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Are ALL "Gurus" a FAKE???

by Foreigner
32 replies
I've been in the WF for quite some time now but, as my post count attest. I visit the forum more like an observer and to get the pulse of the IM niche (online & offline).

Usually people judge others by post count. Is post count a real measurement of a person's knowledge?. We may all have a wide variety of opinions on this matter.

For me, it depends, but that is not always the case. Personally, I've been doing sales online since 2009. My niche is kind of specialized and my average sales commission is $425.00 per sale. All with my simple website that ranks #1 in my niche with SEO traffic & excellent/relevant content only ( survived Panda,Penguin and the whole Google zoo!!). Also I do business offline. As a matter of fact, this afternoon I will pick up a check from a new offline customer for the amount of $997.60. But my post count is low.... LoL But, I do not consider myself a "Guru" or anything like that.

Do all "Gurus" have high number of posts? What is a "Guru" after all?? Are "Gurus" for real or it is all an illusion?

What motivated me to write this post, which I never did before, is a documentary I saw last night on Netflix, all by pure coincidence, which fits this topic to perfection.

The documentary name is "Kumare" and it is about a New Jersey's filmmaker with Indian roots looking for the truth about "Gurus". The documentary shows and proves, that most of the spiritual "Guru" leaders/guides are a fake and that they all gain their power and followers by a natural/psychological need of the followers to have a leader/guide to follow. The filmmaker decided to start a new fake spiritual philosophy and transformed himself to "look like a "Guru".

He invented fake joga moves, meditation techniques and even imitated the Indian accent when speaking English!! Most of his faked moves and teachings will make you laugh!!

The most amazing fact about this journey/experiment is.... HE GOT FOLLOWERS!! Followers who"inexplicable" found a "connection" with his faked teachings and techniques!! He never practiced or reaped any true rewards from what he was preaching and teaching, but he got followers. He was not a Guru!! he was posing as one and people believed him!!

Do you find a similarity with this and the IM world?? Are all IM "Gurus" a fake? or it is OUR perception that they are?. Is it our need to look for a "higher power" or a n "enlightened being" to direct our path to success? The answer to these questions are also found in this documentary. The answer is, we are ALL our OWN Gurus!! We all have the power to achieve anything we desired.

His followers discovered that what they needed to do to achieve their goals was something they already know!! But they where not doing it!! They needed a "Guru" to tell them so they can believe in themselves and do what they know they had to do.

I will not say what happen at the end when he "unveils" his real "self" to his followers and the followers reaction. But for me was quite enlightening.

Real "Gurus" do exist in real life and inside the IM world. But the best "Guru" is YOU. You know what you have to do. Take action, be responsible for your results and 'just do it"!!! There are no magical powers to success, no magic potions or push button solutions. Just you. You need to start doing what you know you should be doing.

Watch the "Kumare" documentary, reach your own conclusions and let me know. I am sure you will start looking at you in a different way.

Your Warrior friend,

Foreigner
#fake #gurus
  • Profile picture of the author Robert Michael
    I'm quite real.. lol everyone is.

    Naaaaaa just kiddin. I'm not a 'guru' - I just thought of the name & liked it.

    But I am real.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      I saw the documentary.

      The idea of a Guru is flawed in that it assumes that one person has a great amount of insight that nobody else has.

      If you are following the Man, that's a mistake. I've never seen it otherwise. But reading what they teach can be enlightening.

      If you are a follower, that means you'll just trust this person to make decisions for you...and not thinking will be the result.

      If you are a student, you are looking to know as much as the Guru. In most instances, it's not that hard.

      Question everything. Doubt everything. If something is true, the evidence will always support it. Blind Faith gave us the Dark Ages.

      Dan Kennedy once said from the front of the room "Be The Wizard...But Beware The Wizard". Meaning have followers, but don't become a follower.

      And when he said "Be The Wizard...But Beware The Wizard"...I looked over to the lady sitting next to me and said "Said The Wizard". I don't think she got it.

      What I meant was that there were 1,000 people in the audience that simply believed everything he said, most without thinking.

      I've had a few people act like I'm a Guru (I'm a speaker and author). I try to correct them. Simply seeing someone as an expert in everything is always faulty thinking.

      But are there people that are extraordinary experts that have a lot to teach? Absolutely. But learn from them, don't follow them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Natniszakov
    I think that as long as what the person teaches or preaches helps you, you are good to go.
    Same here, no, number of post don't say that much, but reputation does, there are some people here that is very well known, they are really good at this. And if you're lucky enogh to reach them, they can teach you some amazing stuff.
    And yeah, you're right, you are the only one who take action for yourself, nobody else is goint to do that for you, you can be your own Guru. You are the only one who is stopping yourself from achieving all your goals.
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  • Profile picture of the author Joan Altz
    Well, truthfully - and others may disagree with me here - there are not many true "gurus" on this forum. A few, yes, like Willie Crawford, and I'm not saying these people can't teach anything, but most multi-millionaire marketers are not here. Gurus don't generally sell their material at $1 to $27 a pop, and most of them at some point become high-end consultants, trainers, and conduct seminars, not webinars.

    I guess it just depends on what you consider to be a guru or not. To me, not many are here, but the people who do pass themselves off as such (though I doubt you'll find anyone actually calling themselves a "guru" lol) are decent for most part and worth listening to, but some have simply tapped into something that works for them and trying to pass it along, and that doesn't make them a guru.
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by Joan Altz View Post

      Well, truthfully - and others may disagree with me here - there are not many true "gurus" on this forum. A few, yes, like Willie Crawford, and I'm not saying these people can't teach anything, but most multi-millionaire marketers are not here. Gurus don't generally sell their material at $1 to $27 a pop, and most of them at some point become high-end consultants, trainers, and conduct seminars, not webinars.

      I guess it just depends on what you consider to be a guru or not. To me, not many are here, but the people who do pass themselves off as such (though I doubt you'll find anyone actually calling themselves a "guru" lol) are decent for most part and worth listening to, but some have simply tapped into something that works for them and trying to pass it along, and that doesn't make them a guru.


      Thanks Joan. You are right. Not many true Gurus in real life. This is one the definitions of Guru I found online:

      gu·ru
      [ goo, roo ]

      1. Hindu or Sikh religious teacher: in Hinduism and Sikhism, a religious leader or teacher
      2. leader of religious group: a spiritual leader or intellectual guide for a religious group or movement, especially one considered not to be mainstream
      3. influential expert: somebody who has a reputation as an expert leader, teacher, or practitioner in a particular field

      Basically, an intellectual guide, spiritual leader & teacher. There are people in this industry that definitively have real talent, high level of knowledge & expertise but are not leaders or teachers. So knowledge per se does not automatically makes a person a Guru.

      A real Guru, is one that has the knowledge, wisdom and kind of spiritual connection to influence his followers. As in the definition : "influential expert: somebody who has a reputation as an expert leader, teacher, or practitioner in a particular field"

      And usually as you said, a real Guru rarely refer himself (herself) as a Guru.

      Most auto denominated Gurus lack all of the above, some have all of the above. Those with the gift to connect, teach and share are the real gurus. The rest of the group, as in the Kumare documentary, are just fake pretenders.
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  • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
    Originally Posted by Nile Vincent View Post

    Well, a guru to me is someone who is genuinely sincere and straight-forward in their delivery...whatever that may be...not to mention competent in their area...

    Since we're in the WF here...and it's primarily an Internet Marketing area...I thought I'd just state who I believe is a sincere "guru"...who actually practices what he preaches...which is quite rare...

    I have been a fan of Chris Farrell's IM training for yrs now...

    Anyone that's new or relatively new to this arena would be doing themselves justice to sign up for a buck...$1...and check it out...for a full seven days...

    Voted No. 1 Internet Marketing Service Online by IMReport Card. Chris Farrell Membership is for those serious about creating a regular and continuous income online...

    The comprehensive training in his membership area is above and beyond what I see anywhere else...in terms of ease to learn and the nature of the training...

    Sure, you've got many instructors etc out there that are good...yet Chris Farrell's style of teaching is relaxing and on-point...

    You'll walk away with quite a bit of IM knowledge...in an ordered and easily managed style...

    Just click here to Check it out...

    I have to say I do agree with you regarding Chris Farell. Even though I think he is not calling himself a "Guru" , his teachings are well worthy.

    When I started online I subscribed to his membership site and learned a lot. This is one of the few examples of knowledgeable professionals who 'walk the walk" and do draw followers without auto proclamating themselves "Gurus"

    As I stated on my post, there are real spiritual /gurus and IM Gurus, but as it was perfectly explained by Claude Whitacre in a post reply, you should follow the teachings and wisdom, not the person.

    There are people out there with real desire to help others and to share their knowledge. We all must have to be careful not to fall for the illusion of those self proclaimed 'gurus' that does not necessary "walk the walk' and just mesmerize with theoretical stuff.

    People usually tend to follow the illusion of the "Guru" figure even though that person never applied his/her teachings.

    This is quite a difference than to find a knowledgeable mentor, get direction & focus and take action. Do not get mesmerized by the "Guru" illusion.

    Button line.... you ARE a GURU!!!
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  • Profile picture of the author RogozRazvan
    Without going into a debate about this, no, not all gurus are fake. I guess it depends on what you call a guru.

    For example, Aristotle can be called a guru of philosophy. OK, ok, I know you are not talking about this. But folks like Eben Pagan are legit for the most part. Yes, they over-hype their products. Almost everyone does.

    Yes, most benefits presented when selling those products are a best case scenario, without actually mentioning this. And yes, it's a numbers game.

    But the difference between a "guru" and a fake is how good that game is. No person will ever create something to get results 100% of the time for the simple fact that markets change, circumstances change and people come in all sizes and shapes.

    But if 1 out of 10 people who buy "the mega internet marketing course" actually reach some decent results, it's a start. If it's 3 out of 10, you are a hero
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by RogozRazvan View Post

      Without going into a debate about this, no, not all gurus are fake. I guess it depends on what you call a guru.

      For example, Aristotle can be called a guru of philosophy. OK, ok, I know you are not talking about this. But folks like Eben Pagan are legit for the most part. Yes, they over-hype their products. Almost everyone does.

      Yes, most benefits presented when selling those products are a best case scenario, without actually mentioning this. And yes, it's a numbers game.

      But the difference between a "guru" and a fake is how good that game is. No person will ever create something to get results 100% of the time for the simple fact that markets change, circumstances change and people come in all sizes and shapes.

      But if 1 out of 10 people who buy "the mega internet marketing course" actually reach some decent results, it's a start. If it's 3 out of 10, you are a hero
      Hi Rogoz....yeah...no person will ever create something to get results 100% of time, since there is a "persona" variable which is uncontrollable; the ability of those who purchased the "guru's" course and actually take action!!

      As I stated before, there are respectful leaders in this industry, real gurus that fit the definition :"influential expert: somebody who has a reputation as an expert leader, teacher, or practitioner in a particular field". Willie Crawford, Eben Pagan & Chris Farrell to mention just a few, fit that definition.

      These people are influential experts and have reputation as experts, teachers and practitioner in particular field.

      My real concern basically comes with those self claimed "gurus" that have no reputation as expert leader and are not practitioners of their teachings.

      Most of the fake gurus, like in the Kumare documentary, dress like a guru, talk like a guru and people believe they are gurus!!.

      Most of these, make their living by feeding & selling the illusion but never practice what they teach.
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      • Profile picture of the author t3cn1c0
        I actually agree with you. However sometimes it really helps that you look up to someone in figuring out what you want in life.

        Some of the Gurus in the IM world can be really helpful to motivate and guide someone to succeed. However you need to work on it, take action. You will be the one who will determine your success in life after all.
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        • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
          Originally Posted by t3cn1c0 View Post

          I actually agree with you. However sometimes it really helps that you look up to someone in figuring out what you want in life.

          Some of the Gurus in the IM world can be really helpful to motivate and guide someone to succeed. However you need to work on it, take action. You will be the one who will determine your success in life after all.

          Thanks t3cnico,

          Yes, there are times when guidance is needed. But we must be aware of who is who. Quoting Claude in a previous reply :"Follow the teachings, not the man".
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  • Profile picture of the author TuNguyen
    1. There are many level of truths in the old adage that, "Those who can not do; teach."

    (Note - This is not meant to be an insult, however can often be taken as such.)

    You must always ask yourself; If someone is having the level of success they claim to be having, then why don't they just focus on making more money doing that, instead of essentially generating more competition for themselves?

    2. Its not how frequently someone talks, but the quality of what is being said.

    3. People do not always apply scepticism to their lives, or they do, but do not apply it to areas that needs it most. Some people, are just too willing to be mislead.
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by TuNguyen View Post

      1. There are many level of truths in the old adage that, "Those who can not do; teach."

      (Note - This is not meant to be an insult, however can often be taken as such.)

      You must always ask yourself; If someone is having the level of success they claim to be having, then why don't they just focus on making more money doing that, instead of essentially generating more competition for themselves?

      2. Its not how frequently someone talks, but the quality of what is being said.

      3. People do not always apply scepticism to their lives, or they do, but do not apply it to areas that needs it most. Some people, are just too willing to be mislead.
      Thanks Tu,

      Throughout my life experience, I frequently experienced and witnessed the "Those who can not do; teach." in the real world. There are a lot of excellent teachers, but most of the time all stops in theory or as you correctly mentioned, they simply teach while others do not want to create their own competition.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        "Those who can not do, teach."

        I want to take this idea on. I've given this a lot of thought. The statement is dangerous because in some instances, it's true.

        But let's take is as meaning "Those who cannot do an activity successfully still teach it, to stay in the game". I believe that's true for many of us.

        But...the great teachers in almost every activity aren't the world's greatest at the skill. The world's greatest boxer, golfer, tennis player....have teachers that couldn't beat them in a contest. But they may have a depth of knowledge that the champion still doesn't have.

        Are the best music teachers the best musicians? Usually not.

        Now, learning how to make money from someone who has never made it?
        Learn selling from someone who has never done it? No.

        "Those who can not do, teach." implies that only failures would ever think of teaching others. And that simply isn't true.

        In fact, most Uber Successful people I know feel obliged to teach what the know. Or else, what's the point?

        Teaching others is a form of immortality.
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        • Profile picture of the author Bayo
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          "Those who can not do, teach." implies that only failures would ever think of teaching others. And that simply isn't true.

          In fact, most Uber Successful people I know feel obliged to teach what the know. Or else, what's the point?

          Teaching others is a form of immortality.
          Well said Claude...and not necessarily because this is what I've done for years and still do to this day.

          I've only ever had 3 'real' or permanent 9-5 jobs in my life, the simple reason being that I always needed a new challenge, if not, I easily got bored and lost interest in what I was doing.

          Another problem was that I had a thing for learning and mastering things pretty quickly.

          My mentor (guru?) back then was the one who advised me to consider becoming self-employed which I did the very month he suggested I 'consider' it.

          With a young family wife and 2 young kids) I needed to make things work as a freelancer with ZERO business skills. I failed 3 times in a row in business and do you think I discovered how NOT to do things in those areas I failed in? You bet I did, and for each 'situation' I made it a point to pass on my knowledge to others who needed it.

          This by the way, started back in 1995 and is how I've done everything I've been successful in to date. I do, make mistakes, hone my skills, get proficient (+ make money), teach others while continuing to get better and better each day, week and year.

          For someone to turn around and say that I teach because I can't do wouldn't go down well simply because it's not true.

          Why People Choose To Teach

          There are tons of very capable people that choose to teach. Below are reasons why I choose to teach and will always continue to do so, irrespective of what anyone says or feels.

          • I teach because I enjoy changing lives
          • I teach because I come from a family of educators
          • I teach because I trained as a kindergarten teacher
          • I teach because I trained professionally to be a teacher
          • I teach because I trained to be a professional coach
          • I teach because many of the people I've been blessed to work with have gone on to impact other lives and families
          • I teach because it allows me to make money while doing what I love

          So Claude you have a great point and I agree with you.

          BAYO
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  • Profile picture of the author marlon
    Yes,

    That's right. It's a littleknown secret!

    Jesus faked all his miracles. Thus, he had all that extra time to teach.

    Bhudda too.

    Gary Halbert never mailed a letter in his life.

    Jay Abraham couldn't drum up 100 million in sales if it killed him.

    And Michael Masterson never built 3 100 million biz.

    Best wishes,

    Marlon

    PS: I hear flame bait posts are fake too. Just sayin'
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by marlon View Post

      Yes,

      That's right. It's a littleknown secret!

      Jesus faked all his miracles. Thus, he had all that extra time to teach.

      Bhudda too.

      Gary Halbert never mailed a letter in his life.

      Jay Abraham couldn't drum up 100 million in sales if it killed him.

      And Michael Masterson never built 3 100 million biz.

      Best wishes,

      Marlon

      PS: I hear flame bait posts are fake too. Just sayin'
      Hi Marlon,

      The examples you mentioned are in fact extraordinaire examples of people who fit one of the meanings of "Guru" : "influential expert: somebody who has a reputation as an expert leader, teacher, or practitioner in a particular field"

      Specially Jesus!!These leaders draw followers by giving an example, not by merely casting mesmerizing spells on people in a desperate need to find a "leader".

      I am bringing the point of the "Kumare" documentary, were a fake "guru' managed to get followers that believed his faked teachings and the similarity of this experiment with the IM world.

      True gurus do exist and true exceptional teachers do exist too, but in the shark infested waters of the IM tank, caution is always recommended.

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  • Profile picture of the author Shaamj
    Some Gurus have made the whole IM subject more difficult than it actually is. Some teach completely incorrect methods that just misguides people who evenntually fail to make things happen online. There are however a few gurus that are actually gurus in the IM industry that know so much and pretty much conquer online....
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  • Profile picture of the author RickGueli
    It all depends on who you are calling a "guru" as a previous poster noted. There are only a rare handful I'd ever call "gurus", and unless you want to get better than even THEM at what they taught and what they did, taking them up as gurus is kinda pointless to begin with
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  • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
    When you call someone a guru, or think of them as such, it is you who place them on a pedestal. There are no gurus, except in your own mind.
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by Dennis Gaskill View Post

      When you call someone a guru, or think of them as such, it is you who place them on a pedestal. There are no gurus, except in your own mind.
      Bulls eye Dennis!! There are good teachers, no doubt. But the term "Guru" involves some kind of mysticism, high level of wisdom that can be dangerous since not always it is real. As someone mentioned before, "perception is reality"
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  • Profile picture of the author t3cn1c0
    Maybe you can use the proper syntax, they are not fake, they just don't satisfy your standards. There are lot of great GURU, but sometimes you can't improve yourself even with a great GURU, seek advice but it is your responsibility to take actions and improve yourself.
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  • Profile picture of the author CaesarSEO
    The self called "Gurus" are usually fake.

    The guys who don't claim to be gurus but have a lot of people who say they are. They are the real "gurus".

    Gurus exist in each field. It's just the ones showing off self calling themselves as such are not.
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by CaesarSEO View Post

      The self called "Gurus" are usually fake.

      The guys who don't claim to be gurus but have a lot of people who say they are. They are the real "gurus".

      Gurus exist in each field. It's just the ones showing off self calling themselves as such are not.

      Hey Caesar, I agree with you. Some self proclaimed Gurus are real gurus, my concern is in the real motivation behind calling themselves "gurus"
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      • Profile picture of the author heavysm
        Not all, but some are fake.

        There is one particular guy that does WSO's that I am currently examining. Supposedly makes $100k/ monthly but a lot of his WSO's have been vague crap that no one could effectively use. The real earners tend to be diamonds among fake gems. You have to come across them and examine them closely before you realize their true nature.

        And knowing the real from the fake isn't easy whatsoever, but I have enough experience on this forum and the WSO section in particular to know that not everyone is being genuine about what they present.
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  • Profile picture of the author kellyyarnsbro
    There were Gurus whom I know physically or in person and these people are real, some of those whom i've never meet yet maybe are not real.
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  • Profile picture of the author mert
    I know that the best way to let loose your bad thoughts is by writing or speaking it out, but it's not right to say such lines.

    A guru is an entity or an outside force that influences your way of life. And to call it fake defeats it's purpose. I mean it's not a guru if what he is teaching is not taking effect on you!
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      The "guru" is a presupposed manifestation of what you can be and what you want to be.

      There is no person better than the next.

      There is as much reason for you to be learning from the person as there is them teaching, as they are learning themselves.


      Daniel
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    Study this social theory:

    Diffusion of innovations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Note that the "early adopters" are about the same
    percentage of people who are leaders or 'gurus'
    in their field.

    The majority would always be depending on someone
    else to make the first step before they follow. It's a human
    phenomenon not just in the field of IM.

    -Ray Edwards
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  • Profile picture of the author allianceprocessing
    Someone's been watching too much of the love guru!
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    • Profile picture of the author Foreigner
      Originally Posted by allianceprocessing View Post

      Someone's been watching too much of the love guru!

      LOL! Patrick, that's an hilarious movie!!

      Hey, watch the "Kumare" documentary at Netflix, no affiliate or anything like that, just pure & enlightening entertainment that motivated me to start this thread and opened my eyes to some of the realities of the IM real world.

      Almost as hilarious as the'Love Guru" !!
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  • Profile picture of the author Bayo
    No. That's a sweeping generalization and many of the arguments each way will be based on everyone's own perspective, and here's mine.

    In the US (of course) when people talk about a guru what comes to mind for most people is someone that acquires followers of some sort. In some instances (because there's no proof that this happens on a wide scale), the gurus take advantage of the naiveté of the people that follow them

    That still does not make 'All' people that could be considered gurus fake.

    If unfortunately you're one of the people that has adopted the 'sweeping generalization' that all gurus are fake or that gurus don't exist, then you're cheating on your true level of intelligence and need to get out more!

    BAYO
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