Are these sites in the SERP really weak?

by Sokar
16 replies
  • SEO
  • |
I did some keyword research and i sometimes end up with results with top 3 rankings which looks really weak ( low backlinks and PR ) traffic on alexa was really bad too. But sometimes i see these "weak" sites beating big names such as ehow with subdomains of my keyword ,wikipedia etc. The dates that those sites are registered are not new too. Newest i seen is 2005.

How are these sites beating the big names? Or does google think that the weak domains are more targetted to my keywords? But those big sites have subdomains with my keyword too. In this kind of situation, would you guys consider it a good keyword to work on?

I welcome all suggestions
#serp #sites #weak
  • Profile picture of the author PhilipSEO
    Originally Posted by Sokar View Post

    I did some keyword research and i sometimes end up with results with top 3 rankings which looks really weak ( low backlinks and PR ) traffic on alexa was really bad too. But sometimes i see these "weak" sites beating big names such as ehow with subdomains of my keyword ,wikipedia etc. The dates that those sites are registered are not new too. Newest i seen is 2005.

    How are these sites beating the big names? Or does google think that the weak domains are more targetted to my keywords? But those big sites have subdomains with my keyword too. In this kind of situation, would you guys consider it a good keyword to work on?

    I welcome all suggestions
    First of all, please forget about Alexa, it is meaningless and no one of repute will take you seriously if you keep referring to it. Read this Alexa FAQ to find out why it's worthless.

    Secondly, it's impossible to to answer your question without knowing the keywords and the domains. You say those websites' link profiles are weak, but the fact that you are referring to Alexa suggests that you are not experienced in SEO and therefore may not be in a good position to judge the quality of their links.
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    • Profile picture of the author Sokar
      Originally Posted by PhilipSEO View Post

      First of all, please forget about Alexa, it is meaningless and no one of repute will take you seriously if you keep referring to it.

      Secondly, it's impossible to to answer your question without knowing the keywords and the domains. You say those websites' link profiles are weak, but the fact that you are referring to Alexa suggests that you are not experienced in SEO and therefore may not be in a good position to judge the quality of their links.
      So if i don't refer to Alexa, is it a better choice to go with yahoo site explorer?
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      • Profile picture of the author PhilipSEO
        Originally Posted by Sokar View Post

        So if i don't refer to Alexa, is it a better choice to go with yahoo site explorer?
        Well if you want to do serious backlink analysis, Yahoo Site Explorer is a good start. Unfortunately, there is no perfect backlink analysis tool. Google's link: operator is useless and can safely be ignored.

        Remember, it's not about the "number of backlinks." a lot of backlinks are just noise. In some cases, even a single great link can drive all or most of a website's rankings.

        Here is how you might use YSE to find a site's best backlinks:

        1. Install some free plugin that shows SEO data on search results. I use SEOquake in Firefox (good and free), but there are others.

        2. The plugin should normally be turned off, so as not to drive the search enginges crazy.

        3. Go to YSE and run the link analysis query (filter out internal links -- that's the "except from this domain" setting, and set it to return links to all the pages of the website, not just the home page).

        4. Turn on the pligin and refresh the page.

        5. Sort the results in descending order of PR.

        6. Turn off the plugin: you don't want Yahoo to start denying you service because you are sending automatic queries.

        7. Links from pages with the highest PR will be at the top.

        8. Some plugins show you which links are nofollow and some don't. One way or another, you need to ignore the links that are nofollow.

        9. In general, the dofollow links with the highest PR are the site's best links (though in reality it can be much more complicated than this).

        The problem with YSE is that it is expected to be dropped by Yahoo within a year.

        The link analysis tool of the new generation will be the SEOmoz Open Site Explorer, which is brand new but will eventually become much more powerful (and it is pretty great already). The paid version of OSE lets you browse 10,000 links, and the free one only 1,000 (same as YSE). OSE does its own spidering of the Web but it hasn't found as many links as Yahoo yet, and it gets updated much less frequently (1ce a month, I think). But never mind that, I am sure SEOmoz will work it up into the tool of the future. Unlike YSE, OSE shows link anchor text and lets you filter out nofollow links -- a very helpful feature.

        I hope this helps!
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        • Profile picture of the author Sokar
          Thanks PhilipSEO for your tips.
          I am now down to one question. When using yahoo site explorer, do i paste the entire link with the subdomains?
          eg : [ www . wikipedia . org / wiki / abcdefg ]
          OR do i just search for
          :[ www . wikipedia . org]
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        • Profile picture of the author PhilipSEO
          Oops, there was a bad, bad typo in the word "whole" above. Ahem, no offense intended, forgive me.
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          • Profile picture of the author Jacob Martus
            Originally Posted by PhilipSEO View Post

            Oops, there was a bad, bad typo in the word "whole" above. Ahem, no offense intended, forgive me.
            Yeah I saw it the whore time.
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  • Profile picture of the author verbose
    If you mean their links are weak are you talking about number or quality of links. I saw a site that was number 2 in a competive niche. Number 1 was wiki. The other sites are xxxx amount of links or higher. The number 2 had around xx linkis but in its links it had 1 Pr6 authority site link and a couple of Pr4's with rest below PR4.
    Quality of Links is important
    Signature

    I love to take something simple and make it as complicated as I can.

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    • Profile picture of the author Sokar
      Originally Posted by verbose View Post

      If you mean their links are weak are you talking about number or quality of links. I saw a site that was number 2 in a competive niche. Number 1 was wiki. The other sites are xxxx amount of links or higher. The number 2 had around xx linkis but in its links it had 1 Pr6 authority site link and a couple of Pr4's with rest below PR4.
      Quality of Links is important

      Hmm.. i seen pages ranking with 10+ backlinks all PR0-PR2 before.. and they beat wiki. Any thoughts on that?
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      • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
        Originally Posted by Sokar View Post

        Hmm.. i seen pages ranking with 10+ backlinks all PR0-PR2 before.. and they beat wiki. Any thoughts on that?
        Different markets equals different algo calculations - from my observations.

        Credit repair has some sort of filter to keep, let's say, 7 "company" sites out of 10.

        Lower importance keywords can be inside another "package" with different calculations, let's say 3 "company" sites out of 10.

        Sometimes these sites do not have high number of backlinks, or high authority backlinks, STILL they manage to keep top rankings - which then brings them backlinks and/or authority cause people start creating articles about them, backlinking them, etc etc.

        In fact this is a smart and natural move from Google to avoid a domination of top 10 by clever SEO's.

        Just my 2 cents from daily observations since 2004.
        Signature
        People make good money selling to the rich. But the rich got rich selling to the masses.
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        • Profile picture of the author Sokar
          Originally Posted by Fernando Veloso View Post


          Sometimes these sites do not have high number of backlinks, or high authority backlinks, STILL they manage to keep top rankings - which then brings them backlinks and/or authority cause people start creating articles about them, backlinking them, etc etc.

          In fact this is a smart and natural move from Google to avoid a domination of top 10 by clever SEO's.

          Just my 2 cents from daily observations since 2004.
          Yea.. thanks for the evaluation dude.. But a question that's been on my mind is how are these sites that do not have high number of backlinks, or high authority backlinks still manage to beat tough sites.. It's very interesting to see how a simple page beats big names
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  • Profile picture of the author FiverrGuru
    google tries to rank different media sites in the top 10, all offering various information on the subject.

    also note that exact match and domains with keywords in them rank better.
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    • Profile picture of the author Sokar
      Originally Posted by FiverrGuru View Post

      google tries to rank different media sites in the top 10, all offering various information on the subject.

      also note that exact match and domains with keywords in them rank better.
      Just a little thought here.. is it possible to beat big sites with a domain of
      [ www . my keyword . com ] with decent amount of quality backlinks? or should i just avoid keywords that have sites like them in the SERP
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      • Profile picture of the author FiverrGuru
        Originally Posted by Sokar View Post

        Just a little thought here.. is it possible to beat big sites with a domain of
        [ www . my keyword . com ] with decent amount of quality backlinks? or should i just avoid keywords that have sites like them in the SERP
        Extremely hard, especially if they're old and exact match domain.
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        • Profile picture of the author Sokar
          Originally Posted by FiverrGuru View Post

          Extremely hard, especially if they're old and exact match domain.
          Hi FiverrGuru. I think you misunderstood my sentence, my bad what i meant was if i have a [ www . my keyword . com ] as MY domain, would i be able to beat [ www . wikipedia . org / my keyword ] <--- for example.
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  • Profile picture of the author pandorasbox
    The other thing is niche links beat normal links of most PR and most will say not, also high pr doesnt matter if you post to many links to the same sight and also website size is a big factor. So, links is not the issue. I have seen a website with page rank 5 with only 20 links and another website in same page on top 10 with about a thousand links.
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