Black Hat, White Hat....What The??

22 replies
just some food for thought, I know this thread will be hammered by those in the business.

Why is there such a high number of products and techniques coming out relating to Blackhat techniques? Based on my understanding blackhat is something a little 'rogue' and typically against the service terms of the site they are being used on. If everone is out there using their secret balckhat techniques, dont you think the big sites are going to cotton on and shut you down?

Im not involved in CPA programs at all but just wanted to throw this up.

Nathan
#black #blackhat #cpa #hat #hatwhat #white
  • Profile picture of the author lazavas
    Originally Posted by Nathan Denton View Post

    just some food for thought, I know this thread will be hammered by those in the business.

    Why is there such a high number of products and techniques coming out relating to Blackhat techniques? Based on my understanding blackhat is something a little 'rogue' and typically against the service terms of the site they are being used on. If everone is out there using their secret balckhat techniques, dont you think the big sites are going to cotton on and shut you down?

    Im not involved in CPA programs at all but just wanted to throw this up.

    Nathan
    i recently purchased a blackhat wso, thing is u can choose to go blackhat if u want but u dont have to, a lot of those techniques can be used in a white hat kind of way if that makes sense, i know a lot of people make money using blackhat but i guess thats their choice, some very clever blackhat marketers out there though, its given me a different view on things
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  • Profile picture of the author James Schramko
    Some blackhat techniques in recent WSO's teach filthy thieving methods that have zero regard for other humans. Why they sell this stuff is beyond me.

    In offline business it is the equivalent of door to door flim flam scams and shoddy petty theft.

    Stuff like replying to car sellers with CPA offers and manipulating would be daters with fake pictures of girls to get them to sign up to dating sites is plain scamming.

    Paying people to click on offers through proxy browsers and incentivizing people with stolen game downloads at media sharing sites is just theft.

    No wonder CPA companies scrub offers when they ARE being stolen from.

    These cockroaches of the human race are low. It should be illegal to sell this information.

    Shame on these thoughtless people.

    One day they will realize that trading dollars for human suffering is unethical and bad karma.

    This is NO way to build a sustainable business that you can retire on and share with your children.
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    • Profile picture of the author lexilexi
      I think it's time for a new definition of black hat. I guess it's too late though.

      It's the hacker argument all over again if you ask me.

      Correct me if I'm wrong.... it *was* my understanding was that black hat was a form of search engine optimization - ways to artificially inflate google rankings through using scraped content to build database sites, using scripts to create multiple profiles on 2.0 sites, etc... automated link building type stuff.

      - but it seems as though the term has now become degraded to mean anything shady or dubious online.

      Am I just off on my own planet here?

      I think the dubious stuff we should call "crack hat", and reserve the term "black hat" for the noble and scientific art of building links on auto pilot without falling foul of the dreaded algo. I guess it's too late for the term "black hat"; it's status has shifted from one of an underground, hi tech art to one of low moral character.
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      "If there is no door, it becomes necessary to break out through the wall."

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  • Profile picture of the author raynman
    In the old cowboy movies the good guys (noble ones) wore the white hats while the bad guys (the dubious ones who couldn't be trusted) wore the black hats.
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  • Profile picture of the author nipit007
    It means what you want it to mean. It may be very harmless and hurt no one or it can be overly aggressive and down right stealing. There is such a wide range and opinions it all boils down to how its used and ones interpretation of that use. My opinion is: it can be Good, Bad, or Ugly. Whats your opinion?
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  • Profile picture of the author Nathan Denton
    Subjectivity is the key. For those involved in "Black hat" techniques i think they would class them as Good whilst those who are taken advantage of would call them Bad.

    i personally don't see the point of partaking in any illegal or immoral techniques to try and earn a quick buck. Like James said, it is no way to build a sustainable business as in most cases the technique will be short lived until it is picked up by the CPA companies.
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    Online marketing, offline marketing and various other things.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kyle L Hannah
    The facts are this ... Most marketers online and offline use blackhat methods in one way, shape or form.

    Most don't even realize it.

    It's simply a means to get an edge on your competition.

    Now what brick and mortar business Doesn't try and do that?

    Hmmm... NONE

    Look at a company like Wal-Mart ... Technically what they do is certainly considered black hat in the offline sense, different beer but same mug...

    There are certainly different extremes in the black hat sense, some things may be considered to far over the edge while others are just slightly bending the rules.

    One's personal opinion on it is what it all boils down to.

    I personally consider super black hat the equivalent of "phishing" scams or money laundering, but that's me. Someone else might consider it simply incentivizing an offer that according to the TOS on the network is not allowed. Hence there are many different definitions.
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  • Profile picture of the author bruintws
    Banned
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    • Profile picture of the author RogerAderholdt
      For me - my reputation is much more valuable than earning a few bucks or even a few 1,000's bucks. I will stick to the WHITE Hat.
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  • Profile picture of the author Taal
    I think people like the dirtiness of black hat in a way, like getting away with something. Just like when your mom told you you couldn't have anymore cookies. You wanted them even more.
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  • Profile picture of the author newbie@CPA
    interesting argument.
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    • Profile picture of the author Linda B
      The Black Hat, White Hat distinction has been argued for years. It's really basically all in the eye of the beholder. Just a couple of years ago, most people in this forum would have considered using submission tools - such as auto bookmarking, auto article submissions, directory submissions - to be Black Hat. Nowadays, not so much. Considering the number of links it takes these days to get decent positions in Google, auto submission is almost a requirement (either that or paying someone to do it for you). I can't see how anyone could consider automation to be an "immoral" tactic, and yet some do.

      I really don't consider a technique to be Black Hat unless it's harming someone. I don't consider bending Google's rules a bit to be Black Hat. After all, you've paid for your hosting and spent the time building your site. Who are they to decide how you will build your business, as long as you are not hurting theirs. They may decide not to index you - that's their business - but they don't have a right to dictate to you. We really need a new definition, since everyone has a different idea, and it's hard to discuss something when we aren't talking about the same thing.
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      • Profile picture of the author markdsullivan
        I just bought a Blackhat WSO not too long ago out of curiosity and realized I was ALREADY DOING BLACKHAT STUFF lol... but, it's definitely not something that can sustain longterm income...
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  • Profile picture of the author Nathan Denton
    i guess the definition of "Blackhat" is clearly in the eye of the user. What may be considered as blackhat could very well be within the rules and TOS of some sites, it may just be a 'sneaky' method of doing something.

    One thing is for sure, using the term Blackhat in any product title will guarantee you a lot of page views and curiosity.
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    Online marketing, offline marketing and various other things.
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  • Profile picture of the author zhanly
    I always want to know more Blackhat tactics, because sometime I think i can get more idea on how people doing things, how they could think out-side the box, etc. You just can't ignore it completely even if you're Whitehat marketer.

    Just my opinion
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  • Profile picture of the author ebizza
    The best marketers use both for balance.

    Blackhat is all about automation.

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  • Profile picture of the author TommyG
    I agree with Zhanly. I don't care to do blackhat simply because I don't want my business to suffer or my accounts closed but I do like to know what is being done simply to be aware of it.
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  • Profile picture of the author glofish
    Black hat is a no no for me. The question is why? If you've done your research, you should be in a position where you don't need to resolve to black hat. There's plenty of rewards to go around for white hat practices.
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  • Profile picture of the author aurora ice
    black hat sometimes are white hat as well. it depends on how a person use it..
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