"The only footprint these networks leave behind is WordPress."

11 years ago

Here's one of the threads ... tried to find the other in Google cache, but no success:

http://www.warriorforum.com/internet...at-google.html

But it's a network of networks! It will never be detected!

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boxoun

11 years ago

Pretty good guess based on sales page but I'm not sure that's fair to call them out without proof. Not that I care, the owner called me a troll haha.

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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

For the price of the subscription you can buy 1 PR3 domain each month

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by retsek

p=6811136"]deleted[/URL]. Mike Anthony, yukon, et al ..will remember trying to tell the guy why his network isn't public.

You mean why his network wasn't private. I won't laugh. I actually feel a little sad for the guy. You can't get any more public ( the bad kind) than Cutts singling you out and it happened in record time. Plus I really don't think Cutts gets it or more precisely cares that his big corporate pals of Google send links to their sister and partner sites ALL THE TIME and leverage their advertising budgets to get links as well mucking up what the Internet used to be about.

We always hear from Matt about destroying the integrity of search by manipulating it but he forgets Google never invented the internet and the corporate policies of which Google is a part has turned the internet into who has the most dollars gets the most exposure plus ahem nothing does more to destroy the integrity of search than when they put their top adwords payers in the top three spots.

Originally Posted by boxoun

Pretty good guess based on sales page but I'm not sure that's fair to call them out without proof. Not that I care, the owner called me a troll haha.

As you know you weren't the only one.

Originally Posted by nik0

For the price of the subscription you can buy 1 PR3 domain each month

Not the best ones. Prices are up but yeah you could pick ups some for that if you have the time to sort through, do backlink checks and analyze location fo links etc.

Look this is how you have to do Network stuff now

1) Big public launches are out.
2) If you offer publicly make the offer time short, sweet and discreet
3) People can't get hooked up to your best sites until they have been with you a while (taking people right on and hooking them up to your highest PR stuff is asking for a drop kick.
4) Keep you best stuff back and offer it to customers who have been with you awhile by invitation only.
5) Sorry but the crew that wants to pay little bit and spit is the crowd to avoid. They are the ones that put up the one page MFAs and run SEnuke on junk sites. We don't like to mention it much but one of the top reasons networks get discovered in the serps is because competitors know that no one would be linking to that garbage site ranking over them if they were not paid to do so. Want to pay $67 a month and no more go run MS with the included links. Serious people are willing to invest in thier business and I have proven price does a great job of keeping out the undesirables that will expose your site like a wino flasher with nothing but a raincoat on.

Frankly I think the time for building networks to rent them out is over. Its time to make it easier for people to build their own and make them be as seperated as they can be. Then if they decide to do all manner of junk they are on their own when the deindexing begins.

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retsek

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

You mean why his network wasn't private. I won't laugh. I actually feel a little sad for the guy. You can't get any more public ( the bad kind) than Cutts singling you out and it happened in record time. Plus I really don't think Cutts gets it or more precisely cares that his big corporate pals of Google send links to their sister sites ALL THE TIME and leverage their advertising budgets to get links as well mucking up what the Internet used to be about.

Yeah, typo. I edited.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by retsek

..I had to share this.

https://twitter.com/mattcutts/status/240522659673276416

Now I am pretty sure he's talking about SEO Fightback. Watch the video on their homepage. That's a word for word quote.

I remember because there was a thread on it recently, and it seems to have gotten deleted. Mike Anthony, yukon, et al ..will remember trying to tell the guy why his network isn't private.

Stop looking for shortcuts, peeps.

I think I've answered that "private" comment above. Yes, he's probably talking about us. I'm flattered we get a personal shout out.

The video is simplistic, and doesn't cover all the features we offer. Sometimes Marketing and Design departments lose some things in translation.

We have a few doubters, so we'll find out for certain in the coming weeks/months if our theory and design is correct. At least point it's pretty pointless to debate if the product will work because soon we'll know for sure. There's no one better to judge the issue than the Google web spam team.

Originally Posted by boxoun

Pretty good guess based on sales page but I'm not sure that's fair to call them out without proof. Not that I care, the owner called me a troll haha.

Thanks for your consideration Boxoun, but I believe the OP is right. As for calling you a troll I apologise about that, I was just frustrated that you commented on 2 threads about the product without getting the basic facts right.

I shouldn't have held it against you because it's clear that I haven't explained the platform very well, or we wouldn't have people saying they are public networks. So, my bad for not making the sales page better.

Originally Posted by nik0

For the price of the subscription you can buy 1 PR3 domain each month

Well, perhaps I'm arguing for the other team here but I like to think I'm fair

You can get more PR domains than that for your money!

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

LOL. I don't have much faith in Google since my XRumer spam still makes me money in 2012, but you're right they will try to hide of course.

See Now thats the kind of stuff I would tone waaay down if I were you. Which sane person wants to not only join a new service Google already has in the cross hairs but whose owner talks about the wonders of spamming with Xrumer. Its like shooting yourself in the foot and then turning it at your head for an encore. You are just blowing up any confidence people would have in your ability to run a network.

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Yes, he's probably talking about us. I'm flattered we get a personal shout out.

LOL. No one believes that Mike. You do have my condolences though.

Well, perhaps I'm arguing for the other team here but I like to think I'm fair

You can get more PR domains than that for your money!

And those comments just put the nail in the coffin with the blown up foot and head. You continue to think that picking up any old PR domain at godaddy despite its link quality is a good alternative while it isn't for anyone but someone looking to inflate the count of PR domains in their network so they can sell it as a service.

DOn't worry I'm still the Quan - not getting into a long any arguments . Just pointing out the salient facts. Hey!..... looking on the bright side you can settle a long standing debate me and the guys had about Matt Cutt's breath - just take a mist sample off your neck.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

See Now thats the kind of stuff I would tone waaay down if I were you. Which sane person wants to not only join a new service Google already has in the cross hairs but whose owner talks about the wonders of spamming with Xrumer. Its like shooting yourself in the foot and then turning it at your head for an encore. You are just blowing up any confidence people would have in your ability to run a network.

Well, we'll know for sure pretty soon! I don't think my opinion on XRumer will affect the outcome of the tweet in the OP.

And those comments just put the nail in the coffin with the blown up foot and head. You continue to think that picking up any old PR domain at godaddy despite its link quality is a good alternative while it isn't for anyone but someone looking to inflate the count of PR domains in their network so they can sell it as a service.

I'm working on automating it, maybe I'll share it with you. I can't get PR4 and PR5 with it, but since the costs are so low I'll be ok with PR2 and 3s since they serve my purposes.

Anyway, gotta sign off for today. Lots to do as you can imagine.

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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

I'm working on automating it, maybe I'll share it with you. I can't get PR4 and PR5 with it, but since the costs are so low I'll be ok with PR2 and 3s since they serve my purposes.

I know what ya mean, you just scrape PR4+ pages to find broken links and pick them up for reg fee like that Hayden also explained on his blog. I got about 100 domains that way, unfortunately only about 20 of them gained PR. I use them as my tier2 network btw. It's a bit odd cause every single one of them has at least 1 PR4 link pointed at it.

Or perhaps you pick up the ones that missed the auction using some domain checking tool like Expireddomains.net or RegistryCompass, got much higher results there as in all gained PR but it was much more time consuming. Think it largely has to do with the amount of time that they are dropped.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

I'm working on automating it, maybe I'll share it with you. I can't get PR4 and PR5 with it, but since the costs are so low I'll be ok with PR2 and 3s since they serve my purposes.

SEE? Prime example. You really do think that you can automate the process of picking up PR2s and PR3s because you don't have a clue about quality. Theres absolutely nothing new in what you are saying Mike. Its stuff plenty people know.The difference is those of us who really know about buying PR domains don't blow the smoke you do.

But hey keep on trucking

Theres no automation out there that is going to tell you what to buy and what not to buy with the click of a button. You could even teach it to count existing backlinks but guess what?? they won't tell you that the incoming links are all owned by the same guy whos domain just dropped

Wonder if he'll decide to keep linking to you or keep those domains active to help you out?

Set your automation program to snap up every PR2 and PR3 that actually drops. You will be broke in a few months with ton loads of worthless domains. (well not you because you can put those in your network and use it to sell that you have more juice than you really do). Sorry man but your claim that they don't lose PR is just smoke, mirrors or the fact that you have done so little in this area you don't know what you are talking about. There is NO ONE in experienced in this that has not lost key links to a domain

The Quan don't really care what you want to do. Thats cool. . Its just for the love of people who are NOT trying to build up the count of PR domains to sell their service. PR only matters for them if they are really getting juice not putting the PR on a billboard so the can collect fees.

I pick up PR2 domains all the time but they don't cost me a registration fee. They cost me a registration fee and my time doing the searches and checks so that if I give someone a PR link or domain I am not scamming the life out of them cause that juice is no longer there. I took a hit recently NOT doing that with some customers. I could have got them PR3s all day long like they wanted but missed a key deadline because I refused to give them PR3s that were not really Pr3s when you check the links.

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mosthost

11 years ago

Go ahead and laugh MikeAnthony

You don't feel that sad. LOL

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Mike Anthony 11 years ago

Originally Posted by mosthost

Go ahead and laugh MikeAnthony You don't feel that sad. LOL

You my girl now Most? Maybe wrapped up under all that ninja cloth (too short though). I don't even tell her how I feel but you know?
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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

This forum needs a zoom function.

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MatthewWoodward

11 years ago

I think what Matt Cutts is getting at is there are more ways to detect a link network than just wordpress as a footprint.

The outbound link profile for example is a dead give away.

I think he is commenting more on the general stupidity of the SEO world (he is right to do so) than anything else.

The SEO Fight Back system is actually very very clever in how it works. For example if I create my own high PR network through SEO Fight Back other members can only see it and use it with my permission.

Just dont give matt cutts permission

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DeskCoder

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MatthewWoodward

I think what Matt Cutts is getting at is there are more ways to detect a link network than just wordpress as a footprint.

The outbound link profile for example is a dead give away.

I think he is commenting more on the general stupidity of the SEO world (he is right to do so) than anything else.

The SEO Fight Back system is actually very very clever in how it works. For example if I create my own high PR network through SEO Fight Back other members can only see it and use it with my permission.

Just dont give matt cutts permission

There you go. Sign up, and create a username like "MrCutts" ... see how many people actually let you in their private network.

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MikeFriedman

11 years ago

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

There you go. Sign up, and create a username like "MrCutts" ... see how many people actually let you in their private network.

Yeah, cause Matt and his team are going to be that stupid to use their real names.

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DeskCoder

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Yeah, cause Matt and his team are going to be that stupid to use their real names.

Well, you think they are really going to sign up for these private blog networks and take them down one at a time. They're smarter than that (at least I would hope so since they work for Google).

I just thought it would be a fun experiment. See how many people who use these networks are dumb enough to let anyone in.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

Well, you think they are really going to sign up for these private blog networks and take them down one at a time. They're smarter than that (at least I would hope so since they work for Google).

Probably google's number one advantage is the belief around the internet by many that they could detect glaucoma in a bird flying by at ten thousand feet if they wanted. If each network is divided and run differently how are they going to detect a network except one at a time?

Even earlier this year BMR went down at a different time than the others. They pretty much went down one at a time.

The problem of footprints is only a factor for those who can't for the life of themselves get over the BMR model and the mass spinning and linking IMers love. That and too many people are brainwashed and in a trance about numbers. Small focused and niche specific directories are all but undetectable as anything else but regular websites but again IMers love to hear big numbers in a network. Thing is - the bigger they are the more likely they are to leave footprints

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DeskCoder

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Probably google's number one advantage is the belief around the internet by many that they could detect glaucoma in a bird flying by at ten thousand feet if they wanted. If each network is divided and run differently how are they going to detect a network except one at a time?

Even earlier this year BMR went down at a different time than the others. They pretty much went down one at a time.

The problem of footprints is only a factor for those who can't for the life of themselves get over the BMR model and the mass spinning and linking IMers love. That and too many people are brainwashed and in a trance about numbers. Small focused and niche specific directories are all but undetectable as anything else but regular websites but again IMers love to hear big numbers in a network. Thing is - the bigger they are the more likely they are to leave footprints

Maybe not 10,000 feet ... but they can sure do it! This bird needs some bi-focals:

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Mike Anthony 11 years ago

That bird's eye sight is fine. He just did what few Imers achieve

He just got paid.
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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Probably google's number one advantage is the belief around the internet by many that they could detect glaucoma in a bird flying by at ten thousand feet if they wanted. If each network is divided and run differently how are they going to detect a network except one at a time?

Even earlier this year BMR went down at a different time than the others. They pretty much went down one at a time.

The problem of footprints is only a factor for those who can't for the life of themselves get over the BMR model and the mass spinning and linking IMers love. That and too many people are brainwashed and in a trance about numbers. Small focused and niche specific directories are all but undetectable as anything else but regular websites but again IMers love to hear big numbers in a network. Thing is - the bigger they are the more likely they are to leave footprints

Very true. Small targetted networks certainly work. They mimic how the internet works as a whole so I don't know what Google could do to detect this sort of thing on a mass scale.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MatthewWoodward

I think what Matt Cutts is getting at is there are more ways to detect a link network than just wordpress as a footprint.

The outbound link profile for example is a dead give away.

I think he is commenting more on the general stupidity of the SEO world (he is right to do so) than anything else.

The SEO Fight Back system is actually very very clever in how it works. For example if I create my own high PR network through SEO Fight Back other members can only see it and use it with my permission.

Just dont give matt cutts permission

Thanks Matt. Yes, the OBL profile is always something to be watched out for. This is important regardless of any system, or lack of system used for making a network.

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

There you go. Sign up, and create a username like "MrCutts" ... see how many people actually let you in their private network.

Lol, we do have checks and stuff to try and catch them. There are many actions a member can take and all of them are recorded. We've already pulled some members up on this sort of thing.

Of course they could evade us this way, but it's the same system we use to see if members are doing anything silly so we keep a close eye on it. I doubt Google are inside yet anyway, but we're expecting them. If they do sign up and decide to spend the resources to take down a collection of small networks then the private networks will be safe anyway.

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Yeah, cause Matt and his team are going to be that stupid to use their real names.

LOL. I don't have much faith in Google since my XRumer spam still makes me money in 2012, but you're right they will try to hide of course.

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

Well, you think they are really going to sign up for these private blog networks and take them down one at a time. They're smarter than that (at least I would hope so since they work for Google).

I just thought it would be a fun experiment. See how many people who use these networks are dumb enough to let anyone in.

I'm not sure what they'll try to do first. Members can request to join semi-private networks, but it's not even possible to get that far with the private networks.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MatthewWoodward

The SEO Fight Back system is actually very very clever in how it works. For example if I create my own high PR network through SEO Fight Back other members can only see it and use it with my permission.

This came up in the other conversation too and to me it still makes no sense whatsoever. If you are going to form a network where people can't see it and potentially join then why use SEO Fightback - just for the love of each of you paying them $69 per month?

SO lets not play games with this. the point of this system is to invite and grow your network by hooking up with people you don't know. IF it were only people you did know you would just do it on your own or use something far more cost effective for a group - like Manage wp.

The owner advocating buying junk PR domains on Godaddy, pushing content scraping and content "mixing" and now full and center in Google's Bulls eye with Matt cutt talking about it all are all kisses of death.

To be fair he has the BEGINNING of a good system he just doesn't understand networks very well.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

You mean why his network wasn't private. I won't laugh. I actually feel a little sad for the guy. You can't get any more public ( the bad kind) than Cutts singling you out and it happened in record time. Plus I really don't think Cutts gets it or more precisely cares that his big corporate pals of Google send links to their sister and partner sites ALL THE TIME and leverage their advertising budgets to get links as well mucking up what the Internet used to be about.

Yeah I agree, it happened pretty quick. It's a bit like being a kid at school and being told that Darth Vader will be waiting for you when school's out.

But still, why was he personally reviewing it? Surely no one believe he does all the hard labour of scouring the web for link exchanges do they?

Haha, yeah, I'm sure the irony of saving web search from evil link spammers while his boss is ignoring the FTC, and profiting from fake medicine in adwords will be lost on him.

Look this is how you have to do Network stuff now

1) Big public launches are out.
2) If you offer publicly make the offer time short, sweet and discreet

We did a public launch but the private networks were not exposed on it, or to members joining.

I'm looking forward to seeing how you handle your new launch (in your sig) actually, assuming it requires discretion of course, and I don't know if it does.

Frankly I think the time for building networks to rent them out is over. Its time to make it easier for people to build their own and make them be as seperated as they can be. Then if they decide to do all manner of junk they are on their own when the deindexing begins.

Ah, but this was the point of SEO Fight Back. You can build your own network, or you can team up with people you know. For example, a lot of people on this forum know eachother, you know they don't work for google. So it means you can cut costs by teaming up. SEO Fight Back is not supposed to mirror ALN, BMR or SEO Link Monster.

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

This came up in the other conversation too and to me it still makes no sense whatsoever. If you are going to form a network where people can't see it and potentially join then why use SEO Fightback - just for the love of each of you paying them $69 per month?

I don't think people would benefit from the system unless they know other people. You could use SEO Fightback to build your own networks, but perhaps there are more cost effective (in the long term) of doing this. But hey, we marketers are fairly social online. Just look at this forum! I know plenty of other people on various forums, that's where I find all my JVs and learn the best SEO.

SO lets not play games with this. the point of this system is to invite and grow your network by hooking up with people you don't know. IF it were only people you did know you would just do it on your own or use something far more cost effective for a group - like Manage wp.

It can be done like that- inviting people you don't know I mean. But i don't think it's wise. I'd hope our member are more secretive than that.

The problem with managewp is that it allows full access to a blog. For example, what if someone else hacks a members computer or steal their password? All the sites belonging to everyone on the account would be screwed. Plus managewp isn't cheap either, I know this because I pay them $360 per month myself!

The owner advocating buying junk PR domains on Godaddy, pushing content scraping and content "mixing" and now full and center in Google's Bulls eye with Matt cutt talking about it all are all kisses of death.

To be fair he has the BEGINNING of a good system he just doesn't understand networks very well.

I prefer being civil with you Mike, I'm pleasantly surprised you haven't been more vindictive on this thread. But you really can get PR domains cheaper then going into the boxing ring and trying to beat the other domainers in an auction. Maybe you have a better system, but for most people who don't do this full time like you do may struggle to go to your lengths or know when too much is too much.

I've been successful finding PR domains that aren't even on the auctions. It's a little bit more work but I get PR2 domains all day long for the price of reg fees, and that's it. Sometimes I go to GD auction and find something that others have over looked. The only domains I've ever lost PR on are the ones I added to ALN in January.

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Mantasmo

11 years ago

Is this real life?

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Phew it's been a busy day!

Well, I'm gonna go through this thread within the hour. The first thing I want to say is we do have private networks.

This means if Matt signed up personally to our service, he can't find the private networks.

Yes there was another thread that got deleted I suspect because me and Mike Anthony argued so much on it. I did save it from the Google cache however before it was removed. I suspect I'll need to pull it up because once again, people do not understand what a private network is.

Private means private, no one knows the sites, no one can join the network without an invite. People cannot even request an invite, it has to be sent by the network owner. I can assure you that private networks are built with SEO Fightback.

So to clarify, our private networks are "public" in the sense that people know they exist. This is the same as someone saying "I build private networks" on the warrior forum or anywhere else public. It's not enough to find them.

These private networks are subject to the same scrutiny as anyone (like some members on this thread) who build their own private networks that they never share with anyone else. The OBL profile, who.is, nameservers, registrars data etc is the only vulnerability.

To our existing members, please remember the difference between private networks (in the Create Network page, choose option: Private, invite only: Yes), and the semi private networks listed on the grid. Only the private networks are 100% secure, so long as you're not making silly footprints with content.

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MikeFriedman 11 years ago

One suggestion I would make for your private network users, tell them not to put forum signature links on IM/SEO forums that link to any site they are building links to from the private network.

I saw someone on another forum leaving a comment about your service. Right there in their signature was an obvious anchor text link to a site they owned. I pulled the backlinks, and it is pretty obvious they are using a private (or public) network. May or may not be one associated with SEO FightBack.

That is just plain stupid on their part and a great way to make a private network no longer private.

I would go as far as to ban users who do that.

I've done this in the past to uncover quite a few "private" networks. I'm sure Google could do the same thing if they wanted to. All they need is that one thread to get started and they can unravel quite a bit from there.
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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Yes there was another thread that got deleted I suspect because me and Mike Anthony argued so much on it. I did save it from the Google cache however before it was removed. I suspect I'll need to pull it up because once again, people do not understand what a private network is.

there is not a person in this thread that does not understand the word private. Been there done that. The point is simple. If your intent is to stay completely private then you get your people together on your own without each one having to pay you a monthly fee.

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Mr Lim

11 years ago

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

there is not a person in this thread that does not understand the word private. Been there done that. The point is simple. If your intent is to stay completely private then you get your people together on your own without each one having to pay you a monthly fee.

Well I'm pretty sure the OP didn't get it, because first he's saying we don't have private networks, and secondly he said "network" instead of networks. They are in fact different networks with no crossover.

Yes, take SEO Fight Back out of it, I think people should get together and form networks. Cooperation is how the world developed, life is better when you share

I do think most people would want a system to implement it. You suggest managewp, I suggest SEO Fight Back. The fee is for the software, not for meeting people although we help with that too. But, again I would hope most marketers already know other marketers before joining.

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DeskCoder

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Yes, take SEO Fight Back out of it, I think people should get together and form networks. Cooperation is how the world developed, life is better when you share

Yeah Mike Anthony ... you can start by letting me into your network

... please.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

Yeah Mike Anthony ... you can start by letting me into your network

... please.

I'll do better. I'll give you a part of it. You can walk away with it.

Catches you will have to live with?

A) You aint getting immediate access to the network at full power all at once
B) If you want to pay $57 a month or think $99 buys you the world on a string go fish instead
C) Have a mind to work and not just push a button

Still want in? Didn't thinks so. (at least in 80+% of imers cases)

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DeskCoder

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

I'll do better. I'll give you a part of it. You can walk away with it.

Catches you will have to live with?

A) You aint getting immediate access to the network at full power all at once
B) If you want to pay $57 a month or think $99 buys you the world on a string go fish instead
C) Have a mind to work and not just push a button

Still want in? Didn't thinks so. (at least in 80+% of imers cases)

You lost me at work ...

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Mike Anthony 11 years ago

Originally Posted by DeskCoder

You lost me at work ...

Well seeing as how I have never seen you there even once I am quite sure that wasn't the last place I saw you.
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paulgl 11 years ago

For what it's worth....

You have to take everything that the Google Golden Boy Cutts
says, as well as everything google prints, within context.

The whole idea is to buy PR, or otherwise shmooze google
into thinking your site has a great, likable, authoritative
footprint. And then selling that to webmasters who
want to do the same.

It has nothing to do with authoritative sites and their own
networks. Amazon, ebay, wikipedia, etc. etc. etc..... all have their
own gaggle of sites, all interlinked, many on the same server,
etc., and they will never suffer any penalty. They use and
abuse their OWN network of sites, ad nauseum.

So, if you keep trying to buy some program or get in on
someone's so-called "network," that's always what I have
preached against. But, you want to create your own online
empire, then do it without fear.

See, interlinking your own sites is very traceable and what
every big site does. From the ones mentioned above, to
go.com, zap2it, failblog, etc. Even google.com for that
friggin matter.

But....what those big sites are not doing, is allowing others
in (or at least on a noticeable level) to ride their coattails
and get PR.

And that's the gist of what's always been forbidden. Creating
networks to shmooze google and selling spots in it for
nothing more than raising PR, anchor text, etc.

You don't think google knows amazon owns boxofficemojo,
imdb.com, audible.com, endless.com, zappos.com, woot.com,
junglee.com,etc. and they are all interlinked with the amazon
empire. Many people don't know they also own alexa.com.

I know. A lot of you will say I'm mixing things up. But, for me,
I emulate the big boys. If they can create a gaggle of sites
for their empire, then that's what I'm going to do.

Paul
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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

My network is private but I sell links on it in my packages, does that make it a public network?

Anyway I haven't had a single site out of 250 deindexed yet. I'm just a small fish and even if they buy a package they only find 10% of my sites, nothing is inter linked.

Anyway Google is not that much into rolling up private networks, sure when it get's too large then they have to make an ethical point and they do something about it. But as long as it's all small then nothing happens really. Google employees have better things to do then buy every single package on this planet to hunt down all the networks.

Just make sure you work smart and divide it among normal sites at shared hosting plans and the chance to get caught is minimum. Another thing that definitely helps is to ONLY use unique content, even when they get smart by detecting spin content some day then they still can't link any of my sites as every piece is 100% unique.

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mosthost

11 years ago

I really think it's very easy to bust any of these networks. Join, submit content, and then de-index.

The in-content links themselves and the sites they link to are the footprint.

Perhaps Matt Cutts just feels very inspired to take "SEO Fight Back" down because of the comments from Michael Carlin. That type of disrespect has probably made it personal now.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by mosthost

I really think it's very easy to bust any of these networks. Join, submit content, and then de-index.

The in-content links themselves and the sites they link to are the footprint.

Perhaps Matt Cutts just feels very inspired to take "SEO Fight Back" down because of the comments from Michael Carlin. That type of disrespect has probably made it personal now.

What disrespect? LOL, I would LOVE to be called Darth Vader

If what you say is right, then guess what? SEO Fight Back will be fine. He can't even join the private networks. This is what I'm going to prove. I hold my hands up though, it's started now so let's see what happens. Pop corn on the ready we'll know for sure in the next few weeks/months.

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mosthost

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

What disrespect? LOL, I would LOVE to be called Darth Vader

If what you say is right, then guess what? SEO Fight Back will be fine. He can't even join the private networks. This is what I'm going to prove. I hold my hands up though, it's started now so let's see what happens. Pop corn on the ready we'll know for sure in the next few weeks/months.

Ok, good luck then

Maybe David will beat Goliath again!

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by mosthost

Ok, good luck then

Maybe David will beat Goliath again!

Maybe I'd have a better chance if I starting working in my underwear and wearing sandals?

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Wait, so if you get hit you are not going to run and hide like some other network owners did or some wannabe SEO network guru put out a BS report about how deindexed links actually help your rankings?
.

BWHAHAHAHAHAHA Mike you got a link? I missed that one.

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Maybe I'd have a better chance if I starting working in my underwear and wearing sandals?

I bet you are going to be fine mike. I meant what I said. You have the beginnings of a decent setup. You just have to get out of the low quality, spam, spin cheap mindset. It will kill ton loads of networks in your system.

The 2 ton gorilla in the room is not anything called a footprint. Customers of the wrong mindset will sink a million networks even with zero footprints. They neither want to invest money nor work on their online venture so they invariably put up horrible sites that no one would ever link to unless they were getting paid to.

and boom theres your foot print right there. Google has some smart guys and I am a half wit but what I would do is monitor serps and then cross reference it against crappy sites (which do have grammar and syntax footprints due to spinning etc)

Sites that are red flagged for ranking despite having these issues would automatically initiate a backlink check. With some efficient comparison programs I bet that sucker would start spitting out domains and IPs like nobodies business.

Sweet and efficient for them. They are monitoring quality and want to kill whats works so if your network is effective in ranking garbage the warning lights go off.

No need to look for footprints - the footprints are in the serps.

If they have anything close to this its the bottom feeder lazy I don't want to invest any real money clients that will kill you every time. they are the same ones putting up MFAs, running on to WF saying ooh - oooh got to get a forum sig link to my money site like MikeF just referenced (and you can't stop them) and they are the very ones that other competitors look at - say no way this should rank over me and put in reports too.

I got a limited product to launch and one tier is the closest thing I have ever offered in the general IM price range and I have been going back and forth on raising it just so as NOT to get those customers. If you charged more and had quality controls where it wasn't anyone can post you would not have to sweat as much as you might be now.

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MikeFriedman 11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

BWHAHAHAHAHAHA Mike you got a link? I missed that one.

It's a long read. Took me about 2 full days to read it because I kept breaking monitors from getting so angry as I read it. It was clearly an attempt to just keep whatever members were left in their Monster network and bring in as many new ones as they good before the well went dry.

http://www. seonitro.com/easyblog/entry/pandapenguin-case-study-analysis
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- Mike Anthony 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by MikeFriedman
  
  http://www. seonitro.com/easyblog/entry/pandapenguin-case-study-analysis
  
  Thanks Mike but I guess I will still not have read it all because its way too long and I have never really agreed with Dori on networks anyway
  
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  MikeFriedman 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Mike Anthony
  
  Thanks Mike but I guess I will still not have read it all because its way too long and I have never really agreed with Dori on networks anyway
  
  You certainly are not missing anything.
  
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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

I'm not automating the PR checks, that's not how you find the domains anyway. It's the links that determine the value. There's a metric from different domain lookups. If some of these metrics match up, then the domain warrants further investigation that has to be done manually.

So, the bulk of the work (finding domain to look at further and sifting through the piles of crap) is automated. Obviously I can't train an AI to look at backlinks, and then guess how much it's worth based on page content, OBLs and the page link profile itself.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

I'm not automating the PR checks, that's not how you find the domains anyway. It's the links that determine the value. There's a metric from different domain lookups. If some of these metrics match up, then the domain warrants further investigation that has to be done manually.

So, the bulk of the work (finding domain to look at further and sifting through the piles of crap) is automated. Obviously I can't train an AI to look at backlinks, and then guess how much it's worth based on page content, OBLs and the page link profile itself.

I've already automated a good deal of that . Shucks register compass does a good load of that. I don't call that the bulk of the work. The metrics given don't make a hill of beans in most cases that matter

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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

Did Matt Cutts mention SEO Fightback somewhere? Missing stuff here I guess, if so I wouldn't feel too comfortable about it.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by nik0

Did Matt Cutts mention SEO Fightback somewhere? Missing stuff here I guess, if so I wouldn't feel too comfortable about it.

Umm either didn't read the OP? or trying to rub it in?

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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Umm either didn't read the OP? or trying to rub it in?

Both

I did read that retsek thought it was about SEO fight back but read it as it was only his opinion so I was like :rolleyes:

:p

Michael must have done some good marketing / promotion then to get in the spot lights of Matt.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by nik0

Both

I did read that retsek thought it was about SEO fight back but read it as it was only his opinion so I was like :rolleyes:

:p

Michael must have done some good marketing / promotion then to get in the spot lights of Matt.

Oh stop, you're killing me LOL.

I didn't miss the sarcasm.

I'll man up and take the digs if we get killed off. But I don't see how he can find the private networks beyond the usual algo stuff which we all know doesn't find many private networks.

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MikeFriedman

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

I'll man up and take the digs if we get killed off.

Wait, so if you get hit you are not going to run and hide like some other network owners did or some wannabe SEO network guru put out a BS report about how deindexed links actually help your rankings?

Just picking.

Not a dig at you all. A dig at those other guys.

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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Wait, so if you get hit you are not going to run and hide like some other network owners did or some wannabe SEO network guru put out a BS report about how deindexed links actually help your rankings?

Just picking.

Lol, I remember that yes. definitely won the how low can you go contest.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Wait, so if you get hit you are not going to run and hide like some other network owners did or some wannabe SEO network guru put out a BS report about how deindexed links actually help your rankings?

Just picking.

Not a dig at you all. A dig at those other guys.

Lol, I didn't see that report. No I'm not one to hide. Plus, I haven't even made any money yet. I'm actually tens of thousands of dollars down because I've put so much into the system. So it's not like I'm gonna run off to an island somewhere like some of the stock market guys did when the **** hit the fan.

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MikeFriedman

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Lol, I didn't see that report. No I'm not one to hide. Plus, I haven't even made any money yet. I'm actually tens of thousands of dollars down because I've put so much into the system. So it's not like I'm gonna run off to an island somewhere like some of the stock market guys did when the **** hit the fan.

It's a pretty interesting report complete with no actual facts or data.

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Mike Anthony

11 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Carlin

Lol, I didn't see that report. No I'm not one to hide. Plus, I haven't even made any money yet. I'm actually tens of thousands of dollars down because I've put so much into the system.

Mike I am sure you think I am one of your worse enemies (well because you have pretty much said so, lol) but I am sorry to hear that and I hope it works out for you. However all may not be lost anyway if that were to happen. I got about about a 150 guys on my forum that would be interested in looking at the software. Individually hosted on thier own servers they might go for it and pay monthly fees where they wouldn't hooked up to others. There are thousands of people running really private networks. Reach them and you would still make a tidy sum.

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retsek

11 years ago

Originally Posted by nik0

Both

I did read that retsek thought it was about SEO fight back but read it as it was only his opinion so I was like :rolleyes:

:p

Michael must have done some good marketing / promotion then to get in the spot lights of Matt.

Ahh don't worry, every time I see your "crush the competition" blurb i :rolleyes: too.

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nik0 Banned 11 years ago

Originally Posted by retsek

Ahh don't worry, every time I see your "crush the competition" blurb i :rolleyes: too.

But you got to admit I have one beautiful sales thread don't ya think

You should try it some time, you'll be amazed!
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- retsek 11 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by nik0
  
  But you got to admit I have one beautiful sales thread don't ya think
  
  You should try it some time, you'll be amazed!
  
  Yeah I smiled a bit. The look on the Panda's face is priceless.
  
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nik0

Banned 11 years ago

The only way they can find it is if someone of the network gets reported by Google by some pathetic / jealous competitor. Or if they infiltrate but with many small networks, I don't know if they are really going to put all the effort into it. BMR/ALN/HPRS was just to easy to take down. I know people who posted like 5000 times at BMR, he gets reported and the whole network is on risk.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

Originally Posted by nik0

The only way they can find it is if someone of the network gets reported by Google by some pathetic / jealous competitor. Or if they infiltrate but with many small networks, I don't know if they are really going to put all the effort into it. BMR/ALN/HPRS was just to easy to take down. I know people who posted like 5000 times at BMR, he gets reported and the whole network is on risk.

Yeah the networks aren't big enough to rank for "Car Insurance" like ALN did. That's not what we designed it for.

Who knows, I think we're low priority given what goes on in the SEO world. But, I have to accept the possibility we're on some list for further action.

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Michael Carlin

11 years ago

It's a great point, Mike (actually, both Mikes). I'll be keeping an eye on lots of things. I have my own private networks for comparrison. I haven't done anything silly like link to my product sites or even link to the same sites from different networks. I regard my private networks as the constant in this live experiment!