47 replies
NLP stands for Neuro-Linguistic Programming, it is the practice of understanding how people organise their thinking, feeling, language and behaviour.

Do you guys use any of NLP techniques in your offline marketing effort?
#nlp
  • Profile picture of the author danielsteven
    Nope, I simply just have conversations with my potential clients. I don't get all caught up in worrying if I'm saying the right thing to push the right neurological buttons... I just have conversations to see if they want what I can provide.
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    • Profile picture of the author RRG
      NLP is all about manipulation.

      Instead of trying to manipulate someone into buying from you . . . why not try some of these crazy techniques:
      • Be yourself
      • Do what's best for your client
      • Offer value
      • Over-deliver
      • Act like you don't care if they say yes or not
      • Be yourself

      Revolutionary stuff, huh?
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      • Profile picture of the author tropvik
        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        NLP is all about manipulation.

        Instead of trying to manipulate someone into buying from you . . . why not try some of these crazy techniques:
        • Be yourself
        • Do what's best for your client
        • Offer value
        • Over-deliver
        • Act like you don't care if they say yes or not
        • Be yourself

        Revolutionary stuff, huh?
        Amen to that bro.

        NLP is really a gimmick to feed off weak people. (NLP Vampires)

        Real leaders, create leaders around them, not sheep.

        Just be yourself, and if anything just work on your confidence.

        1. Look at people in the eye.
        2. Strong hand shake.
        3. Be curious about them in a non-hypocritical way.

        I have been living back in South America for half a year, and i must say that one of the things i notice now that im back in the States is that we have so many comforts that we really forget the basic human qualities of warmth and brotherhood.

        Something that OOOZES in places like Venezuela, Colombia, Ecuador, Peru.

        People are just so friendly, inviting and genuinely interested in being a friend.

        1st world countries are in dire need of going back to those basics.

        NLP = BS
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        • Profile picture of the author cmck873
          You guys realize that NLP is all about clear communication right????

          By not using NLP you are working twice as hard to say the same thing, forcing your customer to interpret what your saying into their own Preferred Representational System

          You can't manipulate anybody into doing something they weren't already planning on doing in the first place.

          The use of NLP to manipulate is almost non-existant. By building rapport with someone and then lying to them, is the same thing con artists do everyday...even without knowing what NLP or Rapport is.

          Source: Me-Certified NLP Master Practitioner-
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        • Profile picture of the author trydawnato
          NLP is preying on people stuck in the tortures of their environment.

          Some people ask me if NLP is really effective. I say I don't know since I prefer to do it the "Natural" way.
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      • Profile picture of the author misterme
        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        NLP is all about manipulation.

        Instead of trying to manipulate someone into buying from you . . . why not try some of these crazy techniques:

        Be yourself
        I don't knowingly use any NLP but I have to say the advice to "be yourself" is the weakest advice in the world. In other words, the advice is to do nothing - just continue doing whatever you're inclined to do, no matter if it's mostly ineffective and could use improvement. As if from birth we have all the developed skills we ever need and don't have to progress ourselves any further or learn anything new at all. Just be yourself, don't learn to use any tools that perhaps could help you grow.

        Manipulation? Here's an example of manipulation for you: when you're looking for an address and you're unsure where it is to the point where you stop someone on the street to ask, smile and say, "Excuse me, I'm trying to find [address]. Can you point me in the right direction please?" By smiling and saying "excuse me" and "please" and being polite in your request, you can actually manipulate people into helping you out!

        (works much better than just being "yourself" approaching strangers and saying, "Hey you! Tell me where this place is.")

        Here's another example: When you're having dinner with friends or family, and you'd like to put some salt on your food but the salt shaker is out of reach, you can actually manipulate others to get the shaker for you and hand it over to you. Here's how to manipulate them: You speak up and say, "Excuse me, could someone please pass the salt shaker?" Extra points if you additionally influence them to do so by stretching out your arm to point to the salt shaker and then opening your hand as if to expect someone to comply with your manipulation.

        This stuff works!

        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        Act like you don't care if they say yes or not
        Pardon me but didn't you just declare that one shouldn't be manipulative like that and instead should just "be yourself"?
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        "Best book on answering objections I have seen... it's for photographers but it has brilliant techniques you can use in any business." - Claude Whitacre. When They Say That, You Say This (Amazon Kindle)
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        • Profile picture of the author Calamaroo
          Don't bother with NLP.

          Don't learn more about NLP. But if by some accident you wind up knowing more about NLP than you do now, promise yourself to never use it.

          Don't even think about NLP. Don't get curious about neuro linguistic programming, now or ever.
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          • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
            Originally Posted by Calamaroo View Post

            Don't bother with NLP.

            Don't learn more about NLP. But if by some accident you wind up knowing more about NLP than you do now, promise yourself to never use it.

            Don't even think about NLP. Don't get curious about neuro linguistic programming, now or ever.
            Perfect!!!
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            Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
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            • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
              I swear I don't use Naughty Love Potion!

              Best,
              Ewen
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          • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
            Originally Posted by Calamaroo View Post

            Don't bother with NLP.

            Don't learn more about NLP. But if by some accident you wind up knowing more about NLP than you do now, promise yourself to never use it.

            Don't even think about NLP. Don't get curious about neuro linguistic programming, now or ever.
            I am not interested in NLP.. Nope! I'm not even thinking about NLP...

            NLP...NLP....

            HEY! Wait a minute there! You just used a reverse double backflip NLP whammy on me, didn't you?!

            You clever Son Of A Gun.

            We never saw it coming....

            "NLP....NLP...." (Trance like droning)

            OK, seriously. I've read the original books on NLP, hypnosis, and have a couple sales courses that are NLP based.

            Clarity of communication...is my goal. NLP helps.

            What I haven't heard yet, is that you need more. Not everything you need is in NLP. Selling is more than rapport, more than clear communication.

            But you would find the principles useful, I think.

            Originally Posted by Dan McCoy View Post

            NLP is about talking to other humans in the same language they use internally. It's about speaking in a way that people can really hear and understand you.
            Best description I've ever read.

            Originally Posted by RRG View Post

            NLP is all about manipulation.

            Instead of trying to manipulate someone into buying from you . . . why not try some of these crazy techniques:
            • Be yourself
            • Do what's best for your client
            • Offer value
            • Over-deliver
            • Act like you don't care if they say yes or not
            • Be yourself

            Revolutionary stuff, huh?
            I understand the "Spirit" of what you are saying. And most of it is good advice. But have you ever said something nice to someone? You are now changing their perception of you. That's manipulative.
            NLP is one of many tools that shows us how people think. NLP simply utilizes the way people think to make communication easier.

            Have you ever seen a Natural Salesman? A person that people listen to, that people want to buy from? That person is using, unconsciously, many of the things NLP teaches.
            NLP just gives us a clearer view of how all this "Natural salesman" stuff really works. Don't you want to know?

            One thing. Don't act like you don't care if they buy or not. Act as if you don't need the sale. There is a big difference. You want them to buy, because it's for their benefit, and you know it's the best choice for them.

            All social interaction is manipulation. Like Misterme said; Saying "Please" and smiling is manipulating.

            Some people just mistakenly think manipulating is something separate from what we do every day...when we are being ourselves.

            There are slimy terrible salespeople that try to manipulate in a clumsy, inarticulate slimy way...for evil ends. Those people are wrong.
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      • Profile picture of the author Randy Bishop
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

          I will say no more on the subject...
          I'm taking you at your word.
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        • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
          Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

          If you have never witnessed NLP in action, then just watch this Millionaire do business like how business is SUPPOSED to be done!
          This guy is your hero eh?

          That's not NLP... That's just douchebag 101.

          Welcome to the forum. Now and then we have someone like you come through here. It doesn't take long for the truth to come out.

          I hope you really contribute value. So far all you are doing is posturing.

          It makes me wonder why you are here?
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          Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.
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          • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
            Originally Posted by Dan McCoy View Post


            Now and then we have someone like you come through here. It doesn't take long for the truth to come out.

            I hope you really contribute value. So far all you are doing is posturing.

            It makes me wonder why you are here?
            I couldn't agree more.

            See his posts in this thread. just bought $7k worth of high end dresses...how to get rid of it? :rolleyes:

            Terra
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          • Profile picture of the author Randy Bishop
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            • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
              Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

              (Or just take advice from hopeless dreamers like Claude and Mr.Mcoy) Being ruthless pays!
              Hopeless dreamers?

              Please, I'm laughing so hard my sides are aching! Stop....please stop...

              No, really....

              You know, I was actually still thinking that you had something of value to offer.
              Truly. And I first thought that you were an assho1e. But you know what? You can still be a jerk and teach something.

              But you're not an assho1e. You're just silly.. (edited, because I felt badly about it later)

              Time for the "Ignore" button.

              Added later; Your Avatar shows you (If it is you) holding someone you obviously care about, and who cares about you. That means more to me than any blustering on your part. But you should still think before you speak. There. That's some real advice.
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            • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
              Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post


              NLP doesn't work? You don't need to master the art of NLP? then just analyse this clip, watch how Vance Miller negotiates his business deals. (Or just take advice from hopeless dreamers like Claude and Mr.Mcoy - see how far that gets you) Being ruthless pays!

              p.s if you can't spot the tactics, then I can only assume that you are yet to master the fine art of NLP
              LOL hopeless dreamers... Hahahaa

              The really funny thing is we agree that NLP is useful.

              I don't need a primer on business. I'm doing just fine. I have never asked one penny from anyone on this forum. Don't need to. I'm here because I actually like people and don't have to pretend to be a miserable wretch to get money.

              I'm as ruthless as they come when making a deal. I absolutely love to steal from my competition. But that has nothing to do with being an ass.

              There is a low road and a high road to life. You can be ruthless and nice at the same time.

              We can already see you aren't believable. You told us you had nothing more to say on the subject, yet here you are bloviating.

              I'm sure you are really successful LOL. I'm sure you have lots of fulfilling relationships to go along with your MOUNTAIN of money LOL.
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              • Profile picture of the author Randy Bishop
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                • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
                  Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

                  Tish Tosh

                  Too long, didn't read

                  Randy
                  I do find it of extreme interest that whenever someone has a very valid counterpoint to yours (polite version) that whenever someone blows your ideals out of the water or proves you are wrong, or that you just made an ignorant statement, or calls you out (slightly rude version), that your reply is "Too long, didn't read."

                  Don't bother to reply, I already know your answer...

                  Too long, didn't read.

                  Terra
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                  • Profile picture of the author Plugin Profits
                    Sure all communication involves psychology and psychology is influential. The more you understand it, the more you can manipulate with it to get what you want, like with copywriting etc. Though the more you know and understand, the more contrived it can become and the more it can be used against others best interests. It's difficult to know and understand that much and not use it to your advantage. There comes a point though where some over focus on those tactics and forget about just being spontaneous and focused on the moment. Seems fine for sales though not personal relationships.
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                • Profile picture of the author Khemosabi
                  Originally Posted by Randy Bishop View Post

                  Tish Tosh

                  Too long, didn't read

                  Randy
                  Good grief! How many AB's are there in this world? :rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan Allard
    I have to agree with the above poster. I don't think you guys really understand what nlp is about (probably been misinformed by some marketer trying to sell you something). Nlp is very effective and I personally use it for personal development. I've also learned to create better rapport with people which has definetly helped my business.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jwil1025
    my sister does NLP as part of her work and i'm sure she is not trying to sell to her clients.

    Its more of a change the way you think to create a better life for yourself well that's what i understand it to be anyway...
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  • Profile picture of the author TWalker
    NLP is generally something one does to improve oneself. It has little if anything to do with other people.

    Now if your interested in swaying other people you should consider things like conversational hypnosis.
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    • Profile picture of the author Roy Naim
      Browsing the forum for a moment in the offline section (about to venture into this world)...the words NLP caught my eyes...

      And like others said above me, NLP is nothing but better communication between one own self and between one to another.

      That is all.

      Here's another thing. NLP is just a label. Richard Bandler and John Grinder labeled the very "techniques" we do every single day.

      You get rapport with someone...how did you do it?
      You lost a lot of weight...what did you tell yourself?
      You built a huge business....what were the steps?

      That is partof what NLP is...figuring out what one has done to do something and then using it effectively.

      It is just a label in a way...but it is a useful label that allows us to learn what we do effectively and how to do it more often.


      Originally Posted by RRG View Post

      NLP is all about manipulation.

      Instead of trying to manipulate someone into buying from you . . . why not try some of these crazy techniques:
      • Be yourself
      • Do what's best for your client
      • Offer value
      • Over-deliver
      • Act like you don't care if they say yes or not
      • Be yourself

      Revolutionary stuff, huh?
      Originally Posted by didacus View Post

      Amen to that bro.

      NLP is really a gimmick to feed off weak people. (NLP Vampires)

      Real leaders, create leaders around them, not sheep.

      Just be yourself, and if anything just work on your confidence.

      1. Look at people in the eye.
      2. Strong hand shake.
      3. Be curious about them in a non-hypocritical way.

      I have been living back in South America for half a year, and i must say that one of the things i notice now that im back in the States is that we have so many comforts that we really forget the basic human qualities of warmth and brotherhood.

      Something that OOOZES in places like Venezuela, Colombia, Ecuador, Peru.

      People are just so friendly, inviting and genuinely interested in being a friend.

      1st world countries are in dire need of going back to those basics.

      NLP = BS
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  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
    Do I use NLP? No because I have never been trained in it.

    Am I likely doing many of the same things? Yes I am sure I am.

    Many techniques that are "invented" are really things many have been doing for years. All they have done is create a label for it and a training method around it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mrs S
    I've had an NLP book sitting on my bookshelf for years gathering dust - I agree with Aaron that I'm probably doing most of the things already, but I'm actually tempted to dust it off and have a read!
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  • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
    Those who say NLP is BS or manipulation might not have a clear idea of what it is.

    I don't sit there and plan ways to trick people's minds into my way of doing things. Sure, you can manipulate with it. Any tool is that way. You can kill someone with a knife or you can use it to cut an apple and serve peanut butter to a kid. NLP is just another tool.

    Brendan Burchard said "Explicit communication is the source of all happiness" and I believe that is true.

    I have read and internalized at least a dozen NLP courses and books. It has been very helpful to me and people tell me I have a certain way of saying things that is simple and clear.

    When you are communicating, it is your responsibility to communicate in a way that others understand you. When a teacher or salesman is having trouble getting someone to understand, there is a failure of communication. The speaker is the one responsible, not the listener.

    I have been through so many books and courses that a lot of the techniques are just part of my speech now. I don't think about them. They are in this post. I'm not being manipulative, I'm just communicating with you.

    NLP is about talking to other humans in the same language they use internally. It's about speaking in a way that people can really hear and understand you.

    It is worthwhile to study ANY kind of material that will make you a better communicator. Life is about communication.

    I personally make sure that 1/4 of my learning is centered around communication. It is vital to all success in your business and relationships.
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  • Profile picture of the author Adam Gersbach
    NLP has its merits and its good to know and understand.

    Definitely not good for manipulation of others.

    Unless the goal to learn NLP is to become a practitioner, its only really good for yourself.

    If one has bad habbits, are not happy, not successful and generally want to improve themselves its awesome.
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  • Profile picture of the author misterme
    I'm not all that well versed in the nuances of NLP but today I got an email from a prospect who was hot, who was to call me today to schedule an appointment, but who now writes to say she thinks she's going with someone referred by friends who is also in her work circle.

    OK, so before you all say I didn't build enough value, suffice it to say we had an initial convo a couple of days ago where I indeed made a mark (I'm well versed enough to know the signs that I've made a mark) - so this was a bit of a surprise.

    Anyhow, I know that attempting to overcome what she plans on doing, and emailing or speaking to her in terms of that, serving up more reasons why my stuff's exactly what she's looking for, trying to build more value, sending testimonials and all that is going to be futile because I don't have her willingly in my camp any more and so it's like chasing to get the cute girl who's not interested in you. It only pushes them further away.

    So because it reminded me of Dating 101, I thought I'd attempt some NLP here. Or what I think is NLP. What DO you do when she's not interested? (that's a rhetorical question). You can't play it like you don't need the work or that she'll lose you, because she doesn't care.

    But she might care if she thinks she may have made the wrong decision and is actually missing out on something good, right?

    So I thought I'd reinforce some doubts she initially expressed about people in her work circle who offered similar services as I do, and anchor some positive feelings about my work on top of that.

    Not that I expect anything miraculous to happen but it's like an experiment. You can't win them all. But what do you think of the email I sent her? Does it fit what I meant it to do?

    Here's the email.

    Dear XXXXX,

    I'm sure whoever your friends suggested will do their best.

    And that they'll get the results you expect and that you'll be ecstatic, because
    that's the only thing that really matters when it's all said and done, isn't that right?

    But if anything makes you suspect you should change your plans with them, of course feel free to get back to me.

    And I'd appreciate if you come across someone you feel will be thrilled over what I can do, please do feel free to give them my contact information. They'll love you even more for it.

    Best wishes,
    MisterMe
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    "Best book on answering objections I have seen... it's for photographers but it has brilliant techniques you can use in any business." - Claude Whitacre. When They Say That, You Say This (Amazon Kindle)
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      ".....will do their best"


      You dog, you!
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      • Profile picture of the author misterme
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        ".....will do their best"

        You dog, you!
        How so? Was that not appropriate? I didn't want to write "I'm sure they'll try to do their best" because that's a slam. But "they'll do their best" sounds sincere to me just as if I said I would do my best.

        But yet I think it has that nuance that they're just going to miss the mark by thaaaat much. Is that what you mean?

        By the way, looking back at my notes on her, there was a point where she wanted to focus on how much she got for my minimum so for all I know I was too expensive for her and she wasn't ever my target client.
        Signature
        "Best book on answering objections I have seen... it's for photographers but it has brilliant techniques you can use in any business." - Claude Whitacre. When They Say That, You Say This (Amazon Kindle)
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by misterme View Post

          How so? Was that not appropriate? I didn't want to write "I'm sure they'll try to do their best" because that's a slam. But "they'll do their best" sounds sincere to me just as if I said I would do my best.

          But yet I think it has that nuance that they're just going to miss the mark by thaaaat much. Is that what you mean?

          By the way, looking back at my notes on her, there was a point where she wanted to focus on how much she got for my minimum so for all I know I was too expensive for her and she wasn't ever my target client.
          Misterme; I can't believe I'm going to say this..I think you misunderstood me. I was praising your subtle artistry in language.

          Originally Posted by misterme View Post

          But yet I think it has that nuance that they're just going to miss the mark by thaaaat much. Is that what you mean?
          Yup. That's precisely what I meant. It's sooooo subtle. I don't think any "civilian" would catch it. But I sure did.

          "Try to do their best"? Is an obvious slam. And would have destroyed rapport.
          "They will do their best". Immediately opens the "But what if their best isn't good enough?", And "That nice Misterme is really complimentary about the other photographer...but...for some reason, I'm beginning to have my doubts..."

          You're right, the deal's probably gone anyway...but it sure was a powerful tool you used there. That may be the best example of creating doubt, invisibly, that I've ever seen.

          The copywriters here will see it instantly.

          My friend, never look for subtext when you read my posts. I'm not that smart.:rolleyes:
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  • Profile picture of the author Aaron Doud
    misterme

    I love subtle word play like that. If they have no doubts it won't do a thing. You didn't say anything bad about the other company.

    But if they have doubts your wording will bring them to the surface. Simple bait to pull the sale back in if it can still be won.
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  • Profile picture of the author Igor Fridrihs
    Hey Everybody

    Why so many posts are against NLP?

    Why do you think that using NLP equal manipulation?

    NLP is a normal tool to use. Just look at a hammer. You can use it
    to make something useful or you can hit somebody and harm a person.
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    • Profile picture of the author Calamaroo
      Originally Posted by Igor Fridrihs View Post

      Hey Everybody

      Why so many posts are against NLP?

      Why do you think that using NLP equal manipulation?
      NLP is evil.

      It is an unethical method that greedy and manipulative people have been using to trick you and the people that you deeply care about to give them your hard earned money. Frankly, you don't wanna know what great lengths these evil people do to screw you and your loved ones with their sneaky usage of very simple to learn and use NLP manipulation techniques.

      Even though some of these manipulation techniques are available for free online, I suggest that you stay away from them. I beg you, do not go to Bing to do a search on NLP.

      Do not attempt to learn more than you already do about NLP. If you do, you will become greedy and manipulative too. Plus, you may be tempted to use it to have sex with somebody else's hot wife or girlfriend. And that's not a win/win for their boyfriends and husbands. Study the Bible not NLP.
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by Calamaroo View Post

        NLP is evil.

        It is an unethical method that greedy and manipulative people have been using to trick you and the people that you deeply care about to give them your hard earned money. Frankly, you don't wanna know what great lengths these evil people do to screw you and your loved ones with their sneaky usage of very simple to learn and use NLP manipulation techniques.

        Even though some of these manipulation techniques are available for free online, I suggest that you stay away from them. I beg you, do not go to Bing to do a search on NLP.

        Do not attempt to learn more than you already do about NLP. If you do, you will become greedy and manipulative too. Plus, you may be tempted to use it to have sex with somebody else's hot wife or girlfriend. And that's not a win/win for their boyfriends and husbands. Study the Bible not NLP.
        This is a serious question. You are using several NLP techniques in your post. Are you being serious? Or are you being sarcastic?

        Again, this is a serious question.

        Added later; I just went back and read some of Calamaro's posts. He's insightful and smart. I think he's trying to be sarcastic here, and make a point. Very "Claudish" of you, I must say.

        Don't play with my emotions like that. I'm a fragile flower.
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      • Profile picture of the author Marvin Johnston
        Originally Posted by Calamaroo View Post

        NLP is evil.

        It is an unethical method that greedy and manipulative people have been using to trick you and the people that you deeply care about to give them your hard earned money. Frankly, you don't wanna know what great lengths these evil people do to screw you and your loved ones with their sneaky usage of very simple to learn and use NLP manipulation techniques.

        Even though some of these manipulation techniques are available for free online, I suggest that you stay away from them. I beg you, do not go to Bing to do a search on NLP.

        Do not attempt to learn more than you already do about NLP. If you do, you will become greedy and manipulative too. Plus, you may be tempted to use it to have sex with somebody else's hot wife or girlfriend. And that's not a win/win for their boyfriends and husbands. Study the Bible not NLP.
        Wow, what a pile of misinformation you are spewing forth.

        Oh wait, sorry I totally misunderstood. I didn't realize you were against all the propaganda being put forth being disguised as fact... national health care, gun control, abortion, gay rights, illegal immigrants, internet marketing, sales, doctors, drugs, newspaper advertising, direct mail, books, magazines, ...

        Marvin
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      • Profile picture of the author Igor Fridrihs
        Hey

        It's very interesting to read your post when you did use NLP Technics.
        So are you serious against NLP or just trying to influence all of us who read your post?
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      • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
        Originally Posted by Calamaroo View Post

        NLP is evil.

        It is an unethical method that greedy and manipulative people have been using to trick you and the people that you deeply care about to give them your hard earned money. Frankly, you don't wanna know what great lengths these evil people do to screw you and your loved ones with their sneaky usage of very simple to learn and use NLP manipulation techniques.

        Even though some of these manipulation techniques are available for free online, I suggest that you stay away from them. I beg you, do not go to Bing to do a search on NLP.

        Do not attempt to learn more than you already do about NLP. If you do, you will become greedy and manipulative too. Plus, you may be tempted to use it to have sex with somebody else's hot wife or girlfriend. And that's not a win/win for their boyfriends and husbands. Study the Bible not NLP.
        LOL. This post is full of NLP and embedded commands. I like it.

        I may have missed a few.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Dan McCoy View Post

          LOL. This post is full of NLP and embedded commands. I like it.

          I may have missed a few.

          Dan; You caught a couple more than I did. I think I was caught up in his "Web of sarcasm". Nicely done too.

          One thing I want to add (I just never tire of hearing myself talk)

          For every question/objection/concern there are several answers.

          A few answers create animosity, and kill the sale

          A few answers create an argument and almost always kill the sale

          A few answers answer the question, but don't move the sale forward.

          Very few answers solve the customer's concern/problem, and help move the sale forward...and out of these few answers, there is usually one that gives the clearest answer, the most complete thought, and also furthers the sale.

          And being "Natural" and "Winging it" are almost never the way to craft that best answer. And NLP, although not the only methodology (And maybe not even the shortest distance to the best answer) is certainly a tool that can help.

          Just remember, inside every Claude is a silver lining.
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          • Profile picture of the author DaniMc
            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            Dan; You caught a couple more than I did. I think I was caught up in his "Web of sarcasm. Nicely done too.

            Very few answers solve the customer's concern/problem, and help move the sale forward...and out of these few answers, there is usually one that gives the clearest answer, the most complete thought, and also furthers the sale.
            That's what I was thinking...he got you.

            It's one thing to type it out, it's another to be able to do it on the fly. I can't do it as well in speech and I think you just made an important distinction for me.

            Moving the sale forward...that's the objective. If I can't execute as well verbally, it's OK, as long as I move things forward. If I can get THEM to move it forward, the sale is made.

            My sales skills are low/amateur at best when compared to some. Although my sales are more on the organizational and selling ideas level, you just made a point that I can keep in mind and easily move towards.
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    • Profile picture of the author misterme
      Originally Posted by Igor Fridrihs View Post

      NLP is a normal tool to use. Just look at a hammer. You can use it
      to make something useful or you can hit somebody and harm a person.
      I don't get it either. I mean, in a sales situation, you can say this or you can say that. And some things you say will pay off better than other things. So we strive to say the right things that help make the sale. If NLP gives us a way to say things which has more influence, why is that a problem for people?

      Again, I haven't studied NLP but to think we should be limited only to saying things in a way that doesn't encourage a sale makes no sense whatsoever for a salesperson, does it? Not only that, but it means those people believe that their prospective clients are but puppets without minds of their own, whose wills are easily taken over, easily persuaded to do things they wouldn't do otherwise by some stranger they never met before talking to them.

      I say we're "manipulated" every day - and willingly so. So here's my challenge: Here in the western world we're fast approaching some major holidays: Thanksgiving and Christmas. On those days many visit family and eat certain foods and beverages. We engage in certain behaviors and rituals, from decorating a certain way, to listening to certain music, singing certain songs, church going, card sending and gift exchanging, maybe wearing certain clothes. Some of us actually bring a tree into our house. How strange is that?

      We greet people with statements we never say otherwise such as "Merry Christmas!" And even the most honest upright people lie to their own children telling them the gifts they gave them were actually given to them by a fictional character who only cares to stop by once a year. And that without even saying hello.

      The only reason you do any of this is because you've been manipulated into believing this is what you do. Oh you may declare you enjoy it or that it's your belief system but the fact remains you were once a clear slate and all this was affected upon you by others. So let's see you guys NOT do any of it. THEN you can talk about not manipulating people.
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  • Profile picture of the author RedShifted
    Yes I use NLP.

    Most people who say they don't use NLP, use NLP on a daily basis and have no idea they're even doing it.

    So any moron who says "NLP is evil" or "its manipulative" or "its too gimmicky" I have 1 word for you -

    You're a f##king idiot.

    There's no other way to say it.

    Have you ever built rapport with a person before? Have you ever tried to act like the person you're talking to? Like if they say "I like bodybuilding" you say "No way! I go to the gym everyday! (even though you really go twice a week)".

    Have you ever used social anchors like business credentials, certifications, degrees etc when trying to make a sale?

    Have you ever put a facebook like button on your website?

    What people don't realize, NLP is really just a form of subliminal marketing. And it is VERY POWERFUL when used properly. The problem is, most people don't know how to use it.

    I didn't get into NLP because of marketing. I got into it when I was in the seduction community. It got me to lose my virginity, it got me my first 3some, it got me my first gf. So OF COURSE, when I got into marketing, I immediately began applying NLP to my marketing.

    And guess what? If you think NLP is bad, there are thousands upon thousands upon thousands of credible, successful businesses using NLP on a daily basis.

    Just turn on the radio. Every 5 seconds you'll hear an ad. And in that add, in the background, if you listen closely, you'll often hear a barely audible phone ringing in the background. And they will often use the phone as an "anchor" during the pitch. Like at the end of the pitch, when they say "call this number" you hear a phone ringing again.

    Frank Kern is well known for using NLP. There are even videos breaking down some techniques he's famous for using.

    Geico uses NLP.

    Vince Offer, the shamwow guy used a TON of NLP in his infomericals. The real issue is, most people don't know shit about NLP. I can use it right in front of you, and you'd have no idea I was using NLP.

    You remember all those double entendres he used in his videos? He would use them over and over and over. Like "these salty nuts are great" "you're gonna love my salty nuts". His infomercials are PLAGUED with double entendres.

    In NLP, these are considered "pattern interupts".
    They interrupt a persons focus IMMEDIATELY.

    They make you focus INTENSELY on what was just said, as you try to decipher whether it was sexual.... or related to the product. But the point is they CATCH YOUR ATTENTION and make you *REMEMBER* what was said.

    Tons of businesses love to put logos on their sites from reputable companies.
    Thats NLP. Its using social anchors to increase your perceived social status.

    Also, there are videos online with guys who have decades of experience using NLP.
    I'm not talking about copywriters because copywriters suck at using NLP in face to face interactions. And thats the best way to use it. All my salesman use NLP, my websites, my videos, everything.

    If you want to see a real NLP pro in action, watch these videos. This guy Cajun, is well known in his industry for being a master at NLP. The "kino", everytime he touches a girl. His bodylanguage. He runs patterns on them. Most guys would watch him and say "he's just confident". But he got that way BECAUSE of NLP. Every single thing he is doing is scripted, the whole interaction is planned out before he even meets the girls. The lines like "you look like my sister" is a disqualification pattern. It forces the girl to qualify to you. Asking girls "do I look like a drug dealer" is for rapport building. Every single thing he is doing, is in one way or another, based on the foundations of NLP.

    Part I - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XBErW5NFUI (he comes in at 7:42)

    Part II - (videos gone for some odd reason).

    Part II is a thousand times better cause he runs a pattern on a girl at the top of a flight of stairs, and by the time he gets to the bottom of the stairs he already has her number.

    NLP is used by a lot of people, in a lot of industries, for various different reasons.
    You can use it to make friends, get a job, market a business, sell business, its one of the most valuable things a person can learn.

    The problem is, it takes years to learn.

    But I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt, before NLP I had no sex life.
    Before NLP I had no successful business, and wouldn't be making 1% of what I make today.

    -Redshifted

    ps. One last thing. Saying NLP is "manipulative" is like saying "marketing is manipulative". It makes absolutely no sense at all. The JOB of any good marketer is to persuade AKA >>> MANIPULATE people, so you can sell them shit. The presentations you make, your websites, your backlinks, like 90% of what a marketer do on a daily basis involves manipulation. Capitalism, in essence, is manipulation. Its based on the exchange of wealth from person A to person B. So if you're against manipulation, GTFO of this industry.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by RedShifted View Post

      I didn't get into NLP because of marketing. I got into it when I was in the seduction community. It got me to lose my virginity, it got me my first 3some, it got me my first gf. So OF COURSE, when I got into marketing, I immediately began applying NLP to my marketing.
      Redshifted; When I was a younger man, I also used..um...scripts to attract girls. It wasn't precisely NLP, but I learned later that it was using many of the same principles. In fact much of what "Mystery" teaches, I was doing. Except for "Peacocking" which was just way too much not me.

      Yes, it worked, and it worked well.

      The problem was, I wasn't really all that much like the person I was, when picking up girls. Sure, I would meet them, they would be fascinated with me for a night, and then I'd move on...and so would they.

      In selling, I don't really have to genuinely be like the image I'm projecting. I can pretend to be fascinated by a pet hamster, the same as anyone...for a few hours.

      But I'm wearing a mask, and masks get heavy.

      When looking for a relationship, I would always answer truthfully (although maybe a little nicer than I was thinking), so they got a real picture of who I was. And I really wanted to know who they were.

      Because, in selling...I can leave, and so can they. No harm done.

      But in a relationship? You simply can't be on 24 hours a day. Eventually, they find out that you don't give a sh!t about their beloved hamster.

      So in a sales situation? Absolutely. In business? Absolutely. Even in looking for one night stands...absolutely.

      But only ordinary people are always at their best.

      So after playing the field for a year or so, I decided to find someone that could tolerate me, really.

      I still was "clever, game playing Claude" for a few minutes, enough to separate myself as someone to talk to...but then I would just act like me.

      And eventually, I found someone who liked that. And she wouldn't have liked the guy I was pretending to be. Just a thought.

      I may even be way off base, or even missing a major part of NLP, that would change my mind.


      Originally Posted by Dan McCoy View Post

      This guy is your hero eh?

      That's not NLP... That's just douchebag 101.

      Welcome to the forum. Now and then we have someone like you come through here. It doesn't take long for the truth to come out.
      Yeah, there was no NLP there. Some people use yelling as part of their business. Hyper demanding people actually do get better results, at least when purchasing in huge volumes like that. And he's obviously wealthy, so maybe that's expected in certain situations.

      I know I'd never deal with someone like that. No need. But I can see where someone (especially an employee) would put up with it. Imagine how much fun it was for the interpreter.:rolleyes:

      And maybe the suppliers were pulling something. Who knows.
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      • Profile picture of the author misterme
        Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

        Some people use yelling as part of their business.
        What I got out of that video was, first of all, his berating, demanding and yelling at the Chinese suppliers was his way of handling their shortchanging him with damaged goods. Apparently, they've done this to him before. But he's the one that chooses to continue to do business with them. And he's the one that chooses in which manner, out of all options, is how he'll handle it.

        His taking apart the shower head stand was a tactic to strip down a commodity to its base commodities and have them price per the base pieces, which drove down its value. Cool tactic, but why the suppliers didn't bring up that the shower head stand doesn't miraculously appear in their warehouse by itself, that its cost isn't limited to merely the item's components, that is, bring up everything and anything at all about their operation needing to get a fair price, but instead remained quiet and accepted his evaluation, I can only guess.

        So my guess is that they may have been playing to the camera, as this is what the show was about. Even if they weren't, we don't know for sure what else may have occurred since it's edited footage. We only know what they staged for us and/ or what the show producers decided we'd see. After all, it's a TV show.
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  • Profile picture of the author charleswoodway
    I use the products of Michael Neil. Books like 'you can have what you want' Inspired my NLP but less technical and yet still really good content
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  • Profile picture of the author TheBigBee
    Let me just posit this... NLP is and has been part of American politics. Look at the Reagan re-election commercials of 1984. Listen to Obama's most memorable campaign speeches.

    If "the powers that be" use this to persuade legions of people to make decisions that ultimately may work against them, why can't we use NLP to persuade business owners to make decisions that may work for them?

    Me personally, NLP scares me. Too much knowledge of the brain and how it works will render me to some eccentric dude with dandruff and coffee stained shirts writing diatribes on obscure blogs.
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  • Profile picture of the author jazbo
    People have always known how to manipulate things to their own ends. NLP works. So does learning how people react in their mannerisms.

    We are far more open to influence than we realise.

    The only NLP I use every day is to reframe things into being positive.
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