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but tools have a purpose. Shoes look cute. you cant fix a door with your shoe...well not correctly anyway. You cant do home repair with a shoe. but then again, i doubt there's a wrench in the world that makes women's legs look as hot as a pair of heels.

4 inch stelletos can function in many ways Michael - ever had one stuffed up your nose or been hit in the solar plexis with one? LOL.

And guys like women to look sexy -- so "cute" has its purposes, too. PLUS - walking on a narrow 4 inch heel really enhances the balance, which is needed to walk on them at all. And you can do some misc hammering with a heel if you are in a pinch.

Anyway, women with tools may be hot...
But, men with high heels are a turn off.

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nice ones, but have to make sure the misses doesnt see it!!

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I would venture a guess that the women have us beat on shoe spending vs the tools.

You can't look good in tools but you will look good in shoes.. On the other hand, you won't be able to fix things with your shoes, but you can with tools.. So both has its purpose.. Why not put it like this.. Women and tools vs. Men and shoes.. What do you guys things? LOL..

I'd rather have a hammer than high heels any day!

Well despite my penchant for digging in the canyons and climbing the mountains...I kinda like my stelletos when the urge hits to look like a chick again. At my age I can still do that with the best of em so why not strut a little bit?

Vanity....said as if something is wrong with vanity. People who are vain take care of themselves better than those who don't give a rip. All that gut flab is serious unhealthiness going on inside of you. Give my my stelletos (I park them right by my tennies) and my quarter-bounce abs and I'll show you the real meaning of "weapon of mass destruction". Take pity on the poor sot with the hammer in his hand that thinks I'm a patsy because I'm lookin' good in my heels. Hahahahahahahahaha.

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Here in the United States women voters greatly out number men voters. And in recent years there have been several women to choose from to run our country. In a democracy what happens must be blamed mostly on the voters. It's true that women have not always been allowed to vote here. However since they have been allowed to vote, women have chosen men as our leaders.

PS - Democrats are known for being anti-war, however Hillary voted for the war in iraq.

I don't mean for this to sound anti-women. I for one would love to see a woman as President. I'm one who believes that Elizabeth Dole would have come closer to being president than Bob Dole ever did.

Worst of all is narrow-minded sterotypical thinking and judgmentalism.

There are both good and evil men and women. In fact everyone has the capacity to be both. I don't think there are any absolutes - (all good, all bad)

What makes a person evil or good is #1 their mind, #2 their heart, #3 their spirit - in no particular order - i don't see that any of those have a sexual identity, nor does 'the will' which would cause you to act one way or the other.

Not that 'mental illness' is any excuse or justification for doing evil, but I do believe a person must be either mentally ill or just plain evil to be a murderer and to do lots of other crimes. Male or female...

Men look stupid in high heels though.

... yeh and therein lies the rub - (pun intended)

I know you are trying to be funny and I get it - but you have no idea, not being a woman how demeaning that is.

Oh great, all I have to do is be a slut. Doesn't matter if I have any other redeeming qualities.

... I know what you are saying - some PEOPLE would have sex with anything - even someone they hate. They are animals. (pardon me to dogs)

I was always told the fastest way to clear a room of men is to mention 'marriage' -

... but I will tell you a quicker way - say you are abstinent (unless married).

This is a sick fricking world.

I'm retired now - but when I was in business I always had around 50 employees working for me.

I always had around 45 female employees and around 5 male.

The reason? All the male employees wanted to do was stand around loafing and trying to look macho with an attitude and get paid for doing nothing. The only thing they were good for was lifting heavy cases and stuff that were to heavy for the women to lift.

The women were great employees. They would do anything you needed for them to do.

They did their work fast and efficient all the time and were far superior to male employees.

They hardly ever called out from work and the males called out all the time and you never know if they would be there or not.

The female employees were the only ones you could count on being at work.

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It's called a mind and a will. That is what differentiates us from animals (supposedly).

Men do think with their "other brain" (lol)

That doesn't make it right.

You sure like to argue (MM)- at least you have a 2nd hobby (JUST JOKING)

They say we are all female first in the womb, and then some of us go on to 'evolve' into males.

My theory is all the energy used to do that depletes the brain function (the one in your head)

I love men, don't get me wrong - but I will not care about their 'other brain' unless they have a mind and a heart.

So it goes in this order with me.

Face (ok move forward) (not ok bolt)
Presentation (clean, demeanor, etc) (ok move forward) (not ok bolt)
Character (could I believe him) (if not bolt)
Mind (ok stay on) (not ok bolt)
Heart (if present move on) (if not bolt apply virtual stilletto)

In other words in order for any size 'other brain' to work for me there would have to be a mental, spiritual and emotional connection.

if not - well (i bolt) and that is why i am usually alone and would much rather be than to have yet another rotten SOB that brings nothing but chaos and pain.

chime in here with 'somewhere, over the rainbow, someone waits for me'.

Well, yes Paul, I do realize that.

I do however feel that we (our behavior) can be transcended by the 'higher' instincts like hello, reason, patience, discipline, ethics - WILL - ya know, sense and sensibilities.

Nothing will "dictate" to me (pun here) that I cannot overcome, even with great difficulty and sacrifice, and gladly, since I want what I want and I don't take any (more) shallow imitations. (it's called experience and maturity I think they call it).

I think men/women can fly, go through walls, read minds, etc - right now it is on a different 'plain' of EXISTENCE, or hidden, in most cases, however;

...so certainly I believe that if they wanted something more than 'cheap thrills' they can learn to control the "rocket in their pocket" - now that's assuming alot and why I say 'can' and not 'WILL'...

God, I can't believe I am having this conversation. I wasn't always a prude...

hey hey hey - This is starting to get off the subject and get to the usual punching and jabbing. An intelligent debate is where we ought to be able to learn from our differences and maybe we can't agree.

Being transcendental means 1.To go or pass beyond the limits of knowledge. 2.To rise above in excellence or degree. 3. To be surpassing.

I don't see where that means people are stupid, slow, or backwards.

Why are there so many millions of 'accidental' children living with "single parents"? Why are there so many divorces? Why so many families on welfare, starving, etc? It's Dick thinking. It's because there was nothing there but sex in many cases. 'Building your house on the sand' -

It can be all good if you can find someone who wants nothing else, then good for you. Keep it up and see where it gets you.

I don't care if you can agree with my point, and if not it doesn't make you bad or me stupid.

I believe that people should think before they jump, that's all. But let me get out of here in the cave. It's starting to get ugly.

You can't imagine how much better i feel now.

Paul, no I was not referring to you at all in any way, except where I said "Paul,..." (I think you are very intelligent and I pay attention when you say something). blush. You have a way of saying something that makes sense and therefore does not offend, even if you do not always agree with me.

There is someone in the conversation that reminds me of my domineering mother . Only her opinion is valid. If you beg to differ you could be called anything from a Jezabel to a complete degenerate, and then she goes Italian with 'you are a disgrace to the family'. mama mia the fascista.

...so, suffice it to say I am hyper-vigilant with this type of personality. I think my opinion is valid and it is upsetting to be 'called out' for trying to express myself -

- disagree with me? cool - opposites attract - but there is no need for being nasty and condescending.

The forum (OT) is such that there is barely a thread I will participate in anymore, and as the conversation always degenerates when this particular Male Mommy Dearest is in it, I say it every time, do not go there. (then i go); whatever.

Check it out - there is nobody on the planet that appreciates the ALPHA MALE more than I do. I always say these types do not need to ACT LIKE a man. They KNOW they are a man, and they exude strength just by their presence. (opposite of macho. controller and pig).

I am just saying something really fundamental (in my addled female way):

If it is not about love, forget it.

Other than that, I can't be bothered. See, I read somewhere that men see things as one day at a time and women look at the big picture.

So in this context, it rolls down to something that I know sounds ridiculous - (I hear all the men running out of the room now) If I analyze a guy and can't say I would marry him, then I wouldn't consider subjecting myself to any part of him (beyond a platonic friendship).

It's been a long, painful road to get here, but I am glad I have arrived. Not to say being dateless (abstinent) and alone is not painful, but it just doesn't hurt as bad as being played.

Anyone with any of their 5 senses working can tell there is a difference between men and women. It used to be a much different world. Only recently have we had the technology to free us from our need for many of the separations between the sexes that we used to need.

Women until recently have been highly socialized to be absolutely helpless outside of the home. That is changing rapidly. As women are coming into more power in the public sectors, the stats for violent crimes committed by women are rising rapidly.

Where modern society lost touch is that they started to mistake division of labor to mean inadequacies in one gender. Somehow the thought that women were weaker led to the idea they were also less intelligent. Not having equal education for centuries didn't help that idea much. But now that education has equaled out - and women aren't strapped to a kitchen and babies and actually get out of the house, the realization that we can be formidable intellectual powerhouses is finally getting out.

It's actually becoming normal for a woman to be able to do "woman" things and her man is able to do "man" things all day, yet at the dinner table at night they are actually able to talk intelligently without dismissing the intellectual validity of their partner.

One factor that men have misunderstood and makes them feel so superior - is all such a lark. The male brain has a gland that the female lacks. It produces hormones which make it difficult for a man to think logically when in an emotional state. A woman can be in a fit of tears, fear, or in an angry tantrum and still be able to think as clear as she is able when calm. The man views the woman as "losing it" when she, in fact, is not at all lost - just hurt or pissed. She's still got the same amount of logical faculties at work as when she's chilled. Some are more intelligent to begin with than others, but find guys you can't say that about, too. I know guys so severely stupid I can't imagine them doing anything but pulling a plow, too - male organs are no guarantee of intellect.

Men also are also under a false impression that women are not as good at directions as men. It turned out that was more a factor of socialization than of intellect. Women weren't a used to travel as men. She stayed home while he went out to hunt, war, etc - and had to find his way home. Women who travel a lot, though, can tell direction just as well as a man. I am guilty of reverse descrimination in that case. I travel all the time and can find my way around just fine. If I do get off the trail, I don't often ask directions, not because of pride, but because many who give directions shouldn't - they send you to the wrong place. When there's a man in the car I'll hand him a map and I've been known to get unreasonably perturbed if he can't read it correctly.

There will always be biological differences to clog up our rationality, but as long as we realize that the other gender has both extreme stupid members and extreme intelligent members it will take us a long way toward looking at people as individuals and not group them according to gender.

Despite - Women do have sex drive, too - even if it isn't the same as men's and I see nothing degrading about dressing to kill once in awhile. I'm sure I wouldn't want to live in frivalous shoes, but on those warm nights with a great guy, I sure am glad that someone makes them. As long as a guy doesn't see a woman as valuable or interesting only when she looks like she's ready to leap his bones, I really don't see the problem with it.

To get back on topic in the off topic asylum and group therapy session,

female vs. male serial killers.

One point to ponder:

S & M - Sadism vs. Masochism

Somewhere I read that there is only S - Sadism.

We direct this to others as in S or to ourselves as in M.

Just as in the anatomical differences between M & F, men may feel more 'comfortable' directing these emotions/actions outwardly, where women internalize more.

Not that I have stats, but I would guess (whether real or farce) most stories I have watched about killers, there is some history of the killers having been abused physically and mentally.

I have seen both men and women repeat the patterns in their adult life - to feel like dirt and be attracted to people who will abuse them; and they allow it. (I read that is because that is all that they think they deserve, and blame themselves for it)

...OR the victim becomes the abuser. I think this is true of either M or F.

Anybody ever heard the old saying:

Men use women to get sex.

Women use sex to get men.

Very true. CDarklock I seemed to have left that off my list.

Respect is paramount in any relationship on any level.

Right on - the 'getting to know each other' stage in the beginning does set the pattern, and where you can learn a lot about whether or not you BOTH want to move forward, or if by the same token you don't see a future there.

One thing I have learned through all my failed relationships is not to ever 'settle' anymore - it is either there or not there, no matter how you look at it.

I have read stats on interviews with 10,000 guys and the astounding part to me is that THEY agree, having sex too soon will usually always doom any chance of a 'meaningful' relationship.

So if a guy is pushy I know that is all he is about.

(I have never proposed marriage to anyone) However, if they try to force their 'agenda', then I have to explain that I would be interested only in the context of a committed relationship. That is the only way the subject ever comes up. Talk about doomed from off the dime. lol.

"Virtue is its own reward"

a commendable point of view.

no doubt lonely...but commendable.

This is a "Sticky" - "No Win" thread. Readers Beware.
In my opinion, worse than any religious or political conversation.

Everybody sing, We all do know the words to this, right?
"O be careful little mouth what we say".

As time passes and the months/years come and go, what remains is,
the tools, the shoes and the credit card bills. :confused:
:rolleyes:

Everybody, Have a Great day.

Men are from Mars and women are from Venus they say. Both have different virtues.