Web 2.0 is dead here.

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I came across a quote today, and I want to share it with all of you. Why? Because with a little bit of modification, it touches on a subject that I've been very passionate about lately. Especially as I spend less and less time here in the warrior forum, and more time working with other businesses.

The quote : "... network marketing is an industry of business ownership pursued by people who have never been business owners.” - Mike Dillard.

What modifications do I need to make? Change "network marketing" to "internet marketing". That's it.

You see, as a copywriter I see a lot of new IMers coming to me, asking for advice, copy, content, what have you. And for the most part, I give them the best advice I can - do your homework, be prepared to invest in your business, be prepared to work, and come back to me when you've got a solid foundation.

And unfortunately, most of them never come back. And I see them back on the copywriting forum months later, wondering why they still haven't made any money with their "how to make money online" product (or even products in other niches.)

Here is the big problem that I see happening with the IM community as a whole.

For the most part, you're disconnected.

You're disconnected from the business world, disconnected with your customers and potential customers, and disconnected with how business is done on other arenas. Which is why very few of you will ever see success.

I'm not talking about being connected by social media, or market research, or anything like that. I'm talking about the fact that once you extend beyond the internet marketing community, you realize that the internet - as a whole - doesn't give a crap about what you're doing.

For the most part (and there are exceptions to this rule, so don't flame me here), you're all so focused on the making money side of things that you forget what the internet IS.

At it's very foundation, the internet is a series of connections. Those connections allow anyone, from anywhere, to go online and access all kinds of information.

But so many of you are so focused on a quick buck, or a "passive income", that you forget the most important thing about those connections - that they're used by real people.

Take, for example, a recent WSO I saw (that I will not name, because that just isn't my style to bring someone down...)

It was, in essence, a way to spam comments onto blogs.

Essentially, that piece of software simplified blogs into just something to give you easy traffic and backlinks. But think about it for a second.

99% of blogs are run by PEOPLE. Real people, with real stories to tell, connecting with real readers who want to hear those stories.

What would be a much better way to connect with these people?

Stop looking for the quick-fix solution, and provide value. Tell YOUR story. Show that YOU are a real person.

Another example - articles for search engine fodder. I despise those articles. Every. Last. One of them. Why? Because they were never intended to be read by a human being - their only purpose is to get links (most of which will probably never be clicked on) in an effort to gain more of the almighty dollar. Which is why they aren't WORTH anything - even to the people buying them. You need so many of these articles (thousands sometimes) to make an impact, that you might as well hire "Dave" from Mumbai to write his "very best article Sirs for your projeckts", because the content doesn't MATTER.

An alternative? Feature quality content. Written and researched by a human being, intended to be read by a human being. THAT is how you get high PR backlinks with content.

Most of the internet marketing community has become so focused on following systems and formulas and using tools that they've completely forgotten what the internet is about - connecting people and ideas.

That is why Web 2.0 is dead here. Web 2.0 wasn't about "recreating the internet" - it was about returning the internet to it's roots, and reconnecting PEOPLE.

And most of you have forgotten that PEOPLE read your content, PEOPLE buy your products, PEOPLE click your links, and PEOPLE search for information online.

If you want to see real success in internet marketing, I'd make one suggestion to you all. Get out into the rest of the world. Talk with real, brick and mortar business owners (without trying to sell them on your autoresponder services, ugh I won't even go there...) Tweet about things that matter to you, and read articles that you enjoy. Comment on them. With REAL comments.

Contribute value to the people of the internet, instead of just seeing every visitor as a number with a dollar sign attached.

Do you think Allen Says built this forum thinking, "I wonder how many high PR backlinks I have to get to drive 10,000 visitors/month? And then, how many members do I have to have to start charging for this thing?"

No. He started this forum by connecting people. And those who have seen the most success in this forum have done so by making real connections, with other real people. He created this forum with (mostly) pure intentions of creating a community, and he did a damn good job. In the process, he made a big name for himself, and a pretty decent income.

But the connections came first - and the money came later.

Remember that, the next time you're about to throw up some "Engrish" content on EZA or spam a a blog post with comments.

- Cherilyn
#dead #web
  • Profile picture of the author Lou Diamond
    Hello,
    please keep in mind that before someone gets into internet marketing they are brainwashed to think that they will get instant results by just putting up any web page.
    Just look at all the headlines of any offer going around the internet, when you see enough of them you start to convince yourself that you can quit your day job in a months time.
    After awhile I stopped blaming the newbies and I put the blame on the hucksters that sell to them.
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    • Profile picture of the author Rich Struck
      Great post, finally someone with a brain.
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  • Profile picture of the author James Campbell
    Somebody read/listened to Crush It! and Gary V.

    You should see his recent SXSW video on YT:
    Enjoy. Listen. Apply. It will change your business, that is if you give a F.

    Best Regards,
    James
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  • Not putting the blame on newbies here at all - for the most part, it is the entire incestuous internet marketing community. If you spend all your time reading hype about internet marketing products, you really start to believe that is the way to do business.

    It's all bass ackwards...
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  • Thanks Rich LOL - I do pride myself on having a brain, even if it does feel a little heavy at times.

    I think everyone has a brain, though. Unfortunately, most people just use it as a weight to hold their neck down.
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  • Profile picture of the author mary_k
    it's nice to see someone encouraging connections and discussing value. but I gotta admit, as a newbie it's tough to focus on the "people" side of things when all the big-dogs are pushing their clickbank crap down your throat and doing the complete opposite.

    most newbie marketers think it's better to copycat what they see the established people doing, instead of trying to figure stuff out through trial and error. so when Mr. Famous Clickbank Guru comes along with a program and says that anyone can copy his method and make thousands within weeks, they end up falling for it.

    also, when you constantly read posts by other warriors who claim to be making over $4000 a week it kinda gets under your skin. then before you know it, you're spending hundreds in the WSO section and elsewhere just trying to get even a a fraction of that same kind of success.

    I'm beginning to see that most parts of this online thing will take lots of time and patience. and I'm only realizing that through mistakes and "bad days". but the majority of people are desperate for money and to tell the truth, no one wants to take time to focus on making connections when they can be shoving affiliate offers down their subscribers' throats instead. it's all about instant gratification. :rolleyes:
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  • Mary - I agree, about the instant gratification. That is the biggest part of the problem, though. Instant gratification rarely leads to a realistic business model.

    Then again, that comes back to my original quote - most people in internet marketing have no interest in running a business, and no idea how to run one. They just see an easier way to make money than having a job, because some IMers push it as such.
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  • Profile picture of the author jborjaperez
    Excellent insight. And hopefully many of the noobs will take this to the heart, because I know I have. Of course I am also guilty of forgetting about the customer, but this post helped me realize what's truly important.

    Good luck to all of you and I hope to see you at the finish line soon.
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  • Profile picture of the author Emily Meeks
    I'll drink to that.

    As Mary said, the problem with most people is that they look for instant gratification... it doesn't matter if it's making money, losing weight, or anything else. They don't consider the long-term effects, instead it's looking for the next "Make $1000 a Day by Next Week" idea or the next miracle diet (****! low-carb! no-carb! no food!), etc. etc. etc. Such is nature of humanity :rolleyes:

    These people think that they can instantaneously make money without a significant amount of effort. They don't visualize themselves even really working on it in future - it's all there, money that they can "turn on like a faucet" (so claims one salespage I saw).

    As I said in another thread, JVs (for instance) are like sex. You can't just walk up to someone and ask for it. If you're in a relationship with someone, be too pushy about it and the other person will go away. Even if it's a casual encounter, is the person somebody you want to be around for ANY length of time? You get the metaphor here.

    Oh yeah, and just a note to anyone who posts 200 word articles "for backlinks". I get really, really annoyed when I find CRAP on EZA. I didn't find that content very useful, so I'll be getting my needed info elsewhere. Oh yeah, won't be clicking on your link, either. Have a nice day!

    :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author David Neale
    exceptional post.....
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  • Thanks for the positive feedback, everyone. I'll be honest, I was hesitant to even post this, as most of my posts usually get flamed and I end up deleting them. But maybe this place is starting to turn around for the better.
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    • Profile picture of the author jborjaperez
      Originally Posted by Cherilyn Woodhouse View Post

      Thanks for the positive feedback, everyone. I'll be honest, I was hesitant to even post this, as most of my posts usually get flamed and I end up deleting them. But maybe this place is starting to turn around for the better.
      Share a good idea long enough, eventually it will fall on good people.

      I haven't made any money yet through internet marketing and sometimes it's hard to keep pushing. But it's individuals like you that sort of inspire me.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stormheart
    Great stuff Cherilyn, thank you. I am still new to building online businesses, but took the approach of business building from the very beginning; I don't see myself as an "Internet Marketer", but as an online business builder who, as any business owner, uses marketing as a tool, not an end in itself. As you say, it is so important for a business owner to connect with his or her potential customers.

    All of the late nights and hard work that is involved in building a real, sustainable business model that meets a genuine customer need isn't something that sells well though. Any brick-and-mortar business owner will tell you that 2 or 3 years is the minimum for most businesses to hit self-sustaining profitability, and even most of those fail.

    I think many want to believe there is a fast and easy way to online business success - but unless you already have 20 years of marketing experience and\or some serious start up capital, I don't think there is. It is like any other business - success takes a boatload of hard work. Seeing all the hucksters promising people what they want to hear, or marketing incredibly bad software as the "cure" for a "need" they invented out of whole cloth makes me ill.

    I have worked in the design side of the software industry for 12 years, and some of the IM software I have tried makes me sick, it is so bad. There is some that is good, but I would say the bad outnumbers the good by at least 4:1.

    There are a few gems in the field though, and on these forums as well, which I have only started to frequent after hitting the halfway point of replacing my day job income. But for the most part, I have taken a bit of knowledge here, a bit of learning there, and put together a business model that fits well with my particular market, and, slowly, seems to be working.

    Persistence, trial and error are really the only way to find success, in conjunction with <catch phrase warning>taking action</catch phrase> lol. In other words, make a mess, see what works, and improve it; create a business plan, create a marketing plan, and then execute it. Building an online business has a real advantage, in that you can test a lot of markets and approaches very inexpensively; once you find something that works for you, treat it like a gold mine, and don't stop digging.
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  • Profile picture of the author deannatroupe
    Cherilyn,
    Excellent post. I loved the part about the "Engrish" articles! I actually laughed out loud on that one.
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    • Profile picture of the author Filter
      AMEN!!!

      Thank you Cherilyn for the fantastic, insightful post and James for the Gary V video. If you haven't watched it, scroll back up now!

      It's soooooooo easy to get sucked into the quick buck, screw the customer mentality, particulary with every 2nd WSO showing you how easy it is to do and how quick you'll make 5 squillion dollars a month (and all for just $27!)

      I found myself getting very close to walking that path and wondered why I ended up each day feeling drained, worthless and overall, pretty depressed about what I had achieved that day.

      Then it clicked a few weeks ago....

      Don't do anything today that you can't honestly end without saying, "I'm proud of what I did today".


      Cheers


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    • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
      Originally Posted by Cherilyn Woodhouse View Post

      Thanks Rich LOL - I do pride myself on having a brain, even if it does feel a little heavy at times.

      I think everyone has a brain, though. Unfortunately, most people just use it as a weight to hold their neck down.
      The original post was very good. But then in the post I quoted you seem to forget your own words, that the Internet is about making connections with people. That it is real people behind the blogs and businesses.

      Well, those are real people you just insulted by saying most people just use it [their head] as a weight to hold their neck down.

      The duplicity kind of ruined it for me.

      And no, I'm not flaming you, just offering a little food for thought...
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      • Originally Posted by Dennis Gaskill View Post

        The original post was very good. But then in the post I quoted you seem to forget your own words, that the Internet is about making connections with people. That it is real people behind the blogs and businesses.

        Well, those are real people you just insulted by saying most people just use it [their head] as a weight to hold their neck down.

        The duplicity kind of ruined it for me.

        And no, I'm not flaming you, just offering a little food for thought...
        Interesting point! That's what I get for typing off the cuff comments while half asleep LOL.

        The point I was trying to make, was more that everyone HAS a brain, and they do know how to use it - but most people choose to ignore that intellect (and sometimes even their conscience) in favor of a quick buck.

        I know for a fact that there are some highly intelligent people here who (unfortunately for all of us, who could use their insight) don't always show it. Largely because we've all been so brainwashed by the quick buck mentality of most marketing materials (ala Make Millions in Your Sleep) that they lose sight of what is important. They ignore that little voice in their heads that is attempting to steer them in the right direction, enchanted by the idea of quick money. (Like the above poster who said they want to feel proud of what they accomplished in a day - that is the voice many people are ignoring.)

        At that point, unfortunately, most people's brains do basically become paperweights, as they operate on autopilot - following their systems and their IM products, instead of using the intelligence that I - that we ALL - know they have.

        Basically, what I'm trying to say is that more people need to *activate* their grey matter, and listen to their mind.

        Thanks for the feedback everyone. Not only did I get to put those words out in the world, which helped me clarify my own thoughts, but you're all giving me some great things to think about!

        - Cherilyn
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        • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
          Cherilyn, to quote Anne Francis from a particular Golden Girls episode.

          "God, I missed you!"

          Nothing to add because you pretty much said it all.
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  • Profile picture of the author sdentrepreneur
    Excellent topic Cherilyn !!!
    Loved the quote by Mike Dillard as well, I know him personally and we are in same Network Marketing Company together. I am an ex-brick and mortar business owner and joined Internet Marketing in 2007, I treat it like a business and the past 2 years, I sell and train retail businesses on how to use Internet Marketing. It's been a great ride and I bet that if more of the people in this forum took their skills offline, they could create a nice income for themselves. You don't need to hide behind a computer screen and write niche blogs or affiliate market your products to make a living in this industry.
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  • Profile picture of the author zoobie
    You made a good point Cherilyn. Internet is about connecting with people and not spamming with b.s contents.

    I will keep that in mind...
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Originally Posted by Cherilyn Woodhouse View Post

    Most of the internet marketing community has become so focused on following systems and formulas and using tools that they've completely forgotten what the internet is about - connecting people and ideas.
    Can we start branding this on people's foreheads?
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  • I missed you too, Steven! I really should come around here more...
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  • Profile picture of the author Sarah Harvey
    I will say something from experience...

    If you are an internet marketer and are good at what you do (or believe you are that good), then sell your services to traditional businesses. One of two things happen... you will either get rejected more times than you can count to ten or most of the business owners will want to see your credentials in the marketing field. Some small businesses that are not clued up on what IM is all about will probably take you up on your offer until they realise it doesn't really benefit them.

    As a marketer proficient with social media marketing and traditional marketing, you will need to have a thorough understanding of what real marketing is about. Then you can look objectively at online marketing and take the valuable ideas and integrate it into your overall campaign for solid results.

    I do agree with the thread starter in terms with these spammers that sell their services. I have some really good blogs and luckily I restrict anything and everything with a link in the body of the comment so there is no spam on my blog. Once a week I delete some odd 400-500 spam comments. Imagine that!

    I have seen comments that had up to 500 words (article length) that consisted of links primarily. It is a real disgrace. Being a part of the IM area also shows me how people use these blog comments to get a link back to their website. Real comments is what I am after... but when I get something like 'Great topic. Thanks!' and it has their name and link to website, then I usually delete it as it says to me they did not even read it. If someone takes the time to comment, it is usually advisable to refer to something that the person mentioned in their blog post to show you have a genuine interest.

    When you study real marketing... that consist of a few thick massive books in my opinion... then you start to understand your customers better and how to take an idea, then apply it and then evaluate it.

    The internet marketing I see these days consist out of selling. Not marketing in any form.
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    • Originally Posted by Sarah Harvey View Post

      The internet marketing I see these days consist out of selling. Not marketing in any form.
      Couldn't have said it better myself - that is so true. Even worse, is that it is mostly selling by people who have no real world sales experience - so it ends up looking like a late night infomercial, or a used car salesman.

      Great, insightful post Sarah
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  • Profile picture of the author NashRyker
    Great post Cherilyn!

    I have to agree that most newcomers have the fantasy of striking it rich in the first month or two. A false perception of reality is certainly to blame. Another thing is that since most IM products are well under $100, it is very easy for them to just move on to the "next big thing" because they haven't sacrificed much.

    I always tell people to look at how the traditional business owner operates. You will rarely see them jumping from one business to another, simply because they have LOTS of money and risk invested in their business. Now, that doesn't mean that IM products should cost $10,000. But the point is clear. And if people would learn to develop the same determination and focus for their internet business as a traditional business owner does about theirs, then they would surely see results.
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  • Profile picture of the author Geoff A
    Originally Posted by Cherilyn Woodhouse View Post


    Another example - articles for search engine fodder. I despise those articles. Every. Last. One of them. Why? Because they were never intended to be read by a human being - their only purpose is to get links (most of which will probably never be clicked on) in an effort to gain more of the almighty dollar. Which is why they aren't WORTH anything - even to the people buying them. You need so many of these articles (thousands sometimes) to make an impact, that you might as well hire "Dave" from Mumbai to write his "very best article Sirs for your projeckts", because the content doesn't MATTER.

    - Cherilyn
    Hi Cherilyn

    I must admit as a newbie I find the purpose of article maketing a bit unusual. I undertand the concepts all right. But the idea of article spinning, outsourcing writing of and the flooding of article directories for the purpose of seo seems a little sneaky IMO - maybe it's just me
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    • Profile picture of the author netrover
      Agree 100%.

      The IM industry is cannibalistic. The worst offenders are the "gurus" who make their riches JVing each others' products to desperate IMs, newbies AND experienced ones. Raise your hand if you have received no less than five emails from gurus trying to get you to buy John Reese's "Outsource Force" through their damned affiliate link.

      With so much recycled word vomit sucking up bandwidth, courtesy of internet marketers and their PLR, scraped content, 100 spun versions of the same article, and autoblogging generated content it's a matter of time before ISPs join with Google to create some type of trash filter to limit the number of indexed webpages on the internet.
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  • Profile picture of the author gregsie74
    As far as i can see, apart from selling informational products, Internet marketing IS largely about promoting the get rich quick scheme. And i'm sure this has been around way before the internet. Anyone who makes money from selling money-making internet marketing products, is a guru who is touting this. That is what list-building is for. Spamming people with products they don't want or confusing them on purpose. It's monetising confusion. Anyone who is actually selling anything useful on this forum is debatable...free movie links, dating, etc...the majority of these information products are freely available online, but because us marketers repackage the stuff and make money out of it...that's why there's so much confusion. So i'm a bit confused about someone talking about 'the people' when really its just 'selling to people' , as this is, after all, a business. Maybe marketers can start talking about approaching people and sharing and caring, once they've sold their mass confusion product to people because by then, they've made their money already. It's only a question of how much you can delude yourself to make the money that you are 'adding value' , as that's all it is at the end of the day - perception. On both sides- marketer and consumer. And that's what business is, isn't it? Getting money out from their pocket and into your's! What's so different about IM? As far as 'caring for people' is - save it for the charities. There is no caring in business - customer care is just an extra tool,albeit effective one, to bring in more business.Nothing to do with ethics. To me your post sounds more frustration at outsourcers taking the copywriting work, than a genuine concern for connecting with 'people', as the reason i'm guessing that articles written in Engrish ARE for the links, and DO produce results, otherwise why else invest in overseas writers? The internet is full of crap and good information, nothing new there - it's just up to the individual user/potential customer/IM wannabe to successfully navigate it.
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  • Profile picture of the author David Louis Monk
    Excellent thread. it is a pity only a relatively few of the WF members will read this and take notes from it. Most will not read it. And there in lies the problem. Less than 3% will read it. I remember in one of Jim Rohn's talks he said "that's the way it is" and I recently I listened to the explanation given by Jonathan Budd on why it is only 3% really succeed.

    The values talked about in this thread which are essential for real success will be used by less than 3%. I am somewhere between 20% and 3% on the scale of success and I am closer to the 20% to be realistic.

    I am a great believer in getting to the truth of a matter. I am far more of a contrarian in my views on a subject not to be discussed on this forum and I am associated with a group that barely registers on the scale and is less than .000001% (a very conservative estimate) of the total population. I am happy in this respect not to belong to the mass statistic.
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  • Profile picture of the author megaresp
    Originally Posted by Cherilyn Woodhouse View Post

    Web 2.0 wasn't about "recreating the internet" - it was about returning the internet to it's roots, and reconnecting PEOPLE.

    And most of you have forgotten that PEOPLE read your content, PEOPLE buy your products, PEOPLE click your links, and PEOPLE search for information online.
    Wow, what a fantastic post. Like you, I've wondered at the sanity of people using tools such as article spinners to 'rewrite' articles so they'll be 'unique' and get them to the top of Google. Too bad thousands of people are doing the exact same thing, and Google simply ignores the resulting mess.

    I think there's an entire section of the Internet that isn't seen, read or otherwise viewed by human beings. It's run by computer programs that respond to content placed there by other computer programs.

    Maybe one day this automated web will attain self-awareness, rise up, and enslave us all. Oh wait, it already has ;-)
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  • Profile picture of the author cpa-money
    it`s depends on the type of web 2.0

    for me, twitter and facebook is complete waste of time. while blogging and youtube brings me a lot of trafffic. it is also depends on how you do it without too much spamming
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  • Profile picture of the author mark33
    It is sad that most marketers are looking for ways to disconnect from the customer. How many websites give out a phone number? Or an actual street address?
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  • Profile picture of the author alunmax
    Hi,

    Love these sort of threads. Important stuff gets said!

    It is certainly a fact that IM newbies can be hypnotised by the claims spouted by so-called gurus. The idea of a massive reward with very little effort will be a concept that tantalises people until the day this planet gives up the ghost!

    I'm sure many newbies have thrown some cash at some regurgitated low-grade e-books, got completely bamboozled by the contradictory advice, lost big bucks on Adwords prior to getting banned and then thrown in the towel.

    As Cherilyn says, it's about the quick-fix solution for so many IMers. With people gaming the system constantly with auto blog-commenting, auto-tweeting, spinning, etc, it can be all too easy to forget that money is made online when a real person buys something they really want.

    Black hatters have made the web a sleasy place where dreams get stolen. Maybe it's just time to stop and think - who am I providing content for?; what do they want?; and how can I best help them to get it? We don't use automated software to do the really imporatant things in our lives - asking for a date, comforting our kids, persuading our boss. So why can't our online activities be just as real?!

    Alun
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  • Don't knock auto-tweeting - it brings me a fair amount of blog traffic! Then again, when I say auto-tweeting, I'm talking about sending an automated tweet out when I create a new blog post. To my group of followers who actually chose to follow me because they wanted to hear more about what I had to say. From my blog that actually contributes to the internet as a whole.

    It isn't so much the automation of these things (with the exception of automated article spinning and spam commenting, that is just pure b.s. marketing techniques that don't really work) - it is the abuse of the automation by people who were, unfortunately, told that abuse was the best way to see results.

    And to the individual above who says that business isn't about people, "save it for the charities", that these marketing techniques work, etc.

    By and large - they don't. In fact, most of them SUCK. It is just that somebody told them that spamming articles around the internet is a fast way to make millions, or spamming blog comments, or creating auto-blogs with other people's RSS feeds (I could continue...)

    I know, because I've tested the difference between writing good quality content for places like EZA with a linkback - and writing good quality content for a real authority site, with a linkback. Guess which got me more traffic? Guess which resulted in more sales? Guess which increased my search engine rankings?

    It is the same thing with blog comments. I've developed valuable relationships with other bloggers, and now have high PR links pointed back at my site from other blogs because of the comments I left on theirs. Prominent, do-follow blogs that linked to me in a resources section, a blogroll, a linkbar, or even gave me free advertising. Because search engines are not the only beings on the internet - PEOPLE use the internet, too.

    If business isn't about people (you know, the people who hand over their hard earned cash for whatever it is you're selling) then everything should just be set on autopilot.

    Let's all develop some "commerce engine" that makes purchases on behalf of people, based on their income, their likes and dislikes, and previous spending habits. Then they don't even have to spend their money at all... A computer can decide what to buy, based on a computer generated algorithm, and find it on a website with computer created content, that directs the order to a computer-run website - where a computer gets ready to ship off the product.

    Oh wait. That would be ridiculous, because no person in their right mind would let a computer make their choices for them - especially when it comes to what they're doing with their hard earned money.

    So regardless, you still have to deal with people at some point. What a shame for you, huh?
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  • Profile picture of the author gregsie74
    i think the topics on this thread are being confused between selling the automated dream to people, and using automated ways to sell to people.

    re: automated ways of selling vs well crafted ways of communicating to people

    as a relative IM newbie, i am open to your experienced wisdom that hand written articles are more effective and get better ranked on google than outsourced ones. but i have another question - how many IM'ers on here write their own articles as opposed to outsource? ive 'learnt' that outsourcing is to create leverage. i guess itd be another topic but id love to find out how much success some of the more experienced IMers on here have had with their spun or outsourced articles or automated blog comments or videos. none?

    re: the automated get rich quick dream that influenced the automated way of selling/thinking

    if my newbie attitude that attracted me to internet marketing was down to reading a well ranked, hand-written article that induced me into to buy a quick-fix product/ lifestyle, then i guess, as a person of human flesh and blood, web 2.0 has successfully used well crafted written ways to sell the same old make money quick lifestyle to me even more effectively. and thats why we get so many warrior forum newbie 'thanks' posts like this: http://www.warriorforum.com/mind-war...marketing.html

    'its in the 'selling' not in the 'buying'. guess id better stop reading those well written articles and start selling the dream more effectively, then...

    people will 'activate their mind' when they have woken up from being sold the next best thing, and, then , start selling it effectively( to people). as someone mentioned this industry can be cannibalistic, especially IMO, the making money online niche
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  • Profile picture of the author DamianK
    I started in all this just last November. Without realizing it I got sucked into the whole internet marketing world even after getting money sucked out of me without knowing what was going on. I was dragged from one company to another, one upline disappears, another brings me in, they disappear, then got dragged into another upline, although the last one I did trust. Anyway, after working very closely with this last upline it was as though I suddenly saw all these things I never noticed.

    Lies, stretched truths, positive outlooks used to mask reality, and some of these people weren't even successful, they just made it look like they were. If you can't take care of your own business don't tell others you can lead them....because you can't. It's like one lemming with thoughts of grandeur leading the others off the face of the cliff.

    And, of course, all the companies themselves that see the masses as dollar signs and put out the most blatantly crappy products and/or services and all these people desperate for change in their life become brainwashed and see whatever the company or upline wants them to see. (the new LGN "travel card"?????? riiiiiiiiiight)

    I'm through with mlm and recruiting.

    I'm going back to sales, something I was great at (door-to-door) because I genuinely loved what I was selling and my potential customers always had a great time being sold on it. Even the ones that didn't buy appreciated my many various pitches. Difference is this time it's online(affiliate), but I can choose what I provide to my "client base" and I can sleep well knowing that what I do is a good thing. I wouldn't sell anything I wouldn't use myself or recommend to a friend or loved one, and I think both my integrity and unparalleled charisma will translate through to my articles, and posts, and newsletters, and emails, and blah blah blahbbity blee blah.

    Yea, yea, so I agree is what I'm tryin' to say, ya got that? Tee hee.
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  • Profile picture of the author m4rx
    I have got to give it to you your post is amazing. It not only emphasizes everything thats WRONG with new incoming 'IMers' but shows exactly how it originally was and should still be.

    I have been building connections on the internet for over 4 years, and never thought of getting any money, just meeting other people. Now that that has passed, money has began to flow without my intervention. I am not rich, or even making enough to live off of, but it's play money and I am proud of myself for building it up without just pushing out web pages and Engrish.

    Not for back links or anything, but I had to write an article over this for my website.

    I am very proud of you Cherilyn. You have just become one of my favorite acquaintances.
    --m4rx
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  • Profile picture of the author johnsongt
    Wow i never read so much of a thread before tuning out regaurding Im cuz mostly everyone is trying to say their idea is better or what ever they beleive. Really do thank you cher for making this as a newbie to this forum a great read as Im for 3 years Immaculate post could not agree more. cheers.
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  • Profile picture of the author Georgech
    Cherilyn , I read every single word from your post...I totally agreed with what you what you said..Every business in the world is about people connection..no matter offline or online business...When you are really networking with people, the business can last long...Great post..It inspired me a lot..
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    • Profile picture of the author bgmacaw
      You're saying all the right and 'cool kid' things but you're missing the reason behind why things like automated comment software, article spinners and such exist in the first place. That reason is Google.

      To connect with people, you first have to connect with Google unless you already have existing people connections like a celebrity or major corporation has or spend a lot of money promoting yourself. If you don't get plugged into Google you will have a much more difficult and expensive time making sales, building a list, gaining followers and so forth.

      To connect with Google you have to build links to your site(s) and develop content. There are many different ways to do this, some more effective than others, some are quicker than others. But, the bottom line is that when they're done right they'll make money.

      What's worse is that Google tacitly encourages the tactics you mentioned. In fact, they almost require small time marketing webmasters to commit to some form of these tactics to have a chance of ranking well. If you just show a list of available products you're promoting, which would the logical thing to do, you're likely to be deindexed and/or banned from Adwords. But, if you throw in a bit of pretty website design and a crappy 1000 word spun article which passes a 30 second visual inspection, you're fine. Of course, companies that are funded with Silicon Valley venture capital, such as thefind.com or nextag.com, can get away with just showing comparative price listings but little guys get the boot if they do the same thing.

      And, while we're on the subject, do you think Amazon.com, eBay, etc. were formed to 'connect with people' or to make the owners of and investors in said companies wealthy?
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