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Offline Advertising

by Jacob Elbaum
77 replies
Hi friends!

Quick question for y'all!

Have any of you ever tried offline advertising? If so, what was your experience with it?

Thank you!

- Jacob
#advertising #offline
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  • Profile picture of the author SARubin
    Well Jacob,

    Your question is a bit vague. So I'm left with only giving you a vague answer...

    Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

    Have any of you ever tried offline advertising?
    Yes, I've done quite a bit of offline advertising.

    Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

    what was your experience with it?
    Sometimes it works... Sometimes it doesn't.


    Now, if you'd like a bit more of a specific answer... You may need to ask a bit more of a specific question.


    All the best,
    SAR
    Signature
    "It all boils down to psychology, and numbers"
    SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Advertising and Marketing Aficionado
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    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
      Touche, SARubin, Touche.

      From your experience doing quite a bit of offline advertising, what have you found to be the greatest challenges? Are you an individual that did offline advertising for your business, or are you part of an advertising/marketing agency that did it on behalf of an advertiser?

      Thanks!
      - Jacob
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      • Profile picture of the author SARubin
        Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

        Touche, SARubin, Touche.

        From your experience doing quite a bit of offline advertising, what have you found to be the greatest challenges? Are you an individual that did offline advertising for your business, or are you part of an advertising/marketing agency that did it on behalf of an advertiser?

        Thanks!
        - Jacob
        Ah yes, better questions lead to better answers...

        Some of the bigger challenges I've experienced with offline advertising (compared to online) are...


        1 - COST. Online advertising is dirt cheap by comparison. You can reach tens of thousands of people, for pennies. Where as offline, it costs quite a bit more.

        I don't have a lot of experience with T.V. advertising (never done it) or Radio (I've only worked on a few radio scripts over the years) but overall, they ain't cheap to produce.

        I have done quite a bit of direct mail, space ads (magazines and newspapers), flyers, and brochures. So I can testify that the printing costs, as well as distribution costs, are a whole lot more than the price of sending a mass email.

        Now, the balance to the cost is, my response rates have often been much higher with physical advertising. There's something about holding an actual piece of paper in your hand, or having a message reach you in the real world, that tends to feel more personal, and creates a stronger bond with the reader / audience.

        To a lesser degree, it may also be attributed to the fact that it takes more effort to walk over to the trash and throw something out, than it takes to simply hit the delete button?


        2 - TESTING. Throw up a banner ad, solo ad, or send out a mass email; and within a day (sometimes hours) you'll have a pretty good idea if it worked (or not) Then you can start testing and tweaking immediately, to improve your results.

        With physical advertising it generally takes longer to measure the results. A couple examples...


        Newspaper ads, you'll generally know within a day or two if it worked (short shelf life. If they don't respond within a day or two, the paper usually ends up lining the bird cage)



        Direct mail, probably the most expensive, but also the most effective in my experience. Again, there's something about holding an actual piece of paper in your hand that tends to feel more personal, and creates a stronger bond with the reader. Especially in this day and age where most things are digital.

        The biggest challenge of direct mail is getting it read. Most people sort their mail while standing over the garbage can. Pile "A" (bills, personal letters, or things of interest) get saved and looked at. Pile "B" (advertisements, and everything else) get dropped in the trash.

        Now, with a good direct mail piece, you should have some response within a day or two. Then you can start measuring, and tweaking. But, testing can get expensive (with printing costs and postage) So you always want to test small, before rolling out big.



        Magazine ads, it could take days (or longer) for some people to respond. And you have to wait until next month before you can test any variations.

        The flip side is, magazines often have a very long shelf life (people will still be able to see your ad - days, weeks, even months into the future)
        Next time you're sitting in a waiting room, or lobby; take a look at some of the dates on the magazines. Many of them will probably be months old.


        There's quite a bit more to it, than what I can feasibly write in a forum post. But cost and testing are the two biggest comparisons I've had between online and offline advertising.

        But just remember, whichever way you decide to go, it still comes down to psychology and numbers (online, and offline)

        You need to understand the market (who your target audience is and what they want)

        Craft your message (something that resonates with your audience)

        And find the right medium (do they tend to give more weight to what they read in a magazine or newspaper? Or do they spend most of the day chatting on Facebook and browsing the web?)

        Psychology = connecting with your audience
        Numbers = response rate, or even better... dollars brought in


        To answer your second question...

        Yes, I've owned a number of businesses over the past 20+ years

        A small home restoration company (restoring horsehair plaster in historical buildings), which I still own to this day (I still have it mostly out of sentimental nostalgia because it fed my family, and kept a roof over their heads for years)

        Also spent a couple years in network marketing (MLM)

        Designed and built websites for a couple years (back when most websites were still HTML)

        Owned and operated an E-commerce business for about 8 years (until I sold it off a few years ago)

        Plus a couple other minor projects over the years.

        I always did most of my own advertising, only hiring someone else with the understanding that they would be willing to teach me something I was interested in learning.

        And now I've been helping small businesses improve their advertising for the past 10 + years. I have worked with a couple ad agencies on a temporary basis, but corporate bureaucracy annoys me too much. So I enjoy being freelance much more.


        Anyway, Jacob, I hope I didn't bore you too much with my short novel of an answer here. (just imagine how long my answer would have been, if you'd asked even more questions)

        All the best,
        SAR
        Signature
        "It all boils down to psychology, and numbers"
        SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Advertising and Marketing Aficionado
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        • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
          Hi SAR,

          Thank you for that in-depth answer. Not annoying at all, actually extremely insightful. I agree a lot with what you are saying as I think it makes sense. Of course, it's preferred to have quick response to whatever kind of marketing/advertising you are doing since then you can take the response that you received and quickly and easily tweak it according to feedback.

          In offline marketing, what have you found to be successful despite the sometimes slow turn-around? If you've done any campaigns on billboards, street signs, benches, etc. and alike, that would also be very interesting to hear about!

          Thank you again,
          Jacob
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

            In offline marketing, what have you found to be successful despite the sometimes slow turn-around? If you've done any campaigns on billboards, street signs, benches, etc. and alike, that would also be very interesting to hear about!

            Thank you again,
            Jacob
            The question is way too general. Are you selling to a general audience or to a niche? Is it just local? National? International?

            Are you trying to build a list, or are you trying to make sales directly from your ad?

            The knowledgeable members here can help you, and answer your questions...but you need to be more specific.

            Different types of advertising work better for different products/methods of distribution/market size and specificity of who your market is.

            Please let us know what you are selling, and to whom.
            Signature

            Sales Closing Book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...laude+whitacre
            Sales Prospecting Book https://www.amazon.com/Sales-Prospec...=UTF8&qid=&sr=

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            • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
              Hi Claude,

              I appreciate the feedback. You make a good point. I am relatively new to WF so sorry about the learning curve

              I am building a platform for buying and selling offline advertising. Call it an Airbnb of offline advertising.

              I'd love to hear more about people who have experience buying offline ads and what the greatest challenges were? With the knowledge, I can of course improve my platform.

              That's the clear and transparent answer to that one

              For right now, I am just trying to gain knowledge and insight from the direct source (business owners who've tried offline ads before or considered it). I am not trying to sell anything, especially if I do not believe I can offer something of value.

              Let me know if you have any thoughts or further feedback. Much appreciated!

              - Jacob
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          • Profile picture of the author SARubin
            Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

            Hi SAR,

            In offline marketing, what have you found to be successful despite the sometimes slow turn-around? If you've done any campaigns on billboards, street signs, benches, etc. and alike, that would also be very interesting to hear about!

            Thank you again,
            Jacob
            WOW! This thread has certainly grown wings since the last time I was here... And from some worthy marketers to boot. Awesome!

            Now, to answer your question, Jacob...

            I don't want to plow a field that's already been seeded; So I'll just reiterate what some of the knowledgeable people here have already stated...

            The most important thing, other than what your selling, is your target audience.

            Seriously... A half assed message to the right audience, at the right time, is worth twice as much as a beautifully crafted message, to an audience that doesn't give a crap about what you're selling.

            Perhaps you've heard the old saying "build a better mousetrap, and the world will beat a path to your door?" Well, I'm here to tell you... "if you live in a land where there are no mice... NOBODY is going to be knocking on your door!" (but I digress)


            Back to your question..


            Offline - Direct mail has always been the most effective for me. Followed by advertorial style space ads.


            Now, as far as billboards, street signs, benches, etc.


            I consider that type of advertising as mostly "brand recognition" advertising.

            I generally work with small to medium size businesses that don't have millions of dollars in their advertising budget. So personally, I'm not a big fan of most brand recognition campaigns. In other words... Advertising dollars need to be held accountable for their performance.

            Now, If it fits into your budget (and it doesn't cost too much) then sure, why not. Saturating a community can make a business more recognizable in the local market.

            And of course, you can turn those mediums into "direct response" by simply including a specific phone number to call, URL to visit, or tracking coupon/code, etc.


            But here's where I have some slight issues with some of those mediums...


            Billboards - Think about it... How many billboards do you actually pay attention to while driving down the road? (other than as a distracting curiosity, while driving)

            Some of them might eventually implant some familiarity with us, if we see them often enough, but most will be forgotten before we even reach our destination.

            Short story to emphasize my point on billboards...

            I took my family to "Times Square" in NY, a while back. They have electronic billboards there, that cost in the tens of thousands of dollars, per month, for the real estate.

            All the bright lights, and flashing signs, were really quite the spectacle to see. (And granted, many thousands of eyes might be exposed to your message every day.)

            But here's the thing... The next day, I couldn't remember a single company that was advertising on any of those billboards. And I'm the kind of guy who actually pays attention to those types of things. (On a side note: To this day, I still remember some of the awesome street performers. And the incredible burger I ate at the 1950's diner, with the singing wait staff)


            Benches - It depends on where you're at, and who you're trying to reach.

            A positive note could be... the brand recognition within a local community. (Again, if it's not too expensive... then why not)

            A negative example would be... If you advertise on benches in, say... Portland Oregon. Your brand would quickly become associated with all the homeless people that are continuously sleeping on your advertisement. (Now, if you're advertising for a charity that feeds homeless people, then that could be a great strategy)


            Signs - Again... It depends.

            For businesses like exterior house painters or landscapers, a sign on the front lawn of the home you're working on is a great idea.

            Then you could follow it up with some local canvasing (i.e. knocking on doors with the pitch... "Hi , we're working at your neighbors house down the street. We'd love for you to come by and take a look. And since we're in the neighborhood we'd like to offer you a special deal on ...")

            At a Gym... If you're selling natural health supplements, or athletic equipment (for example) then some signage could work.

            Or, if I'm hungry and see a sign that say's "the best food in town" it might entice me to stop in, and grab a bite.


            Now I need to be clear here, Jacob... Everything I just said is nothing more than generalizations.

            I'm only putting it out here to (hopefully) get your mind turning, and get you to start thinking of even more specific questions. Because, better questions often lead to better answers.

            Other than that... Some of the others here have already put it into perspective...

            There really is no "one-size-fits-all" when it comes to advertising. It really depends on what you're selling, and whom you're selling it to?

            So, as far as your new platform goes... If you're going to offer advertising / marketing advice to business owners, you'll serve your visitors well by being sure to let them know, " not every method will work the same for every business."

            It sounds obvious to you and me, but you might be surprised to discover how many business owners don't really understand the concept of - the right message, to the right target, at the right time.

            All the best,
            SAR
            Signature
            "It all boils down to psychology, and numbers"
            SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Advertising and Marketing Aficionado
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            • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
              Hi SARubin

              Your thorough responses are so helpful. My partner and I literally sit in front of the screen and read them together. It's extremely relevant, useful feedback and we both really do appreciate that a lot! Billboards, benches, signs, gyms were just examples of many potential offline advertising opportunities. I just wanted to name a few to hear what you had to say about each one, and my goodness, you sure explained yourself clearly

              As we are working on our Aadly platform, I can tell you that we are keeping the small and medium sized business as the core audience of our platform. We understand the challenges that relate especially in terms of lack of time and lack of budget, and we are doing our best to stay customer centric at all times and always take these concerns into consideration.

              In fact, one of the limitations on our platform, when it is released, will be budget, as we focus on offline advertising opportunities at the $3K/mo. and under range, to make it MOST relevant for SMB's.

              In any case, I really like your last point: If you're going to offer advertising / marketing advice to business owners, you'll serve your visitors well by being sure to let them know, " not every method will work the same for every business."

              I could not agree with you more, and I think in a more general way, I agree with you that being open and honest to potential customers is always the best route to building a long term relationship.

              Yes, I may benefit financially from taking a client's money for an offline advertising campaign, however if it does not the needs of their business and is not the right message, right target and not at the right time, then I'd prefer to lose money in the short term to gain their trust and be honest with them in the long term.

              My guess is that working with SMB's is all about relationship building. Much of that is face-to-face meetings, word of mouth and alike.

              If you have any kind of recommendations for how to reach SMB's or examples of how you've successfully done so until now, I'd love to get some more of your feedback.

              Thank you again!!!

              - Jacob
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  • Profile picture of the author AmericanMuscleTA
    Of course I've done a lot of offline marketing!
    Signature

    David Hunter | Duke of Marketing | Retired Real Estate Agent
    www.DukeOfMarketing.com

    www.TheSaviorsMinistry.org

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    • Profile picture of the author HeatherRWheeler
      Originally Posted by AmericanMuscleTA View Post

      Of course I've done a lot of offline marketing!
      Can you explain some experience?
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  • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
    AmericanMuscleTA
    Thanks for your response! Was just wondering what kind of offline marketing you've done...have you done billboards, street signs, direct mail, etc?

    I'm just curious. Also, if so, what have you found to be most effective.
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    • Profile picture of the author AmericanMuscleTA
      Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

      AmericanMuscleTA
      Thanks for your response! Was just wondering what kind of offline marketing you've done...have you done billboards, street signs, direct mail, etc?

      I'm just curious. Also, if so, what have you found to be most effective.


      Depends... who are you targeting? What are you selling? Direct Mail has been the best for me. You just need to make sure you give your prospects a reason to respond. But, you should integrate as much as you can to get what you want your prospects to do.


      What are you selling?
      Signature

      David Hunter | Duke of Marketing | Retired Real Estate Agent
      www.DukeOfMarketing.com

      www.TheSaviorsMinistry.org

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      • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
        Hi David,

        Targeting local businesses trying to increase their local business by building up their brand through offline ads. Can also be direct response if they choose to build a campaign around that (e.g. 10% off using coupon code 12489).

        I am not looking to sell anything, like I wrote above as a response to Claude. I totally understand if it seems I am trying to sell something, but to tell you the truth, I am just trying to better understand and gain some insights from the target audience I am after.
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        • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
          Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

          Hi David,

          Targeting local businesses trying to increase their local business by building up their brand through offline ads. Can also be direct response if they choose to build a campaign around that (e.g. 10% off using coupon code 12489).

          I am not looking to sell anything, like I wrote above as a response to Claude. I totally understand if it seems I am trying to sell something, but to tell you the truth, I am just trying to better understand and gain some insights from the target audience I am after.
          Targeting local businesses?

          See, my local pub is different from the guy next to him, who makes dentures for dentists. And across the street, a candy store, a dry cleaners, and a CPA.

          So, my point is, I believe you are making a mistake targeting local businesses to offer them a platform for advertising. Your very wrong assumption is all local businesses need to advertise. They don't.

          Using your Air BnB example, does any of the Trump family stay at an Abnb? The reason we have Hilton's and Holiday Inns, and Bates' Motels, AND the new and recent Air BnB model, along with Hostels even, is the market is huge with different demands.

          Big budget advertisers, who spend tens of thousands of dollars a month have different needs than Papa Luigi's Pizza Palace.

          And selling a bill board, or a TV ad, or recurring radio ad, which often gets into the thousands of dollars range, is different than offering a slot on a coupon postcard. But to answer your original question, yes, I (and several others here) have experience in OFF LINE advertising. It is a wide swath market, and even with Direct Respone, writing a letter to a CEO of a company is a different animal than selling a space heater in full page ads, both OFF LINE ads.

          So, how about a little targeting?

          GordonJ
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          • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
            Hi Gordon,

            I understand what you're saying and seriously do appreciate the feedback. The way that you say it makes a lot of sense, but I also think that some of it comes from the lack of awareness of offline advertising opportunities out there OTHER THAN print, radio and TV.

            Yes, there are many opportunities that are way way too expensive for the local Papa Luigi's Pizza Palace. I understand that and couldn't agree with you more. But, alternatively, there are many very inexpensive opportunities in almost every local market, that simply are not known are made aware to the local businesses (such as the pizza palace or the local pub or local dry cleaner).

            As an example, and please do not take this wrong as me saying this this would provide ROI for EVERY local business - there is a company called Zoom Media which works with health clubs around the country (more than 2,500) providing advertising opportunities inside the clubs. There is a variety of different opportunities that they offer, and they are relatively inexpensive (Especially compared to any billboard).

            This is just one example of many opportunities that if local business owners were aware of, it COULD potentially be a good fit for them. Next time you are at your local gym (if it's a chain and if you go to a gym ), look on the walls and listen to the music and pay attention to whether or not there are any advertisements. Those are sometimes very good opportunities for local businesses, and we want to help to make those opportunities more present and more transparent to local businesses in just about every market.

            I'd love to hear your opinion on the above. I'm not trying to say it in a rude way or anything. I honestly would appreciate your feedback, because I believe my point is taking a different angle on the market than what most people are used to.

            Thank you,
            Jacob
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            • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
              Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

              Hi Gordon,

              I understand what you're saying and seriously do appreciate the feedback. The way that you say it makes a lot of sense, but I also think that some of it comes from the lack of awareness of offline advertising opportunities out there OTHER THAN print, radio and TV.

              Yes, there are many opportunities that are way way too expensive for the local Papa Luigi's Pizza Palace. I understand that and couldn't agree with you more. But, alternatively, there are many very inexpensive opportunities in almost every local market, that simply are not known are made aware to the local businesses (such as the pizza palace or the local pub or local dry cleaner).

              As an example, and please do not take this wrong as me saying this this would provide ROI for EVERY local business - there is a company called Zoom Media which works with health clubs around the country (more than 2,500) providing advertising opportunities inside the clubs. There is a variety of different opportunities that they offer, and they are relatively inexpensive (Especially compared to any billboard). This is what YOU are selling.

              This is just one example of many opportunities that if local business owners were aware of, it COULD potentially be a good fit for them. Next time you are at your local gym (if it's a chain and if you go to a gym ), look on the walls and listen to the music and pay attention to whether or not there are any advertisements. Those are sometimes very good opportunities for local businesses, and we want to help to make those opportunities more present and more transparent to local businesses in just about every market.

              I'd love to hear your opinion on the above. I'm not trying to say it in a rude way or anything. I honestly would appreciate your feedback, because I believe my point is taking a different angle on the market than what most people are used to.

              Thank you,
              Jacob
              There are tons of advertisements, but not for the club itself. These are HOST driven ads, a form of co-op advertising, been around for ever. However, if you have a new way of letting local businesses know about the co-op advertising opportunities, via a one stop web site, ala Air BnB, then that is different.

              You may have a terrific idea, but it just seems you are fishing when you DO have something in mind.

              If you have a way to secure quality hosts and an affordable way for local businesses to have: a given number of impressions; via mins of air time, or numbers of eyeballs, or rotations on a visual display, and Papa Luigi can buy his 1000 eyeballs for less than a coupon on a postcard, you may be the next gazillionaire.

              I may be wrong, but you gave me the wrong impression with your OP.
              You are right, the host/parasite model is not promoted to the masses of local businesses and a new way of doing that would probably find a welcome in all communities.

              GordonJ
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              • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
                Hi Gordon,

                I appreciate that response. I DO have something in mind and am working on the platform, but thought if I ask the question in a more broad way, it would help gauge the type of feedback I received. Now that I see how thorough and precise Warrior Forum members are when responding to new topics, I will know not to make that mistake again

                Thank you,
                Jacob
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                • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
                  Actually Gordon, I have some first images and a conceptual site live to show a bit about the platform that I am working on.

                  Since you seem to have great insights, I'd really appreciate if you could take a quick glance at the website and give me any kind of feedback you can come up with. My focus now is not becoming the next gazillionaire, but rather just finding a solution that truthfully works for the local business masses.

                  Thank you!

                  Here is the site link: https://www.aadly.com/

                  We have a blog too if you're interested in reading about local advertising on a broader level: https://blog.aadly.com/
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                  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
                    Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

                    Actually Gordon, I have some first images and a conceptual site live to show a bit about the platform that I am working on.

                    Since you seem to have great insights, I'd really appreciate if you could take a quick glance at the website and give me any kind of feedback you can come up with. My focus now is not becoming the next gazillionaire, but rather just finding a solution that truthfully works for the local business masses.

                    Thank you!

                    Here is the site link: https://www.aadly.com/

                    We have a blog too if you're interested in reading about local advertising on a broader level: https://blog.aadly.com/
                    Jacob, I just took a quick look at your concept site. The kind of look a potential advertiser might take.

                    I think you're missing a bet here. If it were me, I'd move the "simple & effective | Affordable | Safe" section up to the first screen, along with a benefit-driven headline. Then link each of those things to a section further down the page, each section containing a "Contact Us" link.

                    You're talking B2B, and your prospects are busy people. Skip the purple splash screen and get down to business.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
                      Hi JohnMcCabe

                      That is some fantastic feedback. My developers are primarily focused on building the platform at the moment which should be completed in 2-3 months. My current priority is to finish that, otherwise I would be on the phone with the head of development right now giving him your comments. Thank you so much.

                      Very very helpful!
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                  • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
                    Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

                    Actually Gordon, I have some first images and a conceptual site live to show a bit about the platform that I am working on.

                    Since you seem to have great insights, I'd really appreciate if you could take a quick glance at the website and give me any kind of feedback you can come up with. My focus now is not becoming the next gazillionaire, but rather just finding a solution that truthfully works for the local business masses.

                    Thank you!

                    Here is the site link: https://www.aadly.com/

                    We have a blog too if you're interested in reading about local advertising on a broader level: https://blog.aadly.com/
                    NOW,
                    I think I get what you are doing Jacob, but, correct me if I'm, wrong, OK?

                    I get the comparison to AirBnB, you are a compiler of outdoor advertising space, maybe remnant at that, like the unused rooms found at Priceline, Expedia, etc. You probably work with owners like Lamar, Clear Channel, EMC Outdoor, perhaps filling a gap between DoMedia and OOOA.

                    You're selling a one stop OUTDOOR or OFFLINE advertising platform for small businesses with a budget of 250-3k a month.

                    Well, time will tell. As noted by others, your site should be perfect in spelling, grammar, and brevity. I like what you are doing, but for a different reason.

                    Sites like AADLY, along with the obvious users of drive by ads, provides great ammunition and potential prospects to those guys selling direct response ads.

                    Just this past Sunday, I spoke to a guy who is going about his EDDM Billboard in a Mailbox program the wrong way....running all over town, grinding away trying to get small mom and pop businesses to ante up a few hundred dollars. A common mistake by the 9x12 crowd or most guys selling ads to local businesses. Chasing minnows around town and ignoring the whales.

                    So, when you get fully operational, you'll provide us with a great resource to find local businesses who are already spending money (up to 3k a month) on advertising, and as a Direct Response guy, if I can't convince ANY biz owner that TRULY measurable results beats impressions and consciousness (brand) advertising 7 days a week, I've got no business calling myself a salesman.

                    In this regard, I look forward to your success. Branding and OUTDOOR/Offline advertising takes a lot of education, as your 7 part series shows and don't take this the wrong way Jacob, but what you do for many of us who have the experience, is you point the way to easy to get customers with the money to spend.

                    Biggest mistake advertising people make is targeting people with small to no budgets. I like to teach people it is just as easy to sell a guy with money to spend (and he proves it with his "branding" dollars) as it is to chase Papa Luigi all over town for pennies.

                    Good luck.

                    GordonJ
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                    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
                      Hi Gordon,

                      You definitely understood the concept. Happy that I was able to clearly and easily get that point across

                      In any case, we are ultimately trying to make offline advertising more affordable and accessible for local businesses.

                      Whatever that can do for other businesses needing to target people with small to no budgets, is not my primary concern as I am sure you can understand.

                      I understand your point, but just to give you some frame of reference - there is a company called google and facebook who BOTH target people with small to no budgets. Don't forget about them...it's a long road and journey, but there's potential.

                      - Jacob
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  • Profile picture of the author myob
    A major portion of my marketing promotions are offline; almost exclusively through articles syndicated in relevant publications or full-page advertorials which are read by my targeted demographics. It has worked astoundingly well for me for over 20 years in dozens of widely different niches.
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by myob View Post

      A major portion of my marketing promotions are offline; almost exclusively through articles syndicated in relevant publications or full-page advertorials which are read by my targeted demographics. It has worked astoundingly well for me for over 20 years in dozens of widely different niches.
      I think advertorials may be one of the least understood, most effective, marketing tools available.
      I'm not surprised that you have had success with them in the mlm world.

      Ron
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      • Profile picture of the author myob
        Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy View Post

        I think advertorials may be one of the least understood, most effective, marketing tools available.
        I'm not surprised that you have had success with them in the mlm world.
        Actually, articles are far more effective as marketing tools than advertorials. If publications don't accept my article submissions, only then do I buy full page ads to get the article published.

        This technique is so powerful, the FTC requires all advertorials (paid ads in article format) to prominently display "Advertisement" at the top of the page.

        Articles without such a declaration are absolutely devastating to any competitor who uses any other form of advertising.
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  • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
    Speaking of the MLM world, most of the offline advertising I've done was during my involvement with several companies.

    Mainly, we did ad coops and went semi-old school. We placed teaser ads in papers like USA Today, regional editions of WSJ, etc.Instead of a phone number, we used a url.

    The url led to a landing page, but not your typical squeeze page. It was, in retrospect, an advertorial. We "sold" our method of finding and nurturing leads, and targeted people who were already comfortable with selling. They opted in for information and training about the method. Of course, we used our company's products and pay plan as examples.

    I don't remember the exact numbers, but people outside our group were surprised at how well it worked.

    We did the promotions as coops because pooling our ad budgets allowed us to run ads in places most individuals couldn't afford.

    We were planning to test running the advertorial directly, but the company killed the MLM plan before we got a chance. People sought other lead sources, got lost in promoting these to each other, and the group fell apart.

    Anyway, offline concepts that worked well since the 1800's (and probably before that) still work in the 21st century. The tactics and tools might change, but people are still people.
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  • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
    A quick observation for you.

    Usually when I'm considering a company to spend my money with for anything I tend to take a look at them and decide pretty quickly whether I like what they offer or whether I don't like what they offer.

    Simple things will influence what people think about your professionalism.

    Things like proofreading.

    This stood out to me as a glaring mistake on what on first impressions seemed like a professional page--->



    What is ADVERSTING?

    That's a new term for me.

    Best regards,

    Ozi
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  • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
    Hi Ozi,

    Wow, that's a bad one. Thank you for catching that. I've looked at that so many times and never noticed it, and I am usually pretty diligent when it comes to my proof reading.

    Much appreciation!

    - Jacob
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  • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
    The big issue for most small business especially when you are targeting those that spend under 3K monthly is how to justify what they invest with you against what they see as the new traffic source of "online"

    For example.

    I used to spend between $15-20K a year on Yellow pages and a similar amount on smaller outdoor fixed billboards etc.

    When Adwords first started a big percentage gradually moved towards online.

    Now with the refined targeting the budget gets whittled back accordingly and anyone trying to get their idea in front of me needs to prove their offering first.

    This may not be the case for larger operations or franchise groups who want brand exposure in specific areas.

    The biggest resistance usually comes from commitment to longer term contracts when there is lack of stability in the market.

    With billboard type displays there was always the "impression factor" where businesses could rely on the longer term effect of continuous exposure.

    In my market this type of display is getting ignored with a large number of businesses using portable LED displays offering immediate benefits targeting consumers ready to buy.

    If your business can deliver the immediacy and flexibility of variable offers tailored to prospects who are closer to buying you will get better success.

    From what I see the display type works best for people who are hungry to buy or in many cases just hungry to eat and the display they see triggers a buying response immediately.

    There was a digital display company that maybe hit the market here in Australia too hard before it's time and it failed...or maybe it got bought out and survived as another name ....anyway what springs to mind is eye media----> you should take a look because I'm sure they either struggled and worked it out or they were the predator that bought the failing assets --->EYE Corp Media

    Your website reminded me of them.

    The easiest way to get business owners on board is proof.

    Prove you can deliver a positive return.

    It gets easier when you can do that.

    It puts you in with a chance to be considered.

    The other thing from a marketing perspective is to target advertisers who are already familiar with the media you are selling.

    It is far easier to get a business to buy an alternative but similar product to what they already use than to get them to "buy-in" to a new method.

    Best regards,

    Ozi
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    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
      Hi Ozi,

      Incredible response. So helpful.

      On that thought, we are currently working with a number of local businesses to prepare case studies that will show ROI on campaigns booked with us.

      I couldn't agree with you more that the only and BEST method of selling to a small business owner the concept of offline advertising would be by proving to them it provides a positive return.

      Maybe the creation of newer, more inexpensive local offline ad options would be a powerful way to start creating new and affordable exposure for these local markets.

      Thank you again for your helpful insights!
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  • Profile picture of the author DABK
    Once upon a time, I spent $1200 to get in the Sunday paper. The sales person did a great job of getting me to think about advertising with the big boys and skip the ROI part of it.

    The Sunday came, people saw my $1200-worth of advertising, and stayed away in droves.

    Do you think I ever bought any advertising from the people who sold me on that?

    Was it their fault I was clueless? No. But I still did not buy from them again.

    My point, be careful how you position yourself so when they mess up (wrong ad for their targeted audience, or lousy ad altogether, or whatever) they don't blame your platform. You say your providers are vetted. You should vet your buyers too. My 3 pennies.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
      Hi DABK,

      I love that advice. Rather than selling to people for the sake of selling and making money, focus on providing real value to customers who will come running back for more.

      I'd say new age sales vs. old age

      Thanks again!
      - Jacob
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  • Profile picture of the author nalbandian1
    Yes, I also used offline marketing using roll up banner stands and tension fabric displays in Trade Shows and I got more than expected and better results.
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    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
      Hi nalbandian1

      In your experience, what worked better/worse for you?
      What lead to better/worse results?
      I am sure your experience can help enlighten many others.

      Thank you!
      - Jacob
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      • Profile picture of the author nalbandian1
        The roll-up banner stands attract more foot traffic to your stores if your graphics and print quality is good, which increases and improve business branding also. This is best advertising method I found because of its low cost.
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        • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
          That's true, because production and everything from idea to creation to implementation is all dependent on you. Plus, you don't pay for the space I am assuming since you already own the storefront.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

        Hi nalbandian1

        In your experience, what worked better/worse for you?
        What lead to better/worse results?
        I am sure your experience can help enlighten many others.

        Thank you!
        - Jacob
        If you are advertising to a mass audience (not a targeted mailing list) it isn't the media. It's the message.

        And all media doesn't work for the vast majority of media buyers (especially small business owners). Why? Because they have no idea how to advertise. And the ad reps have no idea how to advertise.

        It's the single biggest deterrent to selling advertising, not knowing how to create ads that actually sell something. A business owner buys the ad space (radio, TV, Newspaper, online, direct mail coupons, etc) and the ad does nothing. The advertiser blames the media, but it isn't the media, it's the message.

        And ad reps are oblivious to the fact that if they knew how to construct a selling ad...a profit producing ad...the advertisers would be calling them instead of the reps chasing the advertisers.
        Signature

        Sales Closing Book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...laude+whitacre
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        • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
          That's a very good point and I couldn't agree more. I think the biggest difficulty is that there is no RIGHT or WRONG when it comes to producing ads. What one person thinks is a powerful and effective creative, another person thinks looks terrible. How can you determine it without trying/testing?
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

            That's a very good point and I couldn't agree more. I think the biggest difficulty is that there is no RIGHT or WRONG when it comes to producing ads. What one person thinks is a powerful and effective creative, another person thinks looks terrible. How can you determine it without trying/testing?
            There is no one right way. But there are thousands of wrong ways. Any book on direct response advertising would show you the differences.
            And ads that pull in buyers have factors in common with each other.
            And what one person thinks is a winning ad is meaningless unless they have tested hundreds of ads, tracked results, and have studied what makes a winning ad.
            Signature

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        • Profile picture of the author SARubin
          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          If you are advertising to a mass audience (not a targeted mailing list) it isn't the media. It's the message.

          And all media doesn't work for the vast majority of media buyers (especially small business owners). Why? Because they have no idea how to advertise. And the ad reps have no idea how to advertise.

          It's the single biggest deterrent to selling advertising, not knowing how to create ads that actually sell something. A business owner buys the ad space (radio, TV, Newspaper, online, direct mail coupons, etc) and the ad does nothing. The advertiser blames the media, but it isn't the media, it's the message.

          And ad reps are oblivious to the fact that if they knew how to construct a selling ad...a profit producing ad...the advertisers would be calling them instead of the reps chasing the advertisers.

          I agree with you, Claude (for the most part)

          But media is still important. Personally I see the three biggest factors as "market... message... medium." In that order.

          Quick story to emphasize...

          A guy called me about a week ago, asking what he could expect for a response rate to his ad, for a weight loss program.

          Now, obviously I had to tell him it would be impossible to do anything other than "guess" what his response rate would be. But I said I'd take a look at the offer.

          Some advertiser offered him a deal to place a small 4 line space ad in USA today, for around $300 (subscription numbers are around 1,000,000 for the weekend edition, so the numbers are pretty big). But the ad would be placed in the BIZ-OP classified section of the paper.

          So I had to tell this guy that I believed he'd be wasting his money. Because not many people were looking in that section of the paper for a weight loss program. If he could get that ad into the "health and lifestyle" section, then it might have a chance.

          I followed up by suggesting his weight loss ad might do better in any one of the health, fitness, or weight loss magazines. Because that's where his target market is more likely to be looking.


          So I agree with what you're saying, as far as "the message is way more important than the media." But the medium is not completely irrelevant.
          Signature
          "It all boils down to psychology, and numbers"
          SARubin - Direct Response Copywriter / Advertising and Marketing Aficionado
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by SARubin View Post

            A guy called me about a week ago, asking what he could expect for a response rate to his ad, for a weight loss program.

            Now, obviously I had to tell him it would be impossible to do anything other than "guess" what his response rate would be. But I said I'd take a look at the offer.

            Some advertiser offered him a deal to place a small 4 line space ad in USA today, for around $300 (subscription numbers are around 1,000,000 for the weekend edition, so the numbers are pretty big). But the ad would be placed in the BIZ-OP classified section of the paper.

            So I had to tell this guy that I believed he'd be wasting his money. Because not many people were looking in that section of the paper for a weight loss program. If he could get that ad into the "health and lifestyle" section, then it might have a chance.

            I followed up by suggesting his weight loss ad might do better in any one of the health, fitness, or weight loss magazines. Because that's where his target market is more likely to be looking.


            So I agree with what you're saying, as far as "the message is way more important than the media." But the medium is not completely irrelevant.
            Of course, of course, of course. You can pick a media (or section of media) that will never reach the likely buyers. I was speaking in general.

            I had a client that I created an ad for. I told her that if she ran the ad as is, in her local newspaper that she would generate an immediate multiple of her cost.

            She called a week later telling me that she had no response at all. I told her that was impossible and asked her several questions.

            Yup, same ad, no changes, in the newspaper...main section....I was at a loss.

            And then she let it slip that she placed the ad in a newspaper for a town 50 miles away, not her local paper. I asked her why she did that. She told me that the newspaper 50 miles away offered a better deal.

            For this thread I was assuming that the ads were for the general public. For example, I'd never advertise in the newspaper if the target audience was 20 year old students.

            And I'd never advertise a bar on a Christian radio station....but in a local magazine for singles? Sure.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steven Henry01
    I have also done offline marketing. My ways are:

    Telephone Message Sending
    Display Banner
    Advertising
    Used Flags in Event
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    • Profile picture of the author Jacob Elbaum
      Hi Steven Henry01

      I will ask you the same question that I ask nalbandian1 above.
      In your experience, what worked better/worse for you?
      What lead to better/worse results?

      More importantly, did you use any offline media operators or advertising agencies to make your campaign bookings?
      If so, what were some of the challenges in closing the deal that you faced?

      Thank you!
      - Jacob
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      • Profile picture of the author Steven Henry01
        Hey Jacob,

        According to me telephone messages not working now days, because everybody knows these are the advertising messages and delete the message, so i have focus only on advertising, canopies, display banner, customized items i.e. t-shirts, cards, mug etc.

        Got more leads through the advertising, so just focus on it.

        I have not use any agency for the leads generation.
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  • Profile picture of the author bbminded
    One form of offline advertising isnt mentioned at all to my surprise. If you have a service based business, then that generally requires you or your employees to be physically mobile.
    Now, those that fall into this category in some way, let me ask a question of you..... are the make and model manufacturers of the vehicle(s) that you use daily to commute both for business and personal paying you on a regular basis to promote their company, or are you doing it for free?

    If you answered NO, let me ask you why are you doing that? Another question... If you have a physical business presence in your city, do you have signage to let people know who you are and your location? If so, why not take it with you whenever you are out commuting to, both for business and personal reasons?
    Stupid question im sure most are thinking as they read this... "well its made and installed to be in a fixed position/placement. allowing me to do so, plus that just makes no sense". And you would be 100% correct.

    Would you be surprised that you could make anywhere from 30,000-70,000 daily local impressions with no effort at all. What would you value such a form of advertising that doesn't have an ongoing cost, works for you up to 10 years, 24 hours a day, everyday, and has the upfront, one time cost of anywhere between $800 - $3,000.
    Im sure someone on here knows what i am talking about. If so, share with the group, or PM for this particular form of marketing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by bbminded View Post

      One form of offline advertising isnt mentioned at all to my surprise. If you have a service based business, then that generally requires you or your employees to be physically mobile.
      Now, those that fall into this category in some way, let me ask a question of you..... are the make and model manufacturers of the vehicle(s) that you use daily to commute both for business and personal paying you on a regular basis to promote their company, or are you doing it for free?

      If you answered NO, let me ask you why are you doing that? Another question... If you have a physical business presence in your city, do you have signage to let people know who you are and your location? If so, why not take it with you whenever you are out commuting to, both for business and personal reasons?
      Stupid question im sure most are thinking as they read this... "well its made and installed to be in a fixed position/placement. allowing me to do so, plus that just makes no sense". And you would be 100% correct.

      Would you be surprised that you could make anywhere from 30,000-70,000 daily local impressions with no effort at all. What would you value such a form of advertising that doesn't have an ongoing cost, works for you up to 10 years, 24 hours a day, everyday, and has the upfront, one time cost of anywhere between $800 - $3,000.
      Im sure someone on here knows what i am talking about. If so, share with the group, or PM for this particular form of marketing.
      Thanks for the sales presentation.

      And yes, all offline marketing possibilities are not mentioned in this thread.

      Surprise!

      Many of us here could easily list a dozen more, that are proven to work, in less than a minute.

      We know because we've done them.

      The "mystery" thread was some time ago. You missed it.

      Ron
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  • Profile picture of the author bbminded
    Sorry, but no sales presentation... Im not asking anyone for their business.
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  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
    If so, share with the group, or PM for this particular form of marketing.
    You brought it up - so share.... When you post "PM me" it looks promotional.
    Signature

    Saving one dog will not change the world - but forever changes the world of one dog.
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    • Profile picture of the author bbminded
      I obviously came across differently then intended... my bad.... I was being a bit sarcastic and naive as I know anyone reading what I wrote would know exactly what i am talking about.
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  • Profile picture of the author tom17knight
    hi..
    Well, yes one of my close friends is doing offline Advertisement.Today online marketing is an easy way for promoting your goods and services but how could we forget about the past when there was no internet people use to promote their services offline.There are various ways for offline advertisement like promotion through a newspaper, pamphlets. Also, we can start campaigns which include radio etc.By making a call to each known and unknown person.This takes time but it also works as promoting our advertisement online.
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  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    I find the whole idea of this thread fascinating. Offline advertising (or as we old folk call it...Advertising) has a century long history. Thousands of books have been written about it.

    I've written a few myself.

    Nearly every physical business...brick and mortar...has advertised "offline' for the entire time they have been in business.

    Does it work? if you know what you are doing, And the vast majority have no idea how to make an ad pay for itself.

    It took me a couple of years of daily study and trial and error advertising before my ads started generating a profit. Study direct response advertising.

    It isn't "Does advertising work?" The question is "How do you make advertising consistently work for your business?' And unfortunately, that requires study. Far more than you could ever get from reading forum posts.
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    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      Recently, relatives opened a wedding dress shop. I offered, for free (good) advice. But what do I know about wedding dresses and brides? Those (wedding dresses and brides) are waaay different from the insurance, mortgage, window installer, roofer, promotional printing outfits I work with. So, I was turned down.

      Forward a few months later, after they spent a few thousand dollars on marketing, some of which worked, some did not... I'm still no genius, still don't know nothin' 'bout nothin' when it comes to wedding dresses and brides, but what would I do if...

      They get a lot of sales people offering them beautiful ads in beautiful publications (online and offline) with tens of thousands of impressions or copies printed. Which one would I take? How would I approach?

      Since I don't know nothing about wedding dresses and brides, if the prices is less than $500, they ignore what I say if it's not what they want to hear. More than $500, they hear me.

      My way of saying that, not only study, but an open mind and a bit of pocketbook pain is what's required.

      Makes it a very interesting show when there are two owners, one more careful (the one with the credit card in her name) than the other one.

      Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

      I find the whole idea of this thread fascinating. Offline advertising (or as we old folk call it...Advertising) has a century long history. Thousands of books have been written about it.

      I've written a few myself.

      Nearly every physical business...brick and mortar...has advertised "offline' for the entire time they have been in business.

      Does it work? if you know what you are doing, And the vast majority have no idea how to make an ad pay for itself.

      It took me a couple of years of daily study and trial and error advertising before my ads started generating a profit. Study direct response advertising.

      It isn't "Does advertising work?" The question is "How do you make advertising consistently work for your business?' And unfortunately, that requires study. Far more than you could ever get from reading forum posts.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by DABK View Post

        They get a lot of sales people offering them beautiful ads in beautiful publications (online and offline) with tens of thousands of impressions or copies printed. Which one would I take? How would I approach?
        I've known maybe 25 ad reps (different media) and casually talked to several hundred (at events where I was speaking). The concept of learning how direct response marketing works is completely alien to them. I've never even met an ad rep (in any media) that has ever read a single book on advertising.

        A few had graphic design experience, and thought that was advertising.

        In fact, I used to speak to groups of ad reps, and quickly learned that they had no interest at all in learning how to make the ads they sold actually pay. They were interested in learning how to sell more ads.

        You may enjoy this;
        I was called by a friend to view his new TV infomercial. It was selling a water purifier for $500 (maybe 20 years ago). When I arrived he had about 12 investors in the project in the room. The cost to produce the infomercial was about $100,000.

        As I watched the 30 minute infomercial, the others in the room were "ooohh"ing and "aahhh"ing. They were Sold.

        My friend made the mistake of asking me what I thought. I suggested we talk privately, and he said he wanted to hear my reaction in front of everyone.

        The first thing I said was "There are no infomercials selling high end water purifiers. Why do you think that is?"

        One person said "We're the only one. We;ll have 100% market share".

        I said "You won't sell a single one. You aren't giving a strong reason why the must buy a water purifier. You aren't creating the demand. And most people watching think their water is just fine. Your introduction doesn't grab attention or make them want to see the rest of the infomercial. You aren't comparing your water purifier to other methods of cleaning water. You aren't building value. You aren't making it brain dead obvious that they need one, and you're the only place to get one. There are no testimonials. There is no strong close, no reason to order today. This isn't an infomercial, it's a 30 minute documentary on water falls, nature, and shots of people drinking water. Your product is too expensive for an infomercial sale, without offering payments. Do you have an upsell when they get on the phone?"

        They did not..

        And my friend said "But this infomercial was made by the director of (I forget, but some popular movie)"
        And I said "Does that movie sell anything? No. The sole purpose of an infomercial is to sell something, and this one doesn't".

        And of course they ran it on cable, spending another $25,000..and not one single sale.

        Why? They confused production value, lighting...music...positioning of product...as real selling, and it isn't. There wasn't a single salesperson involved. Not even the investors.

        I think I remember reading once that about 95% of all ads run fail to pay for themselves.

        And so ad reps decided to change the reason you advertise. It isn't to make money...it's to "get your name out there"..."Build a brand"....."gain top of mind awareness".

        Anything but sell something.

        My soul weeps.
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        • Profile picture of the author DABK
          Yes, you do know a rep who knows marketing: Do You Have A Burning Desire To Create An Extra 5- Or 6-Figure A Month Stream Of Income?!

          He used to sell yellow page ads.

          As to advertising to put your name out there:

          10 years of placing ads in the same local paper and 10 years of buying half a page ad in the local yellow pages without making one sale directly or indirectly because of that did not teach one mortgage broker I know that getting-your-name-out-there is a waste of money. The mortgage meltdown of 2008 and his subsequent bankruptcy, however, did. Now, he is very willing to purchase ads that get his name out there, as long as they cost $0. Now, he wants 10 times more dollars in than the ad costs him. And, surprise! surprise! his cash flow's better than it used to be.

          Sadly, there's still many business owners I know who think, if I get 90,000 impressions for only $450, I'm getting a great deal... Even as they cannot see a bump, let alone identify 1 sale directly coming from the 90k impressions. Even as they are firm that they can pay no more than $140 for 1 sale.

          Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

          I've known maybe 25 ad reps (different media) and casually talked to several hundred (at events where I was speaking). The concept of learning how direct response marketing works is completely alien to them. I've never even met an ad rep (in any media) that has ever read a single book on advertising.

          A few had graphic design experience, and thought that was advertising.

          In fact, I used to speak to groups of ad reps, and quickly learned that they had no interest at all in learning how to make the ads they sold actually pay. They were interested in learning how to sell more ads.

          You may enjoy this;
          I was called by a friend to view his new TV infomercial. It was selling a water purifier for $500 (maybe 20 years ago). When I arrived he had about 12 investors in the project in the room. The cost to produce the infomercial was about $100,000.

          As I watched the 30 minute infomercial, the others in the room were "ooohh"ing and "aahhh"ing. They were Sold.

          My friend made the mistake of asking me what I thought. I suggested we talk privately, and he said he wanted to hear my reaction in front of everyone.

          The first thing I said was "There are no infomercials selling high end water purifiers. Why do you think that is?"

          One person said "We're the only one. We;ll have 100% market share".

          I said "You won't sell a single one. You aren't giving a strong reason why the must buy a water purifier. You aren't creating the demand. And most people watching think their water is just fine. Your introduction doesn't grab attention or make them want to see the rest of the infomercial. You aren't comparing your water purifier to other methods of cleaning water. You aren't building value. You aren't making it brain dead obvious that they need one, and you're the only place to get one. There are no testimonials. There is no strong close, no reason to order today. This isn't an infomercial, it's a 30 minute documentary on water falls, nature, and shots of people drinking water. Your product is too expensive for an infomercial sale, without offering payments. Do you have an upsell when they get on the phone?"

          They did not..

          And my friend said "But this infomercial was made by the director of (I forget, but some popular movie)"
          And I said "Does that movie sell anything? No. The sole purpose of an infomercial is to sell something, and this one doesn't".

          And of course they ran it on cable, spending another $25,000..and not one single sale.

          Why? They confused production value, lighting...music...positioning of product...as real selling, and it isn't. There wasn't a single salesperson involved. Not even the investors.

          I think I remember reading once that about 95% of all ads run fail to pay for themselves.

          And so ad reps decided to change the reason you advertise. It isn't to make money...it's to "get your name out there"..."Build a brand"....."gain top of mind awareness".

          Anything but sell something.

          My soul weeps.
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by DABK View Post

            Yes, you do know a rep who knows marketing: Do You Have A Burning Desire To Create An Extra 5- Or 6-Figure A Month Stream Of Income?!

            He used to sell yellow page ads.
            Yup, I do know Steve Sipress. In fact, I spoke at his Chicago marketing meeting about advertising.

            I stand corrected. Steve is an incredibly sharp marketer.
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            • Profile picture of the author eccj
              Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

              Yup, I do know Steve Sipress. In fact, I spoke at his Chicago marketing meeting about advertising.

              I stand corrected. Steve is an incredibly sharp marketer.
              Do ad reps make good money compared to other selling professions? I can't remember meeting or hearing of someone in ad sales making a lot of money.

              Maybe they would if they followed your advice? Or if they were good they would sell something else with better potential?
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              • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
                Originally Posted by eccj View Post

                Do ad reps make good money compared to other selling professions? I can't remember meeting or hearing of someone in ad sales making a lot of money.

                Maybe they would if they followed your advice? Or if they were good they would sell something else with better potential?
                Smart question.

                Yes, there are ad reps that make a decent six figure income. Let's assume by "ad reps" we mean people selling ads on TV, radio, coupon magazines, billboards, signage, I have no experience with magazine ad reps.

                Many times, ad reps have territories that restrict them in their sales. And the reps are also restricted by their world view. They are not trained to know how to advertise...and not really trained how to sell. And so they seldom look outside their company for advice or training.

                And truth be told, most reps selling anything are not students of selling, or students of their industry. They don't learn as time goes on. They don't get better. They don't get wealthier.

                I've talked to two authors on advertising selling, written by sales reps (turned sales trainers) Do you know how many reps read these books? Even reps in the same advertising industry? Almost none. And the real secrets of making a small fortune are laid out for anyone to pick up for the price of a beer.

                https://www.amazon.com/Successful-Lo...dp/0814480535/

                https://www.amazon.com/Million-Dolla...p/0976647001/r

                Not affiliate links, I swear to God.

                By the way, I know one ad rep making about $300,000 a year. Not a fortune, but not a waste of time.

                Could a highly trained ad rep (with ambition and a desire to learn) make more money selling something else? Yes. So could I. I sold life insurance for a couple of years in my early twenties. Had I just stuck with it, and incorporated everything I learned along the way.....I would be much wealthier...because the sale can scale to such a high amount. Same with selling commercial real estate (I've heard).
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  • Profile picture of the author sani345
    Originally Posted by Jacob Elbaum View Post

    Hi friends!

    Quick question for y'all!

    Have any of you ever tried offline advertising? If so, what was your experience with it?

    Thank you!

    - Jacob
    offline advertising work only tv channels and newspaper otherwise you can not advertisements you product or review.
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  • Profile picture of the author bonvideo
    Nowadays hybrid methods work best from my experience have ordinary people do things in the web or connect online with your business works best..
    Think of a raffle, contest on social media.. get customers to DO something for you in exchange for little things like a free lemonade "coupon" etc..
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  • Profile picture of the author Jefay
    Banned
    Are some printed products and promotional items good for offline advertising? I have recently ordered some custom lapel pins for my store from http://www.pinsource.com/ and will use them as free promo items for my customers. I guess they will work nicely. What are your thoughts on it?
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by Jefay View Post

      Are some printed products and promotional items good for offline advertising? What are your thoughts on it?
      For me, it's all about them there "Lapel Pins". Sometimes, I like to sneak back in to earlier posts I've made, and embed a link for them, right there in the post. Is that sneaky or what?

      What about You, "Jefay"?
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  • Profile picture of the author Mohammed K Sheikh
    Ive tried offline marketing, like leaflets, magazine etc... not worth it anymore.

    Very hard to track ROI.

    My advise is stick to online marketing, thats where the world is headed (or already there)
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    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      How is it hard to track ROI? You put an offer for 3.73% off or that can be gotten with code xmlx. Anyone asking for 3.73% off or entering code xmlx was reached by your postcards, leaflets, etc. Anyone not doing one of those, got to you some other way. No?

      Originally Posted by Mohammed K Sheikh View Post

      Ive tried offline marketing, like leaflets, magazine etc... not worth it anymore.

      Very hard to track ROI.

      My advise is stick to online marketing, thats where the world is headed (or already there)
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  • Profile picture of the author Odiliangosselin
    Yes, We have used banners & It helped us to get improvement in business queries.
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by Odiliangosselin View Post

      Yes, We have used banners & It helped us to get improvement in business queries.
      Fantastic! Obviously, you had a way of tracking the "improvement in business queries" that banners produced for you. Would you mind sharing your secret here?
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  • Profile picture of the author Odiliangosselin
    Yes I have tried and I got the best results from Signage.
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  • Profile picture of the author explorerwhiz
    Which is the better way to advertising offline or online? And what are the advantages of one over the another.
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    • Profile picture of the author DABK
      Offline and online.

      Advantages: they work well.

      Any more questions?

      Originally Posted by explorerwhiz View Post

      Which is the better way to advertising offline or online? And what are the advantages of one over the another.
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  • Profile picture of the author MartinBuckley
    The best way to do offline advertising is one of the most unused ways, but is the best and that is paying a company or person to distribute your business flyer door to door in an area you want customers. I have never done this and not got new customers, it's works!
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by MartinBuckley View Post

      The best way to do offline advertising is one of the most unused ways, but is the best and that is paying a company or person to distribute your business flyer door to door in an area you want customers. I have never done this and not got new customers, it's works!
      "The best way....".

      Well, it's one way. There are many others that work well, too. One of the things that can double the response to a flyer delivery, is a follow up phone call. This works extremely well if you are marketing to businesses, and gives you a "leg up" over those who only telemarket.
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  • Profile picture of the author DavidGinchansky
    According to me Offline advertising is more efforts as compare to Online,
    but its physically interact with people that are Remembrable and people easily got your product i.e usually produce high quality lead.
    but reach is too low as compare to online marketing.
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  • Profile picture of the author hadyn
    I think it is a really nice idea. I also like making some promotional items like Lapel Pins for this purpose. Have you tried something similar for you? Maybe you will find this idea interesting to you, think about it
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  • Profile picture of the author wickedstock1
    Advertising offline is very tough work in market.
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  • Profile picture of the author umc
    Peak veritability of marketing congruence is by far the nonsense post that threads such as this gobbledygook happenstance.
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    • Profile picture of the author GordonJ
      Originally Posted by umc View Post

      Peak veritability hof marketing congruence is by far the nonsense post that threads such as this gobbledygook happenstance.
      Gibberish, balderdash, blather along with gobbledygook are the default languages of the Philistine, bourgeois and hoi polloi wannabees who desire an elevated state of importance mainly by simply donning the robes of those in the castles. If clothes make the man, then claptrap is the language of the Warrior wannabee.

      GordonJ

      PS. Relevant (perhaps) to the OP...I've changed my mind, today, I would only sell BRAND advertising, after spending decades selling DIRECT RESPONSE (measurable) marketing. Branding spenders have more money, are less concerned with short term results, so I think I've gone over to the dark side and TODAY, find myself in agreement and maybe a tad envious of the guy selling name awareness.
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      • Profile picture of the author eccj
        Originally Posted by GordonJ View Post

        Gibberish, balderdash, blather along with gobbledygook are the default languages of the Philistine, bourgeois and hoi polloi wannabees who desire an elevated state of importance mainly by simply donning the robes of those in the castles. If clothes make the man, then claptrap is the language of the Warrior wannabee.

        GordonJ

        PS. Relevant (perhaps) to the OP...I've changed my mind, today, I would only sell BRAND advertising, after spending decades selling DIRECT RESPONSE (measurable) marketing. Branding spenders have more money, are less concerned with short term results, so I think I've gone over to the dark side and TODAY, find myself in agreement and maybe a tad envious of the guy selling name awareness.
        It's bad work but it's good business.
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  • Profile picture of the author umc
    @GordonJ - You get me. I just get so tired of stupid response after stupid response that I twitched and that's what came out, lol.
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