Anyone else here have killer tendonitis in your mouse arm?

[Allen Graves]

I do...and it's getting worse every time I use the computer. It is starting to really become painful!

I am seeing a doctor on Monday. Just thought I'd see if any other "on the computer all day" people are experiencing this.

I don't play golf or tennis or do any other repetitive motion with that arm. (No sick jokes please!)

AL

[Kay King]

I have tendonitis in both wrists - caused by years of piano, typing, dealing cards and computing. It's much better since I added an ergonomic keyboard. The keyboard took a little getting used to but has made a big difference in the time I can spend working before pain interferes.

kay

[Thomas Wilkinson]

I went to an ergonomic keyboard and mouse pad. It has a
raised rest for my wrist. Its helped a bunch.

T.W.

[Don Schenk]

The first time that happen, I had to switch the mouse to my other hand...felt awkward for a few days.

Then I discovered ice. I keep an ice bag here at home and one at work. Ice grreatly lowers the pain and lets my arm heal.

Don

[Bev Clement]

I no longer use a mouse, use a trackball and that works well.

Allen, Rob had the problem, and the doctor gave him some tablets, what he does is take them for 5 days, and then everything clears up. He keeps some of the tablets at home, and it is flares up he takes them for the next 5 days.

That is what our doctor told him to do, yours might give you something else. But since he moved to a trackball it made a difference.

[Steven Wagenheim]

No, but my shoulder is really sore from playing my acoustic guitar so much.

Computer work, so far, hasn't harmed me.

When it does, I'm in BIG trouble.

[Paul Myers]

Great advice: Better keyboard, at a better level, and a gel mouse mat.

Also, stand up and move around at least once every half hour. Flex your wrists a bit. That also helps get the blood moving, which will wake you up some.


Paul

[pmore]

Not yet, but from what I hear from an IM buddy of mine it is not fun. Perhaps we should start a sticky detailing the importance of ergonomic mousepads and keyboards

[AgileHosting]

Yep, I've struggled with this for some 10+ years now.

In my case, it's caused by my wrists being less stable than most peoples' (the bones in my wrists are spaced farther apart than they should be - making the wrist joints too flexible) and hence the tendons are prone to inflammation. If I don't keep my wrists in a neutral/straight position when working -- if they are bent too much? -- then the tendons quickly flare up.

The fix is simple ... I get off the computer. I don't have a choice. If I try to hammer through the pain and keep using the hand & arm in that position, it's only going to get worse and it'll take that much longer to heal. So I wrap things up the best I can for a couple of days and treat that arm gently.

When it's stubborn, the tendonitis will last for 2-3 weeks. I'll wear a splint then, as much as I can stand it. (And still staying off the compu as much as possible) The key for me is immobilizing the joint and discouraging use of the hand (as that's what caused the inflammation to start with) so I use a splint like this one: Premier wrist brace by bird and cronin

As for painkillers, use whatever NSAID works best for you. I take Excedrin for migraines anyway, so that's my med of choice. However some people swear by ibuprofen or naproxen. Use whatever is most effective for you. Taking down the inflammation with an NSAID is part of the healing process actually. The sooner you can get the inflammation down, the faster the healing goes.

Good luck!! Hope it clears up soon for you.

Bailey

[Josh Anderson]

Hi Allen,

I have worked on creating the most ergonomically comfortable workstation by customizing a desk with some modifications:

1. I have found that the most comfortable and naturally positioned keyboard and mouse for me is the Microsoft wireless comfort keyboard 4000 and the Wireless Laser Mouse 5000.

2. Natural gaze is important for most comfortable screen position so if you are sitting up right and close your eyes and then open them where your gaze rests when first opened is a more natural location. That is at an approximate 30 degree angle below your eyes. So I cut a hole in my desk and built a small platform lower than the desktop and placed my screen there.

3. Wrist issues were getting real annoying with me. Mostly the elbow but irritation from my wrists wresting on the desk or on supposed wrist comfort pads that only added to the unatural positions and discomfort were really annoying me.

So what I did was completely removed my roll out drawer style keyboard platform and instead I purchased and adjustable arm from Office Depot that screws in under the desktop and can be pushed in our out, angled up or down, and swivel to the right or left.

I then took a nice wide piece of wood from the roll out keyboard platform from an old desk and attached it to the arm. The arm came with a platform but they are all crap.

So with all these modifications I can get the best comfort and ergonomic positioning that I need.

4. I also suffer from coccyx pain (tailbone) so I built a standing treadmill workstation so that I can move from a sitting workstation to a standing/walking work station as needed.

[Ernie Lonardo]

Yes I have it too, I got it recently and quit my day job over it and am now doing IM fulltime

I bought some magnetic straps, I believe they helped a lot, and do regular stretches and have breaks, it's almost better.

[cato]

I have found that an ice pack works best for me along with an Ibuprophen or two. It also helps me to stretch every once in awhile and of course, leave the computer.

[Chris Monty]

My arm and wrist are fine. It's my mouse finger that's killing me.

[Ken Leatherman]

Right now my mouse wrist has a dragging pain in it. The keyboard location is good for my wrist but with the keyboard I use I don't have enough room to have the mouse directly beside the keyboard. The mouse is up about 6 inches on the desk top and a long arm stretch to reach it.

Think I will take a look at the suggestion Josh Anderson made above about the adjustable arm platform, and the wireless keyboard and laser mouse.

Thanks Josh for the ideas. In fact thanks for the other suggestions made here.

My suggestions - take a break every 50 minutes, walk outside, shake wrist and arms, do neck exercise and body stretches. Believe it or not you can work them all in in the 10 minute walk. Forgot one other thing. Don't forget to rest your eyes and be sure and force yourself to blink frequently.

Ken Leatherman
The Old Geezer

[Rob Lee]

I have been dealing with the issue too. Yeah it is not easy to deal with. I just take breaks from the computer. That helps. I have learned that using a tablet with a pin can help. That is what some graphic designers use. The roller ball as mentioned before should help.

So far I have tried moving my mouse to my left hand. I got a mouse pad that is a little more supportive. But I agree I am not sure I like that eaither. The thing is you need better ergonomics. I think you guys are on the right track with what is posted in this thread. Using laptop computers can be prone for causeing these issues. I know they are horrible for posture and ergonomics. If you add and external ergo keyboard and a roller ball that should help. Then get a good desk and chair. Maybe get the adjustable keyboard platform that was talked about. I have not tried the magnetic thing yet or the wrist restrains.

My issue is putting too much pressure on my wrist from extended use on the computer. This is cause from using the mouse too much in a bad position.

[Click Cutter]

I found some issues with my mouse arm and especially shoulder too. As one of the solutions I try to avoid additional clicking the mouse if I do not have to. It seems like no effort is involved to make a click but at the end of the day after 100s of them it really feels.

[enoorth]

someone needs to invent a way to navigate a computer by thinking.

[Click Cutter]

that would be cool. But before it happens you need to find other more feasible ways.

[JMichaelZ]

I have found that the skin wears enough to be sore on one of those little bones on my hand right above my wrist from draggin my mouse around. I still have a bump on the finger I held the pen with at high school and college and I am starting to think that my wrist is developing a similar bump.

I get up often as well, and walk outside or play with my dog. That works pretty well.

When I was in the Navy in training after boot camp they made us all get up and go outside or walk around for five minutes every hour. Worked wonders for me then and I still think its a great idea now.

[Sirius Lin]

Aside from Chinese acupuncture to lessen my wrist stress, I also bought a Wacom tablet to use as my mouse. The human hand is better designed to grip a pen than a mouse, and it helped me a fair bit.

~ Sirius

[Shannon Tani]

I've been having problems for about the past month, but it's mostly due to the pregnancy and so much fluid gathering in my hands. I can hardly make a fist and in the mornings it takes awhile for my hands to "warm up".

I don't think that anyone has mentioned wrist braces. You can buy some heavy-duty ones that have metal in them which really prevents your wrists from moving. I think they are $25 for each wrist. I have a different type that's a bit cheaper that works for me. Mine are like a compression glove with a wide velcro band at the wrist that helps stabilize it. They were about $10 for the pair.

There's also, somewhat surprisingly, a "point and click" muscle in your back. At my old company, they used to bring in massage therapists for us and one of the therapists pointed it out. He pushed there and was like "check this out". Suddenly, excruciating pain! I mean in the good, massage it out way. I said "What the **** is that?" and he mentioned that a lot of the small movements you make with your hands actually come from a muscle in your back. It's kind of in the middle of the shoulder blade.

Anyway, I guess I'm just saying that either those braces or a massage might help you feel better until you can get in to the doc.

Love,
Shannon

[BIG Mike]

I've been using keyboards intensively for 28 years - and by intensive I mean 30 hours or more at a pop in the old days. Fortunately, I've never experienced any sort difficulties and don't really expect to <fingers crossed>.

[TheNightOwl]

I'm in the process of moving country and getting my home office re-set up, but when I do I'm going to pay a physiotherapist who specialises in this caper to come in a do [WARNING! Buzzword, wanky jargon to follow!] an ergonomic assessment of my workspace and then advise me (and go with me to Office Depot, if needs be) about the best configuration for my height, etc.

This idea may be a little excessive (LOL!) but I figure it's worth the few hundred bucks, frankly; Going to see a doctor AFTER tendonitis has set in will end up costing me more (not to mention the drugs).

Just a thought.

[TimGross]

A couple tips that I do:

1) I'm left-handed, and there's a left-handed mouse that helped significantly over a "plain" mouse, worth getting for lefties.

2) Make sure the click functions on your mouse are a light touch... Multiply the effort it takes to click by thousands and it adds up.

3) I installed AutoHotkey (free open-source) and assigned left and right mouse clicks to keys on the keyboard. Sometimes I switch off, using the mouse to move the cursor, but using my other hand to trigger clicks. It helps spread the wear and tear.

4) Everyone's different regarding the best keyboard to use... For me it's the Microsoft Wireless Keyboard 6000, but you can't go on other's reviews, you have to try them yourself.

5) There are foot pedals to control mouse clicks. I've never used them myself, but for those with a serious problem it may help a lot.

Trackballs didn't work well for me, although they work well for others.

[Loren Woirhaye]

I have had hand/wrist pain on and off. Of course typing has
something to do with it.

I use a Microsoft thumb-operated trackball mouse. It's great.

At one time I had my computer set up so I could work standing
which alleviated all sorts of problems associated with sitting
on my ass for hours. I recommend it.

I had my laptop on a sort of lectern and the keyboard was at
about a 45 degree angle. I could vary the angle too and this
helps to avoid wrist difficulties.

The mouse was a problem though - I finally settled on putting
a tin or something under the end closest to me. A foam wedge
would be better. It's better to have the wrist bent down a little
than bent up. From side-to-side I try to keep it straight.

[peteinoz]

Originally Posted by Allen Graves

I do...and it's getting worse every time I use the computer. It is starting to really become painful!

I am seeing a doctor on Monday. Just thought I'd see if any other "on the computer all day" people are experiencing this.

I don't play golf or tennis or do any other repetitive motion with that arm. (No sick jokes please!)

AL

Hey AL

mate I had this exactly. for 12 months , I thought it was my shoulder

what it was is this..

my chair was too low..

in case you didnt know, your tendons from your fingers go right up your arms... since my chair was too low, my muscles in my shoulder were tense, thus irritating the tendons when I moved my fingers operating the mouse..

Solution was to raise my chair, just 2 inches, so my wrist is resting on the desk, thus taking the pressure of the muscles in my arm..

in just one week my shoulder was completely fixed..

doc's couldnt figure it out. it was friend at squash who suggested it. and it worked like a charm

hth's

pete

[Chris Hunter]

Allen,

Check out what I found - Got Carpal Tunnel? Tendonitis? Are You Ready For A Vertical Mouse?

This may be the very thing that we need to help us with productivity.

I know that I'll be taking a look at it soon!

Thoughts?

[Greg Cooksley]

Hey Allen,

I have significant experience with these types of repetitive
strain injuries....and the solution to them!!!

I'm going to launch a new thread to ensure that all the posters
above can read it.....

Regards

Greg

[Greg Cooksley]

Hey Allen,

I have significant experience with these types of repetitive
strain injuries....and the solution to them!!!

I'm going to launch a new thread to ensure that all the posters
above can read it.....

Regards

Greg

[Takuya Hikichi]

Timely posts. I am getting those forearm friendly equipment this week. I was just thinking that I should.

[Daniel E Taylor]

I work out at the gym 3 times a week, and I keep forming tendinitous of
the forearm, which is very painful when doing curl sets and lifting things.

[yube]

Hi Allen

I had a lot of hand and wrist problems in the past. What I did to fix it is:

1. Take breaks. There are a bunch of micro break programs. I set my reminder at 25 minutes, and take a quick hand/wrist stretch.

2. Get good equipment. This means having an ergonomic keyboard, mouse wrist pad, chair with strong back support. Also, check to make sure your computer setup isn't hurting you. When you stare forward, back straight, you should see the top of your screen. Your forearms and wrists should be close to horizontal to the ground, with wrists slightly towards each other.

3. Don't use the mouse. Using the keyboard is much faster than using a mouse. Spend some time learning keyboard shortcuts. If you're using Windows, there's this macro program called AutoHotKey that can help you make custom shortcut keys for repetitive tasks.

I read a bunch of RSI prevention articles, and those three things helped me the most.

Good luck!

[kevinw1]

I've been fighting this since 1996 - it's what caused me to close down my custom software development business. Started with one shoulder - I switched mouse to the other side - got it in that shoulder too - then wrists and one elbow. What has helped to keep it under control for me:

• Trackball or other pointing device that doesn't require me to reach. I have mine sitting on a platform over the numeric keypad since I never use that.
  
• ergonomic setup that fits me, height wise, and a good chair
  
• RSIGuard software that MAKES me take breaks and limits my daily time on the computer
  
• Vitamin B6 for the nerve damage that goes along with RSI
  
• At one point when I had official CTS in both wrists, (numbness, tingling in fingers etc) wearing braces at night in bed
  
• Massage therapy

Any of you who have the beginning stages of this, or who just get a bit of pain occasionally, I beg you, TAKE IT SERIOUSLY. Do what it takes to heal it or at the very least stop it getting worse. Otherwise you can and will end up semi-disabled from it, enough to seriously mess with your earning power but not enough to get disability benefits.

[Click Cutter]

To me it appears that constant keyboard operations put more constrains on both hands and shoulders.

[Greg Cooksley]

Hey Warriors,

I provide a solution in this thread...

RESPONSE TO Allen's thread - Anyone else here have killer tendonitis in your mouse arm?

Hope it will help you...

Regards

Greg

[buckapple]

Great suggestions here, I posted on this awhile back. I'll tell you what I've found for me. I use the computer a lot and also I'm a licensed massage therapist and have studied this to help clients.

If you can find a physical therapist that knows their stuff in this area visit one and do the exercises. If you are experiencing chronic pain you have to ease up. What works for me after a lot of computing is the logitech trac roller with the ball in the middle. It's not that hard to go to the other hand and reprogram the buttons. A little awkward at first but not bad.

The point here is you have to give the muscles a break, especially if it is chronic...figure it out with all the suggestions given so far...tablet, different mouse, track ball, hand and arm position,etc.

I've worked with one person that had a program (I forget the name) had all the commands by voice, everything, his computer responded to voice. This person couldn't use his hands at all (injury) so this program did it all, so it's out there.

Learn acupressure. It's hard to explain this in type but you can relieve alot of pain by applying accupressure to the right points. There is one spot just down from the elbow that if pressure is applied while curling the hand under can do wonders, then you let up on the pressure as your hand goes back to normal.

I can't explain how to do it in type but what I'm trying to point out that even a place this far from the wrist can alleviate pain in the wrist. There's a lot of sites on the net about acupressure.

If I had chronic pain I would also look into a castor oil pack. Turn of the 20th century remedy that works wonders. Edgar Cayce talked about them a lot in readings. I've seen them do wonders for muscle conditions and experienced it first hand.


Hope this helps,
Gary

[sylviad]

Can you get tendonitis in your thumb? Since I've been spending so much time using the mouse, I've developed quite a pain on the left side of the first knuckle of my right thumb. It's definitely related to using the mouse all the time.

A few years back I bought the gel mousepad with the wrist support because I was getting slight wrist and arm pain. It's great. The key to prevent wrist issues (and lower arm) is to try to keep your arm supported and lined up with the mouse so that you aren't holding your wrist bent all the time. The arm of my chair is just slightly higher than the mouse, so my wrist stays straight. Haven't had wrist pains since the pad and lining up and supporting my arm/hand.

Sylvia

[jbshort]

Ah...an occupational hazard, it appears.


Here's what I do to try to avoid the problem:

1. Use a wireless mouse and switch hands every other day.
2. Set my alarm to ring every hour I'm on the computer, forcing me to get up and stop working for at least 10 minutes.
3. Watch my posture while I'm working and shift as necessary.

So far, I think number 2 made the most difference. (It helps clear my head too!)

[Jim M]

I know how you feel - I've been working on computers for longer than I care to remember - and recently bought a new tablet device made by Trust - its a TB 7300 widescreen design tablet (in the UK) - unlike older models its very high resolution - large work area - and no block like pixels - its just like using a pen to do everything so your hand isn't curved around a mouse - even the handwriting recognition is excellent - it correctly converted my normal signature to text - and that really surprised me.

It cost around £60 here in Northern Ireland - I'm sure you should be able to pick it up discounted wherever you live - great piece of kit - highly recommended.

[Andy]

See Al? And you were worried about bad jokes!

I don't remember seeing anyone suggesting a chiropractor. My wife was facing carpal tunnel surgery when I happened to mention it to one. I don't think it was actually carpal tunnel but I haven't meant too many doctors this would bother.

The massage, acupressure, acupuncture, and even myotherapy (similar to acupressure techniques) may offer similar results.

Tim: I am shocked! A left-handed mouse? Do you also switch hands to cut your meat like most US rightys? One day not THAT long ago my wife realized I mouse right-handed. I never gave it a thought.

And now for something no one wants to know. I used a swimming pool doughnut for a couple of years to ease the pain in my own tailbone. Even took it on long trips.

Looks like you've got enough here for an ariticle Al, if not an ebook. Anyone know of any chiropracter's with affilate programs?

God bless,

Andy

[Allen Graves]

Holy Cow!

I had no idea the problem was this widespread. I knew Carpal Tunnel was...but not "tennis elbow." For me it is just below my elbow on the top of my arm.

It gets me when I do things like lifting a coffee pot or holding anything that weighs more than a pound with an outstretched arm or when I shake someone's hand. I can't squeeze (and I hate that) Very sharp pain.

Then at the end of the day there's a constant burning sensation...and that is what is getting on my nerves the most.

We should coin a new term for this. Let's see, there's "tennis elbow," "golf elbow"... how about "Mouse Elbow?"

Going to check out that other thread...

Thanks everyone.

[W.P. Allen]

My mouse "click finger" aches and becomes stiff every so often. Not sure what that means.

[Norma Holt]

Yes, I get pains in my arm and shoulder but learned to take breaks more often. I also have an armchair instead of the ergonomic chair which seemed to cause me more pain. Now I can use the mouse on the arm of the chair and with the keyboard on my lap and my feet up, etc., the pains are relatively much less.