My Script Doesnt Work! Arrrgh!!!

I agree that telemarketing is a numbers game. And I have no idea what that guy was paying to outsource the telemarketing.

In the end I don't think his pricing model worked well with telelmarketing. And being on the receiving end of these calls(get maybe 1 to 6 a week) the problem is the business owners are hearing it time and time again.

Telemarketing works and it is a numbers game. But right now personally I think there are too many people calling around and offering services like facebook pages or SEO.

When I get 1 to 6 calls a week plus at least that many emails it just plan getting silly. You've got to be different. Honestly I think you really need to be local because I have never once had a guy walk in. Trust me if a guy had the balls to walk in he would get my attention.

Everyone is used to telemarketing and for B2C it works great as a numbers game. With B2B it works as a numbers game too. But if you are offering the same thing I have heard 4 times already this week I'm going to tell you I am not interested.

Also no offense to people but most of the cold callers I get sound like they have no confidence. They don't believe in their product and don't believe in their script. So I get the guy who posted that thread credit he got himself someone with telemarketing experience vs. doing it himself.

I think telemarketing, as a whole, since it is a numbers game needs better margins. You have to be selling something where you can pay a guy say $100 a day to sell maybe one or two.

I have to say though I would never assume your script was the issue. Because you have the background in telemarketing. You know what works.

And 55 is not a test as you said it is barely touching on it. The problem was as I pointed out in his thread. The model he was selling didn't fit what he was trying to do.

Also do you really get that many people that hang up fast enough that you can get 100 calls an hour(first break after two hours)? That is like 30 seconds per call. Myself I would expect 10 to 20 calls an hour. Less if the person was closing sales since those would take longer. I've never worked in a call center so I am curious on this. 55 calls in my mind is half a day. If they were untargeted there might be no sales. If they were super targeted myself I would expect something to sell to that group.

Edit below:
I agree a lot of what I see here sounds ridiculous. We have a lot of people here who have no business experience. We have a lot of people who really could benefit from listening to the advice of the people with knowledge of it. I know nothing about telemarketing so I would look to someone like you before just winging it.

Myself I try to bring people the other side. Basically I have managed the kinds of small businesses that many are targeting. I am currently the go to guy in my company those selling these services would be pitching to.

I see guys starting up with no experience thinking they can sell a web page they make in under an hour for $3,000. It's not going to happen because those of us looking at $3,000 websites want value for out money and they will never be able to show the value in a simple wordpress website they plan to make in an hour.

I see prices that make no sense. I see people sending out mass emails and cold calling that expect 10% closing ratios.

The big issue is that a lot of people here don't get the fact this is a business and starting a business takes work(rather you do it yourself or hire someone). The people you are selling to are business owners or managers. Many of these people are managing yearly budgets that are more than you will make in a lifetime. Stop and think about that. These people are not idiots. They may not know web design and internet marketing but they are used to dealing with suppliers and interviewing people. Basically they can sense BS. So if they sense BS or sense that you have no idea what you are doing they will not do business with you.

Honestly how many times do we see someone post a thread that says something like, "I have an appointment set up what should I pitch?" Honestly you are booking appointments and don't even know what your products is? You don't even have a rough idea what your prices are? This isn't being a professional. And sadly for those that are professional we get so many calls from unprofessional people that we often assume you all are.

So be professional.
Be different.
And if you stand out and get my attention you might just get our business.

You're right on the money as always.

I think a lot of what you said applies to many people, even those that are not cold calling. People say craigslist doesn't work, and it doesn't compared to really calling and hammering a qualified list but people don't see it work because they don't give it time or because they don't do enough.

Internet marketers used to do 4 or 5 articles and think that they could get affiliate commissions with that. One of my niches in IM, I wrote 200 articles and still nowhere near where I need to be. Someone who has guided me when I first started, has over 2,000 articles in his niches.

People that do SEO, wonder why they aren't getting results after getting a few high quality back links. They need more!

A lot of people seem to give up and they just don't have the right mentality. I do a variety of things to market my business. Cold calling is one of them, but I am still nowhere near the numbers you describe! I would love to do 2,000 calls every few days. I think the maximum I have done is 1,000 a week. If only I could do that consistently!

Any advice on how to pump up the calling while being able to manage regular tasks? I think a lot of people would benefit from that insight. Some of us do make an effort to cold call, but can't do those kinds of numbers. Another issue that I personally have is that I can't hire a telemarketer to work in my office since it is a home office. Hoping that issue will be resolved in a few months! Any advice is appreciated and I'm sure other warriors are having the same problems!

@ Iamnameless

"Thank You".

Trust me I agree telemarketing works. Hell it works on me when the pitch(or script) is good and the service or product fits what I am looking for.

Is it the most efficient method? Not by any means. With a highly targeted list it could be. But people know it is a numbers game.

Like I said I think for B2C it can get amazing results. And some industries have made it their bread and butter. I can't imagine facebook being able to produce for a roofer the way cold calling or direct mail could.

But that being said how many roofers do cold calling without knowing how to roof? How many quote prices that are 10 times more than the going rate?

The problem for offliners here is this industry(seo & web services) is full of people who do just that. They cold call assuming they can make $3,000 for an hour of work.

A vast majority of them would be better to figure out their product/service and pricing before calling. To be a professional business. And IMO they would be better off starting local and selling face to face. Where the fresh faced start up company can have appeal. Where I can see you want my business and want to build a long term relationship.

I've had 10 other people contact me this week by email and phone. How are you going to be different?

Basically I think telemarketing is something these guys should do at a later time or do as appointment setting calling for local customers.

I have never once been contacted by someone locally. In all my years of managing I have never once had a local web marketer contact me. At least not one that ever made it clear he was local.

Think about that. I'm not even in a major metro like Chicago. The local market is untapped in a lot of the cities where offline warriors live. But instead of getting out there and setting up meetings they are emailing and cold calling because it is easier. Because if they get rejected they just know it is a numbers game. How many people here really are secretly hoping for a "no". Yes seems to scare them. Work seems to scare them.

So to all those warriors get out there and take action. Have a business plan. Know how you will grow your business. Market a product or service you know you can sell. Use that to get clients and than be ready to expand the services you offer them. Be ready to ask for and get refferals. Basically be ready to build you business the way 1,000s of others have before you.

Truth is that you can use the exact same script your competition has used for ten years... and call twenty minutes behind them and make sales they didnt make for one reasons or another, and you can keep that process going for years without saturating even a small town (100k people) and still get sales at a predictable rate every week.

Its about the salesman breaking through the walls. Thats all. It will be that way in EVERY market no matter what sales job you take, there is a temptation in every sales job to think its the market or the script or the times, or your bosses stupid business model... Seriously.

Its none of that. Its about the salesman making up his mind to sell.

One person makes a million dollars in the weight loss market, and another says its over and saturated 'Dont try it cuz there's no money in it, its burnt"..., then the next day someone pops up and makes money in it...Its not the market.

LOL when I first saw the title of this post I thought it was another "cold calling doesn't work" complaint. Then I saw the writer was John D and I said "Ah ha."

If you can't do 300 calls a day, that's OK: the process may simply take longer for you. "May" take longer. Don't get yourself into the headspace that it "will" take longer. There's something about Sales: what we call headtrash is the biggest barrier between you and success. Some salespeople have headtrash about the size of the company they can call on. They do fine with little businesses, but get them on the line with a corporate CEO and they go tongue-tied. So don't let headtrash stop you.

John has talked a little about there being a wall for newbie prospectors to get over...invisible things you do badly on Day One by well by Day Ten. So the secret is to get a script you understand, and get making calls. OK, so you made 50 and didn't get a Yes today. Stop being so anxious about getting a Yes! A No is OK too. The only thing we don't want is the indecisive Think It Over. That will make you spin in circles.

We have another idea called "Prejudging the next call." You don't want to do that. This is where you call 20 people and nobody wants to talk, and you then figure that the 21st person isn't going to want to talk to you either, and quit. NO! You have NO IDEA what is going on in the next person's world. They may be sitting there, stuck, *wishing* that someone with your expertise would call!

I made some prospecting calls to city managers on behalf of a client yesterday afternoon. The first bunch of people I called either weren't in or didn't want to talk. For a second, I started getting down about it and the idea of trying again tomorrow popped into my head. But I shrugged that off, of course, because I know what happens. I kept calling. In the next two calls I set up qualified appointments for my client. Success needs no explanation. Success erases all of the annoying effort needed to get there.

Get in there and make the calls. Stick with your script, as long as you know it's a good one. Remember, the people you spoke with in Week 1 who said they weren't interested, you can call them back in 3 months. Their situation may have changed. Your prospecting skills will have improved, too.

Cool post - thanks.

I'm wondering, as a side discussion, do you think telemarketing is even a decent lead generation tactic these days, with all the easy phone centers in Philippines, etc., making telemarketing an unstoppable diseased epidemic? Business owners hate getting calls. Direct mail has proven to be so much more effective for offline. Why jump into the sewer at all when there are methods that are not used much which can get you into the circle of trust of local businesses and even corporations, for purposes of offline marketing. I'm just asking your opinion, since I've used most other lead generation tactics but avoided telemarketing.

Perhaps people get turned down for telemarketing because everyone is doing it. I can tell you that most of my offline clients and leads that I talk to really hate to be called on the phone, so would never want to violate that and then say "hey I would like to do your marketing, even though I just phone spammed you."

I totally agree with you about needing to have some boundaries with workers and be firm.

Also, as you said, I hate it when a so-called consultant gives bad advice, its hard enough to succeed without somebody who is clueless trying to tell you what to do and promoting it as the gospel truth when it is not.

David I expressed a lot of what I believe. I still think telemarketing works for many industries. In this one I think it has been over used and abused.

I myself can't see using telemarketing for this industry. It simply doesn't make sense. Consultants shouldn't be desperate and telemarketing in B2B settings often makes the people receiving the calls feel that way.

Direct mail and setting up seminars I think works much better.

But each person needs to do it the way they feel comfortable.

300 calls a day? Sounds like my old call center job as a collections rep for this well known credit card company. Some people are good on the phone, and some are not. If it were up to me, i'd lead with direct mail first. Make it attractive and mail it out to the intended person.

P.S. I got fired from that call center job within 2 months.... for low performance. Last time i'll do cold calling. Hated that crap.

While I agrre with the overall premise here ( it takes a huge amount of telephone calls to get sales) I would challenge your maths -
Calling 55 prospects is what a paid telemarketer should be doing in their first 30 minutes
that's 33 seconds a call -
The TM needs to be dialing 2000 number per week. Honestly, any call center where telemarketers are making multyiple daaily sales, they are doing 2000 numbers every couple of DAYS!!!
again - on a 40 hr week your slow guys (2000 number per week) are doing 1.2 minute calls
- honestly that's not enough time to introduce yourself - let alone make a sale!
and anyway - telemarketers dont usually make sales - they gather leads - for salespeople to follow up on - because both are different skill sets

which leads to
how many roofers do cold calling without knowing how to roof?
I will answer = NONE.
Now ask me how many TELEMARKETERS who dont know how to fix a roof make roofing sales everyday?
Answer = Thousands.

and how many IMer's that don't know how to telemarket made a sale yesterday?
mmm... not many by the number of frustrated threads on this forum
anyhow - the whole debate is an oxymoron in my opinion
you guys are selling a service - how to use the internet to get more business
there are a number of strategies on this forum using IM tools to do just that ....
I just can't imagine why any one would push telemarketing for IM services ..... unless maybe I had a telemarketing product

Careful guys, don't get into an argument here. Opposing views are fine, but one-on-one arguments can get the entire thread deleted. That would be a disservice to the fine content of this one. If you *must* discuss, keep it civil or take it to PM.

It just happened recently to me; I allowed myself to be baited into a three or four round back-and-forth (I didn't even lose my temper ) with an antagonistic poster, and the thread vanished.

Also, Danny, if I may: I don't think John D is talking about making a sale in 33 seconds. I think he means a dial can take about half a minute, if the prospect isn't available to take the call. The telemarketer hangs up and moves on. I personally think this is a bit brief, that the average is probably a minute per call with "on hold" waiting time and screwing around, but average dial time is still short.

The regular person then fumbles about and hums and haws for a few minutes before making the next call, and this is where the discrepancy between telemarketers and everyone else is.

For the average person, I think your 20 dials an hour is reasonable.

chuckle - it's a common politicians gambit to attack the person if they don't feel they can win the argument! -

Im clearly not attacking, just stating the facts... You came to argue my points, not the other way around...

I had my first experience with a telemarketing company in 1977 and was involved with a company that had a staff of 20+ telemarketers a few years back - in both situations the telephonists did not make any sales at all! They booked appointments for sales reps to follow up on.

Okay and that means telemarketers dont sell-they only set appointments- because all rooms are just like that one right?

I find it interesting that you refer to telephonists making "a sale" ie - get a business owner to purchase a service - in under a minute !

I said "most calls dont last a minute". Which is where your lack of experience is revealed... you should know that. No one said most sales are closed in a minute "most calls dont last 33 seconds". That is true because its ninety percent "No's" and most calls dont make it past the greeting. Have you ever counted 33 seconds? Its longer than you think on the phone.

Have you ever worked on an auto dialer?

I field sales calls on a regular basis - the only time the call lasts less than 33 seconds is when I hang up with a quick - not interested.

Hello?

If I am polite - wait till i verify yes, I am the business owner, listen to the opening 2-3 sentences on how their u beut phone service will save me money - and then tell them sorry, I'm not interested the call has already lasted longer than a minute.

Okay... Keep going. You should really try to record the actual time on one of those one time. 33 seconds is longer than you might think. I would bet you turn most of them down in the first 20.

It is intersting that another on this thread defines success, not as making a sale - but as booking an appointment - no sale in sight - just an oppertunity to make a pitch.

And there is only one type of caller right?

I did do some calling myself recently. My targets were business owners without websites - their only online presence an address and phone number.
The sole objective of my call was to get their email and permission to send them some info. I averaged about 20 calls an hour - just to get an email!

Cool, you got twenty email addresses....Thats "sales" experience at its finest.

As far as timing here...you probably were doing it at your own pace, without much intensity.... I wouldnt expect a home worker to work at the pace of a pro.

With employees on a dialer, the average time in between hanging up and dialing shouldnt be more than 5 seconds or so, if it gets that long we raise the 'drop" rate until its more like 3-5 seconds max waiting time.... In the professional telemarketing world we time things down to seconds, because at the end of the day, 100 TMS, lagging by 5 seconds per call adds up to alot of down time.

So back to the point - yes it takes a lot of phone calls to make sales - can you make 2000 of 'em a week? - selling internet services to offline business owners? Try timing a converstion and see how much gets said in 33 seconds -

Hello again?

I have probably seen a million calls go by my screen monitoring others and watch their stats down to seconds in every case... Again, if you are casually dialing, I understand...

That casual dialing is why many people arent getting results.

There are enough people right here on this forum and in my telemarketing forum who can tell you that 70-100 dials per hour should be about average particularly on a dialer, but not limited to one.

You are only going to get past your greeting with 10% of the people who say hello... and you dont WANT to spend more than 33 seconds wasting your time with most of them. there is a difference between prospecting and "suspecting".

If you are turning up a prospect on every call, then great. You are a better man than I am.

Now , anything is possible - but to sell a service inside 33 seconds - I'd make sure I'd keep that telephonist on staff!

Cool , if you find him, let me know when he's playing his telephone in town... I love to listen to a good "telephonist".

Again, I think you are the one attacking my points and its not the other way around as you have said... However, it isnt worth my time to argue with you.

There is always one in the crowd.

I think it depends on what midas is selling and how he is pitching.

Personally I could never imagine selling in an environment with such a low closing ratio like telemarketing. But that is just because it is not my style of selling.

I'm the guy telemarketers would send in to close the appointments. We wimply have different skills.

midas is likely doing what I would do if I were doing offline marketing personally. Find a product or service that i can price right for a health profit and get a high close ratio. Doing offline marketing I wouldn't sell any product I couldn't trust myself to get a 20% close on. Simply not worth my time.

I also would narrow my targets down so I was only going after businesses I had a high likelihood of closing.

Than I would focus on upselling those clients to larger projects like SEO. I've seen this work time and time again. The loss leader works to gain business and in consulting it doesn't even have to be a loss just an affordably priced service that gets you in the door and turns you into "their guy"

But on a national scale it doesn't work as well as telemarketing because it would require a lot of boots on the ground. Something that would be cost prohibitive for most medium sized businesses. But remember once businesses get big they go back to the boots on the ground. Medical reps, dealer reps(RVs, cars, Sony even), and etc. start putting people on the ground because they sell better. When a business is pitching a product to Wal-Mart they do it in person. Selling in person will always close better.

But telemarketing can work very well if used properly. It just seems like some of us disagree about using it in offline marketing. Now even local I think phone calls though not a classic cold call from a telemarketer work to set appointments.

Get in touch with owner or manager
Business owner: "This is John how may I help you."
Me: "John this is Aaron over in Peoria, do you have a moment?"
BO: "Yeah I have a min."
Me: "I saw your coupons in the paper. Great ad by the way. My company works with restaurants like yours to turn one time coupon users into reliable repeat customer. I wondered if I could set up a meeting with you to show you how my company could use those coupons and our services to do this for you as well. I have time Thurs afternoon, would 1pm work?"
BO: "How long will it take?"
Me: "I can explain the basics in 15 to 30 mins but I will put you down for an hour on my schedule so you can get any questions you have answered."
BO: "Would 2pm work?"
Me: "I have another appointment at 3, would you do 1:30? I don't want to have to cut you short if you have questions" (I really don't have an appointment at 3 but by saying this he believes my time is valuable.)
BO: Yeah I can do that."
Me: "Thanks again John. Would you like me to email over an appointment reminder for Outlook?" (great way to get their email and you are doing them a service)

And I am literally just doing this off the top of my head. The business owners responses are based on how I would answer.

A quick appointment setting call like that is easy. If you are local they will want to help another local business. This is the reason you give the city. Try to be in a city in the same metro area but not the same city, same city sounds stupid to say. Reason #1 when you set up an office to do it in a smaller city in the metro area. In bigger metro areas you can merely say "south suburbs" or something similar.

Now remember what I gave up there is not tested or polished but you can easily take that and build a "script" of your own around it. But you don't really need a script you need to be real. If it was their coupon in the paper that got you to call mention it. If you saw their yellow pages ad mention it. If you were in eating the other night mention it. If you were checking you phone for local restaurants and noticed they didn't have a mobile website mention it. Just make sure you are not selling on this call. You are too busy to take the time to sell on the phone. Your service is too important to be pitched on the phone. You need a meeting and you are busy so it has to be at a time you can do it.

Let's say it is 2:30 and the meeting is still going?(you told him 3pm for your next) Well end it and set up a follow up meeting. Do not close him if he took too long, show your time is valuable. IDC if you have nothing to do. If you have to come back at 5pm to do it than you do. This could be your first sale but he doesn't have to know that. He may be the only appointment this week but you never let him know that. You both have mutual respect of each others time. You are not desperate and neither is he. But you can partner up and work together and both benefit.

Yeah this thread has become an interesting example of two ways of approaching offline sales.

Both methods work but both require doing. And both require different views of what is working.

I think this thread evolved into an interesting discussion. For the noobies here it is an interesting look on how each of the processes work. We tell them to get out there and "do". Now they can see why people advocate the different methods.

Also i think the main point of this thread has and still is that you don't assume a script or other tool used by others isn't working. You need to figure what you are doing that is making it not work for you. Are you giving up too easy? Are you selling the wrong product? The wrong price? Not showing the value to the prospect?

It's easy to make 20 calls and say damn this script doesn't work. It's a lot harder to make a day or two full of calls and than ask yourself why you can't make the script work. In our society we tend to expect others to provide for us and blame them for our failures. But in the end if we are given good tools(scripts/etc) and we don't get results we need to look at what we are doing. Does my voice sound bad? Is the script working but my pitch failing?

It's the reason that a lot of call centers turn over new employees fast. They simply are not good at it. While another caller might be making sales or appointment at ten times the rate of the average caller. On guy gets how to use the tool and his confidence and belief in himself and his tools means he comes off like someone who knows what they are doing. Humans for the most part like confidence. Even those who are leaders(and trust me not all managers or business owners are leaders) have a build in tendency to want to follow someone who is confident.

Look into yourself and you will see why you succeed and why you fail. It's hard. It's scary but it is what in the end makes you better. Want to be a super star? It takes the ability to learn why you succeed and train it. And learn why you fail and find ways to overcome it.

Wait, it took 55 CALLS? I called one business person in my area and I knew right away that my script was terrible and that cold calling was just not for me.

:rolleyes:

I have ran a mortgage business before and I hired and trained telemarketers to make outbound calls, I agree with John, the key here is numbers, it is all a numbers game, it really is and if you or your TM is making only 55 calls, that will simply not cut it. My guys were calling 200-400 calls per day, the more you call the more sales you get, PERIOD. Also the script is important, but you have to start with a script and your TM will mold it as they call, they will naturally adjust the script to their style. Dont expect results overnight, make adjustments to your script and have a min number of calls per day. Also do not sell like a salesman lol, make the client feel that you want to help them out, to better their suitation, if they use you or your service they will acutally benfit from it.