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The Age of ALN Comes To An End

by NicheDad
22 replies
  • SEO
    • |
Some of you may know about the Authority Link Network (ALN) some may not.

For those that don't, it's basically a network of high PR blogs that webmasters can sign up for and have it automatically share spam posts across the network with their links in them.

Well, Google caught on pretty quickly and Matt Cutts recently tweeted about it publicly. The jig is up!
#age #aln #end
  • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
    Eh! It still works. A little deindexing isn't gonna kill it. If Google and Matt Cutts believes they are winning by hitting 25% of all blog network sites, then they really need to step their game up. Higher deindexing rates will just become another part of how these networks operate. No big deal.
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  • Profile picture of the author ThatAblaze
    I'm ****ting myself. Go tell Matt Cutts that he's won now and he can go pick on the real spammers that keep trying to spam my blog. His e-peen is huge and mine is tiny. We all wish we could be like him. He won. Time for him to go home to his.. ahh.. his dog? Goldfish?
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  • Profile picture of the author Prog3nie
    Seems Dan Thies is the one that started it all by poking fun at the ALN and how "these bloggers have NO idea what hit them."

    Matt also touched on the TrafficPlanet forum, and there's an interesting discussion going on about a karma "wish list" for Dan Thies!
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    • Profile picture of the author NicheDad
      Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

      Eh! It still works. A little deindexing isn't gonna kill it. If Google and Matt Cutts believes they are winning by hitting 25% of all blog network sites, then they really need to step their game up. Higher deindexing rates will just become another part of how these networks operate. No big deal.
      Problem with your implied sentiment is that this isn't at all about deindexing a few blogs. The important note to take away from this is that the head of the Google web spam team has now publicly stated that they know about ALN and are acting on it.

      The big issue with all this wannabe frat boy anti-Google establishment bravado is that it's brain-dead thinking. All sarcasm and animosity aside, Google search engineers and the webspam team are not stupid. In fact they are some of the brightest minds in the industry.

      The mere idea that you believe Google just deindexed a few of the blogs on the network and popped the champagne thinking they won clearly demonstrates IMO your lack of understanding of how all this works and what this development signals about Google's ability to spot webspam trends and what they do about it when they do.
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      • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
        Originally Posted by profitmotive View Post

        Problem with your implied sentiment is that this isn't at all about deindexing a few blogs. The important note to take away from this is that the head of the Google web spam team has now publicly stated that they know about ALN and are acting on it.

        The big issue with all this wannabe frat boy anti-Google establishment bravado is that it's brain-dead thinking. All sarcasm and animosity aside, Google search engineers and the webspam team are not stupid. In fact they are some of the brightest minds in the industry.

        The mere idea that you believe Google just deindexed a few of the blogs on the network and popped the champagne thinking they won clearly demonstrates IMO your lack of understanding of how all this works and what this development signals about Google's ability to spot webspam trends and what they do about it when they do.
        Really? Is that what you think? You think they haven't known about ALN for a while now?

        Why do forum profile links and blog comments still work? They've been trying to figure out that little quandary for about 10 years now. So yes, I don't think its a big deal. The world of the web is too vast. No algorithm can cast a wide net to get rid of so called spam without destroying a huge amount of quality websites. My bravado comes from the fact that Google is was and also will be pretty easy to game.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

          Really? Is that what you think? You think they haven't known about ALN for a while now?

          Why do forum profile links and blog comments still work? They've been trying to figure out that little quandary for about 10 years now. So yes, I don't think its a big deal. The world of the web is too vast. No algorithm can cast a wide net to get rid of so called spam without destroying a huge amount of quality websites. My bravado comes from the fact that Google is was and also will be pretty easy to game.
          A) Forum profile links do not work in any real serp. Come on now. Its 2012 :rolleyes:
          B) the vastness of the web has nothing to do with it. ALN is a small part that can be severely hit.
          C) Has nothing to do with algorithms. A manual deindex of a site will hurt you just as well as an algo hit - in fact worse.
          D) If Google was so easy to game then you would have a WSO showing everyone how to get a number one ranking in any serp AND NOT have to issue refunds.
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          • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            A) Forum profile links do not work in any real serp. Come on now. Its 2012 :rolleyes:
            B) the vastness of the web has nothing to do with it. ALN is a small part that can be severely hit.
            C) Has nothing to do with algorithms. A manual deindex of a site will hurt you just as well as an algo hit - in fact worse.
            D) If Google was so easy to game then you would have a WSO showing everyone how to get a number one ranking in any serp AND NOT have to issue refunds.
            1 - Forum profile links still work. They are not nearly what they were but they are still very effective in a tiered linking campaign.

            2 - If you think Google is going to go around trying to bop the mole manually with every blog network out there then they will be chasing their tail.

            3 - Ive thought about releasing a WSO but the old adage is true. Those who are really making money online would never sell their secret because I make way more doing what I do then I would if I sold some WSO for $50 a pop. I also have always had a problem making money off of other peoples dreams. When I was younger I was a musician and fell victim to those sorts of things all the time.

            Also I have sites that make me thousands a month and I am supposed to give that recipe a way for peanuts? Not to say I can rank anything #1, but I can rank virtually anything first page. Ive been on first page for terms like debt settlement, auto insurance, LED TV ect... Now do they always stay there for long stretches... no, but some do and even if they don't the bang for the buck is tremendous.

            Mike I respect you a lot around here. Ive actually put together my own private blog network throughout the last month due to your recommendations. I also followed your teachings of making the sites real websites rather then shady network sites. I really do respect you very much, but please please please don't buy into this garbage that Google is now un-gamable and now that ALN only has 18000 sites in the network rather then 22000 it is done and over and Google has won the battle.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

              1 - Forum profile links still work. They are not nearly what they were but they are still very effective in a tiered linking campaign.
              utter nonsense. We can go back and forth if you wish but theres one thing that will settle it. Show me any site ranking in a competitive serp with forum profile links. You ARE caught in a time warp. Its time to move on.

              - If you think Google is going to go around trying to bop the mole manually with every blog network out there then they will be chasing their tail.
              they don't have to. they only have to hit enough that it no longer becomes an acceptable business risk for services to offer such networks to the wide public. google knows they will never kill every link spam in the world but its only your assumption that has them thinking they do. Its all about limiting the viability of services too widely used. DROVES of people have stopped offering rental services because of this. You have entirely missed the point. I don't think it s time to panic BUT I do think its time to make adjustments and like it or not many services have because its their money on the line.

              - Ive thought about releasing a WSO but the old adage is true. Those who are really making money online would never sell their secret because I make way more doing what I do then I would if I sold some WSO for $50 a pop.
              You are blowing smoke and playing with mirrors. You cannot offer such a WSO because it would not work. You don't have any secret that no one knows of. IF you think profile forum links are still very effective and tell people that they will DEFINITELY not rank #1 in any serp.

              , but I can rank virtually anything first page.
              theres nothing like making claims when you come up with excuses for why you can't show evidence. I live on the moon and take a space ship to earth every morning. Sorry I can't give you any evidence because its classified . Don't believe me? Calling me a liar?

              I really do respect you very much, but please please please don't buy into this garbage that Google is now un-gamable and now that ALN only has 18000 sites in the network rather then 22000 it is done and over and Google has won the battle.
              LOL. Where did I say that Google has won the battle? What battle would that be anyway? Who says we are in a battle AGAINST Google? This thread is about ONE Network. Thats all. I don't see anyone claiming that all kinds of networks are done. Would I still have my sig then? I do know this though. If you have the mentality that you are at war with your main source of advertising you have a bad business plan.

              Like I said in my last post don't buy into the garbage that nothing has changed and we can just go on as is with everything . HO hum nothing new here. There HAVE been changes. What you ignore in your several posts in this thread is that a great deal of this has happened IN ONE MONTH.

              In February alone SEOLinkmosnster got hit hard, Kyle closed down his network, wide spread reports of BMR losing some, countless other networks diving for cover , closing or locking down new and ALN now added to the list. Are very public and widely used services under the gun? Well of course. No sense in putting on blinders.

              IT may not be and never is time to say the sky is falling but frankly I am just as tired of those who claim the sky is the same its always been HO hum no changes will ever touch us WHILE theres rain clouds releasing large drops of water overhead. They are both non constructive approaches to dealing with changes.

              So pardon me. I will admit there is a storm and that its raining - and go out and buy an umbrella and a raincoat (I've actually owned them all along and seen no drop touch my skin). If others want to put on sun tan lotion and head to the beach hoping to get a tan then God be with them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
    They can't mass de-index blogs using their algorithm. Any of you who've actually worked with complex algorithms should know how extremely difficult such tasks are.

    Going after the big boys (ALN, FBL, BMR...) and smaller (but very aggressive) trouble makers is much cheaper and simpler manually.
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  • Profile picture of the author NicheDad
    Keyword, algorithm.

    They're not using an algorithm to take down these networks. It's the webspam folks.

    You're right, blog comments and profile links were a tougher nut to crack. You see what happened here is that they devalued those links and that worked for a while... Then people started figuring out how to automate them! So now, you see blog comment spam links being even less effective. If you think they are still as valuable as they once were you are deluding yourself.

    What we're looking at is a new direction, signaled by the Panda updates rolling out. The blog comment and forum profile link argument is a straw-man. Fact is, they are getting serious about the spam now, and it's obvious to anyone who is paying attention or not trying to soothe their fears by refusing to believe it.

    So the argument of "why has it taken them so long to stop the blog link spam huh?" is irrelevant. It's what they're doing NOW that is important. Ask anyone who buys blog comment link blasts, social bookmarks, forum profile blasts, etc how effective they are. They will all tell you that stuff was absurdly powerful just 6 months ago. Now, not so much.

    That's how fast things are evolving. Wake up.

    Again, my only point is that Google isn't stupid. I can't for the life of me figure out why SEOs think spam tactics they read in a public forum will work forever because Google can't possibly know anything about them...
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    • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
      Originally Posted by profitmotive View Post

      Keyword, algorithm.

      They're not using an algorithm to take down these networks. It's the webspam folks.

      You're right, blog comments and profile links were a tougher nut to crack. You see what happened here is that they devalued those links and that worked for a while... Then people started figuring out how to automate them! So now, you see blog comment spam links being even less effective. If you think they are still as valuable as they once were you are deluding yourself.

      What we're looking at is a new direction, signaled by the Panda updates rolling out. The blog comment and forum profile link argument is a straw-man. Fact is, they are getting serious about the spam now, and it's obvious to anyone who is paying attention or not trying to soothe their fears by refusing to believe it.

      So the argument of "why has it taken them so long to stop the blog link spam huh?" is irrelevant. It's what they're doing NOW that is important. Ask anyone who buys blog comment link blasts, social bookmarks, forum profile blasts, etc how effective they are. They will all tell you that stuff was absurdly powerful just 6 months ago. Now, not so much.

      That's how fast things are evolving. Wake up.

      Again, my only point is that Google isn't stupid. I can't for the life of me figure out why SEOs think spam tactics they read in a public forum will work forever because Google can't possibly know anything about them...
      Im sorry brother but it seems you are the one that is drinking the koolaide here. Yea.. do certain spam links not work as well as they did... of course not. Things evolve. That doesn't change the fact that I still have sites ranked from a year and a half ago solely on forum back links, bookmarks and even blog comments. I am not sure your point. Yes gaming Google becomes "different" but that doesn't mean more difficult. You claim their battle on spam has improved so much, yet I am not feeling the results anymore then usual. I always have sites lose and gain, but I try to stay current and in the end its all the same. Panda was supposed to redefine the industry also, it didn't kill spam anymore then anything else.

      Also one last thing, you mentioned this little attack on blog networks is not algorithmic but manual? Seriously? So thats their grand plan? To manually go in and try and piece apart blog networks? How long until they get around to my private one? Considering their are probably 100's of public ones and hundreds of thousands of private ones then I'll see them in 2030 when they get around to me.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by profitmotive View Post

      That's how fast things are evolving. Wake up.

      Again, my only point is that Google isn't stupid. I can't for the life of me figure out why SEOs think spam tactics they read in a public forum will work forever because Google can't possibly know anything about them...
      Its simple really because living in denial allows people to continue to think they are achieving or can achieve something doing things the way they are used to doing things. You always have people who say the sky if falling AND that nothing matters. Its two forms of change avoidance self delusion. One thinks all change is the end of the world and the other thinks nothing really ever changes

      As for ALN - to me its clearly DEAD. Sure people will say they still get results but why would anyone wanting long term success go with a service that Google comes out PUBLICLY and states they have a bullseye on?
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      • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Its simple really because living in denial allows people to continue to think they are achieving or can achieve something doing things the way they are used to doing things. You always have people who say the sky if falling AND that nothing matters. Its two forms of change avoidance self delusion. One thinks all change is the end of the world and the other thinks nothing really ever changes

        As for ALN - to me its clearly DEAD. Sure people will say they still get results but why would anyone wanting long term success go with a service that Google comes out PUBLICLY and states they have a bullseye on?
        Anytime some form of link building is proclaimed dead, change your tactics and use them as a lower tier in a tiered linking plan. I guarantee you will see big results for a good long while.
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Is there ever coming an end to this kind of threads? I use a handfull blognetworks for my own sites and my clients sites and none of us have seen a single drop so far. Instead our rankings are only climbing.

          I just put ALN on a bit lower level now, not cause they're on to it but because of the 5000 deindexed blogs, I don't know how fast they are with throwing them out of the network and deleting existing content.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

          Anytime some form of link building is proclaimed dead, change your tactics and use them as a lower tier in a tiered linking plan. I guarantee you will see big results for a good long while.
          Its a forum board. anyone can claim/guarantee anything when they are anonymous and don't have to back it up. However no one need believe anything without evidence either.

          Want my guarantee? I'll over you the same $100 from my paypal account I've offered many (but just can't unload) for you to show me just one truly competitive serp where forum profiles and bookmarks "tiered" together will give you "big results for a good long time".
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          • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Its a forum board. anyone can claim/guarantee anything when they are anonymous and don't have to back it up. However no one need believe anything without evidence either.

            Want my guarantee? I'll over you the same $100 from my paypal account I've offered many (but just can't unload) for you to show me just one truly competitive serp where forum profiles and bookmarks "tiered" together will give you "big results for a good long time".
            Im sorry you misunderstood me. Forum profiles and bookmarks tiering a foundation of quality links. Have you not seen the many sites that offer drip feed xrumer and scrapebox links. To backlink your backlinks? Mike cmon man. I don't rank these sites off of forum links. But I do backlink my backlinks off of forum links.

            I will PM you one website in which this was the linking plan. The keywords are highly competitive and have CPC of $100 up. I am in the process of selling this site for around $5000 as we speak. If you give me your word and your reputation that you will keep this site between us, I will send it over to you right now. This will give some proof that I am not blowing smoke. Now mind you I have over 50 of these sites so I am not going to start giving away my whole portfolio nor my best just to prove a point but I will give you something. Just state on this board that you will not release the URL and i'll PM it right over.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

              Im sorry you misunderstood me. Forum profiles and bookmarks tiering a foundation of quality links. Have you not seen the many sites that offer drip feed xrumer and scrapebox links. To backlink your backlinks? Mike cmon man. I don't rank these sites off of forum links. But I do backlink my backlinks off of forum links.
              Dp I don't have much to add. I am glad to hear that you have begun building your own network (Thats a pretty smart move especially in light of so many of the public rental ones being hit) and thanks for acknowledging me in your decision to do so but I think that you will find that as you build your network with quality sites particularly if you get domains with PR you will find that backlinking your sites with forum backlinks has no great usefulness. Now blog comments on a page with some authority and low OBL yes but forum profiles no. A lot of people claim those for getting a site/links indexed but again with quality links with PR there is absolutely no issue with getting links indexed AS LONG AS THE LINKS DON'T ROLL OFF THE AUTHORITY PAGES (which unfortunately is common in rental networks)

              . I will trust you to keep the site between you and I please. But you can see that I am not blowing smoke. Now mind you I have over 50 of these sites so I am not going to start giving away my whole portfolio just to prove a point.
              Yes of course . I would NEVER be so classless as to reveal your keywords or URl. We may not agree on some things but I don't roll like that. Plus I never call on anyone to show me THEIR serps just to show it in the serps with any other site. SO don't think I am presuring you to show your own.
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  • Profile picture of the author mightiest
    Lol @ Google. If they actually could take care of networks like ALN, they'd be doing so silently, not sending out threatening messages via twitter. Certainly they'll deindex some blogs, but if any of you think blog networks are dead ... lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author Cataclysm1987
    Somebody come to me when they deindex 90 percent of ALN and I'll be convinced of Google's victory.
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  • Profile picture of the author JSProjects
    Originally Posted by profitmotive View Post

    Some of you may know about the Authority Link Network (ALN) some may not.

    For those that don't, it's basically a network of high PR blogs that webmasters can sign up for and have it automatically share spam posts across the network with their links in them.

    Well, Google caught on pretty quickly and Matt Cutts recently tweeted about it publicly. The jig is up!
    I don't think it's a huge surprise that Google is following what we do very closely.

    Diversify your backlinks, create good content, and you'll be fine.
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