148 replies
... It has to be said that one of the most important and influential
components of being a successful Entrepreneur -- and
building a successful Website/business -- is being persistent.

Being determined. In fact the vast majority of the time you
have to be persistent ...

... There's simply no other possibility or option. Your goal, dream,
and ambition won't be accomplished without it. Confucius said:
"It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you
do not stop."


What would have happened if Thomas Edison was on his
9,999th attempt at creating the incandescent light bulb and
thought to Himself: "You know, I've had enough about this
inventing business, I'm going to stop now and try something else .
.."
No. He once said: "Genius is 1% inspiration and
99% perspiration."
You have to work at it and:
Keep going.

Failure? It's absolutely nothing to be fearful of. Quite the
opposite -- every little (or not so little) "mistake" and "failure" is
an opportunity to learn something that will not only help you
reach your goal(s) -- it will speed up the process. As C.S. Lewis
said:

"Failures -- repeated failures -- are sign posts on the road to
achievement." Simply ask yourself:

"What can I learn from this that will make me
more successful?"


Rejection isn't all that bad either. In 1998 Google approached
Yahoo.com and suggested a merger. However they were told to
"Keep working on their little school project and come back when
they had grown up" ...

Within 5 years Google had an estimated market capitalization
of $20 Billion. (Lol) And don't listen to the "naysayers" (etc.)

Just Keep Going.

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  • Profile picture of the author Odahh
    the critical element is vizualizing who you want to be in the future ..and making choices every day to move closer to that

    live according to the future you want to create and stop focusing on the past you didn't enjoy much living through
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  • Profile picture of the author socialentry
    Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

    ... There's simply no other possibility or option. Your goal, dream,
    and ambition won't be accomplished without it. Confucius said:
    "It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you
    do not stop."


    but what if you're a nasa scientist and there's a giant meteorite that's heading toward the earth.


    Failure? It's absolutely nothing to be fearful of. Quite the
    opposite -- every little (or not so little) "mistake" and "failure" is
    an opportunity to learn something that will not only help you
    reach your goal(s) -- it will speed up the process. As C.S. Lewis
    said:

    "Failures -- repeated failures -- are sign posts on the road to
    achievement." Simply ask yourself:

    "What can I learn from this that will make me
    more successful?"
    or what if you're saddam hussein and the americans are about to take baghdad.
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post



      but what if you're a nasa scientist and there's a giant meteorite that's heading toward the earth.

      or what if you're saddam hussein and the americans are about to take baghdad.
      people who die from heir failures tend not to write books with a positive outlook on failures .

      i dont know how many failures somone trying to prove the earth is flat can have .. but i am sure they will never succeed

      here is also a point where a male making way to many attempts to get the interest of an uninterested female ..become felony stalking and results in restraining orders ..


      failures are part of skill building and many thing training and improving.. survivor bias ..especially when you have compititions whtih thousands of people where only 1 can win ..

      if you have parents that can pay for your big mistakes.. or your a banker and can have he government or the fed save you from your big mistakes .. and make the taxpayer pay the bill ..

      if you don't have to suffer the pconsequesnses of your mistakes personally .. go ahead ..make all the mistated and failures you want ..
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    "It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you
    do not stop."
    Did Confucius say that? Really?

    I think it does matter how slowly you go - life is finite - you don't have unlimited time. it's fine if the goal is only the journey - if there's a pot of gold at the end, may need to walk faster. so you have time left to enjoy it.
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    Remember all those times when you wished the weekend would last forever? Well, wish granted. Happy now?
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

      Did Confucius say that? Really?

      I think it does matter how slowly you go - life is finite - you don't have unlimited time. it's fine if the goal is only the journey - if there's a pot of gold at the end, may need to walk faster. so you have time left to enjoy it.
      i have to be soft from now on when i answer these type of threads .. the majority of people who read the thread are probably no trail blazing or doing anything that hundreds of others already have done or thousands or more ..

      the dumbest mistake anyone can make that will lead to the slowest possible progress or no progress at all ..is to not go to google and you tube and read or watch people doing what they want to do .. and explaining the mistakes that are made and how to avoid the or fix them ..

      5 10 20 years it use to be hard to find others to learn from .. now there are hundreds,thousands or more people online basically going through the trial and error processe and giving the results ..
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

      Did Confucius say that? Really?

      I think it does matter how slowly you go - life is finite - you don't have unlimited time. it's fine if the goal is only the journey - if there's a pot of gold at the end, may need to walk faster. so you have time left to enjoy it.
      My thought, when I read the Confucius quote was that it matters how fast you go.

      But even more, it matters what direction you are going.

      Direction determines destination.

      But speed? Sure it matters. There is such a thing as "I missed that opportunity" or "Too late".

      I suspect the reason this was quoted, was that it supports a life choice. Few people write quotes that are in opposition to their personal choices.

      There is also the mistaken belief that, if it's a quote, it must be true...and profound.
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      • Profile picture of the author myob
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        There is such a thing as "I missed that opportunity" or "Too late"

        Few people write quotes that are in opposition to their personal choices.

        There is also the mistaken belief that, if it's a quote, it must be true...and profound.
        Time is money. Here's my guiding criteria especially when marketing in any new niche:

        "If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. There's no point in being a damn fool about it."
        - W.C. Fields
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      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        My thought, when I read the Confucius quote was that it matters how fast you go.


        There is also the mistaken belief that, if it's a quote, it must be true...and profound.
        the confusius quote applied growing in morality and faith ..he was not a proponent of a long list of don't dos ..so it was less religion and more secular philosphy ..


        bu generally when people use quotes they tend to use those quotes way out of context of those who said them ..

        like the famouse Einstein quote .. about insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a differentt result ..he was taking a jab at Quantum theory .. not giving any kind of life advice
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

          the confusius quote applied growing in morality and faith ..he was not a proponent of a long list of don't dos ..so it was less religion and more secular philosphy ..


          bu generally when people use quotes they tend to use those quotes way out of context of those who said them ..

          like the famouse Einstein quote .. about insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a differentt result ..he was taking a jab at Quantum theory .. not giving any kind of life advice
          One of the most intelligent answers in this thread.

          Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

          I've talked to people who said they 'quit marketing' because they couldn't 'afford to keep putting money into it' - who quit selling handmade items on ebay because "I can't afford to keep buying the supplies". I've talked to many gamblers who claim they are broke not because they gambled or didn't know how to play the game well....but because they did not 'have enough money for a good stake'....
          In my life, I have learned a lesson that came hard. and I share it here...

          it's the struggle. The starting with nothing, investing time, doing research, talking to people who have made it, and struggling when you have nothing to show for it...because you know you just have to figure it out....

          That's what makes a great entrepreneur. Money is just a way to perpetuate mistakes. Putting more money in an idea or business prevents you from improvement. It's the fact that you could grow with no resources...that's the skill that makes a company.

          And if you have to put more money into gambling, investing, or a business idea, it means that the idea isn't working.

          My wife's nephew asked me to invest in his idea, a coffee shop. I asked him "Have you ever worked in a coffee shop?" No.

          "Why don't you work in a coffee shop for 6 months, and then you'll know how to run it, how to advertise, how to order supplies, and you'll learn if you like owning a coffee shop or not? That way you can save as you learn, and you may not have to borrow money to open one"

          Nope. He just wanted money. Why? Working in a coffee shop to learn...was too much effort. Borrowing money is easier.

          Ideas and effort is better than money. It's success that can be repeated.
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        • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
          Thanks for the responses/feedback. I'll answer a couple of them.

          Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

          the critical element is vizualizing who you want to be in the future ..and making choices every day to move closer to that

          live according to the future you want to create and stop focusing on the past you didn't enjoy much living through
          Absolutely. Two important insights. Visualization can be a great tool ... And as a Entrepreneur having a strong vision of what you want to accomplish can be very motivating. As for the past, yeah, either learn something from it or let it go.

          Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

          I think it does matter how slowly you go - life is finite - you don't have unlimited time. it's fine if the goal is only the journey - if there's a pot of gold at the end, may need to walk faster. so you have time left to enjoy it.
          Great point. Thanks Kay. Admittedly, that wasn't the best quotation I could have used. Personally because I don't know when I will die and/or become unwell, I'm very motivated to work on my Website/venture.

          Originally Posted by DABK View Post

          Yes, it matters how slowly you go.

          Running a marathon and winning one are not the same thing
          True. However I think we should just focus on the race we're running. For example a 75-year-old with medical conditions finishing the marathon would be an excellent success. Thanks for the post.

          Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

          like the famouse Einstein quote .. about insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a differentt result ..he was taking a jab at Quantum theory .. not giving any kind of life advice
          While that may have been the original context, it certainly doesn't mean that it can't be applied to other areas of Life etc ... It's all relative. : )
          Signature
          "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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          • Profile picture of the author Odahh
            Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

            Thanks for the responses/feedback. I'll answer a couple of them.



            While that may have been the original context, it certainly doesn't mean that it can't be applied to other areas of Life etc ... It's all relative. : )
            in 90 percent of other areas of my life i develop tolorance rapidly and face deminishing returns at a a rapid pace ..

            and yes everything is realative to every indivdual bubble of reality they move through life in ..and can have the opposite experience in the same event .. everyone has a wide verity of different events .in their live athat they are using to grasp and experience what is happening in the moment and can be blissfully unaware of most of what is going on around them . untill it leads to injury ..

            Claude poor people are poor because there will always be a bottom 20-40 percent who are considered poor ..many poor in the united state are wealthier than 6.5 billion of the other humans on this planet or at least have more stuff .. a car a cellphone an apartment with air conditioning and a refrigerator ..the amount of infrastructure and resources available for people to use in this county .. is invisible to many people..poor people tend to spend more for everything than rich people ..it is expensive to be poor ..

            that is very hard to explain to people .. but once someone gets the concept they see it .. plus poor people tend to have people around them who steal stuff from them orleech ooff them bad ..
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

              Claude poor people are poor because there will always be a bottom 20-40 percent who are considered poor ..many poor in the united state are wealthier than 6.5 billion of the other humans on this planet or at least have more stuff .. a car a cellphone an apartment with air conditioning and a refrigerator ..the amount of infrastructure and resources available for people to use in this county .. is invisible to many people..poor people tend to spend more for everything than rich people ..it is expensive to be poor ..
              All of that is true (at least I think it is).

              When I say "poor", here is what I mean...

              I mean without extra resources. i know people that earn $100,000 a year, but I consider poor. why? they are spending everything they earn. They aren't investing. They aren't growing. Many of these people are actually living on credit cards, spending more than they earn, borrowing money.

              It is the direction they are going that makes them poor.

              A person earning $50,000 a year, but saves 10% every month, investing in mutual funds (or just about any fund), learning how to make money, reading about how to improve their finances....That person is on the road to wealth.

              In ten years, how well off will someone be? You can tell by what they are doing now.

              And the best way to know the direction the person is taking is...what have they done in the past?

              Are they learning? Putting in the time? Are they spending less than they earn? (Almost anyone can do that) then in a decade, they will be a different person, in a better situation.
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              • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                All of that is true (at least I think it is).

                When I say "poor", here is what I mean...

                I mean without extra resources. i know people that earn $100,000 a year, but I consider poor. why? they are spending everything they earn. They aren't investing. They aren't growing. Many of these people are actually living on credit cards, spending more than they earn, borrowing money.

                It is the direction they are going that makes them poor.

                In ten years, how well off will someone be? You can tell by what they are doing

                .
                trying to measure the rich get richer poor get poorer equasion

                there are also the expensive self destructive bad habits .the people blame on how they where brought up .. or where they came from or genetics .. or what happened when they where under 10 years old

                drug habbits even pot .. and even smoking cigarettes at the cumulative cost over a year..then the 10 $ 20$ or 30 dollar lottery tickets .. ..
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          • Profile picture of the author socialentry
            Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

            True. However I think we should just focus on the race we're running. For example a 75-year-old with medical conditions finishing the marathon would be an excellent success. Thanks for the post.
            but what if you really have to win your opponents are going to hang you if they catch you.



            e.g.suppose you're saddam hussein, what do you do if americans are about to take Baghdad.



            Great point. Thanks Kay. Admittedly, that wasn't the best quotation I could have used. Personally because I don't know when I will die and/or become unwell, I'm very motivated to work on my Website/venture.
            It's been years since you've announced your website.

            For your purposes, a basic website can be done in 1 evening.Just copypaste your posts unto it and you're golden.
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            • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
              Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

              but what if you really have to win your opponents are going to hang you if they catch you.

              e.g.suppose you're saddam hussein, what do you do if americans are about to take Baghdad.

              It's been years since you've announced your website.

              For your purposes, a basic website can be done in 1 evening.Just copypaste your posts unto it and you're golden.
              Yes, l spend a year and a half working full time on my site, doing everything that SBI recommendented, and it failed, (l wouldn't count a 1cent profit with adsense over a year as being a win)


              And to this day with 100 odd pages of unique content, it has still failed, (not much in keyword rankings last time l looked).

              Usually if a site isn't profitable in the first year, it is a dog; we can be thankful that BigFrank isn't about, (cannot remember his other alias).

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            • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
              Originally Posted by spartan14 View Post

              Your post its so inspirational and i think this its the foundation for succes not only in online marrketing field but everywhere in life .The most important words in IM are Consistency and Never give up
              Hi spartan14.

              Thanks for the responce: You understood it perfectly. The basic lesson can be applied to many ventures and pursuits (etc.) Also, like you said, consistency is important as well.

              Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

              It's been years since you've announced your website.

              For your purposes, a basic website can be done in 1 evening ...
              I could definitely take all my notes/research/content/etc. and create a Website in a matter of days ... However it wouldn't be anywhere near as close to the success I'm planning. Some projects, like writing a book, are long-term projects.

              By the way, despite our "differences", I still like BigFrank/OptedIn.
              Signature
              "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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  • Profile picture of the author DABK
    Yes, it matters how slowly you go.

    Running a marathon and winning one are not the same thing.


    Earning 1000000 by the time you are 25 and diung it by the tine you are 75 lead in wildly different life styles.

    What if, Adison had taken a few months to properly review his first 20 mistakes and get the vulb by the 21'st try?

    He would have had timevto invent mire things than he had.

    What if Michael Jordan got good at basketbal after he turned 43?

    Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

    ... It has to be said that one of the most important and influential
    components of being a successful Entrepreneur -- and
    building a successful Website/business -- is being persistent.

    Being determined. In fact the vast majority of the time you
    have to be persistent ...

    ... There's simply no other possibility or option. Your goal, dream,
    and ambition won't be accomplished without it. Confucius said:
    "It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you
    do not stop."


    What would have happened if Thomas Edison was on his
    9,999th attempt at creating the incandescent light bulb and
    thought to Himself: "You know, I've had enough about this
    inventing business, I'm going to stop now and try something else .
    .."
    No. He once said: "Genius is 1% inspiration and
    99% perspiration."
    You have to work at it and:
    Keep going.

    Failure? It's absolutely nothing to be fearful of. Quite the
    opposite -- every little (or not so little) "mistake" and "failure" is
    an opportunity to learn something that will not only help you
    reach your goal(s) -- it will speed up the process. As C.S. Lewis
    said:

    "Failures -- repeated failures -- are sign posts on the road to
    achievement." Simply ask yourself:

    "What can I learn from this that will make me
    more successful?"


    Rejection isn't all that bad either. In 1998 Google approached
    Yahoo.com and suggested a merger. However they were told to
    "Keep working on their little school project and come back when
    they had grown up" ...

    Within 5 years Google had an estimated market capitalization
    of $20 Billion. (Lol) And don't listen to the "naysayers" (etc.)

    Just Keep Going.

    Famous Failures - YouTube
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  • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
    Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

    ... It has to be said that one of the most important and influential
    components of being a successful Entrepreneur -- and
    building a successful Website/business -- is being persistent.

    Being determined. In fact the vast majority of the time you
    have to be persistent ...

    ... There's simply no other possibility or option. Your goal, dream,
    and ambition won't be accomplished without it. Confucius said:
    "It does not matter how slowly you go as long as you
    do not stop."
    Wise words, or proberbs, or the more hell you can go through the more you will appreciate the symbols of success, or appreciate money more. Go through poverty, and you will appreciate money more than someone who won the lottery, and has no idea.

    Also being in the right place and time plays a part, l learned that from watching COSMOS, whereby a scientist worked away for years will no reward, and later on, he got noticed as was offered a position or reward, or managed a new telescope or whatever. Some were in dire circumstances, and could only publish a book, but they never gave up on their dream.

    I spent years learning how to trade online, and due to lack of funds, wasn't able to get very far with it, but l never gave up on it, (well, l had no choice it was the only option left, after trying, building a website, blog, WP software, PPC, and the like) and it is starting to go the way l was hoping for.

    Keep persisting and you develop skills, and those skills can be an asset at some later date.

    Originally Posted by socialentry View Post



    but what if you're a nasa scientist and there's a giant meteorite that's heading toward the earth.
    .
    That's easy go to area 51.

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    • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
      Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

      Keep persisting and you develop skills, and those skills can be an asset at some later date.
      Hi tagiscom.

      Great advice there. : ) And that's partly what I'm doing. In a sense a Person cannot "lose". Sure they may not reach their goal(s) ... However with that method they're learning skills (etc.) that -- like you said -- are valuable and can become assets.
      Signature
      "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
        Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

        Hi tagiscom.

        Great advice there. : ) And that's partly what I'm doing. In a sense a Person cannot "lose". Sure they may not reach their goal(s) ... However with that method they're learning skills (etc.) that -- like you said -- are valuable and can become assets.
        now my policy ..because i can learn skills from a book or a class . is to figure out what skills i need and jump into environment and situations where i will learn those skills and more ..

        and there are a hole bunch of non income producing skills that make life far easier to live .. that need to be learned and developed
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    I spent years learning how to trade online, and due to lack of funds, wasn't able to get very far with it, but l never gave up on it

    I've talked to people who said they 'quit marketing' because they couldn't 'afford to keep putting money into it' - who quit selling handmade items on ebay because "I can't afford to keep buying the supplies". I've talked to many gamblers who claim they are broke not because they gambled or didn't know how to play the game well....but because they did not 'have enough money for a good stake'....


    All of those were intelligent people - yet it didn't occur to them that had they been good at what they were doing...they would not have to keep putting money into it.


    Sometimes quitting is the smartest move to make.
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    Remember all those times when you wished the weekend would last forever? Well, wish granted. Happy now?
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    • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
      Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

      I've talked to people who said they 'quit marketing' because they couldn't 'afford to keep putting money into it' - who quit selling handmade items on ebay because "I can't afford to keep buying the supplies". I've talked to many gamblers who claim they are broke not because they gambled or didn't know how to play the game well....but because they did not 'have enough money for a good stake'....

      All of those were intelligent people - yet it didn't occur to them that had they been good at what they were doing...they would not have to keep putting money into it.

      Sometimes quitting is the smartest move to make.
      Sure if someone keeps losing and coming up with excuses then they should quit. Most Day or Spring traders lose the lot after their first year, and some become successful, and some don't.

      And some have to put the bulk of their trading capital into emergency expenses that cannot be put off, and have to delay their goals for some time.

      A million makes a lot more than a thousand does.

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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post


        A million makes a lot more than a thousand does.

        Um...yes.

        But if you are investing smartly, it doesn't matter how much you start with. If you know how to invest, your money grows. If you don't know how to invest, it goes away.


        I've read this from many money experts, and I agree with it 100%...

        If all the money in the world were divided evenly, so everyone got the same amount of money...inside of two years, we would all be where we are now.

        Rich people are rich, because they know how to make more money than they spend. Poor people are poor because they spend more money than they earn.

        Of course, there is more to it, what country you live in, access to education, intelligence (not equally distributed)...
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    • Profile picture of the author myob
      Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

      I've talked to many gamblers who claim they are broke not because they gambled or didn't know how to play the game well....but because they did not 'have enough money for a good stake'....

      All of those were intelligent people - yet it didn't occur to them that had they been good at what they were doing...they would not have to keep putting money into it.

      Sometimes quitting is the smartest move to make.

      "You gotta know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away, know when to run..."
      - Kenny Rogers
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  • Profile picture of the author spartan14
    Your post its so inspirational and i think this its the foundation for succes not only in online marrketing field but everywhere in life .The most important words in IM are Consistency and Never give up
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  • Profile picture of the author myob
    "Being poor" is a mindset, and quite a distinctive pattern of thinking.
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by myob View Post

      "Being poor" is a mindset, and quite a distinctive pattern of thinking.
      i could list a lot of that thinking ..a person born in the US who stays poor usealy despises rich people..believe profit is evit, rich people don't pay taxes, and somehow all rich people somewho stole their money from poor people .

      when with the growing number of wealthy people around the world is much easier to get wealthy making stuff for rich people .

      many poor people stay poor because even if the go into business they try to sell stuff to mainly poor or cheap people..
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      • Profile picture of the author myob
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        many poor people stay poor because even if the go into business they try to sell stuff to mainly poor or cheap people..
        Marketing to the poor and cheap people is one of the easiest ways of getting rich. They characteristically buy "get rich quick" crap, alcohol, cigarettes, junk food, high interest pay-day loans, over-priced convenience products and services, etc. Mult-million dollar industries specifically target this highly impulsive demographic.

        A perfect example of this "poor" mindset is to ask the people waiting in long lines at any "convenience" store to buy lottery tickets; "What do you plan on doing if you win the [hundreds of million dollar] jackpot? The answer is never surprising.

        The losers just keep on going back and buying more lottery tickets, and the "winners" are often broke or bankrupt in a short period of time. But selling lottery tickets is nearly a 100 billion a year industry. The difference is mindset.
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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by myob View Post

          Marketing to the poor and cheap people is one of the easiest ways of getting rich. They characteristically buy "get rich quick" crap, alcohol, cigarettes, junk food, high interest pay-day loans, over-priced convenience products and services, etc. Mult-million dollar industries specifically target this highly impulsive demographic.

          A perfect example of this "poor" mindset is to ask the people waiting in long lines at any "convenience" store to buy lottery tickets; "What do you plan on doing if you win the [hundreds of million dollar] jackpot? The answer is never surprising.
          ok but all those businesses require access to capital an investors .. a person starting out with nothing ...develop a professional service business aimed at wealthy people ..
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          • Profile picture of the author myob
            Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

            ok but all those businesses require access to capital an investors .. a person starting out with nothing ...develop a professional service business aimed at wealthy people ..
            This is a precise example of the chronic excuses of a "poor" mentality and sheer ignorance of how business works. Some of the richest people in the world started out with nothing or grew up in poverty.

            Living in poverty is a temporary condition. But being "poor" is a defect or disease of the mind.
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            • Profile picture of the author Odahh
              Originally Posted by myob View Post

              This is a precise example of the chronic excuses of a "poor" mentality and sheer ignorance of how business works. Some of the richest people in the world started out with nothing or grew up in poverty.

              Living in poverty is a temporary condition. But being "poor" is a defect or disease of the mind.
              if there is any defect of the mind that comes with poverty ..it is the mental dependence on a steady paycheck.. or the goal to not work any more .. and will stay poor to get as much free money as possible . working the system insead .. of a job or a side hustle .

              the people who are very rich and started out in poverty and are rich..work all the time and can't imagine not working ..

              so we can kind of get in the same area ..where the defect that keeps people poor for life is their attitude around work ..
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  • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

    Um...yes.

    But if you are investing smartly, it doesn't matter how much you start with. If you know how to invest, your money grows. If you don't know how to invest, it goes away.

    I've read this from many money experts, and I agree with it 100%...

    If all the money in the world were divided evenly, so everyone got the same amount of money...inside of two years, we would all be where we are now.

    Rich people are rich, because they know how to make more money than they spend. Poor people are poor because they spend more money than they earn.

    Of course, there is more to it, what country you live in, access to education, intelligence (not equally distributed)...

    Agreed, but if someone invests 1k, and makes $50 a month, then an unforseen bill comes in, then most of the profits and capital is gone. But if someone with 10k is doing likewise, and $1000 has to go into your pet dog that has a thing for golf balls, then you won't really care and can still make quite a lot to replace the 1k, the other guy cannot and has to start again.

    Both will succeed but one will get there quicker, (Walt Disney had to borrow heavily in order to build Disneyland on a swamp).


    Originally Posted by myob View Post

    "You gotta know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away, know when to run..."
    - Kenny Rogers
    What, l can't count my money while sitting at the table!!!


    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

    All of that is true (at least I think it is).

    When I say "poor", here is what I mean...

    I mean without extra resources. i know people that earn $100,000 a year, but I consider poor. why? they are spending everything they earn. They aren't investing. They aren't growing. Many of these people are actually living on credit cards, spending more than they earn, borrowing money.

    It is the direction they are going that makes them poor.

    A person earning $50,000 a year, but saves 10% every month, investing in mutual funds (or just about any fund), learning how to make money, reading about how to improve their finances....That person is on the road to wealth.

    In ten years, how well off will someone be? You can tell by what they are doing now.

    And the best way to know the direction the person is taking is...what have they done in the past?

    Are they learning? Putting in the time? Are they spending less than they earn? (Almost anyone can do that) then in a decade, they will be a different person, in a better situation.

    Sounds like a Ned Flanders, Homer Simpson scenario.


    Originally Posted by myob View Post

    Marketing to the poor and cheap people is one of the easiest ways of getting rich. They characteristically buy "get rich quick" crap, alcohol, cigarettes, junk food, high interest pay-day loans, over-priced convenience products and services, etc. Mult-million dollar industries specifically target this highly impulsive demographic.

    A perfect example of this "poor" mindset is to ask the people waiting in long lines at any "convenience" store to buy lottery tickets; "What do you plan on doing if you win the [hundreds of million dollar] jackpot? The answer is never surprising.

    The losers just keep on going back and buying more lottery tickets, and the "winners" are often broke or bankrupt in a short period of time. But selling lottery tickets is nearly a 100 billion a year industry. The difference is mindset.
    Yes, 70% of people who got access to up to 10k of their Super, (401) in AU, blew it on furniture and gambling. At the moment people are at home twiddling their thumbs, awash with money, and no pokies or casino's open, so they naturally sign up to an online Stockmarket company and put it there.

    These are people with no experience, no concept of losses, and no idea that quite a few investment company's online are outright crooks, (online Casino's more so). They also think that this prosperity run will be eternal, l don't believe so.

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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

      Agreed, but if someone invests 1k, and makes $50 a month,


      Sounds like a Ned Flanders, Homer Simpson scenario.

      Yes, 70% of people who got access to up to 10k of their Super, (401) in AU, blew it on furniture and gambling. At the moment people are at home twiddling their thumbs, awash with money, and no pokies or casino's open, so they naturally sign up to an online Stockmarket company and put it there.

      These are people with no experience, no concept of losses, and no idea that quite a few investment company's online are outright crooks, (online Casino's more so). They also think that this prosperity run will be eternal, l don't believe so.

      if the prosperity run that started 50 years ago is what you are talking about ..much of it has just been getting the basic things to billions of people that a few hundred million people had access to .

      in any case there is an explosion of prosperity comming beyond just financial ..that will ne the result of the convergence of many technologies around the world ..people might not live in huge mansions or fly on private jets.. but a lot of things only available to rich people now ..are going to be available to poor people in the next decade .. that is billions of currently poor people ..

      i remember 30 years ago watching lifestyle of the rich and famous .. and rich people had their in home movie theater that cost tens of thousands to build .. today you can turn any room in a house into a theater for under 100 dollars and with amazon prime,netflix and disney blus .. blue tooth speakers and a laptopme and a low a digital projector .. ..
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  • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
    Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

    It's been years since you've announced your website.

    For your purposes, a basic website can be done in 1 evening.Just copypaste your posts unto it and you're golden.
    Johnathan said a while back it is up and running, took him a long, long, long, long, .... time to get it going

    Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

    Usually if a site isn't profitable in the first year, it is a dog; we can be thankful that BigFrank isn't about, (cannot remember his other alias).

    https://www.warriorforum.com/members/optedin.html To refresh your memory or anyone else that may have gotten about him
    Signature

    Cure Covid -19 join.worldcommunitygrid.org in the fight

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  • Profile picture of the author socialentry
    ^^ Actually this is a good example as to why should anyone in business be concerned about time.



    if for you the baseline is a couple of days (let's say 5 to be generous) to create a website vs. a couple of ...years. But let's say just one year to once again be generous.



    Take 365 days/5 = 72


    You should probably ask yourself whether the new content is really 72 times better then the old one. There's a point of diminishing return here.



    Since you seem to think in quotes, perhaps you will appreciate this one:

    "A good plan violently executed today is better then a perfect plan executed tommorrow"-George S. Patton
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    • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

      "A good plan violently executed today is better then a perfect plan executed tommorrow"-George S. Patton
      Yes I've read that one before. And I'm sure it's good advice for certain situations ... Like many things if Life I think balance is important.
      Signature
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  • Profile picture of the author socialentry
    theres a lot of questionable quotes from Confucius.


    E.g."爱野孩子。 -们会吃掉你的敌人。"


    "Take care of feral children and they will take care you. Your enemies will know their fury"


    2."如果您杀死国王,'建议您杀死第 任妻子。"


    "when committing regicide, it is best to kill the head concubine first. "


    Should we really take heed from a man who recommends that we raise feral children to go after our enemies
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post



      "when committing regicide, it is best to kill the head concubine first. "


      Should we really take heed from a man who recommends that we raise feral children to go after our enemies
      What can we learn here?

      I want to talk about this sentence; "Should we really take heed from a man who recommends that we raise feral children to go after our enemies".
      It's a combination of Argumentum Ad Hominem and appealing to authority. It's a flawed argument.


      Most wise advice I have ever received came from deeply flawed people. "Should we listen to someone who.....?" is always a bad argument. Expertise in one area doesn't mean expertise in all areas.

      And someone's deeply flawed thinking in one area doesn't mean every idea they have is bad. You have to judge the idea independent of who said it.

      I cannot think of anyone that follows that rule perfectly. I certainly don't.

      But I try, if I catch myself.
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      • Profile picture of the author socialentry
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Most wise advice I have ever received came from deeply flawed people. "Should we listen to someone who.....?" is always a bad argument. Expertise in one area doesn't mean expertise in all areas.

        And someone's deeply flawed thinking in one area doesn't mean every idea they have is bad. You have to judge the idea independent of who said it.

        Of course it is, but in practice, it's a useful heuristics.


        Should we listen to every Tom, Dick and Harry out there?

        In theory, logic says yes : every opinion deserves a fair hearing, regardless of the originator.

        In practice, of course not: time constraints says no.


        Even scientific organizations don't operate like what you describe. If they did, they'd be overwhelmed responding to people like the WF conspiracy theorists.
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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by socialentry View Post


          In theory, logic says yes : every opinion deserves a fair hearing, regardless of the originator.

          In practice, of course not: time constraints says no.

          Even scientific organizations don't operate like what you describe. If they did, they'd be overwhelmed responding to people like the WF conspiracy theorists.
          i can have fun with this ..

          maybe much of the advice written 2500 years ago is either dated or just didn't apply to most people back then either ..so advice from confusius ,given to a chinese warlord 2500 years ago .. on the best troops to recruit .. or when the people who really need to be killed when you take over a kingdom and kill the king .. probably does not apply to you .

          confusius was a skilled military leader and very savvy political leader ..would probably run circles around most politicians today ..like many chinese politicians are doing today
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

          Of course it is, but in practice, it's a useful heuristics.


          Should we listen to every Tom, Dick and Harry out there?

          In theory, logic says yes : every opinion deserves a fair hearing, regardless of the originator.

          In practice, of course not: time constraints says no.


          Even scientific organizations don't operate like what you describe. If they did, they'd be overwhelmed responding to people like the WF conspiracy theorists.
          A good point.

          Here's an answer..

          There are people here...and other places that , because of past interactions, I am more or less prone to listen to.

          But it still isn't them I'm listening to, it's their argument. And truth be told, it only takes a sentence or two to determine if the argument is completely nonsensical.

          It tales longer to tell if the argument is structurally sound, and doesn't depend on irrational leaps in logic.

          So, should scientists listen to every Tom, Dick, or Harry? Yes, for a few seconds. If the argument is nonsensical, they have no need to evaluate it further, and no need to respond, unless it's their job to respond to everyone.

          One thing I won't do is watch a 30 minute video about a patently ridiculous proposition.
          Why? Because it's torture to a sane mind. But read a 5 sentence paragraph? Of course. In that 5 sentences, it's easy to determine if the thinking is faulty. And if there isn't a glaring flaw in the thinking, the proposition can be evaluated further.

          But in the larger context? I just don't read claims from sources that are consumed with a faulty idea. For example, a flat Earth. Or someone continuously droning on about a disproven idea.

          And my experience is that, unless suffering from a severe mental illness, nobody is wrong all the time.

          For example; If someone told me "I have figured out how to travel backward in time", I would probably ask a question or two. Almost certainly they would prove themselves to be delusional. But if they gave two well thought out answers to my questions, I'd probably ask more questions.

          The thing that saves so much time is that nonsensical ideas are explained with nonsensical arguments. If the first sentence makes no sense, there isn't much reason to listen further, except to be polite.
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          • Profile picture of the author Odahh
            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            A good point.


            But in the larger context? I just don't read claims from sources that are consumed with a faulty idea. For example, a flat Earth. Or someone continuously droning on about a disproven idea.

            And my experience is that, unless suffering from a severe mental illness, nobody is wrong all the time.

            For example; If someone told me "I have figured out how to travel backward in time", I would probably ask a question or two. Almost certainly they would prove themselves to be delusional. But if they gave two well thought out answers to my questions, I'd probably ask more questions.

            The thing that saves so much time is that nonsensical ideas are explained with nonsensical arguments. If the first sentence makes no sense, there isn't much reason to listen further, except to be polite.
            i have rean into a lot of crazy ideas the last several years.. i had one person on meth claim they could read my mind ..i challenged them to tell me what i was thinking and they mumbled an wandered off ..

            it rare that i run into anyone with an original crazy idea..most are just a list of things from conspiracy sights ..

            claude you are a wierd person ..if you wanted to bake your own bread .. or do any skill.. you would probably go to someone who had the skill and ask if they could teach you ..

            the last person many people ask is the person who has done or is doing the thing ....

            i put many ideas here to bring on disagreement and poke around to figure out a part of someones beliefs and pull out thing i can learn from them..even if they have a complete different set of beliefs than me and or they can only speak four properly pronounced english words ..

            but i am a weird human being ..
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

              claude you are a wierd person ..if you wanted to bake your own bread .. or do any skill.. you would probably go to someone who had the skill and ask if they could teach you ..
              Of course I would go to an experienced bread baker.

              But what if the person said "I can show you how to bake bread that will give you super powers"?

              Some would ridicule the person. But to me, it isn't the person I'm arguing with, it's the argument itself.

              And so I might ask a couple of questions...to guarantee that this is a nonsensical idea.

              And to me, the important thing isn't the idea itself, it's the argument, the structure of the thoughts...the method of figuring it out.

              For example, if someone says to me "I can travel backward in time".I might say "How?"

              And if they say "By running backwards at the speed of light", I might ask "How do you do that?" And almost certainly the conversation breaks down from there.

              Take a statement like "Ghosts are real". Personally, I'm certain they are not. But it wouldn't take hard evidence to convince me that they are real...just a cohesive, well thought out argument. And as of yet, I haven't heard one. They all break down upon the first attempts at asking for reasons.

              So it's not really the person I'm arguing with, or even the proposition itself, it's the logic stream.

              It's my experience that untrue statements, or bad ideas...cannot withstand the first attempts at questioning. Of course that never stops the person from believing in it with their whole heart and soul.
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              • Profile picture of the author tagiscom

                "No amount of evidence will persuade an idiot." - Mark Twain
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                • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                  Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

                  "No amount of evidence will persuade an idiot." - Mark Twain
                  you know i read this and i was like i have seen many mark twain quotes and never saw that one ..

                  the first use of it was on facebook in 2019 ..and no where in anything mark twain wrote
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                • Profile picture of the author myob
                  Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

                  "No amount of evidence will persuade an idiot." - Mark Twain
                  "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so."
                  - The REAL Mark Twain
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              • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
                Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

                you know i read this and i was like i have seen many mark twain quotes and never saw that one ..

                the first use of it was on facebook in 2019 ..and no where in anything mark twain wrote
                You learn something new everyday, (also in Google images).

                Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

                Not every crank can be debunked in less then 30 seconds.( If you're interested, see this for example about crank solutions to the trisection problem in mathematics:
                http://web.mst.edu/~lmhall/WhatToDoW...ectorComes.pdf)

                Now there's shortcut: there is an actual real proof that that the trisection problem is impossible so you don't even have to look to know it's wrong.

                But if they pick a popular conjecture which remains unproven(for which you can be sure there are crank solutions as complicated as for the trisection)... well, you have to find where the error is if you want to give it fair consideration.

                Also, IRL, the difficult part is usually not the logic, it's the checking underlying assumptions. I don't have the time to check every single claim: I can at best make an educated guess and fill the gaps by myself. That's why I want as much info on the originator as possible.

                Roflmao, who said this?Does anyone wants to step up to the plate?

                Not after Claude has eaten from it.


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              • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                "What gets us into trouble is not what we don't know. It's what we know for sure that just ain't so."
                - The REAL Mark Twain
                Maybe you should tell Google then?

                https://www.google.com.au/search?q=%...w=1366&bih=607

                Originally Posted by Profit Traveler View Post

                Oh Shiznit. Now I have to bring up the time I saw a ghost.

                Google Street View plus childhood location where I knew someone got killed.
                Saw face in widow they died, did not think about it until months later then realized that was victims face but now Google drove on the street again with clean new image. No proof.

                I guarantee you Google knows. All that footage from all over the world..but I bet they get numb to people playing jokes and having public sex when the google car passes them .

                No use anyway, for some it is all black and white, and never, ever gray. I just watched COSMOS episode 9, with the photon slit experiment, that behaves like a wave when viewed but particle when not viewed.

                Which according to Classical physics is impossible, and cannot be explained to this day, or a gray area or doubt.

                It hints to consciousness in all things, yes, another gray area.

                Some can wrap themselves up in words, but science when it isn't biased, shows that nothing is black and white!

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                • Profile picture of the author myob
                  Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

                  Maybe you should tell Google then?
                  It has never been Google's intention to provide accurate facts. Google is an advertising company, and the search engine is used primarily by the persistently lazy, determinedly uninformed, profoundly ignorant, dogged conspiracy theorists, and of course opportunistic internet marketers.
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                • Profile picture of the author myob
                  Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

                  No use anyway, for some it is all black and white, and never, ever gray. I just watched COSMOS episode 9, with the photon slit experiment, that behaves like a wave when viewed but particle when not viewed.

                  Which according to Classical physics is impossible, and cannot be explained to this day, or a gray area or doubt.
                  Einstein explained this quite simply more than half a century ago in quantum physics: matter and energy are interchangeable.

                  "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
                  - Albert Einstein
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                  • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
                    Originally Posted by myob View Post

                    Einstein explained this quite simply more than half a century ago in quantum physics: matter and energy are interchangeable.

                    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
                    - Albert Einstein
                    Doesn't explain anything, l am talking about someone viewing this experiment and changing it from one state to another!

                    And Einstein spent the rest of his life grappling with this idea, (Cosmos.Possible.Worlds.S01E09.Magic.Without.Lies) .

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                    • Profile picture of the author myob
                      Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

                      Doesn't explain anything, l am talking about someone viewing this experiment and changing it from one state to another!

                      And Einstein spent the rest of his life grappling with this idea, (Cosmos.Possible.Worlds.S01E09.Magic.Without.Lies) .
                      There is no "explanation". This is Marketing 101 - selling advertising.

                      Most people don't really care about the facts. That Cosmos and Nova series are pure entertainment. Wave-particle duality is the concept in quantum mechanics which expresses the inability of the classical concepts "particle" or "wave" to fully describe the behaviour of quantum-scale objects.

                      This concept as in for example Schrodinger's Cat (a metaphor for the two-slit experiment where the state of matter changes when observed) is woo-woo for those with a Cat-in-the-Hat education. Facts don't matter. People just want warm fuzzy answers and quipy quotes. Catering to laziness is what sells.

                      Press on.
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                      • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                        Originally Posted by myob View Post

                        People just want warm fuzzy answers and quipy quotes. That's what sells.
                        Although I understand what you mean by that, I don't like all the generalizations in this thread.

                        Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful. They're helpful. Like you said, though, many People would rather something "simple" and "easy" than something that requires time, effort, and energy.

                        (Well that's my 2C anyway ...) I suppose it depends on the Niche/Market ... And which part a Person focuses on.
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                        • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
                          Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                          Although I understand what you mean by that, I don't like all the generalizations in this thread.

                          Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful. They're helpful. Like you said, though, many People would rather something "simple" and "easy" than something that requires time, effort, and energy.

                          (Well that's my 2C anyway ...) I suppose it depends on the Niche/Market ... And which part a Person focuses on.

                          Personally, when a person constantly quotes people out of context I do not find it empowering, insightful or helpful. In fact, I find the constant practice to be the the complete opposite and usually reveals that a person is not right with the world - to put it nicely.
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                        • Profile picture of the author myob
                          Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                          Although I understand what you mean by that, I don't like all the generalizations in this thread.

                          Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful. They're helpful. Like you said, though, many People would rather something "simple" and "easy" than something that requires time, effort, and energy.

                          (Well that's my 2C anyway ...) I suppose it depends on the Niche/Market ... And which part a Person focuses on.
                          I have found that there are many uses for inspirational "quippy quotes", the least of which are for inspiration, insight, or "empowering". They are far more useful as power tools for marketing purposes (in any niche, especially personal development promotions, business opportunities, social media injections, jokes, etc.).

                          These are more like fast food for the brain, and don't actually work as empowerment for anyone unless they're driven deep down inside the subconscious mind. This requires conscientious repetitive application, time, effort, and energy.

                          "Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repetition and emotion will one day become a reality."
                          - Earl Nightingale
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                        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                          Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                          .
                          Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful..
                          I get that completely. I've read many books of quotations, to find the ones that I can memorize that hold a principle that I can use, or at least get meaning from.

                          One of my favorites is "What great thing would you attempt, if you knew that you could not fail?"

                          To me, it's motivating, and it doesn't make a claim that isn't true. It's the "claims that aren't true" aspect of many of these quotes, that I don't like.

                          For the Lottery, they say "You cannot win if you don't play". To me, it's a flawless argument. Of course, it preys on the naivete of the reader, but it's technically true.

                          When I was a little boy, and told my Dad that I had a splinter, he said "It will stop hurting when the pain goes away". Honestly, my young little brain was amazed when it stopped hurting. I thought my Dad had told me some wise sage advice.

                          But he just wanted me to stop whining about the splinter. And so it is with much sage advice.
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                          • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                            Originally Posted by Jeffery View Post

                            Personally, when a person constantly quotes people out of context I do not find it empowering, insightful or helpful. In fact, I find the constant practice to be the the complete opposite and usually reveals that a person is not right with the world - to put it nicely.
                            (Hmm.) I hope you're not being prejudice because I have a mental illness. (Which actually has turned out to be a great thing.) And although it's not very nice -- I don't mind People doing that ... They're just ignorant. All the People I have met over the years (including those with Anxiety, Depression, and Bi-Polar) were just nice, lovely People with slight "mental conditions".

                            Anyway, all that said thanks for bringing up the fact that I have been quoting People out of context: I'll definitely correct that. Cheers. : )

                            Originally Posted by myob View Post

                            "Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repetition and emotion will one day become a reality."
                            - Earl Nightingale
                            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                            One of my favourites is "What great thing would you attempt, if you knew that you could not fail?"

                            To me, it's motivating, and it doesn't make a claim that isn't true. It's the "claims that aren't true" aspect of many of these quotes, that I don't like.
                            Wonderful quotations. Thanks Guys. : ) Unfortunately fear is something that holds many People back. One way of overcoming it is to realize that "failure" is just something to learn from. I won't go into more detail because I said it about a dozen times now. (Lol.)

                            Seriously though, thanks for the discussion.
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                            "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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              • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                I don't know why however many times when a Person sets out to accomplish something "important" (/ "audacious" as Allen Says put it) ... They meet with a lot of "resistance" from other People. Insecurity maybe? In any case, I would love to hear your Guys' opinions on that.
                Let me turn that around for you - is the insecurity on the part of people who 'resist' or on the part of the person who always seems to need the approval of others to proceed?

                "It doesn't matter what people say..."

                True - but not for everyone. There are those who need the approval and recognition of other people, need the positive reinforcement, the admiration for their plan/idea. I've had a couple friends like that - the discussions/attention they get in the beginning is important to them....they seldom follow through on the 'big plans' they talk about. One excuse they always have is that family/friends 'didn't support me'. For them, it's not about 'accomplishing' - it's about the drama surrounding it. As that becomes obvious, the reaction of people around them becomes more negative.

                The real question is "why does it matter what people say"?
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                • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                  Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                  This is a popular quote for one reason, it rhymes. And Will and Way start with the same sound..

                  It also sounds hopeful, so it's popular.

                  But is it true? No.

                  Here is what is true. If there is a will, and something is possible, and you stick with it long enough, you'll eventually figure it out.

                  Here is a similar statement "Whatever the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can achieve.
                  Thanks Claude: I appreciate your reply to my question.

                  Hopefully I created that quote because I like it (Lol). Like you said -- it's kind of catchy. I like the "Conceive and Believe" one as well ... (That was created by Napoleon Hill, by the way).

                  People that follow your line of thinking can be what is none as "Purists". And that's fine. Many of these sayings are what is known as "Expressions." For example a Man may say to his Wife "I will always love you ..." When the reality is there's a 40-50% chance they will end up getting divorced. (Lol.)

                  Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                  Let me turn that around for you - is the insecurity on the part of people who 'resist' or on the part of the person who always seems to need the approval of others to proceed?
                  Hi Kay. Good point. Thanks for the response.

                  As much as I would like to be completely free of needing "approval" and "recognition" from other People -- and I'm certainly much, much less needy of it -- I'm. definitely not 100% free. And who knows maybe never will be. What I meant by my expression is that no matter what People say and think (etc.) it won't stop me from accomplishing what's important to me.

                  And other People shouldn't let it affect them either.
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                  "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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                • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                  Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                  One excuse they always have is that family/friends 'didn't support me'. For them, it's not about 'accomplishing' - it's about the drama surrounding it.

                  That's it! It isn't about the effort at all, it's all about the support or lack of support. Like a soap opera, with a hospital as a setting.

                  There is plenty of angst, urgency, conflict, and crying...but the point is never really to treat anybody, because that wasn't the point at any time. It was all about the drama.

                  The problems aren't just hurtles to overcome...the problems are the whole point, something to blame, some tragedy that needs comforting. Achievement is never really the goal.

                  By the way, in the Guru business, these people are called Opportunity Seekers. People who have proven that they will jump from one "get rich quick" opportunity to another. They never stay with it long enough to make any money. The need is to fantasize about having money, not the actual process of earning it.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                    By the way, it the Guru business, these people are called Opportunity Seekers. People who have proven that they will jump from one "get rich quick" opportunity to another. They never stay with it long enough to make any money. The need is to fantasize about having money, not the actual process of earning it.
                    How would you help some of those People? Many of the most successful Internet Marketers kind of started out like that.

                    And (IMO) it's just as bad as not believing any of the "Opportunity" claims and just thinking all of the "Gurus" are just out to take money.

                    Again, I think balance is important. And it's not just work that's required, it has to be (relatively) smart work.
                    Signature
                    "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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                    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                      Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                      How would you help some of those People? Many of the most successful Internet Marketers kind of started out like that. And (IMO) it's just as bad as not believing any of the "Opportunity" claims and just thinking all of the "Gurus" are just out to take money.

                      Again, I think balance is important. And it's not just work that's required, it has to be (relatively) smart work.
                      Jonathan;

                      help those people? You have to understand what they want. They want riches, without a learning curve, and without effort.

                      They keep buying these schemes because they are promised riches. And what they get is a plan that requires effort, testing, and work.

                      I was married to one of these people. How did I help her? i threw away the mail pieces that offered "opportunities".

                      As far as these people becoming internet success stories, I can think of 1. His name is T.J. Rohleder.

                      Opportunity seekers are different from internet marketers. Marketers do the work, learn from their mistake...

                      Opportunity seekers chase dreams...promises. But they never thing of the journey to get rich, only the rewards. Like Lottery players. It's not entrepreneurship, it's an addiction to shiny objects.

                      Here is a sad reality. In every money making niche, most of the people are dreamers, opportunity seekers. Less that 10% are really serious people wanting to learn the "How" of it.

                      The problem is, most Gurus cannot live on the ten percent that are actual students...will actually do the work. They have to make the promises to the dreamers, because they can be relied on to spend the money.

                      For example, if I sell 100 of my books on selling, I know a few things;

                      80% won't ever open the book.
                      Maybe 10% will finish the book. And about 1% will make one attempt to apply something they learned from it.
                      And the people that actually profit from the information? Maybe one in a thousand.... and there is nothing I can do about it.

                      it has nothing to do with me, or the quality of the information. Human nature is to dream of learning the "secret" that will do everything for them, and it doesn't exist.

                      And that's why these people stay poor their entire lives.

                      From decades of training salespeople and selling...I can tell you one incontrovertible truth. You cannot drag a person over the finish line.

                      Like just about anything being advertised, you are selling a dream, you are selling hope. You are not selling an actual method that requires work. It's why weight loss programs never advertise as "Stop eating so much, and take a walk"

                      People want miracles, free miracles, that require no effort. And if there is effort, they want it done for them.
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                      • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                        I appreciate you sharing your perspective Claude. You have a lot more insight into that "market" than I do. It's a shame that many of them are like that.

                        However it's nice to know that some of them will have a change of heart no?
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                        "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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              • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
                Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                Although I understand what you mean by that, I don't like all the generalizations in this thread.

                Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful. They're helpful. Like you said, though, many People would rather something "simple" and "easy" than something that requires time, effort, and energy.

                (Well that's my 2C anyway ...) I suppose it depends on the Niche/Market ... And which part a Person focuses on.
                Agreed, best to leave people that are consistent alone, for your sake as well as theirs.

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              • Profile picture of the author Profit Traveler
                Banned
                I was reading a fairly new Website one day and the guy was going to get into buying and selling websites and he decided to have a Income Statements Page on his site.

                I went to it and it was like a whopping $60 for the Month. I said aww that's cute.

                Little over a year later I visited that site again and he was at 5 digits Monthly.


                That was great reminder just stick with one great strategy with potential.
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              • Profile picture of the author myob
                Seriously, as marketers we can see through such smokescreens. But, fortunes are being made by exploiting quotes of famous people taken out of context, misquotes, false attribution, meaningless profundities, etc.

                "The path to success is to sieze the day and take massive determined action. Be fearless in the pusuit of what sets your soul on fire, and ask not who is going to let you, but rather who is going to stop you. Just do it and never, never, never give up."
                - Winston Chuckles and Tony Robbinghood, "Motivation Guidance and Inspiration for Lazy Go-Getters" available now on Amazing books. Use discount code "Carpe Diem".
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                • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                  Originally Posted by myob View Post

                  Seriously, as marketers we can see through such smokescreens. But, fortunes are being made by exploiting quotes of famous people taken out of context, misquotes, false attribution, meaningless profundities, etc.
                  There are People who have ... Lost all their fortune and gone to Prison because of their Direct Response Advertising. You can usually find fault with anything if you try hard enough.
                  Signature
                  "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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                  • Profile picture of the author myob
                    Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                    There are People who have ... Lost all their fortune and gone to Prison because of their Direct Response Advertising. You can usually find fault with anything if you try hard enough.
                    Don't be so negative. "Direct Response Advertising" is positively one of the most successful outlets for butchered quotations.

                    "Told by an idiot full of sound and fury, signifying nothing. 'Tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune than know what we are, that our destiny is not in the stars but in ourselves. What hath the mind wrought. Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good we oft might win, by fearing to attempt. The lunatic, the merchant, and the copywriter, are of imagination all compact."

                    - William Shakespeare, "As You Like It".
                    (Limited quantities available on Amazing books. Use discount code: "To Be or Not To Be")
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              • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
                Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                Although I understand what you mean by that, I don't like all the generalizations in this thread.

                Some People (including me) like "quippy quotes" simply because we find them empowering and insightful. They're helpful. Like you said, though, many People would rather something "simple" and "easy" than something that requires time, effort, and energy.

                (Well that's my 2C anyway ...) I suppose it depends on the Niche/Market ... And which part a Person focuses on.
                Originally Posted by Jeffery View Post

                Personally, when a person constantly quotes people out of context I do not find it empowering, insightful or helpful. In fact, I find the constant practice to be the the complete opposite and usually reveals that a person is not right with the world - to put it nicely.
                Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                (Hmm.) I hope you're not being prejudice because I have a mental illness. (Which actually has turned out to be a great thing.) And although it's not very nice -- I don't mind People doing that ... They're just ignorant. All the People I have met over the years (including those with Anxiety, Depression, and Bi-Polar) were just nice, lovely People with slight "mental conditions".

                Anyway, all that said thanks for bringing up the fact that I have been quoting People out of context: I'll definitely correct that. Cheers. : )
                "reveals that a person is not right with the world - to put it nicely" simply refers to people that intentionally misquote other people out of context owed to their own misunderstanding of the quote and inherent belief system.

                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                Seriously, as marketers we can see through such smokescreens. But, fortunes are being made by exploiting quotes of famous people taken out of context, misquotes, false attribution, meaningless profundities, etc.

                "The path to success is to sieze the day and take massive determined action. Be fearless in the pusuit of what sets your soul on fire, and ask not who is going to let you, but rather who is going to stop you. Just do it and never, never, never give up."
                - Winston Chuckles and Tony Robbinghood, "Motivation Guidance and Inspiration for Lazy Go-Getters" available now on Amazing books. Use discount code "Carpe Diem".
                I was about to post something very similar, but you did it much better than I could. GMTA?

                Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                There are People who have ... Lost all their fortune and gone to Prison because of their Direct Response Advertising. You can usually find fault with anything if you try hard enough.
                It's not that you have to try hard to see.. Greed.

                Such people were already prisioners of their own mind. Later they became prisoners of the justice system.

                ~ ~ ~

                Somewhere along your journey I hope that you are going to try stop quoting people out of context. Rather, say something of your own.

                Jonathan, a great marketer (IMO) once said to me something like..
                Don't try to be like me or anyone. Just be yourself.
                - Allen
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                In the minute it took me to write this post.. someone died of Covid 19. RIP.
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              • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                For the Lottery, they say "You cannot win if you don't play". To me, it's a flawless argument. Of course, it preys on the naivete of the reader, but it's technically true.

                They say that in casinos, too, and it's true....but equally true is 'you cannot lose if you don't play'. Never heard anyone say it that way.
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                Remember all those times when you wished the weekend would last forever? Well, wish granted. Happy now?
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              • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
                "Write a wise saying and your name will live forever."
                (Author unknown)
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                TOP TIP: To browse the forum like a Pro, select "View Classic" from the drop-down menu under your user name.

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                • Profile picture of the author Profit Traveler
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

                  "Write a wise saying and your name will live forever."
                  (Author unknown)

                  "I never talk back. I listen and always remember your every word, so come pen or mouse, never forget that I will treasure your thoughts forever. Yours truly, Paper."
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                • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                  Originally Posted by Frank Donovan View Post

                  "Write a wise saying and your name will live forever."
                  (Author unknown)
                  I hate you.



                  Added later; This reminds me of an episode of Futurama. Zap Brannigan introduces himself like this...."They call me The Man With No Name, Zap Brannigan!"

                  I remember the first time I heard it, I burst out laughing.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
                    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                    I hate you.
                    Then my work here is done.
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              • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
                Just Keep Going ... my wife's favorite expression.
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                In the minute it took me to write this post.. someone died of Covid 19. RIP.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    Should we really take heed from a man who recommends that we raise feral children to go after our enemies

    After almost a full day on the forum - works for me.
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    Remember all those times when you wished the weekend would last forever? Well, wish granted. Happy now?
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  • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
    Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

    if the prosperity run that started 50 years ago is what you are talking about ..much of it has just been getting the basic things to billions of people that a few hundred million people had access to .

    in any case there is an explosion of prosperity comming beyond just financial ..that will ne the result of the convergence of many technologies around the world ..people might not live in huge mansions or fly on private jets.. but a lot of things only available to rich people now ..are going to be available to poor people in the next decade .. that is billions of currently poor people ..

    i remember 30 years ago watching lifestyle of the rich and famous .. and rich people had their in home movie theater that cost tens of thousands to build .. today you can turn any room in a house into a theater for under 100 dollars and with amazon prime,netflix and disney blus .. blue tooth speakers and a laptopme and a low a digital projector .. ..
    No, the prosperity drive since March. $100 dollars, you are dreaming.

    Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

    theres a lot of questionable quotes from Confucius.

    2."如果您杀死国王,'建议您杀死第 任妻子。"

    "when committing regicide, it is best to kill the head concubine first. "

    Should we really take heed from a man who recommends that we raise feral children to go after our enemies
    But in a nice way!

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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

      No, the prosperity drive since March. $100 dollars, you are dreaming.



      But in a nice way!

      prosperity .. you mean money trillions of dollars in mone printing that has no where to go but stock markets at the moment ..

      ok 100 ma be silly if someone ges good equipment the home movie theater can be done for 500-1000 now and that is haveing the choice between a protector system or or a 60-80 flat screen tv ..and a few bean bag chairs ..

      then you can add the latest playstation or xbox
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      • Profile picture of the author tagiscom
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        prosperity .. you mean money trillions of dollars in mone printing that has no where to go but stock markets at the moment ..

        Yep!


        ok 100 ma be silly if someone ges good equipment the home movie theater can be done for 500-1000 now and that is haveing the choice between a protector system or or a 60-80 flat screen tv ..and a few bean bag chairs ..

        then you can add the latest playstation or xbox
        500-1000 still dreaming, at least in oz.

        I had a friend with a home setup, and it set him back at least $5000 - $10,000, (half a dozen, leather chairs staggered like a theatre has with elevation, a pretty good rear projector, and high end speakers).

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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by tagiscom View Post

          Yep!



          500-1000 still dreaming, at least in oz.

          I had a friend with a home setup, and it set him back at least $5000 - $10,000, (half a dozen, leather chairs staggered like a theatre has with elevation, a pretty good rear projector, and high end speakers).

          you missed the point ..but illustrated i=so if someone wants to make one room into real mini movie theater as you poin out 5,000 to 10,000..instead of the 50-100 thousand for everything it cost 30 years ago.

          but a poor person..who already has a laptop or cell phone with high speed internet ..if they do not already have the 60 inch tv .. and blue tooth speakers ..it could only cost a few hundred bucks for the projector and a new low end blue tooth .. and any room in a house can be be turned into a small movie theater .. and with 30 dollars worth of monthly subscription you can watch almost ever movie available .
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  • Profile picture of the author Princess Balestra
    How temptin' it would be to agree.

    "Jus' keep gowin'," she purred.

    But I would wanna believe always in a more evolvin' an' flexible direction ... which stays the course bcs it matches dreams to reality as smarter options arise from outta the creative glow.

    Sad to say, but sumtimes nowan purrs when stuff keeps gowin'.

    "Get offah me. This ain't sweet no more."

    Best direction for anythin' to be gowin' is when evrywan carried along.
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    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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  • Profile picture of the author Profit Traveler
    Banned
    Well Edison technically was Genius at Patenting the Light Bulb not inventing it.

    Zuckerburg Stole FaceBook.

    The McDonalds Brothers got ripped off by the guy that Sold them Shake Machines Ray Kroc

    The guys that discovered the housing bubble was about to burst did not become whistle blowers they made a Billion Dollars From it using the Banks games against them.

    But it is all very inspirational.
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  • Profile picture of the author Odahh
    claude i don't know how many people you have run into who claimed they have super power..or see ghosts on a regular basis .. but i'm usually just able to attribute those claim ..to the drugs they do or the drugs they have done ..

    many of the stories from the past generally involve people seeing things while in altered stated ..that they seem to believe more when they get to non altered state ..

    i'm open to a lot of beliefs but i tend to be very suspect of how others come to the out their beliefs they have.. many have jumped on board very popular BS from the alternative media/conspiracy sector ..all of it puts humans as some type of victum .. never really wanting to unravel it ..if we want to play the victum we will invent all kinds of forces outside of us and play along ..

    the only super power anyone can really have come from not being a victim or playing the victim or goping outside the limits victum create for themselves
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

      claude i don't know how many people you have run into who claimed they have super power..or see ghosts on a regular basis .. but i'm usually just able to attribute those claim ..to the drugs they do or the drugs they have done ..
      Really? We've had members here tell us that they have super powers. And have seen ghosts on a regular basis...and they get angry when you doubt them. If you ask questions, they suggest you "open your mind".
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      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Really? We've had members here tell us that they have super powers. And have seen ghosts on a regular basis...and they get angry when you doubt them. If you ask questions, they suggest you "open your mind".
        well anyone can claim anything on forums on the internet ..i can only hold what people say online against what i have heard people say face to face ..

        the language people use give them away ..and show some of what people know ..
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      • Profile picture of the author Profit Traveler
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Really? We've had members here tell us that they have super powers. And have seen ghosts on a regular basis...and they get angry when you doubt them. If you ask questions, they suggest you "open your mind".

        Oh Shiznit. Now I have to bring up the time I saw a ghost.


        Google Street View plus childhood location where I knew someone got killed.
        Saw face in widow they died, did not think about it until months later then realized that was victims face but now Google drove on the street again with clean new image. No proof.


        I guarantee you Google knows. All that footage from all over the world..but I bet they get numb to people playing jokes and having public sex when the google car passes them .
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  • Profile picture of the author socialentry
    Originally Posted by Claude

    So, should scientists listen to every Tom, Dick, or Harry? Yes, for a few seconds. If the argument is nonsensical, they have no need to evaluate it further, and no need to respond, unless it's their job to respond to everyone.
    ...
    But read a 5 sentence paragraph? Of course. In that 5 sentences, it's easy to determine if the thinking is faulty. And if there isn't a glaring flaw in the thinking, the proposition can be evaluated further.
    Not every crank can be debunked in less then 30 seconds.( If you're interested, see this for example about crank solutions to the trisection problem in mathematics:
    http://web.mst.edu/~lmhall/WhatToDoW...ectorComes.pdf)

    Now there's shortcut: there is an actual real proof that that the trisection problem is impossible so you don't even have to look to know it's wrong.

    But if they pick a popular conjecture which remains unproven(for which you can be sure there are crank solutions as complicated as for the trisection)... well, you have to find where the error is if you want to give it fair consideration.

    Also, IRL, the difficult part is usually not the logic, it's the checking underlying assumptions. I don't have the time to check every single claim: I can at best make an educated guess and fill the gaps by myself. That's why I want as much info on the originator as possible.


    Originally Posted by Claude

    Really? We've had members here tell us that they have super powers. And have seen ghosts on a regular basis...and they get angry when you doubt them. If you ask questions, they suggest you "open your mind".

    Roflmao, who said this?Does anyone wants to step up to the plate?


    Tagiscom, is it you?
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

      Also, IRL, the difficult part is usually not the logic, it's the checking underlying assumptions. I don't have the time to check every single claim: I can at best make an educated guess and fill the gaps by myself. That's why I want as much info on the originator as possible.
      So far, every assertion I've heard that was untrue had at least one logical fallacy attached to it. The premise can also be untrue, and should be checked. Sometimes it's not worth pursuing, depending on your level of interest.

      Personally, I love going down logical rabbit holes, after someone makes an assertion.

      And...there is a huge difference between having a wrong conclusion unintentionally, and being delusional. The delusional ones are spotted easily and soon. The smart people that just made a mistake are harder to catch.

      Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

      Roflmao, who said this?Does anyone wants to step up to the plate?


      Tagiscom, is it you?
      No names. But these claims range from just superstitions, like Dowsing, to Cosmic Powers, like being able to feel when the universe...the Universe, stopped expanding, and started contracting....

      Claims of being able to having telekinetic abilities, precognition, perfect memory.....

      Two members had a nice conversation about their shared ability to redirect bullets and arrows with their mind.

      We even had a guy years ago that was certain we were in the middle of a Zombie Apocalypse...and was very angry when we asked for evidence.

      There are others, but it would be cruel.

      To be fair, I believed things about as nonsensical when I was in my early 20s. I studied Kung Fu, and many of the claims were nonsense. Superstitions held on to over the centuries.

      As a teenager I was obsessed with learning how to levitate. I was convinced that it was just a matter of figuring it out. But Nope.

      I guess my excuse is that the brain is still forming when you are young...and I was a very...very naive kid.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
        This thread is getting off topic.

        So I thought I would share a saying that may be helpful: "It doesn't matter what People say, because where there's a will, there's a way ..."

        I don't know why however many times when a Person sets out to accomplish something "important" (/ "audacious" as Allen Says put it) ... They meet with a lot of "resistance" from other People. Insecurity maybe? In any case, I would love to hear your Guys' opinions on that.

        And your thoughts on being determined/persistent.
        Signature
        "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

          This thread is getting off topic.

          So I thought I would share a saying that may be helpful: "It doesn't matter what People say, because where there's a will, there's a way ..."
          This is a popular quote for one reason, it rhymes. And Will and Way start with the same sound..

          It also sounds hopeful, so it's popular.

          But is it true? No.

          Here is what is true. If there is a will, and something is possible, and you stick with it long enough, you'll eventually figure it out.

          Here is a similar statement "Whatever the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can achieve."

          Why is that popular? Because the words sound similar, like the lyrics of a song, or an advertising slogan. It's catchy. And it makes you feel good, believing that this is real.

          But is it true? No. There is an objective reality that these sayings never take into account. Your imagination and belief have no effect on this reality.

          So what would be a true statement? "Whatever the mind can conceive, and believe, it can achieve...as long as it's based on reality." It may be undiscovered reality, but it has to be a reality.

          Mentally ill people conceive and believe in the most incredible things. Their belief doesn't change reality. That's why they fall when they think they can fly.

          And now is the time to say something about being "Open Minded". After all, that's the section we are in.


          Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

          I don't know why however many times when a Person sets out to accomplish something "important" (/ "audacious" as Allen Says put it) ... They meet with a lot of "resistance" from other People.
          What kind of resistance could there be? Not believing in an idea? Stealing your money? Stealing your plans and burning them? Hiding your shoes?


          Someone with a new idea, someone wanting to actually accomplish something? I've found others are more interested in their own problems, their own daily lives, to care much about what I do.
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      • Profile picture of the author socialentry
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        So far, every assertion I've heard that was untrue had at least one logical fallacy attached to it.

        Meh. It depends on whom you talk to.

        it's not difficult to build a case where the premise is practically hard to check or outright wrong but the logic that follows is correct.
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        • Profile picture of the author Odahh
          Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

          Meh. It depends on whom you talk to.

          it's not difficult to build a case where the premise is practically hard to check or outright wrong but the logic that follows is correct.
          also the subject matter forget the super natural or esoteric .. outsourcing/automation Ai, Taxes and tax codes , then diet or what to eat ..
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

          Meh. It depends on whom you talk to.

          it's not difficult to build a case where the premise is practically hard to check or outright wrong but the logic that follows is correct.
          It may also depend on the education level of the person you are talking to. If they are talking about a subject out of your expertise, and they are very articulate, you can be fooled about the validity of the premise.

          I'm only speaking personally. I have no expertise in the vast majority of conversations, or the majority of articles I read. So I cannot rely on a superior knowledge base. But I can rely on a knowledge of what makes a bad argument.

          So I use that insight because it's more universal.

          And I know it's possible to use correct logic with faulty premises. But it's far more likely that a nonsensical idea will rely on one of several appeals that bypass the reasoning process.

          I suspect you are talking about highly technical subjects where most people would get lost right away.

          I'm more talking about subjects where the proponent says something like "If 1,000 people say they believe that UFOs have landed in their back yard, at least some of these claims must be true". That sort of gibberish.
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          • Profile picture of the author socialentry
            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            I'm more talking about subjects where the proponent says something like "If 1,000 people say they believe that UFOs have landed in their back yard, at least some of these claims must be true". That sort of gibberish.


            I'm not sure how you keep bumping into these people,

            I can honestly say that the only conspiracy theorists I interact with are solely on the WF. I have met a few who had strong beliefs in "these kind of subjects" but they can be counted on one hand.

            I don't know anyone IRL for example who listens to Alex Jones or who believes the US govt has bases on Mars. Or outright corona deniers. Or believe ET have landed at Roswell. (though to be fair, I've never asked)

            I think the LOA applies to you in this case, you must have a vibe that makes loonies go:

            "Ah finally, here comes someone that will listen to my lunacy. hey did you know I have been recruited by a talking cat to fight the forces of evil. "
            "
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

              I'm not sure how you keep bumping into these people,
              It's a combination if two things..
              1) I meet a lot of people. Mostly in selling, but also I attend lots of events, mostly as a speaker. I just remember the crazies more than most others. "Hi Claude, I'm a pet psychic and want to talk to you about selling my service"...I get that kind of thing often.

              2) Most people I know are small business owners. Maybe 98% are very Conservative, and about 30% have told me about one bizarre (to me) belief or another. Maybe 20% listen to Alex Jones, or Glenn Beck....for hours a day.

              You have to understand that to me, most things people think of as normal conversation, I see as signs of mental illness. It's not them, it's me. I look for the logical inconsistencies. It's a compulsion.

              But if you group conspiracy theories, UFO beliefs, superstitions, belief in ghosts, the zodiac, the belief that they can talk to the dead, the idea that a few people are in control of the world, etc....Maye 80% of the people I know are in that group to varying degrees.

              Just because they are a CEO, doesn't mean they aren't bat sh1t crazy. In fact, people who own businesses are more prone to share their odd beliefs, because they are used to people pretending that they are brilliant.

              And " "If 1,000 people say they believe that UFOs have landed in their back yard, at least some of these claims must be true". ? I've heard that type of argument here several times, and in real life many times.

              One thing I hear a lot is "Everything happens for a reason". To a sane mind, it's like claws against a chalk board.

              Also, I might add, I grew up around these people. Old wives tales and superstition were the science in my family.
              And I grew up in a poor area, with mostly very poor kids. Education and building any kind of wealth were actually frowned upon.

              Frankly, I'm surprised I survived. It's why I have a pathological hatred for being poor. And it's why I study how to think rationally. The alternative is abhorrent to me personally. It's hard for me to conceal sometimes.

              I suspect that you are used to talking to well educated people. It's just a different crowd than mine.
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            • Profile picture of the author myob
              Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

              I'm not sure how you keep bumping into these people
              These "people" are everywhere, and many are otherwise seemingly intelligent and rational.

              Over 60% of the US population believes in UFOs at least at some level, even though there is no evidence whatsoever of extraterrestrial origins.

              A large portion of UFO "believers" also are conspiracy theorists, including among many other "secrets", the government is hiding information about alien visitors and/or ET living among us.

              Sad, but true. Pseudoscience is a multi-billion dollar industry,

              P.S. I am a UFO debunker. Tough job. Very tough.
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              • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                Over 60% of the US population believes in UFOs at least at some level, even though there is no evidence whatsoever of extraterrestrial origins.
                One of the reasons we don't hear crazy things from everyone... all the time... is that most people are polite and want to keep rapport with you. And we want to keep rapport with them. so we try to stay out of conversations that lead to disagreements.

                But I know that ...if you talk to someone...anyone...long enough, they will say something that seems perfectly normal to them, and completely nonsensical to you.

                Sometimes I wonder....what nonsensical thing do I absolutely believe is absolutely true....that is utter nonsense?

                Years ago, I gave it quite a lot of thought, and came to the conclusion that 70% of everything I absolutely know is true...really isn't. And to me, a good day is when I can chip away at that, just a little.
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              • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                Originally Posted by myob View Post

                A large portion of UFO "believers" also are conspiracy theorists, including among many other "secrets", the government is hiding information about alien visitors and/or ET living among us.
                Years ago, I was at a business meeting at a large hotel. Two things were going on that fascinated me. a Star Trek convention was going on. I stood in line behind Mark Lenard (Mr. Spocks's dad) while we checked in. He insisted that nobody disturb him until he went on stage.

                Anyway, lots of people in full make up and costumes. Some of the people in my group had no idea what was going on, which I found amusing.

                The other event was a UFO convention. One large room. I went in, hoping to find a few science people I could talk with.

                Nope. No people that were talking about science. Lots of booths. Every one of them with some weird, nonsense. Magnets to cure disease, pyramids, crystals, books by people who were abducted....

                One lady showed me a picture she had bought. She said to me "It's a real photograph of a live alien". It was a pencil drawing.

                I was there for about half an hour. I had to leave, it was an assault on the senses.
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  • Profile picture of the author klixion
    A black belt is a white belt that didn't quit.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tom Heinz
    I got no beef with anyone but "just" keep going means no directions, no mapping, no preparation.

    Is it just me?
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    • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
      Originally Posted by Tom Heinz View Post

      I got no beef with anyone but "Just Keep Going" keep going means no directions, no mapping, no preparation.

      Is it just me?
      Fixed that for you.

      In many ways you are right if Jonathan (The Original Poster) did not elude to "no directions, no mapping, no preparation".

      To Jonatha's credit he did in fact elude to "no directions, no mapping, no preparation" albeit he did not articulate what he said in a forum of his peers that actually practice and do it for a living and he misquoted famous people out of context.

      So, it is not just you.
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      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
        Originally Posted by Jeffery View Post

        Fixed that for you.

        In many ways you are right if Jonathan (The Original Poster) did not elude to "no directions, no mapping, no preparation".

        To Jonatha's credit he did in fact elude to "no directions, no mapping, no preparation" albeit he did not articulate what he said in a forum of his peers that actually practice and do it for a living and he misquoted famous people out of context.

        So, it is not just you.
        there is also the part about him making the same kind of post about every six months with basically the same content using basically the same misquotes ... out of context . with no attempt on his part to provide any context ..

        just claim read and be empowered
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        • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
          Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

          there is also the part about him making the same kind of post about every six months with basically the same content using basically the same misquotes ... out of context . with no attempt on his part to provide any context ..

          just claim read and be empowered
          I'm still going to use quotations in my Communications because I think it's an excellent way to learn. That's partly how I learn. Different People find different approaches appealing.

          However I'm definitely going to start providing more of my experiences (etc.)
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          "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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  • Profile picture of the author Perimeter 81
    @Jonathan 2.0, first of all, I would like to say that this is a great article, I liked it very much!
    Don't remember who but someone said -*If you can't run - then walk, if you can't walk - then crawl,*if you can't crawl- then lay on the ground,*stretch your hands forward and think positive about your goal.
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    • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
      Originally Posted by Perimeter 81 View Post

      Don't remember who but someone said -*If you can't run - then walk, if you can't walk - then crawl,*if you can't crawl- then lay on the ground,*stretch your hands forward and think positive about your goal.
      Yeah... I think the bear still got him.
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  • Profile picture of the author TobiMDD
    I guess it's almost impossible to start a business from scratch without failing..
    Therefore yes I agree...


    "A winner is just a loser who tried one more time."
    -- George Augustus Moore
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by TobiMDD View Post

      "A winner is just a loser who tried one more time."
      -- George Augustus Moore
      I disagree. Winners and losers are a different species.

      winners don't "try one more time", they don't stop trying the first time. And they figure out what they are doing wrong, and correct it, mid stream.

      losers always have a reason that the last attempt failed, and it's never their fault. So they "try again"....

      But losers "Try". And even starting something, thinking you are going to "Try", means your mind has already anticipated that you are going to fail.

      "I'll try" is synonymous with "I'll fail".

      Winners don't say "I'll try". They say "I'll figure it out".





      "Do or don't do. There is no try" Yoda, Jedi Master.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I disagree. Winners and losers are a different species.

        winners don't "try one more time", they don't stop trying the first time. And they figure out what they are doing wrong, and correct it, mid stream.

        losers always have a reason that the last attempt failed, and it's never their fault. So they "try again"....

        But losers "Try". And even starting something, thinking you are going to "Try", means your mind has already anticipated that you are going to fail.

        "I'll try" is synonymous with "I'll fail".

        Winners don't say "I'll try". They say "I'll figure it out".

        "Do or don't do. There is no try" Yoda, Jedi Master.
        So very true. Two years ago I was asked by a industry leader in the telecommunications industry to attend a "work shop" led by one their finest. A problem needed solved and after much study they could not put their finger on the solution.


        My job was to work from the beginning as was the other participants and see why, how and who could solve their problem. Long story short, I solved their problem in less than 30 minutes.


        When the dust settled I asked the leader of the team "why" I was selected to participate. Her answer was "You were one of the few who said "I'll figure it out."
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      • Profile picture of the author Odahh
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        I disagree. Winners and losers are a different species.

        winners don't "try one more time", they don't stop trying the first time. And they figure out what they are doing wrong, and correct it, mid stream.

        losers always have a reason that the last attempt failed, and it's never their fault. So they "try again"....

        But losers "Try". And even starting something, thinking you are going to "Try", means your mind has already anticipated that you are going to fail.

        "I'll try" is synonymous with "I'll fail".

        Winners don't say "I'll try". They say "I'll figure it out".





        "Do or don't do. There is no try" Yoda, Jedi Master.
        running into many people from the lowest rung to the higherish single digit(7 figures) millionaire .. relm ..

        i i personally will only put the looser term on people actively taking part in messing their lives up and getting better a making their situation worse ..and pulling down the people willing to stay around them .. so their crappy lives negatively impact those people around them .

        living in a in a consumer driven culture .. the default picture of winner you point people at is the high income expensive lifestyle ...

        the people who win that game work all the time .. build equity ,and use leverage in ways that benefit them ..

        but there are many people in between if you are only going to declare the top 1 percent winners or the top 10 percent ..there will always be that other 90-99 percent..below the cutoff . if it financial measurement alone
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

          living in a in a consumer driven culture .. the default picture of winner you point people at is the high income expensive lifestyle ...

          the people who win that game work all the time .. build equity ,and use leverage in ways that benefit them ..
          You are mistaking my meaning.

          There are degrees of winning. Most people earn enough money to pay their bills, keep a family, and take an occasional vacation. Some do more, some do less. But none of these people are losers. And you can have a meager wage and still not be a loser.

          To me, a loser has several characteristics that apply to them. And frankly, I don't know anyone who has one of these characteristics...that doesn't have them all.

          They complain about the world, without ever including themselves as part of a solution....or part of the problem.

          They say "They should..." quite a lot. Because remember, everything bad is someone else's doing.

          They don't feel a sense of personal responsibility for their lot in life. They see the world as things done to them, not things they do themselves.

          When they make a big mistake, it's always someone else's fault. They never say they tripped. They say they were pushed.

          When they get fired, it's never something they did, It's always unfair.

          They think life is unfair...to them.

          They don't always play the lottery, but it's a big thing among the loser crowd. Why? Because they believe it's the only way they can get ahead in life, by luck.

          When they meet someone far more successful than they are, they never just think "Good for them". It's always that the wealthy person did something evil to get their money, or somehow took advantage of others.

          They see a very nice home and think "It must be nice", and not "I wonder what they know that I don't?"

          They believe there is some unseen force that is keeping them from doing better. It cannot be their fault. Never.




          These are losers. Some have families, some have decent jobs. But they are caustic...psychic vampires. And they are everywhere. My guess is that 40% of the people fit in this group. Much of it is from how they were taught as children.
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          • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
            Originally Posted by Jeffery View Post

            Just Keep Going ... my wife's favorite expression
            I don't have a Wife or steady Girlfriend ... However I liked this quotation from Winston Churchill

            "Winston, if you were my Husband I would put poison in your tea." "Nancy, if you were my Wife ... I'd drink it!"

            Lol sorry I don't know the original context ― just thought it was a funny/witty remark.

            Originally Posted by TobiMDD View Post

            "A winner is just a loser who tried one more time."
            -- George Augustus Moore
            Nice. Despite what some LOA (etc.) Practitioners like to claim, a Person must keep taking action ― even small actions ― until they're successful. "Fall down 7 times and get up 8", as the Japanese proverb states.

            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            To me, a loser has several characteristics that apply to them. And frankly, I don't know anyone who has one of these characteristics...that doesn't have them all.

            They complain about the world, without ever including themselves as part of a solution....or part of the problem.

            They say "They should..." quite a lot. Because remember, everything bad is someone else's doing.

            They don't feel a sense of personal responsibility for their lot in life. They see the world as things done to them, not things they do themselves. [Edited]
            Personally I don't take a whole group of People and label them as being "losers" just because they don't have the same thoughts and actions (and accomplishments) that I do.

            As I learned from Susan Jeffers ("Feel The Fear And Do It Anyway") most People are just doing the best they can given their specific thoughts/mindsets (etc.) and circumstances. Another degrading label isn't something that will help them improve their Lives.
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            • Profile picture of the author Bad News Brown
              Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

              "Fall down 7 times and get up 8".
              What if you don't beat the count?
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            • Profile picture of the author socialentry
              Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

              Personally I don't take a whole group of People and label them as being "losers" just because they don't have the same thoughts and actions (and accomplishments) that I do.


              but what about the third reich.or the ottoman empire.


              or what about volonteers for the campaign to re elect jimmy carter.
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post



              Personally I don't take a whole group of People and label them as being "losers" just because they don't have the same thoughts and actions (and accomplishments) that I do.
              Neither do I.


              Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

              As I learned from Susan Jeffers ("Feel The Fear And Do It Anyway") most People are just doing the best they can given their specific thoughts/mindsets (etc.) and circumstances. Another degrading label isn't something that will help them improve their Lives.
              I agree. I cannot improve their lot in life. In fact, nobody can. That's what defines them.

              Do you know what doesn't help them? Support....saying "You're OK just the way you are". You become an Enabler. And this section of the forum is a Support Group.

              There are hard things to hear. I know. But you cannot live your life eating baby food. OK, some do, but without challenges, nobody does anything.

              Sorry, I'm used to talking to business people, so I can sound a little jarring, if you're not used to it. Call it tough love, if you like.....or whatever you want to call it. I have a thick skin. I may look morbidly obese, but it's all skin.
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              • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                Do you know what doesn't help them? Support....saying "You're OK just the way you are".
                I think it would depend how a Person supports them ... Many People with low self-esteem for example would probably appreciate encouragement and support in some form. Maybe not like your example (telling them everything is OK etc ...) however it could still be helpful.

                That's my opinion, anyway. Thanks for the discussion. : )
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                "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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                • Profile picture of the author Odahh
                  Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                  I think it would depend how a Person supports them ... Many People with low self-esteem for example would probably appreciate encouragement and support in some form. Maybe not like your example (telling them everything is OK etc ...) however it could still be helpful.

                  That's my opinion, anyway. Thanks for the discussion. : )
                  appreciation support and anything that makes someone with low self asteem feel better in the short term .. is a tool of evil people.

                  real self improvement and building self confidence through learning skills that can be used to improve a person's life ..that produce something and give them a higher sense of personal value ..that makes them feel of use to the world.

                  when life switches from someone being a loser and pretty much worthless ..to discovering life has an unlimited and growing way for people to be productive .. or creative ..that is the only real way to put someone on a path out of being a looser ..

                  going from having no control over their lives to learning to do thing that improve their lives on regular basis ..

                  giving the drugs or motivational feel good stuff that create short term dopamine boosts ..is sinister and evil without teaching people skill that improve their lives
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                  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
                    Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

                    One thing I hear a lot is "Everything happens for a reason". To a sane mind, it's like claws against a chalk board.
                    Well thought-out (and rational) post/argument Claude. I like the above saying because for me it means that no matter how difficult and challenging a Person's experience is ... They can always learn something from it. I know that may seem kind of "obvious" however for me it's been Life-changing.

                    (That said I'm sure the phrase can get somewhat tiresome and diluted from overuse.)

                    2C
                    Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

                    appreciation support and anything that makes someone with low self esteem feel better in the short term .. is a tool of evil people.
                    Lol. Sorry, that's just nonsense. Just because some People do that doesn't mean that everyone who offers support, comfort, and encouragement are being "evil". Quite the opposite sometimes they're being very helpful and generous. Of course that's not to say that some of them are being "shady" (etc.)

                    Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

                    real self improvement and building self confidence through learning skills that can be used to improve a person's life ..that produce something and give them a higher sense of personal value ..that makes them feel of use to the world.
                    Actually, I agree with that part. Now you're making sense. : ) Giving them the skills and tools (etc.) that will empower them is important for sure. (Many times a Person can't just offer support etc.)
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                    • Profile picture of the author socialentry
                      Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

                      Well thought-out (and rational) post/argument Claude. I like the above saying because for me it means that no matter how difficult and challenging a Person's experience is ... They can always learn something from it. I know that may seem kind of "obvious" however for me it's been Life-changing.

                      (That said I'm sure the phrase can get somewhat tiresome and diluted from overuse.)
                      I've said it before but this is not quite true:

                      If you die from it, you might die too fast to learn anything.

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    • Profile picture of the author Frank Donovan
      Originally Posted by TobiMDD View Post

      "A winner is just a loser who tried one more time."
      -- George Augustus Moore
      So is a loser.
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  • Profile picture of the author Princess Balestra
    "Maybe after we're done here with pizza I can insert a probe to suck your brains out."


    yeah ... been there ...
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    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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    • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
      Originally Posted by manifestsuccess View Post

      Small positive changes + time + consistency = RADICAL CHANGE
      + T I M E

      WILL reflect changes, positive, negative or indifferent.

      The thing is, though, time is finite for us all. How long does one keep on keeping on? Decades? A lifetime? Until death do we part?

      I prefer TRY ANOTHER WAY over keeping on.

      GordonJ
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

        + T I M E

        WILL reflect changes, positive, negative or indifferent.

        The thing is, though, time is finite for us all. How long does one keep on keeping on? Decades? A lifetime? Until death do we part?

        I prefer TRY ANOTHER WAY over keeping on.

        GordonJ
        Sweeping cultural changes take decades...maybe generations.

        But personal changes? Changes in what you are doing? Those changes can take place in a day. Because all you have to do is change the direction you are facing...and walk.


        Most people want the world to change to better suite them. They spend an entire life hoping that everyone else on earth will align with them....adapt to them.

        When you hear "They should" or "They need to..." that's when you know you have one of those people.

        But a few just figure out it's a far easier thing to do to simply align yourself with the rest of the world. And that can be done today.

        Yes, I feel better now.

        And you are right. When I was selling, I would try an approach....a technique...I might give it three attempts. If I couldn't make it work, I'd drop the idea and do something else.
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        • Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post


          Most people want the world to change to better suite them.

          .
          Can I amplify your typo here?

          Despite your Claudesy Capricorn way, you jus' hit on the truth in an instant here via undeliberate miraculature!

          Thing is, las' time I looked, world fulla way plenty othah people than Moi.

          Which means if'n I wanna bend 'em to my poisanal will, prolly I eithah gotta be a stable genius or train my boobies to thwap around athletically while still maintaining their essential sartorial perkiness.

          Or mebbe I should learn DOLPHIN an' summon to my wetsuit-clad enthoosiasm sum kinda ECO SWAT TEAM gonna sieve all plastic from the ocean with waffles I incinerated while tryin' to 'entertain'.

          All I know is, summa the sweetest people could actschswlly make a diffrence don't got no kinda powah ...

          while monstahs with their eyeballs screwed in wrong way round stomp their VISION 'pon the planet whenevah nuthin' much happin' on TV.

          Dunno who said what maelstrom have I been summoned to meet (it is a poetic quote tippa my tongue, but equally it mighta been Mom), but it is a question we all gottah ansah.

          Suite plays to nestin' instinct, I guess.

          Jus' gotta show up with feathahs, gonna be OK.

          Those are my thoughts on your extra e.

          A momentary flourish, an accidentally obvious thing to be.
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          • Profile picture of the author myob
            Good catch on that typoe!

            Originally Posted by Princess Balestra View Post

            Can I amplify your typo here?

            Despite your Claudesy Capricorn way, you jus' hit on the truth in an instant here via undeliberate miraculature!

            Thing is, las' time I looked, world fulla way plenty othah people than Moi.

            Which means if'n I wanna bend 'em to my poisanal will, prolly I eithah gotta be a stable genius or train my boobies to thwap around athletically while still maintaining their essential sartorial perkiness.

            Or mebbe I should learn DOLPHIN an' summon to my wetsuit-clad enthoosiasm sum kinda ECO SWAT TEAM gonna sieve all plastic from the ocean with waffles I incinerated while tryin' to 'entertain'.

            All I know is, summa the sweetest people could actschswlly make a diffrence don't got no kinda powah ...

            while monstahs with their eyeballs screwed in wrong way round stomp their VISION 'pon the planet whenevah nuthin' much happin' on TV.

            Dunno who said what maelstrom have I been summoned to meet (it is a poetic quote tippa my tongue, but equally it mighta been Mom), but it is a question we all gottah ansah.

            Suite plays to nestin' instinct, I guess.

            Jus' gotta show up with feathahs, gonna be OK.

            Those are my thoughts on your extra e.

            A momentary flourish, an accidentally obvious thing to be.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
        Originally Posted by manifestsuccess View Post

        Small positive changes + time + consistency = RADICAL CHANGE
        Excellent: Thanks manifestsuccess. : ) Sometimes it's amazing all the progress a Person can make when they just commit to doing something consistently.

        For example one of my favourite insights (from John Assaraf) is "The Value Of An Hour": Essentially if a Person commits to just working on something (a Website/Business) for just 1 hour a day ― they will accumulate the equivalent of: Nine 40-hour weeks over the course of a year. OK. Let's multiply that by 5 or 6 hours. (Lol).

        Anyway, thanks again for the post.

        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

        + T I M E

        WILL reflect changes, positive, negative or indifferent.

        The thing is, though, time is finite for us all. How long does one keep on keeping on? Decades? A lifetime? Until death do we part?
        I prefer TRY ANOTHER WAY over keeping on.
        GordonJ
        Hi GordonJ

        I understand what you mean as well. And I completely agree that it's important to respond to those changes. In fact many times it's not even an option if a Person wants to succeed. Unfortunately People many give up at the first sign of "defeat/failure."

        Another important aspect is the overall goal. For example a Person may have the goal of being a Six-Figure Entrepreneur and by responding to feedback over time (even a "failure" or "multiple failures" )... They're in the process of accomplishing their goal. (And not giving up.)

        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        And you are right. When I was selling, I would try an approach....a technique...I might give it three attempts. If I couldn't make it work, I'd drop the idea and do something else.
        Another good point Claude. I believe it was Thomas J. Watson that said (when talking to sales People) "You can be discouraged by failure, or you can learn from it." Essentially he meant learning from feedback ― it's just that many people think of it (or look at it) as being a "failure""/mistake." Again the ones that succeed are those that keep going. : )

        2C
        P.S. If I have mentioned something before, my apologies ― I just think this is an important subject.
        Signature
        "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by manifestsuccess View Post

      Small positive changes + time + consistency = RADICAL CHANGE
      Ok so my fault with that is based off me being a crazy person .. willing topack a bag .. and move to another part of the world or another part of the country to for myself to change radically ..for the better ..

      in nature a hard pruning can encourage vigorus new growth in plants .. and through my path of enlightenment .. i just has to go through period that forced me to drop a lot of heavy beliefs and pent up emotions .

      i wanted toget through all that crap as fast as possible rather than spending the next 40 years going to counseling 2 times a week and needing psych meds to get out of bed .. then get through the day and go to bed ..

      now while the world is shut down i am up staying with my brother ..and i might actually go to india ..next year .. do not know yet ..but the next thing i need to do is go more vegatiern ..so i want to go where i can eat great vegetarian food and learn to cook many tasty vegetarian dishes .. but that is six to 9 months away before i can make any plan ..

      if you want radical positive lifelong change ..you need to make radical moves

      i still have yet to figure out where i want to live permanently .
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  • Profile picture of the author BuckyBoy
    Persistance is important, but just as important is - _focus_. We all have a tendency to be interested in other 'opportunities', but they take away from our main goal. To be successful you need lazer focus on your main gig.
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    • Profile picture of the author Profit Traveler
      Banned
      Originally Posted by BuckyBoy View Post

      Persistance is important, but just as important is - _focus_. We all have a tendency to be interested in other 'opportunities', but they take away from our main goal. To be successful you need lazer focus on your main gig.

      Definitely agree but our very nature and the nature of this business challenges that focus almost non stop.

      New tools, new platforms, maybe you get approached to do a special project.

      I know if I was huge on Amazon and got a commissions cut that would change my focus quick but you make a great point just not a easy one.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rashida Qureshi
    I think failure has a lot to do with ego and a sense of entitlement. A fear of failure usually tends to come from the fact that people do not like losing, it hurts their ego. I like the idea of leaving your ego at the door when it comes to trying new things, as failure is almost always guaranteed. Thoughts?
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    • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
      Originally Posted by Rashida Qureshi View Post

      I think failure has a lot to do with ego and a sense of entitlement. A fear of failure usually tends to come from the fact that people do not like losing, it hurts their ego. I like the idea of leaving your ego at the door when it comes to trying new things, as failure is almost always guaranteed. Thoughts?
      I haven't heard that before however I suppose it makes sense.

      Failure isn't always guaranteed ― and even if it was ― it's simply an experience that a Person can learn from. As for "Ego" and "Sense of entitlement" that's a whole other discussion. The problem I see with many People is that they think they know everything ... When in reality they don't.
      Signature
      "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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      • Profile picture of the author socialentry
        Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

        Failure isn't always guaranteed ― and even if it was ― it's simply an experience that a Person can learn from.

        Agreed. I feel we can learn a lot from Mike Tyson's example who have had many failure in his life but is much more succesful then most



        (including IMO Tony Robbins)
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    • Profile picture of the author Odahh
      Originally Posted by Rashida Qureshi View Post

      I think failure has a lot to do with ego and a sense of entitlement. A fear of failure usually tends to come from the fact that people do not like losing, it hurts their ego. I like the idea of leaving your ego at the door when it comes to trying new things, as failure is almost always guaranteed. Thoughts?
      Well yes .the problem comes when people define themselves as failures and somehow figure out how to get some reward from past failures and bad happenings.

      Everyone is going to fail at many points in their lives some people will use the failure to fire their engine of success. Some will aim at the next failure and go from failure to failure.

      And the majority of people attempt to play the game of minimizing any kind of failure .
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by Odahh View Post

        Everyone is going to fail at many points in their lives some people will use the failure to fire their engine of success. Some will aim at the next failure and go from failure to failure.

        And the majority of people attempt to play the game of minimizing any kind of failure .
        When I've failed at something, my first reaction is "Well, that didn't work".

        It's never "I failed at that". The "That didn't work" response is a next step in improvement, The "I failed at that" is a self destructive self direction. The end result is "I fail at everything".

        And when I succeed at something it's "OK, that worked", not "I succeeded at that". No idea why I take myself out of it, not matter the result.



        Originally Posted by Rashida Qureshi View Post

        I think failure has a lot to do with ego and a sense of entitlement. A fear of failure usually tends to come from the fact that people do not like losing, it hurts their ego.
        People don't fear failure, they fear rejection. That's why they generally keep their mistakes to themselves and talk about their successes. It's why a mechanic doesn't take it personally when a repair takes longer after a few attempts. But if he gets turned down for a promotion, it eats at him.

        You cannot take failure personally unless you consider the people that saw your failure, or find out about it.

        Imagine that you are alone on a desert island. Could you ever feel successful? Would you ever feel humility? boastful? like a failure? like an Alpha? Entitled? Deserving? A sense of fairness?

        These feelings are dependent on other people....how others see you. And they are dependent on the fact that you care how others see you.

        at least that's my experience.
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  • Profile picture of the author hsvdm
    I have started my online enterprenur journedy from fiver, then i realized i need to step out of the box, Then I started trying adsense,. And it was complicated at the beginning. when it goes day by day I realized it is the best investment I have ever done,. Now I have more than 100 websites that will generate a combine income more than 10000 USD
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    • Profile picture of the author Jeffery
      Originally Posted by hsvdm View Post

      I have started my online enterprenur journedy from fiver, then i realized i need to step out of the box, Then I started trying adsense,. And it was complicated at the beginning. when it goes day by day I realized it is the best investment I have ever done,. Now I have more than 100 websites that will generate a combine income more than 10000 USD
      Good on you. Mean that in a good way.
      Signature
      In the minute it took me to write this post.. someone died of Covid 19. RIP.
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