The Health Care Situation In The U.S. is Badly Broken

by 107 replies
131
I just got off the phone with another medical billing office to make payment arrangements for one of my wife's MANY medical bills and I'm shocked, frustrated and very angry!

First of all, I feel awful for my wife. She's been suffering with 5 bulging discs in her neck and back for 3 years now. She's had two rounds of cortizone injections for each, two in the back, two in the neck, 25 sessions of physical therapy and on and on. Through all of this time she's missed very little work, too. Tough gal.

Yes, we have insurance. Actually, it's good insurance, but the number of bills keep flowing in and the deductible and co-pays have been mounting the past few months to where it's becoming unmanagable.

Recently she had to go to the emergency room 3 times within a month for pain in her chest and they still have no idea what's wrong with her.

I had made payment arrangements on 8 separate bills and nearly had 6 of them paid off. Now the ER bills are flowing in and they're refusing to make payment arrangements on the entire balance, they want a minimum payment for each invoice! We're talking ER, doctor, anesthesiology and anything else that shows up.

They told me that even if I made minimum payments on all of them that they may still choose to send us to collection if they're not paid off in a timely manner!

I'm in disbelief. I've been sending money as promised to every one of these other entities (physical therapy, primary care, MRI company, Urgent care, etc) for several months without missing a single payment, but now it may have all been for nothing.

As if we needed more salt poured in the would, my wife's car threw a rod in the engine on her way to work Monday. Our mechanic buddy said it wasn't worth replacing the engine and that she needs a newer car. So we're off to get her one this afternoon, financed, of course.

We're not destitute. I'm still in rebuilding mode for both my online and offline businesses, but I can usually make quick cash when we need it and between us we have a decent income. Still, like most others, we have our limits and we're really getting stretched thin.

It's beginning to affect my mindset as well. That's NOT good. I'm starting to really need a break and I can't take one. Sucks!

I'm just stunned by the lack of compassion and cooperation shown by most of these medical entities. Especially when we're trying to pay them!

I'll stop whining now. I know that many others have it worse than we do. It just seems wrong that these guys are determined to screw you when you're trying your best to do the right thing.

Oh well. Heavy sigh...

Rant over.
#off topic forum
  • Sorry to hear that Joe. People shouldn't have to go through these situations just because they get sick. My girlfriend has lupus and she has been to the hospital about 7 times in the last year. She has a very good job and excellent insurance but still her bills keep mounting up. She has bill collectors calling her all the time but just doesn't answer them and tries to pay what she can.

    I have been an advocate for a single payer system, a true universal health care system, for decades. That would be better than what we have now imo.
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [3] replies
    • Most things would be better than what we have now.

      A true single payer system could eliminate health insurance companies and Medicaid, too. That's why it's unlikely to happen any time soon.

      To work properly it would have to be run by a govt agency outside the reach of partisan politics (fat chance) and without legacy appointments.

      A year or so ago I proposed closing down hundreds of local post offices and using that real estate to establish low cost medical clinics. Combine that with a single payer system and you'd have a winner. Add a flat tax and eliminate the IRS and life would be better and simpler. Pipe dreams until the public gets fed up enough to demand something be done that makes sense.

      Healthcare-NOW! - Single-Payer
      • [ 2 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply

    • I'm sorry to hear about the health related problems.

      We can and should do better as a nation with one of the major issues in life.

      I'm sure a single payer system would be cheaper for the feds and the average consumer, easier to transition and manage than what we have today.

      The house was gung-ho for a single payer system at the time the ACA was passed but...

      ... to bad we couldn't get more than 45 senators (all from one side of the isle) interested.

      To discontinue the private health care system in this country would take 60 votes in the senate - per current senate rules.

      It could just as easily take only 51 votes with the VPOTUS breaking any ties if the senate rules changed.

      Maybe next time.


      BTW...

      I heard that the ACA allows for the states to set up a single payer system within their state if they so choose.

      But what would happen to the approx. 400K workers of the U.S. private health care industry?

      I guess that number represents only non-MDs.

      How many would we need to help run the new single payer system?
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply

    • I'm sorry to hear about your girlfriend, Tim. I had a neighbor a few years ago that had just been diagnosed with it and was really struggling. I also have an elderly Aunt that's struggled with it for several years.

      I hope your girlfriend is able to find relief to where it's manageable.

      Joe
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
  • I really feel for your wife Joe.
    I had two bulging disks in my lower back that compressed my spinal cord so bad I almost lost the use of my left leg.
    Everything we tried had no effect at all. That includes three epidurals.
    I have a very high tolerance for pain and what I went through had me in tears 24/7. I can't imagine what your wife feels and how she can endure it. Tough woman you have there.
    I finally had a Laminectomy done in 2003 after a putting up with it for a year. Laminectomy Definition - Tests and Procedures - Mayo Clinic
    Except for the summer of 2011 I've been pain free ever since.

    As for the other stuff with the ins. and medical field, it really is about the money with them since the medical field turned into a "for profit" industry.
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • Thanks guys. She's been tough in many ways, but she's suffered a lot, too. She's also put on a lot of weight the past couple years, which isn't helping at all. It concerns me for her overall health, of course, but it also concerns me that if she gets too big I'm not sure how much I'll be able to help her if her condition continues to deteriorate, which is going to happen. I'm partially disabled too.

    The discs are degenerative and she's also been diagnosed with rheumatoid arthritis. Her fingers are already beginning to disfigure. She's only 46, too. I'm not sure how much longer she'll be able to work. I need to bring her home for good.

    First I have to sit down and put a one and two year plan in place that will replace her income, pay down (absolutely necessary) debts and establish online income streams again that will make my income much less dependent on the U.S. economy.

    Anyway, I don't want to get off topic. I just hope that she can hang on awhile longer and that those medical bills don't prevent her from being treated in the future when she needs it again.
    • [1] reply
    • That's what I was diagnosed with degenerative disk disease which caused spinal stenosis. Also had some arthritis in the mix. Best thing I found for the arthritis is organic apple cider vinegar. I heat up about 4 oz. of water and dissolve around a T. of honey in it (to taste). Then I add 12oz. of cold water and 2T. of the ACV. I had rheumatoid arthritis in my thumbs that was so bad I had to use two hands to pick up a coffee cup, no more. I also eat 4 T. of coconut oil a day. I found out it helps your bones absorb calcium and magnesium among other things.
      • [ 2 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
  • Believe it or not, I have the SAME type of problem. I wondered why they didn't just kind of put me in traction, and put things back into place. I had been in utter PAIN for MONTHS and I luckily saw a physical therapist and LUCKED OUT. CAREFUL, I went to a chiropractor years later, because he would do it for free, to see if I could improve things. They got *****FAR***** worse. Luckily, my lumbar fell back into place eventually, and I slept with my neck on a rolled towel to fix the neck area.


    You guys DO know about REFERRED PAIN, RIGHT!?!?!? Referred pain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Basically, outside of a couple paths, the ONLY control/feeling you have, below the skull, is through the SPINAL COLUMN. Feeling pain in your toes, for example, is an illusion. The brain perceives that a pain signal has been received by a nerve that SHOULD terminate in that toe. If you have a spinal misalignment on any access, it could pinch a nerve and make you THINK the pain is somewhere ELSE! A vertebra in the neck can cause etreme pain in the legs, wrists, etc...

    So if she is going for all sorts of phantom pains, STOP!!!!!!! Talk to a good doctor, and tell them about the disk problems. SERIOUSLY! I went in for a wrist problem that became shoulder pain and eventually severe pain in my legs so I was practically immobile, and it was ALL because of the spin problem. Once that was fixed, the other pains disappeared.

    Steve
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • Hi Steve,

      First of all, I'm sorry to hear of your struggles too. I see what my wife goes through some days and I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

      Regarding referred pain, yes, she did mention it. The primary physical therapist that worked on her before she had to have the shots told her about it and was actually able to alleviate much of the pain during their sessions, but it was only for a short time.

      The last pain specialist she saw said that she should try acupuncture for a few sessions and see if that helped at all. I guess it works for some, but not so much for others. The doctor also said that they could do a nerve block as a last resort, but we're really trying to avoid that. She's terrified at the thought of that.

      I'll say this, I care about my wife very much, but I'm just about to be open to anything. These bills are a real setback. Also, she's more moody than ever before. My son and I try to lay low much of the time, but then she gets upset that we're in the other room. I think part of it is her going through menopause, too. Can you say "psycho?" :-)

      Thanks for sharing.
      • [1] reply
  • Banned
    It cost me $1,200 cash for 3 tongue depressors, 5 min. exam. & 3 hours in the waiting room at the ER.

    They did nothing besides paperwork & supplying $0.05 tongue depressors. Told me nothing was wrong with me, eventually I found out I had strep throat. I only went to the ER because my throat felt like it was on fire & nothing was helping, plus it was the weekend, the doctors office is closed Fri, Sat, Sun.

    It's all one scam.
    • [ 3 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • If that is SERIOUSLY all that happened, I would complain. I COULD, after seeing how they may price things, see the tongue depressors costs tens of dollars, so maybe $30 for all three, but $1170 for 5 minutes?

      Regarding the 51/60, I wonder how far you can stretch the DIP! And Mr. TUTL HIMSELF sounds scared. THERE'S a first! I would be clearer and provide a few videos here but, well... BTW The vice president does NOT get a vote unless there is a quorum and 50 people vote. So if 51 people vote, he doesn't get a vote. HECK, if they get 59 votes, and need 60, he can't vote. THAT'S why he DIDN'T!

      Steve
  • Sorry to hear about your problems, Joe. I wish you luck.

    I hear you loud and clear about the healthcare system. Someone I know recently tried to get healthcare through the healthcare.gov site, you know, the so-called Obama-care stuff.

    The lowest priced policy for her was $496 a month. She only makes $916 a month, so it would cost her over half her income. She can't afford that, so she'll have to pay the fine for not having health care.

    Brilliant system that fines poor people for being poor. Like that fine is going to help her or change anything. Someone should be in prison for designing that mess, IMO.
    • [ 4 ] Thanks
    • [3] replies
    • I called my insurance company(one of the biggest) MANY times in the past and basically got the answer "WE DON'T KNOW, CALL LATER"!

      THIS time, they had the AUDACITY to say it was up to my employer to be ACA complaint. I told him ******WRONG******! That is YOUR job as the insurance company!

      He searched and searched and searched! I must have been on the phone for 2 HOURS! He came back and you know what he said?

      1. My plan is CURRENTLY compatible! But the requirements will CHANGE in JULY!
      2. My deductible is currently reasonable. I am paying a bit more to cut it down to half the standard, so it is now about 1 FOURTEENTH the amount it would be on the HC.G website!!!!!!!!!!! But it MAY go up in august!
      3. My plan has to be renewed in august!

      So they told me more than before, but basically said "WE DON'T KNOW! Call back in JULY!"!

      OH YEAH, he said THEY offer better plans than are available on the government websites, at a better price!

      Steve

    • After everything I've heard...

      Its hard to believe a person making only $900 bucks per month wouldn't be eligible for some type of subsidy that would knock the final cost way down.

      Its strange how most of the horror stories from the ads that are being run against the program turn out to be not so bad after all when some reporter starts digging into the person's situation.

      I hope your friend has looked at all her options correctly.
      • [1] reply

    • Thanks Dennis. I posted that this morning after getting off the phone with a medical billing company and went on a bit more of a rant than I would have liked. It's kind of embarrassing, actually. I guess I needed to let off some steam. I appreciate you all being understanding.

      I agree about Obama Care. I think he had good intentions when he campaigned for it, but it was obviously an extremely poorly planned system. I think they'll modify it and it will get better over the next couple years, but even though many people who couldn't get insurance will benefit from it, many more who already had a good plan are now suffering because of it. They need to act fast to get this fixed.
  • It pisses me off every time I hear a politician say: "Every American needs health insurance."

    The only thing that accomplishes is lining the pockets of insurance companies that over-charge and under-pay.

    We don't need insurance.

    We need health care.
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • I think I have ran out of thanks, but that says it ALL!!!!!!

      SIGN UP ON THE SITE? WHY? ALL it does is allow you to not be charged by the IRS!

      SIGN UP FOR A POLICY? HECK, in a very real way, it breaks a lot of laws. They don't tell you what the scope is, for one. There is a panel setup ONLY to determine SCOPE, so you KNOW this won't cover EVERYTHING. ALSO, there are rules concerning when it starts, etc...

      So this whole "I just got healthcare, YEAH" is a bit early. It is like getting a check, and not being able to see the amount. The CHECK doesn't matter. HECK, what you PAID for the check doesn't matter. What matters is how much you have made AFTER IT CLEARS.

      Heck, I got insurance through my employer a bit over a decade ago. I thought it was a nice benefit, but didn't think about it. I was lucky it covered all that it did. I STILL paid plenty though. I hope I will have similar coverage after the end of this year. The deductible has to be below $2000, and it has to have a large network, or large coverage of out of network. And it has to be a reasonable cost.

      And a lot of doctors are quitting, etc.... I hope I can still keep my doctor.

      Steve
  • Apple Cider Vinegar & Coconut Oil are miracle treatments for everything. I use ACV daily for digestive problems. I brush my teeth with C.O!
  • Sorry to hear about everybody's health problems. I'm lucky so far - and grateful.
    I know a lot of people who are not healthy and have pain everyday, or come down
    with every bug that is going around...

    Joe - when I read about your wife's chest pains, I thought dehydration and low magnesium and potassium levels from the other meds and all she's been going
    through. Just my thoughts and I'm not a doc.

    Dan
    • [1] reply
    • Tim - If they do that, can they opt out of the federal plan?

      That might be the road forward - states taking back their power and creating their own plans.
      • [2] replies
  • In one of these threads someone posted a link that said the average country on par with the US society is paying ABOUT $5000 per person, and the US is paying $8000 per person.

    With that being the case why doesn't SOMEONE say "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!!!!!!!! YOU HAVE THE MONEY!!!!!!!! YOU ARE SPENDING THE MONEY!!!!!!! THERE IS A LEAK!!!!!!! FIND IT AND PLUG IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

    I mean NO offense guys but a lot of this stuff DOES come from the US! So WHAT is wrong!?!?!?!? Are duties too high? Are Taxes too high? Are tests too expensive? Is it R&D? I mean GIVE ME A BREAK! If it is shipping, let's ship in bulk from canada! It doesn't cost much there and we could ship in bulk for PENNIES a package! If it is R&D and we order from abroad, WHY are WE getting the worst deal? If THEY are ordering from US, why don't we pass on the cost. AGAIN, a larger number of units means the per unit cost is LOWER! Does canada care if birth control pills go up 1%? Probably NOT! If it drops OUR cost by 20%, WE would be happier!

    But with our government, they NEVER want to reduce costs! OH? There is a leak? Lets just plug it up with MONEY!

    It shouldn't be hard to find the culprits.

    It is NOT solely the insurance. I have seen bills from the HOSPITALS! So it is hospitals, drugs, and doctors. It is NO secret that drugs cost a LOT more in the US. don't know about the hospitals and doctors, but canada and the US could have a 30 minutes talk and EASILY summarize the countries.

    And if it is the doctors, is it education? Licensing? Operating insurance(liabiity/malpractice, etc...)? Lawsuits? AGAIN, the US is KNOWN for LOTS of lawsuits! Audits? Bad hygiene? etc....?

    Think of it! We could CUT our costs 60% on our OLD system and have good healthcare!

    It is IRONIC that we are spending MORE time looking for a PLANE! BTW did YOU know that many are practically SCREAMING that the US take over the search for that plane!

    Steve
  • My heart goes out to everyone going through heath problems on this thread. don't know you guys but wish you best of luck and will be sure to keep you in my prayer's
    • [1] reply
  • a good chiropractor and massage therapist/PT are priceless. It's no fun not being in good health. For someone who posted on a bad exp w/ chiro, there are many good ones. Also accupuncture worked wonders for my fathers shoulder pain.

    The US system needed some changes but now it will be an utter disaster.
  • Joe:

    You should talk to a bankruptcy lawyer....not about filing bankruptcy, but about negotiating a settlement in this case.

    The goal is not to file bankruptcy itself, but to get their attention, and get them to the negotiating table to work things out. And nothing gets their attention quicker than the spectre of getting nothing at all.
  • check in other countries what the medical insurance cost is?

    and good coverage.....

    now you understand why its broken?

    its 50x what it costs in other countries with just as good doctors as in the usa
    • [2] replies
    • ANOTHER reason why we don't have a free market is that NOBODY KNOWS THE PRICE!!!!!! You can't decide where to go to, etc...

      Steve

    • its not real helpful looking at healthcare cost in a vacuum. In exchange for lower health care cost, what are the overall taxes? they can run 60-70% so "healthcare" isn't low cost. it's subsidized.

      American's are free to go to other countries if they love their healthcare systems too.

      People here think single payer nationalized systems of other countries is some utopian dream with no costs no tradeoffs. Don't be so naive.

      There is less incentive for innovation to develop new breakthrough medical devices and treatments.

      It astounds me that entrepreneurs think a total govt controlled system is the answer.

      The govt will soon come out and say....internet marketers are overcharging people. We must have equal access to internet marketing for all people and businesses. We will set internet marketing quotas and prices to reign in these internet fat cat rich people. Watch everyone cry foul then.
      • [ 3 ] Thanks
  • Hey, I was just searching the term "chiropractor" to see what I can find on internet marketing for my business and landed in your thread. I'm sorry to hear your wife is having some back issues Joe. I do highly recommend finding a great chiropractor in your area and seek chiropractic care. I know it will be effective if she is consistent and stick with it.

    It will need to be a combination of pain medications (to keep pain down so she can do therapies), chiropractic (keep disc healthy and prevent further deterioration), medical massage therapy (to work on the muscles... practitioners forget about properly healing the muscles.. but it's ESSENTIAL to reducing pain and long term results), nutritionist (get the weight down) and physical therapist (get her strong and exercising again).

    This is ideally what she would need for the next 4-6 months to get the results you're looking for. Unfortunately, health care is broken and your insurance will not allow all of this "unnecessary" care. However, I do encourage you to find private offices that will work with you w/ your financial situation. Most have an out of pocket fee which can be more cost effective.

    Please do PM me if you have other questions. More than happy to help.

    Good luck.
    • [1] reply
    • Yep, doctors are run by big Phar, company's, which means the most expensive cure they can find! Unfortunately!

      I was in a doctors office, after my Mother fell on the cement, and needed a bandage, (well after her, cancer checkup) and heard two nurses talking about possible treatment for someone. They were trying to figure out the most expensive treatment they could add to chemo,.


      There are some good alternative treatments being offered here, but in all honesty seek out more.

      If Doctors knock someone who offers an alternative treatment to the usual cancer treatments they will usually be silenced before too long, regardless of how safe it is, or how effective.

      Plenty of documented cases of this sort of crap, happening, so best to seek out all treatments with proven positive track records!

      That's insane!

      To get a melanoma removed in Au, is $100 for a 5 or 10 minute operation!


      Shane
      • [1] reply
  • Our health care system is going to be trash until they render it non-profit. Most of the real problems with it involve greed. Hospital moguls, drug company, device manufacturers, etc. are making a killing keeping people on "life long" medication and treatments, many of which they don't need and could be accomplished naturally without side effects. Once the greed is taken out of the system, then, and only then, will we see real health care instead of an out of control malevolent medical industrial complex.
    • [1] reply
    • This reminds me of your argument that the federal reserve must be eliminated in order for America's people to be prosperous again - which ignores the fact that we already were a prosperous nation while the fed has been around.

      The only way to get most of the greed out of the medical system is to have a savvy populace that wants to go with a single payer type of system or to heavily regulate what we already have in place - and the "heavily regulated" option is in the process of happening now.
      • [1] reply
  • Joe, Medical Marijuana is legal in Arizona. I have horrible arthritis, nothing OTC worked. I won't take meds. I stopped smoking and didn't want to smoke the MJ. Here in CO, we have every delivery system you can think of. It was NOT my intention to get stoned. There are many MJ strains that have VERY low THC., I highly recommend trying it.
  • I guess you guys just love the FEDERAL RESERVE! BTW, I saw this and thought of you:

    Real Talk with Julie Borowski: The 6 Rules for Liberty - YouTube
    Steve
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
  • Is the same 'Golden Age' that we lost 93% of the US dollar. Is this the same 'Golden Age' where the Country & The citizen lived on borrowed money to the tone of 43% of every dollar...Where do you think our TRILLIONS of debt came from, even before Obama.. Our balance of trade is embarrassing...WHY would any country want to buy our GMO/HFCS food?
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [2] replies
    • NO! WHERE do you get THAT! GOD NO! Maybe you misread it or something. We didn't lose 93%! It was more like 98%!!!!!!!!!

      The 43% is wrong ALSO, since it doesn't count pensions, Social Security, etc...

      The US is having trouble because CHINA won't buy our GMO produce! CHINA! The SAME country that we accept concentrated whey laced with cadmium, NICKEL, etc... from! The SAME country we accept little kids toys made out of lead from. The SAME country we accept pet food laced with melamine from! But THEY won't accept our GMO produce.

      http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...A3F20P20140416

      Steve
      • [ 1 ] Thanks

    • The American standard of living was still the highest the world had ever known.

      We paid down most of the WW2 debt by 1980 but then we started a new round of debt, taking our national debt from about 300 billion to almost 4 trillion in the 12 years from 1980 to 1992.

      I never said things were/are perfect.
  • STEVE...You are the best!!!
    ----------------------
    TLTheLIBERATORNot difficult when you borrow 43%
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • If you're talking about household debt, what's wrong with 75%-85% of that debt being related to a mortgage and a car?
      • [1] reply
  • Adding a little to what serryjw said. When things go past a certain point, credit will be less likely to be accepted, and your score drops. When that happens, people need something to get them interested in taking a risk. That is generally done here by RAISING THE INTEREST RATE! SO, as you go past a certain point, that we have ALREADY PASSED, it gets harder and harder to borrow and pay off. S&P was one company that downgraded the US, and they are now suing!

    S&P sues US government over alleged retaliation for AAA credit downgrade | Business | theguardian.com

    Steve
    • [1] reply
    • LOL! I remember that. It took a lot of %&*)_ to downgrade the US gov't. After 9-11 the financial institutions were getting worried about too much consumer debt and a shaky economy. So instead of Visa worry about Visa & M/C worry about your payment history from ONLY M/C...it became one for all and all for one. Every financial institution watched to see if ALL your consumer debt was being paid on a monthly bases. Many shyster lawyer advised their clients to rack up huge credit card debt and then declare bankruptcy.
  • BTW a LOT of things happened around that time! Some things got cheaper because there was a worldwide depression. Some people started businesses out of need. There was greater exposure to other countries. Those that WERE working probably made far more because of minimum wages. It apparently started in 1938. At the time, some of the richest people WERE VERY rich. I mean people owning an ENTIRE national industry. It wasn't like today at all, at least not with the companies themselves. Supposedly the earlier tycoons got together and are now secretly running the federal reserve.

    Houses were smaller and, of course, everything cost less earlier on.

    But if we were in the 63-65% range, WHY did people try to upset the apple cart? Not everyone is going to have a home. ESPECIALLY not NOW! A lot of those people have CONDOS. SOME condos are little more than apartments.

    Steve
    • [1] reply
    • You can have condos/co-ops that are as expensive as a single family homes. It is a lifestyle choice.
      My favorite book of all time. The Creature from Jekyll Island.
      The WEALTHY met in Jekyll Island, GA to establish the Federal Reserve....They own us, they own America.
  • Good grief. You can't teach someone economics on a forum. TL is a statist in every form of the word and isn't going to change his mind here. The only thing that can change his mind is some real education and, apparently, he isn't planning on going to University any time in the near future.

    And yes - I said the same thing about the FED as I said about the ACA -- and, sorry to tell you - I have taken my economic courses, I have done decades of research, and I also READ the ACA when it was a 1,200 page bill, and as a former Chief Justice of my college's student gov who is degreed in linguistics, I know exactly HOW to read a bill correctly. They are sinuous at best, every one of them these days.

    So if I'm to care what a statist who never really researched what he is yelling about or read the ACA and understands it wants to fling at me, sorry I don't. I just stand back when chimps fling poop, too. It's all good to me. I'm aware of issues. Throughout history, statists have thought themselves to be the "safe" ones because they support the "authorized" systems. Throughout history, this position has proved to be a dangerous and very mistaken stance.

    Hi ho. And so it goes.
    • [ 1 ] Thanks
    • [4] replies
    • Hey, after the 4th post I am obviously masochistic. ;-)
    • It STILL amazes me how people can even take home money, and pay the bills in this day and age without knowing the basics.

      Gee, if they think money is just free and has intrinsic value, why insist on taxes at all? Just print more money! And why can't I print out a million dollar bill? Don't forget! I am poor ALSO! I don't have a billion dollars.

      But YEAH, money is supposed to be CONTROLLED! THAT is even specified in the constitution! AGAIN in that section apparently so FEW have read, section 8:

      So many of the recently proposed plans VIOLATE that!

      Steve
    • Isn't that Congress's job? ;-) WHERE in the Constitution gives the Federal Reserve that job?
      • [1] reply


    • Sal, I don't think we disagree in what we want for the American people.

      From what I can tell, you have genuine empathy for the everyday American and their struggles and would like a country in which there is minimum of civil liberty violations, plenty of opportunity and financial times are good - much like the 1945 to circa 1990 period in American history.

      IMHO, no one can seriously say that Americans did not have the highest level of prosperity people in any country had ever known.

      IMHO, caring about the lives and standard of living of everyday Americans is a big part of patriotism which you're great at but IMHO,...

      ... you also practice a strange type of patriotism.

      - You seem to not care or understand that this is a country with many types of people in it and hate speech is something that is very counter-productive and not useful.

      Sure, I agree that people can say whatever they want to say and then (this is where I think we part company) ...

      ...IMHO, people also have the right to respond to it in whatever way they want.

      - You support someone who clearly does not believe in the U.S. (Mr. Bundy, Cliven not Ted also I hope).

      - I've heard you express support for things like The Republic Of Missouri which I guess is some form of government akin to the Republic Of Nevada Mr. Bundy referred to.

      IMHO, folks like Mr. Bundy and his supporters practice a very strange type of patriotism.

      I respect your many civil liberty concerns but IMHO, you've taken them to areas that are not conducive with a modern 21st century society.

      I understand your aversion to mandates but sometimes mandates are necessary for the greater good and the founders seemed to agree. (not that they were always right about everything)

      Here are a few examples of early mandates...

      Harvard Law professor says early Congress mandated health insurance for seamen and gun ownership for most men | PolitiFact Rhode Island


      You called me a statist which means...

      statism. the principle or policy of concentrating extensive economic, political, and related controls in the state at the cost of individual liberty. support of or belief in the sovereignty of a state, usually a republic.

      You're entitled to your opinion of me but I believe there should be a balance between the wants and needs of the individual and the community/group and also...

      ... a balance between the states and the U.S. federal government.

      When the U.S. Constitution was ratified most people understood the need for a stronger federal government because the Articles Of Confederation had proven it could not do the job - especially when you have several quarrelling states and regions with different agendas.

      So, it was understood by most that a much stronger Federal government was a necessary evil and of course the SCOTUS is designed as the authority on what is and is not constitutional.

      You said this earlier in this thread...

      "Our healthcare system is going to be trash until they render it non-profit.

      Most of the real problems with it involve greed. Hospital moguls, drug company, device manufacturers, etc. are making a killing keeping people on "life long" medication and treatments, many of which they don't need and could be accomplished naturally without side effects.

      Once the greed is taken out of the system, then, and only then, will we see real health care instead of an out of control malevolent medical industrial complex."

      I say...

      I agree the excessive greed needs to be squeezed out of our medical system.

      And now, I have to ask exactly how would you make our medical system much better than it is now?

      I'd love to know.


      BTW...

      Does it involve getting some entity to "force" drug companies, doctors, device manufacturers etc., to do the right things, stop being so greedy and accept a minimum of profit in the process?
      • [ 1 ] Thanks
      • [2] replies
  • Yeah, I mentioned a LOT about various US regulations. I had one customer that had a team try to do the impossible. Because of the FDA, they needed about 3 times the resources to do a certain task. They had a bug that needed to be fixed, but COULDN'T be! It had to be approved by the FDA! Anyway, that takes too long and is too complicated. That team dida good job,but there is a mechanism to determine when it fails. Computers have no intelligence, so a PERSON has to go through and reprocess things. They hired a new person, primarily for THAT!

    THAT raises the cost of healthcare a bit. OK, some may not pay a penny, and some may pay a bit, but it's an expense.

    I have to use a device every month. ALL such devices are easy to use. They work the same way and, by their NATURE, will be calibrated reasonably. STILL, even ones that are known to be precise, have track records of a decade or more, and are used by hospitals are FORBIDDEN to be used by a patient.

    And I am not even getting into the bans, lawsuits, GAG demands, and tests, that the FDA does or requires. Most actually HURT the public! Banning tryptophan? Making it illegal to say that vitamins prevent and cure diseases they are KNOWN to prevent and cure, preventing competition? Having such a broad reach? INCREDIBLE!

    Steve
  • These health care companies don't care about the people the only care about the money and until that stops the problem will always remain
  • I know this thread is old and I didn't read the entire thread so I don't know if it was mentioned or not.

    My scenario - my identity was stolen and used to the tune of close to $200,000.00,,,,, and I'm 100% disabled.

    What's relevant to the thread is whomever appeared to be buying pills and possibly reselling them, to the tune of about $18,000.00.

    That's medical bills.On my credit record.

    I'm on Medicare.

    It took me about 3 years to learn not to pay someone else to help you get through something like that and about a month to figure it out myself.

    In any event, I'm in the process of closing on the house I'm buying and guess what my mortgage broker told me when he ran my credit?

    I'll paraphrase because his language is colorful not unlike my own.


    "I could give a ham strung dogs hind leg about the medical bills on your credit history. Nobody pays attention to them anyway."

    Since 2009 no one has come after me for the medical bills. No one has tried to sue me.

    I drive a 2013 Impala and am buying a house. With my income and my g/f's who is also disabled, we clear around $3,000 a month.

    On my own I got my credit score from 580 something to 640,,, and the medical bills are still there on my report.

    They'll go away in 7 years from the time they were first reported.

    If they show back up, dispute them and they'll go away. Bill collectors have the nasty habit of selling accounts and trying to relist them. Let them know you'll report them to the proper authorities that they are claiming invalid debt to Transunion etc and it'll stop post haste.

    If [medical] bill collectors are calling you, write them a letter directing them to only contact you by mail. When they send mail to you, file 13 it.

    Keep in mind, you didn't create the problems with our health care industry. Politicians did.

    Not a plug for the site actually but I have to mention it. Credit Kharma dot com is your friend, especially since it's free.

    I dunno what state the OP lives in, hopefully a blue one but there is always disability and Medicaid.

    My g/f has been disabled her entire life and is on Medicaid. In the blue states and a few red states [very few] it's not bad, and it's free. I know Ohio, Kentucky and Florida where I am now Medicaid isn't bad. In Texas, Arkansas, Louisiana and Alabama it's a slow death.

    So far for us, economy wise and all, Florida is our best bet.

    I'm not gonna get into Politics any further than I have on this one post on this forum because I wanna hang around awhile.

    If anyone is a member of Politix, look for Tolpuddle and you'll see why. That would be me.
Join the discussion

Next Topics on Trending Feed

  • 131

    The Health Care Situation In The U.S. is Badly Broken

    I just got off the phone with another medical billing office to make payment arrangements for one of my wife's MANY medical bills and I'm shocked, frustrated and very angry! First of all, I feel awful for my wife. She's been suffering with 5 bulging discs in her neck and back for 3 years now. She's had two rounds of cortizone injections for each, two in the back, two in the neck, 25 sessions of physical therapy and on and on. Through all of this time she's missed very little work, too. Tough gal.