[Alaister]

Hi everyone,

From today we have decided to have all of the Warrior Forum moderation done by internal Warrior Forum/Freelancer.com staff. We have had a lot of community moderators over the years. They have done an amazing job of enforcing the forum rules as well as ensuring the forums and marketplaces are safe and valuable for everyone.

I would especially like to thank Paul Myers, and the rest of the community moderation team as they have contributed a huge amount of time and effort to moderate the forums. They have all been a great help to us after Freelancer.com acquired Warrior Forum.

Moving forward we will be revising the forum and marketplace rules and our internal Warrior Forum team will be moderating the forums. We will be posting the new WSO and forum rules shortly.

Our goal moving forward is to be fair and transparent with all decisions we make with the aim of growing the Warrior Forum userbase, ensuring quality in conversation and offers sold in our marketplaces as well as remaining the #1 Internet marketing forum and marketplace in the world. The decisions our staff moderators make are final and we ask the community to respect the decisions and the work that they do to ensure the forum continues to run smoothly and be a valuable place for everyone. We won't be dealing with support issues via the forums but will be more than happy to address all issues in our Support Desk.

[pearsonbrown]

It would have taken you very little extra effort to send PMs to the mods involved. I found out this morning when I couldn't use my mod tools. Some of us have been doing this for several years on an unpaid basis.

I didn't expect thanks, just common courtesy.

[Alaister]

Originally Posted by pearsonbrown

It would have taken you very little extra effort to send PMs to the mods involved. I found out this morning when I couldn't use my mod tools. Some of us have been doing this for several years on an unpaid basis.

I didn't expect thanks, just common courtesy.

Sorry about not sending the message before you read this. We've sent emails and PMs to basically all the community moderators. I've sent you a message now.

[Martin Avis]

Alaister ... since Freelancer has decided that it no longer needs the services of volunteer moderators who have put in years of good, if unrewarded, service to the WF, can we assume that you no longer require member moderation either?

[michaeloslier]

I think this place needs some fresh blood anyway.
I'm looking forward to the new rules.

[Kay King]

Sorry about not sending the message before you read this. We've sent emails and PMs to basically all the community moderators.

I find that shocking and a total lack of professional courtesy. What possible rush was there to excuse rudeness to people who have dedicated time and effort on this forum for years?

As for member moderators, I'm done with it myself. My efforts were to help volunteer mods I respected keep this place cleaned up. I'll let paid mods be the forum police now. I'm sure they can handle it without my help.

kay

[Khemosabi]

Originally Posted by Kay King

I find that shocking and a total lack of professional courtesy. What possible rush was there to excuse rudeness to people who have dedicated time and effort on this forum for years?

As for member moderators, I'm done with it myself. My efforts were to help volunteer mods I respected keep this place cleaned up. I'll let paid mods be the forum police now. I'm sure they can handle it without my help.

kay

Dang it Kay.. I'm out of thanks.

Thank you. It's a shame that the people who have made this forum the quality forum that it was are being chased away.

~ Theresa

[joseph7384]

Originally Posted by Alaister

Sorry about not sending the message before you read this. We've sent emails and PMs to basically all the community moderators. I've sent you a message now.

I'm sure sending a message after the fact will boost his sense of accomplishment!

[Karen Blundell]

well, I'm not surprised - nor am I impressed - this is just another nail in this forum\s coffin, in my opinion.

I just want to say thanks to all the previous Mods, you guys rock and deserve much kudos!

[Mike Anthony]

I think most people could see this coming when the Australian positions were advertised. Still some people have served for a long time and have done the community a great service (some not so much). Might I suggest that particularly those that have served a longtime be given a designation by their username and special considerations such as discounts or free access to paid areas?

There must be a way to show continuing appreciation for this service going forward. Could we work on that rather than on the issue of their being let go which again I think many should have seen coming and at least in some cases does have benefit.

[godoveryou]

Oh, bad move.... I understand the logic but can tell you don't see its obvious flaw.

Good luck, you've just devalued your asset. I hope your accounting dept. has a handle on how to properly allocate the accumulated depreciation of a digital asset.

[serpyre]

Well done WarriorForum, removes the service provider conflict of interest that's endemic all the community moderated forums - nice to see you're the first to bring it inhouse. Now just need to bring back the paid subscription model which will add further quality to the site.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by godoveryou

Oh, bad move.... I understand the logic but can tell you don't see its obvious flaw.

Good luck, you've just devalued your asset. I hope your accounting dept. has a handle on how to properly allocate the accumulated depreciation of a digital asset.

Disagree my man. changing mods is their right and to be honest theres just too much hostility between the old guard and the new owners. I am surprised this didn't happen earlier although I am by no means claiming all Mods or even most were not on the new team.

Only issue I see is honoring the work done by the old mods. Replacing them is their call and completely within their rights to make.

[HeySal]

Funny, Mike. I didn't see anyone saying it wasn't their "right".

I'm sad about this. WF used to have a lot of class. I see that quality in rapid deterioration. I can't imagine Allen having ever treated his staff, paid or unpaid, with such disrespect as not sending notification well before making a public dismissal announcement.

But then, the old forum was a community. We made friends and business associates here. Services were offered, but we were never spammed daily about them in our email boxes. We were considered smart enough to know what services we wanted and that they were there when we wanted them. The money mill mentality has been taking hold over time, though.

The old community is dying off. Many of us are trying to ignore the changes by hunkering down in the OT forum, I'm seeing a real drop in participation there, too, of the people I look forward to chatting with when I come in here. It's really sad after decades of developing a community to see it on its way out. Like it or not, this place is changing. We either just ignore it or find another community that we're more comfortable with.

[MikeTucker]

I have been attempting to judge the new ownership slowly.
The loud images, the illogical messiness of the rearranged forums,
and the sudden influx of successful Blue Fart marketers in every
part of the forum rather than localized in only their spammy areas.

I've come to the conclusion that I'm very thankful to you for
making this place feel more like Digital Point and Black Hat World...
It's always a pleasure to watch people purchase silly old stone buildings
and gut them, flipping them into a Sarasota McMansion for fun and profit!

The pretty (substance-less) words are always my favorite parts:

Originally Posted by Alaister

Our goal moving forward is to be fair and transparent with all decisions we make

Originally Posted by Alaister

The decisions our staff moderators make are final

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by HeySal

I'm sad about this. WF used to have a lot of class. I see that quality in rapid deterioration.

Funny sal. I haven't detected that quality in WSOs for years. Whose watch that happened under the evil Freelancers?

I can't imagine Allen having ever treated his staff, paid or unpaid, with such disrespect as not sending notification well before making a public dismissal announcement.

No people just got booted and banned with threads locked for making the wrong observations . Still I would say thats shoddy but that Alaister has said he did email them. Perhaps thats not true and its not in their email box but the usual crowd always knows whatever he says isn't true before they even know for sure. Meanwhile allen is gone. he sold out What does he have to do with anything?

Have you considered the possibility that just maybe if there is bad blood its the group you are a part of that helped to create that with all the "allen this" and it was all roses and peaches until the day the rebel forces and darth Vader took over fantasy talk? To hear you talk its like WF was just this wonderful place that all people of the world came to be blessed and make money while hula girls (or guys) danced in the background not the one that has a pretty bad reputation on the rest of the net earned a LOOOOONG time ago..

The money mill mentality has been taking hold over time, though.

Pure nonsense to put that at the feet of Alaister and freelancer Sal. like it just happened this year. The money mill started taking over the day it was decided anybody could post just about anything for a War room membership and $20 and then $40. Who did that Alaister? or Allen?

Many of us are trying to ignore the changes by hunkering down in the OT forum, I'm seeing a real drop in participation there, too,

Ecstatic to hear. the last time I was in there I read a whole lot of racist stuff and then got a PM that my objections to the racism had earned me a threat of being banned from there (cue the excuses including my objections to racism were not genteel enough).

Once again I am not for the Mods not being notified if they were not and I have suggested a constructive way to honor them but as your post proves the attitude against new ownership goes way beyond that and a lot of it is just about cronyism.

[Icematikx]

Still seems a bit low from any end of the spectrum. Regardless of whether it's their asset - the mods should have been part of that asset. Some moderators take their positions seriously, as a way of contributing to the community. It's like being slapped by Penguin. You wake up one day and find out you've lost a thing you care about.

I've never had a problem with Friedman or Yukon (didn't even know Yukon was a mod!!) - so that goes to show how intouch they were. If WF turns into a nazi-hole, traffic will decline I'm sure. Part of the fun is that the SEO forum is full of crap in between some decent advice. Every thread spurs a Mike Anthony American superiority contest - but that's what makes WF, right?

We'll see.

[Paul Myers]

Mike,

You're talking stuff you don't know about except from second-hand accounts. Yes, there were some very strong policy disagreements. There was not, as far as I know, personal hostility.

No people just got booted and banned with threads locked for making the wrong observations.

Oh, stop. You got a time-out or two for being a dick. Just like a bunch of other people. And just like you're doing now, if in a slightly less obnoxious tone.

There are less than 3 dozen people on the planet who actually have the experience to comment on the things you're alleging happened between the old guard and the new management. You are not one of them.

Repetition of unsubstantiated crap is probably more responsible for the "reputation" you claim than any actual issues. That's not to suggest that problems have never existed, of course. It simply means that they were never what you make them out to have been.

Here's something for you to consider: Anyone who makes a conscious effort to manipulate SERPs is, by definition, a scammer. They may be playing by the "rules," but that doesn't make their work any less deceptive.

Your entire profession is, by its very nature, a con game played on the public through Google's algorithms.

Mote. Timber. Your stone to throw?

Freelancer owns the place. They get to make the rules.


Paul

[nik0]

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Oh, stop. You got a time-out or two for being a dick

Couldn't have said it better

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Here's something for you to consider: Anyone who makes a conscious effort to manipulate SERPs is, by definition, a scammer. They may be playing by the "rules," but that doesn't make their work any less deceptive.

Your entire profession is, by its very nature, a con game played on the public through Google's algorithms.

Lol, what, where?

SEO as a service is a scam? I think most of us explain pretty decently about what we have to offer, and then it's up to the customer whether THEY want to "scam/con" Google.

Everyone has their own responsibilities and it would be very ignorant of people not to be aware that there are some risks attached to it. Sure we can yell best quality service, Google safe, blablabla, but the main point is that Google don't want us to build any links so whatever we yell should be taken with a grain of salt.

Funny you pick SEO as an example, obvious cause this post is aimed at Mike, but what about all these other threads that make you $10k in 30 days, imo that looks much more like a scam as 99.99 percent of people will never achieve that. Sure you're not in charge of such things and not happy with it either but when we call out scams there are some real scams on this forum, and PLENTY of them.

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by HeySal

The old community is dying off. Many of us are trying to ignore the changes by hunkering down in the OT forum, I'm seeing a real drop in participation there, too, of the people I look forward to chatting with when I come in here. It's really sad after decades of developing a community to see it on its way out. Like it or not, this place is changing. We either just ignore it or find another community that we're more comfortable with.

Indeed. The word community really doesn't apply much anymore. Entire forums filled with cookie stuffers, link droppers, and people who barely know a word of English, much less any real information on the topic they're spouting off about. It's like an invasion of bots, only their conversation is just barely intelligible enough that you can't report it. There is no engagement, no great conversations, no humor and camaraderie that existed here for a long time. The "improvements" aren't much of an improvement ... riddled with bugs and barely functional, completely borked up search function, but the worst part is not what they've done to the commercial sections ... it's the destruction of the community. That's Growth Hacking for ya baby ... blind acquisition of the most undesirable members a forum can have just to bolster the membership numbers. Yeah, that makes sense.

Yeah, I get it. Freelancer doesn't make any money on community and great conversations ... they think. But it is the successful, intelligent people who participated in the community that made the commercial sections worth visiting and buying, and who had intelligent advice for all the others who were trying to make it online. For the most part, that's gone. Try asking advice of these new little botlets and what do you get? Me use "xxxxx" (drop spam link here) ... it's really great.

[lgibbon]

Originally Posted by Alaister

with the aim of growing the Warrior Forum userbase, ensuring quality in conversation

Looking forward to that then.
Be sure to let us know when that's scheduled to start.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

.Oh, stop. You got a time-out or two for being a dick. Just like a bunch of other people. And just like you're doing now, if in a slightly less obnoxious tone.

Paul name the time and place if you want to debate me on it. this is hardly the spot. Meanwhile thank you for unmasking what you mean by people being a dick - because what I am doing now is having a different point of view than you and supporting the new ownership. I mean the people sniping at Alaister and ownership in here aren't dicks right? peachy self serving definition but you always could do a mean spin to get the morality out to where you wanted it to go..

As for things you don't know - nope never was banned or given time out. Get your facts straight before you claim others don't have them. I was told not to go to a section after disagreeing with a discussion of your cohorts to the tune of "why do only african Americans riot". Take that as badge of honor to this day. In that context I suppose not being a racist was being a "dick".

There are less than 3 dozen people on the planet who actually have the experience to comment on the things you're alleging happened between the old guard and the new management. You are not one of them.

Sorry that won't work and frankly is ridiculous. I am not alleging anything that is not a fact. I never said you couldn't spin it though. Those 3 dozen people have posted too often in public to claim their present stances toward new management is a secret . Try something logical..

Here's something for you to consider: Anyone who makes a conscious effort to manipulate SERPs is, by definition, a scammer. They may be playing by the "rules," but that doesn't make their work any less deceptive.

Yes Paul All SEOs are scammers since all SEOs try to ahem "manipulate serps" . Something about a pot and kettle come to mind. I wonder why?

Your entire profession is, by its very nature, a con game played on the public through Google's algorithms.

ROFL...that s the funniest thing I have possible ever read on WF!! (also shows how you have completely insulated your mind against outside views of WF) My entire profession as a SEO is by its very nature a con game and you presided over the WSO section even deleting criticism of some of the more questionable - well what some not so insulated in thought as yourself - would in fact call real cons? You are like a man living in a glass house whose convinced himself by repetition of his admonishments that its made of concrete.

Oh my......WF comedy at its finest. I've never been happier at the management change. I doubt they would ever be so incoherent in their emotional accusations. SO far I haven't seen them make any of those anyway. Very graceful under fire.

Meanwhile we might want to stick to the subject of this thread than terribly feeble attempts to attack all SEOs to try to get to me because you are affronted that anyone would defend ownership. I dunno.....The new mods might not find it on topic.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by nik0

Funny you pick SEO as an example, obvious cause this post is aimed at Mike, but what about all these other threads that make you $10k in 30 days,

Haven't you figured it out? Those are not as deceptive and scammy (Google being their higher power eeerrr FTC not so much) . One wonders why someone would not on ethical grounds withdraw themselves from what they consider to be INHERENTLY scam related services all these years given the company they work for makes money off of offering SEO services and has an entire SEO section.

Not enough moral resolve to quit?

Anyway I have confidence new management can be more morally coherent and not make terribly sweeping generalizations based on emotion rather than logic..

[SteveJohnson]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

...Anyway I have confidence new management can be more morally coherent and not make terribly sweeping generalizations based on emotion rather than logic..

It would appear, from the tone and content of your posts in this thread, that you are doing exactly what you condemn. It is patently obvious that you have personal issues with Paul and maybe some of the other former WF mods and are hoping that the new owners right the wrongs you think you've suffered.

You've aligned yourself with the new guard, and that's fine. They own the place. But given the new direction the WF in general is headed, you may have strapped yourself to a slowly sinking ship.

[Kay King]

the funniest thing I have possible ever read on WF

I see a couple people staying out of the "new mod" conversations - their way of being huffy and self righteous. And then there will be a few looking for one last opportunity to claim they've been treated unfairly. Some nurse their resentment like it was a golden nugget to pull out and admire on a regular basis.

Look at the bright side - there's new management that might show more patience for your rants. There's a flood of newbies to buy your stuff. It's all good.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by SteveJohnson

It would appear, from the tone and content of your posts in this thread, that you are doing exactly what you condemn. It is patently obvious that you have personal issues with Paul and maybe some of the other former WF mods and are hoping that the new owners right the wrongs you think you've suffered.

Your bias is showing but its not surprising. I expect to take the heat (if I even call it that) from all you guys by not torching new ownership. Paul made a very personal attack even going waaaay off topic to claim my entire profession is a scam and everyone in it is dishonest (him as well he seems oblivious because he's been part of a forum that takes money from promoting it). Why in this thread? simple and obvious - because I support ownership and think they should be given a chance.

I could reel attacks against ownership and he'd probably be giving me thanks or at the least have no issue. If you call me responding to that personal attack as me doing what I condemn then you are clueless as to what I condemn and I can safely dismiss your assessment. I've never advocated someone not answering a personal attack. Claiming I shouldn't and am violating some ethos by doing so is just more of this cronyism and good old buy network I referred to.

You've aligned yourself with the new guard, and that's fine. They own the place. But given the new direction the WF in general is headed, you may have strapped yourself to a slowly sinking ship.

The point at which people become cheer leaders and gleeful prophets of doom for the failure of the forum rather than trying to find constructive ways forward sorry - is the time they should just step off the ship. Respect the ownership of the site you are on. Thats a simple point of manners I was raised with

I have seen alaister reach out , reverse previous decisions where he could and ask for suggestions almost non stop. This idea that all was well and the direction of the forum was all great before it s just total and absolute malarkey.

So aligning myself with WF as it now exists is the new sin? Sheesh you guys are in deep aren't you? who has the blow torch next. My flame retardant suit is working pretty well.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by Kay King

Look at the bright side - there's new management that might show more patience for your rants.

Even brighter prospects of sunshine Kay. They may lose patience with all your whining against them on their own property especially since Paul has reminded them of what a small group relative to the whole forum you are

There's a flood of newbies to buy your stuff. It's all good.

why wouldn't it be? Marketing forum - remember?

[SteveJohnson]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

...Still some people have served for a long time and have done the community a great service (some not so much)...

...rather than on the issue of their being let go which again I think many should have seen coming and at least in some cases does have benefit.

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Your bias is showing but its not surprising. I expect to take the heat (if I even call it that) from all you guys by not torching new ownership. Paul made a very personal attack even going waaaay off topic to claim my entire profession is a scam and everyone in it is dishonest (him as well he seems oblivious because he's been part of a forum that takes money from promoting it). Why in this thread? simple and obvious - because I support ownership and think they should be given a chance.

I'm not biased, just observational. I observed that your posts display a degree of animosity toward the old mods, illustrated by the bold text in your initial post in this thread, and continuing on in others.

BTW, a lot of people think the SEO 'profession' is littered with scammers. Whether you fit the shoe or not, I have no idea. Nor do I care. You do seem awfully defensive about it, though.

... If you call me responding to that personal attack as me doing what I condemn then you are clueless as to what I condemn and I can safely dismiss your assessment. I've never advocated someone not answering a personal attack. Claiming I shouldn't and am violating some ethos by doing so is just more of this cronyism and good old buy network I referred to.

Didn't say you shouldn't respond to a personal attack if you think you ought to. But as I pointed out above, your posts before Paul posted pretty much made your animosity obvious. Animosity is emotional, not logical.

The point at which people become cheer leaders and gleeful prophets of doom for the failure of the forum rather than trying to find constructive ways forward sorry - is the time they should just step off the ship. Respect the ownership of the site you are on. Thats a simple point of manners I was raised with.

It's not our job any longer to 'find constructive ways forward'. The new ownership has made that pretty obvious.

I have seen alaister reach out , reverse previous decisions where he could and ask for suggestions almost non stop. This idea that all was well and the direction of the forum was all great before it s just total and absolute malarkey.

I, for one, never said it was 'great' before, but it has obviously taken a turn toward becoming an incarnation of DigitalPoint. If you are happy with that and want to cheer it on, knock yourself out.

So aligning myself with WF as it now exists is the new sin? Sheesh you guys are in deep aren't you? who has the blow torch next. My flame retardant suit is working pretty well.

Your posts remind me of a trod-upon corporate toady gloating because a new faction has taken over and is stamping out remnants of the old.

Kind of funny, really.

[Colin Palfrey]

I went to moderate the competition section, couldn't find the controls, then found this post while searching for answers. Sigh. Just...sigh.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by SteveJohnson

I'm not biased, just observational. I observed that your posts display a degree of animosity toward the old mods, illustrated by the bold text in your initial post in this thread,

I could and probably would respond more to your post but gratefully I don't need to. Anyone can scroll up and see my initial post in this thread was a suggestion to give the old mods a designation of honor and special perks. the fact that I don't think all the mods did the same level of a job changes that how? and where does the requirement that all in any endeavor perform at the same level come from? fantasy land? . Having started off with a straight up and up bare face lie you've discredited yourself and proven your bias. thanks for the time saver. Like they say never bury your lead and you did it well.

So far the only constructive thing offered in this thread has been my suggestion to give the old mods a designation and some perks to show appreciation. The rest of you are just whining as you have in almost all other threads like this.

all this stumping the ground and crying because someone else bought your playground and makes the rules is just childish so I don't need to respond to much more. You've lost your power/influence and that is what most of this griping separate from the notification issue (the ONLY real issue) is about.

[rhinocl]

There seem to be a lot of changes happening that real have no benefit for either Freelancer or the forum members. Perhaps Alastair feels the need to impress a superior. However it is very difficult with a forum that has been up as long as this one and as successfull as this one to have even 50% of changes have a positive effect after you analyze them. This is just one more thing that might have been better left alone. The old moderators knew the subject matter and the users and the difference in culture between e.g. the copywriting forum and the main forum. The new ones won't. It would have been better to phase this in gradually.

The domain marketplace is a perfect example of something that was introduced with way too little planning and testing. Please slow down on making changes. If there isn't a strong reason to change something then it is better left alone--just ask Coca Cola.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by SteveJohnson

BTW, a lot of people think the SEO 'profession' is littered with scammers. Whether you fit the shoe or not, I have no idea. Nor do I care. You do seem awfully defensive about it, though.

LOl...I missed this before. You and Paul are vying for the crown. Nothing more entertaining than an internet marketer claiming another profession is thought to be littered with scammers.

You all have a good time. You certainly have given me a good laugh today.

[Paul Myers]

Mike,

the people sniping at Alaister and ownership in here aren't dicks right?

Some of them probably are. I haven't seen any of the "old" mods sniping in a personal fashion. (Usual caveat: It could have happened without me seeing it. But it would surprise me.)

Being a dick is a matter of style, by the way. Has nothing to do with morality. It's also not against the rules.

nope never was banned or given time out.

I sit corrected.

Sounded like that was what you were saying earlier. If you were talking about others you felt were "booted or banned" improperly, that's a whole different discussion.

you are affronted that anyone would defend ownership

I don't know where you get that idea. Seriously. No-one would be happier than me to see them succeed wildly here. I've done what little I can to help them in that direction.

Disagreeing over policy is not the same thing as wishing them to fail.

even deleting criticism of some of the more questionable - well what some not so insulated in thought as yourself - would in fact call real cons

The rules for commenting on offers are pretty clear. If you take a look through the WSO section, you'll find rather a lot of criticisms that remained untouched. The overwhelming majority of threads that are approved never see a moderator's involvement beyond that.

I never had anything to do with approving paid ads here. That said, no-one has spent more time and energy hunting down scammers and trolls in the paid ad sections than I have.

I've lobbied for years, publicly and privately, to get promises of specific results prohibited from any of the ad sections. That was the one of the first suggestions I made to Alaister, and I think that would have ended a huge chunk of the offers most commonly objected to.

Not enough moral resolve to quit?

That's one way to look at it. Another is that one could choose to stick with it and do what they could in an active way, rather than just letting it all go to hell or leaving it on someone else's shoulders.

A matter of one's perspective, I think. I went with the one I believed would be most constructive. The fact that you can't do everything doesn't mean you shouldn't do something.

I should clarify one point. I believe off-page SEO is deceptive. My opinions, however, have never been the basis for policy here. And I'm quite aware of the arguments on the other side. I can see a rational person choosing them. That doesn't mean I think it's the right choice, but I can understand it.

By the way... I like your suggestion about a "meet and greet" thread or event to get to know the new mods. The ones I've had the pleasure of interacting with are impressive people. I think you'd like them.


Paul

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

So aligning myself with WF as it now exists is the new sin?

Not at all. I do hope that WF isn't your main source of income though, because when the death rattle comes and it's redirected to freelancer, those who pinned their fortunes solely here are in trouble.

[abdul786]

Surprised. I thought the basic rule was to keep the things intact with the business which made it a success.

I'm afraid the things which made this place "Warrior Forum" are disappearing too quick.

Well, the community-to-marketplace transition is underway.

Abdul

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

That's one way to look at it. Another is that one could choose to stick with it and do what they could in an active way, rather than just letting it all go to hell or leaving it on someone else's shoulders.
Paul

Actually among the offered options its the only one that makes any sense whatsoever. to claim that you oversaw, grew , promoted and sought to cause to strive an establishment that foisted scams (your definition of SEo) on the public just to take the load off someone elses shoulder or improve anything is morally incoherent. WF was probably the number one place to promote, announce and sell link spam tools (which I railed against before this board ever banned it) and SEO was a major part of this board for many years you presided over it. That just makes your argument even weaker. So you were actively engaged in foisting a scam (by your definition of SEO) on the public.

I know you love to pontificate but i think you are just better off admitting you went to the totally off topic subject of SEo (in a thread that had no mention of it) for no other purpose than to launch an ad hom scammer claim against me because you didn't like my point of view. At least be honest because thats obvious.

In a thread implying all kinds of things against Ownership that the only one you bothered to classify as a dick and involved in a profession that was inherently a scam was the one person who disagreed with your friends assessment makes things rather clear Paul. or let me guess your friends putdowns of ownership were stylistically better than my defense of ownership? Will that be the narrative?

You can try and smooth it out after the fact but as they say...you can fool some of the people some of the time and....well you know the saying.

Meanwhile congrats on the extra free time. Seriously I've done a little moderation on other boards much smaller and it IS a drain.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

Not at all. I do hope that WF isn't your main source of income though, because when the death rattle comes and it's redirected to freelancer, those who pinned their fortunes solely here are in trouble.

Thanks for your concern Susan but in case you didn't know the better SEO clients do not darken the doors of WF. What you see in my sig is my WF facing business which I keep separate from mainline SEO. Out in the rest of the world it actually reflects badly if you even mention here (thats why it was sooo funny to read two posters TRY to accuse the entire SEO industry).

Still if all a number of you are going to do is express hopes/project certainties of how you think the place will flop Why pin even your free time here anymore much less advertise services?

Flee the wrath to come from now. Since Steve claims its no longer your job to forge a way forward then perhaps get out of the way lest it fall faster than you thought.

[SteveJohnson]

Wow. Somebody really frosted your cookies somewhere up the line, didn't they? Your resemblance to the southern end of a northbound horse is unreal.

[Kay King]

Her name is Suzanne - I think you know that.

I've heard only good things about the new mods (and I heard those compliments from the 'previous' mods).

I think it was awkward and heavy handed to make this announcement before all the volunteer mods had been notified...and I still think that.

Only one person has felt compelled to post almost a dozen times in order to be as rude as possible to as many people as possible.

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Thanks for your concern Susan but in case you didn't know the better SEO clients do not darken the doors of WF. What you see in my sig is my WF facing business which I keep separate from mainline SEO. Out in the rest of the world it actually reflects badly if you even mention here (thats why it was sooo funny to read two posters TRY to accuse the entire SEO industry).

Well, good for you then. Glad you have that covered.

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Still if all a number of you are going to do is express hopes/project certainties of how you think the place will flop Why pin even your free time here anymore much less advertise services?

Flee the wrath to come from now. Since Steve claims its no longer your job to forge a way forward then perhaps get out of the way lest it fall faster than you thought.

Because I tend to do pretty much whatever I want to with my spare time. I have friends here in Off Topic that I really enjoy exchanging friendly barbs with on the latest conspiracy theories and ebola and other breaking news and veiled references to politics. So ... if it's ok with you ... and even if it's not, I'll continue to do as I wish. Thanks for asking though.

But, like you, I have moved copies of my sales offers elsewhere and should the ones here in the WF not return their listing fee, I'll discontinue them.

PS: As Kay referenced, my name is Suzanne. It's written under my user name and has been for years.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by Kay King

Only one person has felt compelled to post almost a dozen times in order to be as rude as possible to as many people as possible.

Lets see Kay... You have 6 people attacking you more than once because of your point of view and you reply to them ....hmmm yeah you could go 12 easy. Do the maths. Multiplication thingy. I like the english redfiinitions too. I get called a dick and a scammer and I am the one being rude. Who knew? OT forum new English I guess.

BTW So I wrote Susan. Thats the best you have got?. Why? is Susan now a pejorative?

What did Susans of the world do now?

Originally Posted by SteveJohnson

Your resemblance to the southern end of a northbound horse is unreal.

Steve I thought of explaining how that comment might not speak well for your intellectual capacities of creative speech but I realized you probably wouldn't understand it. so carry on.

aaaaand on that high point of cognitive prowess I'll call it a wrap. Its been real...

until the next whine fest

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by Kay King

I've heard only good things about the new mods (and I heard those compliments from the 'previous' mods).

I've heard the same thing and this thread isn't a reflection on the new mods. It's a reflection of the really cheesy way of not telling people who have worked on your behalf for free for months before making a public announcement.

[nik0]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Haven't you figured it out? Those are not as deceptive and scammy (Google being their higher power eeerrr FTC not so much) . One wonders why someone would not on ethical grounds withdraw themselves from what they consider to be INHERENTLY scam related services all these years given the company they work for makes money off of offering SEO services and has an entire SEO section.

Not enough moral resolve to quit?

Anyway I have confidence new management can be more morally coherent and not make terribly sweeping generalizations based on emotion rather than logic..

You pretty much hit the nail, one of Paul's responses was that he wasn't happy with such offers either but that he was not the one in charge.

If he really was morally against it at such high level he could've quit indeed, though he made a reasonable defense saying if you can't fix it all you can still fix some things. Just wish he had taken better action in that below mentioned case, which was as clear as it could be.

Remember gearmonkey with his PR7-PR9 page links?

[yukon]

Here's the problem with the new moderation update.

In the past, sub-forums had dedicated mods that were interested in each individual sub-forum. We could easily spot a self promoting spammer.

Today, there's no sub-forum mods, you have mods only watching the New Post & the slim chance of watching the mod forum where a problem thread would be reported. Notice I said slim chance because I know how they usually get ignored & pile up which only started after the forum was sold.

In other words, eliminating sub-forum mods is costing Warrior Forum unpaid advertising. I was under the impression the goal here was to turn a profit. Fast forward a year from now & the unpaid advertising (self promoting spam) won't be a pretty sight for forum members to sift through. It's already happening, go look at the SEO sub-forum, I'm sure the other sub-forums will follow.

I don't have a problem with moderation being moved in house but really from what I see you've eliminated moderation instead of replacing volunteer moderators. At the very least don't cheap out, hire some dedicated sub-forum moderators.

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by nik0

If he really was morally against it at such high level he could've quit indeed, though he made a reasonable defense saying if you can't fix it all you can still fix some things.

Like I said I am done for now with the crew from the mutiny on the bounty (the notification issue was solid and well taken but as usual it had to go beyond that) but since I haven't seen you in the crew I'll respond to you

Whats reasonable about that defense? Its a total crock. If you believed that SEO is a scam and conning the public would you have been promoting, recommending and heralding as a great place the forum that was feasting off and enabling software sales of scrapebox, articlekevo, senukex, magic submitter, ultimate demon, link robot, SEO link robot and on and on? Thats not even to mention the countless training products to use them or the services based on using them or even all the rest of SEO products and multitudes off MMO offers based on SEO? Shucks at one point SEO related products had to have been at least half what was offered. No if you even worked there you'd be awfully quiet about how great the place was. How are you fixing by promoting that which is enabling the scamming of the public?

Any one that believes SEO is inherently a scam (which of course it isn't and I am sure new ownership doesn't think it is so has no moral dilemma) and yet was advancing WF that was bow to stern full of the alleged scamming of the public and still promotes lots of it to this day has no right to even talk about scamming in a self righteous tone because it means they compromised their own values to still standby it and help enable the conning of the public for many years heralding it as a great place.

Lol... the sheer audacity of the false charge is sweeping given the circumstances.

[barbling]

The world evolves and like Paul commented:

Freelancer owns the place. They get to make the rules.

I hope it works out to the best of results.

And I also thank all the unpaid moderators who helped out behind the scenes.

I never before realized how many were involved.

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by yukon

Here's the problem with the new moderation update.

In the past, sub-forums had dedicated mods that were interested in each individual sub-forum. We could easily spot a self promoting spammer.

Today, there's no sub-forum mods, you have mods only watching the New Post & the slim chance of watching the mod forum where a problem thread would be reported. Notice I said slim chance because I know how they usually get ignored & pile up which only started after the forum was sold.

In other words, eliminating sub-forum mods is costing Warrior Forum unpaid advertising. I was under the impression the goal here was to turn a profit. Fast forward a year from now & the unpaid advertising (self promoting spam) won't be a pretty sight for forum members to sift through. It's already happening, go look at the SEO sub-forum, I'm sure the other sub-forums will follow.

I don't have a problem with moderation being moved in house but really from what I see you've eliminated moderation instead of replacing volunteer moderators. At the very least don't cheap out, hire some dedicated sub-forum moderators.

You couldn't be more right and of course are in a position to know. I have opened up a lot of threads in sub-forums and the task there is not to find something useful to say ... it's cleanup. Constant. It's overrun with spammers and I'm very tired of opening all those threads and doing a clean sweep cleanup by reporting them. The spammers rule the subforums now, and that is precisely why there isn't any conversations worth joining. Between the outright blatant spammers and the "2014 I just joined and I know everything and I have a link in my sig spammers," the subforums have gone to waste.

[Rod Cortez]

I just want to make one thing abundantly clear: as one of the many moderators from the old guard who worked with the new Moderators from Australia, I can emphatically say that there was no hostility or ill feelings toward the new moderators, new admininstrator, or the new owners.

On the contrary, we all worked well together, and we got along. We even encouraged them to ask us questions (and they did). Were there sometimes disagreements on policy? Of course. Were there times when we gave our honest feedback and opined on the some of the changes that were being made? Of course. But we only did it because we wanted to be helpful. Disagreement does not equate bad feelings or hostile feelings, especially in this case.

While I have my own personal thoughts and feelings on what went down, there's no point in voicing them here. This place has new owners, they have their own corporate culture and way of doing things, they have different security protocols and policies, and only time will tell on how this place will do.

I wish the new owners well and the new moderators good luck with their endeavors.

RoD

[sbucciarel]

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

quality self promotion in the SEO section.

Fixed that for ya

[Mike Anthony]

Originally Posted by sbucciarel

Fixed that for ya

Nope...ask any regular member in the SEO section if the Forum wasn't better say four years ago. Sorry that kind of bursts the bubble that quality decline is all new ownerships fault but Still.....I guess its a compliment of some sort to have someone hanging on to my every word.