High Childhood IQ Linked To Drug Use?(!)

13 years ago

You can't. Just educate them, and leave them to make their own mistakes. The more you try and control them, the more rebellious they're likely to become.

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HeySal

13 years ago

I have a pretty high IQ - and I LOVED to stone out. I also had very good parents and they didn't know what to do about my partying. They took me to a shrink and he said the only thing wrong with me is that I could use some high potency vitamins now and again. My point though? I don't think you're going to feel better when you hear it.

Ultimately there is NOTHING you can do about it if your kid wants to take drugs. Make sure they know you love them - teach them about the danger of drugs - legal and illegal, be honest. Don't tell them all about how harmful pot is - they will learn the difference and your words will be lost on them later. Teach them about how dangerous food additives are so they can round out their knowledge in an internal category of "chemicals" - they will learn to be cautious of ALL chemicals, party drugs, prescriptions, or just deoderant.

IF there is true intelligence behind it, it's experimentation. They just want to know and that's a hard one to stop when dealing with an advanced mind. At a certain point all you can do is hope and pray you have taught them well enough that they don't do anything stupid.

That's probably a drag to hear - but it's the truth of the matter. You can't live for someone else - no matter how much you want to be able to.

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thunderbird

13 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

<snip>Teach them about how dangerous food additives are so they can round out their knowledge in an internal category of "chemicals" - they will learn to be cautious of ALL chemicals, party drugs, prescriptions, or just deoderant. <snip>

That sounds like a good plan. Engage their intelligence. An honest in-depth exploration of what happens -- and the damage done -- from a chemical standpoint.

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HeySal

13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

That sounds like a good plan. Engage their intelligence. An honest in-depth exploration of what happens -- and the damage done -- from a chemical standpoint.

My dad and I sat down once after much conflict over my experimenting.
Background for this one -- I had been being shot up twice a week for allergies and had taken prescriptions that came close to killing me. I wasn't afraid of drugs. Back then they didn't believe in naturopaths - that was mumbo jumbo, so I grew up being drugged with things that left me just this side of drooling. The illicit ones made me feel better while the ones the doctors had made me feel like crap. I loved speed and coke. My favorite was LSD - I used to trip for weeks on end - go to school high. Took my IQ test in 11th grade stoned. LMAO - a story for another day. I could breath good on uppers and they brought my mind back to alertness unlike the asthma pharms.

They gave me one and didn't tell my parents that it would poison me if taken with aspirin - they said "new" = a more appropriate word would have been "experimental". I don't think they knew you couldn't put aspirin with it until after I died and they were able to revive me. After that, it was hard for me think much about taking a hit of sunshine and having a really kewl trip going on (running the mazes). I could feel it wasn't doing the damage that the pharms were. Downers made me feel damage so I wouldn't touch them. But I think I tried about everything at least once. The reason I stopped doing the speed and coke was because I saw it killing people. Same reason I stopped pharmaceuticals.

Anyhow - My dad and I sat down one day and talked. He asked me - frankly as an adult - and with an honest wonder - what it was like to trip on LSD. We had a long discussion. That was about the time I put down most of the drugs. I still liked to trip, and later I started to smoke a little pot, but cut everything else out. Mostly I attribute that to some of the discussion we had that day when we started talking about toxins and side effects.

Maybe I never would have gotten addicted to anything even if I hadn't had the family I had - maybe I wouldn't have. I think the open communication and honest interest in "what is it like" and the discussion of side effects majorly contributed to me putting most of the crap down permanently. Some stuff feels good now, but you don't want to go there. Talking over how I felt afterward and side effects in an non threatening atmosphere was the best thing my dad ever did, I think - outside of teaching me general survival.

There's the point of view from the kid's side.

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Sal
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Dennis Gaskill

13 years ago

At last I have an excuse for the wild things of youth!

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Alexa Smith

Banned 13 years ago

Is an opinion from someone still close to "that worrying age", rather than a parent, welcome here?

Originally Posted by thunderbird

This is disturbing.

Study Suggests Kids With High IQs May Be More Likely to Try Illicit Drugs as Teens and Adults

Yes. There've been ("broadly"/"loosely") similar papers in epidemiology and environmental medicine journals, on and off, for 40+ years, now.

I should think it's probably true, what they're all saying.

Originally Posted by thunderbird

How can a parent successfully steer a smart child from veering in the direction of experimenting with recreational drug use?

Well, this is much contested, isn't it? My own opinion is that "being heavy-handed about it" is certainly wrong and typically counter-productive. (I'm guessing that you think that, yourself, anyway?).

You have a way to go until yours reaches that age?

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Can any kind of early childhood education reduce the probability of this happening?

Also controversial and contested. The incidence of "problems" is clearly higher among those without a stable home/family background, though. Hardly a great insight there, though.

As with other behavioral issues, there are genetic components to this, as well, though: it isn't all "environmental".

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seasoned

13 years ago

How do they account for the OTHERS that take drugs, and the smart ones that don't?

Steve

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Kay King

13 years ago

The "willing to try things" might be why this study "suggests" the premise.

Or it could be the high IQ kids are led to believe they are superior and above the norm and thus feel invincible...

You can find dozens of studies that approach one small concept and draw conclusions that suggest that something might be happening. A parent who takes these studies seriously is at risk of driving his kid crazy:p

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thunderbird

13 years ago

Originally Posted by seasoned

How do they account for the OTHERS that take drugs, and the smart ones that don't?

Steve

I also wonder that.

Originally Posted by Kay King

The "willing to try things" might be why this study "suggests" the premise.

Or it could be the high IQ kids are led to believe they are superior and above the norm and thus feel invincible...

You can find dozens of studies that approach one small concept and draw conclusions that suggest that something might be happening. A parent who takes these studies seriously is at risk of driving his kid crazy:p

I don't know if their premise is reliable or accurate. It also seems dubious and questionable to me. Personally, I think it is stupid and foolish to play chemical Russian roulette with the brain. In some cases, it can trigger schizophrenia, case in point Syd Barrett of the Pink Floyd rock band. Good point about high IQ kids possibly being treated in ways that lend them towards developing a "superior" bad attitude. Who wants to their kids to be snotty?

I do know people with astronomical IQs who did experiment with hallucinogenic drugs and suchlike, including one of my brothers (the weirdo in Japan), so it does happen. Is that generally the case? I doubt it.

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Alexa Smith

Banned 13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

Personally, I think it is stupid and foolish to play chemical Russian roulette with the brain. In some cases, it can trigger schizophrenia

Yes, true ... but we have to be a little careful exactly what we mean by "trigger". I think "trigger" is quite a good word in this context, but it's still quite commonly misunderstood by people who imagine that it means the same as "cause". Epileptogenic "triggers" are a pretty good analogy, though.

Originally Posted by thunderbird

I do know people with astronomical IQs who did experiment with hallucinogenic drugs and suchlike, including one of my brothers (the weirdo in Japan), so it does happen. Is that generally the case? I doubt it.

There's increasing worldwide evidence (collected over many decades, now) that there seems to be at least "a statistically significant tendency" in that direction. I'm quite a skepchick over such issues, but I'm inclined to believe, on the preponderance of the evidence, that that's very likely to be so, myself. If it isn't, there's certainly been an awful lot of mistaken research conclusions/suggestions, and all mistaken in the same direction. Possible, but perhaps unlikely?

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Raydal

13 years ago

"However, other studies have found high childhood IQ is linked to excess alcohol intake and alcohol dependency in adult life."

My organic chemistry professor in university was drunk most the times
during his lectures. If you sat too close to the front you might end up
drunk by the end of class just from his breath.

Yet, he was considered a genius because he got his PhD at a very
young age.

Just one case, but this may be a pattern. I also find that very
intelligent people are more likely to go insane as well--just
from my "non scientific" observations. Such that it is always
said that there is a thin line between genius and insanity.

-Ray Edwards

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Doran Peck

13 years ago

I think the people who conducted the test have a difficient IQ to begin with. There are simply way to many factors to fit into the equation to be able to narrow it down to specific things. Personality, environment, upbringing, emotional stability, and other things have just as much determination as intelligence ( if not moreso)

Aside from that...there is nothing even remotely intelligent about taking drugs....I have a hard time equating such a dangerous and risky activity as something that would appeal to higher intelligence.

then again, this might be an indication that I am an idiot :/

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thunderbird 13 years ago

Originally Posted by Doran Peck

<snip>
then again, this might be an indication that I am an idiot :/

Speaking for myself, welcome to the club
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davidfrankk

13 years ago

The only way this makes sense is that the children with higher IQ tend to have a better understanding of everything. They want to make their own choices and are willing to challenge the world when they can't.

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Kurt

13 years ago

Originally Posted by thunderbird

This is disturbing.

Study Suggests Kids With High IQs May Be More Likely to Try Illicit Drugs as Teens and Adults

How can a parent successfully steer a smart child from veering in the direction of experimenting with recreational drug use? Can any kind of early childhood education reduce the probability of this happening?

I don't have kids. But one constant that keeps coming up in the things I've read about bringing up children is pretty simple. Just let them know you love them and care about them. If you do that, most everything else will fall into place.

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garyv

13 years ago

I'd have to guess that people with higher IQs are much more likely to experiment with everything, not just drugs.

But the purpose of an experiment is to provide evidence to back up an educated theory. If you can provide your child with enough honest evidence ahead of time, then he/she won't feel it as necessary to do their own experimenting.

I have 3 kids - one is in college now. But when he was in High school I told him honestly about my own drug escapades, and the troubles it caused me. So far he's been smart enough to stay away from it. But I also told him that if he ever does try something - that he doesn't have to be afraid to come and talk to me about it. I've tried it all myself, so I can't really fault him if he tries something.

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mojojuju

13 years ago

Is there some kind of drug that can be given to children to reduce their IQ so that they won't use drugs when they get older?

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thunderbird 13 years ago

Originally Posted by mojojuju

Is there some kind of drug that can be given to children to reduce their IQ so that they won't use drugs when they get older?

It's not a drug, but an externally applied device known as "television."
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- mojojuju 13 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by thunderbird
  
  It's not a drug, but an externally applied device known as "television."
  
  Then I choose television. TV: The Anti-Drug.
  
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  :)
  
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John Rogers

13 years ago

A new explanation for my wife who can't understand why I want to try DMT. Works for me!

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thunderbird 13 years ago

Originally Posted by John Rogers

A new explanation for my wife who can't understand why I want to try DMT. Works for me!

I just read about DMT. It has a fascinating pharmacological description in wikipedia. It is similar in properties to ayahuasca, a compound made from vines by inhabitants of the Amazon jungle (now taken by teenagers while playing games on the iPhones?)
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HeySal

13 years ago

I've always wanted to try Ecstasy - but knowing what I do about it, it will never happen. Still wonder what it's like though. If I were 18, I'd probably be able to tell you.

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High Childhood IQ Linked To Drug Use?(!)

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