Specific C-class/ seperate IP address/ seperare host strategy for networks that WORK?!?!

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Hi All,

I have been reading as many posts on warrior as I can about the topic in the title.

Essentially I have FIVE dog niche sites I want to point to two DOG money sites.

Currently the money sites are on seperate IP's on the same Australian Host.

The first level sites are all on a shared Hostgator account.

There seems to be a lot of conjecture about the max number of sites to host on one account, particulary if each of those sites point to one or two money sites.

I get that even having separate IPs with one Host does not guarantee that their IP numbers are far enough away from each other not to look suspicious.

Does anyone have a reasoned view or a recent quote from matt cutts or seomoz etc, that definitively states what the issue is and how to resolve it.

Yes I could host each of the five sites separately, and on separate hosts, in separate countries for a relatively small fortune (for a dog walker when I figure Australian domain costs into it etc) in money and admin time.

Is there a quick workable solution such as seohost (which has up to ten diff IPs on the one account), or will the C class issue wreck this network option?

would having three on a share network, and two on another host work? etc etc?

What are the ACTUAL tactics that you or your "friends" would use to solve this small network issue? THANKS.

PS WHAT ACTUAL HOSTS WOULD YOU SELECT AND WHAT PLANS??
#search engine optimization #address or #cclass or #host #networks #seperare #seperate #specific #strategy #work
  • The two main reasons why this is not a definitive answer are that either seo is an art that no one can tame, or that this question is beyond the scope of the players here (which I doubt)? Or .. is it just a really big secret???

    While I am building a very small support network, it is of no value if G de-rates any of the PR from it. I get that hosting all on one Shared IP is probably not the best method out there, but if i get get some justification as to how far I need to spread these five sites it would be of GREAT help.

    Thanks.
    • [1] reply
    • Aseohosting.com SEO services can be helpful for you.
      Check out their plans and choose the best one for your needs.
      • [1] reply
  • Does anyone have a view about seohost.com shared hosting plans (they say seperate c blocks) is called shared because you share the IP with other clients - up to five.

    It will still be all with one host, but better than sharing five sites on one IP???
    • [1] reply
    • Just about all SEO hosting packages are shared hosting packages.

      The reason that I stay away from SEO hosts is that about the only reason to use an SEO host is to put a private network up. Google knows this too. That makes any SEO host a potential target.

      I have only had 2 sites in my entire network deindexed in the past 18 months by Google. They were entirely different sites. One was on Wordpress. One was HTML. No common articles, outbound links, plugins, etc. between them. The only thing they shared in common was that both were with the same SEO host. Both were deindexed on the same day. When I went through other sites on the same IPs, about 75% of the sites were obviously parts of networks and all were deindexed as well.

      Admittedly, they were not some of my best work. They were two sites I was using just for running some tests, so I did not put a lot of effort into creating them.

      So yeah, there is certainly convenience working with an SEO host, but that convenience means little if domains get deindexed. If you are going to use an SEO host, you better really be building good sites that leave no trace of being part of a network. Just to be safe though, I would avoid them. Spending a few extra bucks a month is worth it.
  • So how many sites should you have on a single hosting account? 1 or multiple as long as they're not pointing to the same money sites?
    • [1] reply
    • That is up to you. I have as many as 4-5 in some cases, but there is absolutely nothing related between them.
  • Having separate IPs is not going to help you much if you are using the same anchor text and linking to the same money site multiple times on your networked site. Unnatural anchor text is much easier for Google to detect than class C blocks.
  • completely useless information.
    • [1] reply
    • Thanks for the conversations and advice guys.

      From other forums and a little research this is where I am at with this:

      Out of the four blocks of numbers that make up the IP address, the C Block is the one that smaller Hosts have in common with all their clients. So having the same C block will make it obvious you are with one host and maybe going heap on a network deal and need further automatic G investigation.

      The seo hosting pack i saw by seohost has five domains for $10 per month.

      My concern is that if another Four people are on your IP, and they are doing their network and get banned or have dodgy sites, then yes you will automatically get banned ( I dont think they just ban some sites on one IP?)

      My sites all have original content, but they each are on thesis and they each point to two of my money sites. Since I dont have other sites to point to, and I dont need to needlessly dilute the PR from these sites, I am working out how to disguise that is what I am doing.

      Seohost dedicated IP plan for five sites is $20 a month, effectively double the shared IP. So if I can get anywhere else that has less than $4 per month for each IP hosting, and I not to go shared IP, then it makes sense not to go with a firm that is known for seo hosting and might encourage more scrutiny from G
      • [1] reply
  • I have had 3 wbsites deindexed but it was my mistake .. I have 77 different websites in my private network..

    My advice for you in this small 5 sites pn is to take website hosting ( no seo hosting) on different servrs and even located in different countries.

    My recommandations are : hostgator, site5, justhost, blue host.... etc

    You can find many offers. They will give you different C-class ip's cause they are built on different servers on different countries .

    So try to do it simple , it is a small Pn and you should have no problem....
    • [1] reply
    • Just to be clear on C class... this is a quote from another forum:

      "An IP consist of 4 parts AAA.BBB.CCC.DDD - the first part is called A-class, the second part B-class and the third part C-class. So any IP under the last part will be in the same C-class. So for example:

      123.123.123.1 and 123.123.123.2 are in the same C-class but
      123.123.123.1 and 123.123.124.1 is in two different C-classes

      Many smaller hosts only mange one single or very few C-classes and therefore makes it difficult to get multiple IPs in different C-classes if you host all your sites the same place. Larger hosts have many C-classes (I believe some even have almost full B-classes but unless you specifically request your various sites to be on different C-class IPs you still could end up on the same."

      BRUCE - isnt the theory that if all of your sites are say on 123.123.123.XXX even though the XXX varies .... If they are a network I( ie point to the same money sites) ... then Google will easily assume they are a network through the C class give away, and de index?

      If however I am with a host that has my sites on different C classes (because A class is country dependent etc) then it isnt as obvious to G. Isn't that why you want to spread your hosting out (to guarantee (almost) that you are on different C classes), and maybe even B classes? And therefore not as obvious?

      DO you also use fake/ not the same, registration details for each hosting plan so that Google cant tell - or is that too hard or not required?

      So C class is then kind of important, and not just a stupid tax? Or am I being Stupid or paranoid, or just not the cleverest grey hatter in the room?
  • Hi Kingfish85 sorry you took exception to my post on another thread, I just didn't feel that I was getting ALL the questions SPECIFICALLY sorted on this thread, and hosting decisions are kind of vital and cost money etc, so I want to get it right, No point making sites manually just to get them de indexed hey?

    It looks like from actual examples IM's have given here that I indeed better " Get yourself a few different cheap hosting accounts and call it a day."

    Re class C " if I tell you a class C Ip is better than a normal class a or b" as per my reply above, I don't get that they are better. It's just that it's a starting point to have different class C IP's if you can. Getting different class A and B's is probably overkill (ie hosting overseas). Different C class Just removes one more signal that G is going to use in their auto tracking list of people gaming them.

    And yes " put good, relevant, quality content on your sites and you'll be fine." that is what I am doing. I just didn't want to pay more than I needed to for hosting, each year, when I am only selling product in Australia and I don't need to over capitalise.

    If I was brilliant at affiliate sites, and had everything automated from link building to article creation then I would just throw money at it, knowing it would come back from my brilliant sites. These questions are about a small player trying to get some return and make a living in the southern hemisphere on sites that are his passion.

    Thanks bradudan I will look into site5, justhost, blue host.. (and keep just one site on hostgator. Cant wait for the fun of site migration.
  • completely useless information.

    1) SEO hosting is a deliberate waste of the IPv4 Space
    2) Hosting websites on different IP Ranges DOES NOT impact search engine rankings, it is a myth.
    3) Any host or "SEO Expert" who tells you that it does make a difference are simply lying to you.
    4) SEO Hosting is pretty much a scam
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
    • [2] replies
    • It has nothing to do with it being better. I do not think anyone here would argue that. Multiple C-class IPs are not going to magically make anyone rank better.

      If you have a bunch of sites together in a network that you are using for the sole purpose of gaming the search results, the reason for putting them on different C-class IPs is to make it less likely that a search engine realizes they are all part of the same network and deindexes them all.

      I agree 100% about there being nothing else special about them.
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
    • Here is a rare commercial example as proof of the above statement.

      Google UK, "Eden Hotel Collection".com

      Central site, 7 sub sites, different URL's, each receives local traffic related to its hotel URL.

      Lots of shared content between all 8 sites in the news section.

      All 8 sites are on the same server, using the same IP.
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
  • There are plenty of web hosts under $4/month that are reliable that you can use for your many sites. Just do your research by reading customer reviews and checking WHT.
  • Hi Mick ...

    the aussie dollar is doing OK, but if the secondary sites dont boost the money sites enough soon enough then the 5 to 10 x (hosting + aus domain) prices can get execisive. This is a hard niche I am trying to crack, not forward selling an affiliate ..

    But yes I get what you mean and a little research plus the recomm even in this tread for host will go a long way. THANK YOU ALL
  • Thanks for sharing nice information. I like these discissions.
  • Hello again,

    I went to register with bluehost and noticed that in the final steps that it says:

    "A Dedicated IP address ensures one IP address is tied to your account, and only your account. A unique IP address allows additional features, including the ability to open non-standard ports, add SSL Certificates and is believed to improve search engine rankings."

    This costs an extra $30 a year.

    Does this mean that most hosting companies provide a shared IP, and if so, how is this different from seohosting companies that also provide a shared IP.

    Are we talking about the quality of clients (and therefore a higher likelihood of your site getting banned for being on the same seo as a blackhatter) or is there a technical difference?

    As none of the major host companies mention how many people are on one IP, i dont get how it is any different and why i should stay away from an seo host kind of company???
    • [1] reply
    • completely useless information.
      • [1] reply
  • completely useless information.
    • [1] reply
    • Oh please. I've been teaching on this subject for over a year here. I know exactly what the prices are.


      of course its per IP. How many Class C IPs does a normal host provide on a $5-$7 package? not five Class C IPs. Who are you trying to fool? Most hosts you would have to show very good reason to get even a second Class C IP at time orf purchase. You yourself indicated IPs might be reclaimed because of the problem of supplying "unnecessary" ones.

      I can't believe you are that obtuse so I can only gather that you are trying to sell up your services. Every non-seo host offers 5 CLASS C IPs with their package? You know full well we are not talking about regular additional IPs so its back to playing games again.


      frankly you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. In one post you say its wasteful to provide those addresses and then you claim all non SEO hosts provide the same deliberately trying to equate apples with oranges.

      P.S. Not interested in the strawman argument that anyone is claiming "class C block is better than an A or B block." This is not the first thread you have been corrected on that.
      • [1] reply
  • What I find amusing is that people are still using the nonsense terms like "C class" or "class C" -- or A, B, C, D, etc. There's no such thing as a "class", much less there being a "C" or any other letter. These are invented definitions by self-proclaimed "marketing gurus" out to sell snake oil. Hosts giggle at these asinine terms, excluding the "SEO hosts" that bilk suckers for their money.

    There's no positive valuation given from IP addresses.

    At very most, sites can be downgraded or entirely deindexed if found to be on "bad neighborhoods" (network ranges comprised heavily of spam, shill, thin affiliate crap sites, etc), which is what most "SEO hosts" are. There's no way to hide the ASN or SWIP'd range from Google.

    Those who still think IP is the only telltale sign of relationship are also indulging in wishful thinking. The code in the site is a dead giveaway (AdSense IDs, for example), as is domain whois. And those are just two of the more common and obvious ones. Even "article spinning" (plagiarism, mostly) is being caught by improved AI that can detect flimsy transposition, borrowed phrases, and synonyms.

    The idea that you can trick Google or Bing with something like an IP address is therefore silly.

    Spend time and funds on creating quality sites people find useful, and would like to visit, and therefore share with others on their own blogs, sites, social media, etc. Or even something picked up by media outlets, colleges, and other authoritative sources.

    All of this blog commenting (spam), forum posting (spam), IP finagling, etc -- all ridiculous in 2012. The games that have been played for the past few years have ended now. Some never even started -- i.e. SEO hosting.

    The longer you stay stuck in the past, the worse off you're going to be.
    • [3] replies
    • This doesn't make any sense. Of course A, B, C, D are "real." The four components of an IP address are referred to by these letters to differentiate them. It's how people communicate about the parts of an IP address. Whether or not hosting on different class C IP addresses is important for SEO is another story. I believe it can't hurt as it's something that Google could easily log and easily use in algorithms. Whether I'm right or wrong on that doesn't matter - the point that claiming there's no such thing as "classes" when referring to IP addresses is still flat out wrong.

      I don't think anyone was saying that IP is the "only" telltale sign. You yourself just said you do believe in telltale signs, such as AdSense ID and whois. Why is it so ridiculous to think that Google might not track IP and take that into account? If you think that getting many backlinks from sites with the same whois might be bad, why is it a stretch to think that getting many backlinks from sites on the same server might not be viewed badly by Google?
      • [1] reply
    • To quote Kingfish's edits "useless information". You merely assume that those running networks either do not address those issues or use "spinning" so like Kingfish your whole argument is based on a strawman. The idea that because Google can use other things to track down a sites ownership in no way implies that A) they do B) that you should do nothing at all if you decide to build a network (your diatrible against doing anything but "if you build it they will come" techniques can be ignored until Kevin Costner does "Field of SEO").

      Fact is the web is run on IPs. Every domain is mapped to one right out the git go so it just makes sense if there ever becomes an issue to take away the one most obvious thing. the ohter issue is that many of you don't know that it isn't just Google alone this is done for. Its also done for competitors that often do report to google. So the Google can do this and that and walk on water argument is equally a failure.
    • Sorry, Class A, B, C, D is NOT invented by marketing gurus or out to sell snake oil. It is to help 'sort out' network architecture and it has been around since 1980s, before the term "Internet Marketing" is born.

      So get your facts right.
  • Thanks Mike,
    Appreciate your reply
  • Banned
    • [1] reply
    • Now, since we need to get our "facts right", please see my details at the bottom for when CIDR "Classless Inter-Domain Routing" replaced classful networking.

      Please explain how the class relates to hosting? Yes, there are classes, but they have nothing to do with hosting or seo at all. They don't "help sort out" network architecture. The classes are comprised of the first octet range of an network range which specifies the number of hosts it can have.

      So when people say A is the first octet, B is the second octet, C is the 3rd octet etc, it means nothing. See below for the quote the OP put:

      ^This is NOT how IP addresses are classed, or ever classed. The class only pertains the the first octet. The IP's above are not even considered class C range... :confused:

      Class A
      0. 0. 0. 0 = 00000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
      127.255.255.255 = 01111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
      0nnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH

      Class B
      128. 0. 0. 0 = 10000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
      191.255.255.255 = 10111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
      10nnnnnn.nnnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH

      Class C
      192. 0. 0. 0 = 11000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
      223.255.255.255 = 11011111.11111111.11111111.11111111
      110nnnnn.nnnnnnnn.nnnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH

      Class D
      224. 0. 0. 0 = 11100000.00000000.00000000.00000000
      239.255.255.255 = 11101111.11111111.11111111.11111111
      1110XXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX

      Class E
      240. 0. 0. 0 = 11110000.00000000.00000000.00000000
      255.255.255.255 = 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
      1111XXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX

      Pfft. please... Go back and read thoroughly the 2 links you quoted and explain how they pertain to hosting. The fact of the matter is that they don't.

      I find it hilarious that you quote to links explaining the network classes yet you still cannot comprehend what they are and how they are applied. Again, when using the classes A,B or C they refer to the number of physical devices or "hosts" the specific range is capable of. It has nothing to do with SEO.

      So, now that we've gotten that outlined, let's move on to "unique class c ip's". Since the class of the network range for said network has nothing to do with SEO, we can conclude that the terms "SEO & IP or network class" actually mean nothing. So, since it means nothing and they do not relate what so ever, we can conclude that selling you "SEO hosting" is actually nothing.

      Strawman arguments...as I said quite a few times, you need a lesson on general networking & IP addressing. Period.


      Classful networking was replaced by Classless Inter-Domain Routing (CIDR), starting in 1993 with the specification of RFC 1518

      RFC = Request for Comments - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

      RFC 1518: RFC 1518 - An Architecture for IP Address Allocation with CIDR

      Since CIDR has replaced classful networking, there "IS NO" C-Class. Even though IP ranges can still be considered part of a class from the years ago, it means nothing now. The IPV4 CIDR blocks people refer to, are not the same as this "C Class" you people keep referring to.
  • Banned
    OMFG LOOK AT MAH NUMBERS

    I R SO GOOD AT SEO NO YOU DUMB, SO WHAT I MAKE NO MONEY< LEAST I AM MASTER OF CLASS CCCCC IPPPSSS

    Class A
    0. 0. 0. 0 = 00000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
    127.255.255.255 = 01111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
    0nnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH

    Class B
    128. 0. 0. 0 = 10000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
    191.255.255.255 = 10111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
    10nnnnnn.nnnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH.HHHHHHHH

    Class C
    192. 0. 0. 0 = 11000000.00000000.00000000.00000000
    223.255.255.255 = 11011111.11111111.11111111.11111111
    110nnnnn.nnnnnnnn.nnnnnnnn.HHHHHHHH

    Class D
    224. 0. 0. 0 = 11100000.00000000.00000000.00000000
    239.255.255.255 = 11101111.11111111.11111111.11111111
    1110XXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX

    Class E
    240. 0. 0. 0 = 11110000.00000000.00000000.00000000
    255.255.255.255 = 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111111
    1111XXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX.XXXXXXXX

    lol jesus christ...
    • [1] reply
    • What's your point? Do you not understand what that is?
  • Interesting....time to read on about this before I decide to start a private blog network? O_O
    • [1] reply
    • When you do ignore alot of things in this thread. It makes absolutely no sense to ignore IP diversity when building a network. None whatsoever. As indicated its better to use diverse shared accounts to get what SEO hosts provide but its just rank silliness to claim Ips have nothing to do with SEO.
      • [1] reply
  • I have a guy in my real estate niche that has most of his BL coming from his own websites ( sidewide too haha ) all on same IP and he is nailed to#1 for every top local term ( over 700 keywords in total) .
    To add insolt to injury most of them are duplicate content , same template websites.
    I guess 12 years old website in same niche with zero SEO ever done to it goes a long way sometimes.
  • Personally, I'd always look for as many unique subnets as possible...
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