Google Non-Natural Backlink Building

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Hi, I am building some backlinks for my site and I read an article that said that Google has an algorithm to detect non-natural backlinking. Basically, I am using social bookmarks and article directories. Is there are certain type of randomness I need to build into my backlinking strategy?

Thanks.
#backlink #building #google #nonnatural
  • Profile picture of the author tpw
    Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

    - Links are not consistent
    Here Karan is talking about "over time"... If you get 500 links this month and nothing next month, that is unnatural and will trigger a red flag...
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    • Profile picture of the author Karan Goel
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      Here Karan is talking about "over time"... If you get 500 links this month and nothing next month, that is unnatural and will trigger a red flag...
      Exactly!...
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      • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
        Originally Posted by tpw
        Here Karan is talking about "over time"... If you get 500 links this month and nothing next month, that is unnatural and will trigger a red flag...
        Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

        Exactly!...
        " Hey TPW,

        I know .... you post mis-information, and then I'll swear to it ... I bet they'll believe it.

        Karan"


        Can you link me to a picture of a google red flag? Or better yet, a respected SEO that discuss in detail with facts and the testing they did to determine just how many links per day / week / month or hour they did to trigger the mythical google red flag ?

        This google red flag for un-natural linking is the unicorn of SEO, or at least one of them.
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        • Profile picture of the author paulgl
          Google could actually care less if you got 500 one month and zero the next.

          Google could care less period, the number of backlinks you get.

          The only thing google cares about is the quality. But they don't
          really "care." They just caution that low level links will be dead
          soon. If those 500 links were solid links, they could ride for quite
          awhile. Maybe forever.

          Many of us here backlinked like crazy, then fell back. And still
          have #1 sites. Authority counts. Get it. Get it quick.

          Paul
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          • Profile picture of the author Shaun Lee
            Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

            Google could actually care less if you got 500 one month and zero the next.

            Google could care less period, the number of backlinks you get.

            The only thing google cares about is the quality. But they don't
            really "care." They just caution that low level links will be dead
            soon. If those 500 links were solid links, they could ride for quite
            awhile. Maybe forever.

            Many of us here backlinked like crazy, then fell back. And still
            have #1 sites. Authority counts. Get it. Get it quick.

            Paul
            Exactly.

            Authority + Relevance + Trust = Ranking

            -Shaun
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        • Profile picture of the author Karan Goel
          Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

          " Hey TPW,

          I know .... you post mis-information, and then I'll swear to it ... I bet they'll believe it.

          Karan"


          Can you link me to a picture of a google red flag? Or better yet, a respected SEO that discuss in detail with facts and the testing they did to determine just how many links per day / week / month or hour they did to trigger the mythical google red flag ?

          This google red flag for un-natural linking is the unicorn of SEO, or at least one of them.
          Hey

          Here's the red flag for you:


          :p:p:p

          Here's a respected resource for you:
          7 Red Flags that Reveal to Google You’re an SEO Criminal – Avoid These!

          Look at point 4.

          And, what can be better than an answer from Matt Cutts, himself.


          Karan
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          • Profile picture of the author dburk
            Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

            Hey

            Here's the red flag for you:


            :p:p:p

            Here's a respected resource for you:
            7 Red Flags that Reveal to Google You're an SEO Criminal - Avoid These!

            Look at point 4.

            And, what can be better than an answer from Matt Cutts, himself.

            YouTube - Is there such a thing as building too many links?

            Karan
            Hi Karan,

            After reading your post and watching that video, I have to ask "did you even watch the video you posted?" The one where Matt Cutts says "As long as you are following the Webmaster Guidelines... I say get as many links as you want." No where does he imply that there is a limit to the number of backlinks you should get, only that they be "meritorious links".

            And that article you posted has made some glaring errors, in my opinion, particularly on point 4. Additional, the author does not backup his claims with any credible sources, seems he's just regurgitating bad information he heard somewhere else.
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            • Profile picture of the author paulgl
              Originally Posted by dburk View Post

              Hi Karan,

              After reading your post and watching that video, I have to ask "did you even watch the video you posted?" The one where Matt Cutts says "As long as you are following the Webmaster Guidelines... I say get as many links as you want."
              Tip of the week! Follow all google webmaster guidelines!

              Paul
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              • Profile picture of the author dburk
                Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

                Tip of the week! Follow all google webmaster guidelines!

                Paul
                Hi Paul,

                And a good tip that is!

                By the way, can anyone show me where it says don't get too many backlinks, or getting backlinks too fast is not recommended in Google's Webmaster Guidelines? I have read those guidelines so many times and I still can't find that mentioned anywhere in there.
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          • Profile picture of the author Tom Goodwin
            Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

            What makes it respected? The dude needs to seriously work on his backlinking, in any event.

            Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

            And, what can be better than an answer from Matt Cutts, himself.
            Actually, much of what Matt Cutts says should be used as toilet paper, but to each his or her own. Google has no reason to ever tell any of use the whole truth on anything. It just doesn't make sense for them. Does Matt say some interesting things sometimes? Sure

            But to conclude that:

            Matt Cutts --> Works for Google
            Matt Cutts --> Says that Google uses ABC
            Therefore, Google uses ABC, is very shortsighted, IMHO.

            Tom
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            • Profile picture of the author AnnYM
              well even i am in doubt- does authority links only hold weight in google or backlinks from hgh PR relevant sites bring in link juice. they are good quality enough. what is so fake about those links or the anchor text for that matter? should i continue with forum posting or switch to article marketing for better results?
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              • Profile picture of the author dburk
                Originally Posted by AnnYM View Post

                well even i am in doubt- does authority links only hold weight in google or backlinks from hgh PR relevant sites bring in link juice.
                Hi AnnYM,

                Search engines like Google index individual pages, not sites. Therefore, PR applies to the individual page, not site. The value of a backlink is weighted in part by page PR and part by page relevance, not site PR or site relevance. There is no evidence that site relevance plays any direct role in search engine ranking, and there is no such thing as site PR, only page PR.
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            • Profile picture of the author Karan Goel
              Originally Posted by Tom Goodwin View Post

              Therefore, Google uses ABC, is very shortsighted, IMHO.

              Tom
              Hey Tom.

              So, what do you expect a company official to tell you more than the ABC.

              He told you ABC, it's now our job to rearrange these to form a meaningful word or sentence or a complete essay!

              Karan
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              • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
                Like I said once before, when the question of what could be better than getting info from Matt Cutts came up...

                What I'd really want to know is what they told him NOT to say...
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    • Profile picture of the author bgmacaw
      Originally Posted by tpw View Post

      Here Karan is talking about "over time"... If you get 500 links this month and nothing next month, that is unnatural and will trigger a red flag...
      Yes, for goodness sake, never, ever, have a post go viral on Digg, Twitter or whatever. :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author dvduval
    Google has a pretty good read now on links that "everybody" can get such as from forums and blog posts, versus links that are placed on authority sites on a limited basis.
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  • Profile picture of the author tylerdrun
    I'd say that google doesn't care. You can build as much as one million backlinks in one day and not worry about it.

    Sure it will take time to show up in the top 10. But building a million backlinks in a day is not going to get you banned or even cause any trouble to your site.

    Google appreciates you to build links to your site. It wants to find your site. And the more sites that link to your site, the easier for google to rank your content.

    What google recommends is content syndication instead of traditional text link backlinks.

    Text links backlinks are very much fake. Whereas the natural backlinks from your article are normal.

    Let's say your article gets published on a high profile article directory like EZA. And your article gets picked up by publishers. Let's say about 10,000 publishes republish your article on their blog or website.

    And you get 10k backlinks. Will google regard it as spam? the answer is no.

    If they did, Google'd go officially out of business.

    Social bookmarking is very much effective. Most sites only allow one bookmark per url. So it is obvious that some user bookmarked the page... Even if you did, it's not gonna appear as you did.

    Same IP links don't count that much. Yep, that's kinda true. But who would be having 100s of sites on their own IP and interlinking them? That kind of strategy is completely stupid and tiresome.

    But if you do something like article submissions then it will work. Or forum posts with backlinks. All of it will work.

    Google doesn't trust authority sites that much either. If it did, they'd again go out of business.

    Your backlink building does not affect your ranking. It affects your PR.

    And your PR affects your ranking to a significant extent.

    That is.. if your site has a high PR and you have an article published it gets top 10 position instantaneously. But if it does not have a high PR, then you will have to build some backlinks to that article or web page.

    Given that all of us are aware of SEO and everyone tries to build backlinks to their pages to rank for a keyword, Google has accepted that fact as that's how it is.

    Google loves content that gets syndicated. However, there will be only one site that will rank in the search engine because of duplicate content(for user's readability).

    Wouldn't you get annoyed if you keep going to a different site everytime but got to read the same content over and over again?

    To improve quality for it's users, google only allows one site to rank. If the site gets taken down, usally the site with the next best PR or popularlity or backlinks with the same content will rank.
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    • Profile picture of the author shaktimaan
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    • Profile picture of the author glassytaz
      wow dude very well written, you just destroyed this thread lol.

      Originally Posted by tylerdrun View Post

      I'd say that google doesn't care. You can build as much as one million backlinks in one day and not worry about it.

      Sure it will take time to show up in the top 10. But building a million backlinks in a day is not going to get you banned or even cause any trouble to your site.

      Google appreciates you to build links to your site. It wants to find your site. And the more sites that link to your site, the easier for google to rank your content.

      What google recommends is content syndication instead of traditional text link backlinks.

      Text links backlinks are very much fake. Whereas the natural backlinks from your article are normal.

      Let's say your article gets published on a high profile article directory like EZA. And your article gets picked up by publishers. Let's say about 10,000 publishes republish your article on their blog or website.

      And you get 10k backlinks. Will google regard it as spam? the answer is no.

      If they did, Google'd go officially out of business.

      Social bookmarking is very much effective. Most sites only allow one bookmark per url. So it is obvious that some user bookmarked the page... Even if you did, it's not gonna appear as you did.

      Same IP links don't count that much. Yep, that's kinda true. But who would be having 100s of sites on their own IP and interlinking them? That kind of strategy is completely stupid and tiresome.

      But if you do something like article submissions then it will work. Or forum posts with backlinks. All of it will work.

      Google doesn't trust authority sites that much either. If it did, they'd again go out of business.

      Your backlink building does not affect your ranking. It affects your PR.

      And your PR affects your ranking to a significant extent.

      That is.. if your site has a high PR and you have an article published it gets top 10 position instantaneously. But if it does not have a high PR, then you will have to build some backlinks to that article or web page.

      Given that all of us are aware of SEO and everyone tries to build backlinks to their pages to rank for a keyword, Google has accepted that fact as that's how it is.

      Google loves content that gets syndicated. However, there will be only one site that will rank in the search engine because of duplicate content(for user's readability).

      Wouldn't you get annoyed if you keep going to a different site everytime but got to read the same content over and over again?

      To improve quality for it's users, google only allows one site to rank. If the site gets taken down, usally the site with the next best PR or popularlity or backlinks with the same content will rank.
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  • Profile picture of the author tylerdrun
    Oh god, I just wrote an article...
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    • Profile picture of the author tpw
      Originally Posted by tylerdrun View Post

      Oh god, I just wrote an article...
      Yes you did... Great job too...
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    • Profile picture of the author FredJones
      Oh no, so did I !! When did you complete writing it? Did I win the race?

      Originally Posted by tylerdrun View Post

      Oh god, I just wrote an article...

      @OP - yes, take care when you build links. Start slowly by building a few links a day, and then accelerate. in other words, increase the rate of link building per day with every passing day for the next 3 monts. Also make sure that the links are coming from sites of different nature (social bookmarks, articles, press releases, videos, rss, web 2.0 and so on) to get the maximum results. You ought to be at top-3 after 4 months or so unless you are targeting some terribly competitive keyword.
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  • Profile picture of the author christopherNV
    Banned
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    • Profile picture of the author tylerdrun
      Originally Posted by christopherNV View Post

      I'm gonna spin it!
      I am gonna kill you... lol.
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    • Profile picture of the author edmltw
      Originally Posted by christopherNV View Post

      I'm gonna spin it!
      I'm gonna PLR-ise it!

      Ed

      p.s. joking!
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  • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
    Text links backlinks are very much fake.
    That is so untrue I don't know where to start. Webmasters link to sites they like every day. Nothing fake about it. Bloggers link to bloggers every day. Nothing fake about it. Forum signature links and article resource box links are text links, nothing fake about them and the search engines seem to love them. Almost all links are text links.

    Maybe you didn't mean what you actually said?
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    • Profile picture of the author tylerdrun
      Originally Posted by Dennis Gaskill View Post

      That is so untrue I don't know where to start. Webmasters link to sites they like every day. Nothing fake about it. Bloggers link to bloggers every day. Nothing fake about it. Forum signature links and article resource box links are text links, nothing fake about them and the search engines seem to love them. Almost all links are text links.

      Maybe you didn't mean what you actually said?
      Yeah... I think u are right. Text backlinks do count. But using services to build text backlinks may not work? or it could not be that effective?

      I'll have to sum up that all backlinks out. I was referring to text backlinks from link farms.

      But clearly... text backlinks are pretty much the same as article backlinks when it comes to search engines.

      The authority of the site linking does count to an extent though. If it has tons of outbound links on the same page, I'd say it is a link that doesn't count that much.
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  • Profile picture of the author InitialEffort
    There was a good article someone wrote in the Warrior Room about link velocity, you should subscribe and check it out if you haven't. (I see you are a member, so you'll be able to see it)
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    • Profile picture of the author Karan Goel
      Originally Posted by InitialEffort View Post

      There was a good article someone wrote in the Warrior Room about link velocity, you should subscribe and check it out if you haven't. (I see you are a member, so you'll be able to see it)
      Maybe this is the one

      http://www.warriorforum.com/war-room...-you-care.html
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
        Originally Posted by Karan Goel View Post

        And, what can be better than an answer from Matt Cutts, himself.

        YouTube - Is there such a thing as building too many links?

        Karan
        A copy of the brief that told Matt what he could and could not say publicly...

        As for non-natural link building...

        I'm sure a company with the resources Google has is aware of how many build their links. For example, a new site often makes a push by using the available tools to list themselves in as many directories, vertical search engines, etc. as possible. So one could quite naturally have hundreds or thousands of such links in a day quite naturally.

        On the other hand, links from a forum profile on an astrophysics board at MIT to an organ-enlargement offer, for example, seems unnatural to me. Especially if there are hundreds of such links, all anchored by the same keyword.

        Which brings up another point...

        It's quite natural to have a variety of anchors for your links, including a company name, the page url itself, and even the infamous 'click here'. If you have thousands of links, all with the same anchor text, you might be playing with fire.

        Ditto with having all of your links focused on one page, unless it's the only page on the site.

        At some point, zero outbound links might be a possible footprint.

        The most natural pattern I can come up with is something like this:

        > When a site launches, get a pile of links from directories and search sites.

        > Link to the site from a wide variety of sources using a wide variety of anchor text. It's okay to focus on a few key phrases, but not having the others at all is unnatural.

        > Link to internal pages, especially from social media. People trying to recommend something (i.e. 'vote' for it) will link directly to the page they are recommending, not a home page or sales page.

        Caution: this is my thinking on the subject, not to be confused with actual results with documented experimental data.
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        • Profile picture of the author flipfl0p
          Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post


          > When a site launches, get a pile of links from directories and search sites.

          > Link to the site from a wide variety of sources using a wide variety of anchor text. It's okay to focus on a few key phrases, but not having the others at all is unnatural.

          Caution: this is my thinking on the subject, not to be confused with actual results with documented experimental data.
          Got new knowledge from you john just 2 questions.
          1. Do you recommend outsourcing bookmarking? If so Is it advisable to hire bookmarkers every week and have duplicate bookmarks for example in DIGG??

          2. Can you explain this?
          > Link to the site from a wide variety of sources using a wide variety of anchor text. It's okay to focus on a few key phrases, but not having the others at all is unnatural.

          hehe thanks John. love your answer ^^,
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          • Profile picture of the author thetruth23
            Originally Posted by tylerdrun View Post

            I'd say that google doesn't care. You can build as much as one million backlinks in one day and not worry about it.

            Sure it will take time to show up in the top 10. But building a million backlinks in a day is not going to get you banned or even cause any trouble to your site.

            Google appreciates you to build links to your site. It wants to find your site. And the more sites that link to your site, the easier for google to rank your content.

            What google recommends is content syndication instead of traditional text link backlinks.

            Text links backlinks are very much fake. Whereas the natural backlinks from your article are normal.

            Let's say your article gets published on a high profile article directory like EZA. And your article gets picked up by publishers. Let's say about 10,000 publishes republish your article on their blog or website.

            And you get 10k backlinks. Will google regard it as spam? the answer is no.

            If they did, Google'd go officially out of business.

            Social bookmarking is very much effective. Most sites only allow one bookmark per url. So it is obvious that some user bookmarked the page... Even if you did, it's not gonna appear as you did.

            Same IP links don't count that much. Yep, that's kinda true. But who would be having 100s of sites on their own IP and interlinking them? That kind of strategy is completely stupid and tiresome.

            But if you do something like article submissions then it will work. Or forum posts with backlinks. All of it will work.

            Google doesn't trust authority sites that much either. If it did, they'd again go out of business.

            Your backlink building does not affect your ranking. It affects your PR.

            And your PR affects your ranking to a significant extent.

            That is.. if your site has a high PR and you have an article published it gets top 10 position instantaneously. But if it does not have a high PR, then you will have to build some backlinks to that article or web page.

            Given that all of us are aware of SEO and everyone tries to build backlinks to their pages to rank for a keyword, Google has accepted that fact as that's how it is.

            Google loves content that gets syndicated. However, there will be only one site that will rank in the search engine because of duplicate content(for user's readability).

            Wouldn't you get annoyed if you keep going to a different site everytime but got to read the same content over and over again?

            To improve quality for it's users, google only allows one site to rank. If the site gets taken down, usally the site with the next best PR or popularlity or backlinks with the same content will rank.
            Originally Posted by tylerdrun View Post

            Oh god, I just wrote an article...
            Yeah, you did dude, i'm just not sure all the information you presented was accurate.

            Anyhow, just a friendly reminder to newbies on the forum: Don't believe everything you read here, please.
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            • Profile picture of the author flipfl0p
              Where can I get quality backlink directory here guys? like quality bookmarking site/article directory site? it seems that all the info about these sites here in the forums seems overcrowded and I cannot get any access to real quality links. Can anyone help me with this?
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      • Profile picture of the author esteban307
        Thanks for all the input..!
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  • Profile picture of the author D Baker
    Originally Posted by esteban307 View Post

    Hi, I am building some backlinks for my site and I read an article that said that Google has an algorithm to detect non-natural backlinking. Basically, I am using social bookmarks and article directories. Is there are certain type of randomness I need to build into my backlinking strategy?

    Thanks.
    1. You will need to be consistent with your link building and keep building links every day.
    2. Vary your anchor text so that not all your links will be with the same anchor text.
    3. Create links from no follow sites as having all your links from Do Follow sites will not look natural to Google.
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  • Profile picture of the author seoforu
    Yes I agree...you can build as many links as you can but make it look natural and google would love it.
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    Guest post links are effective when they are contextual and natural!!

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  • Profile picture of the author jazbo
    Google wants us to behave. So they tell us how big and bad they are and how they will slap your sites down for stepping out of line. The reality is that unless you do something incredibly stupid, or are very unlucky, if you do not utilise all the tools in the armoury then you are missing out.

    The guy in front of you in the SERPs probably does not subscribe to "Google fear". The pictures from the wizard of oz tell you all you need to know about google's webspam team.

    My analogy, is that in the Normandy campaign in WW2, every German tank was one of the feared Tiger tanks in the eyes of the untrained allied soldiers. This fear propagated until it was a serious issue, despite the fact that there were only about 100 tiger tanks in the whole of France.....
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by jazbo View Post

      Google wants us to behave. So they tell us how big and bad they are and how they will slap your sites down for stepping out of line. The reality is that unless you do something incredibly stupid, or are very unlucky, if you do not utilise all the tools in the armoury then you are missing out.
      I almost agree with this.

      A whole complex of some of the brightest minds in the industry isn't quite the same thing as an old man behind a curtain.

      My take is that the various tools available are not a secret at the Googleplex. They know about article submitters and other tools. I would wager that Google owns most of them under one user name or another.

      Bottom line, they know people use tools.

      Use the tools to do things that they would expect you to do anyway by hand, no problem.

      Use the tools to try and fool the system, rather than working with it, and you pay a price if you get caught.
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  • Profile picture of the author Norman Archibald
    This is very helpful! Thanks for the posts. I'm trying to build optimize my site naturally without getting penalized. It's hard work!
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  • Profile picture of the author Jontz
    None is getting any "natural" links today really. To come as close as natural as you can, you should have a lot of different methods. I use social bookmarking, article writing, forum posting, blog commenting, 3-way link exchange, setting up satellite sites.
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