Zero SEO Website Profits - I wanna be Google free! | Warrior Forum - The #1 Digital Marketing Forum & Marketplace

ardley216

Banned 13 years ago

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by ardley216

I think about this all the time as well. I have always thought about using other search engine ads such as Bing. I also am targeting my SEO at bing, just for a test.

Yes, but other search engines just mean other ways of having to think about SEO rather than quality, interesting visitor oriented content. I want to see what is possible by ignoring absolutely all SEO. If, as a consequence the non-SEO'd web pages I create still get ranked, then so be it, I will be happy with that but that is not my intentions with this.

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kochtgr

13 years ago

Well if you post quality informative and unique content regularly even without optimizing your site for SEO, search engines will love your site and it will certainly rank high on many related to your content keywords.

Additionally if you guest post regularly on high traffic blogs, post informative replies and comments on forums and blogs not just for link building but reputation building and you are an active member on social media sites then you really will not have to rely on search engines traffic since you will get a ton of targeted traffic direct from users or referral sites...

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by kochtgr

Well if you post quality informative and unique content regularly even without optimizing your site for SEO, search engines will love your site and it will certainly rank high on many related to your content keywords.

Additionally if you guest post regularly on high traffic blogs, post informative replies and comments on forums and blogs not just for link building but reputation building and you are an active member on social media sites then you really will not have to rely on search engines traffic since you will get a ton of targeted traffic direct from users or referral sites...

That's the idea.. I just think we spend far too long worrying about Google and what they want at the expense of all the other traffic that is available.

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Charles Harper

13 years ago

You have to wonder whether the amount of money, time, outsourcing and resources that we put into ways to 'fake' authority could be better spent on other things. There are websites that don't even think about trying to outwit search engines. They get good writers, pay them more and make more.

Good topic, man. I will be watching.

CT

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Charles Harper

You have to wonder whether the amount of money, time, outsourcing and resources that we put into ways to 'fake' authority could be better spent on other things. There are websites that don't even think about trying to outwit search engines. They get good writers, pay them more and make more.

Good topic, man. I will be watching.

CT

Hey Charles, nice to see you again.. You hit the nail on the head. I don't want this to seem like I am Google hating or anything, far from it. I just want to go back to basics and see what is possible without all the on and off page optimisation stuff.

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onlineleben

13 years ago

Hi Steve, good to see you back with a new challenge.
I really enjoyed your 100buckschallenge 2 years ago and will follow this one as well.
Good luck!

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Hortensia 13 years ago

Very good idea Steve. I am bookmarking this thread!

I have a few sites myself where I did not do any keywordresearch. On purpose.

Almost every day I get quite a lot of visitors often for phrases that don't come up in any keywordtool, with just a handful of articles on the site, some of them real short also on purpose, and without any backlinking or podcast or video submission at all. Nothing ... no linkbuilding.

I bought a wso some time ago called Total Traffic Domination by Mike Morgan, which is also about trafficgeneration without seo, but I still have to start implementation. Having browsed through it though, I am convinced that it is possible to get thousands of daily visitors, without ever checking on which page you are in Google.

Cheers,
JanPaul
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Stephen Crooks 13 years ago

Originally Posted by onlineleben

Hi Steve, good to see you back with a new challenge.
I really enjoyed your 100buckschallenge 2 years ago and will follow this one as well.
Good luck!

I enjoyed it also.. This is about seeing what is possible.
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- mike76 13 years ago
  
  I rank top of google for my keyword (my brand name - a single 4 letter keyword). After I set up the brand, I noticed that it was a very popular biblical name in some countries. As the site is a private membership site, all I had for google to see was the frontpage and a sign-up page. I figured it would be tough to take the top spot.
  
  Over the past 2 years, I've had a few organic backlinks, but not too many as my site is a niche within a niche (English speaking people living in Korea, married to Koreans). It helps that we now have government recognition and there's been a little reporting on that, but otherwise... nothing. For a long, long time, I was sitting in 4th place on google, just below an islamic scholar, wikipedia, and a national park near Tel Aviv!
  
  I've recently launched two sub-sites - a place for the public to recruit my members, and an ebook store with just 2 titles. After reading warrior forum for ideas, I also launched an official blog on a different domain, just to see what happens. The blog has PR3 after just 4 posts and no backlinks (!?) and the main membership site has leapfrogged the competition and now sits at the top of google.
  
  So yeah... it's possible! I got close without trying, though it took 2 years. If you know a few tricks, you can do it quite easily!
  
  Next, I'm going to try and replicate my successes with a few money sites. I'm setting up a feeder site now, then I will work on a few niche blogs, doing just 1 or 2 posts per week on each... I hope to be ranking well within a few months, and I'll then try and take the number 1 spot for a few keywords
  
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fthomas137

13 years ago

yea, panda has really changed the overall landscape of seo. Or should I say 'refined it'. One point that I've found is that Google likes to see more of a blanket then a site. For example, when performing seo for a site, I'm apt to create a youtube channel for the site and use it as the video hosting agent. I've found this to give more of an impact overall. Plus I'm using possibly the 3rd largest search engine, youtube!

Frank

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Mike Anthony

13 years ago

Good thread Steve. I think though that when you really get into it you will realize that you havent really left SEO if you go this route. You will have just crossed fully over to Whitehat SEO because in regard to link building the methods to achieve what you want are very much similar.

Warrior Forums going whitehat in this section? Never thought I would see the day but its a good thing to add.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Good thread Steve. I think though that when you really get into it you will realize that you havent really left SEO if you go this route. You will have just crossed fully over to Whitehat SEO because in regard to link building the methods to achieve what you want are very much similar.

Warrior Forums going whitehat in this section? Never thought I would see the day but its a good thing to add.

Getting ranked in the search engines will hopefully be a consequence but I am not even looking at traffic from those sources with this. I know what you are saying Mike and I guess you could think of it as White hat SEO but that still implies some sort of optimisation for the search engines of my content and promotion. However, I am approaching this by not looking at any of the usual SEO disciplines whatsoever. Not even looking at keywords or anything. Every piece of content I create for this project will be because I want to create it and that is that.

I suppose I will still be actively promoting this content, so it could be argued that I will be doing the usual backlinking. The difference is though, I will not worry about things like PR, anchor text, nofollow or any such thing. The process of promotion will be purely about gaining referral traffic and building the brand. The hope being it will go viral. If the search engines hook onto this as well, then happy days, but like I say, that is just a consequence of the process, not the cause.

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Mike Anthony

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Crooks

I suppose I will still be actively promoting this content, so it could be argued that I will be doing the usual backlinking. The difference is though, I will not worry about things like PR, anchor text, nofollow or any such thing.

Understood I am just saying in regard to link building thats how a lot of SEOs approach it - engage the public and eventually you get the links without worrying about them.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Understood I am just saying in regard to link building thats how a lot of SEOs approach it - engage the public and eventually you get the links without worrying about them.

Yep, you are right Mike. The motivation for SEOs is ranking pages higher in the search engines first and foremost. Obviously I wont complain if that happens with my new project.

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socomplete

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Crooks

Yep, you are right Mike. The motivation for SEOs is ranking pages higher in the search engines first and foremost. Obviously I wont complain if that happens with my new project.

It's this type of thinking that is what Google want's in the first place. Build a website that rocks and naturally get links and traffic as you build. But you know what? I understand where your coming from in terms of worrying about what Google wants.

My vision of a website is similar to facebook, you need to create a way that a large amount of people can follow your website, while forcing Google's hand in sending you traffic because your website is so popular with a lot of people.

Of course your don't have to create the next facebook, but you can create something that solves a problem, and is simple to understand and navigate through, as well as updated frequently with new information.

For example, I'm into the subject of earth changes, and I go to youtube and find a video that links to a blog, this blog is updated hourly, so I keep coming back for more new information because it helps me get the latest information as it comes in.

As long as your content is fresh and unique, a newbie could pick a niche within a niche such as "new dog collar products" and keep people up to date frequently.

From my experience, all I want as a web surfer is 4 main things:

1. I want to know what my friends are up to (facebook)

2. What is the latest news in my area

3. What is going on with my favorite topic/ niche

4. Solving my problems

My analogy for the future of the internet are websites that deliver any of the four subjects mentioned above, at fast speeds.

My focus is more on mass marketing from multiple traffic channels to just 1 website.

For example: pay per click, some seo, press releases, article marketing, blogging, videos, offline advertising, adswaps, and just focus on building a real brand and product line, with seo becoming a channel and not the focus.

I know for a fact that many of you guys and gals don't go to Google for every website that you visit. I personally have about 5 websites that I directly type into my browser, now it's just doing the work to become one of those 5 memorable websites.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by socomplete

I know for a fact that many of you guys and gals don't go to Google for every website that you visit. I personally have about 5 websites that I directly type into my browser, now it's just doing the work to become one of those 5 memorable websites.

You have just summed up the the main part of the philosophy of this project in that paragraph..

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mrpfct

13 years ago

I totally agree Steve. Google makes frequent tweaks at the back end, this sometimes has huge difference. I've been put off from building a site for this reason.

I did read your last challenge and wish you well for this new one.

Cheers

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by mrpfct

I totally agree Steve. Google makes frequent tweaks at the back end, this sometimes has huge difference. I've been put off from building a site for this reason.

I did read your last challenge and wish you well for this new one.

Cheers

Thanks and it is those constant tweaks that just makes us slaves to Google. We end up spending more time trying to decipher the great Google algo than trying to create great content.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by olliepa

I just keep it simply and to the basic and don't try to place all my time into one site and try not to use the same hosting service. Hope this helps and Thanks for the subject line well put together Steve.

Olliepa

Simple is usually the best.. Thanks for the encouragement.

Originally Posted by 36burrows

Yep, time to put away the Google crack pipe for me as well.

I've been really focusing on YouTube videos since the updates and it's already bringing in more traffic from them.

Video is one of the core components of this strategy.

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olliepa

13 years ago

This is a real good subject but you will still be under google because you have external links with twitter and these are recogonize by the search engines.

Now as far as google panda I believe a lot of people got hit by it because they was either using google analytics, using comment scrapers or not add contact page.

Google Algorithm trace all this information and determination of what to do. I just keep it simply and to the basic and don't try to place all my time into one site and try not to use the same hosting service. Hope this helps and Thanks for the subject line well put together Steve.

Olliepa

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36burrows

13 years ago

Yep, time to put away the Google crack pipe for me as well.

I've been really focusing on YouTube videos since the updates and it's already bringing in more traffic from them.

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lightsky

13 years ago

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by lightsky

I also find myself thinking a lot of this problem. But, how possible is to be completely free from Google and still have a great number of visitors? Do you think to focus on social networks?

Oh yes, Twitter, Facebook, YouTube will all be part of the process. I will make sure I demonstrate all the tactics I use (good and bad) either here or on my blog.

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cooler1

13 years ago

A quick song.

I want to be free of the big G,
The panda update, is killing me
I can no longer wait,
For my sites fate,
I want to be free,

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Here is the short list of potential topics that I have a passion for..
1. English premier league football
2. Technology and gadgets
3. Movies
4. Internet marketing
5. Cooking
6. Performance cars
7. Golf
8. Computers
9. Photography
10. Nature

Now it is just a matter of choosing one and then get to work.

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HN

Banned 13 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Crooks

Here is the short list of potential topics that I have a passion for..
1. English premier league football
2. Technology and gadgets
3. Movies
4. Internet marketing
5. Cooking
6. Performance cars
7. Golf
8. Computers
9. Photography
10. Nature

Now it is just a matter of choosing one and then get to work.

I am trying to do exact same thing and for this venture I bought domains like
1. sport.cx
2. how.ee
3. movies.gy and Watch Free Movies Online | www.watch.ee
4. hm?
5. recipe.ee
6. cars.tl
7. www.Golf.GY
8. computers.ee
9. photos.ee, fotos.ee, stockphotos.ee
10. nature.ee, wildlife.ee

Looks like we have a lot in common.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by HN

I am trying to do exact same thing and for this venture I bought domains like
1. sport.cx
2. how.ee
3. movies.gy and Watch Free Movies Online | www.watch.ee
4. hm?
5. recipe.ee
6. cars.tl
7. www.Golf.GY
8. computers.ee
9. photos.ee, fotos.ee, stockphotos.ee
10. nature.ee, wildlife.ee

Looks like we have a lot in common.

You have some funky TLD's there! I wish you well.

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rinor81

13 years ago

Great thread, will keep following it and good luck to all.

I wish I could take my business off Google but I am mostly affiliate marketer and it's kind of difficult making a brand site when you're affiliate...how do you build enough good quality or get people so follow you or your facebook page...

Hope I'll get some ideas here from your success...

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by rinor81

Great thread, will keep following it and good luck to all.

I wish I could take my business off Google but I am mostly affiliate marketer and it's kind of difficult making a brand site when you're affiliate...how do you build enough good quality or get people so follow you or your facebook page...

Hope I'll get some ideas here from your success...

I think this is one area where we ALL need to completely change our way of thinking. Rather than think of yourself as someone who is an "affiliate marketer" who makes "affiliate sites", you are someone who builds sites aimed at offering some value to someone through its content. The fact that you can earn an income through affiliate links is a consequence of that value you are offering.

I am not saying this project of mine will be easy but what I can certainly tell you is that I am feeling excited about creating the content and my mind is buzzing with ideas. My only issue is getting my hands on the gadgets for testing and creating enough content to start creating a buzz on Facebook and other social networks.

I hope this project will give you some inspiration..

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rinor81

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Crooks

I think this is one area where we ALL need to completely change our way of thinking. Rather than think of yourself as someone who is an "affiliate marketer" who makes "affiliate sites", you are someone who builds sites aimed at offering some value to someone through its content. The fact that you can earn an income through affiliate links is a consequence of that value you are offering.

I am not saying this project of mine will be easy but what I can certainly tell you is that I am feeling excited about creating the content and my mind is buzzing with ideas. My only issue is getting my hands on the gadgets for testing and creating enough content to start creating a buzz on Facebook and other social networks.

I hope this project will give you some inspiration..

I do understand what you're saying and I have a feeling you will succeed with this...the thing is really getting a great and wide niche you can talk about and write about and also offer the products which worth the money through affiliate links....that's a possibility, right?

I mean, if I want to make a living out of Internet Marketing, I have to create a site with goals also to make money for me as well as building a community through good and interesting content....what do you think?

I can't afford to create a site that does not earn me money in this business if I want to make a living out of it....

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by rinor81

I do understand what you're saying and I have a feeling you will succeed with this...the thing is really getting a great and wide niche you can talk about and write about and also offer the products which worth the money through affiliate links....that's a possibility, right?

I mean, if I want to make a living out of Internet Marketing, I have to create a site with goals also to make money for me as well as building a community through good and interesting content....what do you think?

I can't afford to create a site that does not earn me money in this business if I want to make a living out of it....

Absolutely I agree 100%. Unless you love building hobby sites, which is all fine and dandy, you will want to earn a living from that site.

What I am saying is that it is far too easy to use the income goals as the driving force for the site you are building rather than concentrate on the site and what it offers your visitors.

I prefer to think of it as a start up business. If you had just invented a robot that can clean windows and you wanted to go to market with it, of course you would have income goals because that is the prudent thing to do. However, you want to make sure that your robot is the best damn window cleaning robot on the market to ensure you reach those income goals.. That window cleaning robot is your site's content, whatever form that may take.

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Stephen Crooks 13 years ago

It has just taken me a couple of days to work out the branding and choosing a domain name for the site. I ended up going for a made up single word for the domain name but I am happy with it.

So, the domain is bought and the branding is clear in my mind, now onto the design of the site. I am looking for a modern, magazine style look and feel with a hint of humour as well.

Website design isn't my strongest skill and so if anyone can recommend a good designer of Wordpress themes, that would be great. I have a few in mind already that I have used before but it doesn't hurt to see what else is out there.
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lovboa

Banned 13 years ago

Personally, I hate searching Google for information... only to find an EMD, made for adsense site with low quality content at the top of the SERPS.

Makes me want to puke...

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socomplete

13 years ago

Originally Posted by lovboa

Personally, I hate searching Google for information... only to find an EMD, made for adsense site with low quality content at the top of the SERPS.

Makes me want to puke...

I know right, the way I'm looking at things is like this, if your going to spend time on something why not make it last as long as possible.

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acedalright 13 years ago

Good for you I say.

Personally, I think playing the google game is a loser long term. If you intend on making money for the next twenty years plus, then I think it's worth considering a better search engine/system may come along.

Google results are typically garbage, littered with spin and crap.

Trust is what gets people coming back, that and interest.

Great content means repeat viewing, SEO = repeat nightmares.

Imagine spending ALL your time on writing good content and none on SEO?

Maybe it's a winning formula
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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by peterjamesmorris

Cool, interesting experiment. Like your style!

Have put the RSS feed for your Google Free Challenge category into my Google Reader - so you've already got a follower :-)

Excellent! This non-SEO stuff is easy!

Just kidding.. I hope this project will inspire many people to look at alternatives to the usual SEO approach.

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barbling

13 years ago

Heh heh, I gave up on SEO years ago when I realized that Google could (and did) kill my 100s of portal sites in one fell swoop.

Now I'm focusing on simply branding myself and making others successful (that in turn makes me successful too).

Took a lot of pain/experience to reach that level of business zen....

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Stephen Crooks 13 years ago

So, after much internal deliberation and debate I have decided to build my site around the technology and gadget market.. It was a tough decision to come to in all honesty. I had many reasons to build a site in all of my passion short list. It is quite surprising the difference between choosing a niche based on what you want to do as opposed to the usual SEO principles of search volume, advertisers etc..! I shall be updating my blog later.
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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by barbling

Heh heh, I gave up on SEO years ago when I realized that Google could (and did) kill my 100s of portal sites in one fell swoop.

Now I'm focusing on simply branding myself and making others successful (that in turn makes me successful too).

Took a lot of pain/experience to reach that level of business zen....

Yep, instead of SEO, you can call it BO (brand optimization)..

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paulgl 13 years ago

Glad you see the light Steve.

I have been preaching google-free for a long, long time.

If I read between the lines from Mike A., doing things
to be google-free could actually lead to more google.

I do strive for google traffic, but needing to make money
via adsense and amazon, I need targeted traffic and boatloads
of it. I can't get that from google. Google search is a crap
shoot.

One thing I'll say about panda, is one of my sites seems to have
taken a hit. I say "seems to," because even though traffic
is down about 75%, the adsense clicks and revenue are
sky high. Could it be that google is directing people to
more targeted sites? I'll take that in a heart beat.

Or maybe, just maybe, I'm doing a bang up job funneling
traffic to my sites.

What good is getting 1,000 visitors a day from google, when 900 don't
care what you are offering? That leaves me with 100
visitors. Now if I could change that and get 300 visitors
with 200 targeted, man I'll take that any day. Google
generated or not.

Paul
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- Mike Anthony 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by paulgl
  
  If I read between the lines from Mike A., doing things
  to be google-free could actually lead to more google.
  
  l
  
  Pretty much. In white hat link building you also spend a bit of time working Bloggers and webmasters on a relationship basis which means it opens up opportunities beyond the links to get raw traffic from their sites.
  
  Haven't used adwords in awhile but its really good for hunting out webmaster and traffic data of sites within a niche. Wordtracker even has a linkbuilding tool (wasn't too impressed with it but they have done some updates to it) which is obviously SEO aimed but lets face it getting traffic on the web means getting traffic through links. Whether you are thinking SEO or not the links are the thing in common.
  
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Fraggler

13 years ago

Steve, you might want to have a read of this thread: http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...mith-myob.html

That is an amazin discussion on building a site independent of the search engines.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Fraggler

Steve, you might want to have a read of this thread: http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...mith-myob.html

That is an amazin discussion on building a site independent of the search engines.

Yes, a top thread.. thanks for that!

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donaldkevin

13 years ago

This is about finding our what is possible without worrying about Google traffic. I am going to utilise anything I can to promote the site but it is going to be all about the viral nature of the content. It is going to be about using the social networks like Twitter and facebook and just pushing this as far as I can and turning the site into a viral, high traffic, profitable web site.

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dagaul101

13 years ago

Unfortunately, Google is the major player in the search engine game with over 60% of the market, unless the combination of Yahoo and MSN in Bing offer a serious challenge, or someone else comes to the fore, we have to play by the Big G's rules

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by dagaul101

Unfortunately, Google is the major player in the search engine game with over 60% of the market, unless the combination of Yahoo and MSN in Bing offer a serious challenge, or someone else comes to the fore, we have to play by the Big G's rules

That's the whole point of this project though. I want to see just what is possible by NOT playing to the big G's rules. I am going to play by my rules and see where it takes me.

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Justin Says

13 years ago

Even though I specialize in search engine optimization and onpage optimization, I actually don't focus on worrying about my rankings much with my niche websites. I feel it's a wasted effort to put so much thought into it because the alrogithms change every 17 hours.

Pretty much I figure there are methods that are longterm and I focus on those. So instead of building backlinks, I build traffic (which builds backlinks, tada).

Instead of building links from high PR websites, I acquire links from popular websites in my niche (yet again, this is likely building PR backlinks, I just don't check).

I focus on providing quality content on my website, versus worrying oh so much about adding keywords all over the place or jamming keywords into H2 tags and bolding tags. But by providing high quality content, I usually end up working it in anyways without meaning to.

I'm not going to say that I've given up on the search engines. I'm just saying that I now focus on actually providing something to my visitors. I focus on giving them a better experience, which then increases conversions. So even if the website isn't ranking #1, I'm getting traffic from other sources (and Google), higher conversions, which then results in more money.

So again, SEO isn't gone, it's still there. I just think people need to rethink their thinking. Screw building backlinks just to build them. Do something of quality that's actually going to help you for the longterm.

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by Justin Lewis

So again, SEO isn't gone, it's still there. I just think people need to rethink their thinking. Screw building backlinks just to build them. Do something of quality that's actually going to help you for the longterm.

We kind of get conditioned to building sites using these core SEO principles because they do work in getting traffic but it does leave you at the whim of the search engines. The other downside is that by concentrating on SEO before anything else, is it any wonder that an article on "cheap alarm clocks" or "decking nails" wont capture the imagination of a visitor.. At least not enough to share virally with their friends and acquaintances.

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Stephen Crooks 13 years ago

Just a quick update.. I have been conducting some research into the demographic of some of my competitors in the gadgets and technology market using the excellent quantcast.com. It is no surprise to see that most people are male but what was pleasing to see was the average earnings of the demographic is very high.

I have also made a list of what I want from the site after analysing my competitors and seeing where I can improve on them.

I am now concentrating on the domain name and the branding of the site as well as looking at starting to create the content.
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JoshuaG

13 years ago

Hey Steve, as a fellow "adsenser" I know this is a big departure from the usual. Of course I don't know how much experience you have with other forms of traffic generation so it may be less of a departure for you...

Regardless, I think you're gonna have A LOT of fun getting creative with your marketing/viral content!

Here's to your future success on a new endeavor!

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Stephen Crooks

13 years ago

Originally Posted by JoshuaG

Hey Steve, as a fellow "adsenser" I know this is a big departure from the usual. Of course I don't know how much experience you have with other forms of traffic generation so it may be less of a departure for you...

Regardless, I think you're gonna have A LOT of fun getting creative with your marketing/viral content!

Here's to your future success on a new endeavor!

Thanks for the encouragement and yes, I am having fun already with this..

The big difference for me Joshua is that I have never really embarked on a new site without using SEO every step of the way. Normally, I would have my keyword tool out at this point looking at various keywords to target. Now I am just looking at creating content because I want to do it.. That is a big difference!

I am not saying the SEO approach doesn't work any more but I want too see what is possible without it. Even more so after this latest Panda update has caused such carnage for many people.

I have a feeling that the results of this project will change the way I do things in future, kind of like a new dawn for SEO.. That is the hope anyway.

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tekman

13 years ago

Try MC Hammers new search engine. Perhaps you can rank first page!

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damiangonzalez

12 years ago

Hi Steve.

I wanted to know how to follow the project because you have not mentioned anything new about the steps you are doing.

Best regards.

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warfore

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Steve Crooks

This latest Panda update has certainly got me thinking I spend way, way, WAY too much time worrying about what Google want and don't want and way, way, WAY too little time considering what my visitors would love...

This has prompted me to start a new approach to building a profitable site, built purely and simply for my visitors with not even a sniff of SEO or any optimisation for search engines whatsoever. I couldn't care less if Google rank this site or not, my traffic will come purely from the viral nature of the content.

I am not saying I am finished with Google or anything but I am just tired of SEO and the rollercoaster. I want to take control back from Google for my visitors. I am going cold turkey on SEO for this and I don't care about keyword search volume, competition on Google, keywords in title, high PR backlinks, linkwheels and all that noise!

I would be interested to read other people's opinions and experiences with going back to site building basics without any SEO nonsense disturbing that Utopian approach.

I will keep this thread updated if people are interested in how I get on plus I am blogging about it on my marketing blog in my sig.

This is about finding our what is possible without worrying about Google traffic. I am going to utilise anything I can to promote the site but it is going to be all about the viral nature of the content. It is going to be about using the social networks like Twitter and facebook and just pushing this as far as I can and turning the site into a viral, high traffic, profitable web site.

Here, here....I feel the same way myself.

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Tony

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Kauzmo

12 years ago

Okay Steve 4 words - It Will Never Work!

There is no way you are going to be able to build a brand that is niche specific without SEO. Are you crazy or what?

Do you mean to tell me you plan on devoting all of your "on site" time focusing on one thing: the visitor?

You are actually sitting their with a straight face telling me that "user experience" is more important than an H1 tag? Blasphemous!

There is no way in hell Google would ever be able to tell your site was actually user friendly, has relevant content and is easy to use. It just can't happen. Google just isn't that smart.

No my friend you better stick with what everyone else is doing. It's the only way. There can be no deviation!

/sarcasm

Okay Steve here is the real deal - It works! Not only does it work, but when you do want Google to pay attention to you something miraculous happens THEY PAY ATTENTION. Not only do they pay attention, they rank your stuff.

Good luck man and have fun!

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JoshuaG

12 years ago

Any updates on this project Steve? I'd love to hear how its going.

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boxoun

12 years ago

I understand what you are trying to say, but it should be worded differently. You should always seo your site.

I think what you mean is that you won't rely on search engine traffic.

Writing good meta descriptions and titles is part of seo and if your site does go viral and get natural backlinks, you want to have good seo so people click yours instead of theirs.

Seo doesn't have to be a bad thing. You should always optimize with seo but don't build business relyin on search traffic.

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markowe

12 years ago

I am totally with you on this way of thinking, the last Panda put a nasty dent in my SEO-based earnings, enough to question how I am spending my time in IM.I've gotta admit, Google won this round for me,I just find it EASIER to rank with good content than mind-numbing backlinking, so that is the way I will probably be headed from now on.

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affiliated survivor

12 years ago

Besides SEO traffic there are only the different kinds of Web 2.0 domains. Do you want to drive traffic like in methods as Nanoblogger, GooBert or Google Traffic Pump?

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damiangonzalez

12 years ago

What happened with this project?

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rimam1

12 years ago

My plan is to get traffic via YouTube, Facebook (using FastAttackLocker), doing giveaways, guest posts, writing and advertising on other ezines (using Directory of Ezines), and participating in industry blogs and forums.

You can also use Google + to get traffic. Now this is a GREAT tip:

http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...made-bank.html

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TammieJJ

12 years ago

I would also like an update on this project...

I gave up on linkbuilding myself a couple of months ago, after being slapped by a manual penalty. For about six months, I was constantly changing and rearranging and updating like crazy, but then I realized I absolutely hated even working on my sites anymore. So, I've gone back to basics - and my own business plan. I have undone all the things that I changed while I was trying to regain my rankings, and now focus on building (or rebuilding) only quality sites, with quality content.

The manual penalty is still there, but my sites are slowly but surely building traffic from other sources. And, the best part is, I no longer worry that every single change I make will upset my rankings in the search engines.

By the middle of 2012, I should be in good shape again, and I will have built a stronger business because of it.

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rooze

12 years ago

You won't agree with this but I think the premise is a bit naive. Do you want to build a beautiful oasis in the middle of a desert and expect people to go out of their way to find you, or do you want to build it close to where the people are?

You can do everything you say to avoid SEO, but SEO does not interfere with content unless you proactively make it interfere.

So you can build your website, staying true to your goals for 'visitor first', then you can utilize a few basic SEO techniques to attract more visitors in a way which doesn't change their experience at your website. More people get to receive the benefit of what you have to offer, versus the oasis in the middle of nowhere approach.

Or is your OP just a metaphor ?

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Talen

12 years ago

Originally Posted by rooze

You won't agree with this but I think the premise is a bit naive. Do you want to build a beautiful oasis in the middle of a desert and expect people to go out of their way to find you, or do you want to build it close to where the people are?

You can do everything you say to avoid SEO, but SEO does not interfere with content unless you proactively make it interfere.

So you can build your website, staying true to your goals for 'visitor first', then you can utilize a few basic SEO techniques to attract more visitors in a way which doesn't change their experience at your website. More people get to receive the benefit of what you have to offer, versus the oasis in the middle of nowhere approach.

Or is your OP just a metaphor ?

The premise might not be as naive as you might think.

I started a site 6 months ago and I knew it would be tough as it's in the higher education niche and I knew I wouldn't have time to do much more than continuously add content. After a while I thought I'd just see where a well optimized theme and my original content would land me.

As of today I am on the first page for one of my keywords which is in the area of 12 million other pages. I've had big authority sites linking to me and other people tweeting and facebooking. The site provides serious information people are looking for and it may just be a bit of luck but it is going places on it's own.

If you have something people need then there is a good chance just delivering can get the work done as well as playing all the normal seo games...

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rooze

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Talen

..... After a while I thought I'd just see where a well optimized theme and my original content would land me..

Right. But isn't that making my point for me? You had a site with great content, when you took the very basic step of adding an optimized theme, your site prospered.
My point is you don't have to allow Google to drive you, just do what you do then add some basic techniques and suddenly you're in a more visible place.

If you don't want Google traffic, just use the robots exclude tag or stick a line in robots.txt

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Talen

12 years ago

Originally Posted by rooze

Right. But isn't that making my point for me? You had a site with great content, when you took the very basic step of adding an optimized theme, your site prospered.
My point is you don't have to allow Google to drive you, just do what you do then add some basic techniques and suddenly you're in a more visible place.

If you don't want Google traffic, just use the robots exclude tag or stick a line in robots.txt

Oh but I love me some google traffic.

and what you say is very true.

I just think many people get stuck in a rut of continuously searching for that right keyword with exact searches of x amount and having the emd and then linkwheels and blasts and all the other hoopla that they tend to forget the fact if you offer something of real value that people are looking for in a way that others aren't then the hoops don't have to be jumped through as often.

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rooze

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Talen

....I just think many people get stuck in a rut of continuously searching for that right keyword with exact searches of x amount and having the emd and then linkwheels and blasts and all the other hoopla that they tend to forget the fact if you offer something of real value that people are looking for in a way that others aren't then the hoops don't have to be jumped through as often.

I agree with that completely. I think the OP related to how some people can actually let their content, the stuff their visitors see, be 'formatted' for google's benefit and not that of their own visitors.
Obviously, it's all gone horribly wrong when that happens and it's time to re-assess. But the assessment shouldn't conclude that a new approach can be justified which doesn't use any SEO whatsoever. That's throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
Do what you need to do for your visitors, but then give the finished product a nice lick of SEO and give yourself the best possible chances of getting some extra traffic. It's kind or ironic really, that's exactly what Google tells us to do, but sometimes we do the opposite then blame Google when things go wrong

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