I Learned My Lesson Building Backlinks too Fast!

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I just wanted to start this thread to let anyone know that doesn't that you can build backlinks too fast, Google will punish you.

My site was on the first page of Google 7th position and after i bought a backlink package that added 2,000 backlinks in 7 days it went to the last page.

So anyone who tells you to go crazy on backlinks that Google doesn't mind, does not know what they are talking about.

Now before i bought the package i read several times that you need to build your links slowly. Man, i wish i would have listened. Lesson learned.
#search engine optimization #backlinks #building #fast #learned #lesson
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    • That is the million dollar question. I don't know but if anyone has any experience with their site being sent to the nether regions and coming back i would love to hear about it.
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  • Yeh building backlinks too fast can be a problem as Google will see your site as spam. However, it also depends on the quality of the links your getting. I would pick quality over quantity all of the time.
  • Building backlinks fast is not a problem.


    The reason you've been penalized is because you RANDOMLY started getting 285 backlinks per day. You set off their spam filter. If you start from day one building 285 per day, and MAINTAIN it, you'll be fine.
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    • That's interesting, i did not know that. But i am going to build them slowly from now on. I just hope my sight will see the light of day again.
  • Building backlinks at a steady pace works with google. But too many will put up a red flag.

    Not only will google lower your ranking but your site can also get blacklisted for these actions.

    Google looks at this as a blackhat method for some reason.

    Im not sure if it is because they think it is a software people are using or just dont like fast link building in general.

    I have learned building tons of backlinks from bloggers seem to be ok but other methods for some reason search engines think your using some type of black hat voodoo tricks
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    • Google wants backlinks to build up naturally - from other people link to your site because they find your site credible. If you get so many of these "natural" links overnight, well you're either a god incarnate or you've been using some underhanded means to get yourself links. 99.9% of the time, Google is more likely to believe the latter.
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  • This probably should have gone here: Adsense / PPC / SEO Discussion Forum

    But regardless, I have a few questions for you.

    How old is your site?
    How long ago did this happen?
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    • My bad, i wan't thinking were to put it.

      My site is 2 maybe 3 months old and it happened a few weeks ago.
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  • I think you could have spread it over a longer period of time. Then there wouldn't be such an issue.
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    • Yes next time i buy a package i will do that for sure.
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  • I said this before and I'll say it again:

    IF this is truly a backLink Filter / Penalization / whatever, t has to be the most STUPID thing Google ever invented.

    Why?

    Cause we can track new sites EASILY and kill them.

    Since new sites get top rankings for a couple days, ALL we need to to is check a new site at top, mark URL, check whois data, and send a big blast of backlinks to send that site to hell.

    ****, i can even create a script to check recently bought domain names with my chosen keywords to send them to hell!!!

    Now, IF Google is doing this ****, it has to be the MOST STUPID idea out of Google headquarters.

    They can devaluate those links, they can ignore them, but filter / penalize / sandbox / whatever it is, IS PURE EVIL cause a smart competitor can track new sites easily.

    Rant Off.

    P.S.: OP, many issues can send a new site down the drain, usually onsite issues. Have you checked everything?
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    • Well not sure exactly what you mean by checking everything, but all i know is shortly after i got my backlinks my site went bye bye
    • Yeah you have said it before and its been debunked many times before as well. You just choose every time to ignore it. The evidence is overwhelming even in this forum that too much spam backlinks tanks sites.

      The fact that new sites rank every day doesn't mean that you can tank them. If they have high quality on page PR backlinks they will insulate them from your spam backlinks. Google is not going to discount the solid backlinks they have. Their position was solidified based on the good links they had before your blast.

      Now if a new site that has little authority, weak backlinks (like forum, profile blog commenting etc) or just a few good ones all of a sudden rises to the top (or would have) on the strength of those links then they have nothing to insulate themselves for the "filter"

      Thats exactly what we see in this forum almost every other week. Stories of young sites without much authority falling like a rock after a blast of backlink building.
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    • Well, Michael Graywolf wrote about a similar technique. He said you can tip over your competition by buying warez backlinks for their site. He didn't advise doing this, though. It's pure evil for sure. Obviously some sites can't be tipped over like amazon, wikipedia, about.com etc.

      Sorry first post, I was responding to someone on the first page, but missed their quote about tipping over new domains being evil or something.
  • A good idea is to imitate the "inovators, early adopter" graph, when it comes to building backlinks.

    http://www.anythingresearch.com/Stra...tion-curve.png

    This will be the most natural link building. (Also profile links is no so natural, are they?)
  • This happens on pretty much every domain I have that is less than about a year old, with much less links. A week, two weeks, six weeks or whatever, I'll bet it will be back again. Did you use the same anchor text in every link or vary it.

    Google takes some time (IMO) to figure out what a site should rank for. When you throw a variation of anchor text links at it, I think it makes Google work even harder to figure out what the site should rank for. Not a problem for an established site.
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    • Yes i did use a variation of anchor text links. I haven't had a problem with my other sites. Some are on page 1 and some on page 2, but i did not build links too quickly too those sites either.
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  • Its not gone. It'll jump about abit with the addition of new links (as said about google has to analyze those links) and go straight back up in time.

    Read Terry kyles case study where his articles and blog would go up and down with new additions of links and go back up within a few days to a few weeks.

    Like said above, if addition of links would affect ranking, you could scout competition that look promising and delay their business by bombarding their new sites. And I'm sure if that was the case you'd see some of the larger sites doing it on the sly so to stop any upcomming competitors.

    I think with the vast amount of knowledge google staff have that they would not over look this.

    Guarantee it.

    Jay.
  • The site is only 2 or 3 months old and you think a couple thousand backlinks has caused this drop?...

    Honestly, you're just getting started on that site.

    Google hasn't "punished" you, it hasn't even decided what to do with you yet!.... I can add over 3,000 back links to a 7 year old site and not see any issue.

    This has more to do with the age of your site, than it has to do with the back links. If you think adding back links like that to a domain is gonna hurt your ranking chances... You think wrong.

    Jay
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    • Well everyone is going to have their opinion but it looks like they did decide what to do with me and that information is on the last page of Google.
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    • That's exactly where I was going with my first question. It is ridiculous to think you will have any sort of stabilized rankings with a site that new. Now maybe if it was a really low competition longtail keyword you were targeting it might have had the potential to stay based solely on the fact that google may not be able to find anything else that would even be related to the targeted keyword, but even in that scenario you are still likely going to see ranking drops and bounces all over the place.
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  • I think this is the million dollar question and the SEO world is divided on this anyway.

    But for what it's worth, this has happened to me too. The site came back after three weeks, much stronger. Another site didn't come back until 6 months. So who knows.

    I'm more wont to believe what Fernando Veloso said that there could not possibly be such a "rule" in Google. At the very worst, it will probably signal a "human" to check it. But if you've got a site with good articles and is non-spammy at all, then I don't think there's anything to be worried about at all. But that's just my opinion.
  • I agree building them too fast and with low quality rank is not the best way to rank your page higher instead of 10-300 pr3's get 10 pr8-9's.
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  • Break it down this way.

    Rather than penalize you, see it from Googles point of view.

    They see a rather large amount of backlinks going to your website all of a sudden. Now that shows flags for them, and tells them that the site might need re-evaluation to make sure it is infact being given the most relevant rankings.

    So to prevent worser customer service, they move the site way below visibility in order to do a re-evaluation of the site to make sure that 1. a massive change has not been applied to the site in questions hence the new links, thus rendering it off topic to the placings it once had.

    Or to make sure that the site is still relevant.

    These again are my warped opinions of what's going on. But then again with Google giving away nothing a lot of the gurus make their own assumptions. Hence I have too.

    Though my theory sounds reasonable in my eyes.

    Jay.
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    • Yes i couldn't have said it better. I totally agree that this is what is going on.
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    • This is just google dance. They have stated publicly that there is no blacklisting for links.
    • I am glad i am not the only one who has had this issue.

      Sure someone could take a website and spam it death with backlinks to send them to the Google desert(those who say Google doesn't mind backlinks too fast or it won't hurt you) but how many people have actually done it?
  • What I meant is, rather than leave the site high above in the serps. To reduce bad customer experience (incase a change of topic has been made on the site), they could move it down while the site is re-crawled.

    Then again that is my theory, could be wrong or right But since the change came along as soon as he used the backlinks, unless it was coincidental then what other reason could it be?
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    • right that is the point i was trying to make. The site has good content. I did all my SEO stuff right. It is not a spam site. That is just too much of a coincidence IMO.
  • Would be interesting to see when the site goes back up, where it stands on page 1. Based on what is taught/said. The site should come back stronger, though do keep us posted.

    Mine usually come back stronger, though I've never tried a blast as big as 2000 links in a week before. I'm interested in seeing the following:

    whether it drops a few places, then slowly crawls back up as links are picked up.

    It instantly comes back stronger.

    Or whether it stays in the same position as before due to the links not being sufficient enough to boost it past the high competing sites.
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    • Yes i will let you know when it comes back and where it does come back at. I really think if it would have stayed there all this time i would have made some sales by now.
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  • Well if you are so sure of this, why not buy the this same backlink package, direct them all at your competitors sites and just knock em out of your way.

    In fact, if you really want to test this I have no problem sending you a link to one of my sites that I would love for you to attempt to take down by sending massive amounts of links at it.
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    • Well other people have said the same thing has happened to them so i don't know. I didn't know this was such a touchy/hot subject.
    • Think you got the wrong idea, atleast if that was directed at me.

      If not then excuse me for being paranoid hehe.
    • I second that :-)
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    THis is so true building backlinks too fast will make GOOGLE very suspicious and can cause your site to be penalized
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    • Yep. Dead on. Consistency is important when building backlinks. If you just start blasting tons of backlinks to your site out of nowhere, that can be cause for a red flag.

      Not always, but done in the way the OP has done it, then most likely, yes.

      There are some other things you need to consider when getting backlinks:

      1. Quality of the links.
      2. Don't just promote your homepage. Deep link into your site.
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    • Did google patent an algo that contains "suspicion"? I think my PC is suspicious I might be cheating on it with a MAC? What ta do?

      I have to wonder if this article is now under suspicion? I m sure it got more than a few thousand backlinks to it today

      English Actress Accuses Polanski of Abuse in 1980s - ABC News

      Ooops I just placed another "red flag" backlink to it - wonder if my link is the one that will trigger the google sandbox for this page? :rolleyes:
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  • You must have purchased some profile links?

    I don't think the links were added to your link count in 7 days.. I just think it took 7 days for them to get to your order and complete it.

    Google didn't count the 2,000 links that fast, shoot, I don't think its even possible..., but you never know, its Google.

    Sorry to hear about that...

    I still think you might have been penalized for something else, if in fact you were penalized.

    What site did you have the links built for?
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    • Yes they were profile links and no Google probably didn't count the links that fast. But like i said earlier a few days maybe after all those links were added my site was out of there.
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  • Shannon.. I've been there. I know that some people don't take the speed of link building too seriously but I've been Google slapped - so I know what can happen. When I launched a new affiliate site, I came blazing out of the gate and built tons of inbound links. Although I was moving up the rankings I got penalized and could never build my ranking back to where it was originally.
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    • Thanks i am glad some people believe me.:rolleyes:
  • I didn't get a chance to read the other replies but the top few, but have you considered that google is reevaluating where to rank your site. It had you where it's calculations thought you should be. Now you have a butt load of new links that are coming in that are from random places I'm sure.

    Now google might be wondering where your site is most relevant where it knew before.

    If getting a huge amount of new links in a matter of days played such a big role against your ranking, then going viral would be a horrible thing. What if your brand new site posted an article that got picked up by MSN's frontpage? How many backlinks would you get in that first couple of days? In most cases more then 2000.

    Your site is too new to think that you had a solid ranking. It takes months to years to maintain a solid position in rankings.

    In no way do I know either way as fact, but this makes way more sense to me with what I've done with sites thus far.

    Travis
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    • I have to disagree about it taking months to years to get a solid ranking. It all depends on the keywords you are going after and how strong your competition on the first page of Google is.
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  • I definitely don't see anything about how you built your backlinks and how many Google sees for them to penalize it...

    There are several upon several other ways for your website to have been penalized...

    I'm only showing you to have a total of 151 backlinks pointing to your site... And 0 are showing from Google.. Out of the 2000 profile links you ordered a couple of weeks ago, I see about 25 indexed in a few Search Engines, but none in Google.

    I suggest you do this, if you haven't already.

    Fetch as Googlebot

    In order to use Fetch as Googlebot, you'll need to have added and verified your site in Webmaster Tools
    1. On the Webmaster Tools Home page, click the site you want.
    2. On the Dashboard, under Labs, click Fetch as Googlebot.
    3. In the text box, type the path to the page you want to check.
    4. In the dropdown list, select the type of fetch you want. To see what their web crawler Googlebot sees, select Web.
    5. Click Fetch.
    The above will basically tell you why your site was put where it was put with the Search Engine... Give it a shot and see what they come up with.

    And you can always request reconsideration of your site.
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    • Thanks for taking a look at my site, i will look into your advice.
  • What I notice when you after you add some backlinks into your site, google will reduce your ranking. But after sometime your rank will slowly move up again if nothing is done.
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    Do you really think Google found those 2,000 backlinks in 7 days?
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    • G may be able to see these. On the other hand, it may be able to ignore these. Why? Because indexing means extra operational cost to G.

      Nevertheless, I must not jump into conclusion. Nobody can't be sure in this matter.

      But if we were to speculate just for the sake of entertainment, perhaps there's some kind of limit for new links to be indexed. And G will select them according to its algo. Perhaps.... maybe.... who knows???


      Hardi
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  • Shannon, I never understand when people setup a brand new website then throw hundreds or even thousands of links at them. Patience is all it takes and by having a lack of it you will probably find yourself moving backwards.

    I have found some of my sites progress nicely with just a few decent links per day. Even every other day. You do not need thousands of links to rank. It's more a case of how you are building your links and how many links point to the pages where your links are on. And when I say 'how many links' I am meaning 'aged' links.
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    • Good stuff as usual Andy. You can even get more than a few each day as long as you don't build them. I can hear the naysayers saying how does Google determine you built them. They don't they just consider the places where self backlinks can be had easily as low quality. Yaou have people doing thousands of backlinks and can't touch the top five yet.

      This is why I am quite happy (even though it nixed my own product here) about the new changes at WF. You couldn't talk about quality when everyone was talking about blasts and thousands and tens of thousands of crappy backlinks. ow you try and push your xrummer "SEO" tactics and your post may be gone Now more and more people are asking about good ways of building links. Quality over quantity is making a come back.
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  • I've said this time and time again.. its not the speed or quantity if your baclinks that boxes your website... it is the LACK OF DIVERSITY.

    You've basically sent to your page a few thousand totally same type of links.

    The overcomplication of SEO by people continues to amaze me to this day...
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    • Are you referring to I.P. diversity?

      If so, then you've overlooked Shannon's first post. He's using links from forum profiles, which suggest that his backlinks come from diverse I.P.

      Therefore, the lack of diversity may not be the problem.


      Hardi
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  • Yes..it's correct-Google penalizes all those sites whose backlinks increases too fast...so keep that in mind...after all Google is a genius.
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    • Yes sir - I met google for lunch the other day. "It" truly is brilliant! Cheap ass ******* tho - made me pick up the check.
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  • Do you think it would make a difference if you purchase an older domain name for "seasoning" reasons?

    Or would that have no affect?

    I'm asking because I'm about to buy a couple domains for some new projects.

    Hoping that you folks with more experience might know how much difference it might make?

    Thanks,
    Sally
  • this happened to one of my sites recently.So what i did was build links to internal pages and the site attained good SERP position again.
  • sorry to here that shannon.

    I hope google forget about you and
    put you back on the first page mate.

    Matt
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  • Maybe it was a case of 'honeymoon period' over for your new domain, obviously the sheer number of linkz didnt help either!
  • Hey Shannon, I guess you are very confuse with all kinds of "noise" here... but I got to say this - building links too fast with 2,000 links in 7 days?

    7 days is nothing, I build 3K links in 3 days and guess what, my 8 days old new site rank for all my targeted keywords! I'm not just talking here, see this prove:

    7 Days New Site with Hundreds of Visitors

    You must know what you are doing, I highly recommend you get Daniel Tan Rank Mover, his WSO will reveal the secret of building backlinks, and the question is not about building links fast or slow, but... see Daniel Tan WSO.

    If you want to know more about why I can build 3K links in 3 days still rank high, PM me or ask your questions on my thread, I'll be glad to share!

    Kok Choon
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  • go slow the first year then ramp it up. you built links way too fast for such a young domain.

    google and study link velocity as well.
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    • Go slow in the first year, only if you want to make zero money until
      year two and let your competition get a one year jump on you.

      Paul
    • I have had this happen to me by building links too fast. Usually after a period of time the site will climb up in the rankings again. The Google dance can be very frustrating to say the least!
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  • This thread is a good example of why making your buisness's bottom line dependent on Google is completely idiotic.

    I am glad I switched to list building and video marketing instead.

    Chris
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  • If you want reassurance, I had 50+ domains that were deep down in the search engine abyss for a few weeks before popping back up to first page and staying there. 2-3 months is still "brand new" so don't sweat it. Keep working on your content and linkbuilding.

    Think of this as a way to deter spammers. A typical spammer would quit once they see that their site no longer rank well on Google, and move on to the next project. Don't get me wrong... I felt like quitting as soon as I saw bunch of my sites ranking in 20 page+, but I continued to work hard and they eventually came back.
  • I am so slow at backlinking only roughly 5 original articles a day, sometimes less if I am busy. Hopeing in two months it pays off and Google do not penalise me at all along the way.
  • I bet I know where you got those 2,000 backlinks ;-) I ordered the same package on an established site that had tons of backlinks already and google kicked me for it.
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  • Yes, same thing happened to my younger brother. He got carried away building to many backlinks. His site was top ranked on Google for multiple keywords one minute and then dropped like a stone... BIG PROBLEM!! In my opinion probably caused by building large volumes of backlinks in a relatively short period of time. In addition, his site domain was less than 12 months old. I always build backlinks manually on a steady but consistent basis,around 50 -100 links per month and this works well for me.
  • Does any one know how google differentiates from link spam and a site that suddenly gets popular and is talked about? As both link building results would look similar (i.e sudden random spikes)
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    • Now them is fighting words in this thread, you are going to get people on one side who say Google (Google is dumb that way) don't know the difference throw a million links at your site (it could happen)

      Then their is the other side who will say Google will sandbox your site especially a new site for building links too fast. Google needs to reevaluate your site to determine the best place to put you and make sure you are not a spam site.

      Now how do they know the difference? from link spam and a site that gets popular? I really don't know and unless anyone here works for Google and knows their algorithm they don't know 100%. But from what i read their have been case studies and my site is not the only one this has happened to.
  • ROFL...

    If this was actually true I could OWN the first page for VERY hard keywords just by "spamming" my competitors and having google drop them off the top spots.
  • "Backlinking too fast"

    Well, let's rephrase that.

    Buying spam backlinks is bad.

    But you can't manually create too many backlinks.



    Although one time I dumped 3 articles into UAW at once, and Google didn't really like that site.. .hehe
  • Backlinks aren't everything.

    You need a healthy variety of references. do follow, no follow, text, video
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    • There is no do follow, and it's nofollow.
      And what the heck is a healthy dose of those?

      I'll skip a healthy dose of nofollow, thank you.

      I have no video either. That's the first I've heard
      about needing video.


      Paul
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  • Hi,

    In my experience, the real danger is getting too many backlinks too fast for new sites. I got sandboxed a couple times because of that, but it was never irreversible. After a few months of existence for your site, many backlinks doesn't seem to be a problem, but I never got more than say 50 new backlinks/day. There are degrees in how fast you build these, and in your case, it was way faster than I ever did, so I'll definitely keep your experience in mind to not overdo it.

    Damien
  • Not trying to stir this up again or anything like that, but there were a few people on this thread that were interested on what became of my site.

    Well i am glad to say that it came back to the 1st page of Google in the 4th spot.

    I am out of the sandbox. (ducks)
    • [2] replies
    • Did you do anything in particular to get your site back to page 1? any new link building methods, new content added to your site etc.?? Or was it more a case of playing the waiting game for it to come back?

      It would be very interesting to hear from you on this. Oh and thanks for starting this post it has been a great read hearing from everyone!
      • [1] reply
    • It never was a sandbox, it was just in queue (as someone earlier mentioned) due to the new incoming links.

      A huge inbound of links not always puts a red flag, think about the big news posts...they could go viral and get hundreds of thousands of inbound links within just few days, and all from indexed pages, would it make sense for Google to penalize such sites?

      This bounce in SERPs from my experience happens in two occasions:
      1). Site is new and there is a constant link building process, so once you see it on page 40 then on page 2 and back on page 15, very normal.
      2). A heap of incoming links in short period of time. Algorithm trying to figure out a best ranking position, so it just randomly slams you on the deep pages, but then when you return you return with better SERP ranking.

      However, to not suffer such "jump" in SERPs (specially with established pages) it would be wise to build links slowly, however whenever you got a news worthy page...don't just hesitate, slam it hard and slam it with quality inbound links too.

      Just my 2 cents
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  • There is a few things to consider first:

    If you build links up too quickly or in general, Google can knock your site down a few places/pages and then after a while you can go higher than you was originally, it is a filter that Google has.

    You can not damage a site with too many links as much as people think as competition would just spam their rivals.

    Building too many links too quickly with the same anchor text is the main reason for drop in rankings.
  • With this 'blackbox' Google you can never be sure what causes the drop. But, in general, these too many links at once might cause with very high probability the drop indeed.
  • Good backlinks in quantity never hurt you. Purchased or automated ones can. Why?

    When you buy a package of backlinks and a few hundred new ones show up on your site daily. No problem. When Google sees that same few hundred appearing on new sites daily they know what is going on. Now if the seller offers you links and never uses those same links to other sites, your less likely to get caught.

    Google is not perfect, but they aren't stupid either.
  • Links should be natural.
    So, I would counter with - depends on how you're building links.

    I mean, think about it. "Building links" itself is paradoxical in terms of organic SEO.... Why not think of it as Building an extremely link-able site and networking it appropriately?
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  • That is true indeed...Google punishes you for building backlinks too fast.So one must remember to build backlinks slowly but regularly.
    • [2] replies
    • When will the insanity in this place end This myth just needs to die, or else stay at DP

      You guys can keep regulating the flow of incoming backlinks and i'll keep blasting and shooting up the SERPs.
    • It's a myth !

      Google will not penalize you in anyway !
  • Thanks for the heads up Shannon,

    I guess a common error for us is that we tend to look for shortcuts. We think that if we do a particular thing like build backlinks too fast, we can reach our goals faster. But it's sad that it needs to happen to you. But thanks for informing us warriors of what happened.
  • I've seen before in a forums that building too many links on a old website is fine. Is that true?
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    • There is no such thing as building too many links, no matter the site age.
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  • I have never experience the so called "sandbox" myself but I hear many people talk about it, usually with sites that are pretty new. I have to say that Fernando Veloso makes an excellent point above about competition sabotage. If Google really did penalize sites for building backlinks too fast, or for getting backlinks from suspicious sites, then IM's would spend a great deal of time locked in a competitive arms race trying to sabotage each others sites by building lots of suspicious links.

    Maybe this does go on and I am just too naive to have realized.
  • I personally do not get this theory at all.

    Websites take a while to 'settle' in the search engines and that takes time but it has nothing to do with backlinks. Just think how many competitors you could take out!

    Although if it did, everything that went viral on the net would make you loose Google rankings?

    Just think of the millions of backlinks that could be created if just one of your articles went viral - even on a new site.

    This theory just does not make sense at all. There are other more important factors that determine where you website will settle in the search engines and realistically, it seems to be between three to six months of age, minimum.

    New sites tend to jump all over the place until they settle. My new sites rank all over the place...page 1, position 1, back to position 200, then back to page 1, etc. That is all NORMAL.

    As long as your site is being found when you do:
    site:http://YOURDOMAIN.com

    If it comes up, then it is still there, it is just still dancing around and there is nothing unusual about that.
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • The reason you've been penalized is because you RANDOMLY started getting backlinks per day. You set off their spam filter. If you start from day one building same backlinks per day, and MAINTAIN it, you'll be fine.
  • Nobody really know whether building too many backlinks in a short period of time may end up being sandbox by Google. Maybe it could be other reasons.

    Let me share my experiences. My blog was on the first page of Google (3 to 9) for a quite a while. For reasons unknown to me my site suddenly disappear out of sight for the last six months. Suddenly it appear again 3 weeks ago on the first page and ranked second if the 3 sponsored links are not included in the counting.

    Just a while ago I checked again and it is now ranked FIRST on google (without counting the 3 sponsored links). I am in a competitive niche with a search volume of 50,000 for the month of June. In this niche there are quite a number of authority sites (wiki etc) with domains ages ranging from 4 to 5 years to more than 10 years. My domain is only about 2 years.

    I have done nothing. No backlinking, no submission to directories etc. Just post new articles daily for the last six months and I have archive of at least 5000 articles in my blog.
  • Lol, when will people know that Google is not a person and their spiders cannot think?
    • [1] reply
    • What? The spiders can think, just that it is programatic.

      Google puts a lot of work towards adding spam detection to their algorithm (as well as Bing). Caffeine has allowed them the resources to do this more intensely.

      A page being sent to the last page of results indicates that the site has been filtered or penalised - it won't be the sites true ranking. This is different to the "sandbox effect" where a page disappears totally from the search query. Often your result (in the last pages of results) is surrounded by other pages that should be on the front page too, or at least in the top 100 results.

      What caused it? Who knows! Remove the links and see if your page comes back. That is all that will tell you if it was caused by the new poor quality links.
      • [2] replies
  • Fast link building for new domains surely will be punished by Google. But if you own old domains don't worry about fast link building for it as its well known for Google and other search engines.
    • [2] replies
    • This is nothing but a lie.
      • [1] reply
    • Huh? Another theory? Would love to see what evidence you have on this as I have NONE that would be remotely even close to what you are saying.

      I have been doing SEO for over 10 years and I couldn't make that kind of statement, or, at least I would not.

      Look, the 'software' doesn't see any links you submit immediately. They have to 'discover' your links. Now, I'm sure the software may have some way of determining spam type stuff, but I don't think it has to do with the number of backlinking at any one time. There are lots of backlinking that goes on, especially with blogs and trackbacks in which you have no control of. Again, there are also lots of things that go viral instantly and can receive millions of backlinks...relevant backlinks or not, you would have absolutely no control over them.

      If you are just out promoting your site, and you are using software that helps you get that job done more timely and efficiently, Google's software is not going to penalize you. They have others way of doing that. Google and every major search engine is all about using software on a super duper large scale to gather and information quickly and link to it...you are worried about a few hundred or thousand of links going to your site?

      If that is what you are worried about, then don't do it. But I just don't understand that theory at all. Too many changes take place with the search engines to know exactly what happens all the time, heck, they don't even know why most of the time either!

      Produce quality content, do your seo optimization both on-site and off-site, submit to directories, submit to social sites, submit your rss feeds, submit to blog directories, submit to video directories, etc. and you will outlast anyone...although you will always dance in the search engines as sites come and go.
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  • Interesting... thanks for sharing your experience with us, even though I'm sure there are many other variables to take into consideration. Make sure you check you check your rankings again in a few days.
  • Okay. Here is where I disagree with you.

    If building backlinks too fast meant you get labeled as spam, then doesn't that mean all I have to do to get my site ranked above yours and anyone else's in my way is to build fast, crumby backlinks to their site?

    Think about it. You don't have ANY control over your backlinks. One way links can be generated by anybody. This whole idea that too fast or too many backlinks is garbage because it would mean that I could go around and ruin someone else's site without actually owning it or being affiliate with it.

    Google doesn't want people to be able to ruin another person's rankings. For this reason, it isn't effective.

    However, building backlinks very quickly will get your site ranked lower or de indexed temporarily. This is known as the Google dance. It can last anywhere from a few days to a few weeks or even months.

    Google does this to make sure no one knows exactly how the backlinking affects their SEO and can't game the system. They take you out of the rankings so you are blind to whatever happens while they are reevaluating your position.

    I doubt you will be hurt permanently by this.
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  • this is a great post because im in the same boat as the OP.....exept with mine the domain itself is not listed. I to went crazy with backlinks. In Google webmasters it shows 2,161 links to the MAIN DOMAIN...i was stupid not to set those links pointing to other links but I know now.

    My diffrence is with the OP he had it indexed and then fell way back...MY domain does not show up AT ALL except for other links (bookmarks, web 2.0 etc) showing up for my site. When I do site:DomainHere.com it comes back with no results.

    I sent an emial to google to reconsider my site but becasue it does not show up at all via the site: search is it reasonable to have it come back at all?
  • this is a big lesson for those, like me that are crazing about link building.
    • [1] reply
    • Hi john55,

      Yes, don't let anyone talk you into promoting your website, that's just crazy talk. Please spread the word, I need all of my competitors to get this!
  • I am not sure about the 2000 links in seven days thing but I know for sure you can build 1000 backinks every 2 or 3 weeks and it will HELP your website move up to the first page of Google, I have done it with several sites/blogs for some 18 to 20 keywords/keyword phrases. One of the keyword phrases returns 455 million competitors and I got one of my blogs to position #4 four times in the last 3 months but it has settled at #7 for the time being. And I continue to add content on a regular basis and build backlinks monthly to keep them on the first page, due to if I stop adding content and building backlinks that site will fall to page #2 or sometimes #3 within 60 to 90 days. So in a nutshell all SEO really comes down to is, backlinks, content and activity. So build your backlinks as fast as possible, update your site/blog with fresh content and do it on a regular basis and that is pretty much about it.


    Joel
  • It really doesn't adress the competitor issue.

    If these tactics worked, competitors could spam you into oblivion. That does not work.

    There probably is something like the Sandbox, though I've never encountered it.

    I've seen temporary drops in rankings a lot from building links fast.

    It works like this:

    A site receives a lot of new links.

    Google wants to bring the most relevant (contextually) from a trusted source (high quality backlinks) and the FRESHEST results. A lot of new links is interpreted as the content being fresh. Like how news spread virally on the internet.

    That's why your site may surge quickly in the rankings. For very competetive niches, this may last only a few minutes. Similar to posting an Ezinearticle that hits first page for about 10 seconds and then never to be seen again. For less competetive keywords, your FRESH content may stay there for days or weeks, but eventually it will fade unless it's now established as THE piece of content for the keyword.

    That probably accounts for most of these 'omg my site dropped after building links'.

    Then again, I have seen some big fluctuations in rankings after building links fast. Eventually the links will count though.

    There is no getting around the fact that domain and content age is still a significant factor for Google. It's simply to weed out spam, which will likely not last a year.
  • I really wonder if it was the amount of links or the quality. I mean you did buy them - therefore they probably came from linkfarms.
  • If you think 2000 links is excessive, wait till you see a site that someone posted on my blog in the comments.

    That site is only one month old, and has 46,000 links....

    AND, it is a one page site. An EMD cum MFA.

    Is this guy crazy or what? Sometimes, I think there's many people out there who really are either crazy or stupid, I don't know which is the case........

    Google definitely penalized the site, and I think this is one guy who needs a link removal service....if there's such a thing.
    • [1] reply
    • It's not the number of links. Maybe the quality of links.

      2000 links? Were these worthless profile links?

      To illustrate the point - if your website suddenly received thousands of quality links because you had secret US military documents from Afghanistan - do you think you would be on the first page of Google, or the last page?
  • The theory about penalty for building link too fast is not totally proven. Reason is that some people apparently seen it happen, but could not give precise explanation. On the other hand, some people don't see this, they deny it.

    Matt Cutts did mentioned that Google never penalizes sites that build links too fast, because it may not be done by owners. It could be the competitors.

    What I suspect is that there's a mechanism to put a new site 'on hold' if incoming links are being generated too fast. This isn't a penalty, in my opinion. It's just a measure to prevent new sites to ruin the listing.


    Hardi
  • I am sorry to burst your bubble, but what you are saying simple doesn't make sense. Just take a minute and think about it.

    If I am an affiliate marketer and by building many backlinks in a short period of time will get my site punished by Google, than I would simply create a lot of backlinks to all of the competition and get them punished and clear the way for top google rankings.

    This doesn't make sense and I doubt very much that Google is doing that.

    I think that due to the fact your site is only 3 month old is the main cause for the sudden drop and the Google Dance can take effect even after 6 months.

    I may be wrong, but the way I see it, There is no way Google punished websites for building links to fast because that will give anyone the power to kick any site he wants from Google by simply creating many backlinks to that site.
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  • I believe that there is nothing wrong with wanting to have your website be on the first pages of the search results. However I would disagree in saying that building backlinks too fast is wrong, and is thus punished by Google.

    Falling from number seven to the last page is all part of the game. It's just like riding a bike. There is nothing wrong with wanting to go fast, but if you go to fast, sometimes you lose control, or slip and fall. However just like learning to ride a bike, building backlinks is a trial and error process.

    Eventually, through experience and some trial error (not too much though, or you will run the risk of being blacklisted) you will figure out the right amount of backlinks that will steadily move your site up the search results ladder, but not too fast as to alert Google's SPAM "sensor".

    I hope this helps.
    Bob
  • What a lot of hooey in this thread. Paranoia. Assigning a factual conclusion with absolutely no real proof to support it.

    The fact is, you can get thousands of links in incredibly short order and not raise even the tiniest flag at Google. But please, you who are worried about getting a mythical penalty from Google for getting too many backlinks too fast please -- I BEG YOU -- build backlinks to your sites very, very, very, very slowly. No more than 3-4 links a week or so. That's exactly what I think you should do. That will keep you COMPLETELY off Google's radar (and completely out of the competition).

    Oh, and whatever you do... WHATEVER YOU DO... DON'T submit your pages to Digg. Sometimes sites submitted to Digg get thousands of backlinks in a SINGLE DAY. That would absolutely ENSURE that your site will be penalized by Google, sent to the bottom of the search results, just like every other URL that hits this page:

    Digg - The Latest News Headlines, Videos and Images

    Oh, and never, ever submit press releases for your site. Those will KILL your ranking. Sometimes press releases get hundreds or even thousands of backlinks from news sources and other sites in just a matter of a couple of days.

    OH! And don't submit your pages to any social media sites. Man, if your page gets popular there you could end up getting hundreds of backlinks in just hours. Google will SURELY penalize your site when that happens.
    • [ 5 ] Thanks
  • Ya well that's different then building backlinks fast naturally.

    I've built 50 backlinks per day on a new site without seeing any problems.

    But 2,000 links in one day? You got problems.
  • Totally correct and I cant believe companies are still selling this crap about thousands of links...Its the quality and the trust of the link that counts in the end. If you are just starting out with SEO, I would strongly recommend to get up to date and learn everything you can yourself even if you outsource as there are lots of SEO companies that still does this (no names mentioned). The basic rule applies: Google does not care about your site but only about the quality of the search results. Why would they want websites that participates in spam to show up in the top?
    They would lose so many users and Google is much smarter than that so SEO has to be taken to deeper levels...
    • [1] reply

    • Think whatever you want about how you think Google should provide search results...but the fact still remains that link spamming still works wonders.

      Google just doesn't reward "quality" on-page content like some of you think they do/should, and building a great site with the hope that the links will just naturally flow in just doesn't work, unless perhaps you have the advertising budget of Hewlett Packard.

      Yet...our sites still do They seem more interested in building such useless features as Google Instant. For some reason, people think Google operates on about the level of Skynet (from Terminator), but it does not.

      Tom
  • there are many factors asnd one of those is age of site. if in small time you get too popular than either you a rockstar or spammer.

    i do believe in link velocity..........
    • [1] reply
    • Link velocity is a good thing. It's the link decay once the linking campaign is over is that's likely the problem...
  • Let me tell a story.

    There once was a newbie (me!) who used to read through the warrior forum day and night and believed whatever he read. Whenever his site dropped down in the serps he worried that it would never come back but it ALWAYS did, even stronger than before.

    He eventually realized that there's no such thing as building links too fast and began to build massive amounts of links to his site. He got better serps position, began to make sales, and then used the money to buy Xrumer... the mother of all link building tools. From then on out it was money in the bank... the end
  • in one of google conference they told that they determine the whole pattern to see if links are genuine, bought ot exhanged. somehow i believe them.
    • [3] replies
    • I believe them too (well usually, I'm sure they've got some misinformation campaigns, but I digress), but that does not necessarily have anything to do with how quickly you build links. For example, Google can track history of each link, the location of the link, the IP diversity of your link profile, and many other factors.
    • ...and we know that whatever Google says is 100% true and that they never have an hidden motives.:rolleyes:
      • [1] reply
    • Do you really think Google will tell you anything different than that ???
      • [1] reply
  • Good thread. I prefer to learn from other people's mistakes rather than make my own

    No 2k backlinks from linkfarm directories

    thanks.
  • Ok, everyone on here should buy a back-link package to facebook and you tube. Let's try to get them de-indexed.
  • To professionals like other SEO's building backlinks for them is easy so then it is fast done with the experts but in the other hand like newbie in SEO world there is so many things that will be gained and experiences to take.
  • The thing with automation is that we all use SE footprints to find them. If we can do this, so can Google. I doubt it would be all that hard for Google to cross-check of a link comes from a site with one of these footprints, or if a lot of your links share these footprints.

    And the day may be coming close where bloggers, forum and site owners get tired of the auto-posters and redirect their anger at the real cause, which is Google. If Google did away with "linking" as a ranking factor, comment and profile spam would end tomorrow.

    On the other hand, it could be years before Google does anything. I've made predictions about Google before that were correct, but was surprised at how long it took them to make the changes.

    I think the solution is the same as it's always been...Diversify and use higher-risk tactics on lower value assets and use lower risk strategies if/as the property value increases.
    • [1] reply
    • Even if Google can use those footprints to see that the majority of your links were coming from them, the worst thing that will happen is a devaluation.

      That's why varying your link sources as much as possible is smart and will probably protect you from such a devaluation.

      I really don't think there is any way to get rid of linking as a ranking factor. Any alternative short of reviewing every single site on the web will be just as easy to manipulate.
      • [1] reply
  • There is a now famous post on another forum (not going to name any names) where a user used a program called scrapebox (a web spamming tool) and decided to blast it towards his competitors site.

    I mean, if he used it on his own he would drop from the serps right?

    And guess what? His competitor dropped...like a rock.

    Until a few days later where he came back in the number one spot!

    Keep watching your site and keep building links to it.
  • I agree, build your backlinks naturally is a good idea.

    But what i have heard, if your site is new, sometimes Google places you in the first page sometimes it won't.
    • [1] reply
    • Well I just got done reading 5 months worth of interesting posts on this thread. Regardless of the various conflicting opinions, one question still remains....

      What happened to his site? Did it ever come back? Or is it just sitting in it's rightful spot on Google?
  • Probably a typical case of he wasn't happy with his results and was quick to judge and point the blame at something, in this case, building backlinks too quickly.
  • Page 3 of this thread, it came back to Page 1 #4 spot.
    • [1] reply
  • Mental Note Taken!
  • I don't believe if the building links too fast will hurt your site. It depends to the age of your site. CNN everyday automatically build thousand or million links to CNN's site. However, CNN never ever be banned by search engine.

    If your domain just bought a couple weeks ago then have thousand links building, I think it will make the SE curious.

    Sorry if I am wrong.

    Regards,
    Mozes
  • I think that problem is not for permanently. I was fallen the same situation as like as you. But now the problem seems to be cleared.
  • Shannon,

    I have the same experience with new sites if I blast out thousands of backlinks and then stop like you did.

    Ignore all these people who say that you're wrong and backlinks can't hurt you.

    They aren't you or I and they have not experienced it.

    So of course what we're telling them sounds like BS.

    Until they get hurt like this, they will never listen.

    I USED to believe that blasting backlinks won't do your site any harm - until I did it to 3 sites. All of them got penalized, all of them were brand new. 2 of them now rank well, one still suffers.

    I didn't do it to my other sites and they were fine.

    So I'm telling you, there's a lot of misinformation going on here.

    You can only test what you think is right.

    Once you test it, you have PROOF.

    I can guarantee you that the vast majority of people here who don't believe that blasting thousands of new links to a new site won't do that site any harm - haven't tested their theory.

    I have.

    I KNOW it harms my sites, so I have stopped blasting my new sites.

    I have TESTED IT.

    I have proof.

    I don't care what anyone else says, because I have confirmed it myself.
    • [2] replies
    • Did you even bother reading the thread? His website came back at a higher position. So, no incoming links can't hurt you.

      And your testing is flawed. There are any number of things that could cause a website to drop and you attributing it to links is just silly. Unless you did a 100% controlled test (which is nearly impossible with so many variables), you would have no way to determine what would cause a site harm. Sites rise and fall in the SERPS everyday and blaming it on links is just false logic.
      • [ 3 ] Thanks
      • [2] replies
    • Hi jacksonlin,

      It sounds like you have confused QDF with a penalty. Many folks who are new at this make that same mistake. When that temporary effect wears off it can leave you scratching your head wondering where your rankings went. It seems natural to assume that that the backlink blast you just did somehow had something to do with it, but no. its just the temporary boost of QDF wearing off.

      I realize that I may never convince you of the truth, but I have replied in hope that some folks reading this thread may question their first assumption and dig a litter deeper to find out what is truly happening, not just what we might imagine.

      If you have tested, I don't doubt that you did, how were you able to isolate QDF from your tests? I'm guessing that you did nothing to isolate QDF, and as a result, jumped to a false conclusion. If you perform your tests after QDF wears off, of both your own pages as well as the pages where you have placed your backlinks, I'm sure that you will see that the backlinks were not the cause of a decline in rankings. Instead it was the temporary boost of QDF wearing off. Since in your own words you say it only happens to "new sites", that seems to indicate QDF, not a backlink penalty.

      One can test and yet still draw an incorrect conclusion from that test if one doesn't fully understand all the forces at play. I'm just saying...
      • [1] reply
  • Agree, the same happened to me too.
    • [1] reply
    • Just to reinforce what everybode is say saying: the same thing happend to me but 1 month later I was back att first place for my targeted keyword - have some patiance
      • [1] reply
  • Ok. So does Google care about SPAM sites? Do a simple search for an SEO tool and what comes up? PAGES AND PAGES of sites trying to give you free ebooks and farm your email addresses and not even the simple site that offers the tool you want for FREE.

    Google can be manipulated by links. 99% of people in this forum do it.

    So if it's good enough for the affiliate marketers, it's good enough for me.

    I think today I'm going to use The Most Bestest Most Freeest Most Amazing Tool To Get My Site on the FIRST PAGE OF GOOGLE!!!

    Drivel. The web is full of poop and needs an enema.
  • Ps... I think KURT and JACOB are actually the same person...
  • I'm jumping into this discussion late- but-

    "Well my other sites are staying pretty much on page 1 or 2 and one of them is older than the one that got sent to Google wasteland. Yes it is a long tail keyword with low competion."

    If you are looking to promote at long tail with low competion, why the heck would you need 2000 links? I bet if you got one good quality link per month, you would be at or near the top.
  • Google has something going on right now that is affecting many. I have read a lot lately about people dropping off of page 1. I have experience this myself with some long tail keywords I used to dominate (and yes my sites are over a year old) and have been replaced with profile pages for pete's sake - not even legitimate content.

    Google is reworking something or will be forced to because these strategies that are being employed now are making google searches irrelevant.

    Keep killing that goose that lays the golden egg there guys.

    And thank goodness that Bing and Yahoo are putting a better search together that what google offers.
    • [1] reply
    • The fact is, Google is changing something everyday statistically. They make over 400 algorithm adjustments every year.

      Doesn't worry me. I'll worry when the internet breaks down.

      Until then, I'm going to keep going to the bank.
  • yep... to the bank... for now... lol
  • Absolutely true..building backlinks too fast can get your site in trouble.My suggestion would be build backlinks at a steady rate...keep the number stable and consistent.
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  • How many backlinks you guys are adding perday? I only have 3 hours for link adding,lol.....
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  • IMO 50 High PR Profile links/week is good enough to get higher rankings.
    • [1] reply
    • thats always been the flip side of the equation. the only way your are going to self backlink thousands of sites in a week is if you utilize sites with next to no PR. At least with High Pr sites you stand the possibility of more PR juice flowing to those profile pages but in the end you want to eventually start getting links from on page PR pages.

      I'm not anti these links. far from it. I just think theres a horrible over emphasis on this. theres too many people whose sole idea of SEO is running spam bots.

      You CANNOT rank for any term with just forum profile links. In the real competitive niches even if theres a glitch in the algo the competitor who you knocked dollars from is going to make sure to report you and in enough cases (not all not even most) they will be heard. whining about them doing it is just foolishness. They have every right to. The site that controls the serps and ranks the page (Google) has stated they should and they have no reason to buy into your ethics since you don't buy into theirs. They don't have to resort to playing the spam blast game.

      All things in moderation.
  • Yep slowly and surely, you always have to think natural with Google, those that have been penalised might find they have a long wait before things get to normal
  • This discussion STILL goes on?

  • For everyone that says "If you get tons of backlinks, you will disappear from Googles search engine" please read this article about someone that Sued Google for that exact claim, and won...
    Suing Google Because Your Google Site Ranking Sucks | Techdirt

    It seems to me that all those people saying "We could just sandbox our competition by generating thousands of backlinks" may just be correct about this. Maybe Google does just move you until it can determine a proper place for your site on the listings. With 2,000 backlinks on a new site, Google has to look at a ton of variables, including searching 2,000 sites (and their PR), and make adjustments to a wide range of things.

    Edit: Grats on getting back to page 1! :-D
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • I guess you missed his update like on page 3 or something, but he came back to page 1.
  • This sounds like the 'Google Dance', and also that newer sites tend to rank higher initially and then stabilize a bit with a lower rank.

    Well, the only thing you should now do is continue the backlinks...

    Stopping the backlinks could be the worst thing you do...like the way you bounced back, you could get pushed back again...

    Aditya
  • This is the proof that we cannot overcome google because its the search engine itself. We SEO's only optimize sites the way google likes. hopw this helps.
  • Building Yeh backlinks too quickly can be a problem that Google will see your site as spam. However, this also depends on the quality of their links are. I would choose quality over quantity every time.
  • it is not only the speed, but also the diversity of the anchor texts. I sow some IMs who try to rank their sites for only 1-2 keywords. If you do so, google will consider you a spam. Try to use many different variants of your keywords
  • Ya sure this happens if you just stop the back linking process after some time, if you keep doing this, Google cant know
  • Yeah, i'm glad you learnt that the quick way doesnt always pay. Building links fast on google is bad and whoever does it will be penalized.
  • That's why I always say build your links naturally. Do it yourself or hire someone to do it for you, don't use any software or packages.
  • Building backlinks fast is not a problem.
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  • I have a site that is about 2 months old and when it first ranked it was number 75 and slowly climbed up until I was #3 on google's first page, within a day or so it completely disappeared and it has been a week and it's finally showing up on rank checker again at number 167 yesterday. 166 today.

    I could just be that google dance thing people talk about. You should probably continue to add content if you are still doing that other wise just wait and see.

    Kim
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    • [1] reply
    • Is that last post supposed to make sense in English ^^.
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