Independent Affiliate Programs.. Are they safe?

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dyer402

So I found a product that I want to run a promo on for my list that seems really awesome. The product creator is super genuine in his videos, is pretty darn congruent with how I think and feel, the pay out is solid, he has multiple products, AND they work with affiliates to create additional content for bonus' and what have you.

Seems like a pretty rad deal..

...BUT

As it says in the title, this guy does not use click bank...

He uses his own internal affiliate program. Which I wouldn't have a problem with as long as I could verify the company who processes the payouts and everything.

The problem I'm having here is his affiliate sign up page requires me to enter my social security number AND bank account information. There is no other information talking about the the security of my personal info, only the earnings disclaimer and product promotion rules.

I really want to promote these products. I subscribed to his list and his info is really good, non-hypey, and useful.

Has anyone here had any experience with independent affiliate networks? If so what would you suggest if you were in my situation?

All advice and thoughts are welcome

Thanks in advance guys!

Cory

Run the other way, this person may be a scam artist trying to get your info.
He does not need your bank account or SIN.

Once he has it you may have a big problem.

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Well let me see. OH yea need to start work on my ???????? again.
Been working for slave wages to long.

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Lisa RRB 12 years ago

The fact that you came made a post asking for reassurance is enough reason to not do any business with this guy. You have good senses... take advantage of that.

I've done work for people I've met online all the time. I'm okay with giving them one thing: my paypal account email. If you are asking for SSN and bank information you had better be a company like Clickbank, Amazon, CJ, etc.

I would never give anyone my SSN or bank account information online. I don't even think I gave PayPal my SSN to verify. I used a credit card instead.
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jbsmith

12 years ago

Independent affiliates - OK, but there should be no need to give bank account information, today most payment is done through Paypal. Something certainly smells fishy here.

Jeff

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Walter Parrish

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dyer402

So I found a product that I want to run a promo on for my list that seems really awesome. The product creator is super genuine in his videos, is pretty darn congruent with how I think and feel, the pay out is solid, he has multiple products, AND they work with affiliates to create additional content for bonus' and what have you.

Seems like a pretty rad deal..

...BUT

As it says in the title, this guy does not use click bank...

He uses his own internal affiliate program. Which I wouldn't have a problem with as long as I could verify the company who processes the payouts and everything.

The problem I'm having here is his affiliate sign up page requires me to enter my social security number AND bank account information. There is no other information talking about the the security of my personal info, only the earnings disclaimer and product promotion rules.

I really want to promote these products. I subscribed to his list and his info is really good, non-hypey, and useful.

Has anyone here had any experience with independent affiliate networks? If so what would you suggest if you were in my situation?

All advice and thoughts are welcome

Thanks in advance guys!

Cory

yes, in the good ole days most affiliate programs were independents.

i however get the red flag with this guy asking for your banking and social unless he is using some other thrid party host for his affiliate program.

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Dan Grossman

12 years ago

I guess none of you are Americans who have earned over $600 from an affiliate program during the course of a year before. Like all other non-employee compensation, that has to be reported to you and to the IRS on a Form 1099-MISC.

He needs your social security number for that form. It's a requirement of the US tax code, punishable by fines and imprisonment if he ignores it, not some kind of scam. Typically affiliate networks and programs get this by asking you for Form W-9, which exists solely to ask someone what their legal name and tax ID number is.

As for the bank information, ask to be paid by check or PayPal if you're worried about it. It's more work for everyone than a direct deposit into your account, but that should by no means be a requirement.

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jbsmith

12 years ago

Exactly Dan - that's why my comment was focused on the bank account information and not SSN. I have to fill in forms (even as someone outside US who sells into US) all the time to prevent hold back on commissions...but I rarely see the need to give bank account information.

Jeff

Originally Posted by Dan Grossman

I guess none of you are Americans who have earned over $600 from an affiliate program during the course of a year before. Like all other non-employee compensation, that has to be reported to you and to the IRS on a Form 1099-MISC. He needs your social security number for that form. It's a requirement of the US tax code, punishable by fines and imprisonment, not some kind of scam.

As for the bank information, ask to be paid by check or PayPal if you're worried about it. It's more work for everyone than a direct deposit into your account, but that should by no means be a requirement.

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Walter Parrish

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Grossman

I guess none of you are Americans who have earned over $600 from an affiliate program during the course of a year before. Like all other non-employee compensation, that has to be reported to you and to the IRS on a Form 1099-MISC.

He needs your social security number for that form. It's a requirement of the US tax code, punishable by fines and imprisonment if he ignores it, not some kind of scam. Typically affiliate networks and programs get this by asking you for Form W-9, which exists solely to ask someone what their legal name and tax ID number is.

As for the bank information, ask to be paid by check or PayPal if you're worried about it. It's more work for everyone than a direct deposit into your account, but that should by no means be a requirement.

Point me to the tax code that says that when we offer an affiliate program we have to have people fill out this form before hand?

Thanks

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Walter Parrish 12 years ago

Thinking more on this I have seen some really crazie requirements and policies in relation to affiliate programs.

Birth Certificate or Drivers License is one that comes to mind.
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Dan Grossman

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Walter Parrish

Point me to the tax code that says that when we offer an affiliate program we have to have people fill out this form before hand?

Here is where the tax code says businesses running affiliate programs must file a 1099-MISC for each affiliate to whom they pay over $600 in commissions:

http://www.irs.gov/instructions/i109...02.html#d0e931

Enter nonemployee compensation of $600 or more. Include fees, commissions, prizes and awards for services performed as a nonemployee, other forms of compensation for services performed for your trade or business by an individual who is not your employee, and fish purchases for cash.

In order to file a 1099-MISC, you must have the affiliate's tax ID number.

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1099msc.pdf

It's the third box on the form. If you don't have time to chase affiliates down for their tax info before paying out the 600th dollar, you ask for it when they register. It's not unusual.

Here's some screenshots showing you where two of the largest affiliate networks ask for your SSN in order to pay you: Commission Junction, ShareASale.

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Walter Parrish

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Grossman

Here is where the tax code says businesses running affiliate programs must file a 1099-MISC for each affiliate who earns over $600:

Instructions for *Form 1099-MISC (2012)

In order to file a 1099-MISC, you must have the affiliate's tax ID number.

My experience has been that more of the larger companies are requiring the form before hand, smaller businesses when you actually come close to the 600, and still some companies that never ask you to fill out the form at all.

I didn't see where the link said it was mandatory to have the forms filled out ahead of time.

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Dan Grossman

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Walter Parrish

I didn't see where the link said it was mandatory to have the forms filled out ahead of time.

Nobody ever said the tax code said you had to fill out anything beforehand. Don't play games.

The question at hand was whether asking for an SSN as part of participating in an affiliate program is a sign of an obvious scam. It's not, because all affiliate programs eventually have to request that of their successful affiliates.

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Walter Parrish

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dan Grossman

Nobody ever said the tax code said you had to fill out anything beforehand. Don't play games.

The question at hand was whether asking for an SSN as part of participating in an affiliate program is a sign of an obvious scam. It's not, because all affiliate programs eventually have to request that of their successful affiliates.

No.
The user had questions, because the product creator didn't address his concerns in his policies.

"There is no other information talking about the the security of my personal info, only the earnings disclaimer and product promotion rules"

As far as social security numbers are concerned, most of us here know when we are doing business that it may be required. However, most affiliate programs usually use paypal and don't require banking information.
As far as the tax code is concerned it was a question I asked you, which you responded to even though I'm guessing you didn't really have a real answer

"Point me to the tax code that says that when we offer an affiliate program we have to have people fill out this form before hand?

No games at all just was a question that's all.

I feel that anyone that has any question about anything in reference to doing business, should ask questions. Ask the WF, ask the site owner, until you get a satisfactory answer.

Remember The Only Real Dummy.
Is the one that doesn't ask questions.

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Bruce Wayne

12 years ago

We should not treat everyone as potential scam artists, but you should make sure why such information is needed for him. As I understand why he may need some information to make ACH payments, I am not sure why he needs your SSN. If he is trustworthy, the reason may be taxes. You should talk to him directly. Contact him by email, phone, skype, chat, etc. and write/talk about your concerns.

Thanks

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Dyer402

12 years ago

Yeah, I've already sent an email to his support desk asking for additional info..

Everything seems completely legitimate accept for this one page. It either means it's okay, or he's really good.. The thing is, is I've received other emails from different marketers promoting his products as affiliates. He has a forum, a fantastic auto-responder sequence, and many videos of himself talking about different topics.

I don't know what to do here.. I feel like it would be a great company to promote for.

They take weekends off, so I guess I will just have to wait for their response. If anyone would like to take a closer look, I'd love to chat over PM or Skype and I'll send you a link to the affiliate sign up page and maybe someone could give me a second opinion?

I just don't want to flame this guys website for any bad publicity if he's legit..

Just a thought if someone isn't busy at the moment

Let me know!

Thanks for the quick responses guys. 'preciate it

Thanks
1 reply

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Bruce Wayne

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dyer402

Yeah, I've already sent an email to his support desk asking for additional info..

Everything seems completely legitimate accept for this one page. It either means it's okay, or he's really good.. The thing is, is I've received other emails from different marketers promoting his products as affiliates. He has a forum, a fantastic auto-responder sequence, and many videos of himself talking about different topics.

I don't know what to do here.. I feel like it would be a great company to promote for.

They take weekends off, so I guess I will just have to wait for their response. If anyone would like to take a closer look, I'd love to chat over PM or Skype and I'll send you a link to the affiliate sign up page and maybe someone could give me a second opinion?

I just don't want to flame this guys website for any bad publicity if he's legit..

Just a thought if someone isn't busy at the moment

Let me know!

Thanks for the quick responses guys. 'preciate it

I would like to see the link, but you need three more posts to be able to send PMs :p

Thanks
1 reply

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Dyer402 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Bruce Wayne

I would like to see the link, but you need three more posts to be able to send PMs :p

skype? (2 posts left!!)
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Dyer402

12 years ago

screw it.. 1 post left...

Thanks

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Dyer402

12 years ago

PM STATUS!! I'm moving up in the IM world

Thanks
1 reply

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Bruce Wayne 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Dyer402

PM STATUS!! I'm moving up in the IM world

LOL, you are fast! Thanks for the PM, I will check this.
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Dyer402

12 years ago

Just sent you a PM Bruce

Thanks

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TheBlindMarketer

12 years ago

I would be very cautious, do a bit of digging, Google the person, and the website, include the keyphrase 'Affiliate Program' and see what results come up.

Thanks

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Dyer402

12 years ago

Ya my girlfriend is gone, WHICH MEANS I get to work. So I have nothing but time, lol..

Thanks

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Jerimiahgunn

12 years ago

See if you can contact any other affiliates part of his program and ask them.

Thanks

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Bruce Wayne

12 years ago

I have a reply for you, but I would rather PM you, when I get to 50 posts, too :p. Please, give me a while or PM me your email address/skype name.

Thanks

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Dyer402

12 years ago

Do you have skype?

Thanks

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nmb

12 years ago

Sounds a bit dodgy to me - too much personal info.

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JackCronfield

12 years ago

Maybe you can post all the relevant details here and to see if someone knows that person. Cheers

Thanks
1 reply

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Dyer402 12 years ago

Originally Posted by JackCronfield

Maybe you can post all the relevant details here and to see if someone knows that person. Cheers

Well like I stated before, I don't want to disclose this guys site or brand to deter anyone from buying or promoting from them.

At this point, my only concern is that they are requiring that I give them my SSN. They provide an option to be paid via PayPal, which I wanted to avoid so I wouldn't have to pay fees to PayPal. So that's not a huge issue.

The thing is that they do not give any real explanation as to why they need this information.

Everything that's being explained here makes sense tho. I don't have a problem giving it to him as long as I can confirm where it's going.

I'm still working on getting a response from their support desk. I think we all know that can take a while sometimes.

Thanks again for all the help guys!
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MA Robinson

12 years ago

If you can't verify an independent affiliate and its asking for your bank account and social security information, it is more likely a scam. If he's not using ClickBank, then all transactions should be done via PayPal. Just my thoughts...

Thanks

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DPEnglish

12 years ago

I wouldn't give my social security to anyone. While he might be on the up and up, who knows whose hands it could land in. Identity theft is easy enough...

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Dan Grossman 12 years ago

Originally Posted by DPEnglish

I wouldn't give my social security to anyone.

Then you can't earn an income in the US. Whether through employment, freelancing, consulting, selling ads, affiliate marketing, hell -- gambling, you can't make a living doing it without giving up your SSN. If you're employed, your employer needs it for payroll taxes. If you're not an employee, then anyone who pays you over $600 needs it to report the non-employee compensation.
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- DPEnglish 12 years ago
  
  Ok, good point. I was a little loose with the "anyone." If you are in a employer employee relationship, you would have to give a SS #, but that's not my understanding of being an affiliate.
  
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Independent Affiliate Programs.. Are they safe?

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