Is blackhat SEO REALLY dead? - Major brand still does it!

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Ok. So I was doing a bit of research the other night on one of my competitiors to see if I could find out some their link bulding methods. What I came accross totally took me by suprise. One of the sites that ranks top 2 for multiple main and long tail keywords seems to be using xrumer type links.

The reason I looked into it so much was because the landing page does not have great on page SEO and mainly consistes of the deals they have on offer. The page was also an inner page of the website. I thought that maybe it was just due to the 'Brand' boost that Google seems to be heading with.

Anyway what I found was mainly guess posts and emd domains linking to the page. I was a bit suprised about the emd's because they were products that the company promotes but nothing to do with the page that they were boosting. So this is tier 1 so to speak and nothing wrong with that at all.

But then I found the the pages linking to these tier one pages were mainly automated Xrumer threads (tier 2). Most of these were indexed in Google but when you actually click to go to the page most of them had been removed so these pages would have been created recently and not yet removed by Google.

At first I thought that they were all just built by an affiliate hoping to either promote their own affiliate links direct to the site and without promoting their own website. But this does not seem the case - they seem to be promoting the brand directly!

Now surely a company of this stature would not be participating in blackhat SEO. Maybe it's just their SEO company doing it and they don't know about it. Either way they could be in for a big fall if they are caught.

I know loads of you on here would be thinking that it's the best method to go when building links is by building in tiers to protect the money site but xrumer links? Surely they will get caught out sooner or later and get hit with a bit hefty penalty - or maybe not.

Personally I have stayed away from this type of tactic since the start of the big affiliate killer updates but seriously with nothing to lose this is quite a tempting option on some of the sites that Google killed.

Don't ask me to name the brand because I wouldn't want a law suit on my hands but it does give me serious food for thought about going back to blackhat.
#blackhat #brand #dead #major #seo
  • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
    Black hat SEO is more alive than ever. There are no true "black hats" here (none that post regularly).
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    • Profile picture of the author rihsatnum
      If there is good there is evil. Light and dark are twin brothers. Black hat will never retreat.
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      • Profile picture of the author kevinhq
        Originally Posted by rihsatnum View Post

        If there is good there is evil. Light and dark are twin brothers. Black hat will never retreat.
        totally agree.
        if there's no black hat, how do we consider a white hat ?
        if there's no evil, how do we consider it's a good ?
        without any comparison, everything would be a mess lol
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  • Profile picture of the author jamesseoservice
    Banned
    white hat seo is really good , its work on long time , black hat seo is not a great seo service
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  • Profile picture of the author Nelapsi
    Who said blackhat SEO was dead?
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  • Profile picture of the author kaymehelp
    it still works but you need to know how to do it
    you may penalize your site if you use it badly
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    • Profile picture of the author darrenlc
      white hat seo is really good , its work on long time , black hat seo is not a great seo service
      I've been whitehat since the first Panda update and it's got me nowhere.

      What ??? This whole SEO thing is blackhat... Its just the kind of blackhat that google is currently targeting that takes your site down.. All other blackhat is still working... Keep testing and keep evolving.. This is SEO
      Judging by what I found you're probably right. Maybe time for some testing of old methods that used to work great but on tiers rather that direct to the site.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Tiered works but how long before they crack down on that as well no one knows. I wouldn't go to xrumer blasts though. Theres a middle ground. Being an out and out spammer catches up to you eventually.
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        • Profile picture of the author darrenlc
          Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

          Tiered works but how long before they crack down on that as well no one knows. I wouldn't go to xrumer blasts though. Theres a middle ground. Being an out and out spammer catches up to you eventually.
          I never seem to get as far as the second tier - maybe that's my problem. As for the Xrumer blasts I'm talking about a major international company selling a product that virtually every adult in the developed world owns. They are getting away with it for now. I'm just so shocked that they would even risk it.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
            Originally Posted by darrenlc View Post

            I never seem to get as far as the second tier - maybe that's my problem. As for the Xrumer blasts I'm talking about a major international company selling a product that virtually every adult in the developed world owns. They are getting away with it for now. I'm just so shocked that they would even risk it.
            Are you sure that is whats causing them to rank. IF you have great link profile outside of spam links it does help to protect you.
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        • Profile picture of the author Nelapsi
          Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

          Tiered works but how long before they crack down on that as well no one knows. I wouldn't go to xrumer blasts though. Theres a middle ground. Being an out and out spammer catches up to you eventually.
          Yep I agree, look at EMD's as a perfect example of this kind of thing. Yes it did work but at the same time everyone knew it was only a matter of time before the crack down came around to him them.
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          • Profile picture of the author darrenlc
            Are you sure that is whats causing them to rank. IF you have great link profile outside of spam links it does help to protect you.
            You know what? You absolutely right. As usual I'm looking at get rich quick instead of long term strategy. Thanks for putting me back the right path before I make a terrible mistake.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
    Serious black hats don't care about long-term rankings. That's one of the reasons their strategies work and will continue to work for a very long time.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

      Serious black hats don't care about long-term rankings. That's one of the reasons their strategies work and will continue to work for a very long time.

      Thats a lot of silly nonsense. I see blackhat people complaining all the time when there is an update and they get slapped. Theres no one ranking for anything that wouldn't want to rank a bit longer if they could. The idea of always just looking for the quick hit and out is kids stuff. Frankly people do it because they don't know how to do better.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Thats a lot of silly nonsense. I see blackhat people complaining all the time when there is an update and they get slapped. Theres no one ranking for anything that wouldn't want to rank a bit longer if they could. The idea of always just looking for the quick hit and out is kids stuff. Frankly people do it because they don't know how to do better.
        You completely missed the point. Surprise! lol.

        People do it because it makes money. You don't know how they do it, so stop pretending to be a know-it-all already. You don't even know any black hat SEOs who make significant money, so why reply at all? Can't help it? No one here is at risk of becoming a BH, that's not an issue here.
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        • Profile picture of the author dennis09
          Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

          You completely missed the point. Surprise! lol.
          Like that's anything new :rolleyes:
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          There is no elevator to success, you have to take the stairs
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

          You completely missed the point. Surprise! lol.

          People do it because it makes money. You don't know how they do it, so stop pretending to be a know-it-all already. You don't even know any black hat SEOs ll? Can't help it? No one here is at risk of becoming a BH, that's not an issue here.
          ROFL . younguns on the internet. Now they think they know who you know through their chipmunk mind reading powers on a forum. HAHHAHAHAHAHA

          I don't know anything about black hat? Thanks for the Sunday night laugh. Plain truth is some of you just want to believe that Blackhat has taken no slaps this year. It fuels the fantasy even if it aint reality.
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          • Profile picture of the author paulgl
            If you don't name the "brand," the whole thread is useless pulp.

            The pages you describe don't sound anything like a major brand.

            Besides, a major brand would not be your "competitor" in
            the true sense of the word.

            That would be like saying the Lingerie football league is a
            competitor to the NFL.

            Paul
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            If you were disappointed in your results today, lower your standards tomorrow.

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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

              That would be like saying the Lingerie football league is a
              competitor to the NFL.

              Paul
              Put them on TV at the same time and I bet they would be
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          • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Thanks for the Sunday night laugh. Plain truth is some of you just want to believe that Blackhat has taken no slaps this year. It fuels the fantasy even if it aint reality.
            You're the most relentless forum troll I have ever come across. I give you that.

            I'm going to end the drama and stay out of "your" threads from now on.
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      • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Thats a lot of silly nonsense.
        Not to mention quite the contradiction, lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author masterjani
    Mostly big brands are getting backlinks automatically by many users from various sources. They also get backlinks from social networks highly. So those little links will not affect them. If you use those same xrumer type to mid level sites then there is a problem.
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  • Profile picture of the author jfambrini
    Google is moving the goalpost again and again. Yesterday's white hat is black hat today and what is white hat now will be black hat eventually. Google wants us to believe that it believes in a "build it and they will come" world. 1% of us build sites that are so compelling that invite links, all the rest must invite links.
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    • Profile picture of the author Nelapsi
      Originally Posted by jfambrini View Post

      Google is moving the goalpost again and again. Yesterday's white hat is black hat today and what is white hat now will be black hat eventually. Google wants us to believe that it believes in a "build it and they will come" world. 1% of us build sites that are so compelling that invite links, all the rest must invite links.
      I personally don't think they have moved the goal post, they just have someone watching the gate to keep idiots off the field. It makes it much more exciting and has me eager to wake up each morning to build my little empire.
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  • Profile picture of the author GobBluthJD
    BH methods were never dead. Nor will they ever die.

    Then again, white hat methods have never been dead. And will never die.

    So there you go.
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    • Profile picture of the author darrenlc
      Originally Posted by GobBluthJD View Post

      BH methods were never dead. Nor will they ever die.

      Then again, white hat methods have never been dead. And will never die.

      So there you go.
      Lol that makes as much sense as a Google algorithm.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by GobBluthJD View Post

      BH methods were never dead. Nor will they ever die.
      What you mean to say is that blackhatters will never admit when some of their methods die.
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  • Profile picture of the author GobBluthJD
    Precisely my point.
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  • Profile picture of the author ronnieavelino
    Originally Posted by darrenlc View Post

    Ok. So I was doing a bit of research the other night on one of my competitiors to see if I could find out some their link bulding methods. What I came accross totally took me by suprise. One of the sites that ranks top 2 for multiple main and long tail keywords seems to be using xrumer type links.

    The reason I looked into it so much was because the landing page does not have great on page SEO and mainly consistes of the deals they have on offer. The page was also an inner page of the website. I thought that maybe it was just due to the 'Brand' boost that Google seems to be heading with.

    Anyway what I found was mainly guess posts and emd domains linking to the page. I was a bit suprised about the emd's because they were products that the company promotes but nothing to do with the page that they were boosting. So this is tier 1 so to speak and nothing wrong with that at all.

    But then I found the the pages linking to these tier one pages were mainly automated Xrumer threads (tier 2). Most of these were indexed in Google but when you actually click to go to the page most of them had been removed so these pages would have been created recently and not yet removed by Google.

    At first I thought that they were all just built by an affiliate hoping to either promote their own affiliate links direct to the site and without promoting their own website. But this does not seem the case - they seem to be promoting the brand directly!

    Now surely a company of this stature would not be participating in blackhat SEO. Maybe it's just their SEO company doing it and they don't know about it. Either way they could be in for a big fall if they are caught.

    I know loads of you on here would be thinking that it's the best method to go when building links is by building in tiers to protect the money site but xrumer links? Surely they will get caught out sooner or later and get hit with a bit hefty penalty - or maybe not.

    Personally I have stayed away from this type of tactic since the start of the big affiliate killer updates but seriously with nothing to lose this is quite a tempting option on some of the sites that Google killed.

    Don't ask me to name the brand because I wouldn't want a law suit on my hands but it does give me serious food for thought about going back to blackhat.
    I believed they did not do this kind link building method. Maybe one of their competitor did it to do a negative SEO for them. BUT when your site is authority enough and have a quality backlinks, it will not affect your rankings at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author darrenlc
      Originally Posted by PeterJonesIMC View Post

      I believed they did not do this kind link building method. Maybe one of their competitor did it to do a negative SEO for them. BUT when your site is authority enough and have a quality backlinks, it will not affect your rankings at all.
      If it was direct to their site then it could be negative SEO but it's to the tier ones that link to the money site.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    Is blackhat SEO REALLY dead?
    "I Want to Believe" - Mulder
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    Hi
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    • Profile picture of the author 9ball
      Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

      Thats a lot of silly nonsense. I see blackhat people complaining all the time when there is an update and they get slapped. Theres no one ranking for anything that wouldn't want to rank a bit longer if they could. The idea of always just looking for the quick hit and out is kids stuff. Frankly people do it because they don't know how to do better.
      They are not real blackhat people LOL

      Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

      Serious black hats don't care about long-term rankings. That's one of the reasons their strategies work and will continue to work for a very long time.
      Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

      You completely missed the point. Surprise! lol.

      People do it because it makes money. You don't know how they do it, so stop pretending to be a know-it-all already. You don't even know any black hat SEOs who make significant money, so why reply at all? Can't help it? No one here is at risk of becoming a BH, that's not an issue here.
      Signature

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  • Profile picture of the author Vivers
    Tons of sites ahead of my sites are doing it as well
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  • Profile picture of the author nekwf
    Blackhat SEO is simply exploiting what they don't say you can't do. Basically, if ad companies like adsense doesn't say you can't do something, doing it is not wrong.
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  • Profile picture of the author WickedDragon
    Black hat will never die.. there will be just some newbies wiped out by it, as allways.
    Meaby you don't know, but black hat links can have quality also.
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  • Profile picture of the author Genesis1
    There is no such a thing noways as White Hat SEO, since in the meaning of the Google, White Hat SEO is when there are no links added manually or automatically by a website author.
    All the links must be have generated only organically from the visitors of the website by sharing, etc..
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    High Quality Backpage, Kijiji, Gumtree Classified Ads Posting Services. Service that brings Value. Get Traffic & Increase SEO at the same time! Prices are starting from 0.09$ per AD. PM Me for more info
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