'Hidden Text' and Google - is it 'black hat'?

by mikler
22 replies
  • SEO
  • |
Hi!

I am putting together a site where good SEO is critical. Can anyone advise how google treats various forms of 'hidden text', both from the SEO and 'Black Hat Trickery' point of view. (I am not talking about keyword stuffing or anything like that)

I am thinking of 'accordian' or 'tabs' type text? Or the FAQ style where you click on a '+' after the question and text opens up.

(Another type would be 'JQUERY' and 'JQUERY MOBILE' effects eg several pseudo' pages on one real page, with the rest hidden...)

As hidden text has been used to hide keyword stuffing, I understood that Google may penalise it? Or not count the text towards SEO?

Am I therefore advised not to use this? Or is it fine and I shouldn't be so paranoid....

Knowledgeable comments appreciated.

Thanks

Mik
#black #google #hat #hidden #text
  • Profile picture of the author Nelapsi
    When you head down that path you are just waiting for the update that makes you cry.
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
    Most of the accordian type tabs are written in Javascript or Flash. They are not at all blackhat in any way. It is not seen as hidden text. I don't understand why anyone would tell you that.

    However, search engines do not read Javascript or Flash, or at least very little of it. So while it will not be seen as you using hidden text, it will indeed be hidden. Search engines will not read it at all.

    If it is written using HTML/CSS, you are fine.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    Not all hidden text is bad.

    Tabs for example, aren't bad.

    This forum has hidden text in the header drop down links.

    The question is, how you go about coding the hidden text (javascript, CSS, etc...).
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    • Profile picture of the author nik0
      Banned
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      Not all hidden text is bad.

      Tabs for example, aren't bad.

      This forum has hidden text in the header drop down links.

      The question is, how you go about coding the hidden text (javascript, CSS, etc...).
      Sometimes I have clients that only have an image at their homepage, and they like it that way,and then in the sidebar or top menu bar a few links to more informative pages like their services.

      So I'm always like, that's gonna be real tough to rank, then I runned into someone else who said, no I have content click there and you'll see, so I click and damn a whole page full of it without the url changing. So Google can read it obvious so guess it's some tabbed way.

      How hard is it to set something up like that, are you aware of any guides for this and if this is doable in Wordpress?
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      • Profile picture of the author F1SEO
        It's the white text on white background that Google doesn't like.

        Things like Jscript accordian or open/close it OK because it's just a user interaction that helps to tidy the website - as long as there's no keyword stuffing in there.
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      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Banned
        Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

        Sometimes I have clients that only have an image at their homepage, and they like it that way,and then in the sidebar or top menu bar a few links to more informative pages like their services.

        So I'm always like, that's gonna be real tough to rank, then I runned into someone else who said, no I have content click there and you'll see, so I click and damn a whole page full of it without the url changing. So Google can read it obvious so guess it's some tabbed way.

        How hard is it to set something up like that, are you aware of any guides for this and if this is doable in Wordpress?

        The thing you need to decide first is, do you want the content shown in Google Cache (text version) or are you trying to hide content.

        If you want Google to display the hidden content in the Cache (text version), then you can do that with CSS.

        If you want to hide content, then load the content in some complex/overkill/pretty javascript.

        For CSS you can find a few tutorials searching Google, here's an example tabbed CSS tutorial that shows you everything you need to get Google to display all the hidden text in the Cache (text version):

        If you use a WP plugin, look at the Google Cache (text version) of the demo, to make sure the tabbed content is being displayed in the Cache. Most WP plugins probably don't care about SEO so you'll just have to check each demo Cache to make sure the plugin is actually showing the tabbed content.

        My advice is don't spam out the page, with that said, there's legit reasons to use tabbed content. An example of legit hidden content is a slider, which some display the hidden content as unordered list, which is SEO freindly. Example, a slider hidden content might look like this in Google text Cache:
        • slider content-1
        • slider content-2
        • slider content-3
        • slider content-4
        • slider content-5

        The above example would only be used for small amounts of text, which sometimes that's all you need is to drop a keyword/link on the page, plus the example slider is still usable (images/text/links) for traffic.
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        • Profile picture of the author mikler
          Hi Yukon

          My reasons for using tabs would perhaps be:

          EXAMPLE-1: a sales page - perhaps a photo - and three tabs? One with description, one with tech spec, one with pricing details. All text is important for google to pick up...

          EXAMPLE-2: an FAQ page - a list of question - when you click on the link, a paragraph opens up underneath with the answer. Again vital that all text is picked up by google

          Are you saying that this is more a technical issue - and that as long as one does not do keyword stuffing or anything stupid like that, google is fine with the above two examples?

          Comments appreciated

          Mik
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  • Mikler,

    Hidden text sends a red flag to Google that a site may be untrustworthy. You may want to avoid doing it if you plan on keeping your site around for the long term.

    Here is Google’s policy on the subject,

    Hidden text and links - Webmaster Tools Help

    Hope that helps,

    Shawn
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
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      Originally Posted by TheContentAuthority View Post

      Mikler,

      Hidden text sends a red flag to Google that a site may be untrustworthy.

      No it doesn't.

      Your trying to generalize all of web development.

      Do you think the hidden links in the WF header are bad (Google doesn't)?

      OP, Obviously have to use some self control.
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  • Profile picture of the author mikler
    Thank everyone

    Can I give you an example (chosen at random :-) :
    Why Choose The Art Of Suave? | The Art of Suave

    You will see four 'pull down' sections in the main body of the text:
    'The Satisfaction', 'The Results' etc etc

    (I think this is called 'toggled content' and is often used for FAQ sections.)

    QUESTION(s): If all the sections are collapsed, will 'google' see the text?
    Will it see it as normal text (and register the text for SEO as it does with normal text?
    Or will google possibly see this as 'sinister'? In which case I will not use it?
    Does google treat 'covered tabs' in the same way?

    Comments/help greatly appreciated.

    Thanks

    Mik
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  • Profile picture of the author bb785
    What you are describing is not really hidden text. These techniques are used all over the place and are absolutely acceptable unless you are trying to manipulate by stuffing with links or keywords.
    In the example you give, the text would be crawlable by the SEs and should not be a SEO issue at all.
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  • Profile picture of the author Sneha1989
    Hey actually i want to know about Black Hat SEO what does it Mean ??
    can any body tell about that
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  • Profile picture of the author mikler
    What is 'black hat'?
    Always good to use google for general explanations
    e.g. see here
    Black Hat Search Engine Optimization - What is Black Hat SEO?
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  • Profile picture of the author nik0
    Banned
    Great thanks, just bookmarked the pages for future reference!
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  • Profile picture of the author Matt121
    Do not place hidden texts in your website. Google will sanction you for that.
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  • Profile picture of the author mike221
    If you have put hidden text link then it's simple meaning is that you are only promote your link with anchor text(for ranking purpose only). Do you think it would be natural or search engine way? Of course not, this kind of reasons why Google has introduced "Penguin & Panda". Google knows that which types of methods SEO could be apply and Master Google find out solutions to avoid it.
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  • Profile picture of the author SEO Haven
    Avoid hidden texts at all times. If a human reviewer (once you hit page 1 of Google for any keyword) sees your hidden texts (and they will) they'll definitely impose a penalty (most likely -50 to -200)
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Matt121 View Post

      Do not place hidden texts in your website. Google will sanction you for that.
      Originally Posted by mike221 View Post

      If you have put hidden text link then it's simple meaning is that you are only promote your link with anchor text(for ranking purpose only). Do you think it would be natural or search engine way? Of course not, this kind of reasons why Google has introduced "Penguin & Panda". Google knows that which types of methods SEO could be apply and Master Google find out solutions to avoid it.
      Originally Posted by SEO Haven View Post

      Avoid hidden texts at all times. If a human reviewer (once you hit page 1 of Google for any keyword) sees your hidden texts (and they will) they'll definitely impose a penalty (most likely -50 to -200)


      Your doing it wrong. :rolleyes:

      -50, -200 penalty? Whatever your smoking pass it around.
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      • Profile picture of the author nik0
        Banned
        Originally Posted by yukon View Post

        Your doing it wrong. :rolleyes:

        -50, -200 penalty? Whatever your smoking pass it around.
        I always love those -50 -100 -ONE HUNDRED AND EIGHHHTTTYYYYYYYY penalties.
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  • Profile picture of the author SEO Haven
    Clearly I missed the "tabs" part.

    The only hidden text that will get you penalized is keyword stuffing, changing the text color to match the background and using sneaky codes.

    BTW. the -50, -200 etc are what Google uses if you regularly analyze Google Webmaster Tools. If you've ever been hit by a panda, penguin or whatever it was, you're sure to know about that.

    And no, I'm not passing ANYTHING around! IT'S ALL MINE!
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    • Profile picture of the author paulgl
      Originally Posted by SEO Haven View Post


      BTW. the -50, -200 etc are what Google uses if you regularly analyze Google Webmaster Tools. If you've ever been hit by a panda, penguin or whatever it was, you're sure to know about that.
      That's ridiculous. So, the people who drop 201 places, they got
      double secret penalties?

      More and more I understand why there are so many fail threads
      here.

      Someone should mention that accordion menus like that give
      a lousy user experience. I hate the ones where it's hard
      to close and/or keep them open.

      Keep in mind too, on a side note, that if this menu opens up over
      an adsense ad, it is technically breaking the TOS. And, you
      have more chance at an invalid click if they click over the menu
      and it collapses, causing a click on an ad.

      Paul
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