STRAP IN- the Next Panda update is here and targets webspam and spinning.

by Mike Anthony 223 replies
Thought some of you guys who don;t follow SEO news closely might want to know-

Google just posted its about to do another Panda update and that its aimed at webspam and spun content with links within unrelated text (looks a whole lot like what some SEO networks that got hit used to do)

Official Google Webmaster Central Blog: Another step to reward high-quality sites

Update this has already been pushed out

Google Launches Update Targeting Webspam In Search Results
#search engine optimization #days #panda #spinning #strap #targets #update #webspam
  • Profile picture of the author James-
    Thanks for highlighting this change Mike. I have just come back from the pub to notice a fairly significant amount of my sites have been dropped waaaay down in the SERPS and i had not done anything to them.

    I guess i am now paying the price for submitting spun articles with anchor text back to my sites.

    Oh well, onwards and upwards!
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  • Profile picture of the author jsherloc
    Hopefully this algo update also works on the 10+ methods/combos of "negative seo etc" we've seen currently being discussed on this forum and other major IM forums as well.

    Wonder if they'll slip some other changes in with this one that they won't release publicly hmm
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
    Pretty much

    "While we can't divulge specific signals because we don't want to give people a way to game our search results and worsen the experience for users, our advice for webmasters is to focus on creating high quality sites that create a good user experience and employ white hat SEO methods instead of engaging in aggressive webspam tactics."

    Sounds like some new secret ingredients are being put into the sauce
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    • Profile picture of the author WareTime
      Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

      Pretty much

      "While we can't divulge specific signals because we don't want to give people a way to game our search results and worsen the experience for users, our advice for webmasters is to focus on creating high quality sites that create a good user experience and employ white hat SEO methods instead of engaging in aggressive webspam tactics."

      Sounds like some new secret ingredients are being put into the sauce
      That's the same thing they say every time. Of course they can't go into details.

      Did you see the episode of Gilligan's Island where the castaways were almost rescued, but Gilligan screwed it up?
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by WareTime View Post

        That's the same thing they say every time. Of course they can't go into details.
        IF you don't think changes have been made to the algo you haven't been paying attention for the last year and a half.

        All of my sites with solid PR links are still ranking… well except 2 but they were 1 page garbage sites and thats out of 44. So 36 out of 44 sites still rank. 38 of those 44 have a very solid backing of PR sites. Im not trying to sell anything its just what it is.
        DP its really too early to say what is and what isn't the case. I haven't seen much of a disaster either but seeing as how the algo was just pushed out today and frankly still in terms of hours it will be days before anyone can start doing a victory lap and saying conclusively what protects or helps with the new algo. We have to see where things settle not where they are now.
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  • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
    Yep...I just linked to this over in the thread below. Fingers crossed that they get it right and kill off lots of my crap competition.

    http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...nge-today.html
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  • Profile picture of the author TheAdsenseGuy
    Lost all 1st page rankings on my 10 authority adsense sites today. These did have quality content on them. Had 1000 word articles written by a high end writer, had video and other media on all pages. They were 20-50 pages in length. I did use spun content for backlinks so that's probably what did them in. F__K SEO. Im done.
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  • Profile picture of the author bummed.out
    Forget waiting a few days. The rest of my sites that survived the previous Panda attacks have dropped to where search engine traffic probably won't find them. This has nothing to do with quality of content (I can write well, and did).

    Rather, I guess, it has to do with using a system for ranking that worked really well for a while and now does more harm than good. Sh*tballs. Still, Matt Cutts can go...ahh, forget it. I'm sure enough of you hit by this can finish that sentence for me.

    Well, time to do things differently.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
    Yes - although the report said days, Cutts just confirmed by twitter that the algo has now been pushed out.
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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    3%? haha, this one is gonna be bigger than Panda.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      3%? haha, this one is gonna be bigger than Panda.
      code number for 95% marketers and SEOs
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  • Profile picture of the author Jordan Kovats
    Wow...I was always warned about spinning and quality content vs quantity content. Slow and steady and doing it right keeps on winning.
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  • Profile picture of the author jsherloc
    Reading Google's posted examples of what they are looking for though, it seems to me that it would possibly BE EASIER to negatively affect websites by linking to them on spun garbage properties in that manner?

    The examples they give, someone could just spin unrelated articles into gibberish and then target their competitors website using optimized anchor text that the "target" site is clearly targeting, posting on tons of properties the same way en masse? Hope it doesn't actually make things worse and easier to go through negative seo processes, because it almost seems like it could based on those two examples and reading further into things lol...

    It's like Google says "Oh yeah guys, in the midst of a bunch of other ways people are actively abusing visible loopholes in our link-reliant algo, and doing this now in record numbers, here's two other specific examples that we are currently on a rampage looking for sites with these types of backlink patterns..."

    I'm pretty pessimistic about the whole thing though, so maybe I will be pleasantly surprised with the outcome of all this who knows...
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  • Profile picture of the author footfoot
    Why is google so public about everything? I think they're spinning their wheels and getting desperate. Engaging in fear tactics more than actual substance.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mike Hlatky
    WTF?

    Google makes no sense to me. Several of my authority sites just dropped out of the rankings.

    Apparently original and constant content is not the right answer.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by Mike Hlatky View Post

      Apparently original and constant content is not the right answer.
      Content can be original and constant and still be no good.
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    • Profile picture of the author Cash37
      Originally Posted by Mike Hlatky View Post

      WTF?

      Google makes no sense to me. Several of my authority sites just dropped out of the rankings.

      Apparently original and constant content is not the right answer.
      Apparently they werent authority in G's eyes!

      I rely on referral traffic now primarily for my big sites. Anything from Google is just a drop in the bucket.
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  • Profile picture of the author babyfacedassassin
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    • Profile picture of the author Supafly
      QUOTE=babyfacedassassin

      "I just want to thank Google today for the best update yet. My thin affiliate sites are now on page one with only xrumer backlinks.

      I knew my Black Hat SEO would pay off one day and it has finally happened. I don't need good content to rank, heck I don't need any content to rank well today in Google.

      All you need is kindergarten knowledge of SEO. Pay someone a few bucks to blast 10,000 links or heck you might not even need those links. All you need to rank in this new crazy age is a domain name pointing to a blank page.

      Thank you Google for doing such a great job of creating an awesome user experience!"

      LMFAO
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      • Profile picture of the author Theeban
        Originally Posted by Supafly View Post

        QUOTE=babyfacedassassin

        "I just want to thank Google today for the best update yet. My thin affiliate sites are now on page one with only xrumer backlinks.

        I knew my Black Hat SEO would pay off one day and it has finally happened. I don't need good content to rank, heck I don't need any content to rank well today in Google.

        All you need is kindergarten knowledge of SEO. Pay someone a few bucks to blast 10,000 links or heck you might not even need those links. All you need to rank in this new crazy age is a domain name pointing to a blank page.

        Thank you Google for doing such a great job of creating an awesome user experience!"

        LMFAO
        I guess, Google put sites applied 'white-hat' SEO into dustbin and pushed up the sites applied "black-hat" seo, even they emphasize white-hat SEO...:confused: I guess... r they recommending black-hat SEO with this recent changes?? aww..no, they shouldn't.... let's wait for few days & c
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    • Profile picture of the author ronmojohny
      Originally Posted by babyfacedassassin View Post

      I just want to thank Google today for the best update yet. My thin affiliate sites are now on page one with only xrumer backlinks.

      I knew my Black Hat SEO would pay off one day and it has finally happened. I don't need good content to rank, heck I don't need any content to rank well today in Google.

      All you need is kindergarten knowledge of SEO. Pay someone a few bucks to blast 10,000 links or heck you might not even need those links. All you need to rank in this new crazy age is a domain name pointing to a blank page.

      Thank you Google for doing such a great job of creating an awesome user experience!
      unfortunately, sites with those type of backlinks are being targeted next. (according to Dan Thies, who has been right on all of this all along)
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      • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
        Originally Posted by ronmojohny View Post

        unfortunately, sites with those type of backlinks are being targeted next. (according to Dan Thies, who has been right on all of this all along)
        The update is still being rolled out. No point in discussing current SERPs when we have no real data at all. It's all just guru BS and wild guesses at this point.
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  • Profile picture of the author attorneydavid
    Panda hit longer tail search results that article directories and stuff were soaking up. This is hitting highly SEO'd results, ie those with commercia intent. This is going to be extremely negative for search for these terms since what's ranking now is going to be on average quite dated.

    I'm guessing this 3% will be as a practical matter the biggest change in search results ever.
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  • Profile picture of the author JSProjects
    3% is a LOT of sites. It may not sound like much initially. But it's HUGE.

    Should be a "fun" next couple of days.
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    • Profile picture of the author Thinking_man_too
      About 80% of my sites were hit hard.

      I do not use article submissions or own a text spinner. All my content was hand written.

      I research my niches and take a lot of time on each article no outsourcing ever.

      I will be curious to read the tea leaves once I see what others say here.
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      • Profile picture of the author esmein
        From what I see many sites with 100% unique content and no junk backlinks pointing to it have been hit hard.

        Just search for anything with the word "insurance" in it, and you'll see how out of whack the SERP is right now.

        I see 2-3 years old forum threads come up for queries within my topic. Surely someone in 2009 could answer questions about the Thunderbolt port...
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  • Profile picture of the author jonathanleger
    ROFL! Search G for "new shoes" -- look who's #1:

    Interpretive Simulations - NewShoes - (Intro to Marketing, Marketing Principles)

    They have GOT to be kidding. Somebody needs to hit CTRL-Z over at the 'plex.
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  • Profile picture of the author Chambers
    Hello Ladies & Gentlemen,

    My sites took a massive nosedive today. All I can do is smile and laugh, this has happened before, and I will be back.

    As long as there is a system, it will be gamed.
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    • Profile picture of the author TheAdsenseGuy
      Originally Posted by Chambers View Post

      Hello Ladies & Gentlemen,

      My sites took a massive nosedive today. All I can do is smile and laugh, this has happened before, and I will be back.

      As long as there is a system, it will be gamed.


      Sure, in time we will be able to game the system again - for a while. But if we're all spending 8 hours a day everyday just trying to keep up with Google's B.S. - then seriously, is it worth it?

      I don't know about you but I'm going into new online business models. Just don't think SEO is a viable long term business model anymore for your own website.

      Instead of trying to rank websites on Google let's try using 3rd party websites and rank those in Google.

      1. Want to rank for a "how to" keyword? Lets upload a kindle ebook onto
      Amazon and rank the Amazon page in Google - it's easy, takes less that a week usually.
      2. Wanna sell affiliate products? Make Youtube videos and rank those in Google - with backlinks it only takes a couple days to a week.
      3. Wanna start an Ecommerce business. Forget about building a website. Hook up with a dropshipper and then sell your products on Amazon.com using FBA (fulfillment by Amazon). And then build backlinks to your Amazon product page and get traffic from Google.
      4. Listbuilding

      And you know what? Google will never penalize Amazon.com or Youtube. Not going to happen.

      Google doesn't need us "little guys" anymore. They only want huge branded authority sites ranking in their search results. After all, it's a kickback for the millions these sites spend in Adwords.

      Lost all of my sites today too.
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  • Profile picture of the author mrultra
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    • Profile picture of the author Chambers
      Originally Posted by mrultra View Post

      Not sure, but it looks at first glance like exact match domains have taken a hit too.
      the majority of my sites that tanked were EMD
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    • Profile picture of the author mrtrance
      Originally Posted by mrultra View Post

      Not sure, but it looks at first glance like exact match domains have taken a hit too.
      Pretty much all my sites that got hit were EMDs. I've noticed other EMDs that were on page 1 tiok a dive as well.

      Anyone else seeing similar things?
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by mrtrance View Post

        Pretty much all my sites that got hit were EMDs. I've noticed other EMDs that were on page 1 tiok a dive as well.

        Anyone else seeing similar things?
        Yep had one EMD client that tanked hard for his home page but his inner pages moved up. You know I will be studying the differences and I already have some ideas why. However we have to wait awhile before we make any hard and fast conclusions. Things always change around as a new algo does its recrawl.
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      • Profile picture of the author Thinking_man_too
        I did a google search on "is popcorn healthy"(a term that I used to hold the #2 position for. )

        Every article on the first page of google was written in the last month. ZERO older then that.

        Weird.


        1
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    • Profile picture of the author Tania Shipman
      Originally Posted by mrultra View Post

      Not sure, but it looks at first glance like exact match domains have taken a hit too.
      My exact domain match went from top 10 to not even in top 100. It's recipes and information about my countertop convection oven with all original posts and pictures.

      Not even in top 100 anymore.

      Tania
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  • Profile picture of the author jonathanleger
    When searching for "bicycle wheels", you would expect 100% ecommerce sites that sell the wheels, right?

    Search G for "bicycle wheels" and you'll see:

    #1 - ecommerce site
    #2 - wikipedia entry for "bicycle wheel"
    #3 - ecommerce site
    #4 - ecommerce site
    #5 - A book at Amazon ("The Bicycle Wheel")
    #6 - ecommerce site
    #7 - ecommerce site for bicycle parts in general (the ranking page has nothing to do wih the wheels though)
    #8 - ecommerce page selling bicycle wheel stands -- not bicycle wheels
    #9 - ecommerce site
    #10 - page out of 1995 (literally) that has articles about bicycle wheels

    Very poor results indeed.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by jonathanleger View Post

      #1 - ecommerce site
      #2 - wikipedia entry for "bicycle wheel"
      #3 - ecommerce site
      #4 - ecommerce site
      #5 - A book at Amazon ("The Bicycle Wheel")
      #6 - ecommerce site
      #7 - ecommerce site for bicycle parts in general (the ranking page has nothing to do wih the wheels though)
      #8 - ecommerce page selling bicycle wheel stands -- not bicycle wheels
      #9 - ecommerce site
      #10 - page out of 1995 (literally) that has articles about bicycle wheels

      Very poor results indeed.
      I get shopping results above Wikipedia at 3
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    • Profile picture of the author mrultra
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      • Profile picture of the author lovboa
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        Originally Posted by mrultra View Post

        Do a search for viagra. Two hacked sites and two sites with nothing about viagra on page one.
        Lol

        Northern Kentucky University on the first page.
        Spammers are powerful! Sheesh!
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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    Check out Flippa. Lots of auctions are like deer caught in the headlights.
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    • Profile picture of the author warrioraw
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      Check out Flippa. Lots of auctions are like deer caught in the headlights.
      Hehe, nice find.

      I've noticed one of our sites seems to be effected by this change. Not the whole site, just one keyword that I can see so far.

      As others have stated best wait a few days for all the changes to go through and see how you come out after that rather than panicking now.
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  • Profile picture of the author Chambers
    Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

    I would like to applaud Google for further making high PR links more valuable. All those who have access to them should have benefited today. This is an awful algo update. They should just call this the "penalty update" unless you have enough authority PR links. Which hopefully all of us stocked up on after the BMR/ALN hit which was obviously done to allow this "penalty update" to work. Same as Panda. High PR links buy you out of the penalties. Ladies and Gentlemen welcome to the age of negative SEO and private high PR blog networks.
    LOL says the guy pushing high PR blog networks...
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    • Profile picture of the author retsek
      Originally Posted by Chambers View Post

      LOL says the guy pushing high PR blog networks...
      He's right. From what I'm seeing sites with strong PR links and an active social presence escaped this update, even if they are guilty of keyword stuffing, a few low quality-spammy links, and thin content.

      Sites that lack those two qualities were hit with the sledge.

      Either way, I like this update and I hope they don't roll it back!
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by retsek View Post

        He's right.
        As everyone knows I am into people building their own networks and acquiring links from High Pr sites but to say that all this algo targets is lack of high Pr links is inaccurate.
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      • Profile picture of the author Chambers
        Originally Posted by retsek View Post

        He's right. From what I'm seeing sites with strong PR links and an active social presence escaped this update, even if they are guilty of keyword stuffing, a few low quality-spammy links, and thin content.

        Sites that lack those two qualities were hit with the sledge.

        Either way, I like this update and I hope they don't roll it back!
        No he's not the majority of my sites that were slammed were linked with high PR linked and they were all original content.

        Not buying what he's selling...
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    • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
      Originally Posted by Chambers View Post

      LOL says the guy pushing high PR blog networks...
      Says the guy with 36 of 44 sites still ranking.
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      • Profile picture of the author Chambers
        Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

        Says the guy with 36 of 44 sites still ranking.
        That's it...your response?
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        • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
          Originally Posted by Chambers View Post

          That's it...your response?
          You want a better response? Ok here it goes. Google since Panda has hugely disproportionately weighted high PR links. Its the only way to bypass all their algo updates. They call these algorithm updates but they are just mass penalties. The filters can be beat by having enough "authority links" or "high PR links". Why do you think they decide to kill high PR networks right before this update. And why do you think they don't care about negative SEO. Because sites that "deserve" to rank will have those links, hence will not be hugely affected by their penalty filters.

          Think for a second, guy who feels that I am just trying to push a product. They did it because its the loophole. All of my sites with solid PR links are still ranking… well except 2 but they were 1 page garbage sites and thats out of 44. So 36 out of 44 sites still rank. 38 of those 44 have a very solid backing of PR sites. Im not trying to sell anything its just what it is. Its not the end all be all. This update definitely hit onpage content too but if you didn't see what was going down in the last 2 months then I won't be able to open your eyes now. Just trying to help.
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          • Profile picture of the author Chambers
            Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

            You want a better response? Ok here it goes. Google since Panda has hugely disproportionately weighted high PR links. Its the only way to bypass all their algo updates. They call these algorithm updates but they are just mass penalties. The filters can be beat by having enough "authority links" or "high PR links". Why do you think they decide to kill high PR networks right before this update. And why do you think they don't care about negative SEO. Because sites that "deserve" to rank will have those links, hence will not be hugely affected by their penalty filters.

            Think for a second, guy who feels that I am just trying to push a product. They did it because its the loophole. All of my sites with solid PR links are still ranking… well except 2 but they were 1 page garbage sites and thats out of 44. So 36 out of 44 sites still rank. 38 of those 44 have a very solid backing of PR sites. Im not trying to sell anything its just what it is. Its not the end all be all. This update definitely hit onpage content too but if you didn't see what was going down in the last 2 months then I won't be able to open your eyes now. Just trying to help.
            Even if I agree with you or not, thanks for typing out a response and explaining your reasoning.
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          • Profile picture of the author mrtrance
            Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

            You want a better response? Ok here it goes. Google since Panda has hugely disproportionately weighted high PR links. Its the only way to bypass all their algo updates. They call these algorithm updates but they are just mass penalties. The filters can be beat by having enough "authority links" or "high PR links". Why do you think they decide to kill high PR networks right before this update. And why do you think they don't care about negative SEO. Because sites that "deserve" to rank will have those links, hence will not be hugely affected by their penalty filters.

            Think for a second, guy who feels that I am just trying to push a product. They did it because its the loophole. All of my sites with solid PR links are still ranking… well except 2 but they were 1 page garbage sites and thats out of 44. So 36 out of 44 sites still rank. 38 of those 44 have a very solid backing of PR sites. Im not trying to sell anything its just what it is. Its not the end all be all. This update definitely hit onpage content too but if you didn't see what was going down in the last 2 months then I won't be able to open your eyes now. Just trying to help.
            So what do you consider high PR links now that private blog networks took a hit? Do these have to contextual high PR links or can they be from high PR page comment as well?
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by mrtrance View Post

              So what do you consider high PR links now that private blog networks took a hit? Do these have to contextual high PR links or can they be from high PR page comment as well?
              contextual. everything is heading toward what Google calls it - editorial links. Private networks didn't take a hit. Public rental ones did. I didn't and haven't lost a single domain. I've polled people (over a hundred I deal with ) who are building networks and none of them have reported experiencing mass deindexing.
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  • Profile picture of the author JoshN
    I dont have many sites but the few I have took a dive, and then came back higher than before. Least thats how it looks. I use unique article rewrites in my backlinks but they are spun.... so oh well. I am just glad I dont have big money sites up yet.


    The SEO game is risky... I am gradually taking more time away from SEO and backlinking and placing it all on the front end with keyword research. Now I seriously do keyword research 70-80% of the time and only pick stuff where my page basically goes to the top of google by default.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    No big loss.

    Sometimes you have to take out the trash.
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    • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      No big loss.

      Sometimes you have to take out the trash.
      Ya well google needs to send a few more trucks around the cul de sac bro - cuz all they did was fill up the first page with cr@ppier crap ...

      As usual ...
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      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

        Ya well google needs to send a few more trucks around the cul de sac bro - cuz all they did was fill up the first page with cr@ppier crap ...

        As usual ...
        Not on any of the keywords that I target.

        It doesn't matter what changes Google makes, people will always focus on anything they can find that is negative, never fails.

        If Google left the SERPs alone & never changed the algo. we would be looking at spam for every possible keyword, which has never happened because Google never stops tweaking their algo.
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        • Profile picture of the author mosthost
          Originally Posted by yukon View Post

          Not on any of the keywords that I target.

          It doesn't matter what changes Google makes, people will always focus on anything they can find that is negative, never fails.

          If Google left the SERPs alone & never changed the algo. we would be looking at spam for every possible keyword, which has never happened because Google never stops tweaking their algo.
          Confirmation bias is unavoidable. If you feel bad about losing rankings you aren't going to feel good about Google's changes!
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

        Ya well google needs to send a few more trucks around the cul de sac bro - cuz all they did was fill up the first page with cr@ppier crap ...
        Too early to tell where things will settle out....But you sound a bit sore steve. maybe its time to do part 2 of this famous thread


        http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...ing-power.html

        every 6 months its been more and true and we are pretty close to putting a fork in them now.
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  • Profile picture of the author josephseeley
    I had 2 (out of 100) sites that took a dive. Both were (very short, brandable) EMDs. They were also the two highest quality sites I have.

    One of them lost impressions. The weirdest thing is that one of them gained 300% impressions since Thursday ... but it was for every non-relevent page on the site. Privacy policy, about, contact us, (other topic) categories, (other topic) tags, and site-map pages which no one is going to want to click through to because they clearly aren't relevant and shouldn't be showing up in the SERPs at all. (Usually I no-index most of these pages, but must have missed it on this site.)

    Most of my lower quality sites have increased in rankings/traffic slightly.

    It's like Google looked at all my sites and decided to pick the least relevant and/or lowest quality pages to spam the SERPs with.

    Google is trying to downplay the "over-optimization update" now, but it seems to be helping sites/pages that don't use keywords much in their backlink profiles and/or onsite. The only problem with that is of course that sometimes keywords are useful to use to address a specific topic ...
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  • Profile picture of the author lovboa
    Banned
    This is like a quarantine, the ones you see in the movies.

    Google's not just mass exterminating the 'zombies', but even the clean ones with a little bit of red in their eyes from not getting enough sleep.
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  • Profile picture of the author mrtrance
    I'm just trying to pinpoint what is across all my sites that triggers all to drop in the SERPs at once. I'm assume that there has to be a common thing among them in order for all of them to drop off all at once. The only thing I can see so far is all my sites were EMD and that is the most common thing among them. Sites that I had not worked on for a while or did not build backlinks too got hit just like ones that I had been building backlinks.

    So if that is the case then it might not be an issue with backlinks, but maybe onsite structure since all of these are EMDs, used the ClickBump theme, and had about 1% kw density for each page that was using it's keyword.
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  • Profile picture of the author gearmonkey
    I don't think you have anything to worry about as long as you post high quality and unique content. Blog networks that use only the highest quality hand written content are flourishing right now.

    And round and round we go.
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  • Profile picture of the author rosesmark
    But Google doesn't tell the working style.I mean which is effective for improving keyword ranking. Google already said that we judge the off page optimization not you so, how we judge our off page strategies is working good
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  • Profile picture of the author jonathanleger
    Do a search for viagra. Two hacked sites and two sites with nothing about viagra on page one.
    Yeah, I read about that on a thread at TrafficPlanet.com. That's just pathetic. It's like AltaVista just before it died.

    Hopefully the next few days will sort out some of the most egregious mistakes.
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    • Profile picture of the author pukimama
      How are they gonna target spin text too ?
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      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Originally Posted by pukimama View Post

        How are they gonna target spin text too ?
        It's impossible to target spun text.

        The example that Google gave was unrelated spun text. In other words, the lack of relevancy between the hyperlink & the on-page text is a red flag.

        This is all the more reason to stay laser focused on content/links like I've been saying for a long time (Silos).


        Example:
        In 1896, Benz designed and patented the first internal-combustion flat engine, called boxermotor pork chop recipe. During the last years of the nineteenth century, Benz was the largest automobile company in the world with 572 units produced in 1899 and applesauce, because of its size, Benz & Cie., became a joint-stock company.
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        • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
          Originally Posted by yukon View Post

          It's impossible to target spun text.

          The example that Google gave was unrelated spun text. In other words, the lack of relevancy between the hyperlink & the on-page text is a red flag.

          This is all the more reason to stay laser focused on content/links like I've been saying for a long time (Silos).


          Example:

          Except that - as of 24 hrs ago - the site in the pay day niche for cutts example was still on page one - LOL
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  • Profile picture of the author nik0
    Banned
    Damn Google got me good this time while I kind of survived the other updates (only 1 little drop before but that had purely to do with the deindexing of blog networks) my >50k exact keywords went from top3 to top 50 this night. Although this costs me around 200 euro/month I've already heard much worse stories of mid-sized companies being hurt by this.

    As I check the rankings for my site more then anything I have a pretty good picture of the first page printed in my head and it looks a lot different, only #1 and #2 remained stable and they have only very few links (although nr1 is a massive PR6 authority site) and nr2 is there since the beginning of the internet it seems with a few dozen legit links.
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  • Profile picture of the author FamousOnYoutube
    Got lost of words when I saw 3 of my 10 websites losing rankings. From page 1 to page 11. I don't what to say but work hard again to take these sites back to their previous position. Sigh.
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  • Profile picture of the author mrmatt
    Some jacked up results that is for sure. Irrelevant. Lots of local businesses not showing up for local searches and irrelevant sites in their place. Sad.

    Just checked all my clients sites. All doing well and are still in top positions. Seeing some weird stuff show up that I have never seen before. Angies List being one of those.

    Yellow page and directory results are back in full force.
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    • Profile picture of the author troybh
      My all original content 150 page authority site just took a nosedive. Did some BMR for 5 months but stopped this 1 year ago. ?????? Survived all the previous pandas so not too happy now.
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  • Profile picture of the author AllproJJ
    This is gonna be an interesting ride for everyone to say the least. I guess we just sit back, see where we land in the coming days and go from there.
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  • Profile picture of the author jonathanleger
    Another lousy example:

    Keywords: "cheap purses"

    Check these page one results:

    High Quality Replica Bags - USA UK Canada Australia Europe UAE

    Book Now

    Shuffletown | Joe Henry

    Two of the three show titles that don't match the actual page titles (the last two), and the two pages have NOTHING to do with the query.
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    • Profile picture of the author awarum
      Originally Posted by jonathanleger View Post

      Another lousy example:

      Keywords: "cheap purses"

      Check these page one results:

      High Quality Replica Bags - USA UK Canada Australia Europe UAE

      Book Now

      Shuffletown | Joe Henry

      Two of the three show titles that don't match the actual page titles (the last two), and the two pages have NOTHING to do with the query.
      My only guess is Google is giving crappy content sites high ranking and hopefully force other sites to spend money on PPC. Force people to spend money on PPC instead of SEO. If you are actively building links, you obviously have the money to spend, so give that money to Google.

      Maybe Google should just start charging people for top 20 position in Google.
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      • Profile picture of the author Bryan V
        *Strapping in!*

        Originally Posted by awarum View Post

        My only guess is Google is giving crappy content sites high ranking and hopefully force other sites to spend money on PPC. Force people to spend money on PPC instead of SEO. If you are actively building links, you obviously have the money to spend, so give that money to Google.

        Maybe Google should just start charging people for top 20 position in Google.
        If there really are too many useless results showing, they're going to make changes, not wait for PPC money to roll in. Without relevant results, there's no one around to look at search PPC.

        Just let it ride for now
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        Perhaps an attic I shall seek.
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      • Profile picture of the author Marc_L
        Originally Posted by awarum View Post

        My only guess is Google is giving crappy content sites high ranking and hopefully force other sites to spend money on PPC. Force people to spend money on PPC instead of SEO. If you are actively building links, you obviously have the money to spend, so give that money to Google.
        If Google was doing this then they would be putting themselves out of business. Google took over search because it gave the most relevant search results. If they continually rank low quality sites highly in their search results then there won't be the searches for Adwords to make money.
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    • Profile picture of the author josephseeley
      Originally Posted by jonathanleger View Post

      Another lousy example:

      Keywords: "cheap purses"

      Check these page one results:

      High Quality Replica Bags - USA UK Canada Australia Europe UAE
      Google Translation: These handbags are so cheap even their image links have broken already!

      Google Translation: Prices from only $325.91/night ... not really what I'd call "cheap", but it is a relative term. When you make $60billion on ad revenue ...

      Google Translation: You may have to "purse" your lips to sing some notes. You get the lyrics for free, which is pretty cheap! I don't see a problem here! :p
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  • Great update . I wonder why i saw a massive increase in my serps this morning . also all of my competition must have been pushed down
    As my pic below shows. this is all you will be doing unless you change your outlook on Seo completely


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    • Profile picture of the author todawg_not
      Originally Posted by high_plains_drifter View Post

      Great update . I wonder why i saw a massive increase in my serps this morning . also all of my competition must have been pushed down
      As my pic below shows. this is all you will be doing unless you change your outlook on Seo completely



      Bwahaaa That's so true
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  • Profile picture of the author martyJames
    Yes, quite a few of my sites hit too - im currently building my own blog network (hope google isnt reading this!) so hopefully will be immune in the future - time will tell.

    The thing that i find amusing is that googles catchphrase of 'displaying the most relevent results' etc and its mission to return quality content and sites in its search results is sooo way off the mark. SEO is always going to dominate the search results - we just change when google does... Interesting times!
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  • Profile picture of the author msu
    It's a bit early to know the permanent effect on our sites. It always takes a few days - maybe more - for these updates to settle in. Strap in and hold tight.
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  • Profile picture of the author Becker13
    Banned
    My new strategy that I just implemented is holding up really well, saw most of my sites go up ironically
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    • Profile picture of the author reyyui
      Originally Posted by Becker13 View Post

      My new strategy that I just implemented is holding up really well, saw most of my sites go up ironically
      Promote your signature???
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      • Profile picture of the author terryd
        Originally Posted by reyyui View Post

        Promote your signature???
        I agree, pretty pathetic....
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      • Profile picture of the author awarum
        Originally Posted by reyyui View Post

        Promote your signature???
        I was thinking the same thing.
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      • Profile picture of the author Bryan V
        Originally Posted by reyyui View Post

        Promote your signature???
        LOL^

        But yeah.. it's a bit early to be buying/selling any guides about this.
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        Perhaps an attic I shall seek.
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  • Profile picture of the author mbmehmet
    Omg. I don't even understand this C&AP. I lost 5 of my sites last year March, I left them till march this year and a reconsideration request got them back in index after rehauling all sites from scratch. This morning.....nada, zilch, all rankings gone. Ok, google I get the f****** HINT. lol Can't believe those guys, they make no sense at all.
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  • Profile picture of the author josephseeley
    I'm already selling my "how to unoptimize your website with one keystroke" e-book ...
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  • Profile picture of the author boxoun
    All my fresh sites that I have sitting in the que have finally shown up in the serps! No backlinks and no content is king! lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author UMS
    Here's another example of poor results

    quality backlinks

    2nd result is a blank Wordpress site that was created on 18th April.
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    • Profile picture of the author Dellco
      Amazing. Google has really outdone themselves this time. This is the worst results I have ever seen in a long time. I would say at least 80% of the SERPs look like a tsunami just rolled over. My good sites all tanked as well.

      It appears they are doing these updates just for the sake of it. There could even be nefarious reasons for them doing so and nothing at all to do with improving the internet. Absolutely horrendous.

      I think a lot of hitherto Google fanboys got hit this time. Time to wake up and smell the coffee!
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by UMS View Post

      Here's another example of poor results

      quality backlinks

      2nd result is a blank Wordpress site that was created on 18th April.
      Actually thats amazing quality - its a great demonstration of what backlinks just by themselves can do

      Anyway not seeing it now so there is a whole lot of shuffling going on.
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  • Profile picture of the author Instantfruit
    MY sites have been punished!!

    I`m pretty new to this, survived the last panda updates (thrived even!)

    Has google messed up here? Are they likely to "undo" some of whats just been done, or do people think this is it now and we have to try to understand whats been done and optimise accordingly?
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  • Profile picture of the author carrotdogs
    I have seen an increase in my serps when checking through my rankings today. A lot of the competition ahead of my site were EMD's, which are now ranking below my site for most keywords. Still early, so I will keep an eye on it before coming to a conclusion.
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    • Profile picture of the author mrehan
      I do use spun articles for backlinking. After todays' update, my 2 spun articels on 2 web 2.0 properties are ranking on page 1 for the keyword that my site (with good unique content) was ranking for before the update today. The links on the Web2.0 properties are pointing to my website/page. If this is what google wants then they are actually promoting spun articles.
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  • Profile picture of the author Captain_Morgan
    so what does this mean, emd's dont have any value's at all cus its to do with keyword stuffing?

    what exactly is keyword stuffing so an article of 500 words with 2% keyword density is keyword stuffing??
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  • Profile picture of the author boxoun
    There is no way this update will stick. They are ranking irrelevant tag pages of mine lol.
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  • Profile picture of the author attorneydavid
    A site a follow that ranks for competitive legal terms using exclusively off topic blog comments is gone. So I'm assuming anchor text not related to page = bad.
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  • Profile picture of the author krishan1982
    Google slap day by day My site ranking go down Page 1 to Page 3
    i m make good back link Low obl but google slap once again every time panda update google changes my ranking
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  • Profile picture of the author arasca
    i have the same problem, my keywords has been dropped from page one to page 8 and so on, don't know what to do now, adding more unique content and optimizing onsite seo to see if its going to help, after that will do some backlinking
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  • Profile picture of the author martyJames
    Lets bypass google and launch the 'Warrior Search Engine" - all warriors who invest are guaranteed page one rankings. Matt Cutts blog will NOT be indexed!
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    • Profile picture of the author krishan1982
      Originally Posted by martyJames View Post

      Lets bypass google and launch the 'Warrior Search Engine" - all warriors who invest are guaranteed page one rankings. Matt Cutts blog will NOT be indexed!
      Hmmm wait for good search engine
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  • Profile picture of the author Steadyon
    I have just checked one of my test sites that has ranked on page 1 for the last 3 years.

    It only has about 6 pages of good quality original content.

    But it was a keyword rich domain (exact match) and had useful stuff for a visitor.

    To get it on to page 1 I set up about 20 web 2.0 properties mainly with 1 or two pages of content. These had a mix of spun and slightly rewritten stuff.

    Then over a few month time period I sent out a few Article Marketing Robot blasts and used these to link back to the web 2.0 sites.

    These links contained some keyword phrases but I definitely made an effort to mix up the anchor text and even had many plain "click here" type links.

    Some of the web properties were randonly linked together and in no way was it a simple link wheel. I did my best to disguise things.

    The result today?

    My site was hammered from the front page today. It is now ranking at 200 or so instead of 3 or 4.

    So clearly google's algorithm has cleverly figured this out and taken action.

    A sad day for the little guys...

    Sam


    P.S. - As mentioned in another thread one of our money sites was chewed up and spat out by panda. No "blackhat" or anything like I mentioned above was done and it also suffered very heavily.

    It could be time to get a white-collar job and join the masses again and go and owrk for a Big Brand :-(
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  • Profile picture of the author Maraun
    I think a viable long-term way forward is to make sites with link bait on them.

    Link bait can be anything that makes users link to your site. Content lockers for downloads that only unlock after twitter post or facebook share, funny pictures and anything else that people would share on their own.
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  • Profile picture of the author BigNorm
    Well one thing seems certain, as far as I can tell, EMD's will get you penalized with this update. All my EMD sites are gone. The upside, my internal pages my begin to rank better. Silo structured sites definitely make alot better sense now in light of the new update.
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    • Profile picture of the author Bryan V
      Originally Posted by BigNorm View Post

      Well one thing seems certain, as far as I can tell, EMD's will get you penalized with this update.
      Tons of brand name EMDs have not budged. They aren't punished for simply being an EMD.

      There are weak ones ranking well too, but their placements are questionable.
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      • Profile picture of the author terryd
        Originally Posted by Bryan V View Post

        Tons of brand name EMDs have not budged. They aren't punished for simply being an EMD.

        There are weak ones ranking well too, but their placements are questionable.
        Agreed, it's not just a EMD algo change. I've got some that have stuck while others have been pushed to oblivion....
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        • Profile picture of the author nik0
          Banned
          Most sites that are struck have 2 things in common:

          1: Bad backlink profile
          2: Affiliate or Adsense site

          Most sites from offline clients have not been affected by this update. Read again : most

          It seemed Google really focused on the combination of these 2 things this time. Personally I just changed all my packages to a more natural way of building links, if even social signals will hurt sites then I'm clueless as well.

          Personally I think the best solution right now is to wait and to see if they do a rollback cause the examples people came up with are just ridiculous, tag pages that start to rank very well, an empty shell for "make money online" and more of that crap.

          In case the rollback doesn't bring back our rankings I think it's smart to buy new domains and copy the content to them to start with a clean sheet and only build solid links and use manually made web2.0's or other links as a buffer for the lower quality links, I am even thinking about building in a 2nd tier buffer but I'm not sure how much juice will be lost doing it in such way. I know I'm just gonna purchase a new domain cause I don't think I'll get back easily. My site is just a few pages but ranked in the top 4 for 2 keywords with >50k exact searches.
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          • Profile picture of the author Architex
            Nope. My site is a legit site with 1000's of pages and is a PR 5 site and is gone to the depths of who knows where. I sell house plans online that are my plans so they are all unique. This will obviously have to be rolled back some because the results are just too horrible to stay like they are. For certain phrases anyway. One of my KW the #1 spot now is a site that is incredible thin. Maybe 20 pages total. Looks like G may have messed this one up a little.

            I also just noticed for my main company site I am now #2 for my main KW where I was #5 before and I am also #10 with a video I did using Animoto. How that is #10 is beyond me!

            Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

            Most sites that are struck have 2 things in common:

            1: Bad backlink profile
            2: Affiliate or Adsense site


            Most sites from offline clients have not been affected by this update. Read again : most

            It seemed Google really focused on the combination of these 2 things this time. Personally I just changed all my packages to a more natural way of building links, if even social signals will hurt sites then I'm clueless as well.

            Personally I think the best solution right now is to wait and to see if they do a rollback cause the examples people came up with are just ridiculous, tag pages that start to rank very well, an empty shell for "make money online" and more of that crap.

            In case the rollback doesn't bring back our rankings I think it's smart to buy new domains and copy the content to them to start with a clean sheet and only build solid links and use manually made web2.0's or other links as a buffer for the lower quality links, I am even thinking about building in a 2nd tier buffer but I'm not sure how much juice will be lost doing it in such way. I know I'm just gonna purchase a new domain cause I don't think I'll get back easily. My site is just a few pages but ranked in the top 4 for 2 keywords with >50k exact searches.
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            Architex
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            • Profile picture of the author nik0
              Banned
              Originally Posted by Architex View Post

              Nope. My site is a legit site with 1000's of pages and is a PR 5 site and is gone to the depths of who knows where. I sell house plans online that are my plans so they are all unique. This will obviously have to be rolled back some because the results are just too horrible to stay like they are. For certain phrases anyway. One of my KW the #1 spot now is a site that is incredible thin. Maybe 20 pages total. Looks like G may have messed this one up a little.

              I also just noticed for my main company site I am now #2 for my main KW where I was #5 before and I am also #10 with a video I did using Animoto. How that is #10 is beyond me!
              That is awfull, I assumed it was just against the combo of thin afffiliate and unwanted links cause a few seo companies outsource their work to me, and they only have offline clients, and close to none of them dropped in the rankings.

              While many of my own clients have been hit and most of them run affiliate / adsense sites. And I used blog networks before, and they also used blog networks theirselves before.
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        • Profile picture of the author jimmyn
          Originally Posted by terryd View Post

          Agreed, it's not just a EMD algo change. I've got some that have stuck while others have been pushed to oblivion....
          Yeah, i think it's just coincidence that a lot of people have EMDs which meet the other criteria this update is affecting.
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      • Profile picture of the author BigNorm
        Originally Posted by Bryan V View Post

        Tons of brand name EMDs have not budged. They aren't punished for simply being an EMD.

        There are weak ones ranking well too, but their placements are questionable.

        I doubt very much the big brand name websites will be touched.

        Looking through Google search results, I am noticing alot of edu sites ranking where they never were before.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by BigNorm View Post

      Well one thing seems certain, as far as I can tell, EMD's will get you penalized with this update. All my EMD sites are gone.
      Nope not all


      https://www.google.com/search?aq=f&s...F-8&q=best+buy
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      • Profile picture of the author inter123
        Does that mean things like Unique Article Wizard, Article Marketing Robot etc have now become redundant?
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        • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
          Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

          Does that mean things like Unique Article Wizard, Article Marketing Robot etc have now become redundant?
          Yes, Thank God! Google is finally catching up with the link spammers and it is about time. And yes, all of you who spin articles, wikis and web 2.0's you are link spammers.
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          • Profile picture of the author The Expert
            Spun content is still alive and well. It's just "junk" synonym-level, auto-spun content that is going down.

            Look into Paragraph/Sentence level spinning and you'll see that it's unlikely that there will ever be a day when this method isn't viable. That's because sentence and paragraph structures are "language concept driven" and a search engine cannot understand "language" as we know it. They ARE able to compare synonnyms mathmatically though as google knows more about synnonyms than you do and can assign a value to particular words and then, if the numbers in various versions add up, they can be predictably labeled as "spun".

            That can't be done with paragraph/sentence level spinning though because google doesn't understand language. You can't assign numbers to individual words in a sentence in such a way to understand the "concept" being communicated and without a value mathematical value being assigned to various sentences, there's no way to compare them from a computer perspective.

            Visit TheLeadingArticles.com and read everything there and you'll see what I'm talking about.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by The Expert View Post

              Spun content is still alive and well. It's just "junk" synonym-level, auto-spun content that is going down.
              Thats actually technically true but what alot of people consider spinning IS synonym auto spinning. Sentence and paragraph spinning is more thought of as rewriting.
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            • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
              Originally Posted by The Expert View Post

              Spun content is still alive and well. It's just "junk" synonym-level, auto-spun content that is going down.

              Look into Paragraph/Sentence level spinning and you'll see that it's unlikely that there will ever be a day when this method isn't viable. That's because sentence and paragraph structures are "language concept driven" and a search engine cannot understand "language" as we know it. They ARE able to compare synonnyms mathmatically though as google knows more about synnonyms than you do and can assign a value to particular words and then, if the numbers in various versions add up, they can be predictably labeled as "spun".

              That can't be done with paragraph/sentence level spinning though because google doesn't understand language. You can't assign numbers to individual words in a sentence in such a way to understand the "concept" being communicated and without a value mathematical value being assigned to various sentences, there's no way to compare them from a computer perspective.

              Visit TheLeadingArticles.com and read everything there and you'll see what I'm talking about.
              I'm not sure if this has any relevance, but I learnt the right way to spin my submission content from them itself. I went there to buy content but found zero articles regarding my niche, so I decided to write my own article, took me a day to come up with 10,000+ words article, highly spun in sentence/paragraph wise. I used it for link building, that site still stands at #10. But then I cannot guarantee it worked as another site of mine EMD still stands at #5 with just one type of backlinks and low quality spun that I did before I learnt this strategy.

              Sentence and Paragraph level spinning, people avoid it because it takes a long long time and writing just one article can frustrate anyone so much. If you get others to write it, it'll be very costly since 1 article will cross 10k words. But honestly, sentence/para level spinning is not really spinning, it is more like writing several different articles, picking random sentences each time and everytime that happens, it actually makes sense. The amazing part is that the articles when spun look very natural and humanly written.

              Spinning word level is really bad. It is spinning on synonym level and it is very much detectable. Using synonyms looks all the same to a human if they read and I'm sure google could easily come up with a strategy to catch that. If google catches it, the uniqueness of each article will drop like anything. Moreover my word level spinning was getting me like 40-50% uniqueness with footprint of synonyms. When I wrote a sentence level spin, I got very close to 90% unique. I even compared like 50 versions of articles with each other. Around 75% of the times articles were 95-99% unique most of the time and like 10% of the times they were 80-90% unique with each other and a few times 70-80%. I realised the power of sentence level spin.

              I guess, with future tests, I'll just know the truth.
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          • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
            Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

            Yes, Thank God! Google is finally catching up with the link spammers and it is about time. And yes, all of you who spin articles, wikis and web 2.0's you are link spammers.

            Ohhh Mister Rexie - dont gloat too hard or get yer panties all hot n bothered about this algo just yet ...

            Google plays buy rules - and you're trying to ... others do not. You will always be disadvantaged - waiting for google to come save you.

            ... and remember, if a webmaster can accidentally trash their own site to the bottom of googles dustbin of the serps - they can now [ thanks google ] punk your sites to sit right alongside them at the bottom.

            Cue the ... " I dont rely on google for traffic " response.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
              Originally Posted by 4morereferrals View Post

              Ohhh Mister Rexie - dont gloat too hard or get yer panties all hot n bothered about this algo just yet ...

              Google plays buy rules - and you're trying to ... others do not. You will always be disadvantaged - waiting for google to come save you.

              ... and remember, if a webmaster can accidentally trash their own site to the bottom of googles dustbin of the serps - they can now [ thanks google ] punk your sites to sit right alongside them at the bottom.

              Cue the ... " I dont rely on google for traffic " response.
              LOL. The biggest thing that everyone missed in the negative seo outing last week was the case study from Negative SEO on the auto site. What did he say in that post? He said he looked for sites with poor on site structure.

              That was the biggest takeaway of the fiasco and no one caught it. A great negative SEOer admitted negative SEO on sites with proper on site structure was safe - or at least not profitable to go after.

              So, since my sites are near perfect in information and site architecture, I am not worried. No one can affect my onsite structure. I am in complete control over that.
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  • Profile picture of the author sanlee
    i think google's on weed today.
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  • Profile picture of the author martyJames
    i notice that the main KW i was rankin high for has disappeared completely from the index BUT all the wordpress tags are still ranking??

    Re the soon to be created 'Warrior Search Engine" , when you search for 'google' it will return:

    Your search - google - did not match any documents.
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  • Profile picture of the author bcruan
    Ha, google has really done some prople over with this. Wikipedia is ranking in position number 5 for insurance in the UK! My emd has dropped from first to 7th, although it has been replaced by a one page, small articel emd.

    I think a big focus is on spun content as mentioned and link relevance more than ever.
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  • Profile picture of the author river99
    This update is totally SUCK!

    Rank #1 for "make money online" keyword

    make
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  • Profile picture of the author Instantfruit
    One of my larger sites has really been hammered.

    Interestingly, its pages with links that have been knocked back the most, pages without links appear pretty stable - some have even improved!
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  • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
    I don't think EMD has anything to do with it. It is a coincidence that most EMDs were made purposely for targeting certain keywords and most of them were built on exact same backlinking strategies most used. The same spun content/article directories etc. However I believe this update is wrong as it has weeded out most of the high quality sites that a reader would really care about reading.

    I think this time google has gone way too far in trying to control the spam, most people who create the high quality content that people really want to read and it helps them give what they were looking for ARE the ones who know about SEO and their high quality content are SEOed, from onpage to offpage.

    What is the end goal of google? Penalise people get backlinks to get their site up? Or improve the SERPS with better quality for a reader? I think Matt Cuts or whoever is doing this has completely neglected the quality content part and is just focusing on trying to stop people from building links or in short trying to kill the whole IM space. This will kill google as well in the long run because their quality of searches are going down as well.

    This will also promote more SEO services now, but the only difference is SEO services will be bought by people against their competitiors than to their own site now. People who give SEO services will still earn, but the wrong way. Way to go google :/

    Suggestions....

    I think if google really don't want people to do spammy backlinking etc, I think google should just devalue those links rather penalising. Devalue the low quality stuff and reevaluate the site. It does not happen today no matter what say. Once google thinks your site has unnatural backlinking, they destroy your SERPS and send you down 50-100 pages. Will discounting some bad quality links send you so much down? I'm sure you ranked higher than that the first time you created content and it had no backlinks than now when you have a mix of high quality backlinks and low quality. If google just devalues low quality or whatever it considers not effective/unnatural, one could just see some downtake in rankings, not completely out of the whack as we see today.

    Push all the sites that have done backlinking/over optimisation and you'll find that all the quality content that a reader wants has disappeared. That will destroy Internet Marketers as well as Google.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
    There won't be any rollbacks, lol. The update is still in progress, give it a couple days. It's a complex algo and a huge database they have to work with.
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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    If you're seeing your tags pages rank instead of posts, it probably means your articles are over-optimized or keyword stuffed.
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    • Profile picture of the author mosthost
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      If you're seeing your tags pages rank instead of posts, it probably means your articles are over-optimized or keyword stuffed.
      No doubt. Same goes for your home page missing and interior pages ranking. If the home page is gone it's overoptimized and has a phrase based penalty.
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      If you're seeing your tags pages rank instead of posts, it probably means your articles are over-optimized or keyword stuffed.
      Not necessarily, a Tag page has 100% keyword anchor-text pointing at it's page from all of the Post.

      The actual pages linking from the Tag to the Post have the Post-Title anchor-text on a typical site that runs Tags.
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      • Profile picture of the author retsek
        Originally Posted by yukon View Post

        Not necessarily, a Tag page has 100% keyword anchor-text pointing at it's page from all of the Post.

        The actual pages linking from the Tag to the Post have the Post-Title anchor-text on a typical site that runs Tags.
        Over-Optimization isn't only linked based.

        Chances are the people reporting this haven't optimized the titles and descriptions of their tag pages. Second, tag pages usually have several posts on them which levels out keyword density issues if the posts are about different things. In some cases, Tag pages are snipped with the excerpt or via the read more..
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        • Profile picture of the author yukon
          Originally Posted by retsek View Post

          Over-Optimization isn't only linked based.
          True, a canonical tag pointing at the Post should help tell Google which of the pages is the most important URL (Post vs. Tag page).




          Originally Posted by retsek View Post

          Chances are the people reporting this haven't optimized the titles and descriptions of their tag pages. Second, tag pages usually have several posts on them which levels out keyword density issues if the posts are about different things. In some cases, Tag pages are snipped with the excerpt or via the read more..
          If they are doing SEO correct they will have a unique page <title> for every page on the site. Most Tag pages include several Post pages, I doubt they would all match the Tag page <title>.

          You can rank a page without a description tag, so I don't think that has anything to do with SEO (as far as Google Bots). I'm not saying the description tag isn't useful, it is useful If done correctly to help increase SERP CTR.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by yukon View Post

            True, a canonical tag pointing at the Post should help tell Google which of the pages is the most important URL (Post vs. Tag page).


            If they are doing SEO correct they will have a unique page <title> for every page on the site. Most Tag pages include several Post pages, I doubt they would all match the Tag page <title>.

            You can rank a page without a description tag, so I don't think that has anything to do with SEO (as far as Google Bots). I'm not saying the description tag isn't useful, it is useful If done correctly to help increase SERP CTR.
            Lots of truth here. I stop the problem before it occurs by NOINDEX/NOFOLLOW all tag pages. All in One SEO will do this for you on WP, but you have to check the box, it is not automatically checked I dont think.

            Total truth on the description part, too.
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    • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      If you're seeing your tags pages rank instead of posts, it probably means your articles are over-optimized or keyword stuffed.

      Google was ranking those ahead for months before this purported algo "enhancement"

      ".... just one more step towards Bing ..... errrr Quality" - Matt Cutts
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  • Profile picture of the author wAvision
    The new SEO = Negative SEO....im starting my WSO now...and NSEO biz...looking for a partner...
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Originally Posted by wAvision View Post

      The new SEO = Negative SEO....im starting my WSO now...and NSEO biz...looking for a partner...
      Thanks for the heads up, I can add you to my forum block list.
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      • Profile picture of the author wAvision
        Originally Posted by yukon View Post

        Thanks for the heads up, I can add you to my forum block list.
        facepalm.jpg

        LOL...It was a joke obv...
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    • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
      Originally Posted by wAvision View Post

      The new SEO = Negative SEO....im starting my WSO now...and NSEO biz...looking for a partner...
      Even though that is not legal, but I'm with this. This is probably one of the ways to make Google realise of it's blunder by trying to weed out Internet Marketers than actually by trying to improve the quality of their SERPS.
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  • Profile picture of the author scrapcar
    My site has gone up loads in the SERPs over night.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rukshan
    Another unrelated result for "replica bags"

    Current news | politics, business, health, sports

    I noticed this site has too many Replica related tags in right sidebar.
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Originally Posted by Rukshan View Post

      Another unrelated result for "replica bags"

      Current news | politics, business, health, sports

      I noticed this site has too many Replica related tags in right sidebar.
      That site isn't on page #1 in Google US SERPs.
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      • Profile picture of the author Rukshan
        Originally Posted by yukon View Post

        That site isn't on page #1 in Google US SERPs.
        I see it #10 in Google US.
        (I checked it with Search Global plugin)
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  • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
    I see this site instead --> pack148.net

    on Page 1. It has NO where mentioned "replica bags" lol
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  • Profile picture of the author wAvision
    Are things starting to settle?

    I am not seeing anymore shuffling in my niche
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    I got a feeling (and I predicted this a few months ago) that EMD's are definitely being targeted.

    Have a look at the SERPS.

    You'll notice deeper URLS listed, where the keywords might appear six directories in.

    You'll also note the additional weight given to LSI.

    *Some of the urls dont even contain the keyword.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post


      You'll also note the additional weight given to LSI.
      Yeah I noted this on another forum. My early analyzing indicates LSI is a HUGE part of this update. They've either tweaked it or turned it up as a more weighted factor - probably both.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Yeah I noted this on another forum. My early analyzing indicates LSI is a HUGE part of this update. They've either tweaked it or turned it up as a more weighted factor - probably both.
        I agree. Not sure that its working as intended though.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Actually these search results.....they look "old"

    Like they did back in 2009/10.

    Anyone else finding that?
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  • Profile picture of the author grexley
    I have a thin content, EMD site full of uncloaked affiliate links and adsense ads that has remained #1 for many overly optimized keywords.

    I have 2 sites full of useful, original content that other sites link to on their own, that were destroyed in the rankings.

    My speculation is this has much more to do with the backlink profile, not the onpage content.

    The two sites I lost had about 50% web 2.0 links and blog network posts, in addition to high PR links and legitimate editorial links. None of the links came from pages with spun conent. Though many of the web 2.0 links had backlinks from spun content.

    Google warns about linking from bad neighborhoods, and at this point I suspect that is coming to mean any kind of low quality blog network(that they've identified) and maybe even web 2.0 properties that have spammy backlink profiles.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by grexley View Post


      My speculation is this has much more to do with the backlink profile, not the onpage content.
      I don't think thats speculation. Thats pretty much fact. There would be little use in Google going to the extent of showing screen shots of links in unrelated content if they were not going after the links themselves as well.
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      • Profile picture of the author nik0
        Banned
        My friend has a website about "butt muscle excersises", in dutch that would be:

        bilspieroefeningen (he always ranked at #1 for that term)

        when I type that into Google I get the results for:

        buikspieroefeningen - which means: belly muscle excersises

        Which is a totally different excersise. My friend is ranking nowhere and Google just keeps changing it to "buik". This started since last nights update btw.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Im looking at these search results and Im seeing page after page of big companies filling the top 10 results.

    What happened to "ma and pa sites" being able to compete.

    What BS.
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    • Profile picture of the author Paul Gram
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Im looking at these search results and Im seeing page after page of big companies filling the top 10 results.

      What happened to "ma and pa sites" being able to compete.

      What BS.
      It's ALL about creating a strong and social brand now, which the ma and pa sites will have to do in order to compete. It's not over but the game is definitely changing!
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by Paul Gram View Post

        It's ALL about creating a strong and social brand now, which the ma and pa sites will have to do in order to compete. It's not over but the game is definitely changing!
        NAILED IT!
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      • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
        Originally Posted by Paul Gram View Post

        It's ALL about creating a strong and social brand now, which the ma and pa sites will have to do in order to compete. It's not over but the game is definitely changing!
        Oh okay. Ill just tell my 54 year old housemate that she needs to build a brand and not just blog about weekend markets :rolleyes:
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        • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
          Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

          Oh okay. Ill just tell my 54 year old housemate that she needs to build a brand and not just blog about weekend markets :rolleyes:
          Let me quote the line under your user name "No excuses - Just do it"
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          • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
            Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

            Let me quote the line under your user name "No excuses - Just do it"
            At least Ive got the balls to use my real name and my actual photo.
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    • Profile picture of the author Sojourn
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Im looking at these search results and Im seeing page after page of big companies filling the top 10 results.

      What happened to "ma and pa sites" being able to compete.

      What BS.
      There is absolutely some strange stuff out there. I've been studying product review related keywords today and gave up looking for any patterns in the mix. Too early to tell what the heck things will look like until all the changes roll through and the recrawling is done but I just can't imagine that what's out there today is what Google would deem "a great user experience" in many situations.

      For a laugh, look up "bread machine reviews" without quotes and read through the Weebly and Tripod listings that are about midway down the first page. I think I need to buy a bread machine based on this piece of spun garbage:
      "Very first a bit concerning the drawbacks I've skilled:

      It is actually loud. The actual massaging procedure is really a sensible loud extramarital relationship which endures 30-40 minute's complete. It's possibly difficult to prevent all of the sound in the breadmaker,..."

      I'm not sure if that means the bread maker comes with a man you hope your husband never finds out about or a back massager.
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    • Profile picture of the author zaco
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Im looking at these search results and Im seeing page after page of big companies filling the top 10 results.

      What happened to "ma and pa sites" being able to compete.

      What BS.
      Hahaha I guess you lost your sites rankings! first I would like to say I feel bad for all the people who lost their rankings except you each time someone used to post an issue with their site you come back with the answer " stop whining" and start bullying them lol , pay back time? karma? hah!
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  • Profile picture of the author Cecil Dee
    I was reading through the WF yesterday and saw a thread about this, then I got an email from Jon Leger with some actual examples, then after reading a few more threads on here I see a pattern. It seems like these algo changes lately are really weighing heavy where you get your links from, with little regard about authority, age, content. I agree that it is still all about the links however with a big twist. Many of the links you once believed were good are now crap so we must now hunt down the best links and secure them for link building. Also it seems like GA and WMT aren't helping either so alternatives are needed for them as well.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
      Originally Posted by Cecil Dee View Post

      I see a pattern.
      Oh really now... don't flatter yourself. The algorithm is still processing data, give it a few days before even looking at the SERPs, let alone searching for patterns.

      Watching all of you discuss these wildly changing SERPs is hilarious. Take a good guess why you're seeing what your'e seeing? Is Google really dumb? Is it possible, just maybe, that they know exactly what they're doing, what the final outcome will look like (to very good accuracy) and just need more time to process their gigantic index?

      Here's a kindergarten-like explanation:

      Imagine that they have like 1000 pieces of "index". Now imagine they have a set of new rules that they can only apply to 1 piece at a time. It takes an hour to process a piece, then it goes back into the index as a new piece (with a new score). Now think about the SERPs this way - once all 1000 pieces have been processed, SERPs should look the way Google wants them to (which they have tested a hundred times over in a sandbox/testbed). So when the piece you're in gets re-evaluated and put back in with the old pieces, your website's "score" might be very low (in context of the old scoring system), so you lose rankings. Wait until all websites get processed and all scores are re-evaluated - bit by bit.

      Obviously, no one knows exactly how things work over at Google, but I bet the above is pretty damn close.

      edit: another possibility is that they're applying a bunch of filters one by one. Same outcome as the other method though. Gotta wait it out and see what happens.
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      • Profile picture of the author Cecil Dee
        I don't think the purpose of this discussion is flattery. We are all chiming in with our thoughts and ideas about the latest algo with Google, a few days, weeks, months won't change what we're experiencing Now. Obviously you don't rake in $5+ billion per year by being a dumbass.

        Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

        Oh really now... don't flatter yourself. The algorithm is still processing data, give it a few days before even looking at the SERPs, let alone searching for patterns.

        Watching all of you discuss these wildly changing SERPs is hilarious. Take a good guess why you're seeing what your'e seeing? Is Google really dumb? Is it possible, just maybe, that they know exactly what they're doing, what the final outcome will look like (to very good accuracy) and just need more time to process their gigantic index?

        Here's a kindergarten-like explanation:

        Imagine that they have like 1000 pieces of "index". Now imagine they have a set of new rules that they can only apply to 1 piece at a time. It takes an hour to process a piece, then it goes back into the index as a new piece (with a new score). Now think about the SERPs this way - once all 1000 pieces have been processed, SERPs should look the way Google wants them to (which they have tested a hundred times over in a sandbox/testbed). So when the piece you're in gets re-evaluated and put back in with the old pieces, your website's "score" might be very low (in context of the old scoring system), so you lose rankings. Wait until all websites get processed and all scores are re-evaluated - bit by bit.

        Obviously, no one knows exactly how things work over at Google, but I bet the above is pretty damn close.

        edit: another possibility is that they're applying a bunch of filters one by one. Same outcome as the other method though. Gotta wait it out and see what happens.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Heres an interesting search...

    Try this one..

    Go to Google.com, type in "dog training"

    Check the 2nd page.

    www.senuke.com

    WTF?????
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Hlatky
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Heres an interesting search...

      Try this one..

      Go to Google.com, type in "dog training"

      Check the 2nd page.

      www.senuke.com

      WTF?????
      WTF is Google doing?

      All The Things - google update spam all the websites
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    • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Heres an interesting search...

      Try this one..

      Go to Google.com, type in "dog training"

      Check the 2nd page.

      www.senuke.com

      WTF?????
      Haha thats a really funny example of google fail today.
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    • Profile picture of the author awarum
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Heres an interesting search...

      Try this one..

      Go to Google.com, type in "dog training"

      Check the 2nd page.

      www.senuke.com

      WTF?????
      I don't see it. Maybe you search for Senuke a lot and google is showing it to you only? :confused:
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      • Profile picture of the author mosthost
        Originally Posted by awarum View Post

        I don't see it. Maybe you search for Senuke a lot and google is showing it to you only? :confused:
        WikiPedia is in number two for me.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
          Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

          WikiPedia is in number two for me.
          No dude, 2nd page.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
        Originally Posted by awarum View Post

        I don't see it. Maybe you search for Senuke a lot and google is showing it to you only? :confused:
        Ive never searched for seonuke. I dont even know what it is.

        Im based in Australia.
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      • Profile picture of the author GlobalTrader
        Originally Posted by awarum View Post

        I don't see it. Maybe you search for Senuke a lot and google is showing it to you only? :confused:
        It is showing on Page 3 for me so it is there just one page difference for USA users.
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    • Profile picture of the author awarum
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Heres an interesting search...

      Try this one..

      Go to Google.com, type in "dog training"

      Check the 2nd page.

      www.senuke.com

      WTF?????
      senuke is on 4th page now
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Tell you what, if EMD's hold less weight in the search engines, there's gonna be a LOT of pissed off domainers out there.
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  • Profile picture of the author wAvision
    Can someone please answer these questions...

    I did not follow the last updates this closely, i am sure that some of you did...

    1. were any of the updates this bizarre...with the page 1 results etc...
    2. Did it take a few days for everything to settle
    3. Did you have any sites involved that dropped, then a few days later bounced back?
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by wAvision View Post

      Can someone please answer these questions...

      I did not follow the last updates this closely, i am sure that some of you did...

      1. were any of the updates this bizarre...with the page 1 results etc...
      2. Did it take a few days for everything to settle
      3. Did you have any sites involved that dropped, then a few days later bounced back?
      This is normal. It happens everytime there is a big update. Some sites come back quickly, some take time, some never come back. So that one is up in the air.

      The more competitive the niche (the more spammers) the more fluctuations, longer. In a lot of my niches, there havent been any fluctuations since yesterday, so they seem settled. Other niches are different every time you hit refresh.
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  • Profile picture of the author SeoKnightsInc
    Love this and other Panda Update

    As a web developer i was never in favor of Using Spun Content for link building as its total crap. I read few patents from Google and i know that soon Spun content will be slapped badly and same happens


    I am happy none of my Page has lost its ranking and they stepped UP few spots in Google.

    Every morning i wake up and find my blog full of scapebox idiotic comments that consumes a lot of my time to trash.

    Let these shady tactics to spam this beautiful internet be punished a bit more severely so that we live in a healthy Internet Ecosystem and not in a spun crap.


    Thanks Google and i will wait for more such steps
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    • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
      Originally Posted by pbbiet View Post

      [B][SIZE=4]
      As a web developer i was never in favor of Using Spun Content for link building as its total crap. I read few patents from Google and i know that soon Spun content will be slapped badly and same happens
      Same what? They didn't "slap" spun content today. Why so many people took this away from their official announcement is beyond me - they never said that they slapped spun content. Those examples show contextual links from unrelated "context" pages.
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      • Profile picture of the author inter123
        Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

        Same what? They didn't "slap" spun content today. Why so many people took this away from their official announcement is beyond me - they never said that they slapped spun content. Those examples show contextual links from unrelated "context" pages.
        People on this thread took it as spun content being slapped because that is what the OP is implying.

        The example given on Google blog talks of spinning beyond recognition such that the the backlink is irrelevent to the page and the sentence is gramatically incorrect. Do people for definate know that their sites were slapped because they used spun content as backlinks?
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

          People on this thread took it as spun content being slapped because that is what the OP is implying.
          and the OP stands by it. I'm not the only one either since the thread over on traffic planet has much the same conclusion implied in its thread title -

          "Google just announced new algorithm changes to come in next few days, targeting keyword stuffing and spun content"

          People can claim if they wish that it has nothing to do with it but there is absolutely nothing in what Google said that rules out exactly what the paragraph says AND the implication of them specifically using a screenshot of a site that has spun content

          From google -

          "Of course, most sites affected by this change aren’t so blatant. Here’s an example of a site with unusual linking patterns that is also affected by this change. Notice that if you try to read the text aloud you’ll discover that the outgoing links are completely unrelated to the actual content, AND (my emphasis) in fact the page text has been “spun” beyond recognition:
          So they didn't simply talk about unrelated links they talked about unrelated links AND spun content. I think people are kidding themselves that Google will have an algo that can determine related content (allegedly able to spot quality as well) and not be able to spot the tell tale signs of spinning. As indicated before I mean by this auto spinning. Rewriting an article line by line or paragraph by paragraph is not going to leave the tell tale patterns of spun content from auto spinning.


          The example given on Google blog talks of spinning beyond recognition such that the the backlink is irrelevent to the page and the sentence is gramatically incorrect.
          Almost all auto spinning results in grammatical mistakes. IF you touch up the article afterwards its more like rewriting.
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          • Profile picture of the author inter123
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            Rewriting an article line by line or paragraph by paragraph is not going to leave the tell tale patterns of spun content from auto spinning.
            Does that mean something like UAW is ok for the time being since it spins paragraphs?
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            • Profile picture of the author SeoKnightsInc
              Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

              Does that mean something like UAW is ok for the time being since it spins paragraphs?
              It does not spins paragraphs it spins lines. Its also not safe as sooner or later it will be also punished and i had heard a few people complaining about loosing the rank after using UAW.
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              • Profile picture of the author Legit SEO
                The only sites of mine that went up were the ones that I recently hit with spun blog posts. Go figure
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      • Profile picture of the author IM Ash
        (HAHA, I was 4 posts too late with this one... )

        You gotta feel sorry for the guy from AskTheBuilder. com who runs a fantastic site loaded with high quality. I remember when he was hit after the first Panda update and now it looks like he took another hit.

        He left this comment on Google's blog:

        Matt,

        You guys jumped the shark with Panda 1.0. Go read this blog post if you want to see where many of us on the other side of the fence see this going:

        Free High-Quality Content Online - How Much Longer?

        Read closely the text from the Google blog that I quote. Panda was supposed to "reward creators of original content." BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

        If that's the intention of Panda, why have I lost 80% of my traffic at www. AsktheBuilder. com? You can't get any more original content than what I have.

        It's SO GOOD that www. ehow. com has cited it on over 13,000 of their pages. It's so good it's copied all the time by the webspam sites that constantly outrank me on page one of your results.

        How is it you can't tell the difference from my original content and what the thieves regurgitate? Are you serious?

        For goodness sake, www. copyscape. com has been able to spot plagiarism for YEARS. Why can't your highly educated engineers do it?

        Perhaps the most blatant content farm - www. ehow. com - is still on page one of Google for many results. How in the world can you say that's good for the ecosystem? They *copy* content from me and tens of thousands of other original content creators.

        I have a challenge for you Matt. Why don't you convene a Summit of about 100 of the top Original Content Creators - two from each vertical - and have them come out to the Mother Ship so you can hear our side of the story?

        You do realize that you're putting out of business tens of thousands of great content creators, don't you?

        Who's going to fill that vacuum? Who will ehow. com copy then?

        If you think that it's easy to create thousands of pages of great content, you're dreaming. You got too close to Steve Jobs' Reality Distortion Field.

        I beg you and the top decision makers at Google to think about my Summit idea. I'd gladly come to have a sensible debate about the unintended consequences of Panda and what you're doing.

        Tim Carter
        Founder - www. AsktheBuilder. com
        Source: Official Google Webmaster Central Blog: Another step to reward high-quality sites
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        • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
          Originally Posted by IM Ash View Post

          You gotta feel sorry for the guy from AskTheBuilder. com
          Not to mention he has pagerank 6 links from Google, does that mean they are a crappy source?
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          • Profile picture of the author plsearch
            I don't think the update is finished, going to take several days for the dust to settle. Maybe longer
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        • Profile picture of the author mosthost
          Originally Posted by IM Ash View Post

          (HAHA, I was 4 posts too late with this one... )

          You gotta feel sorry for the guy from AskTheBuilder. com who runs a fantastic site loaded with high quality. I remember when he was hit after the first Panda update and now it looks like he took another hit.
          Nah, I don't feel sorry for him. Take a good look at his website. The design is not what's expected for top ranking websites. The Adsense is prominently displayed above the content.

          Undoubtedly the information he shares can be found in other places on the web. Rather than him 'challenging' Matt Cutts, he should consider challenging himself to build a better looking, more functional, and user friendly website.

          He might have to accept that the long party is over and get back to doing home repairs.
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          • Profile picture of the author IM Ash
            Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

            Nah, I don't feel sorry for him. Take a good look at his website. The design is not what's expected for top ranking websites. The Adsense is prominently displayed above the content.

            Undoubtedly the information he shares can be found in other places on the web. Rather than him 'challenging' Matt Cutts, he should consider challenging himself to build a better looking, more functional, and user friendly website.

            He might have to accept that the long party is over and get back to doing home repairs.
            Was about to say you heartless but just visited his site after a long time and see he has totally screwed up the user-experience on his site.
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            • Profile picture of the author mosthost
              Originally Posted by IM Ash View Post

              Was about to say you heartless but just visited his site after a long time and see he has totally screwed up the user-experience on his site.
              LOL, exactly. Then you saw what I saw
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              • Profile picture of the author jr1228
                Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

                LOL, exactly. Then you saw what I saw
                Didn't his site used to look different? I loaded it up today and thought there was an error in the coding because it looked so off.
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                • Profile picture of the author mosthost
                  Originally Posted by jr1228 View Post

                  Didn't his site used to look different? I loaded it up today and thought there was an error in the coding because it looked so off.
                  Yeah it sure did. It seems like he redesigned it with the intention of getting people to 1) search Google for his old articles and 2) sign up for his newsletter. The feeling of the home page is very off for what I'd expect for a big money keyword division like home repair/building. Let's face it, you have giants in that sector.

                  I assume he lost money every month since Panda came around and attempted to redesign the website in an attempt to conserve/increase Adsense cash. Instead, he weakened the user experience, causing further declines in traffic and obviously revenue.

                  He should have focused on redesigning the website to entice user engagement IMHO
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              • Profile picture of the author OmarNegron
                His site was not always like that, it looked great and he was top 10 earner in adsense back in the day. He had no other choice but to turn his site the way it looks now.

                How would you feel providing original content and all and then get killed? Think about that, put yourself in his shoes. Google has no heart and there is no such thing as low quality and high quality in their eyes.

                Sometimes I think its a bunch of nerds playing around with buttons randomly and to top things off they don't provide any customer service or way to contact them because they know how pissed off people really are.

                This will be their downfall unless they aim to improve. Seems their motto = "Don't be evil"

                It's totally backwards!!

                - Will
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      • Profile picture of the author SeoKnightsInc
        Originally Posted by bnetwork View Post

        Same what? They didn't "slap" spun content today. Why so many people took this away from their official announcement is beyond me - they never said that they slapped spun content. Those examples show contextual links from unrelated "context" pages.
        I think you are missing something Man have look at the blog post again or checkout this snap of that portion of blog.

        Here is what Matt wrote
        Notice that if you try to read the text aloud you’ll discover that the outgoing links are completely unrelated to the actual content, and in fact the page text has been “spun” beyond recognition:
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  • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
    Hows this?

    Tim Carter from http://www.AsktheBuilder.com is on the Google Blog complaining that his site has tanked LOL it can't get any better than this.

    Here check out his spammy backlinks;

    www.google.com/adsense/static/en_US/AsktheBuilder.html
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  • Profile picture of the author billnad
    I thought I may as well barrel in here like everyone else. I have no explanation really but I have lost roughly half of my 20,000 visits a day traffic starting yesterday late afternoon.

    My site is 2600 pages of mostly original or high quality and low distributed PLR. The pages are all high quality in my eyes and my pages are highly keyword optimized. Backlinks are spread across all different kinds although I dropped doing any of the low quality kinda spammy stuff like forum profiles and Pligg backlinks around a year ago.

    I never got hit by a panda update, I did get hit by the ads to high (or was it content too low) on the page and my ranks shot right up after I redid my page layout.

    As I have moved towards better quality backlinks and more focussed content I have seen my traffic go up over the last year and especially that last couple months so this has really been a reality check for how I need to do better in the social space as well as looking at my link type diversity.

    Does anyone really think that this change has to do with content or is it all about backlink sources?
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  • Profile picture of the author mrtrance
    So I'm wondering why didn't my clients' sites get hit at all here when I used the same backlink campaigns as I did for my EMD Adsense sites? 1 is for local service niche keywords and the other is general 2 word keywords that is not localized. Those rankings did not move at all, but all my sites took a dive.

    I mean if G was looking at my backlinks then these sites would have been hit as well and not just my own sites. So it may be with something onpage that triggered a drop across all my sites. It's just weird to me that every site gets hit in one big wave unless there is common thing present in all of them.

    What do you guys think?
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  • Profile picture of the author TolyZ
    Honestly I don't know wtf is going on.
    Same link building strategies - but only few sites effected.
    Unique content that passed copyscape, not spunned.

    WTF GOOGLE
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  • Profile picture of the author arv
    Did a query on "search engines" and I don't find G in the top 10. Looks like the algo isn't working the way it is intended to be.
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  • Profile picture of the author Goldenpig2007
    thanks for the update
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  • Profile picture of the author nik0
    Banned
    I did english spun content for my dutch website, so obvious my keywords were dutch inside the Englihs article. My site heavily tanked. I am 100% sure that is the exact reason as Matt showed in his blog as it matches 1 on 1.
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  • Profile picture of the author lovboa
    Banned
    You think we're panicking, imagine what it's like at Google right now.

    "Guys, do a search for 'make money online'. Oh my..What the he11 did we do???"
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  • Profile picture of the author claytonvox
    I read an article today with the theory that those who aren't spending money through Google, will likely to have their sites penalized eventually. Does sound far fetched but is there any truth in it?
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by claytonvox View Post

      I read an article today with the theory that those who aren't spending money through Google, will likely to have their sites penalized eventually. Does sound far fetched but is there any truth in it?
      Doubt it. Look at all the affiliates that were spending money with Adwords a few years back. Google just closed their accounts.

      One tthinkg to keep your eye on, though is at some point the 1st page of google has to become all paid listings. It is probably sooner than people think.
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    • Profile picture of the author mootonandy
      My money sites dont contain spun content or keyword stuff and they have taken a huge dive.
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      • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
        Originally Posted by mootonandy View Post

        My money sites dont contain spun content or keyword stuff and they have taken a huge dive.
        ...but the sites that backlink to you probably do have spun content and have taken a nose dive and you've gone down with them. I'm the in same situation.
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  • Profile picture of the author slix
    No, I didn't spend a dime and my sites are intact.
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  • Profile picture of the author DPM70
    Kinda goes to show how people aren't building REAL businesses. 95% are living off the 'passive income' dream of putting up a few websites with backlinks, gaming the search engines and thinking that's enough. It obviously aint.
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    • Profile picture of the author greatestmj
      Originally Posted by DPM70 View Post

      Kinda goes to show how people aren't building REAL businesses. 95% are living off the 'passive income' dream of putting up a few websites with backlinks, gaming the search engines and thinking that's enough. It obviously aint.
      I have no idea why you people come here and post these rubbish posts. Maybe SOME of us DO HAVE other sources of income as well but that does not mean we sit here and watch one of the source go poof. I don't think anyone here is talking about going bankcrupt etc. So shut up.
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      • Profile picture of the author 4morereferrals
        Originally Posted by greatestmj View Post

        I have no idea why you people come here and post these rubbish posts. Maybe SOME of us DO HAVE other sources of income as well but that does not mean we sit here and watch one of the source go poof. I don't think anyone here is talking about going bankcrupt etc. So shut up.

        Right ... its like - Unless youre building online business' like THEY do - they arent real.

        Always a hoot some of these clowns in here passing their assinine judgements.

        Ive got clients with these make believe online businesses doing $3 - $30 - $300 and as much as $3k per day per website with these "un-real" businesses - who dont have 1 iota of social media BS.

        Ya know its amazing how some businesses make a metric ton o cash - in those fake niches like insurance - and they have no idea how or where to tweet, "Like" or +1 anything ... but those make believe leads keep landing on their pages and calling and filling in lead gen forms. I talk to 100's of agents and brokers across the country - and very very few of them that have tried social media awareness and branding have any traceable ROI that crap. It does work for some - its suited for a lot of verticals - but doesnt do magic trapeeze acts for all.
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  • Profile picture of the author awarum
    SeoMoz is ranking #16 for keyword "dog snuggies"
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    • Profile picture of the author zaco
      Originally Posted by awarum View Post

      SeoMoz is ranking #16 for keyword "dog snuggies"
      They are also ranking #8 for keyword Google snuggies LOL
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      • Profile picture of the author awarum
        Originally Posted by zaco View Post

        They are also ranking #8 for keyword Google snuggies LOL
        Looks like a 301 Redirect
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  • Profile picture of the author atlanta2008
    Let me knock you out of you seats!
    According to my source.. next Algo update will crack on over optimization in a way of having to many high quality back links.
    So if you happen to have high ratio of high quality BL in your portfolio.. sorry it is not going to help you getting out of this dry..
    Almost everyone will be affected.
    The only safe websites for now are those with "under construction" signs, with zero BL.
    Just make sure your page title is in line with what you are trying to rank for.
    Sit tight and watch competition dropping of the top rankings while your empty page rise to the top of the 2nd page.
    That is correct, top of the 2nd page.
    The whole 1st page is now reserved to paid customers.
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    • Profile picture of the author bitriot
      Most of my thin sites got knocked out of the serps. Even good ones - for instance, a 3 page +contact/policy/etc site with over 40 REAL customer reviews.

      My best affiliate site that was doing $300 /mo also got its ass kicked this month.

      That said, my best site of all has seen marginally higher traffic today so we will see if this is a trend or an outlier.


      It's a tough time for those of us whose income relies on SEO lately.
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    • Profile picture of the author footfoot
      Originally Posted by atlanta2008 View Post

      According to my source.. next Algo update will crack on over optimization in a way of having to many high quality back links.
      So if you happen to have high ratio of high quality BL in your portfolio.. sorry it is not going to help you getting out of this dry..
      Great, now I'll have to dig up old Bill's cell number and get my link for "DIY Dog Poop Composter" removed from Microsoft's homepage!
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    • Profile picture of the author Russel Mogul
      Originally Posted by atlanta2008 View Post

      Let me knock you out of you seats!
      According to my source.. next Algo update will crack on over optimization in a way of having to many high quality back links.
      So if you happen to have high ratio of high quality BL in your portfolio.. sorry it is not going to help you getting out of this dry..
      Almost everyone will be affected.
      The only safe websites for now are those with "under construction" signs, with zero BL.
      Just make sure your page title is in line with what you are trying to rank for.
      Sit tight and watch competition dropping of the top rankings while your empty page rise to the top of the 2nd page.
      That is correct, top of the 2nd page.
      The whole 1st page is now reserved to paid customers.
      In a nutshell we are all screwed.
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  • Profile picture of the author footfoot
    Simply discounting links from blog comments, forums/forum profiles, bookmarking sites, article directories would get the job done for google. Instead they have to complicate it up
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  • Profile picture of the author madison75074
    I would not panic too much if your site dropped. The results for a "make money online" search on Google lead me to a blank Blogger page in the page 1 #1 position. Assuming Google would not leave a blank page in a number 1 positon, I have to believe that there will be more movement over the next few days.
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  • Profile picture of the author MarketShare
    About half of my sites have taken a hard hit this week. Hoping that things will settle out in the right direction. Most of the ones hit have been locally optimized sites. I think it's also interesting that I have received about 8 coupons for Google Adwords this week in my email. All good for NEW Adwords accounts.
    Guess they knew my local sites would be page 50 and beyond.
    I really feel frustrated about this update.
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  • Profile picture of the author RayFinckle
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  • Profile picture of the author Vexo
    So i know the update is still busy but if you ask me it is looking more and more like it is going to stay this way or close to it.

    Has anybody tried buying a new domain name and just posting all the old articles on it and remove the old domain ? I remember reading somewhere that someone did this with one of the previous updates and it helped allot.
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