EMDs are a myth

by 45 replies
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Having seen about 1000 top 10 results for kws on google in the Last month, On Market Samurai i can honestly say based on my observations that EMDs mean ZIP NADA NOTHING

I dont care if its EMD.com
I do not think that the kw has to even be in the domain, I think it makes zero difference, and even to have the kw in the url? I think that makes very little difference

Why? first of all how hard is it to go spend 10 dollars and buy an EMD? not very hard
So why should google get all excited and give you a higher search ranking for that? Does not make sense that this would make your site more relevant.

Now in the past perhaps it did but today? I think it makes ZERO difference

I have a site that drives me up the wall in a new niche I am researching
They DOMINATE Google, they must have 1,2 positions for 100s of kws, thats only the ones I have discovered

Its all the same site, same domain name. which has NOTHING to do with the kws I am searching for, There is no way they would be able to put all these kws in the domain name

Why do they rank high? Backlinks

Pure and simple

Even their subpages for kw terms are optimized with anchor text for that phrase, and they are high PR backlinks, and no they do not go to the root , these backlinks are pointed towards the inner pages with THOSE kws on it.
IMO
EMDs make NO DIFFERENCE AT ALL
NONE

Now I am sure some will say, just look at this example look at this example there is an EMD ranking top of the SERPs

sure but
If a guy goes out and buys BigBlueCars.com
He usually ALSO goes and puts 1000 Backlinks (as high PR as possible)
with Big Blue Cars as the anchor text

He is 1000 times more likely to backlink for that term since he bought the EMD
so the reason he is ranking is because of his backlinks, not because of the EMD

In the past, yes I think Google did give a big boost to EMDs
but now I dont think they do at all

Just my 2c
#search engine optimization #emds #myth
  • I hear what you are saying, and I know that they do not have as big of an impact as thay did before. I have, though, had a great deal of experience with both EMD's and non-EMD's, and found ranking much easier with EMD's. Even if it only has a slight difference, that slight difference is worth having a bit of an edge over your competition.
  • Banned
    [DELETED]
    • [2] replies
    • Good point. Though my "IM mind" is programmed to avoid clicking EMD's most of the time. Since I know they're usually just trying to push a product.
    • This is an extreme example, but I would not be clicking on BOTH results.

      Since the past 2 years, whenever I see an EMD in the SERPs I know that 9 out of 10 times it is usually a low grade MFA trying to take advantage of the EMD effect, and a quick mouse-over preview confirms that, 9 out of 10 times.
  • It definitely still does make a difference. I had someone with a EMD website that had only been up for 10 days beat me on a keyword that I had over 20 links showing up in Yahoo Site Explorer for and a page rank of 2.

    The reason EMDs get a rankings boost is so that when people search for a particular website or business name, it comes up high (ideally first) in the search results. For example, if I typed "warrior forum" into Google, I would expect to get the Warrior Forum and not something similar that may have more links or higher page rank.
  • I agree.. If you're product is "weight loss ebook" and your domain name was "ringtone.com", it'll surely put some doubt to the searcher.. Very irrelevant..

    However, if just for adsense, it'll be working... but not when you have products to market as EMD is important on that point.
  • Sure if you had a weight loss kw optimized backlinked page trying to pull up on a
    ringtone.com site , you would get way less clicks

    but thats not what I am talking about
    You guys must be talking about ranking faster or higher on very weak competition kws

    the kws I have been looking at lately the 1,2 site is at least that position on 100 kws
    the kw is not in his domain, and most of the time not in his url either

    why does he rank so high then ? backlinks
    he has like 5k 10k backlinks on his inner pages

    if you actually think a new EMD could outrank the guy, I find that laughable, because there are plenty of those EMDs trying to outrank him and they are maybe position 9
  • Banned
    lol, okay.

    I have a few high volume state insurance keywords (state + insurance.com) that would probably differ with your opinion. No real work and high rankings #1-3 spot normally either above or below the state's official website...

    Aged domain + EMD + good onpage seo + a few links = Kaboom!
  • You guys waste all that time backlinking and buy a site for ONE KW? seems like a waste to me thats all you want to rank for is 1 kw?

    Example this guy that drives me nuts his 1 site, i bet it ranks top 2 for 500 kws
    why? because all the main site backlink authority IMO is somewhat passed down to all his subpages, plus the site age passes, etc

    must be the reason or else how does he rank 1,2 for so many kws? would that be possible if he went out and tried to backlink 500 domains individually? i dont think so
  • I know everyone here believes you can learn SEO from reading these forums but this is proof that it is not true
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
    • [1] reply
    • LOL! How about people who do paid SEO while relying on the WF
      for anything and everything? If only their clients knew. I'm not
      talking about an occasional question or two. Comes with the
      territory. But to keep asking question after crazy question...
      well....and learning on the fly....those people should give
      money back.

      I give the OP a 70-30 on this one. Sometimes there seems to be
      a boost, but it can't just be EMD. There has to be a whole lot
      behind the search data, queries, real life, and other authority sites
      in the niche.

      Case in point: warriorforum.com and digitalpoint. They own
      the niche for internet marketing forums.

      Then you can toss in zillow, kayak, etc., and it seems that the
      big boys looking to make big authoritative sites do not like
      anything close to an EMD.

      Even silly stuff like icanhazcheezburger.

      I certainly believe getting some "keyword" (quotes on purpose)
      in a domain. But it's not required.

      I do believe the insanity of just slapping an EMD site with crap
      is going to be a thing of the past.

      Paul
      • [1] reply
  • Banned
    [DELETED]
    • [1] reply
    • You must have magical sites then
      I never see that
      unless of course the kw is 300 searches a month
      in which case a trained monkey could rank top 3

      also I notice you guys conveniently sidestep one of my main points

      you buy a domain for one kw? obviously that must be the case if you buy an EMD, otherwise why waste the time making your domain say the kw?

      to me that seems like a big waste of time, you have to make 10, 20, 50, 100 sites, to target all your main kws, each site trying to get the EMD which of course its never available, so then you end up with all these terms getting 300 searches per month, which of course the EMD is available but how much money can you make on a term with that low of a monthly search total?

      not much
      • [2] replies
  • Diversification I agree however
    Any site I build has at least 5 main kws I am targeting and I am hoping to get traffic from 100s of more long tails

    I am just telling what I observe
    the one main competitor of mine who drives me nuts, why is it that no EMDs outrank him and his kws are nowhere found in the domain or the url? Because of backlinks

    and these are high monthly search total kws, I am talking 15k, 20k, 25k, not 1k
    and he ranks top 2 on about 500 kws
    and when I say top two I dont mean 1 or 2
    I mean BOTH 1 and 2

    How is that possible with all the EMDs trying to knock him down, ? if EMDs are so effective?
    Because his backlinks kick the crap out of their backlinks

    thats how
  • Banned
    Google: insurance quotes

    Look at number one, then look at #2-5 then get back to me.

    Number of searches a month, a little over 300 a month (135,000) in a crazy hard niche... Certainly doing less to reach that than the billion dollar companies.
  • You guys who say EMDs are so effective, why are you getting so upset?
    if they truly are so effective, and people believe what I am telling them, (that they are not) you should be happy

    that would mean less competition for you
    • [2] replies
    • NO one is upset except you. This is just another whine thread about not ranking. Even those who love EMDs don't believe that buying one ensures you rank.

      and for goodness sake man. If you have so much time to post here at least take the time to remove the lorem ipsum text at the very top of the page you have been trying to rank in your sig for weeks. Its not a ranking factor :rolleyes:
      • [1] reply
    • I think you need to realize that people are peeking out from
      under a rug, giving you a wink, looking around the corner, and
      in a round about way are telling you that you may have a point,
      BUT....there's a tad more to the story.

      The answer about insurance quotes is exactly what I'm referring
      to. What are people going to be really searching for in the real
      world? Insurance quotes? Probably not. I'd vote for people people
      searching for car insurance quotes, life insurance quotes,
      cheap health insurance, etc. And when you do that, you see
      what comes up. The vast majority of searches are not 2 words.
      They are 3-5.

      I'd also say that people would search more for just insurance
      than they would for insurance quotes.

      One major reason why this forum gets threads talking about
      how come they are #1, but getting little or no traffic.

      Paul
  • Well.. if you have EMD.com that is obviously a very good indicator to google that your site is relevant to the keyword, so naturally you will get a slight boost in rankings.

    You say you don think it makes any difference, but i think the truth is a high pr anchor text link will blow any EMD out of the water. If the site is an EMD as well though... well thats an additional bonus.

    I don't think its accurate to say domain names and page url's are irrelevant.
  • Well if you have an EMD, and you are shooting for low competition low monthly search totals kws
    and your competition has no brains and no high PR backlinks, yes you can easily come in and walk all over them

    But what I am saying is, if you have competition without an EMD but
    he has good knowledge of onpage SEO, and high PR backlinking and anchor text, and has been around for awhile

    Your EMD isnt really going to help you much

    Now if you target a kw with 500 exactly monthly searches local
    and the top 3 competition on google has very low backlinks and bad anchor text and bad onpage SEO, sure you can come in and kick some heads, i think the EMD might give you a slight boost..............

    but if you are talking strong competitors with Good solid high PR backlinks, and good anchor text, who have been around for awhile with a decent PR , (5 or higher)
    your EMD wont help you much. Its not magical, I believe if it does help at all , the amount of boost it gives is very low and also depends on the competitors being weak
    Now in the past, Yes I think Google really used to give a lot of boost to EMDs

    The site I had in my sig before was an EMD for a not that highly searched beach resort term

    I think I was 34 for the term with that EMD on Google
    the top 10 all had stronger backlinks and their domain did not contain the kw and their url did not contain the kw

    and that EMD was a .net
    which is pretty strong
    so explain that?

    The top 5 on Google had less than 300 backlinks, and they were not strong backlinks and the sites were only like PR2 sites, and their domain didnt contain one word even of the kww..............they did not even have the kw on the anchor text very much, in fact some of them I doubt had the kw in their anchor text..........yet my EMD was number 34 on Google

    so obviously EMDs are not magical
    • [3] replies
    • Banned
      It says you're not a good seo too.
      • [1] reply
    • Who ever said they were?

      Now I know how the OP of this thread felt

      http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...hey-doing.html

      Oh.....right.... never mind

      anyway I dug around in the forum and this guy ran a thread that proves you are wrong

      http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...es-proves.html



      or is it that you WERE right? or maybe THAT you was wrong three weeks ago? Hard to tell really which one maybe you can figure it out for us. One of you maybe. or maybe both?
      • [ 4 ] Thanks
      • [1] reply
    • Oh, just to enlighten you just a bit, think of it like this. If there are two site exactly the same, with the number of backlinks, keywords, being targeted, anything and everything about the two sites were the same and the only difference is the domain name. The other one has EMD and the other has doesn't even have the keyword they were both targeting in its domain, which one do you think will rank better?

      However, it's not that I'm recommending EMDs because I personally don't prefer them. I just wanted some guys like you to realize that your are getting the misconception here. It's not really that important, but the fact that it somehow has a value, is my point. It's not something like what you've mention on your 1st post that it make NO DIFFERENCE AT ALL.
  • Wow... quite the lively conversation going on here. I'll chime in with what I do with EMDs.

    Lets say in a perfect world bridesmaiddresses.com is available. It gets X amount of searches and is a great kw to target. But I dont want to stop there.

    I would then look to target "strapless bridesmaid dresses" and maybe "short bridesmaid dresses" once my site has gained a little authority. It would then be really easy because the domain has the "main keyword" in it, and the other keywords im targeting are relevant to the main site's topic.

    This is the whole idea behind what I think people want to acheive with niche authority sites.

    Kind of how Pat Flynn did with his security guard training site. Look that up if you want to see some really good kw research and how he targets kws that aren't his domain name.

    I know this isn't on topic but I think EMDs are important and they have their place. Are they necessary, no not always. Everyone's allowed their own opinion based on their findings and their experiences. Not one opinion is wrong or right...
    • [1] reply
    • EMDs being easier to rank, if all other things are equal is not an opinion. There are absolutely valid reasons for not using them. SEO is not one of them.

      By the way, you're spot on in your post. I really don't understand why we're even having this conversation though.
      • [1] reply
  • I believe for aged and regularly updated sites EMD does not matter that much but it sure helps.
  • I've got a .co.uk EMD ranking #1 for a term that sends me 2,500UVs every day. Only backlinking I've done is from my old pr0 blog that I never update, on the same IP. Ie, it's got about 7 worthless backlinks.

    It beats a .gov website, as well as many other established high PR sites going after the same KWs.

    EMDs do work. And don't try and patronise me about 'magic sites', I've been using EMDs to help with rankings for over 6 years.

    EMD + Proper On-Page SEO = Massive advantage over the competition.
  • I remember you PMing me a few weeks ago asking for help on backlinking or building some type of sites..

    Everything your wrote on this thread is a 'theory', and you obviously have never ranked for a decent term if anything at all, so why go out of all your trouble to give out this kind of information?

    EMD's do work, they always will work. Even Matt Cutts said so.

    Again, disappointed with the information being provided at this forum..
    • [1] reply
    • Couldn't agree with you more. Many times I don't blame the marketer/webmaster..if the universe you are comparing to exists within a small subset, that's all you will ever know.

      Now, there are some of us who have more than a "couple" of domains, which over the past 10+ years has made bank based on certain seo principles..domain name being one of them.

      With over 400 domains/sites in my portfolio, I will continue to search out and use EMD's for profit. This isn't theory, but actual practice...
  • EMD's are only one piece of the puzzle.

    An EMD can be very valuable to someone who knows what they're doing. But to a newb who doesn't know what they're doing, it's useless.

    For example, 2 guys win the lottery for a million bucks. Guy #1 invests in real estate, stocks, etc. and becomes more rich in a few years. Guy #2 spends it on drugs, hookers, etc and wonder what the hell happened when he becomes broke. Same principle.

    You base your conclusion that EMD's are a myth using correlation data, but I think you're looking at the wrong ones. Look at the serps for the following terms:

    home security
    cruises
    credit cards
    penny stocks
    cd rates

    The guys with EMD's in those serps know what they're doing. They know an EMD doesn't guarantee top rankings with ****ty SEO. But they know having exact match or keyword in domains is good leverage. Again, it just comes down to how you utilize this ranking factor.

    Also,

    Really? Please show me where I can buy an EMD like homesecurity.com or cdrates.net for 10 bucks?:confused:
    • [ 2 ] Thanks
  • Yeah, EMD's working.

    and it is useful to use some EMD site as a microsite linking to your main site!
  • EMDs give a boost.

    I mean, how can you argue against that.

    But it is kind of tough hunting EMDs that are available. (And the usefulness diminishes in case you decide to make an authority website)


  • #1: Insurance Quotes - Compare Auto Insurance Rates - InsuranceQuotes.com
    #2: Cheap Insurance Quotes & Free Financial Guides

    Done.
  • A correlation analysis from SMX Advanced between Google and Bing earlier this year has shown that just by itself, exact match is remarkably high in correlation to rankings both in Google and Bing. No other on-site/on-page factor they examined even came close.

    I think the question is, with search results in so many sectors becoming so overrun with obviously over-SEO'd, spammy, manipulative and sometimes, downright poor quality exact-match domains, is Google bound to take action?
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  • 53

    EMDs are a myth

    Having seen about 1000 top 10 results for kws on google in the Last month, On Market Samurai i can honestly say based on my observations that EMDs mean ZIP NADA NOTHING I dont care if its EMD.com