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Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?
#roi
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  • Profile picture of the author Shawon10
    in ROI there is no guaranty but only for $1 i will not pay $500
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  • Profile picture of the author affmarketer101
    just that it, so please send your money to saving account in the bank and you can earn some interest.
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    • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
      Originally Posted by affmarketer101 View Post

      just that it, so please send your money to saving account in the bank and you can earn some interest.
      Inflation will eat up the interest before he gets the $1.00 from the bank.

      To the orginial poster what value do you place on time ? If it takes several hours to make a product and weeks to sell that one product is it worth it to you ? Would it be a on off sale or multiple sales and how offen ? So there are more answers to the question.

      Say you shipped a product and lost a $1.00 on every sale. But learned what went wrong. Now you make $100's of dollars profit because of that one loss. Was it worth the education you received ?
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      • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
        Thanks for the food for thought and taking the time to reply.
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  • Profile picture of the author yukon
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    Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

    Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?
    Ha, ha, what's wrong with this world?
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      Hi Yukon. I got this question from Matt Loyd, he's the owner of MOBE (My Online Business Education) from one of his youtube vid's. He says the answer is yes. He goes on to talk about his investment philosophy.

      I ask these questions to see how others feel and to get some perspective. I can say I felt the same way the majority does.

      I'm here to learn and help like everybody else. No disrespect intended. I value your opinion and would appreciate your continued input.
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      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Banned
        Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

        Hi Yukon. I got this question from Matt Loyd, he's the owner of MOBE (My Online Business Education) from one of his youtube vid's. He says the answer is yes. He goes on to talk about his investment philosophy.

        I ask these questions to see how others feel and to get some perspective. I can say I felt the same way the majority does.

        I'm here to learn and help like everybody else. No disrespect intended. I value your opinion and would appreciate your continued input.
        Mobe looks like they sell dreams.

        I've seen John Chow pushing that business on Youtube.

        Anyways, all I see from Mobe is hype. I don't see anything else for sale.

        It's your money but my advice, don't get suckered into schemes.

        If you've started this thread to sell Mobe, good luck with the mods.
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        • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
          No I am not selling mobe products: I mentioned MOBE as a background reference for my line of questioning. Regardless Matt Loyd is a highly successful internet business owner and I think worth serious consideration.

          My point is group value is worth more than its individual constituents and therefore should be priced at a higher rate than the sum total of its individual parts: But by how much?
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

    Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?

    Of course not.

    No one in his/her right mind would go for that offer.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      Thanks Steve.

      Thanks Jason. Your a wealth of information.

      Thanks for the reply radu.
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  • Profile picture of the author radu
    Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

    Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?
    No way...

    Anyways there is nothing guaranteed nowadays online...
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
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      Originally Posted by radu View Post

      No way...

      Anyways there is nothing guaranteed nowadays online...

      You can pretty much guarantee he's going to lose $500 asking these types of questions.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Kanigan
    Until you are talking about bigger numbers, where say you get at least a 4-figure return, talking about single transactions is playing the small game. The tiny game, really.

    Many businesses operate on slim margins. But many businesses are also run by dumb people, and go out of business. I don't know if you noticed, but the fast food giants went to war not long ago trying to buy customers with the lowest meal prices possible.

    And what did they discover? Oh, they couldn't make any money. Each transaction was giving them the death of a thousand cuts. There is no Get Out Of Stupidity card, even for established and large businesses.

    If your perspective is stuck on one transaction, you will struggle.

    Lifetime Customer Value is where to look.

    Also called CLV, or LTV.

    Laddering.

    Increased frequency of transactions. And looking at it from the CUSTOMER'S perspective is also key.

    It isn't about the "put $1 in, get $1.05 out" perspective.

    That's playing it small.

    You must beat inflation, the tax man, opportunity cost. As the seller AND for the buyer. And that's just to begin with.
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    If I was willing to settle for a 0.2% return, I'd put the $500 in a CD and forget about it. Anything that took more time/effort would not be worth it.

    There are too many other ways to make much higher returns with acceptable risk to mess with this kind of thing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rory Singh
    I thought you were joking
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  • Profile picture of the author quadagon
    Honestly with the information at hand it's impossible to know.

    I'd want to know how much effort is required.
    How long it takes for the ROI and how scalable it is.

    If it makes $1 a minute for little work and is scalable then yeah I could be interested. Reinvest the next day and you are earning $3-$4 a minute and so on.

    If I have to wait a week, month, year or decade for the return then the risk reward isn't of interest.

    If it can't be scared then what's the point in only earning $1.

    and that's before ethical considerations.
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      quadagon thanks for the reply. Good stuff.
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  • Profile picture of the author IGotMine
    I got this question from Matt Loyd, he's the owner of MOBE (My Online Business Education) from one of his youtube vid's. He says the answer is yes. He goes on to talk about his investment philosophy.
    Be careful who you listen to.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
    Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

    Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?
    Theoretically, if I could do that something like 1,000 times a day then maybe.
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    "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      Thanks for the reply Jonathan.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jonathan 2.0
        Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

        Thanks for the reply Jonathan.
        Welcome. : ) (Sometimes thinking of the "big picture" can be good.)
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        "Each problem has hidden in it an opportunity so powerful that it literally dwarfs the problem. The greatest success stories were created by people who recognized a problem and turned it into an opportunity."―Joseph Sugarman
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  • Profile picture of the author nickyz1
    $500 is too much for a $1 unless if it's a daily income. I can go with $30 per month with my $500 but if am only getting $1, I cannot risk my money
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    • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
      Originally Posted by nickyz1 View Post

      $500 is too much for a $1 unless if it's a daily income. I can go with $30 per month with my $500 but if am only getting $1, I cannot risk my money
      But this is what the OP said. Quoted him directly "for a guaranteed return" So he said no risk is involved.
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
        Originally Posted by DWolfe View Post

        But this is what the OP said. Quoted him directly "for a guaranteed return" So he said no risk is involved.
        There's always some risk, even if it's just the risk of lost opportunity. If I have my $500 tied up earning $1, I can't use it on something else that might bring me $501.

        **********************

        I've much more often seen assertions like this used in the context of paid advertising. If I could pay $500 for a customer and get $501 back on the initial transaction, and then have an acceptable average LTV beyond that, we have a whole different conversation.

        Let's try a hypothetical on for size.

        Suppose you had a small house with $500/month fixed costs (mortgage, insurance, etc.). You rent the house out for $501/month. Yes, you only make $1.00 per month up front, but every mortgage payment increases your equity in an asset that can later be sold for a greater return.
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  • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
    Thank you John. I understand your reply as saying that the investment makes a return in two ways the roi and leverage by way of increase in overall equity toward a more substantial goal thus making the 500$ for 501$ a more acceptable form of investment.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve B
    It's not just about ROI.

    You also have to consider the opportunity cost.

    If I invest $500 to make $1, how much am I losing because I no longer have my $500 to invest in a different opportunity that could make me much more.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
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      Op would be negative from the transaction expense alone.

      Not that risking money to break even makes sense.

      I guess what's happening here is more about getting suckered into an IMers sales pitch. This is the 2nd thread where I've recently watched someone act like their guru can walk on water. Usually a red flag for selling on the forums.

      Really I don't think any replies on these types of forum threads matter because these people will blow their money whether or not they get peer validation for some half baked scheme or not.



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      • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
        I get your point. Its not a good idea. Also, That i'm putting Matt Loyd on a pedestal. That i'l be wasting my money any which way I choose to take and that the peoples opinions on this thread are of no value. I don't agree though I value your input.
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      Thanks Steve. Definitely a point worth considering.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nottyqueen
    If you give me guarantee that I can back my money today, if I invest 500$, I may profit 1$, any surity?
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by Nottyqueen View Post

      If you give me guarantee that I can back my money today, if I invest 500$, I may profit 1$, any surity?
      This raises another consideration.

      How long does it take to get that $1 of profit?

      $1 on a $500 investment is only 0.2%.

      If it takes you six months or a year to make that, you're better off stashing your money in a CD or savings bond while you work on something else.
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      • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
        I get where your coming from. It depends on the context. Yes the investment is worth it if circumstances around the investment are favourable.
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    • Profile picture of the author OptedIn
      Originally Posted by Nottyqueen View Post

      If you give me guarantee that I can back my money today, if I invest 500$, I may profit 1$, any surity?
      There's nothing like thinking big and looking for guarantees in life.
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      The guarantee's hypothetical. Though Playing devils advocate the guarantee is my word, putting my reputation behind it.
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  • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
    Originally Posted by rockerjaw View Post

    Would you pay $500 for a guaranteed return of $501 dollars?
    In order to answer your question on whether or not I'd invest $500 to generate a return of $1, I'd answer it with my own question, "What time frame are you talking about?"

    If it's over the course of a year, then it represents 0.2% p.a., which as others have pointed out is pretty poor, and anyone would quite sensibly decline that "offer".

    If it took a month to generate that $1, that is the equivalent of 2.43% p.a. Not spectacular but higher than the rate you get from a money market fund at the moment. So, perhaps someone (not me) would invest their hard earned in that.

    It the time frame is a week, the rate rises to 10.95% p.a., which is a tidy return, and probably worth investing in.

    At a single day to generate that $1 from your $500 investment, that equates to 107.36% p.a., which is a bloody good return in anyone's book, and I'd definitely be interested.

    If it takes an hour then your annualised rate of return is 3,992,460,266.45%. With a return like that, you'd be a fool not to invest.

    If you break it down even further into a minute, or a second, they both give out numbers that are so astronomical as to be meaningless. My old copy of Excel 2003 won't even calculate them and just gives an error message for both.

    And so, we return to my original question, "What time frame are you talking about?". Until you answer that, no-one can give a definitive answer to your question.

    Always keep in mind Whatty's First Law Of Quantum Financial Dynamics:

    T = M (time equals money).
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
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      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      In order to answer your question on whether or not I'd invest $500 to generate a return of $1, I'd answer it with my own question, "What time frame are you talking about?"

      If it's over the course of a year, then it represents 0.2% p.a., which as others have pointed out is pretty poor, and anyone would quite sensibly decline that "offer".

      If it took a month to generate that $1, that is the equivalent of 2.43% p.a. Not spectacular but higher than the rate you get from a money market fund at the moment. So, perhaps someone (not me) would invest their hard earned in that.

      It the time frame is a week, the rate rises to 10.95% p.a., which is a tidy return, and probably worth investing in.

      At a single day to generate that $1 from your $500 investment, that equates to 107.36% p.a., which is a bloody good return in anyone's book, and I'd definitely be interested.

      If it takes an hour then your annualised rate of return is 3,992,460,266.45%. With a return like that, you'd be a fool not to invest.

      If you break it down even further into a minute, or a second, they both give out numbers that are so astronomical as to be meaningless. My old copy of Excel 2003 won't even calculate them and just gives an error message for both.

      And so, we return to my original question, "What time frame are you talking about?". Until you answer that, no-one can give a definitive answer to your question.

      Always keep in mind Whatty's First Law Of Quantum Financial Dynamics:









      No.

      The transaction fees would have you negative until you ended up sleeping on a park bench and waking up with seagull shit on you.

      Recalculating...
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      In order to answer your question on whether or not I'd invest $500 to generate a return of $1, I'd answer it with my own question, "What time frame are you talking about?"

      If it's over the course of a year, then it represents 0.2% p.a., which as others have pointed out is pretty poor, and anyone would quite sensibly decline that "offer".

      If it took a month to generate that $1, that is the equivalent of 2.43% p.a. Not spectacular but higher than the rate you get from a money market fund at the moment. So, perhaps someone (not me) would invest their hard earned in that.

      It the time frame is a week, the rate rises to 10.95% p.a., which is a tidy return, and probably worth investing in.

      At a single day to generate that $1 from your $500 investment, that equates to 107.36% p.a., which is a bloody good return in anyone's book, and I'd definitely be interested.

      If it takes an hour then your annualised rate of return is 3,992,460,266.45%. With a return like that, you'd be a fool not to invest.

      If you break it down even further into a minute, or a second, they both give out numbers that are so astronomical as to be meaningless. My old copy of Excel 2003 won't even calculate them and just gives an error message for both.

      And so, we return to my original question, "What time frame are you talking about?". Until you answer that, no-one can give a definitive answer to your question.

      Always keep in mind Whatty's First Law Of Quantum Financial Dynamics:
      You have a good point IF one can repeat that ROI often enough to reach the calculated APRs.

      To get your 3,992,460,266.45% APR, you would have to repeat the transaction

      365 days/yr X 24 hrs/day = 8,760 times per year. Year after year. Not likely to happen, especially if you stipulate a guaranteed return.
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      • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

        You have a good point IF one can repeat that ROI often enough to reach the calculated APRs.
        You are correct. I forgot to add that the figures were a compounding, rather than flat return.

        With a flat rate of return the figures are:

        Yearly - 0.2%;
        Monthly - 2.4%
        Weekly - 10.4%
        Daily - 73%
        Hourly - 1,752%
        Minutely - 105,210%
        Secondly - 6,307,200%

        So, the First Law Of Quantum Financial Dynamics still applies, and the OP still needs to clarify whether this was a one off event or ongoing. Also, if it's an ongoing event, whether the return is flat or compounding.
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    • Profile picture of the author rockerjaw
      Originally Posted by whateverpedia View Post

      In order to answer your question on whether or not I'd invest $500 to generate a return of $1, I'd answer it with my own question, "What time frame are you talking about?"
      Hi Secks Symbol.lol. Thanks for the great reply. The questions is posed to get a response to provide ideas to base pricing on and gain food for thought.

      Hi John Much Appreciated.

      Originally Posted by Jonathan 2.0 View Post

      (Lol) You Brainiacs are in good company.

      Self-Driven 12 Year Old Is A Maths Genius | Child Genius - YouTube

      (Hehe)
      Very funny.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jessica Ambos
    There is no guarantee in business. People always tell you that there is but there isn't. There's always a risk involved and it's up to you on how to make sure there is return of investment.
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