Stuck on Overcoming the damn Sape links

24 replies
  • SEO
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Ok so I've mentioned that one of my long time clients is up against a site that has a lot of links on hacked sites. I say SAPE but of course it could be a similar network. I mean 50,000 links like this.

My client's site is for his brick and mortar, local business. He IS the keyword. He had the number one spot for years because he earned it in real life through happy customers and hard work. Then a couple of month ago this new site appeared out of nowhere, then Bam my guy is number 2. My question is: where does the "burn" come in on churn and burn? Or more specifically when? Google is deindexing the links but new ones are being added and it seems G's not keeping up. I've seen them devalue like 20,000 of these links in the past month but at what point does the site get penalized?

Background:

-Yes they've been reported for blackhat

-The spam site is bare bones, not optimized for much of anything and not on Google places whereas my client is (it's a local search term)

- The spam links appear in a list of over 200 other spammy links (cheap viagra and payday loans). The list is identical on each linking site. The links are hidden in the source code of a random page of the linking site, usually an old post from 2010 or similar.

So basically the question is... what would you do to counteract this? Thanks in advance!! I'm trying to help the good guy win
#damn #links #overcoming #sape #stuck
  • Profile picture of the author IM nice guy
    Originally Posted by FakeItTilYouMakeIt View Post


    So basically the question is... what would you do to counteract this? Thanks in advance!! I'm trying to help the good guy win

    Maybe you could just emulate the spammy site, with your own spammy site, and get that #1 back, and then feed traffic to your clients REAL site. Not ideal, but it could definitely work.
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    • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
      Banned
      Originally Posted by IM nice guy View Post

      Maybe you could just emulate the spammy site, with your own spammy site, and get that #1 back, and then feed traffic to your clients REAL site. Not ideal, but it could definitely work.
      THAT, my friend, could be the answer. I can't just sit here in my white hat working hard and playing fair while Google lets the spam-lords rob honest folks blind. I actually have a PR3 site with almost edm that has no association to my main site. That one is at the bottom of first page right now but it maybe time to spam it up
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
      Originally Posted by IM nice guy View Post

      Maybe you could just emulate the spammy site, with your own spammy site, and get that #1 back, and then feed traffic to your clients REAL site. Not ideal, but it could definitely work.
      I think that is an absolutely horrible idea.

      Look, if you are doing SEO for your own sites... fine. Blast, hack, do whatever you want as long as you are okay with the ramifications. When you are doing SEO for a real business though, you are holding the reputation of that business in your hands. To throw links that are obtained illegally that point to your client's site, even indirectly, is risking the reputation of their business.

      If you soil their reputation, it's not like they can just buy another domain for $10 and start over. This is their business and likely their livelihood. Not to mention they probably do a ton of advertising and branding offline that they would have to change.
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  • Profile picture of the author smodha
    Is FakeItTilYouMakeIt still flirting?

    I know your games Cougar
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    • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
      Banned
      Originally Posted by smodha View Post

      Is FakeItTilYouMakeIt still flirting?

      I know your games Cougar
      I know you're jelly I didn't realize talking about Russian hack networks and spam wars would get your motor running. duly noted. rotflmao

      Great now nobody is going to take this thread seriously argggggg
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  • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
    Banned
    Should I lay down and die? Should I cross my arms and hope eventually google will care about one small business losing money? This other business has "stolen links" on pbs, reuters, discovery education endless high pr sites. I can link my butt off all day and I'm good but pbs isn't going to give me a link. These are unrelated, unearned links we are talking about here. My client is losing thousands of dollars on this and Google is in no hurry. Did you have a better idea because I'm all ears, seriously.
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Tovey
    Maybe you could just emulate the spammy site, with your own spammy site, and get that #1 back, and then feed traffic to your clients REAL site. Not ideal, but it could definitely work.
    This one ^^^
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    • Profile picture of the author paulgl
      Give me a friggin' break. Weren't the lot of you just pumping
      up sape?!?!?!?

      If your client was a "real" brick and mortar business, he would
      not be relying on google serps...and if he was, he's a fool.

      Paul
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      • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
        Banned
        Jeez Paul tell me what you really think

        1st) I'm not a fan of SAPE. Can't speak for everyone on WF but I think it's bad karma to buy links on hacked sites. JMO

        2nd) Obviously the SERPS aren't his only source of leads. But Google is a juicy lead source, nothing to sniff at certainly. Nothing to toss aside and say... meh, let the competition have it. Google is the modern phone book and I know you know that.

        Throw me a bone Paul what would you do?
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  • Profile picture of the author Lanx
    were you hired to take back the number spot? or did this takeover happen while you were managing/being contracted to this client?either way it doesn't look good, site that get sape rankings seem to keep them, i think from consensus, it is like putting ppl back into the good ol BMR days, buy a membership drop a few links, sit at number 1.

    Unfortunately you can't "try" out stuff on his site, it's his money site, we can't jeopardize it.
    if he really does want to take back number, without jeopardizing his site, i would just continue doing what your doing with his site and get 2 separate sites. have his mother and father buy the domain and hosting, we kinda wanna disassociate him with his mother's and fathers new site.make it completely different from his site, if he uses wordpress, guess what one of those sites is gonn use joomla, the other, drupal. yea we're basically gonna use PBN rules here. then of course both sites would have content on it, and start getting ranked, the first one would get more links than what you were comfortable with his money site and the second one would get agressive backlinking. now i'm not talking 30k profile/blog posts, of course that's silly. i'm talking about multiple pyramids per property, not just one pyramid, that's not going to be enough, like 1 each week, and keep the previous pyramids alive with constant content. (1 post web2's are silly for tier1, make them real blogs)

    i mean what else do ppl have to offer? if my client wanted his "position" back, and of course without endangering his main site, i recommend this. (of course his family would buy and own the properties, not you, so he wouldn't think you're gonna run off with the l33t rankings)

    again what's his budget? and what's he comfortable with, that's the main 2 factors.
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  • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
    Banned
    Don't worry Mike, I would never play with any of my clients' reputation or bread and butter. I only do small local business, and only honest hard working folks who do business the right way.

    As for the proposed spam site... I'm undecided. If I do go for it I wouldn't link it to the main site in any way. The only contact info would be a different, previously unpublished phone number. I have never felt like I needed to play dirty but it's been months of lost revenue. And yes I think even though he has other lead sources nobody in the service industry can say Google isn't important. He's feeling the burn. The problem is, it's not just one keyword... It's all his main keywords. All the money keywords he dominated for years (fair and square). Now it's been months and that big ol spam site is just sitting there, no penalty in sight. So what do you do?
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    • Profile picture of the author PaulBaker
      It can get real expensive trying to out spam a spammer. Particularly for multiple keywords.

      If the guy is using a network or SAPE type links, he/she is making an on-going investment. The best place to attack back is ROI.

      How is the other site monetized and can you hit them there? Better yet, can you keep increasing the profile of your client's site, increasing the spammer's investment and reducing their ROI?
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      • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
        Banned
        Originally Posted by PaulBaker View Post

        It can get real expensive trying to out spam a spammer. Particularly for multiple keywords.

        If the guy is using a network or SAPE type links, he/she is making an on-going investment. The best place to attack back is ROI.

        How is the other site monetized and can you hit them there? Better yet, can you keep increasing the profile of your client's site, increasing the spammer's investment and reducing their ROI?
        I just had an absolute epiphany!! Thank you verrrry much! Now I just hope he goes for it, fingers crossed.
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        • Profile picture of the author PaulBaker
          Originally Posted by FakeItTilYouMakeIt View Post

          I just had an absolute epiphany!! Thank you verrrry much! Now I just hope he goes for it, fingers crossed.
          lol, cool. Keep us updated, it's an interesting situation.
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          • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
            Banned
            Originally Posted by PaulBaker View Post

            lol, cool. Keep us updated, it's an interesting situation.
            Oh I will Basically I think it's time for him to point all his assets at his main site. These are good, aged, local, big, established sites in his niche that just happen to be his. When he was comfy in the top spot he had the luxury of owning half the first page of the serps for his keywords but I say meh, I can build him another network this is an emergency and his top money site has to be priority. Just trying to decide on the best execution... he's never linked them before... they are all technically seperate companies that provide the same service to the same area, but all the actual work goes through his main company. Different brands. This is what I set up for him back in the day. What do you think? Maybe use the blogs on the different sites or be more aggressive? It would have to be flawless.
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            • Profile picture of the author PaulBaker
              It would be an easy call if it was your own site rather than a client's but your client really only has 2 choices. Wait it out or be more aggressive. As long as it's your client's choice and they understand that things can backfire temporarily.

              Personally, I would start by using your own network. Slowly and methodically.

              You can always remove the links again if you need to and that is the beautiful part of what you have set up.
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  • Profile picture of the author FakeItTilYouMakeIt
    Banned
    @Lanx My history with this client: I built his authority site up 5 years ago. He has had the domain for 10 years. 5 years ago he contacted me, he had lost his top spot. We expanded his tiny 12 page site to 200 pages of unique content. Got him a rock solid link base excellent timeless links, compared to his competition he was NYC and they were Branson, Missouri lmboooo He was fine for years, updating his blog and social media, getting links naturally. When he called me this time to say he had lost his spot I went through everything and he has everything on his side to be in that top spot still except for these damn SAPE links. I mean an old authority site that is still updated frequently, still pulling links and doing great with his online presence and reputation. This spam site is less than a year old, 10 indexed pages and it is ludicrous to me that it's still sitting there.

    Anyways... Here's what I have to work with:

    -4 other sites on the first page of the SERPS for his keywords that are on different hosting, no mutual links, probably two he'd be willing to sacrifice for a good cause. The other two have Google places so he'd want to keep those.
    -Maybe 8 or 9 aged Web 2.0 that he actually uses and updates

    Thank you guys for the advice, this is my niche and it drives me crazy that I can't get him where he needs to be.
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Gram
    What I'd recommend is building some powerful, high pr links to your clients site. Definitely not spam links, quality links.

    Also, SAPE is on Google's radar right now so that is a good thing.

    In addition to building additional high PR links, you can also optimize his site for additional keywords that the spam idiots aren't targeting.
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  • Profile picture of the author ProSence
    If your competitor is spamming late them spam..... but you shouldn't spam..

    Black hat technique works, but it doesn't have long life.
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