Does Google really treat a subdomain as a different domain?

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Hi,
I often hear/read etc. that a sub domain is treated as a different domain (than the root/main domain) by Google.

However - when I was using PPC and got slapped, I tried to use the same keywords with a site using a subdomain of the same domain but I got low QS immediately. (I used different content so obviously the low QS came from the domain I was using)

Now - Penguin. Many of my websites got hit by it but initially one domain and its subdomains which were ranked with different keywords but the same niche got hit. My other sites(domains) got hit too eventually, but I was convinced that G was penalizing the domain.(So, I had about 10 sites which were ranked well, and 3 of the above sites - the sites with one domain and 2 subdomains of the domain - got hit at the same time but not the others until later).

Also - we use "high PR web 2.0" for their backlinks and this is because high PR site has high domain authority and we want that with our web 2.0 sites. If subdomain doesn't get any of root domain's domain authority, using subdomain type web 2.0 sites doesn't make sense, does it? (Am I missing something here?)

Now - I have a new company website which has different departments (like an insurance company which has car insurance, health insurance etc.) and it would be natural to use subdomains (or sub folders for that matter) but I'm worried if one of the sites (the main domain or subdomain) got hit with a new algorithm then all the sites get got hit.

To sum up, my questions here -

1: Does Google really treat a subdomain as a separate domain?

2:If yes, how do you explain my above experiences and the reason we use high PR web2.0 sites for our backlink sources?

3:If no, is it advisable NOT to use a subdomain (or sub folder) for any new site (e.g. for a department of a company) which you would like to rank as risk hedge?

Thank you.
#search engine optimization #domain #google #subdomain #treat
  • I too have read and heard this and have my own interpretation of these happens.

    I suspect that Google figured out that they were passing substantial domain authority to subdomains on a domain that weren't necessarily connected/recommended to/by the base domain.

    In response to this they slapped a penalty, or an algorithmic adjustment on sites like wordpress.com, blogspot.com, etc that have no editorial control over their subdomains, this obviously improved search engine results as sites on Wordpress.com shouldn't benefit from the domain authority garnered through the success of the WP project.

    This was interpreted rightly or wrongly by SEOs as a message that subdomains were being treated as separate domains to the base domain.

    I would suggest that in some cases this may be true, but that Google is able to figure out when a subdomain is under the editorial control of the main site or not and thus sites with few subdomains are likely to reap the rewards and penalties associated with the main domain, but subdomains on wordpress.com would still not see any benefit.
  • Based on what I have read.. subdomains are treated as basically folders off the root domain.
    • [2] replies
    • Hi ikuret75,

      To answer your questions:
      1. Does Google really treat a subdomain as a separate domain?
        • Answer: Yes, since it technically is a separate domain, Google does treat it as a separate domain.
      2. If yes, how do you explain my above experiences and the reason we use high PR web2.0 sites for our backlink sources?
        • Answer: Sites do not have PR. PageRank is assigned to individual pages, not sites. The domain has absolutely nothing to do with ranking, save the keywords that may be included in the URL.
        • The reason People use Web2.0 sites is:
          • They are free.
          • You can often include your keyword in the domain so that it is included in all your URLS.
          • You may receive traffic and/or links by participating in a community website.
      3. If no, is it advisable NOT to use a subdomain (or sub folder) for any new site (e.g. for a department of a company) which you would like to rank as risk hedge?
        • Answer: Except for the reasons stated above, the domain plays no role in ranking, each web page is ranked individually based on the content on the page, and how the page appears in the web of pages that is included (regardless of domain).
      • [ 2 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
    • Question

      Is it better to just use pages or subdomains?

      I am setting up amazon stores and putting different products on.

      Which is better?

  • AdWords and Search are two different things that are not related.

    How the search team views something does not necessarily directly correlate to how the AdWords team sees it.
    • [1] reply
    • My point is if Google treats subdomains as different domains, then they should/ would not have penalized my subdomain sites instantly. When I used a new domain it was fine (With different content). The point is Google penalized my subdomain for my base domain. It does not mattaer PPC or Search, it is about if Google sees them differently. If in the PPC the algorithm is to treat them as related domains, it is very likely they have similar Algorithm in the Search as well.
      • [1] reply
  • Wow, I was worried that Google would in-fact pass on authority to sub-domains then it would be quite possibly to pass penalty to them has well.

    As such I have built a number of sub-domains and I limit my link building to 0.5% percent for the domain being in-fear that if the domain got hit so would the sub-domains....

    But I have notice that my domain ranking at #2 out of "2,640,000 websites" for its main keyword with just a couple of back-links. I suspect that building links to the sub-domain has even given the domain more authority for its keyword or it could just be low competition.

    But my sub-domains are not ranking from the 18 Sep. 2012 and my domain is still ranking as usual.....

    Well I do hope someone can shred a little light..
  • Yes, they sure do. Otherwise every WordPress.com blog on a subdomain would be a MASSIVE AUTHORITY and rank for every keyword. And they don't.
  • I have a 12 year old domain with about 10 sub-domains on it.

    A while back, I put an auto-blog on the main domain as I wasn't really using it for anything useful.

    Anyway, when Panda came along, the main domain and all the sub-domains were deindexed (quite a few pages on the sub-domains had PR).

    I removed the autoblog and filed a reconsideration request. About two weeks later the main domain and all the subdomains were back in the index again and the PR restored.


    For me, that's proof that Google doesn't treat subdomains as entirely independent entities.
    • [1] reply
    • Yes, this is something I see or hear often that made me think about the question.
      • [1] reply
  • I highly doubt that Google treats subdomains as entirely seperate domains.
    You can test this with query such as this:

    yourdomain.com

    Only one or two subdomains of your site will be shown in 10 results (if any)
    Google usually limits search results in a serp with seperate domains and lists
    only one or two pages from each seperate domain.

    So your subdomains belongs fairly to your main domain in eyes of Google.
  • I think what sometimes happens (probably most of the time), is that the main domain (example.com) serves as the "Home" for the meat of the site and then links to different services, etc. on subdomains (service.example.com).

    Therefore, if there's a penalty to the main domain, the subdomains are subsequently penalized as well. It can work vice-versa as well.

    In this scenario, even if Google treats subdomains differently (and I'm not saying they do), the fact that they're linked together can get all domains/subdomains penalized.

    Thanks,
    • [1] reply
    • I can see evidence that Google uses domain information to penalize all related subdomains. I do think that domain authority is passed on to the sub domains, but not as much as domain to inner page. Take for example hubpages and Squidoo. You can gain faster authority and pr on squidoo vs hubpages.

      It would be interresting to compare two different sub domains from says , hubpages and tumblr and see if authotity does have effect on the sub doamain.
  • There might be certain penalties which are carried over the entire domain and the subs.
    BEST example for this (as already mentioned) how an adwords campaign can immediately give you a bad QS if you re-do a new lander on a new subdomain because you screwed something up on the main domain.

    Problem is, we never know once a new algorithm kicks in or when a MANUAL review happened whether it affects the entire domain (plus subs) or just the domain. But its reasonable to assume that it's NOT that easy, in case of doubt I always assume the entire domain got slapped.
    • [1] reply
    • I am looking to create a sub-domain and push a lot of traffic to it for a specific product we offer. Will that not create any juice for the primary domain? Because the XXX.MYDOMAIN.COM will still have MYDOMAIN.COM.
  • Banned
    Do this: site:cars.about.com
    • [1] reply
    • yukon I usually understand your points but this is a little too cryptic for me. I'll preface this by saying I don't know whether or not google treats domains and subdomains independently.

      For site:cars.about.com, only cars.about.com results show up. So, seems like it's being treated as a separate domain.

      However, when doing site:about.com, many subdomains show up (such as randb.about.com). So, there it seems like subdomains are grouped with the main domain and not being treated separately.

      Now I'm more confused then I was initially. :rolleyes:
      • [1] reply
  • When you buy hosting plan with unlimited domain all it do is that you have one primary domain and all other you add is sub domain.
    • [1] reply
    • tofrar subdomain is not same as addon domain.With a addon you only share the same c-panel, its a complete stand alone website.
      • [2] replies
  • Ive had my suspicions about this as well. I think something gets passed from the root domain to the sub. I also think its possible that having a PR6 or PR7 as your main domain on your hosting account, with all your other domains under it, can help those lesser domains rank.

    Only going off of anecdotal evidence, no case studies:-)
  • I have my main site (www.mainsite.com) and a subdomain (new.mainsite.com), I'm only using the subdomain as a development area for my new redesigned site. The subdomain is hidden under the construction page, so SE's shouldn't get confused and start indexing the subdomain (or at least it's contents).

    When I'm ready to make the switch to the new design, would it be okay if I just have my host server point my domain (mainsite.com) to the new subdomain?

    Technically, Google / SE's should see this as the same domain (www.mainsite.com), since they wouldn't really see the subdomain that I setup...?... Just not sure if this is proper way to go about switching to the new design?
  • Yes, if your TLD gets hit with a penalty it's hard for your sub domains to carry on without a hitch, setup silo sites if you're worried, it's safer this way..
    • [1] reply
    • Thanks John... Unfortunately, it wasn't so easy to switch my domain over / repoint it to the subdomain... Host Gator tech support had no idea how to do this, other then to tell me to do a 301 redirect.
      • [1] reply
  • Oh man subdomains! What a nightmare. If you ever want to rank on Google do not use a subdomain! Google hates them! I had a blog on a subdomain, blog.subdomain barely ranked for over 20 blog posts. Moved it to mysite/blog ... guess what loads of keywords getting ranked.

    Also when was the last time you saw a subdomain in Google search.. avoid if I were you
    • [1] reply
    • Hmm... I see subdomains in nearly every Google search. Www is a subdomain, as is en and many others. Perhaps you haven't been paying attention? :confused:

      For example I just did a Google search for the term "blogging" and the SERP page included results for all of the following subdomains:
      www
      codex
      googleblog
      analytics

      Try searching the term "puncuation" and you see first page results that include the following subdomains:
      www
      en
      grammar.ccc
      owl.english

      It appears that Google doesn't "hate" subdomains after all, perhaps it was some other reason that you had trouble ranking with your first subdomain?

      From all of the research and testing I have done over the years, I have never seen an actual case where the proper use of a subdomain would harm SERP rankings, I believe that is just a myth.
  • I think yes. you may google it for more information
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