeah, to answer your question, high search volume but low competition level.
    Signature

    12BET | Live Casino Malaysia

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221788].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author JosephPMorris
    Simple answer yes. But it has a big definition into Keyword research. Like good and bad keyword. Good like targeted Keyword, and Bad like Law quality keyword.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221826].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author norasetia
    I don't think that keyword research is that simple. If it would be that much simple then every other person will call himself a digital marketer or SEO specialist. Your concept of highest Estimated Impressions & Clicks and the lowest Competition is correct but finding the perfect keyword which can bring traffic to your website is a tricky job.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221931].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kate H Smith
    Banned
    Yes, your goal is correct. However, it is not that easy to find those keywords.

    For me, keywords are important, if you have a review website or if you are trying to promote your service. But, if you are trying to earn 'real' engagement and want people to follow you, sometimes it is necessary to think creatively.

    There are lots of people who don't ponder about keywords and indeed earn a lot more who follow keyword strategy religiously. In fact, I have those clients too who try to present that 'new', jaw-dropping concept/title which can attract attention and get shares and likes as well on social media.

    So, it all depends.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11221958].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Tony Marriott
    Yes, keyword research is actually pretty easy. But people really get bogged down with it. I really not sure why. Maybe because there is so much data available and everyone wants that 'perfect keyword' that will make them rich.

    The reality is that that time has long gone and things are much more a long game these days.

    First make sure you fully understand the basics of keyword research.

    See https://moz.com/beginners-guide-to-seo/keyword-research

    You aren't looking for one keyword, you are looking for many related keywords.

    To find a good keyword you need to understand it's value.
    Value = monthly searches * EPC

    EPC (or cpc) is used as 'guestimate' value for the popularity of the keyword by advertisers. If advertisers are paying more for a keyword they generally expect to make more. Therefore the higher the EPC the higher the keyword value.

    Multiply that by the amount of monthly searches and you have some sort of comparison you can use to decide if one keyword is better than another.

    IT IS NOT A REAL VALUE and you will not make that money.

    So now you have a relative 'value' and you need to know how hard it is to rank for that keyword.

    NOTE: The 'difficulty' measure in the Google Keyword Planner is a measure of the ad difficulty NOT the organic ranking difficulty. They are often very different.

    Check the top ten pages for any keyword and see who is raking. If it is a bunch of major players or brands then it will be tough. Try also looking at the PA (Moz Page Authority) of the top 10 competitors. This gives you an idea of how strong the backlinks are and what you will need to achieve to rank on page one.

    At the end of the day you will only get an 'idea' of a good keyword. Only trying to rank and monetize it will prove it's worth.

    That leads into 'searcher intent' which is a whole new subject but very relevant in keyword research but too much to cover here.
    Remember ranking comes from content and backlinks, You can break those down if you like but that's the core.
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222016].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Joe Ray
      Yes, keyword research is actually pretty easy. But people really get bogged down with it. I really not sure why. Maybe because there is so much data available and everyone wants that 'perfect keyword' that will make them rich.

      The reality is that that time has long gone and things are much more a long game these days.

      First make sure you fully understand the basics of keyword research.

      See https://moz.com/beginners-guide-to-seo/keyword-research

      You aren't looking for one keyword, you are looking for many related keywords.

      To find a good keyword you need to understand it's value.
      Value = monthly searches * EPC

      EPC (or cpc) is used as 'guestimate' value for the popularity of the keyword by advertisers. If advertisers are paying more for a keyword they generally expect to make more. Therefore the higher the EPC the higher the keyword value.

      Multiply that by the amount of monthly searches and you have some sort of comparison you can use to decide if one keyword is better than another.

      IT IS NOT A REAL VALUE and you will not make that money.

      So now you have a relative 'value' and you need to know how hard it is to rank for that keyword.

      NOTE: The 'difficulty' measure in the Google Keyword Planner is a measure of the ad difficulty NOT the organic ranking difficulty. They are often very different.

      Check the top ten pages for any keyword and see who is raking. If it is a bunch of major players or brands then it will be tough. Try also looking at the PA (Moz Page Authority) of the top 10 competitors. This gives you an idea of how strong the backlinks are and what you will need to achieve to rank on page one.

      At the end of the day you will only get an 'idea' of a good keyword. Only trying to rank and monetize it will prove it's worth.

      That leads into 'searcher intent' which is a whole new subject but very relevant in keyword research but too much to cover here.
      Remember ranking comes from content and backlinks, You can break those down if you like but that's the core.
      Thanks for your answer. This is really helpful! I appreciate it.

      You said:
      To find a good keyword you need to understand it's value.
      Value = monthly searches * EPC
      That sounds very interesting and I want to try it, but when I download the csv data from the keyword planning tool, I can only use the Estimated Impressions for any operations because the Avg. Monthly Searches is not a numeric value, it looks like this, 1K - 10K.

      So, you think I should try: Value = Estimated Impressions * CPC
      Or, that doesn't make sense?

      Thanks again for your help!
      Signature

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222420].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Tony Marriott
        Unfortunately you need to be running AdWord campaigns to get the monthly search volumes with the Google KWP. Otherwise you get 'ranges'. The theory is still the same but your estimates will be wider of course.

        You can also try other keyword tools to get the searches. Just Google google alternative keyword tools. Most have limited free versions so you may need to pay to access fully.

        Or you could use the Bing keyword tool. That gives you search numbers for Bing, which will be different to Google, but again it will be 'relative' data.

        At the end of the day you are just trying to give yourself a fighting chance or a slight edge over a wild guess.

        As I said before people get bogged down in the detail and specifics. You will only really learn the technique properly when you actually do it. So you need to make a decision an act on it. Win or lose you will learn. Choose half a dozen keyword and create a page to target each one. See what happens.
        Signature
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222679].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author raihan888
    It seems like a easy stuff but it is not, because you cannot choose your keyword by researching on the basis of one.You have to research it day after, you have to gather knowledge about trend,competition of that keyword.And one more thing, do not choose your keyword only depending on keyword planner tool. Use other tools also for choosing keywords
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222022].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Parm Sandhu
    The Good thing you can do is write your services keywords and synonyms of keywords and makke sure every specific services have 1 specific service target keyword e.g; digital marketing Melbourne, Online Marketing Melbourne, Internet Markketing Melbourne. This will help you rank and the BIG thing happens when you check your Google Search Console search queries and see in depth and optimize accordingly.

    Make sure you add Schema.org vocab.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222462].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author avemfly619619
    [DELETED]
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222751].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author jabedahmed
    Yeah it's a very easy thing, you can easily find any kind of keywords from keywards reserchs websites.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11222985].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author DABK
    Keep in mind that the competition levels given are for AdWords, not for SEO. So, if interested in keywords for SEO, they do not help.

    Also, what kind of site will you have? The AdWords competition, though it does not allow you to speak with certainty about SEO competition, does identify buying keywords, and the higher the competition level, the better for buying they are.

    But, for AdSense sites non-buying keywords work well. Non-buying keywords work well for other purposes.

    In other words, it's simple but not as simple as you think.

    Majestic SEO, if memory serves, assigned an SEO value to keywords. Don't know how they did it... You might want to research that, if you're going to build something like what you have in mind.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11223107].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Joe Ray
      Thanks for your answer.

      Just to make sure I understand you correctly; are you suggesting that for SEO purposes we shouldn't use low competition keywords? Instead, we should use highly competitive keywords?

      I understand that AdWords provides this data for those who are competing to buy keywords in a competitive keyword space. That being said, my logic was that, in AdWords the Competition data is indicating the competitiveness level for a given keyword, so I should be able to use this data for SEO as well.

      How can we use this data for SEO? My logic is based on the belief that it must be very difficult to rank for any highly competitive keyword. Thus, for SEO, it might be a better idea to find keywords with low Competition and high Estimated Impressions.

      Again, this is just my logic, I don't have any SEO background. As I mentioned, I am trying to learn this so I can use the most optimal keywords for my website.
      Signature

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11223357].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author DABK
        Your logic is good; the competitiveness score in Google keyword planner is for AdWords, which means, low competition for ads does not necessarily mean low competition for SEO.

        You find a keyword with low competition in adwords because only 2 or 3 outfits are willing to pay more than a few pennies. It's got 400 searches a month. Google does not serve ads at the top of the page. You're thinking you're getting 30% of those 400 searches, if you make it to #1.

        Except, 5 pages in the SERP's have good SEO. No matter what you do, you only make it to #6. To make it higher would cost you more than it's worth it. As number 6, you get only about 5% of those 400 searches, only 20 a month, that is.

        If you make $30 a sale, and you send 4 of those 20. With a good sale page, you make 0 to 1 sales a month, you make $0 to $30 a month, over a long period, say, $18/month on average. What's your profit if it takes you 2 hours of work to stay at #^ or if you have to pay $25 a month for SEO?

        Don't jump on me for the numbers, they favor you without being unrealistic... You'd be better off with your own numbers. And, yes, my scenario makes sense is you make $500 every time someone buys, for instance. Or $501, $502 or $732. It doesn't make sense if you're where most people are, pennies to $50 for one sales.

        Not only plausible, possible and likely scenario.

        Once upon a time, I started a site on remortgages... found keywords with low competition and SEO'd the heck of some of my pages... overkill actually. By the time I was done, tools like majestic seo and such were saying my keywords were too competitive... I did not care, it was me who had #1, 2 and 3 (yup, it was when Google would show 3 pages from the same site).

        But those keywords did not make sense any more for anyone with adsense and affiliate sites... Still made sense for actual loan officers and mortgage brokers... But other keywords were easier, no one tried...

        You judge if a keyword is worth it, from an SEO point of view, based on the number of visitors you think you're going to have if you make it to #1 in relation to how much it would cost to do that.

        And you know the cost by looking at how tough #1 is.

        Some keywords, because of the higher traffic and how much you make per sale, make sense if you only make it to #3 or 9.

        Originally Posted by Joe Ray View Post

        Thanks for your answer.

        Just to make sure I understand you correctly; are you suggesting that for SEO purposes we shouldn't use low competition keywords? Instead, we should use highly competitive keywords?

        I understand that AdWords provides this data for those who are competing to buy keywords in a competitive keyword space. That being said, my logic was that, in AdWords the Competition data is indicating the competitiveness level for a given keyword, so I should be able to use this data for SEO as well.

        How can we use this data for SEO? My logic is based on the belief that it must be very difficult to rank for any highly competitive keyword. Thus, for SEO, it might be a better idea to find keywords with low Competition and high Estimated Impressions.

        Again, this is just my logic, I don't have any SEO background. As I mentioned, I am trying to learn this so I can use the most optimal keywords for my website.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11223431].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Joe Ray
          Thanks again for your valuable advise. I appreciate it.

          You said:
          "Your logic is good; the competitiveness score in Google keyword planner is for AdWords, which means, low competition for ads does not necessarily mean low competition for SEO."
          Yes, I see your point. But, is there any other available data that is more useful to predict keyword effectiveness for SEO? My understanding is that the google keyword planner data is all we have to work with. So, we have to make the best of it.

          Or, is there any data that can be used more effectively for SEO?

          If not, then what if I write a machine learning code to find a pattern (coefficient) in this AdWords data? Something like a linear regression can determine association (not causation) between Competition, Estimated Clicks, Estimated Impressions and Estimated Average CPC.

          This wouldn't guarantee completely accurate predictions, but, even a 75% accuracy could possibly make a huge difference.

          Right now, I just wrote a quick code - no machine learning - just simply comparing Competition and Estimated Impressions. I feel like this is already helping me finding keywords with some potential.

          In your opinion, is there a better way to predict SEO value for keywords?
          Signature

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11227271].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author DABK
            Read
            https://nichehacks.com/buyer-keywords-list/
            https://searchengineland.com/mapping...ney-seo-270862
            https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jon-r...b_9649884.html
            https://backlinko.com/commercial-intent


            Originally Posted by Joe Ray View Post

            Thanks again for your valuable advise. I appreciate it.

            You said: Yes, I see your point. But, is there any other available data that is more useful to predict keyword effectiveness for SEO? My understanding is that the google keyword planner data is all we have to work with. So, we have to make the best of it.

            Or, is there any data that can be used more effectively for SEO?

            If not, then what if I write a machine learning code to find a pattern (coefficient) in this AdWords data? Something like a linear regression can determine association (not causation) between Competition, Estimated Clicks, Estimated Impressions and Estimated Average CPC.

            This wouldn't guarantee completely accurate predictions, but, even a 75% accuracy could possibly make a huge difference.

            Right now, I just wrote a quick code - no machine learning - just simply comparing Competition and Estimated Impressions. I feel like this is already helping me finding keywords with some potential.

            In your opinion, is there a better way to predict SEO value for keywords?
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233989].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Rajeshwari Raje
    Yes, It is easy only. first you should understood the business and then find the competitor keywords.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11223115].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author furqanarshad
    principle is simple but you have to adopt best performing keywords and their related keywords as well. You can not focus only on less competitive and high searched keywords because search trends changes with respect to time.
    i.e. If you are in education niche you can see the searches and competition improves on education paper related keywords in exam/thesis season.

    So its always good to focus on related keywords with the high searched keywords as well.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11224704].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author ezrankings
    Hi Joe Ray,

    Try to look for keywords with high impressions and clicks and medium competition.

    Try doing SEO for your website on medium competition keywords and later on move to high competition keywords. Make sure you do it keyword by keyword and keep the medium keywords intact. while doing this, you would have to make sure that you don't end up doing keyword stuffing. Else, Google can ban your website.

    Tip: To make sure you don't do keyword stuffing, in the long run, you can get rid of keywords which are not productive enough for you.
    Signature

    Grow your business with Digital Marketing Agency

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11224741].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Steven Henry01
    Hey Software Engineer,

    It's a simple process to analyze the keywords for the new websites. If you have eCommerce website you can target your products as a keywords. This is not matter keywords have good competition or not, you have just need to focus on keywords which have monthly searches and competition just not matter now days.

    Thanks & Regards,
    Steven
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11232823].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Manoj Negi
    If you are objective is get the ranking through SEO then after checking the keyword's avg. monthly searches in the Google Keyword Tool you can check the total results on Google too which will give you an idea that how much competition is there and how long it may take you to get the ranking for the specific keyword.

    I suggest, pick the combination of LOW, MEDIUM and HIGH keywords and run the SEO, you can easily get the top ranking on the Low competitive keywords which will start giving the traffic to your website in a couple of months and simultaneously you can work on the Medium and High competitive keywords.

    If you use all the high competitive keywords to do the SEO in the starting then you might have to wait for many months to see the website ranking.

    You can simply put your website URL in the Google keyword tool and the system will generate the relevant keywords for you then you can pick the desired ones after checking their competition level and avg. monthly searches.

    It's always good to work on the high impressions/clicks keywords but getting the top ranking on those keywords takes so much time.

    Hope this helps!
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233383].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Suraj Yadav
    Frist a fall, your keywords check the keywords planner then. proper choice in your competition keyword so 3 and 4 minimum words keyword then improve in keyword...,
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233472].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author avemfly619619
    not yet, You should try a different technique to research your keywords for you business.
    Signature
    digital marketing company in Delhi | seo company in Delhi | SMO Company in Delhi
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233543].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Rohaniamal4love
    Yes, but that is depend on your niche and competition of it.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233655].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author AlexPam
    A few questions:

    1. Do you know how to find out the lowest competition?
    2. Do you know how to work with long tails, broad, phrase, exact match keyword research?
    3. Do you know how to find synonyms, augmentation, etc.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11233690].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author dburk
    Hi Joe,

    In a word, no, it's not as simply as you were led to believe. The Keyword Planner Tool data is just the first, and easiest phase of keyword research, but less than half the data you need can be derived from that tool. The remaining data you need must be extracted from SERPs, and tools that analyze the content and SEO methods of your actual organic search competitors.

    Performing keyword research is pretty simple, understanding it and using it effectively is much more difficult for many marketers.

    How you use that data depends a great deal on your goal and the strategy that you choose to implement to reach that goal.

    A couple things to be aware of:

    1. Keyword Planner "competition" level is strictly advertiser competition in the auction for ad slots, and has absolutely nothing to do with SEO competition. There is often an inverse relationship between advertiser competition and SEO competition. You should never consider ad platform competition level a reliable indicator of SEO competition. You need to perform addition research to determine SEO competition, the Keyword Planner Tool does not contain that data.

    2. High relative bid prices and high competition levels in the Keyword Planner tool are usually a reliable indicator of commercial intent for a keyword. That is the best kind of terms to focus on SEO for an actual business enterprise. High competition/bid equates to high commercial intent and those terms tend to work well for bottom-of-the-funnel targeting strategies.

    Low advertiser competition keywords are often an indication of a high informational intent (low commercial intent), and those terms often have high SEO competition, so you have to look elsewhere to determine true SEO competition level. If you are using a top-of-the funnel.

    HTH,

    Don Burk
    Signature

    * Get Results - Outsource Your PPC Management |
    *     Don Burk Advertising & Marketing - www.donburk.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11234160].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jamel Hassell
    You want to search for keywords or phrases pertaining to your subject matter.
    what you also want to do is use the keyword planner to search for longtail keywords ,shortail keywords ,check for volume monthly searches etc. Keep in mind that keyword search is important but not as important as the value .
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11234162].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Marsha sarv
    It's easy if you know your website of blogs niche and targets with 100% surety. Then researching keyword became really easy.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11234530].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author sunpeaks589
    According to me you must select both Keywords some high competition and some Low competition will be good website ranking
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11234621].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author dragoshs
    everything has it's own complexity which will lead you to it's simplicity. basically you'll find yourself where you were at the beginning. got it?
    Signature

    => Top Latest Binary Options and Forex Live Signals
    => Earn free bitcoin

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11242204].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      Can I get some of whatever you're smoking?

      Originally Posted by dragoshs View Post

      everything has it's own complexity which will lead you to it's simplicity. basically you'll find yourself where you were at the beginning. got it?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11242380].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Joe Ray
      everything has it's own complexity which will lead you to it's simplicity. basically you'll find yourself where you were at the beginning. got it?
      You mean, when our perception of reality is complexifying faster and faster; this built-in acceleration of complexity will reach an omega point, generating some sort of a transcendental object caused by an inevitable implosion?
      Signature

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11245046].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Dinu007
    I think it depends on your experience.if you are beginner you should do more research
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11242852].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author chetanlegend
    Not at all, I believe that this is the toughest job in SEO, you'll be winner if you can choose those keywords generating business instead of picking up the search terms having high search volume.
    Signature
    prom dresses
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11244028].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author neal patel
    keyword research isn't this simple. you have to keep many thing in mind while choosing keywords.

    if you choose your keywords keep few points in mind like
    always choose keywords with medium or low competition and monthly searches should be high.
    don't choose high competition keyword or else it will be tough to be on the top with that particular keyword.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11244300].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Subho D
    Keyword research should be done in relevance to site information. For instance, you are selling cakes in London. In such a case, your keyword should look like "cakeshopLondon", "Londoncakeshop" etc.

    Google looks for keywords primarily while crawling and that is what you need to harness in your site.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11244328].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      I so hope you mean cake shop London and London cake shop!

      Originally Posted by Subho D View Post

      Keyword research should be done in relevance to site information. For instance, you are selling cakes in London. In such a case, your keyword should look like "cakeshopLondon", "Londoncakeshop" etc.

      Google looks for keywords primarily while crawling and that is what you need to harness in your site.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[11244904].message }}
Avatar of Unregistered

Trending Topics