Finally - real input on the Chemtrail issue

by HeySal
33 replies
  • OFF TOPIC
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For a long time people considered chemtrails to be a "conspiracy theory". All you have to do is sit and watch these things expand into clouds to know that something is very, very wrong.

Finally we have action against this travesty. Here's a video of experts talking to a political committe in N. California. Looks like we're going to have some fight against these things, finally. Very interesting to hear what these scientists, doctors, and pilots are saying.

  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    Viral Video Claims to Prove 'Chemtrails' Conspiracy : Discovery News

    However, David E. Thomas, a physicist writing in Skeptical Inquirer science magazine, took a closer look at the KSLA report. Thomas notes:
    “The actual video clearly shows 68.8 ug/L (micrograms per liter), or 68.8 ppb (parts per billion)…. 68.8 millionths of a gram per liter corresponds to 68.8 parts per billion, (and) the reporter was off by a factor of 100 because he read the ’68.8′ as ’6.8.’ Ferrell overestimated the amount of barium in the test report by a factor of 100…. The test result was not ‘three times the toxic level set by the EPA’; it was around 30 times less than the EPA’s toxic limit.”

    So the alarming levels of barium that conspiracy theorist Jim Marrs cited as evidence of chemtrails was in fact a mistake created by a TV reporter’s poor math skills.

    What about the new video showing explosive proof of chemtrails? There are several problems with this theory — aside from the fact that no one has ever shown that chemtrails are real.

    First of all, it seems very unlikely that passenger airlines at commercial airports like the one seen in the video would be used in top-secret military experiments. Any passenger seated in a dozen or more window seats behind the airplane wings would have a clear view of any supposed “spraying” going on — which kind of defeats the purpose of having a super-secret conspiracy spraying plan no one can know about.

    Secondly — despite claims to the contrary — the video does not show anything being sprayed from the wings; instead the “mysterious” trail is merely created by the air disruption as the plane’s wings fly through the fog.
    The whole idea of an unknown chemical being sprayed that far above us doesn’t make sense from a meteorological point of view. As Robert Carroll notes on his website The Skeptic's Dictionary:
    “Any biological or chemical agents released at 25,000 feet or above would be absolutely impossible to control, making any measurement of effects on the ground nearly impossible…. Such an exercise would be pointless, unless you just wanted to pollute the atmosphere.”

    There’s no evidence that so-called chemtrails are any different from ordinary airplane contrails. Indeed, given how visible and common the chemtrails supposedly are — and the fact that there are many thousands of private pilots flying everything from small, fixed-wing aircraft to hot air balloons to ultralights that could presumably collect samples of these mysterious chemtrails — the fact that no evidence of them has surfaced is remarkable.

    Furthermore, there’s no indication that all of these supposed chemtrails are actually doing anything: If the mysterious chemicals are some sort of mind controlling drug or mass experiment, it seems that whatever is being used is ineffective because people act the same with or without chemtrails overhead. It seems the only people chemtrails have an effect on is conspiracy theorists.
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    • Profile picture of the author HN
      Banned
      The whole idea of an unknown chemical being sprayed that far above us doesn’t make sense from a meteorological point of view. As Robert Carroll notes on his website The Skeptic's Dictionary:
      “Any biological or chemical agents released at 25,000 feet or above would be absolutely impossible to control, making any measurement of effects on the ground nearly impossible…. Such an exercise would be pointless, unless you just wanted to pollute the atmosphere.”

      This is a perfect example how they fool the public while "debunking the so called conspiracy theory." The metal dust (Aluminium powder or whatever) is meant to stay up there, so they can use their meteorological weapons. It's not meant to cause any effects on the ground, directly. You don't need to control it, you want it to spread around the globe.

      A beam or a wave that they shoot from HAARP would reflect from this shield in the sky and cause havoc in any country they chose to attack.

      I am not going to argue about the conspiracy itself. I am shoving how this argument debunks nothing!

      P.S. This is like if you are arguing about the damages that GMO is causing and they'll defend themselves with something like: "no, GMO is not meant to damage the plants, see it makes them grow bigger and faster."
      And the public will applaud to that and call you a GMO conspiracy theorist.
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
        Originally Posted by HN View Post


        This is a perfect example how they fool the public while "debunking the so called conspiracy theory." The metal dust (Aluminium powder or whatever) is meant to stay up there, so they can use their meteorological weapons. It's not meant to cause any effects on the ground, directly. You don't need to control it, you want it to spread around the globe.

        A beam or a wave that they shoot from HAARP would reflect from this shield in the sky and cause havoc in any country they chose to attack.

        I am not going to argue about the conspiracy itself. I am shoving how this argument debunks nothing!

        P.S. This is like if you are arguing about the damages that GMO is causing and they'll defend themselves with something like: "no, GMO is not meant to damage the plants, see it makes them grow bigger and faster."
        And the public will applaud to that and call you a GMO conspiracy theorist.
        Much like the videos (as the one above) proves nothing either. I am not saying it does not exist - but this is hardly proof.

        So as much as the article (as you state) "fools the public", those videos "fool the chemtrail proponents", no?

        I find it funny how people can point to an article and completely dismiss it while swallowing what the other side puts out (which so far doesn't prove anything).

        I guess the "proof" is what we want to believe...
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        • Profile picture of the author HN
          Banned
          Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio View Post

          Much like the videos (as the one above) proves nothing either. I am not saying it does not exist - but this is hardly proof.

          So as much as the article (as you state) "fools the public", those videos "fool the chemtrail proponents", no?

          I find it funny how people can point to an article and completely dismiss it while swallowing what the other side puts out (which so far doesn't prove anything).

          I guess the "proof" is what we want to believe...
          On this particular issue, what's the point of knowing the truth?
          If you know that you can cure cancer you can use that knowledge. If you know GMO can harm you, you can avoid it. Chemtrail? What are you going to do about it? That's why I didn't even watch the video, so I can't answer your question.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
            Originally Posted by HN View Post

            On this particular issue, what's the point of knowing the truth?
            If you know that you can cure cancer you can use that knowledge. If you know GMO can harm you, you can avoid it. Chemtrail? What are you going to do about it? That's why I didn't even watch the video, so I can't answer your question.

            Nothing if no one can prove it's real.
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            • Profile picture of the author Kay King
              I had to sit on my hands last night...but here goes.

              Sal - you need to vet this stuff before posting it as fact.

              This man is not an engineer - not an aerospace person - not technically trained. He is an artist who specialized in drawing illustration of planes and space vehicles. He claims to have worked for all the big plane manufacturers and several govt agencies - none of them have verified his employment.

              The "geo" website link that show on the video belongs to a man who claims to be a solar energy expert. Again, he is not an engineer nor an educated expert in any related field. His resume is: he worked for a power company!

              On that website there are glowing articles about the chemtrail guy - and about someone who is an "expert in solar energy". IN other words - that website is owned by someone who hires people to write articles about how great he is. However, he neglected to opt for privacy when he registered the domain.

              The guy talking about chemtrails "came up with the idea while thinking one day" - doesn't say what he was smoking at the time. Thinking about it later, "he realized he was right". Science? Who needs it?

              A modest amount of digging into this person and his cohorts will have you chuckling at the theories they come up with. But then you look at smart people who buy into it - and it's a bit frightening.
              Signature
              Saving one dog will not change the world - but the world will change forever for that one dog.

              I'm going to work on being less condescending
              (Condescending means to talk down to people)
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              • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                I had to sit on my hands last night...but here goes.

                Sal - you need to vet this stuff before posting it as fact.

                It's been vetted, thank you. The UN has been having talks about chemtrails this last month. I've been studying this for some time. I picked the link I did so people can understand the issue and see that "real people" know this issue - it's not just shyte on conspiracy rags, and politicians are weighing in on it. I was anticipating flack, of course, and, as you might have inferred, I am ready for it. You will find some links below and some offline references for info. Why you are getting "conspiracy sites" instead of real info is that it's not listed as "chemtrails". You need to look for "weather modification" or "stratospheric Geoengineering". You just aren't searching correctly.

                Mike - yes it's a cut video. I'm thinking none of you who think this is "conspiracy theory" wouldn't sit through the filming of the whole meeting. It was 2 hours. I was hoping it would raise serious questions and talk instead of just a lot of "conspiracy theory" screamers. Of course, there is a full length documentary now called "Why in the World are They Spraying" (Purchase DVD | Why in the World are They Spraying?
                ) that is exceptionally well documented - if you were willing to pay the price of admission.

                For you who have not studied the situation because you are too busy saying it's not true:

                Check out legislation on weather modification and geoengineering. Then come back and call me a "conspiracy theorist" because I don't believe that we base legislation on fairy tales. Geoengineering is very real - you can major in it in school for cripes sakes.

                Here's an excerpt from the UN webcast.


                Okay, since a lot of you are skeptical, lets use some logical sequencing. To start out with - lets look at some laws about Weather Modification and see that you can get permits, and other aspects of weather modification law (geoengineering). Then you ask yourself why would all these laws be in effect if nobody was tampering with weather modification. Is it logical that so much time would be spent writing laws on "conspiracy theory"? Really?


                15 U.S. Code Chapter 9A - WEATHER MODIFICATION ACTIVITIES OR ATTEMPTS; REPORTING REQUIREMENT
                15 U.S. Code Chapter 9A - WEATHER MODIFICATION ACTIVITIES OR ATTEMPTS; REPORTING REQUIREMENT | LII / Legal Information Institute


                Want to do some weather modification? Don't try it unless you have your permit!
                Weather Modification Law


                More weather modification law in the US:
                Weather Modification Law in the USA
                http://www.rbs2.com/weather.pdf


                Text of the Weather Modification Research and Development Policy Authorization act of 2005
                https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/109/s517/text


                And according to this Weather Modification Program in Colorado - you can get GRANTS!
                Colorado Water Conservation Board


                Canada has some laws now, too:
                Weather Modification Information Act

                http://www.rbs2.com/weather.pdf


                Okay - I could go on - there's a LOT of legislation, but you should get the idea from this and can look up the rest on your own. If you can't, you've got little right to be slamming anyone for their own sweat and effort to find out why "contrails" now expand into clouds instead of dissipating as a contrail should, eh?

                Now here's a sweet list of Weather Modification Programs -- from NOAA, for those of you who want "authoritive" info and don't like some websites that already did this damned research for everyone:
                http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...uly_7_2011.pdf

                http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_10WXMOD5.pdf

                http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_09WXMOD5.pdf

                http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_08WXMOD5.pdf


                Well enough of that. You have some info here to keep you busy for awhile.


                Journal of Geophysical Research:
                Regional climate responses to geoengineering with tropical and Arctic SO2 injections:
                Read the PDF: Regional climate responses to geoengineering with tropical and Arctic SO2 injections - Robock - 2008 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Atmospheres (1984–2012) - Wiley Online Library


                In the UK they aren't even satified with leaving the sulfur delivery to planes, they want to shoot it right off the ground:
                U.K. Researchers to Test "Artificial Volcano" for Geoengineering the Climate - Scientific American


                However - they are currently under a stratopheric aerosol engineering moratorium and are fighting to make it permanent.
                Directive to Ban Stratospheric Aerosol Geoengineering and Aerial Aerosol Spraying in the United Kingdom (21-Dec-2013) - Chemtrails Project UK


                In this article by NOAA - he talks about the PROPOSED chemtrailing. That was in spring of 2009. This article doesn't say much other than the fact that geoengineering is not BS. But at this point, this is the level of the info that some seem to be able to handle. He's talking about real proposals, not conspiracy theories. He's also not telling that some legislation covers some years and not others. Such as 2010 was covered but 2011 was not. Some legislation expires. How bout that?
                Geoengineering Problems


                Here's an overview of the problem from the Royal Society in the UK: This is the abstract but the full text is free.
                An overview of geoengineering of climate using stratospheric sulphate aerosols


                Frankly, I don't remember what this one said. I know it was relevant somehow. LOL.
                http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/csd/assessm...s/chapter5.pdf


                VERY good discussion of the issue here:
                http://climate.envsci.rutgers.edu/pd...AerosolGeo.pdf


                Now, if you put some of this info together, which some of you might have by now - Lets look at the next bit of info that
                people really need to be aware of. Weather Modification Companies. That's right - Geoengineering isn't just a matter of
                Scientists and nations. It's CORPORATE. Can you get your head around the significance of this statement?

                North American Weather Consultants - Cloud Seeding/Weather Modification


                Here's one ya might want to buy stock in, LMAO:
                Weather Modification, Inc.: Private Company Information - Businessweek


                Patents:
                Hughes Aircraft Patent #5,003,186 -In 1991 a U.S. patent was issued to Hughes Aircraft Company; the Stratospheric Welsbach Seeding For Reduction of Global Warming Patent (#5,003,186). It proposed injecting into the upper atmosphere, a "very fine, white talcum-like" powder of aluminum oxide, barium oxide and other oxides for the stated purpose of reducing Global Warming". http://chemtrails.cc/docs/welsbach-seeding-patent.pdf


                If you want a list - here's just the patents since 1990. Some are rather benign - others are just scary.
                4948257 - August 14, 1990 - Laser optical measuring device and method for stabilizing fringe pattern spacing
                4948050 - August 14, 1990 - Liquid atomizing apparatus for aerial spraying
                4999637 - March 12, 1991 - Creation of artificial ionization clouds above the earth
                5003186 - March 26, 1991 - Stratospheric Welsbach seeding for reduction of global warming
                5005355 - April 9, 1991 - Method of suppressing formation of contrails and solution therefor
                5038664 - August 13, 1991 - Method for producing a shell of relativistic particles at an altitude above the earths surface
                5041760 - August 20, 1991 - Method and apparatus for generating and utilizing a compound plasma configuration
                5041834 - August 20, 1991 - Artificial ionospheric mirror composed of a plasma layer which can be tilted
                5056357 - October 15, 1991- Acoustic method for measuring properties of a mobile medium
                5059909 - October 22, 1991 - Determination of particle size and electrical charge
                5104069 - April 14, 1992 - Apparatus and method for ejecting matter from an aircraft
                5110502 - May 5, 1992 - Method of suppressing formation of contrails and solution therefor
                5156802 - October 20, 1992 - Inspection of fuel particles with acoustics
                5174498 - December 29, 1992 - Cloud Seeding
                5148173 - September 15, 1992 - Millimeter wave screening cloud and method
                5245290 - September 14, 1993 - Device for determining the size and charge of colloidal particles by measuring electroacoustic effect
                5286979 - February 15, 1994 - Process for absorbing ultraviolet radiation using dispersed melanin
                5296910 - March 22, 1994 - Method and apparatus for particle analysis
                5327222 - July 5, 1994 - Displacement information detecting apparatus
                5357865 - October 25, 1994 - Method of cloud seeding
                5360162 - November 1, 1994 - Method and composition for precipitation of atmospheric water
                5383024 - January 17, 1995 - Optical wet steam monitor
                5425413 - June 20, 1995 - Method to hinder the formation and to break-up overhead atmospheric inversions, enhance ground level air circulation and improve urban air quality
                5434667 - July 18, 1995 - Characterization of particles by modulated dynamic light scattering
                5441200 - August 15, 1995 - Tropical cyclone disruption
                5486900 - January 23, 1996 - Measuring device for amount of charge of toner and image forming apparatus having the measuring device
                5556029 - September 17, 1996 - Method of hydrometeor dissipation (clouds)
                5628455 - May 13, 1997 - Method and apparatus for modification of supercooled fog
                5631414 - May 20, 1997 - Method and device for remote diagnostics of ocean-atmosphere system state
                5639441 - June 17, 1997 - Methods for fine particle formation
                5762298 - June 9, 1998 - Use of artificial satellites in earth orbits adaptively to modify the effect that solar radiation would otherwise have on earth's weather
                5912396 - June 15, 1999 - System and method for remediation of selected atmospheric conditions
                5922976 - July 13, 1999 - Method of measuring aerosol particles using automated mobility-classified aerosol detector
                5949001 - September 7, 1999 - Method for aerodynamic particle size analysis
                5984239 - November 16, 1999 - Weather modification by artificial satellite
                6025402 - February 15, 2000 - Chemical composition for effectuating a reduction of visibility obscuration, and a detoxifixation of fumes and chemical fogs in spaces of fire origin
                6030506 - February 29, 2000 - Preparation of independently generated highly reactive chemical species
                6034073 - March 7, 2000 - Solvent detergent emulsions having antiviral activity
                6045089 - April 4, 2000 - Solar-powered airplane
                6056203 - May 2, 2000 - Method and apparatus for modifying supercooled clouds
                6110590 - August 29, 2000 - Synthetically spun silk nanofibers and a process for making the same
                6263744 - July 24, 2001 - Automated mobility-classified-aerosol detector
                6281972 - August 28, 2001 - Method and apparatus for measuring particle-size distribution
                6315213 - November 13, 2001 - Method of modifying weather
                6382526 - May 7, 2002 - Process and apparatus for the production of nanofibers
                6408704 - June 25, 2002 - Aerodynamic particle size analysis method and apparatus
                6412416 - July 2, 2002 - Propellant-based aerosol generation devices and method
                6520425 - February 18, 2003 - Process and apparatus for the production of nanofibers
                6539812 - April 1, 2003 - System for measuring the flow-rate of a gas by means of ultrasound
                6553849 - April 29, 2003 - Electrodynamic particle size analyzer
                6569393 - May 27, 2003 - Method and device for cleaning the atmosphere

                AND HERE'S A GRAND FINALE THAT SHOULD SCARE ANY LUCID HUMAN BEING SHYTELESS -
                MONSANTO BUYS WEATHER MODIFICATION COMPANY. Do you remember in the video I posted that you had
                time to watch and scoff at - and one scientist asked: "How did Monsanto know to make it's crops aluminum-proof"?
                Well, now you're starting to get it if you're at least lucid.
                Monsanto | Monsanto Acquires The Climate Corporation

                AND - ya know you can get geoengineering textbooks and other books on the subject real easily. It's called a
                LIBRARY.

                Okay for all of you who call me ungrounded or nuts, let me tell you I've spent more time linking info in here than you have probably ever put into researching the subject. Even if you look up and see chemtrails, you are sooooo damned sure it's bull that you don't even study it - just call people "conspiracy nuts" when they open their mouths. But...........I'd be glad to look at a few more little entertaining excerpts from media articles if you insist on posting them.
                Signature

                Sal
                When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
                Beyond the Path

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                • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
                  Sal,

                  Sometimes you are just a bit over sensitive

                  No one in this thread said you were nuts or anything else. In fact, I never said that this was all just a conspiracy. As I said in another post, in my limited exposure to this subject, people who say this is all real and evil seem to post to videos like the one you did in your OP. That one says very little to me. It screamed of someone editing excerpts together to make things seem worse. Excerpts of people who claim to be what they are, offer no credentials (in the video) nor offer any proof or documents. It seems just a bit odd that you have people in front of some committee trying to convince them of something and offer no proof. And these days, EVERYone calls Monsanto evil and links them to all the ills of the world.

                  So, now you offer loads of links. Very nice. I'll spend some time on a few, but if you want people to believe in what's going on, you have to find some middle ground. First you post a questionable video claiming it's real input, then you link to everything under the sun, which from the titles I see will offer something - but will it offer a definitive link to weather manipulation to chemtrails to dangerous substances? Or will they simply be more write ups of "proof" from people or organizations who are simply desperate for people to believe them?

                  I guess there's only on way to find out

                  Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                  It's been vetted, thank you. The UN has been having talks about chemtrails this last month. I've been studying this for some time. I picked the link I did so people can understand the issue and see that "real people" know this issue - it's not just shyte on conspiracy rags, and politicians are weighing in on it. I was anticipating flack, of course, and, as you might have inferred, I am ready for it. You will find some links below and some offline references for info. Why you are getting "conspiracy sites" instead of real info is that it's not listed as "chemtrails". You need to look for "weather modification" or "stratospheric Geoengineering". You just aren't searching correctly.

                  Mike - yes it's a cut video. I'm thinking none of you who think this is "conspiracy theory" wouldn't sit through the filming of the whole meeting. It was 2 hours. I was hoping it would raise serious questions and talk instead of just a lot of "conspiracy theory" screamers. Of course, there is a full length documentary now called "Why in the World are They Spraying" (Purchase DVD | Why in the World are They Spraying?
                  ) that is exceptionally well documented - if you were willing to pay the price of admission.

                  For you who have not studied the situation because you are too busy saying it's not true:

                  Check out legislation on weather modification and geoengineering. Then come back and call me a "conspiracy theorist" because I don't believe that we base legislation on fairy tales. Geoengineering is very real - you can major in it in school for cripes sakes.

                  Here's an excerpt from the UN webcast.
                  Topic of "Chemtrails" Discussed at United Nations Global Warming Session - YouTube


                  Okay, since a lot of you are skeptical, lets use some logical sequencing. To start out with - lets look at some laws about Weather Modification and see that you can get permits, and other aspects of weather modification law (geoengineering). Then you ask yourself why would all these laws be in effect if nobody was tampering with weather modification. Is it logical that so much time would be spent writing laws on "conspiracy theory"? Really?


                  15 U.S. Code Chapter 9A - WEATHER MODIFICATION ACTIVITIES OR ATTEMPTS; REPORTING REQUIREMENT
                  15 U.S. Code Chapter 9A - WEATHER MODIFICATION ACTIVITIES OR ATTEMPTS; REPORTING REQUIREMENT | LII / Legal Information Institute


                  Want to do some weather modification? Don't try it unless you have your permit!
                  Weather Modification Law


                  More weather modification law in the US:
                  Weather Modification Law in the USA
                  http://www.rbs2.com/weather.pdf


                  Text of the Weather Modification Research and Development Policy Authorization act of 2005
                  https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/109/s517/text


                  And according to this Weather Modification Program in Colorado - you can get GRANTS!
                  Colorado Water Conservation Board


                  Canada has some laws now, too:
                  Weather Modification Information Act

                  http://www.rbs2.com/weather.pdf


                  Okay - I could go on - there's a LOT of legislation, but you should get the idea from this and can look up the rest on your own. If you can't, you've got little right to be slamming anyone for their own sweat and effort to find out why "contrails" now expand into clouds instead of dissipating as a contrail should, eh?

                  Now here's a sweet list of Weather Modification Programs -- from NOAA, for those of you who want "authoritive" info and don't like some websites that already did this damned research for everyone:
                  http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...uly_7_2011.pdf

                  http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_10WXMOD5.pdf

                  http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_09WXMOD5.pdf

                  http://www.agriculturedefensecoaliti...t_08WXMOD5.pdf


                  Well enough of that. You have some info here to keep you busy for awhile.


                  Journal of Geophysical Research:
                  Regional climate responses to geoengineering with tropical and Arctic SO2 injections:
                  Read the PDF: Regional climate responses to geoengineering with tropical and Arctic SO2 injections - Robock - 2008 - Journal of Geophysical Research: Atmospheres (1984–2012) - Wiley Online Library


                  In the UK they aren't even satified with leaving the sulfur delivery to planes, they want to shoot it right off the ground:
                  U.K. Researchers to Test "Artificial Volcano" for Geoengineering the Climate - Scientific American


                  However - they are currently under a stratopheric aerosol engineering moratorium and are fighting to make it permanent.
                  Directive to Ban Stratospheric Aerosol Geoengineering and Aerial Aerosol Spraying in the United Kingdom (21-Dec-2013) - Chemtrails Project UK


                  In this article by NOAA - he talks about the PROPOSED chemtrailing. That was in spring of 2009. This article doesn't say much other than the fact that geoengineering is not BS. But at this point, this is the level of the info that some seem to be able to handle. He's talking about real proposals, not conspiracy theories. He's also not telling that some legislation covers some years and not others. Such as 2010 was covered but 2011 was not. Some legislation expires. How bout that?
                  Geoengineering Problems


                  Here's an overview of the problem from the Royal Society in the UK: This is the abstract but the full text is free.
                  An overview of geoengineering of climate using stratospheric sulphate aerosols


                  Frankly, I don't remember what this one said. I know it was relevant somehow. LOL.
                  http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/csd/assessm...s/chapter5.pdf


                  VERY good discussion of the issue here:
                  http://climate.envsci.rutgers.edu/pd...AerosolGeo.pdf


                  Now, if you put some of this info together, which some of you might have by now - Lets look at the next bit of info that
                  people really need to be aware of. Weather Modification Companies. That's right - Geoengineering isn't just a matter of
                  Scientists and nations. It's CORPORATE. Can you get your head around the significance of this statement?

                  North American Weather Consultants - Cloud Seeding/Weather Modification


                  Here's one ya might want to buy stock in, LMAO:
                  Weather Modification, Inc.: Private Company Information - Businessweek


                  Patents:
                  Hughes Aircraft Patent #5,003,186 -In 1991 a U.S. patent was issued to Hughes Aircraft Company; the Stratospheric Welsbach Seeding For Reduction of Global Warming Patent (#5,003,186). It proposed injecting into the upper atmosphere, a "very fine, white talcum-like" powder of aluminum oxide, barium oxide and other oxides for the stated purpose of reducing Global Warming". http://chemtrails.cc/docs/welsbach-seeding-patent.pdf


                  If you want a list - here's just the patents since 1990. Some are rather benign - others are just scary.
                  4948257 - August 14, 1990 - Laser optical measuring device and method for stabilizing fringe pattern spacing
                  4948050 - August 14, 1990 - Liquid atomizing apparatus for aerial spraying
                  4999637 - March 12, 1991 - Creation of artificial ionization clouds above the earth
                  5003186 - March 26, 1991 - Stratospheric Welsbach seeding for reduction of global warming
                  5005355 - April 9, 1991 - Method of suppressing formation of contrails and solution therefor
                  5038664 - August 13, 1991 - Method for producing a shell of relativistic particles at an altitude above the earths surface
                  5041760 - August 20, 1991 - Method and apparatus for generating and utilizing a compound plasma configuration
                  5041834 - August 20, 1991 - Artificial ionospheric mirror composed of a plasma layer which can be tilted
                  5056357 - October 15, 1991- Acoustic method for measuring properties of a mobile medium
                  5059909 - October 22, 1991 - Determination of particle size and electrical charge
                  5104069 - April 14, 1992 - Apparatus and method for ejecting matter from an aircraft
                  5110502 - May 5, 1992 - Method of suppressing formation of contrails and solution therefor
                  5156802 - October 20, 1992 - Inspection of fuel particles with acoustics
                  5174498 - December 29, 1992 - Cloud Seeding
                  5148173 - September 15, 1992 - Millimeter wave screening cloud and method
                  5245290 - September 14, 1993 - Device for determining the size and charge of colloidal particles by measuring electroacoustic effect
                  5286979 - February 15, 1994 - Process for absorbing ultraviolet radiation using dispersed melanin
                  5296910 - March 22, 1994 - Method and apparatus for particle analysis
                  5327222 - July 5, 1994 - Displacement information detecting apparatus
                  5357865 - October 25, 1994 - Method of cloud seeding
                  5360162 - November 1, 1994 - Method and composition for precipitation of atmospheric water
                  5383024 - January 17, 1995 - Optical wet steam monitor
                  5425413 - June 20, 1995 - Method to hinder the formation and to break-up overhead atmospheric inversions, enhance ground level air circulation and improve urban air quality
                  5434667 - July 18, 1995 - Characterization of particles by modulated dynamic light scattering
                  5441200 - August 15, 1995 - Tropical cyclone disruption
                  5486900 - January 23, 1996 - Measuring device for amount of charge of toner and image forming apparatus having the measuring device
                  5556029 - September 17, 1996 - Method of hydrometeor dissipation (clouds)
                  5628455 - May 13, 1997 - Method and apparatus for modification of supercooled fog
                  5631414 - May 20, 1997 - Method and device for remote diagnostics of ocean-atmosphere system state
                  5639441 - June 17, 1997 - Methods for fine particle formation
                  5762298 - June 9, 1998 - Use of artificial satellites in earth orbits adaptively to modify the effect that solar radiation would otherwise have on earth's weather
                  5912396 - June 15, 1999 - System and method for remediation of selected atmospheric conditions
                  5922976 - July 13, 1999 - Method of measuring aerosol particles using automated mobility-classified aerosol detector
                  5949001 - September 7, 1999 - Method for aerodynamic particle size analysis
                  5984239 - November 16, 1999 - Weather modification by artificial satellite
                  6025402 - February 15, 2000 - Chemical composition for effectuating a reduction of visibility obscuration, and a detoxifixation of fumes and chemical fogs in spaces of fire origin
                  6030506 - February 29, 2000 - Preparation of independently generated highly reactive chemical species
                  6034073 - March 7, 2000 - Solvent detergent emulsions having antiviral activity
                  6045089 - April 4, 2000 - Solar-powered airplane
                  6056203 - May 2, 2000 - Method and apparatus for modifying supercooled clouds
                  6110590 - August 29, 2000 - Synthetically spun silk nanofibers and a process for making the same
                  6263744 - July 24, 2001 - Automated mobility-classified-aerosol detector
                  6281972 - August 28, 2001 - Method and apparatus for measuring particle-size distribution
                  6315213 - November 13, 2001 - Method of modifying weather
                  6382526 - May 7, 2002 - Process and apparatus for the production of nanofibers
                  6408704 - June 25, 2002 - Aerodynamic particle size analysis method and apparatus
                  6412416 - July 2, 2002 - Propellant-based aerosol generation devices and method
                  6520425 - February 18, 2003 - Process and apparatus for the production of nanofibers
                  6539812 - April 1, 2003 - System for measuring the flow-rate of a gas by means of ultrasound
                  6553849 - April 29, 2003 - Electrodynamic particle size analyzer
                  6569393 - May 27, 2003 - Method and device for cleaning the atmosphere

                  AND HERE'S A GRAND FINALE THAT SHOULD SCARE ANY LUCID HUMAN BEING SHYTELESS -
                  MONSANTO BUYS WEATHER MODIFICATION COMPANY. Do you remember in the video I posted that you had
                  time to watch and scoff at - and one scientist asked: "How did Monsanto know to make it's crops aluminum-proof"?
                  Well, now you're starting to get it if you're at least lucid.
                  Monsanto | Monsanto Acquires The Climate Corporation

                  AND - ya know you can get geoengineering textbooks and other books on the subject real easily. It's called a
                  LIBRARY.

                  Okay for all of you who call me ungrounded or nuts, let me tell you I've spent more time linking info in here than you have probably ever put into researching the subject. Even if you look up and see chemtrails, you are sooooo damned sure it's bull that you don't even study it - just call people "conspiracy nuts" when they open their mouths. But...........I'd be glad to look at a few more little entertaining excerpts from media articles if you insist on posting them.
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                • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
                  Banned
                  Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

                  It's been vetted, thank you. The UN has been having talks about chemtrails this last month. I've been studying this for some time. I picked the link I did so people can understand the issue and see that "real people" know this issue - it's not just shyte on conspiracy rags, and politicians are weighing in on it. I was anticipating flack, of course, and, as you might have inferred, I am ready for it. You will find some links below and some offline references for info. Why you are getting "conspiracy sites" instead of real info is that it's not listed as "chemtrails". You need to look for "weather modification" or "stratospheric Geoengineering". You just aren't searching correctl.
                  You referred to "the Chemtrail Issue" in the OP. So, if we're not up on chemtrails, we search for chemtrails and now it's us that isn't searching correctly.

                  Maybe the whole thread would have been taken more seriously if you'd posted something other than a ridiculously poorly done video that proves nothing.

                  So now we're bombarded with several months worth of "other" reading material, patents and information spanning numerous different issues, mostly referring to weather modification. If you wanted to discuss weather modification why didn't you call it weather modification to start with?
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                  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                    I searched for the "experts" you referenced - and they aren't experts. Everything written about McCandlish and his partner and the guy who owns 'geotrack' site traces back to THEM. It's a cluster*** of info issued by them - quoted by them - repeated by them - written by them about each other. Even the "references' they mention are more stuff THEY came up with...not supporting documentation.

                    Weather modification is one thing - claiming it's being purposely done through chemtrails is a different animal.
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                    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
                      Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                      I searched for the "experts" you referenced - and they aren't experts. Everything written about McCandlish and his partner and the guy who owns 'geotrack' site traces back to THEM. It's a cluster*** of info issued by them - quoted by them - repeated by them - written by them about each other. Even the "references' they mention are more stuff THEY came up with...not supporting documentation.

                      Weather modification is one thing - claiming it's being purposely done through chemtrails is a different animal.
                      Yes it is different. However - I'm sorry that you feel that all of those links are not "authoritative" enough for you. If links to gov, UN, Legislation, universities aren't good enough for you, I guess you'll just have to go back to your corporate mainstream News media channel where you can get info that you seem to prefer.
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            • Profile picture of the author HN
              Banned
              Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio View Post

              Nothing if no one can prove it's real.
              I don't get it. Are you watching those videos looking for someone that will prove it's real or on the contrary hoping that they won't be able to? Why waste time on this issue? You highlighted the wrong question. What's the point in knowing the truth on this particular issue, in other words knowing that it's not real? Does this make your life easier? There are a lot of other problems besides this one.
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              • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
                Originally Posted by HN View Post

                I don't get it. Are you watching those videos looking for someone that will prove it's real or on the contrary hoping that they won't be able to? Why waste time on this issue? You highlighted the wrong question. What's the point in knowing the truth on this particular issue, in other words knowing that it's not real? Does this make your life easier? There are a lot of other problems besides this one.
                I agree 100%, which is why I don't spend a lot of time on it. I am simply commenting on the use of supposed "proof" videos filled with "experts" that really say nothing at all and offer nothing in the way of evidence. Yet people swallow it up anyway and call non-believers sheep with the wool being pulled over their eyes.

                To answer your first question, I watch them to figure out why people think this amounts to chemtrails being real. I am more interested in what motivates people to buy into this than the actual "issue" itself. Why? I don't know. I guess my schedule wasn't all that full today
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              • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
                Banned
                Originally Posted by HN View Post

                I don't get it. Are you watching those videos looking for someone that will prove it's real or on the contrary hoping that they won't be able to? Why waste time on this issue? You highlighted the wrong question. What's the point in knowing the truth on this particular issue, in other words knowing that it's not real? Does this make your life easier? There are a lot of other problems besides this one.
                Just about every question in the world isn't relevant to most people and most people don't really give a damn either way, but will issue an opinion on it. Just like you're spending time on a thread when you allegedly think there are a lot of other problems to think about. So why are you bothering?
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                • Profile picture of the author BigFrank
                  Banned
                  All I know is, if it were I that would have written the title of this post, folks would have lined-up to castigate me, if not castrate me.

                  Cheers. - Frank
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  • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
    What I find most interesting on this subject - and this video is a great example - are all the "experts" who talk about what they see, or what they tested. But as in this video, I see NO documented proof of testing, results, etc. So you have to take their word. In fact, how do you know they are even the experts they claim to be?

    Also, this video has been HEAVILY edited. It jumps around, skips, and quite comically, cuts many times to the audience raising their hands (for what purpose I have no idea since no questions were asked and no answers given) and it even looks like the same scene over and over.

    In fact, where does it even say its some political committee in N. California? Or what the purpose of this "committee" is?

    So far, in ALL the videos I have been pointed to as proof of chemtrails have been just like this one - long on talk and short on evidence.

    This is NOT to say I think chemtrails are real, a conspiracy or otherwise. But if you're trying to convince people, this video does nothing in that regard.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    That poorly done video was just a video of a local political meeting. It was just to show that these things are being taken seriously and there is action being taken against them.
    Corporations have been getting permits to do whatever the hell they want and we're having to backpedal and stop them - and who knows what the military is doing. Some of those aerosols are used to heighten radar.

    Also note - that the average citizen can report spraying if they see it by getting the number on the tail of the plane if you can watch it come in or have field glasses strong enough to get the number and they can be charged for it if the chemicals are found to be environmental or health hazards.

    What to look for? Contrails that start right at the plane rather than just behind the plane (it takes a second for ice to form, while emissions are immediate). Streaking - when spraying occurs, planes often only spray for a while, not their complete route. If you see these things being turned on and off, they are spraying. Contrails are continuous and dissipate rather than forming clouds. Planes also don't fly in close checkerboard patterns like you will sometimes see with chemtrails. There's sites that show pictures of very obvious spraying. They might be "conspiracy sites" - some aren't, but it only takes one look to know you aren't seeing anything "natural". At least people old enough to remember clear skies should be able to tell.




    This link provides the best explanation of the law - any law, actually, that I've ever read to help laymen understand laws and how they are binding to us - the subject of "acquiescence". If you want to better understand the way any and all US laws work - this is a good page to read, whether you think the site is a good one or not.

    I understand this is a controversial subject because most of what's being done is not reported by mainstream media - at all. I also know there's much discussion about HAARP - however, I have never done an ounce of research on HAARP, do not equate this issue as the same thing as some do. Maybe it is. I wouldn't know. I haven't had time to research that one....at all. It may be just conspiracy theory because I know they do atmospheric research. It may be a real threat. If it is, it's gov run so we aren't likely to just have the real answers handed to us on a platter. What worries me isn't HAARP - it's Monsanto owning one of the Weather Mod corporations. Yikes.

    Anyhow - sorry I presented my entrance into the issue as I did, but I felt the need to have objection to be able to really get people to listen to the answers. This is one of those "conspiracy theories" that has just been taken out of "theory" mode and now has action going on all over the globe. Just trying to bust through any slip programming.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      What worries me isn't HAARP - it's Monsanto owning one of the Weather Mod corporations. Yikes.

      Anyhow - sorry I presented my entrance into the issue as I did, but I felt the need to have objection to be able to really get people to listen to the answers. This is one of those "conspiracy theories" that has just been taken out of "theory" mode and now has action going on all over the globe. Just trying to bust through any slip programming.
      I agree that Monsanto is about the most evil corporation on the face of the planet, and purchasing Climate Corp, a company that underwrites weather insurance for farmers is troubling at best. (It's not a Weather Mod corp. but it's a weather insurance firm).

      Now that the issues are further documented, I don't have any problem at all swallowing a conspiracy theory relating to chemtrails produced for the purposes of weather manipulation to say ... slow down the effects of global warming and for research on weather warfare (like they used in VietNam).

      Some patents suggest that exactly is what is going on:

      We would also like to present an excerpt from U.S. weather patent # 5003186, entitled "Stratospheric Welsbach seeding for reduction of global warming" :

      ...seeding the greenhouse gases' layer with a quantity of tiny particles of a material characterized by wavelength-dependent emissivity or reflectivity, in that said materials have high emissivities in the visible and far infrared wavelength spectra and low emissivity in the near infrared wavelength spectrum,

      whereby said particles are suspended within said gases' layer and provide a means for converting radiative energy at near infrared wavelengths into radiation at the far infrared wavelengths, permitting some of the converted radiation to escape into space.

      11. The method of claim 10 wherein said material comprises one or more of the oxides of metals.

      12. The method of claim 10 wherein said material comprises aluminum oxide.

      All patents can be searched here. Another patent # 7645326, entitled "RFID Environmental Manipulation" reads:

      The patent involves the use of a reflective blanket of aluminum oxide-laced cloud cover to act as reflectors of radio frequency transmissions and the same increase the strength of such radio frequency signal. The aluminum oxide should only be introduced only when the environment is vacant of humans, preferably at nighttime, when radio wave propagation is at its highest rate of efficiency. The formula for aluminum oxide is Al(2)O(3). It can be toxic if inhaled in large quantities. It can cause coughing, mucous production and shortness of breath.

      For it to work properly, the transformer system of this invention (aluminum oxide blanket) involves the external antenna gathering an RFID electromagnetic signal interrogation message from a remote source, such as a cellular telephone transmission tower or perhaps HAARP antennas. This interrogation will be in the microwave frequency.

      What goes up into the atmosphere must come down, right? What is interesting is that Monsanto is already using aluminium-resistant seeds, and more can be read about this here. Is it a coincidence that Bill Gates is funding the aerosol spraying of aluminium into our atmosphere, while also wanting to invest in Monsanto's aluminium-resistant seeds? Does this not seem like a conflict of interest? Aluminum-resistant gene patent # 7582809 states :

      A method of producing a genetically transformed plant wherein the method comprises: (a) cloning or synthesizing a nucleic acid molecule encoding a Al-inducible citrate efflux transporter polypeptide, wherein said nucleic acid molecule is selected from the group consisting of: (i) the nucleic acid molecule shown in SEQ ID NO:1; (ii) a nucleic acid molecule encoding SEQ ID NO:4; and (iii) a nucleic acid molecule encoding an amino acid sequence at least 95% identical to the amino acid sequence shown in SEQ ID NO:4, wherein said nucleic acid molecule encodes a polypeptide capable of providing tolerance to aluminum to a plant; (b) inserting the nucleic acid molecule in a vector so that the nucleic acid molecule is operably linked to a promoter; (c) insert the vector into a plant cell or plant seed; (d) expressing said nucleic acid molecule in said plant cell or seed; and (e) regenerating a plant from the plant cell or plant seed, wherein tolerance to aluminum in the plant is increased compared to a wild type plant.

      So does this mean that organic farmers who are using pure non-GMO seeds will be affected by the aluminium and bacterial agents that are being used in aerosols, while Monsanto crops remained unaffected in order to reap the profits? Let's work together by putting an end to this. It all starts with informing others and carefully choosing what products we buy. EthicalConsumer.org makes a great point when it addresses the power of boycotts:
      An Additional Article on Same Thing
      Chemtrails Killing Organic Crops, Monsanto’s GMO Seeds Thrive

      Organic farmers and our food supply have a huge environmental hazard to contend with compliments of the U.S. government – chemtrails. Chemtrails are chemical or biological agents deliberately sprayed at high altitudes for purposes undisclosed to the general public in programs directed by various government officials. These sprays pollute the soil, water and air while compromising the health of humans, animals and plants. But wait – Monsanto has developed seeds that will weather the effect of the sprays, creating a tidy profit for the corporation while organics suffer.

      Monsanto’s GMO seeds are specially designed to grow in the high presence of aluminum. Aluminum is the chemical found in chemtrails. If this poisoning continues, true organic farming may become impossible in the not so distant future. When aluminum pollutes soil and water it kills crops. It collects in people and causes diseases!

      Chemtrail cocktail

      Geo-engineering food companies such as Monsanto use the governments claim of slowing down global warming through chemtrails to justify the need for the GMO seeds. The problem with chemtrails is that what goes up, must come down. These chemicals are seriously polluting our waterways and soil while seeping into crops and contaminating livestock, not to mention changing the weather patterns. Plants are especially sensitive to the soil degradation that occurs with chemtrail spraying, creating serious issues concerning our food supply.

      Genetically Engineered Seeds Resistant

      Mosantano in cooperation with the government has designed genetically modified seeds which withstand the effects of chemtrails. The seeds are designed to survive extreme weather conditions, pollution, salt stress, heavy metals and chemtrails. Organic and natural crops will die from severe pollution and the chemtrails while Monsanto continues to profit. Further proof that the government and giant food cooperation’s are controlling the food supply.
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  • Profile picture of the author michaeldfleming
    HeySal, looks like some of these guys are 5 years behind on the news XD Poor zombies. Gotta love 'em.

    That's a "contrail" coming out of that engine. Jet's are spraying you with water from combustion engines. *wink* Ignorance must be bliss. That's why 40% of people die from air pollution and stupidity (willful ignorance is a choice).

    Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report
    Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report

    Climate Intelligence Agency: The CIA is now funding research into manipulating the climate.
    CIA funds NAS study into geoengineering and climate change.

    In addition, Wikipedia states quite the opposite in the "Climate Engineering" post:

    "In a 2009 review study, Lenton and Vaughan evaluated a range of geoengineering schemes from those that sequester CO2 from the atmosphere and decrease longwave radiation trapping, to those that decrease the Earth's receipt of shortwave radiation.[6] In order to permit a comparison of disparate techniques, they used a common evaluation for each scheme based on its effect on net radiative forcing. As such, the review examined the scientific plausibility of schemes rather than the practical considerations such as engineering feasibility or economic cost. Lenton and Vaughan found that "[air] capture and storage shows the greatest potential, combined with afforestation, reforestation and bio-char production", and noted that "other suggestions that have received considerable media attention, in particular "ocean pipes" appear to be ineffective".[6] They concluded that "[climate] geoengineering is best considered as a potential complement to the mitigation of CO2 emissions, rather than as an alternative to it".[6] In October 2011, a Bipartisan Policy Center panel issued a report urging immediate researching and testing in case "the climate system reaches a 'tipping point' and swift remedial action is required".[108] The National Academy of Sciences is running 21-month project which will study how humans might influence weather patterns, assess dangers and investigate possible national security implications of geoengineering attempts. The project will be funded by the CIA, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, and NASA.[109]"

    - See more at: Stop Chemical Terrorism | The History of Weather Modification
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by michaeldfleming View Post

      HeySal, looks like some of these guys are 5 years behind on the news XD Poor zombies. Gotta love 'em.

      That's a "contrail" coming out of that engine. Jet's are spraying you with water from combustion engines. *wink* Ignorance must be bliss. That's why 40% of people die from air pollution and stupidity (willful ignorance is a choice).

      Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report
      Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report

      Kay - my point in my post was that it's out of the closet and being discussed by varied local legislators. That first link in the quoted post is the one I wanted, but mine was the one I had handy. Still made the point - someone's starting to DO something about a real nightmare.

      Climate Intelligence Agency: The CIA is now funding research into manipulating the climate.
      CIA funds NAS study into geoengineering and climate change.

      In addition, Wikipedia states quite the opposite in the “Climate Engineering” post:

      “In a 2009 review study, Lenton and Vaughan evaluated a range of geoengineering schemes from those that sequester CO2 from the atmosphere and decrease longwave radiation trapping, to those that decrease the Earth’s receipt of shortwave radiation.[6] In order to permit a comparison of disparate techniques, they used a common evaluation for each scheme based on its effect on net radiative forcing. As such, the review examined the scientific plausibility of schemes rather than the practical considerations such as engineering feasibility or economic cost. Lenton and Vaughan found that “[air] capture and storage shows the greatest potential, combined with afforestation, reforestation and bio-char production”, and noted that “other suggestions that have received considerable media attention, in particular “ocean pipes” appear to be ineffective”.[6] They concluded that “[climate] geoengineering is best considered as a potential complement to the mitigation of CO2 emissions, rather than as an alternative to it”.[6] In October 2011, a Bipartisan Policy Center panel issued a report urging immediate researching and testing in case “the climate system reaches a ‘tipping point’ and swift remedial action is required”.[108] The National Academy of Sciences is running 21-month project which will study how humans might influence weather patterns, assess dangers and investigate possible national security implications of geoengineering attempts. The project will be funded by the CIA, the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, and NASA.[109]“

      - See more at: Stop Chemical Terrorism | The History of Weather Modification

      Hey thanks - that first link is the one I wanted to post and couldn't find.

      And in the thread ThomM posted about "best movie he's seen" - which is a documentary on soil and how our industrial agriculture is destroying it - he posted this link. I read it and it just about turned my intestines to water.

      Chemtrails and Horizontal Gene Transfer

      BTW - farmwars is NOT the same as Infowars - no Alex Jones here.
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  • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
    Here's Rosalind Peterson being asked by a caller as to why she isn't in on the lawsuit being brought about by Joe Marmon. She tells him it's because there isn't enough evidence to support the case.

    I'll repeat that for you: She tells him there isn't enough evidence to support the case.

    I have no proof whatsoever that the jets are releasing anything but jet fuel emissions.
    She then goes on to say she has "proof" about the "rocket program" releasing chemicals. Not jet aircraft - rockets.


    So, one of the people you put up as evidence for chemtrails denies there actually is any evidence to support the theory.

    Checkmate.

    Game, Set, Match.

    Do not pass go, do not collect $200.

    No soup for you.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
      Banned
      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      So, one of the people you put up as evidence for chemtrails denies there actually is any evidence to support the theory.
      I disregard Rosalind Peterson altogether. She says one thing in 2007 and another now. The website she founded just redirects to another unconvincing website.

      The evidence of the extent of weather modification and geoengineering, the delivery systems, etc. lies in the verifiable patents, including the Monsanto patents for aluminum resistant seeds. I mean, it's as if Monsanto is expecting a bunch of aluminum to be falling on crops or something, and with a patent on aluminum resistant seeds, wouldn't that be just dandy for Monsanto to own the only seeds that will thrive in soils stressed by aluminum and other metals/chemicals.

      The patents are real and have been going on for a very long time.
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      • Profile picture of the author SteveJohnson
        Originally Posted by BigFrank View Post

        All I know is, if it were I that would have written the title of this post, folks would have lined-up to castigate me, if not castrate me.

        Cheers. - Frank
        People are lining up to do that anyway, whether you wrote the post title or not.
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        • Profile picture of the author BigFrank
          Banned
          Originally Posted by SteveJohnson View Post

          People are lining up to do that anyway, whether you wrote the post title or not.
          Right. No cliques, here. lol They'll need to take a number. This is not the only forum that I grace with my presence. :-)

          Cheers. - Frank
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    "She doesn't have evidence" means she hasn't got pictures, flight numbers, plane numbers, etc. There is tons of evidence of spraying. More than enough - what isn't evident to her is WHO we should be suing. You have to name a defendant. Is it Monsanto? The military? You almost have to nail the plane with the equipment, have it reported when it lands, and have someone waiting there to inspect the plane. Then you have to find out who owns the tanks and ordered them to be used.

    That's what she means by "no evidence".

    If there's a lawsuit going on, someone must have been able to nail down a culprit. Who's the defendant in the case, do you know or have a link? Seriously, I'd love to look it up but don't have time right now.

    Never mind - I just hit google. Seems that there's a lot of suits going on. Not sure who these people are yet....guess it doesn't matter as long as there's some good lawyers on it -- other than the fact we've still got Monsanto owned judges at the top.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      "I don't have any evidence, but I know it's true ...doesn't meet the sniff test.

      I have no problem with the idea of geoengineering weather - or that it is being studied/tested or might be possible. My son (meteorologist) and I have talked about things related to that and it's not a new idea. There was some "weather engineering" on hurricanes years ago that didn't work out too well. To me that is not the same as the idea" chemtrails are a conspiracy to..." whatever.

      So often, there is science that's fascinating and has real potential either for good or not so good. Do I believe there are tests, etc going on that we aren't told about? Sure do. Do I think the govt would slip in some questionable testing? No doubt about it. Do I believe there's a chemtrail conspiracy? Um, no.

      Seems for every scientific subject and test there are people trying to appear like experts, pretend to have insider knowledge, and promoting their own personal conspiracy theory. When I visit a site (geoengineeringwatch dot org) that is neither org nor engineer-related...and find non-scientists promoting themselves and theories they "thought up one day"...it takes me to lala land.

      So far, we have (as humans) engineered the earth's weather in a negative way without meaning to with our industrial revolutions, our endless exhaust and production of creature comforts. Companies like Monsanto have added to the process.

      Science might come up with ways to engineer weather in a positive way - in my opinion, govt isn't smart enough to apply it and can't be trusted to do it.
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  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    OK - I have found DEFINITE PROOF....


    That I've been on youtube too long today...


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  • Profile picture of the author garyv
    Oh my gosh... someone pleas stop me from doing anymore searches please!!!


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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Well, fortunately - the UN and 193 countries didn't think it was a "conspiracy theory" or funny. Geoengineering has been banned in 193 countries! And if you know anything about geoengineering...........this isn't a silly matter or just "isn't happening".

    Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report

    This is the link that I wanted you all to see, but opted to show one about a local committe first. Why? So people can see how senseless calling issues "conspiracy theories" is before they even know what the issues are.
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Well, fortunately - the UN and 193 countries didn't think it was a "conspiracy theory" or funny. Geoengineering has been banned in 193 countries! And if you know anything about geoengineering...........this isn't a silly matter or just "isn't happening".

      Geoengineering sparks international ban, first-ever congressional report

      This is the link that I wanted you all to see, but opted to show one about a local committe first. Why? So people can see how senseless calling issues "conspiracy theories" is before they even know what the issues are.

      Sal, you showed us that one first because you view it as "real input". You said so in the thread title.

      The serious responses in this thread have not called anything a conspiracy theory. You need to step off that soap box. What has been said was that the info you provided was dicey at best and did nothing to prove anything. BIG difference. Why is it that those trying to prove something like this accuse those who question or disagree of shouting "conspiracy theory"?

      The only conspiracy theory in this thread is your conspiracy theory that everyone said this is a conspiracy theory
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio View Post

        Sal, you showed us that one first because you view it as "real input". You said so in the thread title.

        The serious responses in this thread have not called anything a conspiracy theory. You need to step off that soap box. What has been said was that the info you provided was dicey at best and did nothing to prove anything. BIG difference. Why is it that those trying to prove something like this accuse those who question or disagree of shouting "conspiracy theory"?

        The only conspiracy theory in this thread is your conspiracy theory that everyone said this is a conspiracy theory

        There has been "real input". The first link was "real input" -- it was just local real input and not the 193 countries link.

        You are correct. I am the only one here who said "conspiracy theory". This is not soap box.........this was checking out what people really think.

        Frankly, even those who don't know the issue well enough to take a real stand either way as well as those who think it's bunk............impressed me, because nobody did come out with the tinfoil hat crap. I can't tell whether Gary was just into some OT lighten up treatment or whether he just doesn't believe that geoengineering is going on - either way, he didn't spew the tinfoil rap.

        Everyone that knows me on here knows I'm a researcher. A little research shouldn't startle you. I did want to talk about the fact that geoengineering has been banned...........but I wanted to see the frame of mind people are in on this issue because it was called "conspiracy theory" for a long time even though it's very visible where they spray. Coming out with 193 countries banning it is a good way to let people know it's a real issue, but it doesn't tell me what I wanted to know. I already know about geoengineering. I've been watching the issue. I wanted to know where people's heads are at right now. I found out. People are becoming much more savvy than I realized........at least in here.

        I tried the same thing on FB and couldn't get a real grip on what the general scope of knowledge of the issue is. Actually - I'm pretty well pleased right now.
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        Sal
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