14th Jul 2009, 04:09 PM | #1001 |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:11 PM | #1002 | |
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You know that I think your packets are great for the segment you're targeting and I think your service is extra cheap. Please don't get me wrong, I never said you were being deceptive. Just suggesting that perhaps there was a lack of clarity. | |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:12 PM | #1003 | |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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This is one thing that takes quite a bit of my time; I have sites in my "master list" that have changed things since I found the sites, even though they are not, nor have they ever been, in the packets. And I'm the only person I know of who got a link from the site. So I have to substitute some of the sites I had chosen previously for the month. Sites change things sometimes. That's the way it is. | |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:15 PM | #1004 |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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Yes, I know that, Steve. I just don't know how to make this distinction without having to put a "disclaimer" in. I don't like disclaimers, for the most part. "Negative message" and all...
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14th Jul 2009, 04:15 PM | #1005 | |
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First let’s be clear here; I think your service has been great and the price very low. Even if half of the links get removed I think it is still a great deal. I’ve had good results with these backllinks myself. This is not about "grumbling" but about facts. I went back and found even more backlinks deleted. However, I’m going to keep creating these profiles to see what happens… And I didn’t say that out the 30 package 6 were not working. I said out the 16 I created 6 were not good. I just do the PR7 and PR8 sites because I don’t have enough time to do all of them. I just do the 7 and 8 PR sites, so I don’t know if the others 14 sites are holding up or no. I agree with most of the folks in the forum; the problem maybe over a thousand people creating these profiles at the same time is raising clear red flags. I think Joel pointed out a good idea about distributing the packages at different dates to different lists… Just my humble opinion… | |
14th Jul 2009, 04:16 PM | #1006 |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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Thank you, DJBory. I really am thinking about some methods to "trickle" the packets more than they are now. |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:25 PM | #1007 | |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:29 PM | #1008 | |
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I think the difference between link packets and google is quite clear, really. All I'm really saying is we should accept that in the eyes of the general population of the internet, and hence in google's eyes (because it wants what the internet audience in general wants), we're spamming if we drop links on sites just because they happen to be dofollow and have a high PR. | |
14th Jul 2009, 04:35 PM | #1009 | |
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Knock yourself out. Sites are listed in my sig. | |
14th Jul 2009, 04:36 PM | #1010 | |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:39 PM | #1011 |
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OK I agree with that, definitely. Peace. My point was (and not properly stated, obviously; I should do better) that website owners and google are likely to think its spam.
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14th Jul 2009, 04:41 PM | #1012 | |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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Okay, all this discussion about Spam made me smile. So far this week I have won the Swiss lottery three times and 6 people have died and need me to get the money out of the country for them. Some of you may have heard my story about turning in the scammer to the U.S. Secret Service: Here is the story Well, did you know that these people actually buy "email leads" so they can scam people? The lady who I turned in actually bought more email leads for her Nigerian connection AFTER the legal process of her getting into serious trouble for this crime had begun!! I still have a copy of what she wrote to her "boyfriend" who was in Nigeria after she knew she was in trouble:
Now this is REALLY what "Spam" is. | |
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14th Jul 2009, 04:46 PM | #1014 |
Gold Nuggets Producer War Room Member |
If you want to have a laugh and/or learn how to properly treat scammers, check out: scambuster419.co.uk: where 419 scam artists meet their match |
14th Jul 2009, 04:50 PM | #1015 | |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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14th Jul 2009, 05:28 PM | #1016 |
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Seems to be a big heated debate going on here! Ouch! I think everyone should just go and find their own sources for backlinks (hint hint) lol! But seriously they actually do have alot of advantage over just using the backlink packs! I personally use a mixture of my own and angela's and pauls! Tom Brite |
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14th Jul 2009, 05:49 PM | #1017 |
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What a bunch of justifications, rationalizations, and semantic games. As Jeremy already said, any rational person who understands this stuff and isn't trying to fool themselves knows that using those packets for IM backlinks is spamming. Forget the 'technical semantic definitions', when you're creating profiles, blogs, etc. on non-relevant sites for the purpose of gaining backlinks, you're spamming to some extent. Why all the justifications? Personally, I do similar backlinking. We all have my own moral compass and boundries. I try to accomplish my objectives without doing stuff I'm too uncomfortable with, but I certainly know what I'm doing and don't try and fool myself - or anyone else. Mark |
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14th Jul 2009, 06:49 PM | #1018 |
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I tried the system of both (Angela and Paul) 2 weeks ago in 5 websites. Today 1 of my websites that was #8 in google was banned, other that was in page 5 today is in page 6. With the others, nothing happened. And now my name appears with my ip in a list of forum spammers. It was my experience with Angela´s and Paul´s backlinks. |
14th Jul 2009, 07:18 PM | #1019 |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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Your site wasn't "banned"; you are experiencing the "Google Dance". This is completely NORMAL and happens to just about everybody. Mark my words, your site will be back shortly. There are some sites who don't like links and have even created a "list" of people who have tried to leave a link on their system. A few other sites might pay attention to such a 'list'. However, it means absolutely nothing to Google or any other search engine. If it did, wouldn't you think that competitors would be getting the competition "blacklisted" all over the Internet? Of COURSE they would. If that sort of thing really mattered, all you'd have is mayhem instead of a search engine. Google knows that and they are NOT going to let something like this ruin their BILLION dollar business. |
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14th Jul 2009, 07:43 PM | #1020 | |
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14th Jul 2009, 09:27 PM | #1021 |
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I find this thread funny... It just raises "eithical" questions. The funny thing is this... I can Automate ALL of Angela's links, but the manner I was doing so was giving her sites away for free. I didn't feel that it was right (personal choice) so I changed the way the automation could be done to protect her business. I automated Steve Aylor's BGM 3.0 Package too. (I am not making a "judgment call" here) The thing I have realized is this... some warrior will not see it that way I do. That is their choice. If people put themselves over the rest of the community, they will ruin it for everyone else. Just my Two Cents, Francis |
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14th Jul 2009, 09:31 PM | #1022 |
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| Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. Come get your "angela" course on how to find high PR sites to get links from! I know you want to help the newbies. I still maintain that your service is way under priced. Raise the price to $20, 30 whatever. Put together a course teaching people how to find their own sites. Yes, I know people could do that now. Surely Angela has honed her craft over time. All those little tips, tricks and nuances would have real value. You say the attrition rate for this month is the same as past months. I know your honorable, and I don't doubt any such statements. I do still stand by my sentiments of a couple weeks ago...with the whole affiliate thing and the numbers growing...that there could likely be more prevalent "countermeasures" by G. or these types of sites themselves in the future.(anyone's guess) The decrease in the numbers of peeps hitting a handful of sites at one time, would decrease. You have a valuable product for newbies (some would still purchase the packets) People like me would still buy the packets. Also, although going out and looking for the sites on my own...would be a terrible use of my time-- I would be inclined to purchase such a course for purposes of training an employee/outsourcer to do such work. The increase in price might more than offset the decreases in packets sold? Also, I'll bet you would make for a great teacher, and you might really enjoy such a thing? It could be an ongoing dealeo with new resources, tips and tricks every month? Anyway, just a thought |
14th Jul 2009, 10:04 PM | #1023 |
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FWIW I keep a spread sheet of every profile I have made since I joined up in June. Out of 160 total sites (June/July, including Pauls 50 packs as well), 95 are still good. That's roughly a 40% loss rate which is in line with what others are posting. I don't know how that compares with previous months. |
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14th Jul 2009, 10:29 PM | #1024 |
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Axleman, I also keep all of my urls bookmarked (in my case), in an "Angela" folder. I bought all back packets a couple of months ago (when I 1st discovered Angela), and I have done the 120 from Paul since inception. I don't go back and check them. What I noticed though, is that a fair amount of Paul's sites have very little traffic--like 2, 3, 4k a month. In my humble opinion, those types of sites would be much more likely to notice a big spike in traffic ("spam" as some here call it--which I wouldnt argue with), and consequently...take action. So it wouldn't surprise if a good deal of them had taken action on my profiles, even though I do my due diligence in blending in, and trying to set up a *non-spammy* type profile. |
14th Jul 2009, 10:54 PM | #1025 |
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Maybe the key is to wait and do them several weeks later after the herd hits |
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14th Jul 2009, 11:15 PM | #1026 |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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For those of you who think backlinking is "dying" because some sites react negatively to links, read this. This was written LAST OCTOBER; 60 days after my program began. This site had 20,000 spam posts in one week. I just found this site a few minutes ago, so it certainly has never been a portion of MY program. "Spam posts" which cause sites to shut down registrations and such have been an issue probably pretty much the entire time the World Wide Web has been around. This is not going to "kill backlinking forever" or any of that other stuff people have been saying.
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14th Jul 2009, 11:31 PM | #1027 |
Angela from Aberdeen Registered Member War Room Member Join Date: 2007 Location: Aberdeen, WA USA.
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The dance doesn't normally take this long but I HAVE heard of this happening to a couple of folks. Keep me posted on how it goes with your site.
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15th Jul 2009, 12:49 AM | #1028 | |
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I hope my site will be more or less stablize. It's been around for more than 6 months already. and it is still dancing. hahaha. Care for advice? | |
15th Jul 2009, 02:37 AM | #1029 |
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I think you hit on a really important point: Creating a link and then having it removed is a small signal to google that the link is not valuable (maybe it is spam, or inappropriate, or off-topic). Creating many links and then 20-30% disappear quickly is a HUGE SIGNAL for google that your links are not valuable. Having this happen across MANY SITES is an enormous red flag to google that there's something common between all those sites AND that the links are useless. In other words, like I've been saying all along, saturation and overuse devalues the product. Diversify and find your own places to drop backlinks, and you'll be fine. Stick ONLY to Angela's packet and your site is a part of a large group of sites that lose links together at the same time, etc. Do you really want your site to be grouped with pharma sites and worse, porn? I still think Angela has a tremendously valuable product. However, it's overused and worse, creates a large, easily identifyable group of sites that behave, link-wise, in a similar fashion. |
15th Jul 2009, 02:47 AM | #1030 | |
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I am wondering is there a way that you could find out if this person is being genuine or just here to troll and be a knucklehead? Do you have a record of the IP address that you could maybe back trace to see if this person (quoted above) actually did buy your stuff? I'm asking because that is a pretty heavy dis on you and Paul and the first real problem I've heard of coming from your products. I wouldn't take something like that lightly if I were you guys. Geosander, if you are being legit than I have no gripe. But I would ask, for the benefit of many of us, Angela and Paul included, that you provide us with more proof that this happened to you as a result of using their products. | |
15th Jul 2009, 03:21 AM | #1031 | |
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Thank you Mike Ong for the wonderful personal reviews. i have also wanted to raise some of the common issues you highlighted. i really wish we can do something to solve these issues especially the part on webmasters deleting our account. It happened to me too, many a times, and i was totally disheartened because i put a lot of effort in doing it. So here comes another question, for those who are familiar with Free Traffic System, is it any better than Angela's links? in terms of time taken to build backlinks, sustainability of backlinks, and backlinks' strength (does it really matter if it comes from high PR), etc? wad do ya think: using both FTS + Angela's links together with Francis Murray automated script would give a better result? I need your opinion, thank you so much!
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15th Jul 2009, 05:04 AM | #1032 |
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To add to the debate, I use a combination of links from: - Angela - PJ - Warrior Jonathan Leger's My Way Links - Steve Aylor's Backlink Goldmine 3.0, and, - My own research (free SEO Quake toolbar on Firefox is great) The 4 services above are high value, low-cost offerings by great people BUT I believe that it's risky to be too over-reliant on any one option. For example, Angela has gotten loads of (unwarranted) heat just in this thread and could decide to close her service, then what for her subscribers? Spreading your vulnerability just makes good business sense. Also, while you are backlinking (especially copy and pasting HTML code into profiles), backlink your target site AND your YouTube video AND a keyword-title-relevant GoArticle AND a Wetpaint page AND etc etc, you get the idea. The beauty of a good backlinking campaign is that you can really DOMINATE a specific KW phrase with a bunch of your different sites/pages that increases traffic and blocks competitors (don't forget that Google usually likes a variety of sites on its SERPs but they can be all/mostly yours). The great thing here is that backllinking 6 different pages takes no longer than one with HTML pasting (but much longer with WYSIWYG sites). If you really thought about it, how else could Google determine what sites should be on a SERP page #1 but through backlinks? Google teams subjectively assessing the quality of every single site in every single niche? The cost and time would be astronomical. Backlinking seems here to stay. However, it DOES seem likely that G will get better at spotting obviously artificial link building which will require new tactics. It's all a kind of game in motion. With these profiles that we backlinkers set up, of course they are a form of spam BUT these sites are also hitting us with constant banner ads for diet products, dating sites etc so we are ALL selling something but a profile with backlinks seems pretty harmless to me on the scale of spam malevolence given that we aren't forcing that profile on anyone. |
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15th Jul 2009, 05:15 AM | #1033 |
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Last week I completed half of Angelas July packet, and already my pages are climbing the SERPs. The only other thing I've done is submit my sitemap to Google. This is for a brand new site, and while the site itself is SEO'd to death I think that the movement I'm seeing is largely due to Angelas method. |
15th Jul 2009, 06:53 AM | #1034 | ||
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Is not ranking for any keywords; it is nowhere to be found. I just can see it when I search with the whole URL, so I know it is still indexed. The site is not new; it’s about a year old.. Let me make this very clear: even though many of my profiles have been deleted, I DON’T BLAME ANGELA’S BAKLINKS for what happen to my site. I have been using the links for other sites and they are still there, one of them went to page one of GOOGLE and it is still there. I just don’t know why this happened. I have done nothing special to this site; just get backlinks as with my other sites. The reason I’m posting is not to badmouth Angela’s or Paul’s Backlinks, but to see if anybody have a clue or can somehow help me to get my site back on track… Does anybody have an answer for this? Was the site ‘BANNED’ or ‘SLAPPED’? And what do you guys think I could do to get it back? Any help?:confused: DJBory | ||
15th Jul 2009, 07:43 AM | #1035 | |
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15th Jul 2009, 07:56 AM | #1036 |
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Let me just say that any webmaster (competitor) could oh-so-easily damage your websites (even get them banned) by simply reporting you guys to various "authorities" and what not. If I was competing with any of you for a good keyword and I came across this thread - you're done. tough. |
15th Jul 2009, 08:17 AM | #1037 |
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| Yeah, it is me with yet another post… Sorry for the continuous posting… This is just an idea; How about if we all let ANGELA and PAUL know the sites that are deleting the profiles, so she can, maybe every other day, send us an update to which sites not to use. Or maybe we can send us email or PM between us to share which of these sites are deleting the profiles. I’m open to share my list of sites that are not working or that have deleted my profiles. I think we could help each other a lot by doing this, and maybe save us the time that we spend creating those profiles that are going to be deleted anyway later on. If somebody is willing to work with me in this, this is what I propose: I do 1-15, you do 16-30. After a week we share each other the sites that are no good. This way we can reduce 50% the # of profiles being deleted. If anybody is interested please PM me and we can do this for the next month packages… I’m open to suggestion as well… |
15th Jul 2009, 08:25 AM | #1038 | |
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15th Jul 2009, 08:27 AM | #1039 |
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Yes, I bought their stuff. I´m telling my experience because in my sites I didn´t use nothing more for baclinks only their packages. And I´m sure that my site was banned because when I review it in google webmaster center this text appears in a red box: "This site may be in violation of Google's quality guidelines. More Details". When I click in more details this appears: "Pages on your site may not appear in Google search results pages due to violations of the Google webmaster guidelines. Please review our webmaster guide lines and modify your site so that it meets those guidelines. Once your site meets our guidelines, you can request reconsideration and we'll evaluate your site. Submit a reconsideration request" For this is that I think that my site was banned. My site is only a simple blog with original text and nothing more and I didn´t use any other technique of backlinks. Maybe for others their packages were useful but for me don´t. |
15th Jul 2009, 08:31 AM | #1040 | |
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15th Jul 2009, 08:32 AM | #1041 |
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15th Jul 2009, 08:36 AM | #1042 |
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OK, while I agree that a signal from a single website is not going to affect your ranking, however, a signal from a set A of significant authority sites, about removing links from another significant set of sites B, may or may not affect your ranking. Especially if the link creation and link removal times follow a common pattern. It'd have to be on a really huge scale though, something that google could believe didn't represent the manipulation of any one website owner or even a group of website owners. I don't have any idea whether losing 20-30% of your backlinks from (just as an example) Angela's backlinks packets, when it happens to hundreds of other sites at the same time, and when the links were originally *all* on profile pages, is significant for google. |
15th Jul 2009, 08:40 AM | #1043 |
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Hey Steven, I’ve been following your posts; you seem to be a very knowledgeable and experienced guy. What would you do if a website is in page one of Google for a few KW’s and one good day it just disappeared? It is any way to get that site back to first page? Or is it done for good? DJBory |
15th Jul 2009, 08:48 AM | #1044 |
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All I can say is that I am very happy with the results I have seen. I am currently in the top 5 for almost every keyword I have attempted for my site.And trust me, a couple of these words are VERY competitive.
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15th Jul 2009, 09:12 AM | #1045 |
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15th Jul 2009, 09:27 AM | #1046 | |
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Thank you for coming back to post this, if you were lying most probably you would not come back to keep talking about it, so it must be true what happened to you and may be we all should do a research and be more careful on how we are getting our links. Google hate link farms, any type of spaymmy link building and sometimes something that used to be good becomes spammy due to the high level of posting by spammers, I am wondering if it is possible that some of the places where you posted your links were over spammed and got you in trouble? hard to find out. I hope your site comes out of this penalty soon and I hope it does not happen to my sites.
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15th Jul 2009, 09:45 AM | #1047 | |
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15th Jul 2009, 09:46 AM | #1048 | |
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15th Jul 2009, 10:26 AM | #1049 | |
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All of the same things happened to me that may have happened to you as you are doing your backlinks, and my stuff is still at the top! And my links are still somewhat "diverse", too. Although I have to only put sites where links can be added 'under the radar' now, they are NOT all one type of site or one method of placing the link. Only a HUMAN would know that they are 'profile' links. And technically, they are NOT all "profile" links; go back into July's packet and take a look...you'll see. Thousands of people sign up on sites and only lurk. Thousands. On many sites, more people lurk than actually post. Ask any forum owner. This has been a well known fact since forums and "community type" sites began. Not to mention that pretty much everyone who has posted on this thread has a sig file to add to their backlinks which blows the "the only backlinks you have are profile links" right out of the water. | |
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15th Jul 2009, 10:45 AM | #1050 | |
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Firstly, that right sucks. Sorry to hear it mate. However Steve is right, there are many other factors that may have contributed to this happening. Maybe once you get your post count up you can PM the site URL to someone that can pinpoint exactly why it happened. There are plenty of cats around here that I'm sure would help you out. I would be willing to look at it myself, but there are likely others around here more adept at that sort of thing. I can only tell you that in my experience with Angela's and Paul's packets, I have seen nothing but positive results. Thankfully even my "dances with Google" only lasted a few days to a week. Keep us posted. | |
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