Is this pushing it too far?

Completely missed me Worse I would never ever buy.

Why?

I kept asking myself - If he has these killer proven to work headlines why wouldn't he use one? So not only is it kind of wacked it does exactly what you don't want. It lowers credibility in the product itself.

Just my two cents.

[ 1 ] Thanks

Signature

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397204].message }}

MarkAndrews IMCopywriting

14 years ago

[DELETED]

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397245].message }}

Kay King

14 years ago

This type of game playing approach may well work with those who are browsing around for entertainment. Somepme looking for a useful WSO will probably leave before they finish the countdowns.

It's imaginative - but a bit much for my taste. But that's only my taste.

If you want to be creative, have the courage to use your creations. It may be wise not to use creativity for every line, though.

kay

Yuck - those men are gross!

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Saving one dog will not change the world - but the world changes forever for that one dog

***

Dear April: I don't want any trouble from you.

January was long, February was iffy, March was a freaking dumpster fire.

So sit down, be quiet, and don't touch anything.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397278].message }}

Asher

14 years ago

Originally Posted by colmodwyer

Headline and lead is very confusing. Which isn't a good thing when you take into account what you're trying to sell.

Colm

I'm not sure what you mean by headline and lead
is very confusing. Care to elaborate?

Originally Posted by Paul McQuillan

In my opinion , it's a mess.

I don't really get the stick figure and it is a distracting
turn off.

When it comes to this subject matter I don't think
this is a good approach.

Thanks for the honest thoughts, Paul. Is there
any way you think I can improve on it?

Originally Posted by mathiaslebesby

You got my attention. What is your price?

Great~ I'm considering 2 tiers. One at $7 for first
10 buyers before I pop it at $17. What do you
think?

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Completely missed me Worse I would never ever buy.

Why?

I kept asking myself - If he has these killer proven to work headlines why wouldn't he use one? So not only is it kind of wacked it does exactly what you don't want. It lowers credibility in the product itself.

Just my two cents.

I actually *did* use a title and I placed it in
the title of the thread itself. With regards to the
headline, I'll admit *laugh* I didn't turn to using
my resource.

I wrote this down on a piece of paper on a whim
somewhere and decided to stick with it (pun
intended) before I change it later, better to get
started & have something to work with, imho.

I *meant* for it to be a little whacked... just to
get the attention required

Originally Posted by MarkAndrews IMCopywriting

Goodness sake!

Another train wreck.

It's bloody awful!

Words fail me (again).

I've got this feeling there's a
few Warriors out to yank our chains
lately.

Heh, give me a chance to grow, would ja?

I'd love to get some advise from you as
I've seen you give lots of great advice
to some others

Originally Posted by Kay King

This type of game playing approach may well work with those who are browsing around for entertainment. Somepme looking for a useful WSO will probably leave before they finish the countdowns.

It's imaginative - but a bit much for my taste. But that's only my taste.

If you want to be creative, have the courage to use your creations. It may be wise not to use creativity for every line, though.

kay

Yuck - those men are gross!

Thanks, Kay! You got me, hook, line and
sinker. I'm trying for the game playing, fun
approach rather than the typical offer.

Appreciate the part about the countdown,
I inserted that on a whim as well. I might
just remove it since the letter could do
pretty well without it.

I'll rework the headline and title so
everything's a little more cohesive.

I'd like to know what you meant by being
wise not to use creativity for every line,
I was trying to be a little clever but it may
have been a little too much... is that what
you mean?

(yes, indeed, those men are indeed gross.
I've seen stuff that would make Arnie - in his
younger days - eyes bulge wide open

)

Thanks for all the thoughts and comments, I take
it all seriously and will begin on re-doing this. I'd
probably stick with the stick men (pun intended)
as that's my stick trick (again).

Everything else, however, can be changed.

Asher

Thanks

Signature

Asher Aw

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397691].message }}

The Copy Nazi

Banned 14 years ago

Why wouldn't you just say

Pick Your Hitman

There's an idea here somewhere but it's struggling to be heard. What exactly are the stickmen bringing to the pitch? You're selling "Killer Titles" and yet you use the confusing and ordinary "If you had a choice which 1 of these men is to be your hired killer?" (And what bodybuilding has to do with "hired killers" I'll never know.)

Kill everything above "A Killer Headline Title" and go with something like

"Headless Copy Found in Internet Marketing Backwoods"

followed by the existing copy -

It's the title that gets the clicks, it's the headline that grabs the attention;
a second they stay to read... is a second they are not moving the mouse
over to the back or close button... and a step closer towards the
purchase.

And when it comes to marketing or selling a product/service online, you
really have to see it as a mission in order to succeed. Your titles are the
first and most important thing to keeping the reader's attention.

*Trial and Error* titles are like leaving your work to a guy like this! Are you
sure you want that?

The headline titles absolutely have to be KILLER because there are so
many articles, blog posts, press releases out there... you can't just have
any title - you need ones that will PHYSICALLY REACH OUT AND GRAB
THEIR EYEBALLS!

Here's What I Got For You

Introducing: Killer Titles

Killer Titles is an Excel spreadsheet resource I've created over several
months of writing articles. This is my swipe file of killer article titles, my
personal collection. Every time I begin writing an article, blog post, or
whatever it is... I fire this baby up and instantly, I get time-tested,
proven-to-work titles ready to slaughter the competition.

What's more, this resource can be used for any niche. Instead of giving
you the titles as they are... I've broken them down into usable
cut-and-paste format titles. For example, the title of this thread is:

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397799].message }}

Asher

14 years ago

Originally Posted by MarkAndrews IMCopywriting

Any time I can render any
assistance, sure, simply give
me a shout Asher.

No problem.

You and the little stick men,
enjoy your day!

Best regards.

Mark Andrews...

Awesome

I'll record myself shouting
"Shout Asher" and gmail it to you
sometime. That'll be the secret password.

Originally Posted by Metronicity

Why wouldn't you just say

Pick Your Hitman

There's an idea here somewhere but it's struggling to be heard. What exactly are the stickmen bringing to the pitch? You're selling "Killer Titles" and yet you use the confusing and ordinary "If you had a choice which 1 of these men is to be your hired killer?" (And what bodybuilding has to do with "hired killers" I'll never know.)

Kill everything above "A Killer Headline Title" and go with something like

"Headless Copy Found in Internet Marketing Backwoods"

followed by the existing copy...

Sweet! I got no idea what headless copy found
in internet marketing backwoods mean but I
reckon if they don't get it (like me), they'll stick
(pun, score!) around to find out more.

You're absolutely right about the confusing and
ordinary headline title. That one I'll be changing
for sure.

I couldn't find nice, free assassins/killers so I went
with the whacked up bodybuilding pic to get the
brain juice flowing...

Awesome input, thanks for hearing the small
cry from the idea hidden within the text.

Asher

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Asher Aw

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1397903].message }}

The Copy Nazi

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Asher

I got no idea what headless copy found
in internet marketing backwoods mean

If you were reading a newspaper or magazine or online site would you be likely to click on "Body Found" or "Headless Body Found in Backwoods"? I've just spun it to pique your interest. Meaning, if you have a dud headline nobody is going to read your body copy. Perhaps it would be better as -

"Headless Body Copy Found in Internet Marketing Backwoods"

Read this - Ten times as many people read headlines as go on to read the body copy.

To present your message, you must first get your readers' attention. That is the primary job of your ad's headline. Legendary adman Claude Hopkins said, "It is not uncommon for a change in the headline to multiply returns from five to ten times over." That's the power of a good headline at work.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1398181].message }}

Asher

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul McQuillan

My personal take is over the top curiosity headlines are not the
best way to go.

In WSO land we are all trained to move quickly through. People
prefer the headline to tell them what and why. Some of the most
successful headlines are descriptive (in WSO)

...

Don't get goofy once you have a headline. That whole murderer
thing is hard to take when we talk about headlines. It's way too
dramatic.

Poor headlines lose money That is your focus. You have the answer
to help their sales pages or WSO offers get read more.

People rely on hype or over the top copy when they are lazy. It
is very easy to conjure up a "My Headline Killed Your Mama" but
very hard to turn that into something worth reading.

Because it is so hard to carry that theme through we will do little
stick figures holding guns. Your page is not edgy, it sucks.

It does not quickly single out why people should keep reading. Unlike
the general population, Warriors want to know what, why and how
much- fast!.

Hope that helps

Paul

Hi Paul,

Thank you very much for your comments, I've
taken them very seriously and I actually *did*
do some research when I looked at the WSO
section.

The ones that are pretty successful really do
have a straight-to-the-point title and that's
what I was achieving for.

Thanks for reminding me about it, guess the
stick men concept kinda pushed that out the
door a bit.

I've since corrected the thread title that I'll
be using. Thanks!

Asher

Thanks

Signature

Asher Aw

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1403903].message }}

MattHaslem

14 years ago

Test it.

Btw ppl are saying it wont work... kennedy reackons thats a good thing to be hearing. Who knows, just test it.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1398574].message }}

Kay King

14 years ago

I'd like to know what you meant by being
wise not to use creativity for every line,

One creative approach can be expanded into an interesting read. Taking several creative approaches and throwing them all into the same page of copy may just look unfocused. The point of creative copy is to draw attention to the product in an entertaining way. Unrelated images, etc are irrelevant to the sales copy unless they clearly point to the product in some way.

The muscle bound wonders in the images might be ok with a sample of "killer titles" from the product listed below them....or you could use less yucky images of three different topics with "sample" headlines below each.

Something like "Create killer titles" would catch my attention even on the fast moving WSO threads. Most of the titles above wouldn't. Remember it's a sales page. You want to attract those with an interest in the product.

A countdown of 5,4,3,2,1 might work - a good idea carried to extremes can lose its edge.

kay

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Saving one dog will not change the world - but the world changes forever for that one dog

***

Dear April: I don't want any trouble from you.

January was long, February was iffy, March was a freaking dumpster fire.

So sit down, be quiet, and don't touch anything.

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1399081].message }}

Asher

14 years ago

Originally Posted by bigchezmktg

Asher - I love the concept (and if you've seen my R-rated website, you'd know NOTHING is too over-the-top if that's what your customer likes!)

Your picture (accompanied with a more intriguing headline) is a great start. But I'm not sure the headline you've got now is the one that'll make people wanna say "What's in the next paragraph? I'm interested!"

Metronicity is onto something, but it's still not there yet. The two of you could prol'ly come up with something great.

I hate to say it, but I agree (reluctantly) about the stick men. I just don't think they add to your conversions. They're cute and funny, but kind of amateurish. If you want something that looks drawn in, but a little more refined, try CopyDoodles. It's cheap and easy to use.

Lemme know if I can help. I like the cut of your jib.

Rachel

Hi Rachel!

Interesting site you got there - I wonder how she's
going to get her heels out without leaving some
kind of mark

I've actually decided to do away with the stick men...
since they're not really working according to so many
copywriters who have so generously offered their
views.

Who am I to say their time-tested concepts won't
work? I'll be going against my own copy of selling
time-tested article titles.

I know about Copydoodles... but I'm not going to use
it... not when I can easily do something like that with
my own Photoshop. It won't be as neat... but at least
it's MY doodles~

Originally Posted by Paul McQuillan

Dan Kennedy has not seen this page. The problem is that the people
who would be interested in the product are saying they don't like it.

I would love a product that could pump out good headlines

I do agree with testing it. For $20 you'll know what your next move should
be.

Hey again Paul, this is actually for article titles
only. But I don't blame you for thinking this could
lead to sales letters... I didn't mention it in the
letter.

I decided to do away with it because it's mainly
focused for article titles. It just so happens that
some of them can actually be used for sales copy.

I'll also *clean* up the copy so I don't get people
saying... "I thought this was for copy writing!"

Originally Posted by Kay King

One creative approach can be expanded into an interesting read. Taking several creative approaches and throwing them all into the same page of copy may just look unfocused. The point of creative copy is to draw attention to the product in an entertaining way. Unrelated images, etc are irrelevant to the sales copy unless they clearly point to the product in some way.

The muscle bound wonders in the images might be ok with a sample of "killer titles" from the product listed below them....or you could use less yucky images of three different topics with "sample" headlines below each.

Something like "Create killer titles" would catch my attention even on the fast moving WSO threads. Most of the titles above wouldn't. Remember it's a sales page. You want to attract those with an interest in the product.

A countdown of 5,4,3,2,1 might work - a good idea carried to extremes can lose its edge.

kay

Kay, you're awesome

I totally agree with you
and many copywriters about the stick men concept.

The stick men aren't meant to be taking center stage,
they're meant to be supporting roles of the main
character... which is the offer.

I've done away with a lot of the existing stick men
and will think of some others which will give it more
"oomph" but not draw any attention away. Thanks
for sharing about the creative concept - I get it
now.

Originally Posted by travlinguy

The way it was laid out was confusing to me. I don't want to work to figure out what you've got. Old saying, a confused mind always says no...

Thank you for sharing, I hope the new one's
less confusing and much more to the point for
your liking!

Asher

Thanks

Signature

Asher Aw

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[1403945].message }}

bigchezmktg

14 years ago

Asher - I love the concept (and if you've seen my R-rated website, you'd know NOTHING is too over-the-top if that's what your customer likes!)

Your picture (accompanied with a more intriguing headline) is a great start. But I'm not sure the headline you've got now is the one that'll make people wanna say "What's in the next paragraph? I'm interested!"

Metronicity is onto something, but it's still not there yet. The two of you could prol'ly come up with something great.

I hate to say it, but I agree (reluctantly) about the stick men. I just don't think they add to your conversions. They're cute and funny, but kind of amateurish. If you want something that looks drawn in, but a little more refined, try CopyDoodles. It's cheap and easy to use.

Lemme know if I can help. I like the cut of your jib.

Rachel