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Playing with the Big Boys (30,000+ Searches and $50+ CPC)

by ChristianSites
14 replies
  • SEO
    • |
I've successfully started and grown several smaller sites (1,000 - 3,000 visitors/mo.), and I have managed the off-site SEO for several larger sites (targetting terms that are 45,000+ searches/mo. and have a CPC of $40+). I have never launched a site for myself that targets such a competitive term, though.

I'm thinking about starting a site that would target 3 main keywords (1 for the domain and 2 major category pages). These three terms all have monthly searches of 30,000+ and a CPC of $50-100.

My plan is to have the main domain (keyword 1) and 2 category pages (keywords 2 and 3), these are the competitive terms. From each category page, I will have a number of pages that target longtail words that all have monthly searches of 1,000+ and a CPC of $5-30. I know I can rank these smaller pages, as I have done this before. My thought is then to fund efforts for the really competitive terms with the earnings from the smaller pages, as the site grows (also to put in a lot of time myself).

I have 3 main questions:
1. What are your initial thoughts / What's your reaction?
2. I'm looking at extremely competitive niches - is there any glaring thing I am missing? I know these are competitive, and I know I will need 2,000+ backlinks eventually (this is a long-term, 2+ year project).
3. Speaking of 2,000+ links, how would you go about building backlinks? I know what strategies work and what are a waste of time, but what would your ratio be of different backlinking strategies be? (I'm less interested in anchor text and more interested in, for example, 30% guest posting, 30% PBN, 30% web 2.0s, 10% I can't do math).

Finally, do any of you that have made it in highly competitive niches have advice for me?
#$50 #big #boys #cpc #playing #searches
  • Profile picture of the author Nicky Papers
    Advice: Don't over think your strategy and get caught up in the minutia. There is no substitute for hard work and consistent effort.
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  • Profile picture of the author tjtigers14
    Hard to say without knowing what niche it is and what sort of resources you have at your disposal. I do think you should look into broken link building though. You can get supercharged links on resource pages and it's totally scalable (the only white hat strategy that is imo)

    But I agree with the person above, if you want to do it than you can do it. Good luck!
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  • Profile picture of the author ChristianSites
    Thanks for the responses - and encouragement!

    Nick - that's probably the best advice I'll hear. Have you undertaken a multi-year project? What do you do to keep from getting discouraged?

    TJ - I'm familiar with the broken link strategy, but have never used it. Do you create resources to match what the link pointed to and suggest linking to them instead, or do you just say "here's a broken link. please link to me to say thanks." If the first, how do you scale it?

    P.S. the niche is education, any creative linking ideas?
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  • Profile picture of the author online only
    1) If you want to make serious money you have to go for the toughest keywords - so I agree with you, I would go where the "big boys" at.

    2) First off, I would analyze top 3-5 sites with ahrefs (or any other tool that you use) and see how many backlink from different domains do they have. If they have over 1k then I would say it's pretty competitive keyword/niche.

    Once that's done I would check their backlinks. Are they natural/editorial or just profile links with addition to (public)private network.

    3) 2000+ links are doable within 2 years. But it requires hard work and probably an extra VA to help you out. I would spend most of the time by writing e-mails, creating relationships, good quality content etc... Because if I build semi-decent links througout 2 years, it might be too late - there could be new algos/filters etc, so the "hard work" would be gone within minutes.

    So definitely, I would go with the whitehat approach with a mixture of your own PBN links.
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  • Profile picture of the author ChristianSites
    Online Only - thanks for the response. I get the impression you're familiar with this level of competition, and perhaps you could help me understand what I'm up against?

    One main competitor has 200,000+ links from ~6,000 sites - he's obviously link spamming, so I'm not concerned about him. There are some sites ranking over him with just ~350-500 links.

    My biggest worry is a site that was started in January. They put up a bunch of links in the spring, and then another batch in July. They now have 1,600. One link I have investigated so fare is a PR7 home page link on a related site (how much did they pay for that?). My main question about them is: how are they building 300-500 links in a month that appear, at first glance, to be high PR, mostly related, links. I know some are bought, but just finding the sites - they must e using Scrapebox?

    3. I have definitely gained respect for your link building strategy form the forums. Thanks.
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    • Profile picture of the author seekdefo
      Originally Posted by ChristianSites View Post

      Online Only - thanks for the response. I get the impression you're familiar with this level of competition, and perhaps you could help me understand what I'm up against?

      One main competitor has 200,000+ links from ~6,000 sites - he's obviously link spamming, so I'm not concerned about him. There are some sites ranking over him with just ~350-500 links.

      My biggest worry is a site that was started in January. They put up a bunch of links in the spring, and then another batch in July. They now have 1,600. One link I have investigated so fare is a PR7 home page link on a related site (how much did they pay for that?). My main question about them is: how are they building 300-500 links in a month that appear, at first glance, to be high PR, mostly related, links. I know some are bought, but just finding the sites - they must e using Scrapebox?

      3. I have definitely gained respect for your link building strategy form the forums. Thanks.
      I guess they using a private network or buying up high PR expired domains with PR Powershot or some other software
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    • Profile picture of the author online only
      Your main competitor seems like a blackhat guy so I wouldn't worry about it too much. As you said, some sites with less links are outranking him/her.

      The site that started in January... Well it's hard to say much about his links without actually seeing them. Personally I think it's mixture of private networks & legit links. In both ways, I think he knows what he is doing.

      So your goal is to make 300-500 backlinks per month - that means approx 10-15 links per day. I wouldn't say it's impossible, but it takes a lot of time, researching etc etc.

      If you really want to go all in with this project then here's what I would do:

      1) Do some broken linkbuilding
      2) Create relationships with other blogs/sites in your niche
      3) Offer help for people in similar niche as your
      4) Send tons of e-mails per day
      5) Contact people on twitter or use topsy
      6) Create linkbaits, skyscrapers
      7) Follow reputable SEO blogs
      8) Create infographic(s)
      9) Make your site look awesome - this helps actually a lot, especially in e-mail outreaching.
      10) etc...

      Btw, do you also have somesort of monthly budget for that project? This could speed up the process a lot (content, essential tools, maybe a VA?!)

      Hope that helps.

      Originally Posted by ChristianSites View Post

      Online Only - thanks for the response. I get the impression you're familiar with this level of competition, and perhaps you could help me understand what I'm up against?

      One main competitor has 200,000+ links from ~6,000 sites - he's obviously link spamming, so I'm not concerned about him. There are some sites ranking over him with just ~350-500 links.

      My biggest worry is a site that was started in January. They put up a bunch of links in the spring, and then another batch in July. They now have 1,600. One link I have investigated so fare is a PR7 home page link on a related site (how much did they pay for that?). My main question about them is: how are they building 300-500 links in a month that appear, at first glance, to be high PR, mostly related, links. I know some are bought, but just finding the sites - they must e using Scrapebox?

      3. I have definitely gained respect for your link building strategy form the forums. Thanks.
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      • Profile picture of the author sahilsxy29
        Originally Posted by online only View Post


        1) Do some broken linkbuilding
        2) Create relationships with other blogs/sites in your niche
        8) Create infographic(s)
        9) Make your site look awesome - this helps actually a lot, especially in e-mail outreaching.
        this!
        along with a proper link building strategy you'll rank easily. its not that hard.. believe me
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  • Profile picture of the author GyuMan82
    You don't need to attack the biggest keywords to make good money in SEO.

    You can dominate a lot of smaller keywords where the aggregate total will make you more money than focusing on one giant keyword.

    SEO is not a dick measuring contest, and to be honest it sounds like you don't have the skill/knowledge to tackle such huge keywords considering you're asking WF for advice.

    Trust me start with smaller keywords and bank first and build your experience.

    After you have figured out how to do this, then decide whether or not it's worth your time to tackle big keywords.

    And this is advice from someone who has put up I don't know how many 100,000+ Exact Match keywords on page 1 over the course of my SEO/IM career.

    If I were to liken it to something it would be like the movie industry.

    You can create some huge $200 million blockbuster movie that tanks and brings in only $100 million at the box office (huge loss). Sure there is lots of glitz, glamour, media etc. but you lost money fool.

    Or you can create some garbage $2 million Tyler Perry movie and bring in $10 million at the box office (good ROI). Sure nobody respects you, but you're laughing to the bank.

    Tyler Perry, seriously a genius. But so I digress.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tony Dean
    Adsense does not seem viable any more. I put up two websites over 2 months ago showing three adsense ads in each, and the clicks have paid any where from 2cents to 4 cents, not the several dollars that the main keywords should fetch. Some shenanigans on Googles part maybe?
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    • Profile picture of the author ChristianSites
      Online Only -
      Thanks for the advice. It's along the lines of what I was thinking, but having an order suggested was helpful. (I also have a couple of other link-building strategies for .edu domains (not commenting), which I would add but will not discuss here).

      My biggest issues is the budget, which I am aware of going into this. I'm looking to start this with a ~$500-750/mo. budget. My idea then was to rank some pages for smaller keywords, and use that income to increase the budget.

      Also, by conservative estimates using adsense (I know, there's better ways), pos. 1 for the main term would bring in $20,000/mo., and pos. 2 around $10,000. These is only for one keyword. I think I'd be ok in the top 3 to start with (but no. 1 is the goal!).

      Gyu - I've ranked sites at the no. 1 pos. for a 40,000+ search, $40+ CPC term, which is highly competitive (car insurance industry). I have played with smaller sites, but would like to start making six figures, not five. Hence, why I want to play with the "big boys."

      I'm asking the WF, because there are some people that seem to be very aware of what they're doing and knowledgeable about it. Most advice will be garbage, but I can learn from people like Online Only (I would add Nik0 and Yukon, and some others). Thanks for the help from those who have.
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      • Profile picture of the author GyuMan82
        Originally Posted by ChristianSites View Post

        Online Only -
        Thanks for the advice. It's along the lines of what I was thinking, but having an order suggested was helpful. (I also have a couple of other link-building strategies for .edu domains (not commenting), which I would add but will not discuss here).

        My biggest issues is the budget, which I am aware of going into this. I'm looking to start this with a ~$500-750/mo. budget. My idea then was to rank some pages for smaller keywords, and use that income to increase the budget.

        Also, by conservative estimates using adsense (I know, there's better ways), pos. 1 for the main term would bring in $20,000/mo., and pos. 2 around $10,000. These is only for one keyword. I think I'd be ok in the top 3 to start with (but no. 1 is the goal!).

        Gyu - I've ranked sites at the no. 1 pos. for a 40,000+ search, $40+ CPC term, which is highly competitive (car insurance industry). I have played with smaller sites, but would like to start making six figures, not five. Hence, why I want to play with the "big boys."

        I'm asking the WF, because there are some people that seem to be very aware of what they're doing and knowledgeable about it. Most advice will be garbage, but I can learn from people like Online Only (I would add Nik0 and Yukon, and some others). Thanks for the help from those who have.
        As someone who makes "6-figures" (and not barely, way past) through affiliate marketing and is already there, I can tell you you don't need to be in the insurance niche and can make this in smaller niches.
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        • Profile picture of the author ChristianSites
          Gyu - you certainly can make money, and lots, in not-so-competitive niches. I guess I'm looking to explore what the possibilities in a competitive niche are. Both for more income and for a challenge, probably.

          P.S. Sorry, I may have misinterpreted your previous post.
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          • Profile picture of the author GyuMan82
            Originally Posted by ChristianSites View Post

            Gyu - you certainly can make money, and lots, in not-so-competitive niches. I guess I'm looking to explore what the possibilities in a competitive niche are. Both for more income and for a challenge, probably.

            P.S. Sorry, I may have misinterpreted your previous post.
            Ah I see. Well good luck to you mate and hopefully you report back with some good news!
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