LIVE CASE STUDY - Bring The Fresh vs. Extreme Niche Empires vs. Google Sniper 2

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You can still read all about my first experiment in this thread, but I advise you to check the new, better one here:
http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...xperiment.html

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Hello all!

I admit it. I have been absorbed by the huge number of moneymaking methods and tactics out there, and have been pulled in 1000 different directions. What's worse, without even knowing if any of them was good.

But some time ago I decided to put an end to this taking MASSIVE ACTION and I started seeing some results.

As my next action-taking step and, at the same time, as a way to give back to this community by sharing my results with you LIVE, I'll run an experiment.

Here's what I've decided to do:



I've chosen three well known methods, which in the end follow a very similar approach: choose a niche and one or a few related products, select some targetted keywords, and build a site around them to make money selling as an affiliate (there's an additional monetization method in one of them, that I'll mention later in the case study).

These methods are:
  1. Bring the Fresh by Kelly Felix and Mike Long
  2. Extreme Niche Empires by Sean Donahoe
  3. Google Sniper 2 by George Brown.
I'll be following the basic training included with the initial payment for each of these methods, not the advanced or upgraded "flavours".

As I build my sites following these methods, I'll be tracking and posting the following magnitudes:
  1. Time spent working on each one
  2. Money spent working on each one (I already have hosting, so I won't compute this cost to any of them).
  3. Position in Google for their main keyword, and maybe some secondary keywords.
  4. Number of visits to the site
  5. Earnings

No, I won't reveal the niche or keywords as part of the case study

Apart of that, I'll also be reporting my progress, detailing any roadblocks I may find, and how I overcome any issues.

Of course, I may not be able to give too much detail sometimes, as it's not my intention to reveal the methods themselves here, I have to protect their creators' IP. I hope you'll understand

I'd like to make it as impartial as possible, so that the results are somewhat comparable, so here are the conditions that will rule my experiment / case study:
  1. I'll use the same niche for the three of them, so that they target the same audience. For instance (I'll use this niche as an example here, but it won't be the real one), they may all target "hard-core gamers".
  2. I'll promote physical products in all cases, so that no difference arises based on the likelyhood of buying / refunding digital vs. physical goods. For instance, I may promote gaming accessories like headsets, keyboards, mouses, etc.
  3. I'll also try to use the same marketplace, likely Amazon, so that differences in the checkout process don't affect results.
  4. So that sites don't compete against each other in google, they'll target different products and keywords. However, I'll try to choose products that serve similar functions and share simlar prices, for the same reason as above.
  5. I'll follow the searches and competition levels suggested by each method, searches as reported by the Google External Keyword Tool, and easiness to rank or competition levels as reported by Market Samurai / Traffic Travis.
  6. I'll try to follow all the methods to the letter; if for some reason I had to deviate from them, I'd explain where and why.
  7. As I have no preference for any of the methods, I'll speak of them and build their sites following an alphabetical order, as I did in the post subject. This does not mean Bring the Fresh is "number one" except for the fact that it starts with a B and the others don't
  8. If I decide to outsource some task for one site, I'll outsource the same or similar tasks for the others, so that the cost and time spent on each are somewhat comparable.

IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER: I know the results . So don't take this case study as the end-all be-all of how each of these methods perform by themselves or as compared to the other two.

Who knows, maybe one works like charm for the niche I choose and Amazon products, but another one would have beat it promoting a digital product from Clickbank and the third would have trashed the others had I chosen a different keyword for its site.

Also, my results may not be comparable to yours if you followed any of them, as we all have different technical, marketing and sales backgrounds.

You know, the only way you'll find to BE SURE how good any method works FOR YOU it's by testing it yourself.

But I hope the experiment yields some interesting results that we can all learn from. At least, I hope I'll achieve some results with all of them just because I'LL TAKE ACTION, and we can at least learn from that.

Next stop: niche / keyword research.

As you see I have a daunting task ahead. Wish me luck!

Mikel

PS: let me know what you think of this case study, and if you think there's something I may be missing, or something else you'd like me to share with you.

PS2: if you like this experiment, please click the thanks button below!
#search engine optimization #bring #case #empires #extreme #fresh #niche #sniper #study
  • This should be quite interesting. I don't know all 3 methods - I know Google Sniper 2 and a bit about BTF, and I have a feeling that the results could be very similar.

    Are you planning to do the keyword research and backlinking strategies as prescribed per each method also, or are you going to use your own methods for all 3 sites?
    • [2] replies
    • This sounds great, I will be following this thread closely!
      • [1] reply
    • Regarding the techniques and tools I use in order to find possible keywords, I'll use what the methods suggest but I'll complement it with further techniques I use and tools I have.

      BUT in order to select the final target keyword out of those I find, I'll make sure I stick to the rules detailed in each method about search volume and competition.

      Regarding promotion (backlinking etc.) I'll do exactly as each of them teach, so that we can see the differences in rankings I achieve with each.
      • [1] reply
  • Looking forward for this best of luck =)
  • Great experience, i will follow it closely as well
    • [1] reply
    • Well, these have been two pretty intense days, but I've finally finished my keyword research, and registered my domains.

      It has taken longer than expected, but I know it's not been because of the methods themselves. I was imposing additional constraints to them (like forcing the sites and thus the keywords to be in a given niche -the same for all three-, and targetting physical products, for instance). I guess that if I had been 100% free to go where the keyword discovery process had leaded me, I would have found one more easily.

      I've also came up with some unexpected (and important) findings along the way, that I'll tell you about later, but first let's summarize what I've done until now:

      1. I selected a niche and found different products on Amazon I could promote.
      2. I started my Keyword Research process. Basically, I created custom filter presets in Market Samurai, named BTF, ENE and GS2, and populated each of them with the appropriate search volume and competition values for each method. This really eased the filtering process a lot, and once you do it, it's done forever.
      3. Finding a keyword for Bring The Fresh was not immediate, but happened relatively easily. In fact, I found several possible keywords, and there were a couple of exact match domains so I bough both. I'll only build one of the two possible sites for this case study, the other one will be used in the future.
      4. Regarding Extreme Niche Empires, I went through the training videos again, and it turns out it doesn't rely on a single keyword, but a list of 10 related keywords for a site; so it's not as laser-focused as the other two methods, it advocates for larger sites. And it's much more aggressive regarding the competition it advises to go against. So it took me a while -more than twice it had taken me for BTF-, but I found a list of 9 keywords that match Sean's criteria. Luckily enough, the exact match domain for the most general of these keywords was available, so I purchased it. Voila!
      5. And finally, GS2. Boy, that was hard! . In fact, it was becoming so hard I had to "bend the rules" a bit, in order to find a keyword with enough searches but not too many competitors; I just allowed myself to pick a keyword with a competition level which is a bit higher than advised, but George himself admits to target such levels in one of the videos so I'm not completely off-limits. I spent almost the whole evening today looking for that keyword, but I finally found it. And with an exact match domain available. So, mission accomplished.
      6. I bought the domains through Namecheap and pointed them to my hosting account.

      As I said in the beginning, I came up with me up some additional interesting things that I though I should share with you.

      1. One of the possible keywords I had found was said to have 1200+ phrase searches monthly. I almost bought the exact-match domain, that was available. Luckily enough, I decided to take a look in Google Trends, to find that the traffic was almost non-existant until feb 2010, it started to rise significantly until october 2010, and then declined until february 2011, when it reached a negligible level again. I have no idea why search volume for this keyword spiked and then disspaeared, but I guess Google was using the average in order to report those 1200 searches / month; well, that's not the case now AT ALL. Targetting that keyword would have been a terrible mistake.
      2. Another product related keyword also looked good, but after the surprise above, I decided to look at Google Trends again. I kid you not: do you know these "news" Google displays beside the search volume graph? well, they all spoke about deaths, recalls by the manufacturer, and how finally the product was banned in the US. This could have been even a worse mistake than the one above! I could have built a site for a product I cannot sell!!
      3. And finally, some geographic issues: in some cases, I found some idioms or expressions that seem to be widely used in the UK, but not at all in the US; in other cases, the same expression is used in both countries, but the keyword is still searched for more often in the UK than in the US. This may be irrelevant if you plan to monetize via adsense, or selling an info product, but it's not if you plan to sell Amazon products, because Amazon has a UK store where I presume all UK users would buy, and the affiliate cookie is not shared by the US and the UK sites.

      So, what are the until now?

      1. Never go for a keyword blindly, based only on the data reported by the keyword tools. Always double check that information with Google Trends and Google Insights for Search. Verify the search volume is stable or increasing.
      2. Beware of the global search volume as opposed to local search volume figures. Make sure your keyword is searched for in the countries you want to target.
      3. Know your market. Or do a little research before you enter it. Just in case you start promoting a banned product
      4. As Amazon products are targetted by many marketers, building laser-targetted sites (like BTF or GS2) for Amazon products can be a bit tough in certain markets, especially if your target audience does not (in significant numbers, I mean) look for product models / names in Google. It's easier in some markets like electronics, where users are much more likely to search for model names in Google, and there are thousands of product names, so competition is not so hard.
      5. If no particular product names can be targetted, then you may want to target "product category"-type keywords, though the competition levels for those keywords are often too high for these type of strategies (so that I make myself clear, I mean general product category keywords like "Dual-Suspension Mountain Bike" for instance, as opposed to brand/model keywords like "Mongoose Status 3.0 Dual-Suspension Mountain Bike").
      6. Another tactic that may work in these cases is to find a keyword related not directly to the product, but to the need the product fullfils, so that you can build a site around that keyword, and then promote the product as the solution.
      7. If you plan to sell amazon products, check where the majority of your visits may come from, in case you have to use an Amazon store other than the US one. If your audience is split among different countries (USA, UK, Canada) you either have to promote to the biggest market and thus loose the comissions for the others, which will cut your profits or -as I'll likely do- use some geotargetting plugin and present the correct store depending on where the visit comes from.
      Well, that's all for now. Tomorrow, I'll start building the sites, and at some point during the weekend or maybe next Monday, I'll start with the promotion and backlinking phase.

      Hope you find this useful!

      Mikel
      • [ 12 ] Thanks
  • Very comprehensive case study! Great stuff!!
  • This is looking very interesting cant wait to see what happens. Good luck
    • [1] reply
    • I'm really looking forward to this. Please do continue until the end.
      • [1] reply
  • Subscribed and watching with interest!
  • Awesome. I always love following case studies. I'll be keeping my eye on this one.
  • This will be great thread. Keep it alive for a long time



  • Very useful information, thank you for sharing. Looking forward to an update soon!
  • Just saw this thread- I am embarking on BTF now- Really interested to see the rest of the process you are taking. Subscribed
  • Wanna see what happens..
  • bookmarked!! any progress in last 10 days?
    • [1] reply

    • I too am watching closly, I am familiar with Sniper but not the other two. Look forward to the final verdict.
      • [1] reply
  • Yes, I have some news indeed.



    Hey, how's that for a marketing headline for this post?

    Well, here's the situation:
    • I'm behind my expected schedule, mainly due to the problems I'll tell you about. I should already be well in the "promotion" phase, and I just finished my content and on-site SEO for the three sites.
    • Regarding the BTF site, since the last time we talked -hmm.. kinda - I have just added the main money-making post this week, pointing to the Amazon product I chose for this site.
    • The GS2 site is also finished, I added an additional article type post, and the main money-making post this week, also pointing to Amazon.
    • And ENE has been the cornerstone of all my struggles this past weeks.
      • First of all, as I told you this method advocates for much bigger sites, with at least 10 main money-making posts. As writing articles is not what I like best and I was busy with other ventures aside of this experiment, I decided to outsource the writing of 8 long (750 words) posts.
      • I used the service offered by Fweez, as I had some credits sitting there. The first obstacle in my advance was their turnaround time. They were apparently a bit overloaded with requests, and it took 10 days for them to deliver.
      • As -if I remember correctly- I used a 50% discount coupon to purchased these credits, the cost was 30 bucks, which is approx 0,005 a word. And the quality was quite good; except for the first paragraph in one of the articles, which I re-wrote, I published everything as it was delivered.
      • So I had all my content online; then I had to "start the cyclone". Without getting into much detail so that I don't reveal too much of the what, how and why of the method, let's say it involves some auto-blogging.
      • And hell broke loose First, in order to do that, Sean provides two wordpress plugins as part of ENE. But they are encrypted and they use IonCube to support that encryption. I tried and tried to install and make that work in the hosting provider I was using, without luck.
      • So, I had to move the whole site to a new host. Thank god I had WPTwin... I love you, Jason Fladlien and Will Matos! So I made the copy with WPTwin, pointed the DNSs to one of my other hosting accounts, waited.... and waited... and waited till the DNSs propagated and my ISP finally noticed they had changed, and restored the site in the new host (reinstalling it took like 3 minutes once everything was pointed correctly).
      • In this new host it took me a while but I managed to have IonCube installed and my PHP.ini files working smoothly, but I finally did it.
      • So I finally had that part working... almost, as in the past days there seems to be a problem with one of the four main types of auto-posted contents, that is not affecting me but also other users of ENE. It does not invalidate the method or make it unusable, but it reduces its efficiency; hopefully Sean will come up with a fix soon. Otherwise, I'll switch to another plugin that does something similar, as using Sean's plugin is not mandatory, it's just something you have at your disposal as part of the program but you can use similar ones if you have them.
      • In any case, I managed to have some additional 30-something posts in that site created automatically.
    That's the situation now content-wise.

    Regarding how the sites are performing (remember, I haven't done any promotion to any of them yet):
    • My BTF site has been indexed completely; it's sitting steadily in position 5 in google and 3 in Bing, and is already receiving some visits. I won't tell you the exact numbers yet as I just published my main post, I want to give it more time to rank for additional keywords.
    • My GS2 site is already fully indexed also, and is currently in page 3 in Google, and receiving no visits yet.
    • My ENE site is partially indexed, and not ranking yet. As I said in the previous post, this is not unexpected as it's targetting much more competitive terms. Obviously, no visits.
    So, up until now I'm most satisfied with my BTF site, as it's the one that took me less time to research and build and the one that is getting the best rankings.

    But I must not be too short-sighted, as I start promoting them results may change significantly in the near future.

    So, next, on to backlinking!!!

    Mikel

    Ooooh, I almost forgot !

    I was checking indexed pages and backlinks using the rank tracker in market samurai and, as expected, my BTF and ENE had 0 backlinks... but my GS2 site showed approx. 150 backlinks.

    As I have done no backlinking, I checked SEOMoz, and it turns out there was a site with my exact domain name -and obviously, tightly related content- live until Dec 2010, and it had been backlinked with some articles and some "site information type" links.

    So, why is this semi-pleasant?
    • On one side, it's work someone already did for me. I'm immensely grateful to whoever it was
    • Regarding the experiment, it may slightly affect results, as it turns out the GS2 site starts with some advantage as compared to the other two. In any case, as I will backlink the three much more heavily, in a few weeks that number of backlinks shouldn't be relevant anymore.
    • And the ugly side of the coin: if someone had this domain and had created some content last year, and let it expire, it's obvious he/she was not making much money out of the site. The question is why:
      • Was it because he was too lazy to persevere until the site ranked high enough to get traffic? Then it shouldn't affect me, but...
      • Was it because he was not able to monetize the traffic he was getting? Maybe the traffic doesn't convert for this keyword, and if that were the case, well... I'm doomed!
    We'll see in the future, rest assured I will let you know!

    Mikel
    • [ 7 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • its the coolest thing you're dong man.

      I'll follow this thread until see some good results from either method.

      Thanks for the efforts to help all of us saving time and money!
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    • [1] reply
    • Hey Mikel-

      As everyone else is saying, thanks!

      One question I have: I'm working through the BTF guide right now and also purchased a new WSO on Amazon sites and hope to combine the two to maximize value.

      Question: If you are targeting an item or items for the BTF site, which I assume you are doing, are you being ultra specific (ie. Brand + Model + Reviews), kinda specific (ie. Brand + Model) or just specific enough (ie. Toilet Seat Covers) in your quest?

      The reason I ask is that in the basic version of BTF, I don't see this really discussed. The obvious answer I assume would be if I could get a vague term with lesser competition that would be best but those are needles in haystacks. Just trying to look ahead a bit.

      Thanks for the effort.

      JR
  • very interesting since im using GS2
    • [1] reply
    • :confused: i am sorry, what ist GS2, never heard
      • [1] reply
  • Very interesting Thread...I am using ENE method to build my niche sites...lets see how you go with your sites and which system is more robust....will follow this thread
  • I'm very green,very new to all of this. I chose ENE because of the idea of "authority content" versus the regenerated garbage I find all over the web, and also because it sounded like it would provide a legitimate way to get in without gettin slapped around (as sean likes to say) by panda.

    the idea of going after a tiny piece of a big market is scary!

    and reading so far i wonder if i chose the right product.

    I wanted to check out BTF but honestly I can not afford $97 at one time (with ENE i am having to go slowly because of costs.. hosting and domains aren't too bad but i need to get a good article tool and some other things i haven't even uncovered yet lol so i have to get them piece by piece.. this may take forever!)

    and i know people say "if you need money quickly try something else" but i'm not looking for overnight riches.. i'm looking for long term, something i can build into a business and change my sons life with.

    this thread is fascinating.. and if nothing else has tipped me off to a few things i didn't know before.. or gave me enough of a clue to go investigating. as i said, i'm about as green as they come.

    but i'm itchy all over in my brain wondering if i should scrimp and save until i can afford BTF too lol. since i can do nothing now, and i'm elbow deep in ENE, i'll keep reading this thread, keep slogging through ENE and hope the first project I picked is a good one! but after reading this.. i may pause and start a second track (this is already my 4th idea but a 5th might just be better!)

    Thanks so much for doing this experiment!
    • [1] reply
    • Don't do it! That's the big danger in IM. Everything sounds so good and so cool that you just HAVE to get each shiny new thing. This isn't meant to reflect in a bad way on any programs out there. Most all of them will work IF YOU STICK TO ONE AT A TIME AND FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS.

      Good luck!
      • [ 3 ] Thanks
  • Has subscribed this thread and looking forward to your update.
  • WoW! Killah! Working the ENE modules and have the BTF starter waiting on my HD so arriving on this thread is pure clairvoyance.

    And there's even some headsup as to what the ENE IonCube requirement might have in store.
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  • Great Information!
    I love this kind of testing/evaluating. I will keep an eye.
    I took the ENE route like a month ago. I have not made any money yet. But we will see what happens. I can not wait to see your results!
  • This is an interesting experiment.I thought Google Sniper and Bring the fresh is kind of similar.The more advanced SEO stuffs is probably ENE and Bring the Fresh forum.

    Thanks for making the efforts to post your progress.
  • Banned
    awesome thread
  • I cant wait to for the next update.
    This method takes time but in the long run it is worth it. Currently I have sites with sitesell or SBI which are a few years old. Their system is excellent and I rank number 1 for 40 or so pages and earn some extra change also. I am very open to these methods and seeing which performs the best.
  • Any updates Mike?!
  • Ditto. Any updates???
    • [1] reply
    • This thread has such a potential. I hope You are all right and will come back soon.

      Waiting for updates on this thread is like, waiting for new episodes of your favorite TV series, during season break.
  • Awesome thread! cant wait to hear the latest update
  • Nice live experiments like these always give confidence to future purchasers of the products
  • This thread kinda keeps my passion for IM burning. I'm setting a tent here for updates.
  • Any updates
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • One Month and waiting for an UPDATE please!

      Absolutely LOVE this thread. Thank YOU!!!!!
      • [2] replies
  • I've bookmarked this. Thanks for sharing
  • Great thread- thanks for this. Learning about some great WP stuff too
  • I looking forward to see which will do better..
    This way I know what to buy ! thanks
    • [1] reply
    • Finally an update yeey !!!
      Congratz on making some money already.
      And as far as not doing as much as fast as you expected, don't worry about it. Just continue doing it even if it's going much slower than you expected.
      Remember that it's better to walk slowly than not to walk at all.
  • I wonder if you have any thoughts on how these sites perform vs. larger content sites. I've seen in the last few months that sites with more content seem to perform better.
    • [1] reply
    • Generally speaking, my experience has been quite similar lately. Of all my sites, those where I add more content regularly and have more "depth" so to speak tend to rank better and keep their rankings longer without a huge backlinking effort.

      It's not that I've tried to build hundreds of sniper type sites, though, so maybe someone can report a different experience.
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
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  • Banned
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  • I've always have a thing for case studies... thanks for this Mikel, I want to click the thanks button, but it seem that my post count or something else hasn't allowed me to see the thanks button.

    Edit: Nevermind, I see the thanks button now.
  • No updates yet Mikel?We are waiting to see what progress you made from the 3 different programs.
  • Looking forward for news...
  • BRAVO!!! You are teaching so much...including the amount of real work that goes into having successful outcomes. So much for all those one-click solutions.....
  • This is an excellent thread with loads of good info and makes you realize that this forum still has great people.
    Many congratulations and good luck.
    Rgds
    Ben
  • This is a good online case study, it gives direction on what to do in terms of online marketing. However, it would be great to see some more updates.
  • Wow... I just came across this thread and had no idea anyone had really put these methods to such an extensive test.

    I see some people are dissapointed with our support and I feel very ashamed that some of you have felt that we have abandoned this project as it could not be further from the case. We have a dedicated support staff ready to help with any questions you have at Internet Marketing Success Center and you can contact our team of Wordpress experts at any time with any issues or questions you have.

    The blogfeeder has been causing problems for some people due to changes in Article Directory attitudes to auto-posters after the panda update and we did add an additional article directory to the system but we do recommend tools like WP-Robot etc for more professional autoblogging. I was not trying to reinvent the wheel with autoblogging but understood that some people would not want to shell out $75+ for another plugin once they purchased the course.

    Actually we are in the process of adding another 1000 sites to our existing Extreme Niche Empire here at IMSC. So this system is under constant development and we will be releasing an updated version next year to stay in line with the current Google climate and changes.

    Autoblogging and the methods we recommend work very well to create real income over time and like I say, its all about scale and automation.

    We are also working on much more simplified versions of this approach for future products and even our next product Commission Commando is based on AutoBlogging to some degree with more emphasis on Social Media Traffic to ignore Google and its updates.

    I am actually in the process of adding 2 more article directories to the blogfeeder but again, I do recommend more pro tools like WP-Robot that have many more years in the field behind it

    You can also get free content feeders from places like Blogger High that work pretty well but not in the same vein as Blogfeeder and WP-Robot.

    I was also asked why we removed the forum. There was 2 reasons, 1 there was a lot of spam and abuse and we were not able to keep up with a lot of that and also because of the perception that we were not supporting this product. We wanted to direct more people to the support center so we can help people more directly. The forums rather than being a help ended up being a hindrance in that regard.

    So, after reading this excellent thread I hope that helps clear some things up and I would also like to invite everyone to check out our new TV show IMSCTV here and leave any comments you feel like.

    Also you can ask a question directly on our site and if enough people ask the same question we can make it a subject of future shows.

    All the best

    Sean

    IMSCTV - IMSC TV | Just another WordPress site
    Ask a Question - Ask Sean a Question
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
  • So is this still a live thread? Or is it the proposed WSO now? No offence Wealth Mentor, but I think we need to here from Mikel on this.
  • Thanks for your in-depth analysis some really valuable information here, has answered many of my questions about article posting and making correct use of article spinners. Will have to test some of these out myself
  • hi mikel: i just want to thank you for the huge efforts and time you have invested in this live case study operation just to help out fellow newbies on this forum you are really a caring and genuine person. i promise that if you ever create WSO i'll purchase it without demanding a reviews or even asking you whether it will help me make money or not ...just pm with your email for future contact..
  • Thanks for sharing this.
    • [1] reply
  • Hey man, keep it up!! You are doing a great job!
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • Being caught in the "endless shiney object syndrome" I really appreciate this post.
    thanks again for giving insight on how to work at this stuff.
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply

    • Id gladly donate a Backlink Energizer plugin and up to 10 BLISS CLuster paks [ web 2 accounts ] for the energizer installs to post TO - as well as advise and assist in the backlinking indexation process and tips.

      pinging and rolling rss feeds by themselves may not produce the quality results they want.
      • [1] reply
  • You are right MarketWarlord. I won't completely sign Sean off as I respect anyone who is willing to put their a** on the line to launch any type of IM product, especially here in the WF where people will call you out on it. I just need a breather because I too have experienced other so called gurus that dropped the ball after I've devoted much time and money into a project from them. I'm calmer now and you have definitely made me realize that I may have been a little tough on Sean. After all, he did come back here to explain the situation and I do give him props for that. But in the 50 years I've been walking around on this rock, I've found that customers aren't always so forgiving. I understand how things can go awry and would just like anyone who may have read my reply to realize that when you launch an IM product, you are asking a lot of people to trust you and when that trust is broken it is extremely hard to rebuild. I wish Sean the best. He is apparently back on top of his game again with Commission Commando as I get emails from all kinds of gurus promoting his products (probably 3 or 4 a day) so, he obviously has an extensive following. Sorry if I came off too harsh, but everyone should learn from this. Heck, I'm not sure if I would ever offer a WSO or IM product just for the very reasons that he's mentioned. I'm sure I will end up checking out one of his products in the future. It's inevitable when you're talking about someone like Sean. He obviously has his foot firmly planted in the door and I doubt anyone will ever completely shut him out. Live and learn my friend.
    • [1] reply

    • I definitely hear you. I have been trying to get my nerve up to do a product and put it in a WSO. It seems that trust is a frail thing, especially in the IM realm; and for good reason. It's too easy to take advantage of people... and some people sure do that.

      I agree with you that people need to realize that putting something out for others to use is a serious undertaking. On the flip side... that is what I kind of like about this forum and the WSOs. If your stuff survives that... then it is a really good sign that it is of value.

      Nice talkin to you! Best of luck too!
  • It has been about two months now for last update on this post. Is Mikel already back from his holiday?

    Love to hear more about this topic.

    Or is this already down the WSO route?

    Anybody got insight on Mikel, like how he is doing right now or where he is, maybe some of you know him personal?

    Anyway hope to see something happening in here soon.
  • I find this case study quite interesting. Can you give an update with respect to the performance of each program? I would really like to know the results so far.
  • I just came across this thread today while checking Warrior views on EME before buying into it. I have had some success with GS2, but have been folloing Matthew Carter's training over the past few months.
    This thread is easily the most valuable forum contribution I have seen in my two years in this game and I am happy to contribute to the Tip Jar. $3.50 just seems far too little to keep Mikel motivated... Is anything happening on the idea? Mile, are you still at it?
    • [1] reply

    • Yes, one day at a time...making progress on all three...damn, these are not the easy so called "make money quick" programs...I don't give a damn what the promoters are saying...
      • [1] reply
  • [DELETED]
  • Banned
    [DELETED]
  • No update so far in this exciting thread?
  • I haven't read the entire thread but I bet GS 2.0 got it's ass wupped.

    James Scholes
  • I really eager to see the result over the next 2 or 3 months. I don't know about BTF and GS2 (I don't have them) but ENE is very very good tutorial, top notch, unfortunately it has One drawback. Within the course, Sean shows an example (real website that he built from the scratch step by step, so anyone can follow it easily) with all the easy but very smart traffic strategies and excellent tools that he provide, but I could not find that site live, why?
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • Sean took down his example website after he finished making the videos.
  • I become Bring The Fresh Full Disclosure member recently, I have to say that the materials are excellent, but as a fresh member, I have also to say that communication with Bring The Fresh Owners are very insufficient, because I bought their "Deluxe Guaranteed Rankings DFY package" on 29th January 2012 (My PayPal payment ID transaction number is 05B072838G158230U), but up until now I don't know the status of my order. I have sent e-mail twice to 'kellysfelix@gmail.com' (on 30 and 31st Jan 2011) and another one to 'kellyandmike@bringthefresh.com' early today (1st feb 2012). Those 2 e-mail addresses are the official contact point within the members area.

    I write this not to rush bring the fresh team with my tiny order, I just want to know the status of that order.

    I am still waiting for the reply, and I write this in warrior forum, hoping that either Kelly or Mike or their staff can see this post and can help me out
  • @Itchydog : thanks for your info
  • Mike have contacted me, and also Mario from BTF, it seems that we had little problem on e-mail communication but now everything seems OK.

    To Mike and his team, Thank you very much for your attention
  • Hello all, I'm back!

    This may be a long post, as I plan to cover the following:
    1 - An explanation of why I've been missing all this time, which I think I owe you.
    2 - The situation with the sites I created for the experiment as of now
    3 - Important conclussions about this experiment
    4- What do you want me to do of this thread from now on?

    So, here we go.

    1 - What I've been up to.

    Well, I've been up to a lot of things in the past months, and there's an important lesson I've learned in that time:

    No matter what your plans, intention and schedule are, LIFE GETS IN THE WAY.

    I was moving to a "new" apartment closer to the center of my town (BIlbao), which I was having rehabilitated. Long story short, the works that should have ended in July ended in October, after no few headaches for me. Moving there was also a slight nightmare, and afterwards I had quasi-legal problems with one of my new neighbours.

    So I was severely distracted for months, and I could only focus on several offline projects I had signed contracts for with a few customers.

    So, lesson learned: never again assume that things will always go smoothly, and plan your efforts and compromises assuming you'll be working at your maximum capacity and efficiency.

    The good news is all is well now, so I'm up and running again. And I don't plan to move to a new place EVER

    2 - The situation with the sites

    As you can ssume from the previous section, I haven't had time to work at all on those sites, so they've been "on their own". How have they done since I last reported?

    - The GS2 site stabilized at position #1 in Bing, and page 3 in Google and Yahoo. The daily traffic curve looks like a function generating random numbers between 1 and 7 , with less than 100 visits a month. I only achieved one conversion (physical product sale), so I've lost a few bucks with this site.

    - The BTF site is stable at position #11 in Google, #5 in Yahoo and #3 in Bing. It receives a few more visits than the previous one, but nothing significant. I've also made a single sale, that mostly covered the cost of the domain.

    - Regarding the ENE site, the situation is more complex. If you rememeber, I created 9 money pages, plus many automatically generated posts. Supposedly, the auto-blogging part of the equation should help the main pages get up in the rankings.

    Well, here's what's happened:
    • The money pages have not reached any top positions. The highest one in Google is at position #15, the lowest one is nowhere to be seen. The highest ranking one is at position #14 in Bing, the lowest is nowhere. And the best position they achieved in Yahoo is #36.
    • But, and that's important, the auto-generated posts, being focused in longer tail keywords, are in fact ranking for many different keywords all around the keywordsphere (nice term, huh? :rolleyes, and driving traffic. The site got approx 400 visits / month last year, in january they grow to 800 / month. And these pages that get traffic for long tail keywords are funnelling part of that traffic to the money pages.
    • And, regarding monetization, I haven't made any physical product sales, but if you remember I installed Adsense (in the money pages and the home page), and am getting -after tweaking and optimizing placement of ads- an average CTR of 5,8%. It is not the best of my sites, but it's not bad at all either. The CPC is not high, though, so I've made close to 100$. Enough to cover for the expenses and make some profit, but not to live off of it.
    I'd like to give my opinion on the programs themselves, apart of how my sites performed:
    • GS2: The site is active, and George is still running webinars for members and adding content. I think that honors him, considering how many marketers launch a site and then never add a single comma to it, or even take it down after some time.
    • BTF: The site is also active, with a forum where members can interact, and Mike and Kelly show up often to interact with members.
    • ENE: As I already said in some previous post, Sean mainly disappeared, leaving the members with a plugin that only partially worked and with no replies. If this has changed lately, please correct me, but that's how things were when I last checked.

    3 - Important conclussions about the experiment

    Here's the thing... if we think of this experiment as a pure "case study" of what someone wanting to build an affiliate site can find on his way, I think I can consider it a complete success: I think I found every possible issue you can come across

    I had technical issues in the case of BTF, I had personal matters getting in the way, I had to decide that I'd do some things myself and outsource others, I found that each method recommends different services (for instance, backlinking services) and you can't follow instructions to the t you will end up being a member of every service out there...

    If we think of it as a SEO experiment, my feelings are my performance has been so-so. I did most of what was advised in the methods, but not all. I think the final positions in the rankings prove that finding an easy keyword, an EMD, and throwing a few backlinks at it, is not enough to get to #1. But it doesn't disprove it's possible, either, you just need more consistency over time, something I have not done.

    Of course, even though it was not the objective of this thread, money-wise the experiment has been a complete failure. But I think I'm the one to blame; the reason lays in the ultra-strict constraints I set in the beginning trying to be "scientific".

    If you re-read my first post, in order to try to give each method an igualitarian treatment, I forced all of them to target main keywords in the same niche, related to physical products, using the Amazon marketplace, and centered around products that shared some "functionality" or benefit to the user.

    Well, this may have helped me compare them SEO-wise (though, as you may remember, I had to stretch the limits of GS2 a bit), but has set the foundation for a complete monetary failure.

    I now think I should have let each of them "fly free", and lead me to whatever keywords I could find in whatever market, and see how they performed, each on their own merits.

    My final conclussion, if someone didn't already know that: this thing ain't as easy as we're sometimes made to believe.

    Sure, these methods can work, and I know because I have some other sites that are profitable, but only after a lot of work, testing and tweaking. "throwing anything" at Google or the visitors is not enough, not anymore.


    4 - And now, the final question: what do you want me to do from now on?

    Regarding the three sites I built, I will let the GS2 and BTF ones die, and keep the ENE one, and work on it a bit more because I think it has some potential.

    So, the alternatives now are:

    a) I do nothing more with this thread, and leave it here as an interesting experiment. Sometimes things have to have a beginning, and have an end, and maybe the time has come to close this thread.

    b) I try to run the same experiment again with three new sites, this time focusing on monetization, giving more freedom to the three methods. I'm not especially motivated to building another ENE site, but what the heck, if that's what you want I can do it.

    c) I run my own experiment, based on the GS2 / BTF / ENE techniques, but mixing and tweaking them, following a strategy that has given me good results in other cases. And this time, giving you much more detail (even revealing the sites and keywords) This would be like a WSO unfolding in front of your eyes.

    Oh, by the way, I don't plan to make a WSO of this thread, though I'm really really thankful to those that offered to heklp me on that endeavour. I have several WSOs in mind but they'll be centered around what I want to be my core business, and it's not "how to make money online", so if I do something else here, it would be for free.

    So, what would you like me to do? I'd love to hear from you!
    • [ 12 ] Thanks
    • [3] replies
    • First of all thanks for your great case study it was a great read!
      As far as where to go from here, I think you have 3 solid options. I say you should go for C with a twist...
      take on myself and two other students to each work one of the methods and document everything to turn it into a WSO
    • Mike,

      I like "option C" also. I think you have brought great knowledge to us and I for one would look forward to seeing more of your case study. Please let us know if there is anything we can do to help in your endeavor.
    • Hi Mikel
      I used to live in Getxo - near Bilbao

      Although I love the idea of case studies, I think we need to face the facts
      this is 2012.... you can't build an authority site as a case study, an authority site needs to be build with a BUSINESS MODEL in place not with a "keyword sniping mentality"

      Building a site to get ranking for just 1 - 2 keywords is like working on a beautiful sand castle ... it will be destroyed eventually.

      what it will be cooler is .. instead of you creating these sites based on SOMEONE ELSE model..... create your own

      Don't follow other people, instead tell us what you have learned, and create an amazing authority site but with a clear business plan and not with a "let me follow what so-called gurus are telling me to do"

      just my 2 cents.
      Un abrazo!
  • Thank you for doing the case study, great read.
    • [1] reply
    • Thanks for the work you have put into it and your report of the results.

      I was happy to hear that ENE came out a little bit on top. I have been using it for a while in a few different ways and have been pretty happy with the results. I have been making about $100 per week using it on a site and haven't really pushed hard on getting the site ranked well. I am back in the saddle on it and expect to drive this to the point where I am making upwards of $50 to $100 per day with it on one site.


      I look forward to seeing anything else that comes out of this study. Let us know if we can be of assistance.

      Best regards,

      Anthony
  • I love this case study because you are only promting physical products.
  • Gotta love case studies, thanks for the time and effort.
    • [1] reply
    • I think you hit the nail on the head with option C:

      "I run my own experiment, based on the GS2 / BTF / ENE techniques, but mixing and tweaking them"

      I think this is the most important lesson you can get from any product. When you follow something to the T, you are doing yourself an injustice, because you are likely able to add additional steps or creativity that we as product owners may have over-looked, simply because we aren't you and we don't have your own unique perspective.
      • [ 2 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
  • Option C as well.

    Markets differ and people differ. You have to find out what's working for you and make that better. That'll differ for everyone. Experience is the best teacher and courses are simply guides that teach you (hopefully) from other people's experience so you don't have to start from scratch.
  • I say you build 100 of each, log the time you spend on each, the money you spend, earnings, traffic and then create a nice table showing which method is more efficient when you look at time spent vs money spent vs earnings, lol.
  • I think your 3 methods is totally great for long term,
    1. Bring the Fresh by Kelly Felix and Mike Long
    2. Extreme Niche Empires by Sean Donahoe
    3. Google Sniper 2 by George Brown.
  • Option C: this one sounds very interesting...and also sounds like you'd have your
    heart in it to the hilt!

    Good luck, and let us know if there's anything we can help with...
  • Hi Mikel Perez,

    Thanks for taking the time to do a case study and for posting back recently.

    I don't want to pour water on what you have done, but am i right in saying that for all the work you did, you only made two sales?

    If this is the case, then surely that can merit doing all the work you did or paid for.

    Please correct me if I have misread something. It's just that I see so many people try their hand at IM and make zero or next to zero.

    I make money online but mainly by selling physical stuff.

    Thanks.
  • Hey folks.

    Don't know if you're aware or not, but Kelly Felix just launched Bring The Fresh 2012 as a Warrior Special Offer.

    http://www.warriorforum.com/warrior-...s-revenge.html
    • [1] reply
    • Do you own this my friend?
  • I was especially interested in hearing how Google Sniper perfoms vs Bring the Fresh as I am definetly going to sign up for one of those two.

    Everyone has some bad luck once in a while, glad you found a place finally.

    Thanks again for the case study, maybe you can repeat that from time to time or even build a website around it? (sounds like quality content and interesting to me).
    • [1] reply
    • I'm a brand new buyer of Kelly's BTF (bought a few days ago), and I'm still wading through all the content, so am not in a position yet to offer any meaningful feedback. (Bought it and prepared to settle in for a few days of undisturbed, focused study and preparation/implementation....LOL, and life intervened...still- onwards and upwards)

      Hey! Idea for one of the "serial" WSO creators: "Life intervenes: How to ....."(fill in the blanks):p

      However, it has become clear to me from reading this really excellent thread of Mikel's that things aren't as easy/simple as they might appear on sales pages and that a certain amount of improvisation/addition may be needed to really crack it (as Kelly also points out)....time will tell though, as I intend following the BTF method to start with. From what I've seen to date, their forum and support is alive 'n well and a good source of support- for me, this resource alone is priceless.

      MANY thanks to Mikel for freely sharing the result of your time, money and dedicated work...this is truly priceless (using that word again, I know, but I do use it quite literally). Not many IM'ers would do this kind of thing. Thanks again.

      Mikel, as to your question of which way to go: I fully agree with Kelly that option c) I run my own experiment, based on the GS2 / BTF / ENE techniques, but mixing and tweaking them would be great.

      I look forward to your future posts in this thread.

      Piero
      • [1] reply
  • I really appreciate the time and effort you put in this. Thank you very much for the amazing case study.
  • I've bookmarked this. Great thread- thanks for this. Learning about some great WP stuff too
  • Hi, guys!

    I just started my new experiment.

    I decided to open a new thread, you can follow it here (and don't forget to subscribe to that one in order to stay up to date):
    http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...xperiment.html
    • [1] reply
    • Hi
      I really enjoyed reading this thread
      I was hoping you had time for one more post on this experiment
      What happened to each site after the recent Penguin update?

      Thanks
      Rob
      • [1] reply
  • Banned
    Great advice and tutorial for experienced as well!
  • Banned
    subscribed and will follow intently.....thanks to everyone who's posting helpful content!
  • Hi Mikel, you are taking so much pain...waiting for the results...
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