[POLL] Are there really SEO Secrets??

[BenJackson]

We see this phrase all the time in WSOs and even in threads here:

SEO Secrets

So what do you think? Is it all rubbish or do you think there really are clever tricks/secrets that expert SEOs are using for top rankings?

[xxxJamesxxx]

Well I wouldn't call them secrets just stuff you don't know yet.

I use to buy SEO based WSO all the time but there's nothing new in them for me despite their claims and "Secrets".

James

[JawadAshraf]

I don't know about the others but I used to say my SECRET SEO Blueprint because it works all the time when I use it and it gives me SAME results every time when I apply it. Actually when anybody figured out a strategy which works for him and most of the people don't know about that then it calls SECRET. It's so simple.

[Cosmit]

the only "secrets" are simply places to get backlinks from... which are no longer secrets after someone runs a backlink scan on you.

No, there are no secrets. They're only secrets if you're a complete beginner.

I can trace your site and figure out exactly where you got your links, how long it took, anchor text, pagerank of backlinks, etc. And there I have your secret.

[yukon]

Yes, there are seo secrets.

I've mentioned this example before, I'll do it again.

I've been doing my own SEO for about 5 years now so I'm always on the lookout for something unique, seo wise.

A few months back I was looking at a house to buy, this part has nothing to do with IM or SEO, I was simply shopping around for a house.

I couldn't get the house location to show up on Google Maps, so I clicked the Google Text search which already had the house address in the Google Search text box.

When I landed on Google Search (text search) I noticed a video thumbnail image of the exact same house I was just then looking at on the real estate website.

I knew the real estate website I was just on didn't have a video, so I was thinking wtf, how are they getting a simple jpg image to show up inside Google Search as a video thumbnail image?

What I found out was, the real estate site was being sneaky in how they displayed that image inside of flash (xml file ).

You would never know that simple .jpg image was flash without looking at the source code.

So yes, seo secrets exist, at least until you find out about them.

BTW, that video thumbnail in Google Search is prime SERP real estate!

[Mike Anthony]

I normally would have said no but with changes with Panda and social network signals being rolled out into the SE algos its a new world and there are some secrets to the new changes - some of which no one has figure out so I voted probably

[Justin Stowe]

I was gonna say there aren't secrets...

Until yukon spoke!

But for the most part- SEO is SEO. I might learn one new thing when I buy a WSO on the subject, but for the most part they're all the same.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by Justin Stowe

I

But for the most part- SEO is SEO. I might learn one new thing when I buy a WSO on the subject, but for the most part they're all the same.

The secret to SEO WSOs is that more often than not there is no real SEO in them.

[Eric Lancheres]

Hey!

Yes, there are definitely some SEO secrets that some SEO professionals don't share.

Of course, the term has been re-used over and over again... often by people that don't REALLY have a secret to share.

The DEFINITION of a secret is something that other people "don't yet know/hidden from others". Once people learn the new SEO technique, it's no longer a secret.

Perfect example:
When social bookmarking came out... it was considered a secret that you could bookmark your link on 15-20 sites and get massive rankings JUST from that. (This was back in 2006-8ish)

Now, that's not a secret... heck, just adding normal bookmarks doesn't even work that well anymore. However, back then, when it DID work, and not many people knew about it, it was a secret.

These days (like always), there are a ton of new secrets that people have discovered and pay a lot of money for. It's worth it if SEO is your bread and butter!

[yukon]

Wanna see a cool trick in how to hide content from Google?

You can control what text Google thinks is on the page (you won't find this in any WSO).

I learned this trick about 5 years ago when I first got hooked on seo.

At the time I had a free font website, you know, like the BIG daddy of all font sites dafont.

Anyways, I was looking at the Google Cache (text only version) snooping around to see what they were up to.

Long story short, dafont hides their entire Header Navigation behind javascript. Some guys might say, yea a lot of sites have javascript Nav. what's the big deal.

It is a big deal, because dafont has 98 internal links on their Index page that they are hiding from Google, the 98 links don't leak PR.

1) Regular dafont Index page here

2) Same dafont Index page here

Compare both the regular Index page & the Google Cache (text only page), Google reads text so the Full Cache (images, etc...) are all fluff.

Just a little trick to control the page links/text.

PS, don't go crazy with hiding text, still it works & I know for a fact dafont has been doing this for over 5 years.

Hidden links (Google Cache)

The links the traffic will see

[JSProjects]

I voted "probably not." But I wouldn't have a problem with voting "probably," either. Most SEO methods aren't secrets. Sure, there's always slick techniques that work. Mainly leaning towards black hat methods. But these are eventually exploited and become worthless.

[Grindstone]

Lots of SEO secrets, none of them worth selling in WSO's for $7, $17, $27, etc.

[rahmanpaidar]

Originally Posted by yukon

Wanna see a cool trick in how to hide content from Google?

You can control what text Google thinks is on the page (you won't find this in any WSO).

I learned this trick about 5 years ago when I first got hooked on seo.

At the time I had a free font website, you know, like the BIG daddy of all font sites dafont.

Anyways, I was looking at the Google Cache (text only version) snooping around to see what they were up to.

Long story short, dafont hides their entire Header Navigation behind javascript. Some guys might say, yea a lot of sites have javascript Nav. what's the big deal.

It is a big deal, because dafont has 98 internal links on their Index page that they are hiding from Google, the 98 links don't leak PR.

1) Regular dafont Index page here

2) Same dafont Index page here

Compare both the regular Index page & the Google Cache (text only page), Google reads text so the Full Cache (images, etc...) are all fluff.

Just a little trick to control the page links/text.

PS, don't go crazy with hiding text, still it works & I know for a fact dafont has been doing this for over 5 years.

Yukon, nice points you mentioned in this thread and I think many people
including me learned from them.

But let me say that the new googlebot seems to be reading
javascripts and links within them. Even Flash files as you mentioned in
previous post is being read by googlebot and all links, texts and images
are extracted as far as the current technology allow bots. Even
links whitin PDF files seems to be counted as a "follow" links that are often
showing up when you use "link:site.com" command that proves
javascripts, flash and PDF are being crawled.

I designed a site for one of my customers that uses javascripts for dynamicaly
changing text and links from one source file to apply to all pages when needed.
And the interesting part is that the links in javascripts are showing up in GWT
when I examine them. And now after your post I checked the cached
version and it is not showing there.

This is not the case for Yahoo, and site explorer does not show links in
PDF, Javascripts and flash files.

[Brad Seid]

I wouldn't really call them secrets but there are Plugins and SEO Backlinking Tactics that Google likes a lot better and helps...

There are a lot of automation tools that can bring in a higher quantity of backlinks in a shorter period of time. But Google is constantly working on their updates to knock out the "craplinks"

[Sohel Parvez]

Probably Not, as i don't know any secret of SEO.

[Mike Grant]

Yep, definitely secrets. I exploit them often.

[Grindstone]

Originally Posted by Mike Grant

Yep, definitely secrets. I exploit them often.

Haha, indeed. And as soon as they're public knowledge, they get exploited too frequently and google adapts. Loose lips sink ships, close to the vest ranks indefinitely.

[paulgl]

The first 2 answers are basically the same, "Yes."
The other 2 are basically the same as well, "No."

Right now it's leaning slightly to "No."

Here's a secret: Basic optimization is not worth squat.

Paul

[Becker13]

There are alot of things that people just do not share

[yukon]

The only flash I've ever seen Google read was Flash that was pulling data from an external xml file, so actually the flash wasn't being read it was the xml file, which is a text file.

Javascript is kinda funny, like I've posted above, I don't think G can read that dafont javascript in their header. If G could read the dafont javascript it would show up in the G cache.

I have seen them read javascript before, just not all of it.

I've also seen G read the contents of an iframe from a remote site.

Originally Posted by rahmanpaidar

Yukon, nice points you mentioned in this thread and I think many people
including me learned from them.

But let me say that the new googlebot seems to be reading
javascripts and links within them. Even Flash files as you mentioned in
previous post is being read by googlebot and all links, texts and images
are extracted as far as the current technology allow bots. Even
links whitin PDF files seems to be counted as a "follow" links that are often
showing up when you use "link:site.com" command that proves
javascripts, flash and PDF are being crawled.

I designed a site for one of my customers that uses javascripts for dynamicaly
changing text and links from one source file to apply to all pages when needed.
And the interesting part is that the links in javascripts are showing up in GWT
when I examine them. And now after your post I checked the cached
version and it is not showing there.

This is not the case for Yahoo, and site explorer does not show links in
PDF, Javascripts and flash files.

[MikeFriedman]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

The secret to SEO WSOs is that more often than not there is no real SEO in them.

I'll agree with that. Most SEO WSO's are either just a bunch of backlinks, and usually really awful ones at that, or information that someone repackaged from some really bad PLR or an ebook that is 5 years old. And then there are some really crappy ones that will promise you "page one rankings".

[paulgl]

Okay, off topic a little.

Yukon, didn't you point out that google reads their own friggin ads as well?
I did not believe that until I went to get the url of an ad I hated.
Unfortunately, it was in flash so I had no way. On a whim I searched
for the text in the ad. Clicked on the first site that was listed. lo
and behold, top center, was an adsense TEXT ad with the exact
phrase. I knew it was the same ad, just text.

I scooped up the url and blocked it.

This made me be very careful at what ads I want to see on my sites.

The competitive ad filter is a two-edged sword.

There are some that appear all the time. Probably these have more of
a chance at being read, if at all.

I'd say that's at least a smoking gun for them reading text generated
from javascript. They also claim to read some flash text, but I wouldn't
count on it.

Paul

[yukon]

Originally Posted by paulgl

Okay, off topic a little.

Yukon, didn't you point out that google reads their own friggin ads as well?
I did not believe that until I went to get the url of an ad I hated.
Unfortunately, it was in flash so I had no way. On a whim I searched
for the text in the ad. Clicked on the first site that was listed. lo
and behold, top center, was an adsense TEXT ad with the exact
phrase. I knew it was the same ad, just text.

I scooped up the url and blocked it.

This made me be very careful at what ads I want to see on my sites.

The competitive ad filter is a two-edged sword.

There are some that appear all the time. Probably these have more of
a chance at being read, if at all.

I'd say that's at least a smoking gun for them reading text generated
from javascript. They also claim to read some flash text, but I wouldn't
count on it.

Paul

Yes, I've cuaght Google reading the Adsense javascript Ads maybe a dozen times for multiple sites, including at least one of my own sites.

Thing is javascript can be made conmplex & I think G is only reading basic stuff. I could be off saying that (basic stuff) since I havn't seen every site on the net. Still, from what I've noticed I don't think they are very good at reading the complex javascript code (yet).

Back to the flash, I've downloaded & decoded some flash files to get the flash source code (off line) & what they did was the flash content was all remote, nothing existed inside the flash files except a link in the source code to a remote xml file that could be hosted anyplace on the net. Inside the xml file was a URL pointing to a jpg image, which Google was showing in the SERPs as a video thumbnail image, lol. That was the real estate site I talked about above. It was all xml (URLs) that was being read by Google. Sneaky but it worked.

[Cosmit]

Originally Posted by yukon

Yes, there are seo secrets.

I've mentioned this example before, I'll do it again.

I've been doing my own SEO for about 5 years now so I'm always on the lookout for something unique, seo wise.

A few months back I was looking at a house to buy, this part has nothing to do with IM or SEO, I was simply shopping around for a house.

I couldn't get the house location to show up on Google Maps, so I clicked the Google Text search which already had the house address in the Google Search text box.

When I landed on Google Search (text search) I noticed a video thumbnail image of the exact same house I was just then looking at on the real estate website.

I knew the real estate website I was just on didn't have a video, so I was thinking wtf, how are they getting a simple jpg image to show up inside Google Search as a video thumbnail image?

What I found out was, the real estate site was being sneaky in how they displayed that image inside of flash (xml file ).

You would never know that simple .jpg image was flash without looking at the source code.

So yes, seo secrets exist, at least until you find out about them.

BTW, that video thumbnail in Google Search is prime SERP real estate!

So the secret is to be sneaky and cloak a video in source but not display to visitors? SEO secrets? no thanks

[Cosmit]

Originally Posted by yukon

Wanna see a cool trick in how to hide content from Google?

You can control what text Google thinks is on the page (you won't find this in any WSO).

I learned this trick about 5 years ago when I first got hooked on seo.

At the time I had a free font website, you know, like the BIG daddy of all font sites dafont.

Anyways, I was looking at the Google Cache (text only version) snooping around to see what they were up to.

Long story short, dafont hides their entire Header Navigation behind javascript. Some guys might say, yea a lot of sites have javascript Nav. what's the big deal.

It is a big deal, because dafont has 98 internal links on their Index page that they are hiding from Google, the 98 links don't leak PR.

1) Regular dafont Index page here

2) Same dafont Index page here

Compare both the regular Index page & the Google Cache (text only page), Google reads text so the Full Cache (images, etc...) are all fluff.

Just a little trick to control the page links/text.

PS, don't go crazy with hiding text, still it works & I know for a fact dafont has been doing this for over 5 years.

Hidden links (Google Cache)

The links the traffic will see

You want not to leak PR? Add rel=nofollow.

Besides, I wouldn't encourage anyone to cloak links. What is the purpose?

[markowe]

I could tell you but I would have to kill you.

[Larbi Rahmani]

I think there is, but I wouldnt call them secrets,
I mean google has a set of guidelines and rules to rank higher, and they have algorithms to rank sites, so I think you can override these rules to rank higher.
so new tricks will always exist and search engine always fight them.

[JamesGw]

Google's algorithm is pretty complex, so I wouldn't be surprised if people have caught onto things that others haven't. That said, I doubt anyone selling WSOs has.

[Ibcontact]

SEO is ROI biggest, everybody have different thinking. So SEO basic is same for everyone. But every body work way is unique. That's like a secret .... I mean some time second person's work way is different than our work...

[Matt_Johnson]

I don't think there are any secrets. Just hard work.

[Rough Outline]

There are secrets out there, but mainly there are loopholes that people exploit and then they get closed ad infinitum.

[yukon]

Originally Posted by Cosmit

You want not to leak PR? Add rel=nofollow.

Besides, I wouldn't encourage anyone to cloak links. What is the purpose?

Like already said, I'm not trusting nofollow to cloak links, it's just not going to do anything. Google still reads the nofollow link.

Plenty of reasons to cloak a link, I already pointed out with the dafont Index page.

Instead of leaking PR to 98 internal links, dafont is only passing juice to a handful of links & most of that small amount of links is new font pages. By keeping the link count on the page very small those new font pages are getting a boost from the PR6 on the dafont Index page, more so than If they had those 98 links showing up (outside of the javascript).

A lot of folks use the bucket analogy when describing PR leak. If you had a bucket with 4 holes (links) your not going to leak very much PR from the page compared to the same bucket with 100 holes (links) which would leak a lot faster.

[thebitbotdotcom]

I think that there are some ways of doing things that are secret. For the most part, all of the tricks are out in the open, but their are a few weird ones that are still covert.

The biggest secret of all...how, exactly, to make everything look natural...