27 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}
27 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}

Can you solve this mystery? (Clickbank hops)

by Zac The Man
22 replies
I own a product on clickbank and some affiliates seemed to have tested it out to see how well it was converting. Having tested it out and made a few sales (each was making approx 1 sale for every 100 hops), they then no longer tested it anymore.

I guess this means they didn't think it was converting well enough for them?

But what i'm curious to know was what kind of traffic they were sending me. Because if they were sending me poor traffic, i might still have a good product on my hands. But if they were sending me good targeted traffic (ie having been warmed up using a list), then maybe they are right and my product doesn't convert good enough.

By looking at the following graph (attached to this post is the graph), what kind of traffic do you think created the hops these affiliates sent me?

Affiliate 2 has me most perplexed. This guy sent me 5 sales in about 1 hour and then 1 sale after another 5 hours (6 sales in total). And then no more sales. I can't understand what kind of traffic he sent me to achieve that. The only thing i can think of is that he sent out 1 single email to his list. Which is odd, because i provide a set of 5 emails for affiliates to pre-sell the product. If this affiliate was testing the product, surely he would have tested it our properly? Only sending out 1 email is hardly a good way to test a product ...or is it?

Because he was able to generate 6 sales that quickly, i can only assume this is someone who knows a thing or two about affiliate marketing and testing out product conversions.
#clickbank #hops #mystery #solve
  • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

    if they were sending me poor traffic, i might still have a good product on my hands.
    A good "sales page", you probably mean? This is mostly about sales page quality/conversion-rates, rather than product quality, isn't it?

    Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

    But if they were sending me good targeted traffic (ie having been warmed up using a list), then maybe they are right and my product doesn't convert good enough.
    Yes, I agree.

    Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

    By looking at the following graph (attached to this post is the graph), what kind of traffic do you think created the hops these affiliates sent me?
    I can't read it at all, but in any case, can't you discuss it with them, ask them about their traffic sources, and so on? As an affiliate, I get vendors asking me this sort of thing all the time ...

    .
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726416].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

      can't you discuss it with them, ask them about their traffic sources, and so on? As an affiliate, I get vendors asking me this sort of thing all the time ...
      I only have the persons clickbank ID. There is no way for me to contact them using just that - is there?
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726507].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author drewfioravanti
    You should know how well your product converts from your own traffic sources.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726423].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Originally Posted by drewfioravanti View Post

      You should know how well your product converts from your own traffic sources.
      I only have one traffic source myself. I get organic traffic to my blog, which has a link to the salespage. So in this way, my traffic i send to the salespage is warmed up (+ they will have got to know me). This traffic is converting at 1 sale in every 15 hops (on a good day), 1 sale in every 50 hops (on an average day) and 1 in 80 hops (on a bad day).

      With only one source of traffic to judge by, its inevitably hard to judge how good or bad my sales-pitch is. But obviously, these 2 affiliates believe they should be getting more than just 1 sale per 100 hops.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726501].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

    what kind of traffic do you think created the hops these affiliates sent me?

    Zac,

    Wouldn't the best source of this information be the affiliates that sent you the traffic? How are random people on this forum going to be a better source of information than the ones that generated the traffic in the first place?

    So many business owners are hesitant to contact and work with their affiliates. It's beyond me why this is the case. The affiliates are your sales force and you should be working as a team because every sale is a team effort. Product owners, if they really want to use affiliates productively, should pay them well and bend over backwards to help them in every way possible.

    Steve
    Signature

    Steve Browne, online business strategies, tips, guidance, and resources
    SteveBrowneDirect

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726518].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      I only have the persons clickbank ID. There is no way for me to contact them. I tried seeing if there was a clickbank product associated with that ID but there wasn't.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726525].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      As Drew and Steve rightly imply, here, the main problem is that you need to have everything tweaked and tested and have proven conversions of targeted traffic before you try to bring affiliates on board. It's relatively easy to attract affiliates, but to re-attract them if you lose them is extremely difficult.

      .
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726530].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author webproishere
    I don't understand why we can't contact affiliates (besides making them optin first) from within CB. This should be added as a new feature.
    Nothing's easier than asking them right ?
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726545].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by webproishere View Post

      I don't understand why we can't contact affiliates (besides making them optin first) from within CB.
      Vendors can elect to "white-list" all affiliates, if they really want to. If they do that, nobody can become an affiliate without their consent.

      They can also incentivize/encourage potential affiliates to contact the vendor, and can do this on their Marketplace listing, on their Vendor Spotlight page, and on their "affilites" page. (Have you done any/all of those things, Zac?).

      Otherwise, affiliates are entitled to their anonymity, and vendors don't have the "right" to identify them. But, again, the OP's main problem here is that one needs to have everything tweaked and tested and have proven conversions of targeted traffic before one tries to bring affiliates on board.

      .
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726577].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
        Originally Posted by Alexa Smith View Post

        They can also incentivize/encourage potential affiliates to contact the vendor, and can do this on their Marketplace listing, on their Vendor Spotlight page, and on their "affilites" page. (Have you done any/all of those things, Zac?).
        .
        I've done this. Each new affiliate gets a very nice gift for making their first sale. Some affiliates contacted me this way as a result when they made their first sale. But the big guys (affiliates 1 and 2 above) never contacted me. It almost seems like they wanted to remain autonomous.

        I'm worried that my pitch isn't good enough for them. Without big affiliates, you'll never really go anywhere. There are only about 5 or so affiliates like the above who sent alot of traffic my way but then never sent it again.

        Do the graphs look like they only sent one email out to a segment of their list? Surely that's not a proper way to test a product. But i'm guessing these guys know more than me.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726595].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Sitestomp
    Sounds like affiliate #2 sent a ton of traffic and then your product wasn't converting as well as they had hoped so they bailed on it. Are you monitoring where your traffic is coming from? You should have some idea of where it came from...
    Signature
    ** Professional, Quality, and Experienced Conversion Website Designer **
    I can handle all your web design needs | Skype: Sitestomp


    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726582].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan Mizel
    As an affiliate myself, you need to understand that all offers compete against one another at all times. There are a variety of metrics we look at, EPC, effective CPM, as well as overall earnings.

    Just because you want me to, that certainly doesn't mean I'm going to promote something "your way," especially if you have not gone out and bought traffic yourself yet. I know what my own list is capable of, so if I do a blast and make 10 sales with one vendor, and another vendor makes me 20 sales (same commission rate), vendor 2 wins.

    You absolutely cannot expect an affiliate to mail for you five times, that's not only unreasonable, it's just selfish (and it ain't gonna happen), especially with thousands of products out there for them to promote.

    Before you can reasonably expect anyone to promote something for you, you should go out and buy PPC, search traffic, PPV, even try to convince some of you are competitors to promote on a JV basis to establish metrics.

    The bottom line is that we have expectations of our own, and if your offer does not perform well in the test, you need to tweak your process, funnel, sales page, or other element that will affect overall earnings.

    When the traffic comes in so fast you can't keep up, it means people are earning money with you at a rate greater than when they send the traffic to a different vendor.

    Remember traffic goes where it's respected and money loves speed;-)

    Jonathan
    Signature

    Your First Paid Traffic Campaign
    www.MarketingMonopoly.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726604].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Very true. I'd imagine though when a new product comes on the scene alot of affiliates will test it out to see if its any good. My product only has a gravity of 3 so its not like i'm well noticed on clickbank ...but these guys gave it a go and obviously thought "no".

      How much of a "no" that was though i don't know. I don't know if its fixable or not.

      What little gravity i have so far is only generated by people putting up reviews on reviews sites and creating quick youtube videos.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726620].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan Mizel
    Your metrics don't sound that bad, seriously, the most important thing you can do right now, is reach out to other vendors who sell similar products and try to get them to mail for you.

    Do whatever it takes, pay them bonus commissions, give them an iPad, send them a gift card. whatever. Drive a bunch of clicks and sales and split-test different letters, price points, commission rates and offer variations. Establish metrics so you know without a doubt what's working and that you have an offer worth promoting.

    They aren't competitors, they are potential JV partners.

    Jonathan
    Signature

    Your First Paid Traffic Campaign
    www.MarketingMonopoly.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726638].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Thanks. I'm going to try a salesvideo instead of the current salesletter. And maybe a combination of salesvideo and salesletter. The commission rate and price point are in line with my competitors so this shouldn't have been a factor.

      Maybe those affiliates were looking for a gem when all i had to offer them was an average product that was selling ...but not spectacularly. I think though its better than alot of my competitors products who have high gravities.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726665].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author rjd1265
    Maybe they sent it to a solo ads list just to build their list up. I do that all the time.

    Make 6-10 sales of a product on Clickbank then stop. I am interested in the opt ins, not the sales so I do not promote any further.
    Signature
    You Are A Snowflake
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726670].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Originally Posted by rjd1265 View Post

      Maybe they sent it to a solo ads list just to build their list up. I do that all the time.

      Make 6-10 sales of a product on Clickbank then stop. I am interested in the opt ins, not the sales so I do not promote any further.
      That might make sense. Because the opt-in rate is poor to the free report i offer if someone tries to click away from the main product. I haven't developed it properly and the graphics for it are poor. It's something i've been meaning to try and improve.

      But why not send such traffic to your own free report that you know is converting well? Surely if you know from experience that a certain free report converts well, that you would then create your own version of this free report and send your solo ad traffic to that free report?

      I don't know either why they would send that traffic to my free report and not the free report of someone who is established in the niche (and likely have a better converting free report). Unless, the bought traffic (from the solo ad) is likely to have been sent to that established vendors free report numerous times already by other people who have bought that list.

      But hold on a second. When someone opts in to the free report - i end up with their email address ...NOT the person who sent me the traffic in the first place.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726682].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author rjd1265
        Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

        That might make sense. Because the opt-in rate is poor to the free report i offer if someone tries to click away from the main product. I haven't developed it properly and the graphics for it are poor. It's something i've been meaning to try and improve.

        But why not send such traffic to your own free report that you know is converting well? Surely if you know from experience that a certain free report converts well, that you would then create your own version of this free report and send your solo ad traffic to that free report?

        I don't know either why they would send that traffic to my free report and not the free report of someone who is established in the niche (and likely have a better converting free report). Unless, the bought traffic (from the solo ad) is likely to have been sent to that established vendors free report numerous times already by other people who have bought that list.

        But hold on a second. When someone opts in to the free report - i end up with their email address ...NOT the person who sent me the traffic in the first place.
        I buy solo ads and direct them to my opt in list. I dont even give a free report. They go to my site which is just an opt in form and a heading. When they op tin they go the vendors sales page.

        So i get the name/email and in some cases sales.
        Signature
        You Are A Snowflake
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726778].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
          Originally Posted by rjd1265 View Post

          I buy solo ads and direct them to my opt in list. I dont even give a free report. They go to my site which is just an opt in form and a heading. When they op tin they go the vendors sales page.

          So i get the name/email and in some cases sales.
          So basically what you do is the same as any other person who has alot of traffic? Its in your interest to send that traffic to a good converting offer. And if that offer doesn't convert well you don't traffic back there again.
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726793].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author rjd1265
            Originally Posted by Zac The Man View Post

            So basically what you do is the same as any other person who has alot of traffic? Its in your interest to send that traffic to a good converting offer. And if that offer doesn't convert well you don't traffic back there again.
            Well yes, if you convert we will ramp up our traffic to your offer....But you have to remember and ask yourself what the goal of the affiliate is. Did he do a big blast to build his list...and the sales were a bonus or was he hoping to make money off your product.

            Maybe they used AdWords to drive traffic and after a few days realized that 6 sales did not cover the cost of the ad spend.

            I made 10 sales in one day back a few years ago on a Water4Gas product...but did not break even as the competition was high and the CPC was high. I think I made $300 but spent $350
            Signature
            You Are A Snowflake
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9727103].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan Mizel
    >The commission rate and price point are in line with my competitors.

    Those are good ideas, but don't fool yourself. it's not the commission rate, or the gravity, or even the conversion, it's the EPC for the affiliate. Bump your commission to 75% and see what happens.

    I have sold over $5MM worth of stuff on CB and would NEVER consider less that 75% commission to attract a good affiliate. At our peak, we were selling $10K a day, and keeping $2500, which was just fine. Sometimes that's all it takes to get the big boys interested.

    Jonathan
    Signature

    Your First Paid Traffic Campaign
    www.MarketingMonopoly.com

    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726674].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Zac The Man
      Originally Posted by Jonathan Mizel View Post

      >Bump your commission to 75% and see what happens.
      I've done that from the start. Plus they get 50% of the upsell ...which also seems to be converting about the same as my competitors in this niche. I can tell that from the stats in the clickbank marketplace.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9726691].message }}

Trending Topics