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Why NOT to buy a mac

by Aussie_Al
35 replies
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I found this on another forum and thought it might be fun to share.

Full disclosure: I once was a "mac guy" and have used them for the last 15 years however in the last 5-6 years I have become much more of a "PC guy"

Anyways check this out for a laugh:
  • Profile picture of the author Aussie_Al
    Originally Posted by SUPER IM View Post

    I haaaaate mac! the people who have them seem to have something stuck up their behind. too much money for sense.. to much "ohhh windows?... i have maaaaac..."


    they do the same thing just for double tripple the price
    The majority of computer users know very little about what's actually inside a computer, and you'll be surprised to know that Apple computers are very similar inside to a normal computer that you can build yourself. They use Intel processors and AMD video cards, and most other parts like RAM and hard drives are identical to an ordinary, off the shelf computer.

    The only real difference is the BIOS, because this is designed so that Apple OSs can only be installed on a genuine Apple computer in order to prevent people from buying an Apple OS and putting it onto an ordinary computer.

    Mac computers are actually nothing special hardware wise, for the same price that you could build a high end gaming rig you could buy a cheap Mac with 2 year old hardware. Apple deliberately targets ignorant and uninformed users by putting a computer together with old, substandard hardware, then they put a nice case around it and sell it with a nice looking mouse and keyboard in order to trick people into thinking that it's somehow the latest and greatest hardware.
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    • Profile picture of the author hardraysnight
      Originally Posted by Aussie_Al View Post

      The majority of computer users know very little about what's actually inside a computer, and you'll be surprised to know that Apple computers are very similar inside to a normal computer that you can build yourself. They use Intel processors and AMD video cards, and most other parts like RAM and hard drives are identical to an ordinary, off the shelf computer.

      The only real difference is the BIOS, because this is designed so that Apple OSs can only be installed on a genuine Apple computer in order to prevent people from buying an Apple OS and putting it onto an ordinary computer.

      Mac computers are actually nothing special hardware wise, for the same price that you could build a high end gaming rig you could buy a cheap Mac with 2 year old hardware. Apple deliberately targets ignorant and uninformed users by putting a computer together with old, substandard hardware, then they put a nice case around it and sell it with a nice looking mouse and keyboard in order to trick people into thinking that it's somehow the latest and greatest hardware.
      but they do have nice colours
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      • Profile picture of the author JimmyR
        Macs are great for people who don't need to do much. I recently bought a Macbook Pro and it stands as one of the stupidest purchases I have ever made. For a power user, they just suck.... pretty much in every way. They are nice for web browsing and watching videos though.

        As soon as I can get everything off onto an external, I'm bootcamping to Win7.
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        • Profile picture of the author QuickSurf
          I have a Macbook Pro 13, Apple may not have the best "specs" but this is where they excel... build quality and battery life. I could never use a cheap feeling plastic laptop again, and none have the excellent trackpad the Pro line does, and battery life is excellent, backlit key's etc. I run Win7 on it as well on a virtual system.... but there's no windows laptop that competes for battery life. I can watch 2-3 HD movies on a plane, you'd be lucky to get through 1 movie on a windows laptop. But the best thing is you can run Win7 and os/x same time, best of both worlds.
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          • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
            Banned
            Of course, looking on the bright side, if you have paid extra for a Mac, but you still want to be able to use normal software on it, just like anyone else, all is not necessarily lost: you can always pay extra again for something like "Parallels" so that it can pretend to be a PC instead. That's probably your best remedy, really ...
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  • Profile picture of the author mattmax
    No to get involved in a religious war, but I do have a couple of pro Apple comments:

    1. Their pricing has become better in the last few years

    2. The fact that they control the hardware and the software (machine and OS) results in a more reliable overall user experience (it has for me)

    Case in point: About a year ago I purchased a 27" iMac. I had never owned a Mac before. Before I purchased it, I did my best to see what it would cost to build a similar PC. I built a setup (Newegg) that was virtually identical in terms of specs, but a lot uglier (not all in one, not all aluminum, etc.), and the resulting price was about $400 less than the cost of the iMac. Given that my total cost was just over $2000, and that the iMac was easily vastly more visually appealing, I decided to take the plunge.

    I upgraded the RAM myself (one of the places that Apple still gouges), which took all of 5 minutes.

    I also encouraged family members (who I had been unofficial tech support for since the dawn of time) to make the switch. There was always a lot of groaning, and complaining about how the iMac that cost the same (in my dad's case) was not as powerful as the PC he had his eye on, or that the only notebook that could be afforded (in my sister's case) was used and not as powerful as the notebook she was looking at. In both cases, however, they are happy as can be, and the number of tech support calls I get has dropped to almost nil.

    I don't think there is a perfect computer or computer company out there, but I also think that there are many more factors at play than total price for a list of hardware specifications.

    /.02
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    • Profile picture of the author Aussie_Al
      Originally Posted by mattmax View Post

      No to get involved in a religious war, but I do have a couple of pro Apple comments:
      haha nice one!

      Yup there is good and bad on both like I said for the longest time I was a "mac guy" I Just figured this giant graphic might be of some interest to fellow warriors
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      • Profile picture of the author mattmax
        Originally Posted by Aussie_Al View Post

        haha nice one!

        Yup there is good and bad on both like I said for the longest time I was a "mac guy" I Just figured this giant graphic might be of some interest to fellow warriors
        Totally.

        FWIW, I think that the Macs have recently become a decent deal in their more consumer oriented machines. A Mac Pro is still outrageously expensive though, relative to what you get - although I am hard pressed to imagine why any "normal" user would even want to get one.

        In the interest of full disclosure, I have been toying with the idea of getting a PC for gaming, because that's really the only way to go for a high performance gaming rig.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Fereday
      Originally Posted by mattmax View Post

      No to get involved in a religious war, but I do have a couple of pro Apple comments:

      1. Their pricing has become better in the last few years

      2. The fact that they control the hardware and the software (machine and OS) results in a more reliable overall user experience (it has for me)

      Case in point: About a year ago I purchased a 27" iMac. I had never owned a Mac before. Before I purchased it, I did my best to see what it would cost to build a similar PC. I built a setup (Newegg) that was virtually identical in terms of specs, but a lot uglier (not all in one, not all aluminum, etc.), and the resulting price was about $400 less than the cost of the iMac. Given that my total cost was just over $2000, and that the iMac was easily vastly more visually appealing, I decided to take the plunge.

      I upgraded the RAM myself (one of the places that Apple still gouges), which took all of 5 minutes.

      I also encouraged family members (who I had been unofficial tech support for since the dawn of time) to make the switch. There was always a lot of groaning, and complaining about how the iMac that cost the same (in my dad's case) was not as powerful as the PC he had his eye on, or that the only notebook that could be afforded (in my sister's case) was used and not as powerful as the notebook she was looking at. In both cases, however, they are happy as can be, and the number of tech support calls I get has dropped to almost nil.

      I don't think there is a perfect computer or computer company out there, but I also think that there are many more factors at play than total price for a list of hardware specifications.

      /.02

      Great information, thanks. It's funny how Mac Owners look for any opportunity to say how great their computers are...kind of like BMW owners - what gives? Anyway I get this from my Brother and Sister who are Mac people... But I have to say they are faster and last longer, and never seem to run out of battery power when they need it most -- very different than on my PC...I may have to try a Mac some day.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    When I first took computer classes at the local community college, I didn't know the difference between a mouse and a hard drive. And I had zero bias between Mac and Win.

    I had a couple of classes on a Mac, and a couple of more on Win. I found I was DOING things on a Mac and LEARNING how to do things on Win.

    Everything on WIN is a little bit harder and takes an extra step or two.

    Since then, I've said, if you want to learn computers, get a WIN. If you want to USE a computer, get a Mac.
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    • Profile picture of the author MarieDi
      Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

      Since then, I've said, if you want to learn computers, get a WIN. If you want to USE a computer, get a Mac.
      Yes. 100% true.
      I've had a Mac since 1984, the first 128k Macs. I've also worked on PCs.
      To tell you the truth, only those who have never used a Mac get all vocal against it.
      I've has many PC-Evangelist friends who quietly became Mac users (and pretty silent ones, I'll say ) after giving it a decent try. I don't know of any Mac user who switched to PC and been happy with it.

      This being said, I personally want to thank all of you who called me names in this thread like "ignorant" and who seem to believe I'm not a "normal" computer user.

      To finish, I'll just say this: all the Macs I've owned knew how to open any document, whether it originated from a PC or a Mac. We are now at the closing of 2011 and I still see PCs that can't read a file created on a Mac...

      Hmm...!

      Marie
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      • Profile picture of the author Dana Goetz
        You go girl!!!!
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
        It's really a matter of what you're used to. Case in point:

        Originally Posted by MarieDi View Post

        Yes. 100% true.
        I've had a Mac since 1984, the first 128k Macs. I've also worked on PCs.
        To tell you the truth, only those who have never used a Mac get all vocal against it.
        I've has many PC-Evangelist friends who quietly became Mac users (and pretty silent ones, I'll say ) after giving it a decent try. I don't know of any Mac user who switched to PC and been happy with it.

        This being said, I personally want to thank all of you who called me names in this thread like "ignorant" and who seem to believe I'm not a "normal" computer user.

        To finish, I'll just say this: all the Macs I've owned knew how to open any document, whether it originated from a PC or a Mac. We are now at the closing of 2011 and I still see PCs that can't read a file created on a Mac...

        Hmm...!

        Marie
        It stands to reason you prefer them. I have been using PCs for about as long. And yes, I DO have experience on Macs as well.

        Nothing wrong with a Mac. I like them. But for the type of user I am, I can get a very nice laptop for about $650.00 - and a comparable Mac I have priced at a minimum of $1400.00. For my needs, it makes no sense to pay twice the amount.

        And FWIW - I have never TRIED to open a Mac doc on a PC. What would be the point? It's not enough to make me spend so much on one...

        And Kurt, I have been USING PC's for years, but only ever LEARN on a Mac. Again - a matter of what you're used to
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        • Profile picture of the author Kurt
          Originally Posted by MikeAmbrosio View Post

          It's really a matter of what you're used to. Case in point:



          It stands to reason you prefer them. I have been using PCs for about as long. And yes, I DO have experience on Macs as well.

          Nothing wrong with a Mac. I like them. But for the type of user I am, I can get a very nice laptop for about $650.00 - and a comparable Mac I have priced at a minimum of $1400.00. For my needs, it makes no sense to pay twice the amount.

          And FWIW - I have never TRIED to open a Mac doc on a PC. What would be the point? It's not enough to make me spend so much on one...

          And Kurt, I have been USING PC's for years, but only ever LEARN on a Mac. Again - a matter of what you're used to
          And to repeat, I had NO experience on either platform until I took some classes on both. Mac is (was) far more user friendly. Of course, if you become accustomed to one first, you'll prefer that platform. However, that wasn't the case for me.

          Windows has caught up some over the years, but 15 years ago or so, trying adding new periphrials to a Mac or to a PC. Set the BIOS? Are you kidding me? Win has improved, but still look at any installation instructions to this day: 7 steps on a PC, 5 on a Mac.
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          • Profile picture of the author MikeAmbrosio
            Originally Posted by Kurt View Post

            And to repeat, I had NO experience on either platform until I took some classes on both. Mac is (was) far more user friendly. Of course, if you become accustomed to one first, you'll prefer that platform. However, that wasn't the case for me.

            Windows has caught up some over the years, but 15 years ago or so, trying adding new periphrials to a Mac or to a PC. Set the BIOS? Are you kidding me? Win has improved, but still look at any installation instructions to this day: 7 steps on a PC, 5 on a Mac.
            I understood what you were saying Kurt. I was simply contrasting your last sentence:

            Since then, I've said, if you want to learn computers, get a WIN. If you want to USE a computer, get a Mac.
            I remember when Windows 95 was released - people said things like "Windows 95 = Mac 85" (or something like that). Windows was always a bit behind in their OS

            What peripheral have you had to add that required resetting the bios? It must have been a while back? Because in the past 10 years, the only time I ever touched the Bios is when upgrading it - which was 2 clicks and a restart...

            I recently started messing with Linux (Ubuntu) - talk about out of my element. It took me HOURS to install a printer LOL. These days, things like printers and other USB devices pretty much install themselves...even on a PC.

            Yup - just a matter of what you're used to.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    WOW, only 3299!?!?!? That sounds CHEAP! By your calcs, it is maybe $2200. SCO UNIX in 1990 cost OVER $1400!!!!!!! So that brings the price up to $3600. Apples OS could do what SCO could, but BETTER.

    But you fell into a trap. A faster CPU won't run it's best without faster memory, so raising the speed of the CPU DOES increase ITS price, and the price of memory, etc... Disk size is NOT the sole determinant of value. Apples drive IS like the 2nd fastest on the market. Some are little more than a THIRD of that speed. And size, and family add onto the price. RAID? WHAT RAID!?!?!? They don't make "RAID" controllers! Buying a RAID controller, to controllers, is like saying you bought a car, for vehicles! So what is it? 0? 5? And what type of connections? Just TRY going to a "car dealer" and say you want a car! They may LAUGH at you! You could end up with ANYTHING! How do you even find a "CAR" dealer? They all specialize in given brands which, themselves specialize in given types.

    Regarding the BIOS, IBM played the SAME trick! IBM only copyrighted the BIOS! PC DOS, ashton tate, and ms flight simulator originally wouldn't run on copies, because of the BIOS differences.

    It IS a shame! SUN produced a GREAT platform. When they moved to IBM workalike, they started collapsing! The got rid of the ONLY thing they REALLY owned! IBM apparently used an INTEL evaluation platform, and only copyrighted the ROM. Once competitors found out the secret, THEY started collapsing. Apple used to own EVERYTHING! NOW, they own ONLY the OS! THEY started losing customers.

    Even DEC started going downhill after trying to proprietize the IBM platform! Within a few years, they were DEAD!

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Fazal Mayar
    i guess mac isnt as good as people make it sound to be but its not shabby at all!
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  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    ANother reason not to get a mac. A few years back I was on a project that was replacing hard drives on MAC laptops. There was a total of 73 screws you had to remove and replace for the process. Totally rediculous.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by KimW View Post

      ANother reason not to get a mac. A few years back I was on a project that was replacing hard drives on MAC laptops. There was a total of 73 screws you had to remove and replace for the process. Totally rediculous.
      73 screws for ONE drive? On an IBM compatible system, I could see maybe as many as 12. SOME IBM compatible systems might not have ANY! Some have latches on the case to allow it to open, and laches on the drive to allow them to slide.

      There IS a problem in the world! People USED to believe they could do whatever. before I was born, they already had labels... "DO NOT OPEN! DANGER! NO user serviceable components inside.". Let's see some STUPID things the industry has done for such behavior:

      1. Removed the reset switch!
      2. Removed the OFF Switch!
      3. HELL, is the ON switch even REALLY an ON switch?
      4. MANY things are even SEALED!
      5. They don't even provide the Schematics anymore.

      With all this garbage, maybe they never cared to help anyone get in the case. Even many "EXPERTS" are pretty stupid, and don't know the first thing about electronics.

      Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author jayspann
      Originally Posted by KimW View Post

      ANother reason not to get a mac. A few years back I was on a project that was replacing hard drives on MAC laptops. There was a total of 73 screws you had to remove and replace for the process. Totally rediculous.
      On the newest model its about 12-16 screws depending on which size of laptop your talking. On the 09 model I have there is only one screw

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      • Profile picture of the author MoneyMagnetMagnate
        I was weaned on a MAC...I got my first Mac from a person who worked at Apple and got the company discount.
        Back then, it was Mac or PC - there was no compatability. It was easier to use a Mac...(remember 'user-friendly'?)

        Then - I was forced into PC servitude! And like Kurt said...I found myself asking "why doesn't this thing just do it like a Mac?" PC users learned tasks - Mac users learned tricks!

        The PC plebs could tell you were an Apple polisher easily back then - you tried to click on everything twice - :rolleyes: The marketing dept. got all the Macs for graphics.

        But alas, like some speculate of Cro-magnon and Neanderthal, soon there was cross-breeding afoot! Now look - the grandchildren (iphone / android) are still not fully getting along yet...:rolleyes:
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by jayspann View Post

        On the newest model its about 12-16 screws depending on which size of laptop your talking. On the 09 model I have there is only one screw

        ONE screw on a laptop would be dumb! Drives can vary in height a little, so pressure fitting is DUMB! You COULD have a bracket(as ALL I have seen do), but the drives are generally STANDARD and attach via screws. That bracket COULD have a kind of hinge attached with one screw. And did the cover have no screws? Most have screws.

        So, could you potentially remove the drive with one screw? YEP! But it is VERY rare that anyone wants to do that. Probably over 80% of the time, it is to REPLACE the drive. At least SOME of the time, they will put that drive elsewhere. So that means removing the bracket, and likely remounting a bracket, and then you deal with MORE screws!

        Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    Steve, this was on Ibook laptops.I don't know how it was on a regular desktop Mac.
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by KimW View Post

      Steve, this was on Ibook laptops.I don't know how it was on a regular desktop Mac.
      Well, on the average type laptop I HAVE seen maybe 4-6 screws to screw the drive into a bracket, and maybe 4 to screw the bracket in, and maybe 2-4 to screw the cover on. so that is like 18! 73 STILL sounds extreme. Of course, some older laptops, and ESPECIALLY proprietary ones, like apple, might have you taking out several EXTRA screws, because they aren't meant to be serviced. MOST laptops today have a multi piece cover, in a sense, where one covers the battery(and is usually part of the battery), one covers the memory, one may cover the CPU, and one may cover the drive.

      I once had a laptop that had all the covers I described EXCEPT the drive one!!!!!!!!! I had to replace the drive, because it went bad! I had to unscrew the top cover, flip it forward, unscrew the keyboard, flip it back, unscrew the drive bracket from the computer, unscrew that from the OLD drive, and reverse the process. THAT was maybe 19 screws! Of course, I had to do it TWICE, so you MIGHT say it was 38 screws! BTW I replaced the drive with one 50% larger. It is STILL a little uneven, because the new drive is close to like 1/8" taller! 8-/!

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author KimW
    Maybe you all remember reading about this a few years back. These were part of the batch we put new hard drives in.
    $50 iBooks cause stampede! | TUAW - The Unofficial Apple Weblog
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  • Profile picture of the author Rich Struck
    Nobody has ever accused Apple of chasing the low end of the computer market. If you want a computer that is "good enough" go with Windows. If you want a computer that is a joy to work on, go Mac.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alexa Smith
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Rich Struck View Post

      Nobody has ever accused Apple of chasing the low end of the computer market.
      Not the low end in price, anyway.
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    • Profile picture of the author Michael Fereday
      Originally Posted by Rich Struck View Post

      Nobody has ever accused Apple of chasing the low end of the computer market. If you want a computer that is "good enough" go with Windows. If you want a computer that is a joy to work on, go Mac.


      Yep, that's how Apple People put it too... a joy, or a pleasure to work on...maybe I will try one? Not much difference in learning Windows Vista and what's on a Mac I imagine...
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  • Profile picture of the author megaquests
    so is there a way to run mac ios on pc?
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  • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
    Those memories of the horrid 1 button Mac mice haunt me to this day. I'm a PC guy 4 life.
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    • Profile picture of the author Daniel Evans
      When I was young I waorked on a Mac Classic (the boxes with the mono screens) and loved them for the fact they were unique.

      Now, all we have are branded PC's as the OP states with the ipad aside.
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  • Profile picture of the author paul_1
    Most people buy MAC because its "cool" to have a MAC... So they're basically buying the brand and the sense of security of having a MAC...
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by paul_1 View Post

      Most people buy MAC because its "cool" to have a MAC... So they're basically buying the brand and the sense of security of having a MAC...
      I guarantee they don't buy MACs for prestige of the name.

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author cashtree
    i've had this discussion with mac fanboys before, they justified them paying more because of the customer support you get with a mac, apple stores etc...while that's nice, it's still not worth the price tags they put on their products. They're all overpriced and underpowered, the only thing they make good is monitors. A lot of Mac came from Freebsd, they just added on to it over the years. and to answer your question as to why more are getting Mac's it's because Apple has done well with Iphone, ipad and ipod, so customers get under the impression Mac's must be good too. I've never been a fan of apple, they're control freaks, and I don't like their business models. But I also don't like facebook, I could go on and on why, but 800 million do, so who cares what I think.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stevemartin619
    Nice Information about Mac and now, i realized why people's doesn't buy Mac
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