Ad Rank testing. What's the difference between position 3 and position 6?

[alxvallejo]

What's the difference in CTR between position 3 and position...6?

Is someone's willing to look at position 3, why not browse position 6? I guess that's my hypotheses but I'm not quite sure how to test it. Is the only way to lower the bid?

[SimpleSEOTips]

This post is ageing a bit but should give you a rough indication of the kind of CTR differences in AdWords ad positions:
Google AdWords Click Through Rates by Position | 37 AdWords Secrets blog

[trustedseller]

CTR is click through rate of your ads
effective text ads or attracting images are prone to higher CTR rate
so better chances of conversion
Keywords positioning depends on Quality score and the competitor niche

[alxvallejo]

Originally Posted by SimpleSEOTips

This post is ageing a bit but should give you a rough indication of the kind of CTR differences in AdWords ad positions:
Google AdWords Click Through Rates by Position | 37 AdWords Secrets blog

Notice how position 7 ranks slightly above position 5. Exactly my point.

[ichl13]

I thought your serp rank decides your traffic and CRT is other stuff like ad placement, content etc

[paulgl]

The OP is obviously talking adwords, not SERPs.

You can bid on position. That is, bid on 5 and below.

CTR is seldom(?) based on position. If people notice the ads,
they must be noticing what the ads say(?) Okay, over
simplifying the average surfer, but I always scan the ads.
But then, I scan the search results as well. That's why
google wants your ads to be spot on for searches that it
pops up for.

(?)denotes I'm guessing. Now it is true that high QS score ads will
be near or at the top, hence probably a better CTR. But just
being on top does not mean best CTR. It's the quality.

You want your ad showing on results that fit your ad, not necessarily
position.

If your ad is showing with other ads that just as great as yours, then
being at #5 is not good.

Paul

[ichl13]

Oh, my apologies, I skim read the OP and assumed

[alxvallejo]

Originally Posted by paulgl

CTR is seldom(?) based on position. If people notice the ads,
they must be noticing what the ads say(?)

Why would there be bidding wars if position didn't matter? If it's a competitive industry, companies will pay top dollar to be in top 3 Ad Rank.

Originally Posted by paulgl

But just being on top does not mean best CTR. It's the quality.

You want your ad showing on results that fit your ad, not necessarily
position.

If your ad is showing with other ads that just as great as yours, then
being at #5 is not good.

"Greatness" in an ad is hard to define. People have different tastes.
Also, the biggest determining factor of QS is CTR.
I'm also assuming that the relevancy is not an issue. I'm assuming all ads are relevant in this case.

My main point (whatever OP stands for) is that our motivation behind PPC management is to earn the highest ROI. Ad position is a combination of QS and Bid. Yet QS is not a direct reflection of the "quality" of an ad. Moreso, it's a reflection of historical CTR and the relevancy of keywords to the search query (ergo ad group structure). Yes, CTR may induce "quality" in the beginning of a campaign. But after you've established a high QS, you then have the freedom to lower your bid and hit the 7 spot, where you earn a higher ROI.

This is especially true if you are not selling a high quantity item (in which case, the top 2-3 positions would probably outperform position 7 in terms of ROI).

But if you are generating quality leads, there's no point in entering a bid war that could spread well into positions 5. In that case, you would see a drastic difference in ROI between positions 5 and 7.

Am I making any sense? I don't even know.

[paulgl]

You completely misunderstood my points, and you misunderstand
how adwords works.

Not everyone can bid high enough to be on top. In many niches,
the top spots are always going to the high QS ads. Those people
will actually bid less. This may or may not be for the words you
are bidding on.

The auction is open, but not in the real sense of the top ad
going to the top bidder all the time.

In those niches, the top ad will always be spot on and has
been shown to get the best CTR, among other things.

But if people read the ads, and some ads are better than
others, at least to the searcher, they will get the clicks.
Nothing to do with top ad.

Great ads are not really hard to define in the context of
a search. If your QS is 10, you have a great ad for the
words you are targeting.

If you want to test, bid on a lower position. The reason
why google has this option, is because some people
do not have high enough QS to qualify for #1-3, but they
actually pay more to be in #4 or below.

Google rewards the best advertisers with a lower cost.

On the flip side, many high paying global advertisers that
get special treatment will get top billing. That's why on
some searches, the next ads actually look better.

How do you think people increase their QS? They get a high
CTR. Not everybody can start on top. They have to start
somewhere. If they start in position 3 or lower, but strive
to write ads that get the clicks, their QS rises as does their
ads, their cost goes down, their ROI goes up! Amazing how
google has this all figured out. No wonder they lead the universe
in PPC.

Paul

[alxvallejo]

Originally Posted by paulgl

Great ads are not really hard to define in the context of
a search. If your QS is 10, you have a great ad for the
words you are targeting.

I disagree. I don't have one keyword above a 7/10 yet they have excellent CTRs and even more importantly, high conversion rates. I don't think I'll ever see a QS of higher than 7 in this particular account. This is a great ad if it converts and gives my client a profit and I don't know how to optimize it further (other than landing page optimization).

Originally Posted by paulgl

On the flip side, many high paying global advertisers that
get special treatment will get top billing. That's why on
some searches, the next ads actually look better.

I don't understand. If you're a global advertiser, your ads better be optimized. For me personally, I rank consistently in 1-2 range with a 7/10. No special treatment there. I think we need to take context into account. It would be interesting to cite some queries that this issue arises.

I think I do understand how AdWords works; QS is rewarded with lower prices, no questions asked.

I just know that it's not that difficult to get your ads optimized up to 7/10, get the 1-3 spot, and see your CTR increase. What's the missing component? A catchy teaser? Depends on the product I'd say. And depends on the audience. If the audience is looking for hot pancake items, then sure, a catchy teaser would beat the competition. But for other markets, lawyers for example, it's straight up bid wars.

QS is more than optimizing for a "great ad". It's also having the brand/product to back it up.

In fact, based on your argument that top position doesn't necessarily mean high CTR, why bid high at all? Why not aim for the middle?