+++Who Else Is Being Fooled By Google's Keyword Tools

14 years ago

I agree that the data is not correct.

Awhile ago I found an amazing keyword with the tool and quickly made a website and built some links. When I got to the #1 position in Google and saw ZERO traffic I was pissed. This has happened to me a few times so the data is really hard to trust anymore.

Thanks
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GeorgR.

14 years ago

Originally Posted by aaron_nimocks

I agree that the data is not correct.

Awhile ago I found an amazing keyword with the tool and quickly made a website and built some links. When I got to the #1 position in Google and saw ZERO traffic I was pissed. This has happened to me a few times so the data is really hard to trust anymore.

did the google tool suggest it had a high search volume?

What does market samurai spit out?

Thanks

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niac7

14 years ago

Yeh, and I notice more and more people posting similar situations.

Maybe they'll improve the SKTool, which is more accurate (when it decides to work).

Until then, we may just me rolling the dice on the Micro Niche sites.

Thanks
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Joe118 14 years ago
If you don't trust Google's own tool, maybe you should trust websites that are explicitly competing for the search term, and also advertisers that are bidding for that term.

You can determine the number of websites that are actively trying to rank for a term by the following procedure:
1. Go to Google and click Settings->Search Settings
2. Set google to display 100 results at once
3. Then search for allinanchor:"your search phrase" (note the " around your search term, you want that)
4. Go to page 10 of the results, it will show you e.g. result 200-241 of 241.
So in that case 241 pages have back links that contain the search phrase in the anchor text and are likely to be trying to actually rank for that phrase.

If the number is small (for me less than 50), and google says the amount of traffic is small (for me less than 1K/mo), then I'd skip that search phrase and niche.
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kevinw1

14 years ago

I have a suspicion that the GAKT search numbers include searches on sites like Amazon which use the Google search engine for their internal search. Why do I think that? Because exact multi-word brand name/title/model number searches show ridiculously high search numbers which don't reflect organic traffic results.

Thanks
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dburk

14 years ago

Originally Posted by niac7

Basically, this attachment is stating that the info in the Keyword Tool is based on ALL Google Searches. Although it doesn't specify, this probably means searches from:

the main site,
image searches,
map searches,
mobile searches,
searches from sites that include a Google powered search function.

Who knows what else?!

Hi niac7,

While the data includes searches from a variety of locations, they all serve SERPs that can send targeted traffic to your web page. It seems to me that it would be more accurate to include this data rather than exclude it.

Originally Posted by aaron_nimocks

I agree that the data is not correct.

Awhile ago I found an amazing keyword with the tool and quickly made a website and built some links. When I got to the #1 position in Google and saw ZERO traffic I was pissed. This has happened to me a few times so the data is really hard to trust anymore.

Hi Aaron,

I suspect that you weren't using the tool properly. It was designed to aid AdWords advertisers so the default settings do not return the data you were seeking. Try using the exact match option and you will get the data you need for organic listings.

Originally Posted by Joe118

If you don't trust Google's own tool, maybe you should trust websites that are explicitly competing for the search term, and also advertisers that are bidding for that term.

You can determine the number of websites that are actively trying to rank for a term by the following procedure:

Go to Google and click Settings->Search Settings
Set google to display 100 results at once
Then search for allinanchor:"your search phrase" (note the " around your search term, you want that)
Go to page 10 of the results, it will show you e.g. result 200-241 of 241.

So in that case 241 pages have back links that contain the search phrase in the anchor text and are likely to be trying to actually rank for that phrase.

If the number is small (for me less than 50), and google says the amount of traffic is small (for me less than 1K/mo), then I'd skip that search phrase and niche.

Hi Joe,

While you offer some good advice, you still need the number of searches to do the analysis that you suggest.

If you change the number of results per page to 100 it will significantly slow your searches. There is an easier way to find the actual number of indexed pages. Just add:

Code:

&start=990

to the end of your URL. Or you can use this handy little tool I built to format the search queries for you:
Serious Names - Tools

Originally Posted by kevinw1

I have a suspicion that the GAKT search numbers include searches on sites like Amazon which use the Google search engine for their internal search. Why do I think that? Because exact multi-word brand name/title/model number searches show ridiculously high search numbers which don't reflect organic traffic results.

Hi kevinw1,

I believe that site searches are not part of this data. Site searches are part of the Content Network which is excluded from the Keyword tool data.

[ 1 ] Thanks
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niac7

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Joe118

If you don't trust Google's own tool, maybe you should trust websites that are explicitly competing for the search term, and also advertisers that are bidding for that term.

You can determine the number of websites that are actively trying to rank for a term by the following procedure:

Go to Google and click Settings->Search Settings
Set google to display 100 results at once
Then search for allinanchor:"your search phrase" (note the " around your search term, you want that)
Go to page 10 of the results, it will show you e.g. result 200-241 of 241.

So in that case 241 pages have back links that contain the search phrase in the anchor text and are likely to be trying to actually rank for that phrase.

If the number is small (for me less than 50), and google says the amount of traffic is small (for me less than 1K/mo), then I'd skip that search phrase and niche.

Good advice for determining competition. I'll definitely add that to my competition analysis.

Originally Posted by kevinw1

I have a suspicion that the GAKT search numbers include searches on sites like Amazon which use the Google search engine for their internal search. Why do I think that? Because exact multi-word brand name/title/model number searches show ridiculously high search numbers which don't reflect organic traffic results.

I wouldn't doubt it at all. We can never really know for sure.

Originally Posted by dburk

Hi niac7,

While the data includes searches from a variety of locations, they all serve SERPs that can send targeted traffic to your web page. It seems to me that it would be more accurate to include this data rather than exclude it.

Thanks for the response. Let me demonstrate the problem with this by giving an example.

Say, I am a niche marketer and I find a nice little niche called "Indoor Electric Grill".

GAKT shows EXACT search numbers as 4,400 Local Searches.

Nice...so we think.

Now, that same exact term in SKTool shows the search results as only 440.

This means that only 10% of the Search Volume in GAKT's numbers are actually from the Google Search page.

The other 90% of the searches could be from Image Searches, Book Searches, searches on other sites that use Google Search, or any other unknown source.

If only 440 searches are coming to the actual Google Page, then my 1st page ranking loses quite a bit of its value.

It is still possibly to make money from this traffic, but it is much harder since you have 90% less traffic than you thought you would have.

This is not an isolated example either. There are many. The rare example is when the numbers actually come close to matching.

So, searches from other sources are irrelevant unless my site is shown in those results too (Image Results, Shopping Results, Book Results, etc.)

Optimization for Google's main SERPs page is not the same as optimization for Image SERPs or any other SERPs for that matter.

Also, search results are not the same for those Google searches at people's websites. I do not know why, but I did test this.

I searched a term on Google and then searched the same term on a little site that used Google for search and chose "Search Web". The SERPs were entirely different.

So the only data that matters is the one that gets us the traffic from Google's main page. Anything else is pure speculation. We may or may not benefit from the othr traffic. When it comes to this type of business, there is no room for that type of uncertainty.

It appears that SKTool is the closest thing that we have. GAKT is designed for people paying for Adwords, which means their ads WILL show on ALL of these different Search Networks. But our organic listings aren't provided the same luxury.

Thanks
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dburk

14 years ago

Hi niac7,

I hear what you are saying, the problem is that you are comparing apples to oranges. The SKTool and GAKT use different sources for data, but it's not just different sources, they report different types of data as well. The GAKT reports keyword search query volume, while the SKTool reports traffic from specific keywords. These are not even close to being comparable. It's like the difference from Gross Sales verses Net Profit, you cannot look at the two different types of data as a one on one comparison.

It would be unusual for these two very different types of data to be even close to the same. It doesn't mean that that one is correct and the other isn't. About half of all searches do not even result in a click. That data is not included in the SKTool report and it is included in AdWords Keyword Tool.

These two different sets of data are useful, but I can understand how it might confuse someone if they thought these tools were reporting the same type of data.

These links provide some specific information about the data that is being reported by these two different tools, you may find this information helpful:

How does the Search-based Keyword Tool differ from the Keyword Tool in AdWords? - Search-based Keyword Tool Help
What should I know about the Keyword Tool's search volume statistics? - AdWords Help
What statistics can I see for my Keyword Tool results? - AdWords Help

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niac7

14 years ago

Originally Posted by dburk

Hi niac7,

I hear what you are saying, the problem is that you are comparing apples to oranges. The SKTool and GAKT use different sources for data, but it's not just different sources, they report different types of data as well. The GAKT reports keyword search query volume, while the SKTool reports traffic from specific keywords. These are not even close to being comparable. It's like the difference from Gross Sales verses Net Profit, you cannot look at the two different types of data as a one on one comparison.

It would be unusual for these two very different types of data to be even close to the same. It doesn't mean that that one is correct and the other isn't. About half of all searches do not even result in a click. That data is not included in the SKTool report and it is included in AdWords Keyword Tool.

These two different sets of data are useful, but I can understand how it might confuse someone if they thought these tools were reporting the same type of data.

These links provide some specific information about the data that is being reported by these two different tools, you may find this information helpful:

How does the Search-based Keyword Tool differ from the Keyword Tool in AdWords? - Search-based Keyword Tool Help
What should I know about the Keyword Tool's search volume statistics? - AdWords Help
What statistics can I see for my Keyword Tool results? - AdWords Help

Hey dburk,

Thanks for the response.

So that I'm clear....You're saying that SKTool actually reports the traffic (meaning clicks) from a keyword, while the GAKT provides the actual search volume. Is that right?

So, in my example above, the GAKT numbers reflect how many times the term was actually searched across all channels: 4400 searches.

Then the SKTool estimates how many clicks were generated (to Adwords ads, I presume). Meaning about 440 Adwords were clicked out of those 4400 searches, roughly.

That does make sense.

However, it still leaves us with a little guess work. Based on this new info, it appears that they are both pulling stats from all sources.

I guess we just have to realize that their tool is designed for Advertisers and not the Organic guys.

Which also makes sense.

Oh well, the good news, if I understand correctly, is that the example above means that only 10% of the traffic resulted in Adwords clicks. That means the other 90% might have clicked elsewhere.

Let me know if I got that straight. Thanks for the clarification.

Thanks

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321sitemonitor.com

14 years ago

I have heard the same bug couple of months ago. I don;t use it personally but i have heard much about Yahoo's and G's keyword tools. SO i don't think it wrong if you are finding problem in it.

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gordi555

14 years ago

Yep, I found this. Now I always use their figure and take 90% off. Normally get the true figure using this method! It's a shame because now I don't want to give my time to anything that has lower then 5,000 local searches even though I would really be into the niche.

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wetday

14 years ago

To help reduce how much you are fooled I recommend that you use multiple tools such as estibot to get an idea of search volume there as well.

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Jacob Martus

14 years ago

Wow. This really sucks. No wonder my pages with amazon specific products as my keywords that are on page 1 of Google are getting hardly any action at all. The keyword tool showed close to 8000 searches for a specific product on Google. Yet I'm only getting like 3 hits a week from that keyword and im on page 1.

So basically, whatever the keyword tool gives us...we should take off 90% and thats the amount of searches the actual google search engine is receiving?

Thanks
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niac7

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Jacob Martus

Wow. This really sucks. No wonder my pages with amazon specific products as my keywords that are on page 1 of Google are getting hardly any action at all. The keyword tool showed close to 8000 searches for a specific product on Google. Yet I'm only getting like 3 hits a week from that keyword and im on page 1.

So basically, whatever the keyword tool gives us...we should take off 90% and thats the amount of searches the actual google search engine is receiving?

Not sure. That's the problem.

This changes my strategy on finding some of those "long-tail" keywords.

It's possible that a lot of those 8000 searches for that Amazon product are being made in Google's Shopping section or something.

Thanks

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Oling

14 years ago

Great Thread! it is no wonder that some of my keywords I took from GKword tools are getting much of a traffic. some of them has it at 8000 searches a month locally but I hardly get visitors to my site.

Thanks for the eye opener
Oling

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niac7

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Oling

Great Thread! it is no wonder that some of my keywords I took from GKword tools are getting much of a traffic. some of them has it at 8000 searches a month locally but I hardly get visitors to my site.

Thanks for the eye opener
Oling

Yeh Oling,

This seems to be a common theme for a lot of people here.

Sometimes the numbers are right and sometimes they are not.

This is why alot of people are making money with some of their sites and not others, despite following the same formula.

I guess you'd just have to crank out tons of these niche sites and hope for enough winners to offset your costs from the losers.

I guess that is the nature of business.

I guess, we'd have to research how much traffic a website that is on the first page is getting for the particular keyword. That would be a better measure.

I think there is a tool for that, but I can't remember it. I'll keep you guys posted if I am able to find it again.

Thanks

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petelta

14 years ago

Im going with market samurai for the next month and will see how the results play out

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niac7 14 years ago
***Update***

Found a lot more info on Googles Keyword ToolSSS.

Yes, I meant to put 3 Ss.

Turns out that aside from the SKTool, there are actually THREE (3) versions of the GAKT.

https://adwords.google.com/support/a...n&answer=25844

This next page gives you more info about the results. It also reiterates that these Search Volume results are for queries from Google and the entire "Search Network".

https://adwords.google.com/support/a...y?answer=25148

Here's a little info on the "Search Network".

https://adwords.google.com/support/a...y?answer=90956

Lastly, I stumbled upon a confusing stat that may be of significance.

It would be better to see it for yourself and maybe someone can explain it to me. Maybe, I'm missing something.
1. Choose your Favorite Keyword and plug it into GAKT.
2. Check off the Top 5 Keywords that come up.
3. Download those 5 to an Excel Spreadsheet.
4. Record the Volume in the Local Search Column
5. Record the Volume in the "Estimate Impressions" Column
I'm confused on why these numbers are different. I'm also confused on if these are Monthly numbers in the "Estimated Impressions" column.

For Example:

I searched "Printable Coupons" and downloaded the top 5 results.

Printable Coupons shows:

201,000 Local Searches
882 Estimated Impressions

Free Coupons shows:

90,500 Local Searches
1208 Esimated Impressions

:confused:

So, Printable Coupons has more searches, but an Advertiser can only expect 882 Impressions? per month? per day?

But why can the same advertiser expect more Estimated Impressions for a term with lower search volume.

I've been searching Google for more info on these stats. I'll keep searching, but maybe someone can enlighten me.

Keep in mind, this is not stopping my marketing and it shouldnt stop anyone from taking action on a strategy.

It just makes you more efficient when you have a full grasp of the data that you are working with. Keyword volume is our lifeblood, so we need sure we are getting the right blood-type.
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homejobcreator 14 years ago

I think it's time for me to go to bed instead of reading this - I'll look into my 'inadequate' search numbers tomorrow ... it's after midnight here.

But thanks for the info, didn't know that it could be as high as 90% inaccurate!
- Thanks
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Craig McPherson

14 years ago

I have to say that it works the other way sometimes.

I found a phrase that MS said gets 580 seaches a day.
I did a small Adwords campaign and have averaged 2,300 impressions a day.

Now just to monetize the little sucker and I would be laughing.

Thanks
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niac7

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Craig McPherson

I have to say that it works the other way sometimes.

I found a phrase that MS said gets 580 seaches a day.
I did a small Adwords campaign and have averaged 2,300 impressions a day.

Now just to monetize the little sucker and I would be laughing.

You're absolutely right.

It is Hit or Miss...

Guess you got a good hit.

I think the lesson from this is to SEO your site for more than just the main search Organic results. You should be trying to Rank in as many Google Search types as possible: Web Search, Image Search, Video Search, etc.

The more of these areas that you rank in, the better your chances at picking up more and more of that search volume.

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mejohn

14 years ago

I actually like Google's Keyword Tool. I used to hate it before I found that you can search by exact results, rather than just broad. I have consistantly found that if I am in #1 position in the Google search results, I get roughly 11% of the exact search numbers. The broad search Keyword Tool rusults are out to lunch.

Thanks

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+++Who Else Is Being Fooled By Google's Keyword Tools

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