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Are farmers insider or outsider?

by socialentry
5 replies
The forum is dead. But I have a question so I'll give it a shot. So in sales, most people make a distinction between farmers (people who prefer the soft touch and accumulating a herd over time) and hunters (people who typically cold call and tend to be more transactional,etc)

But are farmers insiders? the image is that they get an automatic pass because they are 'friends of friends of friends'.
I always found that it was better to be on the outside, this way you weren't really bound by the group's social mores or rather it's internal politics. Above the fray so to speak.

The thing I noticed is that when you're an insider e.g. part of the old boys' club, people feel genuinely threatened if you display expertise. Or at least you have to come in strong, and be careful to curate your image.
By being an outsider, you bypass internal politics. It's always better to know about it, but you can always claim ignorance or just arrange happy little coincidences.

What do you guys think?
#farmers #insider #outsider
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  • Profile picture of the author spartan14
    Beying a farmer doesnt make you automaticaly a insider ,it means you nurture relationships
    Insiders are more defined by social and influence than by aproach style

    Outaiders have often more freedom to operate but they may work harder to gain trust
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  • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
    Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

    The forum is dead. But I have a question so I'll give it a shot. So in sales, most people make a distinction between farmers (people who prefer the soft touch and accumulating a herd over time) and hunters (people who typically cold call and tend to be more transactional,etc)

    But are farmers insiders? the image is that they get an automatic pass because they are 'friends of friends of friends'.
    I always found that it was better to be on the outside, this way you weren't really bound by the group's social mores or rather it's internal politics. Above the fray so to speak.

    The thing I noticed is that when you're an insider e.g. part of the old boys' club, people feel genuinely threatened if you display expertise. Or at least you have to come in strong, and be careful to curate your image.
    By being an outsider, you bypass internal politics. It's always better to know about it, but you can always claim ignorance or just arrange happy little coincidences.

    What do you guys think?
    I understand the question.

    The reason most salespeople "Farm" is because they are afraid of calling a prospect, initiating a conversation...or (God forbid) actually asking someone to buy.

    The matter of being an "insider" or an "outsider"?

    Everyone gets it wrong. Farmers believe that by constantly being in touch, providing free content and services, that eventually someone will buy, because they are considered an insider, This is a flawed idea.

    You get the first sale, and provide excellent service, going beyond what was promised. And then you're an insider. Then you are trusted. Then you are referred to other movers and shakers.

    The sales call, and sales comes first, not at the end. The first sale establishes the relationship. You want a relationship based on trust and nothing establishes trust as quickly as money changing hands and promises kept. That's selling.

    Some successful salespeople/service providers do a hybrid....they give free content, which build a little familiarity and and image of competence.....but then they make the sales call.

    The problem with nearly every instance of farming...is that there is no sales call. And the sales call is what jump starts the whole process.

    Alternatively, if you are really well trained in how to obtain and contact referrals from your clients (a whole different sales skill from selling) you bypass the whole "getting to know you" phase, and avoid much of the rejection you get in cold calling.

    But referrals are a real study that can be done 1,000 ways that won't work, and only a few ways that will work. I can recommend a book or two on the subject that I find helpful if you like.
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    • Profile picture of the author socialentry
      Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

      The sales call, and sales comes first, not at the end. The first sale establishes the relationship. You want a relationship based on trust and nothing establishes trust as quickly as money changing hands and promises kept. That's selling.



      Alternatively, if you are really well trained in how to obtain and contact referrals from your clients (a whole different sales skill from selling) you bypass the whole "getting to know you" phase, and avoid much of the rejection you get in cold calling.

      But referrals are a real study that can be done 1,000 ways that won't work, and only a few ways that will work. I can recommend a book or two on the subject that I find helpful if you like.
      I'd appreciate that, yeah.

      i will need likely need the skillset or modify it enough to make it work for me (as is usually the case). My prediction is that it will come in handy.

      too much happened in 10 years to put it in a forum post,but TL;DR ,sales-skills wise, I'm more or less at the same spot as ... the last time I really spoke about it i think.
      In my case I don't think it's so much a reluctance to sell but I feel my circumstances are different.

      But this time around I have a few more specialized scientific and tech skills which means the prospects are much harder to qualify in general. At least one of the consultants I am friend with does purely word of mouth and has zero marketing experience: most of the leads come from referrals or e.g. students he mentored. Bosses he used to work etc. Those people eventually move up the corporate ladder, identify a problem and play matchmaker.

      So there are advantages beyond just selling, mainly that it skips a lot of the qualification.
      That also plays into fullfillment.

      In the coming years will be the time to see if my gambit paid off or if I would have been better off staying in sales altogether.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by socialentry View Post

        I'd appreciate that, yeah.

        .
        You're in luck. I've read every book that I've ever seen on the subject of referrals.

        This is the best one.

        Fearless Referrals by Matt Anderson.

        You can buy a good used copy on Amazon or E-Bay for a few dollars.
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  • Profile picture of the author Princess Balestra
    We pumpin' on abundance of noplace flourish ...

    or nourishin' directo?

    Seems to Moi this is the connecto.

    Yeah but I see the senshl growith mindset nallagy here.

    Whethah it is noblah in the grind to plant awesome, or read shit 'bout unresolvabyool metaphorical conflicts an' turn to dust fore'n no ghosts evin show up.

    *lemme check that again*

    *uh huh*

    Farms are undisputed deliverahs of the neck&neck ubiquitous.

    So routinely competitive you might almost wanna call 'em SLOVENLY.

    "Grown for convenience, like U a towtwill peenience."

    Which is kinda cool if'n you shahpin' for exquisitely cuntoured ZUCCHINI you too stoopid to even' cook.

    But what if you don't actshly know what you wanna?

    An' there is a spewsoscape of ansas beeyimd durrect to your amygdala/cerebellum/tits?

    Farmed all watah tortyoore style?

    From outside sumplace you cain't evin see?

    That is why I seek always to git muh hands on evry vegertbyool my menu dreams inevertyoolbly carbonize.

    The fullness of pertaters...

    Like I could teabag The Rock before he gaht faymiss!

    The crumbly wondah of cauliflowah ...

    Yeah, jus' exfoliate with the fkr steada witnessin' noocleah armageddon 'pon yr dinnah plate.

    The intrinsic recyclability of avocado stones ...

    Like the team invented glass eyes said, "you simply won't see the true benefits until you pop them directly in."

    PRINCESS! THIS IS AN INSIDER OR OUTSIDER QUESTION!
    PLEASE TAKE A STAND -- OR DESIST YE FROM ALL NONSENSE SPECULATION!

    You askin' can I lick my owin ass jus' bcs I a Yogah queen?

    I may be nyoorotic, but no way I ouroboorosotic.
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    Lightin' fuses is for blowin' stuff togethah.

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