Would I rank better with dog-trainingtips.net or dog-training-tips.net

by My220x
21 replies
  • SEO
  • |
Obviously dog training tips is just an example but do you think it would make a big difference by having the hypen between each word or just between the first and second?
#dogtrainingtipsnet #rank
  • Profile picture of the author Samuel Baker
    Wouldn't know the exact answer but I would say the second option with hypens between each word!
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    • Profile picture of the author Rob Hall
      Hmm,

      I think both are really low quality domain names in terms of SEO value to be brutally honest.

      They're also both low quality in terms of remember-ability.

      Google doesn't like those hyphens, it's obviously a domain that's trying to reap the values of SEO.

      You really need a hyphen free domain. Even if you add an extra word for example 'mydogtrainingtips.com', that would provide much better ranking value for "dog training tips" than any of those domains you've specified.
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      • Profile picture of the author abnation
        Originally Posted by Rob Hall View Post

        Hmm,

        I think both are really low quality domain names in terms of SEO value to be brutally honest.

        They're also both low quality in terms of remember-ability.

        Google doesn't like those hyphens, it's obviously a domain that's trying to reap the values of SEO.

        You really need a hyphen free domain. Even if you add an extra word for example 'mydogtrainingtips.com', that would provide much better ranking value for "dog training tips" than any of those domains you've specified.
        Yes, "mydogtrainingtips" is quite a lot better than "dog-training-tips" or similar domains. However, I don't actually believe that the hyphenated version is despised by Google. The reason why a lot of SEO guides advice against using hyphens is probably readability rather than SEO advantage.
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        • Profile picture of the author Rob Hall
          I believe that's exactly why Google would not attribute any additional qualities to the domain name. In general a hyphenated domain would only be used when the non-hyphenated domain is not available.

          In my experience I can't really recall a hyphenated domain ranking exceptionally well for any competitive terms - this might not be the case though.

          I appreciate what you say and it may be the case.
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  • Profile picture of the author actionplanbiz
    if your gonna use the hyphen then i would just use it between each word. better for people to remember your domain name
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  • Profile picture of the author markbyrne
    I've taken a site with a single hyphen to page one (a .org) in under 48hrs, and steady after one week. The thing is, the more hyphens you have, the less credibility you get from both real and virtual visitors. Rob makes a very good point there too.
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    • Profile picture of the author abnation
      Originally Posted by markbyrne View Post

      I've taken a site with a single hyphen to page one (a .org) in under 48hrs, and steady after one week. The thing is, the more hyphens you have, the less credibility you get from both real and virtual visitors. Rob makes a very good point there too.
      It does sound pretty likely yeah...
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  • Profile picture of the author Zeb
    No hyphens would be the way to go. Saw an example above "mydogtrainingtips". Instead of putting the extra letters in front, try to get the extra letters at the back. Example : dogtrainingtipsnow etc...It seems that G prefers the main keyword to be in front.
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    • Profile picture of the author veotis
      Go to Google and type in build yahoo store. You'll see a hyphenated domain outranking Yahoo.

      So, the best thing to do is test. I have some hyphenated domains ranking #1, but you can't rank well with a hyphenated domain...
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  • Profile picture of the author James Fried
    I try to stay away from hyphenated domains as a general rule. I would head in the direction of edogtrainingtips.com before I would go down the hyphen route.

    If you have to use hyphens, I would agree that the best way is to include a hyphen between all of the words so at least it is simpler for the reader.
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    • Profile picture of the author Boris_yo
      Google treats hyphens like word separators. If you cannot get exact match domain, then i suggest getting a hyphenated domain name.
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  • Profile picture of the author Trent Brownrigg
    I had a hyphenated domain (with 4 hyphens) ranked in the top 10 for many very competitive keywords... home business, home based business, work at home jobs, make money at home, and hundreds of others. Actually it still is ranked there for most of them but I no longer own the site. Sold it last year.

    My point is that yes you can do just fine with hyphenated domains. But I do recommend getting one without hyphens if you can.
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  • Profile picture of the author robmena
    This is the way to go trust me we SEO sites all the time.

    dog-training-tips.net
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    • Profile picture of the author paulgl
      These arguments are so silly.
      I searched for dog training tips and lo and behold:
      dog-obedience-training-review.com
      Comes up numero uno. Can we kill these myths?
      That even kills the stupidity of the no hyphen argument!

      It doesn't matter what your friggin domain is!

      SEO is what you do TO your site. If people actually did that,
      instead of looking for some magic formula, this forum would be
      filled with success stories instead of those who swear they
      should be #1 but the big bad google got 'em!

      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author robmena
        Your domain name can matter and does. Not to say you have to have the name in the domain to rank for it, but it makes things alot easier, we see it all the time with our clients. And in reality you can have the best optimized site, but if your not doing the off page factors it means nothing. I'd take off page factors any day and wouldn't have to optimize a website to rank keywords for it. Thats why you see keywords come up with sites that don't have one mention of it on the site. Of course both are good to have.

        Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

        These arguments are so silly.
        I searched for dog training tips and lo and behold:
        dog-obedience-training-review.com
        Comes up numero uno. Can we kill these myths?
        That even kills the stupidity of the no hyphen argument!

        It doesn't matter what your friggin domain is!

        SEO is what you do TO your site. If people actually did that,
        instead of looking for some magic formula, this forum would be
        filled with success stories instead of those who swear they
        should be #1 but the big bad google got 'em!

        Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author cableghost
        Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

        These arguments are so silly.
        I searched for dog training tips and lo and behold:
        dog-obedience-training-review.com
        Comes up numero uno. Can we kill these myths?
        That even kills the stupidity of the no hyphen argument!...Paul
        This is funny. What truly matters to G about this domain ranking so well is the 2,500 backlinks the page has, not the domain name.

        Another example I had found one time is iloveindia.com. This site is a directory and many of the topics, such as Bathroom decor, rank well, and the content is not unique. It is about SEM, not SEO that will get your site ranked.

        -Scott
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  • Profile picture of the author Colton
    This may sound crazy but I saw something the other day where a guy said if the main keyword you were going for was taken then use dogtrainingtipsdotcom.com. I thought that was insane until I saw proof of his #1 ranking for a big time keyword.
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    • Profile picture of the author shaggard
      Originally Posted by Colton View Post

      This may sound crazy but I saw something the other day where a guy said if the main keyword you were going for was taken then use dogtrainingtipsdotcom.com. I thought that was insane until I saw proof of his #1 ranking for a big time keyword.
      I think ths just goes to show domain name is ALWAYS outweighed by good backlinks, content and site SEO.
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    • Profile picture of the author Crew Chief
      Originally Posted by Rob Hall View Post

      Hmm,

      I think both are really low quality domain names in terms of SEO value to be brutally honest.

      They're also both low quality in terms of remember-ability.

      Google doesn't like those hyphens, it's obviously a domain that's trying to reap the values of SEO.

      You really need a hyphen free domain. Even if you add an extra word for example 'mydogtrainingtips.com', that would provide much better ranking value for "dog training tips" than any of those domains you've specified.
      Google doesn't like hyphens???

      You can't rank well with a hyphenated name?

      Where is everyone getting this information?

      Google these keywords, no quotes and then scan the first page of the SERP.

      Self help - Self-Help is #1!
      Make money on the internet - Make Money On The Internet is #7
      Lose weight fast - How To Lose Weight Fast - Get Toned and Burn Fat is #7
      Marketing strategies - Internet Marketing Strategies - Three Step Formula is #9
      Dating sites free - Free Dating Sites - Links To Totally Free Online Dating Services is #10
      Dating sites for seniors - Reviews of the Best Senior Dating Sites is #2
      Asian dating - ASIAN DATING , ASIAN BRIDES , ASIAN SINGLES , ASIAN WOMEN , ASIAN GIRLS , Thai Girls is #4
      Learning styles - Learning Styles Online.com - including a free inventory is #3 and #4
      Learning styles - VARK -- A Guide to Learning Styles is #9
      Cell phone lookup - Free Cell Phone Directory | Cell Phone Lookup & Reverse Cell Phone Lookup is #7

      The takeaway here is, IM requires that you do your homework. That means before you form a belief, make sure that it is founded on in depth research and not opinion.

      You can take ANY domain name, (and it doesn't have to be keyword rich) and dominate the SERPs if you are up on your On Page SEO and Off Page SEO. In the examples that I showed, all of those keyword phrases are highly contested.

      You can dominate the SERPs with .biz, .us, co.cc, hyphenated domains, sub domains, .org, and .net. Again, it's based on your SEO skills.


      Originally Posted by Rob Hall View Post

      I believe that's exactly why Google would not attribute any additional qualities to the domain name. In general a hyphenated domain would only be used when the non-hyphenated domain is not available.

      In my experience I can't really recall a hyphenated domain ranking exceptionally well for any competitive terms - this might not be the case though.

      I appreciate what you say and it may be the case.
      I just gave you some examples and could show you plenty more.


      Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

      These arguments are so silly.
      I searched for dog training tips and lo and behold:
      dog-obedience-training-review.com
      Comes up numero uno. Can we kill these myths?
      That even kills the stupidity of the no hyphen argument!

      It doesn't matter what your friggin domain is!

      SEO is what you do TO your site. If people actually did that,
      instead of looking for some magic formula, this forum would be
      filled with success stories instead of those who swear they
      should be #1 but the big bad google got 'em!

      Paul
      This man speaks the truth! And if you're looking for the secret magic formula used by the most successful IMers, here it is:

      In the trenches SEO work, On Page and Off Page!

      Originally Posted by Colton View Post

      This may sound crazy but I saw something the other day where a guy said if the main keyword you were going for was taken then use dogtrainingtipsdotcom.com. I thought that was insane until I saw proof of his #1 ranking for a big time keyword.
      There are people who do that, true enough. Mike Filsame does it with https://paydotcom.com/

      And I could show you a ton of other domains that use other modifiers. Again, its based on your SEO skills and not some magic formula... and as some have eluded to, Google doesn't evaluate and compare domain names and rank your domain above mine because mine's has hyphens or other modifiers.

      The only caveat with hyphens is the number of hyphens. Matt Cutts did say that a certain number of hyphens and a domain takes on the appearance of being spam.

      The bottom line; if you learn to master SEO, you can outrank any site with effort and time no matter what domain name you have.

      Giles, the Crew Chief
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  • Profile picture of the author Aira Bongco
    I guess there is a heated argument between pro and anti hyphens in here.

    Anyway, my advice is to buy the domain that you feel is right. Then make it up by providing lots of optimized backlinks to your domain. Offpage optimization is always more important.
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  • Profile picture of the author Groovystar
    Hey if you want to rank high for "click here" the best name is "Adobe.com" XD

    ...my point? The domain name is probably a very small factor in ranking.
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