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Nowadays it is common to call females "guys" and female thespians commonly refer to themselves "actors" instead of actresses (not that there's anything wrong with that).
  • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
    Not surprising...it seems many people these days like to try and make males and females identical uh sorry.. I mean "equal". Otherwise the sexist brigade will jump on you...
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    • Profile picture of the author ShayB
      I don't see a problem? :confused:
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      • Profile picture of the author MerlynSanchez
        I've always (since back in high school) referred to a group of females as "guys".

        Gals sounded like something out of the 40's, and girls seemed childish ( we were teenagers and certainly didn't want to be referred to as children!).

        It was always, "hey guys, where should we go"". etc. I still say it.

        Interestingly enough I have never referred to one female as a "guy". It only works with a group.
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      • Profile picture of the author thunderbird
        Originally Posted by ShayRockhold View Post

        I don't see a problem? :confused:
        No, no, none at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author Face Cap
      Originally Posted by Ernie Lonardo View Post

      Not surprising...it seems many people these days like to try and make males and females identical uh I sry I mean "equal. Otherwise the sexist brigade will jump on you...
      Absolutely , you are correct
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  • Profile picture of the author smileverse
    Em. This is what i have questioned myself many time at first, but later I've convinced myself after referring to few websites. Finally, I understand that these day World follow the trend (not the rules, punctuations or grammar).
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  • Profile picture of the author neiljohnson85
    I think now a days anyone can called anything to all. so it's general thing. so better what we have to speak to other by pointing them. we can say what's in our mind. Thank you.
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  • Profile picture of the author lcombs
    Personally, I like women to be feminine.
    I like the difference.
    There are 'guys' and 'gals';
    There are 'dudes' and 'chicks'
    Why is it that anything that used to differentiate women from men, associating anything efeminate to women is now regarded as sexist and/or degrading toward women?
    To me, it sounds like women are recognizing men as being better.
    (With which, I strongly disagree).
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    • Profile picture of the author Dennis Gaskill
      Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      Personally, I like women to be feminine.
      I like the difference.
      There are 'guys' and 'gals';
      There are 'dudes' and 'chicks'
      Why is it that anything that used to differentiate women from men, associating anything efeminate to women is now regarded as sexist and/or degrading toward women?
      To me, it sounds like women are recognizing men as being better.
      (With which, I strongly disagree).
      I agree with you for the most part, although I can see why women wouldn't want to be called a chick. Nowadays though, gals call each other "dude" too. Frankly, I think those who cry sexist at every turn are looking for something they are not going to find ... not the way their going about it.
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    • Profile picture of the author ShayB
      Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      Personally, I like women to be feminine.
      I like the difference.
      There are 'guys' and 'gals';
      There are 'dudes' and 'chicks'
      Why is it that anything that used to differentiate women from men, associating anything efeminate to women is now regarded as sexist and/or degrading toward women?
      To me, it sounds like women are recognizing men as being better.
      (With which, I strongly disagree).
      As someone who has worked a great deal in fields that are traditionally "masculine," I may be able to shed some light on the "other" perspective.

      Being "feminine" is fine. But (in general) that often has a connotation that there are some things that females shouldn't/can't do.

      I've had professors say I shouldn't be in a college math class because it "takes the spot away from a man."

      I've had male coworkers say that women shouldn't sell electronics. (I was the first female in that particular location.)

      There are other examples, but you get the idea.

      I'm not upset if someone calls me a lady. "Gal" and "chick" bug me. They have been used far too often to me in a derogatory manner. ("Ha. The new chick thinks she can beat my sales numbers." [Which I did.] "I don't see why gals should go to college." [They have every right to.])

      If you've never had the terms used to refer to you badly (or never meant any harm in using them), it's hard to see how they could be taken that way. But they can be.

      As far as "actor and actress" is concerned - if we don't have differing terms for male and female doctors, artists or singers, what's the harm in making the terms that do have a distinction more in line with the ones that are gender-neutral?
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      • Profile picture of the author John Durham
        Originally Posted by ShayRockhold View Post

        As someone who has worked a great deal in fields that are traditionally "masculine," I may be able to shed some light on the "other" perspective.

        Being "feminine" is fine. But (in general) that often has a connotation that there are some things that females shouldn't/can't do.

        I've had professors say I shouldn't be in a college math class because it "takes the spot away from a man."

        I've had male coworkers say that women shouldn't sell electronics. (I was the first female in that particular location.)

        There are other examples, but you get the idea.

        I'm not upset if someone calls me a lady. "Gal" and "chick" bug me. They have been used far too often to me in a derogatory manner. ("Ha. The new chick thinks she can beat my sales numbers." [Which I did.] "I don't see why gals should go to college." [They have every right to.])

        If you've never had the terms used to refer to you badly (or never meant any harm in using them), it's hard to see how they could be taken that way. But they can be.

        As far as "actor and actress" is concerned - if we don't have differing terms for male and female doctors, artists or singers, what's the harm in making the terms that do have a distinction more in line with the ones that are gender-neutral?
        Shay, I agree, and love you from the bottom of my flip flops to the top of my head, but...

        I have tested this over some numbers, and women dont do well generally at fundraising for police organizations comparitively. So there are SOME gender specific things that are true, just like I dont think a man would get very far selling underclothes in a womens clothing department.

        It would just make them feel too weird.
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        • Profile picture of the author ShayB
          Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

          Shay, I agree, and love you from the bottom of my flip flops to the top of my head, but...

          I have tested this over some numbers, and women dont do well generally at fundraising for police organizations comparitively. So there are SOME gender specific things that are true, just like I dont think a man would get very far selling underclothes in a womens clothing department.

          It would just make them feel too weird.
          Fair enough.

          And I say that if you don't let me try simply because of my gender, that's a mistake. It's the "generally" that is the issue.

          Women may "generally" suck at selling electronics. I dunno. Don't care. The point is that I can sell electronics - just as well or better than most guys can (in my experience).

          Guys are "generally" taller than women. Except for my female cousin, who is knocking on the door of 6 feet tall. So to make a blanket statement that women can't/shouldn't stock shelves because they're too short for the job is flat-out wrong.

          That's an odd example but I hope it shows my point.

          Edited to add: I've known some kick-a$$ Avon reps and lingerie salesmen that were guys. It's all in the way it's done.

          Another edit: You love me! *swoons*
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          • Profile picture of the author John Durham
            Originally Posted by ShayRockhold View Post

            ....*swoons* .....
            Now thats what a good woman is supposed to do!! lol (Just kidding, dont hurt me. lol)

            Glad I said "generally" because there are exceptions, and its not surprising that you are one, being stellar all around as I have come to know you through your posts..., however I was just speaking to the rule., not the exceptions

            Im a man who can clean house and make dinner...Well okay, I like to "think" I can make dinner...so I understand. I have met men who are amazing cooks though, and I have met women who I think there might be a good chance they could kick my A$$!

            In fact I got cowgirl punched by one so hard it about knocked me over once!

            No offense intended, I am probably one of womens greatest fans, my mom is one by God!
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  • Profile picture of the author hardraysnight
    whatever happened to ladies and gentlemen
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    • Profile picture of the author thunderbird
      Originally Posted by hardraysnight View Post

      whatever happened to ladies and gentlemen
      I noticed a typo. The question should be, "Whatever happened to guys?" "Lady" is considered to be derogatory by some womyn.

      (I sneak away )
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      • Profile picture of the author hardraysnight
        Originally Posted by thunderbird View Post

        I noticed a typo. The question should be, "Whatever happened to guys?" "Lady" is considered to be derogatory by some womyn.

        (I sneak away )
        i once walked into a room, yes i am a searcher at heart, there wwere three persons of the female gender

        i said; ' good morning, ladies.'

        they said 'we are not ladies, we are women.'

        i said 'that is up to you, but i will always be a gentleman.'

        as i left the room, i turned and called 'see you sheilas.'
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        • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
          I have no qualms at all about being called a lady.

          I was raised to be a lady, and do consider myself one, at least I try. And I do expect to be treated like one.

          Anyway, when I say hey "guys", that includes women too, not to take away from their femininity at all, but I use it as a term of endearment for friends.

          I would never come up to a mixed group of strangers and say "hey guys". I would say, please excuse me, but can you tell me, blah, blah, whatever.

          Terra
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          • Profile picture of the author lcombs
            Originally Posted by MissTerraK View Post

            I have no qualms at all about being called a lady.

            I was raised to be a lady, and do consider myself one, at least I try. And I do expect to be treated like one.

            Anyway, when I say hey "guys", that includes women too, not to take away from their femininity at all, but I use it as a term of endearment for friends.

            I would never come up to a mixed group of strangers and say "hey guys". I would say, please excuse me, but can you tell me, blah, blah, whatever.

            Terra
            I think you and I have disagreed on more than one occasion, however,
            nothing mean spirited, I believe.
            Anyway, my point is, I always had the impression that you know how to be and appreciate being considered a 'lady'.
            And, for that, you have my respect.
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            • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
              Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

              I think you and I have disagreed on more than one occasion, however,
              nothing mean spirited, I believe.
              Anyway, my point is, I always had the impression that you know how to be and appreciate being considered a 'lady'.
              And, for that, you have my respect.
              Oh no, nothing ever mean spirited, for sure, at least not my take on any thing we've discussed anyway. I'm sure we've disagreed but have done so politely and friendly.

              Aww! Thank you for the compliment. It was mighty gentlemanly of you.

              Terra
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    • Profile picture of the author lcombs
      Originally Posted by hardraysnight View Post

      whatever happened to ladies and gentlemen
      I have a 35 year old daughter.
      About 10 years ago I opened a door for her and said "Ladies first".
      She looked at me like I was crazy. She had no idea what I was talking about.

      The concept of 'ladies and gentlemen' went out the window when women's lib started.
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      • Profile picture of the author thunderbird
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        I have a 35 year old daughter.
        About 10 years ago I opened a door for her and said "Ladies first".
        She looked at me like I was crazy. She had no idea what I was talking about.

        The concept of 'ladies and gentlemen' went out the window when women's lib started.
        I don't find so much touchiness about such matters with women I know. Basically, when the topic even comes up it is usually in joke form.
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        • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
          Shay has some valid points and a lot does ride on the the way the term is used. A condescending tone and a negative connotation can turn any word into insult when the normal use of it is complimentary.

          That being said, I have never for the life of me been able to figure out why a woman, lady, female, etc. would take offense at being called what God/nature created them as, negative connotations aside.:confused::confused:

          Now, tell me I walk like a man and we have a problem! Don't get me wrong, I love to watch men walk, but men are supposed to walk that way and it's not comely of a woman. You know, like no man wants to be told they walk like a lady, but like to watch ladies walk.

          Why ladies and gentlemen can't be obvious opposites like black and white or up and down like it's supposed to be is beyond me!

          I miss the simple small hometown life, lol!

          Terra
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      • Profile picture of the author hardraysnight
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        I have a 35 year old daughter.
        About 10 years ago I opened a door for her and said "Ladies first".
        She looked at me like I was crazy. She had no idea what I was talking about.

        The concept of 'ladies and gentlemen' went out the window when women's lib started.
        the concept of ladies may well have gone out the window when womens lib started, although i very much doubt it, but that does not stop one being a gentleman instead of a snag - sensitive new age guy
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          Originally Posted by hardraysnight View Post

          the concept of ladies may well have gone out the window when womens lib started, although i very much doubt it, but that does not stop one being a gentleman instead of a snag - sensitive new age guy
          Eventually they will emasculate you if you act like that too much... they are very selective as to what offends them.

          Ask them who they would want to be with if a war or famine broke out...they would want to be with a man who had manly prowess and could hunt...and the sensitive guys would be considered weak. Im very sensative myself, but I know Im a man too.

          You need food and shelter more than you need poetry. Im proud to be a man who can do either one, but I havent forgotten which gender I am.

          I think Dennis Gaskill is the perfect example with his demeanor of a man who has a good balance.

          He is the quentessential "Gentle -Man".

          @ OP

          Looks like Tbird is learning how to make people tick...thats a good sign that you have the ability to do great things!

          Originally Posted by MissTerraK View Post

          I have no qualms at all about being called a lady.

          I was raised to be a lady, and do consider myself one, at least I try. And I do expect to be treated like one.

          Terra
          I would bet your husband feels charming alot too, because you allow him to exptress that part of himself. Thats healthy.

          Nothing more attractive than a woman who will sit in a car, and not get out until you come around and open her door. lol

          She demands that you are a gentlemen, and you get the pleasure of experienceing yourself as one.

          Loooove that personally.

          I told my daughter to do that if a man fails to open her door, and she did, and her husband opens the door everytime or she dont get out.

          Im out of this thread now that I just lost 25% of my WF customers. lol
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          • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
            John,

            OMGosh! If I could give you 1,000 thanks, I would!

            It's like you simply opened my mind like a book and read it word per word!

            Actually, that's a little scary, haha!

            I understand you completely and can see that you do me as well.

            And yes, hubby and I have that perfect combo that works for both of us.

            I would never, ever do or say anything that would deflect his masculinity even though I've had opportunities where I could. His masculinity is one of his most appealing attributes and isn't effected even when he cooks (which he loves to do) as he cooks in such a manly way, if you know what I mean. haha!

            I love to just watch him work his magic in his style with our food.

            Anyway, for what it's worth, I personally think you would make a lady very very happy.

            Terra
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  • Profile picture of the author go4glory
    Doesn't really matter. Every few years slangs change, new words, customs prop up. If its understandable to most ppl, then it's fine.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    I feel like polarity and contrast is important in all areas of life in order for us to be able to make distinctions.

    A: When woman are not proud of their special God given distinctiveness, its just like saying "men are better".

    B: I would never want to be with a woman who was as manly as I am, in fact I have left one because of that. She was all feminist, and I couldnt tell who the man was. I am proudf of my gentlemanliness and one of the joys of life is feeling and experiencing that with a real woman.

    C: When a woman is different than a man it provides the polarity that makes him feel his manliness, and when a man is a real man it makes a woman feel more feminine, it has to because of contrast.

    D: How can I feel like a man if my woman is not letting me show my prowess and is offended with the manly gifts I offer. How can I ever feel charming if she refuses to be charmed?

    (How can you have any pudding if you dont eat yuour meat? lol- JK that went though my head when I wrote that, totally irrelevant).

    F: How could a woman possibly feel like a woman in the presence of a man that acts like a girl? There's no distinction.

    In my own life I want a woman who I can open doors for and treat gently like a princess, because the difference between us is wonderful and our expressing our differences gives me what I need to feel like a man and gives her what she needs to feel like a woman.

    If I cant open a door for you, or buy you dinner, then you need to be with someone else , because you are stealing from me the thing that helps me define myself as a "gentleman".

    I WANT that difference...I know theresdnothing worse than a man who acts like a girl. I dont even care if you are GAY, act like a man. God made us different and by not wanting to recognize that , you are just are stealing the sense of identity and the joy of the special gifts of the other person.

    Now, when it comes to equal opportunity I guarantee you that the avergae man is going to pick up a 100 pound box faster than the average woman, we have scientifically a different type of adrenaline and testosterone...

    But still a woman should have a chance to prove herself if she wishes, just like men should be able to have the same opportunity at what are typically considered womens jobs...

    But in the end, its just a personal choice for me, a feminine woman who knows how to let me treat her like a lady allows me to experience the joy of what I offer as a man,

    ....but if everytime I do something gentlemanlty there is a probblem?

    Sorry Bye bye...theres another lady is going to say "why thank you, you are such a gnetleman" and my heart is going to flutter.

    If you want to steal that from your man go for it... But in my case, if you wont let me be a gentleman and I dont feel like a man with you, you are G-O-N-E!

    I dont want to be with a woman who is more man than I am. I think alot of others feels the same. You wouldnt want to be with a man who was more womanly than you are , right?

    Nothing is more attractive than a woman who embraces her feminenity.

    Sorry.

    People will disagree...its a personal choice, but for me, personally, its a straight up, shriveling, turn off.

    Its one thing to be able to fend for yourself if you have to, but its another to steal from your man the opportunity to fend for you like he is designed inwardly to want to do.

    What if everytime you tried to charm your man with womanly wiles he corrected you and said "I dont want that?"

    Some other man would be delighted with your special ways, and would make you feel the things you wanted to feel... He would be stupid to reject your womanly gifts and steal from you the joy of offering them.
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  • Profile picture of the author dallas playboy
    I suggest not going into a biker bar and saying, " How you ladies doing today? "
    Women don't seem to mind being called "guys" but it don't work the other way
    around. Not if ya wanted to stay out of the hospital.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by dallas playboy View Post

      I suggest not going into a biker bar and saying, " How you ladies doing today? "
      Women don't seem to mind being called "guys" but it don't work the other way
      around. Not if ya wanted to stay out of the hospital.
      I use to play music in biker bars so I know the type, and you wont ever see me riding on the back of some big sweaty womans harley. Its a personal choice. I like woman who are feminene.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    @ Miss T

    Sounds like your hubby is an aweful lucky feller, and I will bet he knows it! Good for Yall!
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    • Profile picture of the author ShayB
      I'll be the first to admit I'm not girly.

      I don't own a dress or a skirt. I will wear flowery shirts at times, but with pants or shorts.

      I'm not masculine, per se, but I am very strong-willed and I don't like the feeling that I am dependent on a man.

      I don't mind having doors opened for me and stuff. I like being treated to dinner and sch if the guy wants to do that.

      But when it becomes "let me take care of you, princess - I don't want you to work. You just sit back, clean the house, cook my meals and look pretty" - then no. I can't do that. I've tried. I'm so not wired that way that it's not even funny.

      And there's nothing wrong with being either way. Some women like that. That's cool. Some guys like being with a headstrong woman and that's okay, too.

      I'm sure I'm screwing this up, so I'll shut up now.
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  • Profile picture of the author thunderbird
    I think gender is like the transitions between landscapes with some middle ground that contains both landscapes. That is why there are manly women, effeminate men, and people are not clearly either gender. I don't have any battle with that. As long as someone isn't messing with me or harming others, I have no problem with them, however strange they may be. I am a fairly regular bloke myself, perhaps with a touch more testosterone and serotonin than most, lol.
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    • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
      Originally Posted by thunderbird View Post

      I think gender is like the transitions between landscapes with some middle ground that contains both landscapes. That is why there are manly women, effeminate men, and people are not clearly either gender. I don't have any battle with that. As long as someone isn't messing with me or harming others, I have no problem with them, however strange they may be. I am a fairly regular bloke myself, perhaps with a touch more testosterone and serotonin than most, lol.
      Interesting indeed...

      As for me, I don't like the lines blurred, I like 20/20 vision and want it to stay that way.

      It is such a pain when I have to dig out the ole spectacles and scrutinize to determine whether a person is a man or a woman, and all the squinting and scrutinizing causes my forehead and eyes to scrunch up and could contribute to premature wrinkles. Haha!

      Terra
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    No Shay , alot of women feel that way. I think we are talking about the kind who just reject everything their man has to offer... and they dont want their to be any difference in gender considered at all.
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    • Profile picture of the author ShayB
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      No Shay , alot of women feel that way. I think we are talking about the kind who just reject everything their man has to offer... and they dont want their to be any difference in gender considered at all.
      Perhaps you're right.
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  • Profile picture of the author nelspetty924
    It's cool, I see no problem with that.
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