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Shingles vaccination

by glchandler
15 replies
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Shingles is caused by the varicella zoster virus (VZV), the same virus that causes chicken pox.
Hey Sal...you keep up on this kind of stuff so I direct this inquiry to your general direction.

The VA is pushing me to get this shot (over 60 yrs old) and I am a bit nervous---give me your thoughts, please?
  • Profile picture of the author Jim Gillum
    How does that change if you already had chicken pox?
    Are you in danger of contracting the disease?
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  • Profile picture of the author Rick McCombs
    Here is some info that will answer your questions.

    Shingles Symptoms, Causes, Treatment, Vaccine, Postherpetic Neuralgia and Pictures on MedicineNet.com
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  • Profile picture of the author domainarama
    I am over 60. I was in India for a year. In the middle of my stay I contracted shingles. I had a relationship with a local Indian MD. He suggested doing nothing. His words were shingles is "self limiting." I called my MD in New York. The NY MD suggested a medication. A non-Indian MD cannot write a valid prescription to be filled by an Indian pharmacy. My local pharmacy filled the scrip anyhow. My shingles attack lasted maybe 4-5 days, then back to normal. When I returned to NY my NY MD assured me proper medication is appropriate, unlike what the Indian MD suggested. Yes, most cases of shingles are "self-limiting" but some cases are not, and you don't want to be one of those. I don't know about a shingles shot. My experience (and pro-NY MD bias) suggests that if you actually get shingles treat it aggressively with medication. I have had no after-effects.
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    • Profile picture of the author glchandler
      The link below is an opinion I would listen to:

      Shingles vaccine: Should I get it? - MayoClinic.com

      I read this earlier this week. My concern is the VA pushing for these---rings of some sort of quiet "study". Well known this was done in past decades with hallucinogenics and other niceties of life.

      Easy to say ,,,"Well it's free, the Army is paying for it" but still difficult to talk myself into getting poked with this particular needle.

      Some of my medical difficulties are side-effects of medications for other ones. I can't seem to get my brain around this but time will tell.
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        My mother had shingles and couldn't get rid of them.
        It was the most painful thing I had ever seen her go through.
        Without reading any of the links, I remember her doctor saying shingles result when you have had chicken pox as a child. It is a virus that remains dormant till you are older and is triggered by a weakened immune system. You can get shingles at any age.
        It seems to me that keeping your immune system in shape would be a more practical way to combat shingles then a shot.
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        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

          My mother had shingles and couldn't get rid of them.
          It was the most painful thing I had ever seen her go through.
          Without reading any of the links, I remember her doctor saying shingles result when you have had chicken pox as a child. It is a virus that remains dormant till you are older and is triggered by a weakened immune system. You can get shingles at any age.
          It seems to me that keeping your immune system in shape would be a more practical way to combat shingles then a shot.
          You would think. It is odd, the shingles vaccine is attenuated LIVE herpes zostrix virus. So they give you a similar virus to try to prevent an outbreak of that virus after being dormant for decades? I would love to know HOW effective it was, side effects, and just how it works.

          Steve
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        • Profile picture of the author HeySal
          Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

          My mother had shingles and couldn't get rid of them.
          It was the most painful thing I had ever seen her go through.
          Without reading any of the links, I remember her doctor saying shingles result when you have had chicken pox as a child. It is a virus that remains dormant till you are older and is triggered by a weakened immune system. You can get shingles at any age.
          It seems to me that keeping your immune system in shape would be a more practical way to combat shingles then a shot.

          That's my view on the situation.
          Take a look at this logic. You get chicken pox and your body does not immune you to the virus. OKay - they shoot the virus into you (along with many immune system repressants) and it is going to immunize you to the same thing that your body wouldn't naturally immunize you to in actual contact in the first place? And subsequent conditions caused by the virus is caused by the improper function of the immune system -- so their bright idea is to shoot you full of stuff your body won't become immune to anyway, along with things that will deter the proper functioning of the only thing that can stop infections, your immune system - and that is logical or even feasible HOW?

          I would tell the VA that you are not interested in being an unsuspecting victim of pharmaceutical commissions and offer to pay them their due commission and leave out the vaccine. That is usually enough to shut them up about their shots.
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          • Profile picture of the author Kay King
            I've known two people with shingles - both were older people and suffered greatly from them. I think either of the people I know would have been happy for a shot that would have prevented the pain they were in.

            The effect of the chicken pox virus is unlike many other diseases - we've known that for a long time but had nothing to counteract it until recently.

            One thing I've noticed on forums is that any time "vaccination" is mentioned there are some who are strongly against it - no matter what disease it is meant to protect you from. I fully agree that it's not wise to just get a shot because "it's the thing to do" - but I disagree with making a decision based on forum opinions rather than medical research.

            If you have shingles it affects only you - so only you can decide whether the vaccination is something you want or not.
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            • Profile picture of the author Kay King
              Some of my medical difficulties are side-effects of medications for other ones. I can't seem to get my brain around this but time will tell.
              In the Mayo Clinic article - it is recommended not to get the vaccine for those with allergies to medications - or with weakened immune systems.
              Shingles are truly odd as they are a reactivation of a virus and because the darned things can be short or last a LONG time.

              Oh boy - one more thing to worry about.
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              • Profile picture of the author glchandler
                I would tell the VA that you are not interested in being an unsuspecting victim of pharmaceutical commissions and offer to pay them their due commission and leave out the vaccine. That is usually enough to shut them up about their shots.
                This is my first reaction, then read:

                Is shingles contagious?

                Yes, shingles is contagious. Shingles can be spread from an affected person to children or adults who have not had chickenpox. But instead of developing shingles, these people develop chickenpox. Once they have had chickenpox, people cannot catch shingles (or contract the virus) from someone else. Once infected, however, people have the potential to develop shingles later in life.
                I try not to worry too much about my own discomfort as have "been there and done that" with pain for too long. However I have four grandchildren who have not had chickenpox.

                So now I am going to look into just how vulnerable I will make them if I ever break outwith shingles! Any chance of harming them automatically means vaccine!
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    But they are "vaccinating" you with stuff that the body won't immune itself to anyway - which means the vaccine isn't any good. It's a pharmaceutical ploy to make more money. I repeat the logic........if you can get the virus and your body doesn't immune itself (such as it does with flu virus), what damned good does it do to shoot that virus into you....if there is no natural immunity system, the vaccine can't GIVE you one. Vaccines work by triggering your own body's immune system and there isn't one for this virus. There is NOTHING a vaccine can do about it. It's a herpes virus, there is NO immunity.

    You need to look at reports that are from independent studies completely free of money exchange with the drug concerns. I'm seeing a LOT of money running around in this one.
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    Sal
    When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
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    • Profile picture of the author glchandler
      But they are "vaccinating" you with stuff that the body won't immune itself to anyway - which means the vaccine isn't any good. It's a pharmaceutical ploy to make more money. I repeat the logic........if you can get the virus and your body doesn't immune itself (such as it does with flu virus), what damned good does it do to shoot that virus into you....if there is no natural immunity system, the vaccine can't GIVE you one. Vaccines work by triggering your own body's immune system and there isn't one for this virus. There is NOTHING a vaccine can do about it. It's a herpes virus, there is NO immunity.

      You need to look at reports that are from independent studies completely free of money exchange with the drug concerns. I'm seeing a LOT of money running around in this one.
      No real worries there...if I do get stabbed I will be sure I want it.

      And for a late night giggle? This is just a bit of what I found when researching the vaccine.....
      Objective: To determine the net financial gain or loss for herpes zoster vaccination services provided to patients from the perspective of an independent community pharmacy. Design: Retrospective review of pharmacy records over the program's initial 11-month period, Setting: Independent community pharmacy in Iowa City, IA. Participants: Patients received immunization with the herpes zoster vaccine from a certified pharmacist. Intervention: Herpes zoster vaccination services were provided to the patient and documented by the pharmacist. Main outcome measure: Net financial gains or losses were calculated for the herpes zoster vaccination program. Sensitivity analyses were based on costs that might be incurred during program start-up, Results: 478 patients received zoster vaccination services over the Initial 11-month period. A net financial gain for the herpes zoster vaccination program was achieved, with a net profit of $15.02, or 8.15%, per vaccination. Conclusion: Revenues for this vaccination program exceeded its costs from the independent community pharmacy perspective.ABSTRACT FROM AUTHORCopyright of Journal of the American Pharmacists Association: JAPhA is the property of American Pharmaceutical Association and its content may not be copied or emailed to multiple sites or posted to a listserv without the copyright holder's express written permission. However, users may print, download, or email articles for individual use. This abstract may be abridged. No warranty is given about the accuracy of the copy. Users should refer to the original published version of the material for the full abstract.
      My goodness there sure is money in that which ails the human!
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  • Profile picture of the author gareth
    You want to try Beta Glucan for your immune system - but you will need to import it in bulk as 3-5 gm's per day are needed to boost immunity.
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  • Profile picture of the author domainarama
    @gl, I suspect you're of my generation. When I went to college everyone read the long, authoritative-looking books on alternate health written by Adele Davis. Every sentence was footnoted, and research was cited up the wazoo. She had nasty things to say about Western medicine, very much like what HeySal has written on this thread. Her stated aim was to use alternative medicine to help people avoid cancer. She was a model anti-cancer crusader. And she had all the arguments.

    Guess what she died of.
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