Yesterday was a GREAT Day for SEO... and me! Its About Time!

129 replies
  • SEO
  • |
Man, I got all kind of google love with this latest update. Of all my sites, not one lost a single ranking for a single keyword. Interestingly, the sites around me bounced around.

I now have one site where I rank #1 for a single word keyword that gets 200K searches a month. I was #9, so I was competitive, but I am now #1.

Am I lucky? Am I a master SEO? NO!!! I simply do things according to the way google wants them done.

Here is what google taught us last year. Fix you on page issues. They were nice in doing this. They new that a link based algo change would do damage to well meaning webmasters with bad site structure.

So, they gave us an opportunity to fix those issues with Panda. Panda wasnt a bad thing. It forced us to create good sites from a content and architecture perspective.

After Panda was finished running its course, they switched to a link based algo change. Remember last week with the Negative SEO stuff? Remember the guy with the neg. SEO on the auto website? A lot of people missed the key point in that thread. This amazing Negative SEO admitted he only goes after sites with bad structure and on page issues. In other words, google prepared us for this a year ago!

As far as link building. Here is what I do not do:
No link wheels
No articles
No blog commenting
No "Public" blog networks
No Forum Profiles
No Wikis
No Web 2.0's
No spun content whatsoever
No over optimized anchor text
No EMD's

Basically, any service you can buy off Fiverr or WF, I do not use. If it can be automated or done cheap, then it is spam! You might not like that but it is true.

Here is what I do do

I vary my anchor text, and do most of my links with no anchor text. Lets face it. Google knows the only people who use anchor text are webmasters and SEOs. Real people dont use anchor text. Crap, I run a forum and link to other sites with the URL and no anchor text cause I am too lazy to use anchor text.

Guest Blogging
Yup. I take the time to contact bloggers and offer to write content for them. Takes a lot of time. But it works GREAT!

Private Networks
One thing I like to do is create my own network of sites. These arent in the fashion of BMR or ALN. These sites have tons of GREAT content, every one of them is branded, uses social media (only engaging social media) and have active readers and RSS subscribers.

These sites link to my money sites.

Branding
I use this one a lot. I brand everything! Create brand signals through social media - even offline promotion. Build branding through other webmasters, whatever. Just send strong signals that you area a brand.

Directories
I do use directories, but only niche and paid directories. I submit sites to the Yahoo directory $499. I submit my sites to Best of the Web $299. I submit my sites to other more niche directories where there is the possibility of the directory not taking my submission.

A lot of people say you have to have all those different backlinks to have a diverse backlink portfolio. That is a lie and misinterpretation. What you need is backlinks from multiple sites, not different types of backlinks.

Build links by hand. Build authority sites, not thin affiliate sites.

Google is now forcing people to do SEO the right way, and it is only going to get harder to spam and game the system. For a lot of you, it was a great ride. This new algo change is going to test all of us and weed out a lot of internet marketers who only know how to game a system instead of working within it.
#day #great #seo #time #yesterday
  • Profile picture of the author Rafay Zafar
    How much was your per month cost on seo and content?
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by Bad___Boy View Post

      How much was your per month cost on seo and content?
      I do most everything myself, including writing. I dont trust any one else with my content, because I understand the importance it has in ranking.

      Really, the investment is time. I spends lots of time working while everyone else is sleeping. It pays off big, though.
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      • Profile picture of the author aygabtu
        Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

        I do most everything myself, including writing. I dont trust any one else with my content, because I understand the importance it has in ranking.

        Really, the investment is time. I spends lots of time working while everyone else is sleeping. It pays off big, though.

        Promoting your own site, whether you pay someone to generate backlinks and articles or you do it yourself is considered black hat. All links should be done naturally through visitors to your site that were impressed with it. Not by you spending hours a day posting links all over.

        Google wants natural link building. You posting 99% of the links is not natural.
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        Check top 300 Google SERP results free. WhatsMySERP.com tracks and graphs changes for multiple domains/keywords/regions. Also includes advanced keyword density tool.

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        • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
          Originally Posted by aygabtu View Post

          Promoting your own site, whether you pay someone to generate backlinks and articles or you do it yourself is considered black hat. All links should be done naturally through visitors to your site that were impressed with it. Not by you spending hours a day posting links all over.

          Google wants natural link building. You posting 99% of the links is not natural.
          I dont post links all over, just in certain places. Also, I do not build thousands of links, just handfuls. That is all it takes, really.
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          • Profile picture of the author aygabtu
            Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

            I dont post links all over, just in certain places. Also, I do not build thousands of links, just handfuls. That is all it takes, really.
            What do you do if you are competing against sites that have been around for 10 years, with a million backlinks? Do you really think you or anyone is going to get in the top 10 waiting on real users to post links to your site or posting a few links yourself?

            It is ridiculous to penalize quality sites for trying to promote themselves, but google does it, although you are free to pay them to promote you through adwords.
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            Check top 300 Google SERP results free. WhatsMySERP.com tracks and graphs changes for multiple domains/keywords/regions. Also includes advanced keyword density tool.

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            • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
              Originally Posted by shayman View Post

              I think you're being smug a little too soon Mr Rex.
              Not being smug at all. I am pointing out that if you play by the rules, even when others are not, it will eventually work in your favor.

              Originally Posted by aygabtu View Post

              What do you do if you are competing against sites that have been around for 10 years, with a million backlinks? Do you really think you or anyone is going to get in the top 10 waiting on real users to post links to your site or posting a few links yourself?
              The site where I am currently #1 for the one word keyword. My site has 760 backlinks. The other sites on the first page have between 10K and 200K backlinks.

              The number of backlinks is not important bay itself. It is the quality of the backlinks. So, 760 high quality backlinks trumps 100K low quality backlinks.

              As for age. When I build a site, I only buy domains that are at least six years old So all my sites are...old.

              You have to change your thinking!
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              • Profile picture of the author LadyJoy
                What are your favorites sources where you find your domain names which are six years or older
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                • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
                  Originally Posted by JeanneLynn View Post

                  Mr.Rex, you should post your site, so we can see a good example of what Google wants. I'd love to take a peek.
                  Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

                  It's not just a website, don't forget. He 'builds businesses.' How many people hide their business? Unless he's AFRAID
                  Originally Posted by JeanneLynn View Post

                  Why would he be afraid? He should just post it. I'm honestly curious to see his business.
                  Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

                  Me too. I wish to emulate his success.
                  Yea lets ask Ryan Diess' opinion of outing a site.

                  Originally Posted by LadyJoy View Post

                  What are your favorites sources where you find your domain names which are six years or older
                  Godaddy auctions. You can sort by age and keyword.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
        Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

        I spends lots of time working while everyone else is sleeping. It pays off big, though.
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        BS free SEO services, training and advice - SEO Point

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  • Profile picture of the author lniskasaari
    Good for you and congrats!

    Celebrate as long as you can because the allmighty google can punish you any time as we`ve seen...

    -Lauri-
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  • Profile picture of the author JSProjects
    Nice post. However, there are plenty of people that do the same thing who are getting hammered by Google right now. I think Google is kind of "all over the place" right now.
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  • Profile picture of the author cagliostro
    Directories are totally useless. They have been replaced a long time by Search Engines and mainly Google.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by cagliostro View Post

      Directories are totally useless. They have been replaced a long time by Search Engines and mainly Google.
      Have you tested this theory with multiple sites? How many sites have you submitted to paid directories like Yahoo and BOTW only to see them lose rank?

      Statements like yours are narrow sited, not to be rude, but did I mention "Branding?"
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    • Profile picture of the author mosthost
      Originally Posted by cagliostro View Post

      Directories are totally useless. They have been replaced a long time by Search Engines and mainly Google.
      Keep dreaming. I still bring in considerable dollars from websites that primarily have backlinks from directories. Directories with decent PR are still very much a value.
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    • Profile picture of the author inter123
      If you have the cash to invest then great otherwise get out of the kitchen.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

        If you have the cash to invest then great otherwise get out of the kitchen.
        Wrong. If you are not willing to invest the time into a legit online business, with proper focus on organic visibility, then get out of the kitchen.
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        • Profile picture of the author inter123
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

          Wrong. If you are not willing to invest the time into a legit online business, with proper focus on organic visibility, then get out of the kitchen.
          What claptrap.

          Sure you need to put in the time but without the cash to invest, you are on a boat, in the middle of the lake without a paddle.

          At least the spinning backlink option, it allowed people to enter the market with low levels of investment.
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          • Profile picture of the author dp40oz
            Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

            What claptrap.

            Sure you need to put in the time but without the cash to invest, you are on a boat, in the middle of the lake without a paddle.

            At least the spinning backlink option, it allowed people to enter the market with low levels of investment.
            You do have a point here. Google is going in the direction of everything else. Those who have the money to play the game succeed. Building a true organic presence for high competition niches requires a lot of time and money. Also think who has the money to hire the best writers, the best researchers the best graphic designers. If Google succeeds in their game plan the SERP's will become like strip malls. With big companies owning the best rankings. Now is that right or wrong?... It just is. I personally don't have a problem with it but its the way of the world.

            If I search 36 inch LED TV, maybe your blog has great insight but I probably want bestbuy.com to come up.
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            • Profile picture of the author inter123
              Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

              You do have a point here. Google is going in the direction of everything else. Those who have the money to play the game succeed. Building a true organic presence for high competition niches requires a lot of time and money. Also think who has the money to hire the best writers, the best researchers the best graphic designers. If Google succeeds in their game plan the SERP's will become like strip malls. With big companies owning the best rankings. Now is that right or wrong?... It just is. I personally don't have a problem with it but its the way of the world.

              If I search 36 inch LED TV, maybe your blog has great insight but I probably want bestbuy.com to come up.
              Yes totally hence the point:

              Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

              If you have the cash to invest then great otherwise get out of the kitchen.
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            • Profile picture of the author MaroshIS
              Originally Posted by dp40oz View Post

              If Google succeeds in their game plan the SERP's will become like strip malls. With big companies owning the best rankings.
              Exactly this is going to happen here. Ryan Deiss was talking about this some time ago. Internet as we know it is dead.

              Looking at the 1st page of my keywords after recent Google cleanup, I see only big brands, rich companies with milion backlinks owning top spots. And yes this is what Google wants to see. They are all in one boat. Please understand it.
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              • Profile picture of the author sublime311
                Originally Posted by MaroshIS View Post

                Exactly this is going to happen here. Ryan Deiss was talking about this some time ago. Internet as we know it is dead.

                Looking at the 1st page of my keywords after recent Google cleanup, I see only big brands, rich companies with milion backlinks owning top spots. And yes this is what Google wants to see. They are all in one boat. Please understand it.
                Yes, i totally agree, Ryan's predictions months ago were on the ball. Google says, in its blog today "we want you not to do any kind of SEO". Basically saying, if you don't have the big bucks to do PR/Viral/Branding/Social campaigns, you won't have a chance in the future to gain those natural links from fans and normal visitors!

                For smaller niches with less competition, it may be possible still for couple more years, if you do your SEO like Rex says, good content that gets noticed, shared by educational authorities etc. But eventually, more and more niches will be taken over by big guys.

                I am just wondering how all these "Local Internet Marketing Freelancers/Agencies" will be affected. Every single day I see another WSO teaching people about how to get local clients. Tactics in them work to get the client, but nobody is talking about how the future of their relationship with their customers will be -- in terms of delivering results and what they will charge to their customers for an SEO service that Google wants to see (or non-SEO/viral content service that Google wants). $295 for Google Places, $695 for site SEO, $250 for video SEO!?... These prices won't be feasible anymore and local businesses have to pay premium prices that they cannot afford! What are these local business agencies will do for delivering results for SEO, I am really wondering. Please share your opinions!

                So do you see how the walmarts and amazons of the future will take over small businesses, via Internet? Many will go out of business as they already struggle.

                Maybe most local keywords are not so competitive now, but they are becoming competitive fast. In the future, local winners will be dentist franchise chains, chiropractor groups, auto body shop franchises etc. Mom and pop has no luck, can't afford to pay the premium fee to their local marketing servicing people. Yes they will stay in the business and make a living, which that's what most of them want, but forget about expanding their business. Capitalism at its best, that's the system unfortunately. We shouldn't be surprised.

                I think everyone who is getting into this hot trend of taking on local clients, just know that you are saving the day right now. If you are seriously thinking about creating a long-term local internet marketing business, you have to think about your future service offerings and pricing structure. Cookie cutter service offerings and automation may be the thing of the past soon. Higher priced and more personalized service offerings will take over. But is that really a business that you want to be in?
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                If you always put limit on everything you do, physical or anything else. It will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them... BRUCE LEE

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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

            What claptrap.

            Sure you need to put in the time but without the cash to invest, you are on a boat, in the middle of the lake without a paddle.

            At least the spinning backlink option, it allowed people to enter the market with low levels of investment.
            Im sorry if this offends but SEO was never intendd to be easy. Google is protecting a multi billion dollar company. They arent concerned with our budgets. That is why you find wayz around by doing the work yourself. Then you invest your profits back into g
            your business until it sustains itself.
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            • Profile picture of the author inter123
              Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

              Im sorry if this offends but SEO was never intendd to be easy. Google is protecting a multi billion dollar company. They arent concerned with our budgets. That is why you find wayz around by doing the work yourself. Then you invest your profits back into g
              your business until it sustains itself.
              No offense taken.

              SEO seems an ever changing field. What seems to work now expires further down the line.

              Google have always set a clear set of guidelines on what they seek. That is, people link your sites naturally without any manipulation. If they failed to keep trust here, people's indignation would be understandable.

              By creating your own blog network, you are not playing by the rules. What is there to say, 6 or 12 months down the line, big G finds a way to expose that too? The only safe way is to create great content and hope it goes viral. Your own personal Blog Network, is in the eyes of Google, blackhat, and is gaming the system. It is something that works at the moment but for how long?
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  • Profile picture of the author shayman
    I think you're being smug a little too soon Mr Rex.
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  • Profile picture of the author esmein
    In a rain of arrows only the fool laughs before it's over.
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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

    Man, I got all kind of google love with this latest update. Of all my sites, not one lost a single ranking for a single keyword. Interestingly, the sites around me bounced around.

    I now have one site where I rank #1 for a single word keyword that gets 200K searches a month. I was #9, so I was competitive, but I am now #1.

    Am I lucky? Am I a master SEO? NO!!! I simply do things according to the way google wants them done.

    Here is what google taught us last year. Fix you on page issues. They were nice in doing this. They new that a link based algo change would do damage to well meaning webmasters with bad site structure.

    So, they gave us an opportunity to fix those issues with Panda. Panda wasnt a bad thing. It forced us to create good sites from a content and architecture perspective.

    After Panda was finished running its course, they switched to a link based algo change. Remember last week with the Negative SEO stuff? Remember the guy with the neg. SEO on the auto website? A lot of people missed the key point in that thread. This amazing Negative SEO admitted he only goes after sites with bad structure and on page issues. In other words, google prepared us for this a year ago!

    As far as link building. Here is what I do not do:
    No link wheels
    No articles
    No blog commenting
    No "Public" blog networks
    No Forum Profiles
    No Wikis
    No Web 2.0's
    No spun content whatsoever
    No over optimized anchor text
    No EMD's

    Basically, any service you can buy off Fiverr or WF, I do not use. If it can be automated or done cheap, then it is spam! You might not like that but it is true.

    Here is what I do do

    I vary my anchor text, and do most of my links with no anchor text. Lets face it. Google knows the only people who use anchor text are webmasters and SEOs. Real people dont use anchor text. Crap, I run a forum and link to other sites with the URL and no anchor text cause I am too lazy to use anchor text.

    Guest Blogging
    Yup. I take the time to contact bloggers and offer to write content for them. Takes a lot of time. But it works GREAT!

    Private Networks
    One thing I like to do is create my own network of sites. These arent in the fashion of BMR or ALN. These sites have tons of GREAT content, every one of them is branded, uses social media (only engaging social media) and have active readers and RSS subscribers.

    These sites link to my money sites.

    Branding
    I use this one a lot. I brand everything! Create brand signals through social media - even offline promotion. Build branding through other webmasters, whatever. Just send strong signals that you area a brand.

    Directories
    I do use directories, but only niche and paid directories. I submit sites to the Yahoo directory $499. I submit my sites to Best of the Web $299. I submit my sites to other more niche directories where there is the possibility of the directory not taking my submission.

    A lot of people say you have to have all those different backlinks to have a diverse backlink portfolio. That is a lie and misinterpretation. What you need is backlinks from multiple sites, not different types of backlinks.

    Build links by hand. Build authority sites, not thin affiliate sites.

    Google is now forcing people to do SEO the right way, and it is only going to get harder to spam and game the system. For a lot of you, it was a great ride. This new algo change is going to test all of us and weed out a lot of internet marketers who only know how to game a system instead of working within it.
    EXACTLY my methods.

    ..except for private networks part. I don't do too much of that. I may buyout a related site from time-to-time, but I prefer focusing on money sites alone.

    And directories aren't useless. I do Yahoo and BOTW for each authority site I own. From there its small niche directories with a good link profile and resource lists.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Good post and am with you on a lot of things. However it much too early to be doing victory laps. It will be at least a few days before things settle out and we know what is what.


      Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

      Not being smug at all. I am pointing out that if you play by the rules, even when others are not, it will eventually work in your favor.
      Your points are well taken and line up with how I do SEO in many respects but lets not get too smug/cocky - having your own network to rank sites is not what Google would consider playing by the rules.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Good post and am with you on a lot of things. However it much too early to be doing victory laps. It will be at least a few days before things settle out and we know what is what.
        Not a victory lap, just a knock back to reality for all the people freaking out over lost rankings. Good. You lost rankings. Now, get over it and start doing things the right way, either on new sites or by fixing the issues with your old sites.

        In other words - SEO for the future landscape, not what works to game the system now. If you do that, then every update is going to get you and you are going to repeat the cycle of highs and lows. I do not like ups and downs. So, I stay in the middle of the road.

        I had a client once that had a horrible backlink portfolio. The first thing I did was spent 6 months removing links from his previous SEO. 6 months, I did not build one link. I actually caused him less links. But during those six months, his site kept climbing in the SERPS. That site is now number one for most all keywords in their niche.

        Being at the top wasnt completely because of me. It had a lot to do with his branding efforts. But what was happening was, bad links were holding his site down.

        His rankings were also unaffected by the recent algo change.

        I tell you that to tell you to start getting rid of some of those links you were building! I did a lot of DMCA requests to remove links and it took a lot of work, but paid off. And yes, I did go to the extreme.
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        • Profile picture of the author Dellco
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post


          I had a client once that had a horrible backlink portfolio. The first thing I did was spent 6 months removing links from his previous SEO. 6 months, I did not build one link. I actually caused him less links. But during those six months, his site kept climbing in the SERPS. That site is now number one for most all keywords in their niche.

          Being at the top wasnt completely because of me. It had a lot to do with his branding efforts. But what was happening was, bad links were holding his site down.

          His rankings were also unaffected by the recent algo change.

          I tell you that to tell you to start getting rid of some of those links you were building! I did a lot of DMCA requests to remove links and it took a lot of work, but paid off. And yes, I did go to the extreme.
          I am looking for exactly such assistance. Someone who knows how to remove "bad" links and the procedures involved to clean up backlink profiles. Let me know anyone who does this. It can be you too.

          And I suspect this will be the NEW HOT INDUSTRY in SEO.
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        • Profile picture of the author athenistic
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

          Not a victory lap, just a knock back to reality for all the people freaking out over lost rankings. Good. You lost rankings. Now, get over it and start doing things the right way, either on new sites or by fixing the issues with your old sites.
          Is that why my high quality site with loads of visitor valued content, low bounce rate, no unnatural backlinking at all and only a breath of completely white hat seo applied to it completely dropped out of the SERPs with the exception of my frigging TAG pages??

          Or is that why the site that I spent a day making 4 crappy pages, filling it with affiliate links, blasting the heck out of it with forum profile links, and then ignoring it for 8 months suddenly hit #1 for it's high competition keyword and made me nearly $500 in commissions last night?

          You're right - this is the best update ever.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by athenistic View Post

            Is that why my high quality site with loads of visitor valued content, low bounce rate, no unnatural backlinking at all and only a breath of completely white hat seo applied to it completely dropped out of the SERPs with the exception of my frigging TAG pages??

            Or is that why the site that I spent a day making 4 crappy pages, filling it with affiliate links, blasting the heck out of it with forum profile links, and then ignoring it for 8 months suddenly hit #1 for it's high competition keyword and made me nearly $500 in commissions last night?

            You're right - this is the best update ever.
            The fact that your tag pages were indexed is proof your site was not structurally sound. Tag pages should be noindex/nofollow.

            Fix the structure issues and duplicate content.
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            • Profile picture of the author athenistic
              Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

              The fact that your tag pages were indexed is proof your site was not structurally sound. Tag pages should be noindex/nofollow.

              Fix the structure issues and duplicate content.
              I really wasn't looking for your advice, but since you've freely given it, my category pages are noindexed. Tag pages have original content. Post excerpts have original content. I haven't been hit with a dup penalty.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

          I tell you that to tell you to start getting rid of some of those links you were building!
          I don't need to. You only learned recently what I have known for a long time. I never needed to remove any links because I never went that route to begin with. I guess you mean that generically because I neither told you that any of my sites tanked or what backlinking I was doing.

          Hint - I have my own network as well.

          You ARE being cocky if you act like you are playing by all the rules though. You already stated you use a network and there is no way that Google considers that "by the rules".
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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

            I don't need to. You only learned recently what I have known for a long time. I never needed to remove any links because I never went that route to begin with. I guess you mean that generically because I neither told you that any of my sites tanked or what backlinking I was doing.

            Hint - I have my own network as well.

            You ARE being cocky if you act like you are playing by all the rules though. You already stated you use a network and there is no way that Google considers that "by the rules".
            I was talking generally about link removal. I removed links from a prior SEO not my own and that was two yearz ago.

            Link networks are not bad as long as their sole purpose is not to rank other sites. My network sites exist to provide info to people. Each site is high quality is branded with socially active followers.
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            • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
              Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post


              Link networks are not bad as long as their sole purpose is not to rank other sites. My network sites exist to provide info to people. Each site is high quality is branded with socially active followers.
              Sticking some social factors on sites that you yourself indicated you use to rank other sites does not remove the fact that Google does not prefer you to use other sites in a network structure to manipulate rankings in serps. I am not disputing the approach at all since thats pretty much how I do things as well. The sites are best to have their own usefulness. However I am not pretending like you are doing that utilizing a network of any kind is what Google calls playing by the rules.
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        • Profile picture of the author alistair
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

          Not a victory lap, just a knock back to reality for all the people freaking out over lost rankings. Good. You lost rankings. Now, get over it and start doing things the right way, either on new sites or by fixing the issues with your old sites.

          In other words - SEO for the future landscape, not what works to game the system now. If you do that, then every update is going to get you and you are going to repeat the cycle of highs and lows. I do not like ups and downs. So, I stay in the middle of the road.

          I had a client once that had a horrible backlink portfolio. The first thing I did was spent 6 months removing links from his previous SEO. 6 months, I did not build one link. I actually caused him less links. But during those six months, his site kept climbing in the SERPS. That site is now number one for most all keywords in their niche.

          Being at the top wasnt completely because of me. It had a lot to do with his branding efforts. But what was happening was, bad links were holding his site down.

          His rankings were also unaffected by the recent algo change.

          I tell you that to tell you to start getting rid of some of those links you were building! I did a lot of DMCA requests to remove links and it took a lot of work, but paid off. And yes, I did go to the extreme.
          A lot of people here have commented that they have been doing things the right way but still got penalized.

          You may be laughing now but remember, those who laugh last laugh loudest.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by alistair View Post

            A lot of people here have commented that they have been doing things the right way but still got penalized.

            You may be laughing now but remember, those who laugh last laugh loudest.
            The question is, what constitutes "the right thing" to each person?

            Im not laughing, just trying to wake people up and get them focused on doing the real "right" thing, not what forums teach.

            The people getting offended are the ones who know they screw up. Google doesnt owe you anything! I live by that rule. We are playing in google's playground, and we can be evicted at anytime. They dont care, neither do their visitors. Google exists for users, not webmasters.

            Somebody post a site where they did things the right way and still got penalized. Lets have a look at it.
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            • Profile picture of the author Thinking_man_too
              Mister rex

              You are being very insensitive at the least. People have lost years of work.
              Some people have lost there lively hood and their families are in trouble.

              The money I lost was helping pay for my daughters college.

              IF you really want to help people then you should post your advice as advice maybe something like this:
              "FYI I have x sites and none got hit by this update. Here is what I did and didn't do.......Hope it helps."

              But you seem to be thumping your chest proudly while rubbing lemon juice in the wounds of those that have not faired as well.

              I will repeat what many here have said already that you ignore: May people had quality sites with quality informative hand written well researched articles that were all white hat and they got Destroyed.

              Given that statement I would propose to you that your course of action was as much luck as it was genius in that Google could just as easily made a minor algo change that would have tanked your sites and not some of the other excellent ones.

              And even if many sites that tanked did use bad practices of some kind it is still poor form to act the way you do.

              And if you really want to help people then detail out some of your strategies like exactly what good page structure is and isn`t and help people. Otherwise you are just gloating.

              Mark
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              • Profile picture of the author troybh
                If I were the OP I would not be so happy. This google algo has punished good sites and all the crap is floating to the top. OP could be in for a big surprise once the algo sorts itself out.
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            • Profile picture of the author WhosGotMoves
              Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

              The question is, what constitutes "the right thing" to each person?

              Im not laughing, just trying to wake people up and get them focused on doing the real "right" thing, not what forums teach.

              The people getting offended are the ones who know they screw up. Google doesnt owe you anything! I live by that rule. We are playing in google's playground, and we can be evicted at anytime. They dont care, neither do their visitors. Google exists for users, not webmasters.

              Somebody post a site where they did things the right way and still got penalized. Lets have a look at it.

              I was initially intrigued by your post and the confidence you displayed in your personal SEO techniques. But I have to side with everyone else that this isn't in fact yet the right time to begin your "look at me and how great my methods are" rant. You really are trying to prove an almighty point that everyone else is wrong and you are right simply because where your sites are seated at this moment.

              You can't honestly believe that 48 hours after hitting #1 that your methods have somehow proven themselves worthy of everyone else taking notes.. Examples:
              "fitness blog" - result #1: Melinda's Fitness Blog: Ladies, Build Your Dream Body at HOME!
              "buy viagra online" - result #7: UGA Faculty of Engineering

              I know there are a ton of these examples out there, but the first has no content on the site whatsoever and the second is a School of Engineering for a Viagra result. You mean to tell me that their "architecture" and SEO methods are the reason they are ranking well?
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              • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
                Originally Posted by WhosGotMoves View Post

                You can't honestly believe that 48 hours after hitting #1 that your methods have somehow proven themselves worthy of everyone else taking notes..
                You missed the point. I am now number 1 for that one keyword, but I have always been on the first page for it, so it was a minor bump. I rank for literally thousands of keywords, and not one of them took a hit. Most stayed the same, some made minor bumps upward.

                The point is, doing consistently proper SEO, not link spam, is the key to long term success. While everyone else was going to services on fiverr or whatever and clicking buy now, I was doing things the long, hard, slow time consuming way - and my results have paid off, and everytime google updates its algo, I am unharmed because I do what they want done.

                The point is, I survive everyone of these updates. It isnt a 48 hour thing. If that was the case, then I am still waiting for Panda to take me out and it just hasnt got to me, yet? Or the Big Daddy update a few years back?
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              • Profile picture of the author iobeek
                Originally Posted by WhosGotMoves View Post

                I was initially intrigued by your post and the confidence you displayed in your personal SEO techniques. But I have to side with everyone else that this isn't in fact yet the right time to begin your "look at me and how great my methods are" rant. You really are trying to prove an almighty point that everyone else is wrong and you are right simply because where your sites are seated at this moment.
                There are many like him but they are silent. They are silent for about a year now. They don't do any link building and they are silent, they are silent since they get "f*ck off you newbie" from a bunch of gurus and seo experts here.
                Links come by themselves....the old one...build it and they will come still applies in some evergreen niches.

                Bunch of crap is posted daily. People whining how some big brands now rank with big budgets. How are those big brands any different than themselves who have budgets of hundreds or thousands of $ if we compare them to those who don't have any budget

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                • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
                  Links come by themselves....the old one...build it and they will come still applies in some evergreen niches.
                  You are also one of those which DON'T understand that exactly such sites with quality content 5 and more years old and updated are GONE too in the serps.

                  Maybe just because they used longtale keywords as permanent URLs and titles. Tests will figure out this.

                  Instead there are now privacy and contact sites in the serps.. and tons of squidoo lenses and hubs.

                  But what this update shows clearly again - no website is save from loosing all traffic over night. Doesnt matter how good your quality is and how white hat you followed googles guideline.
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                  • Profile picture of the author iobeek
                    Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

                    You are also one of those which DON'T understand that exactly such sites with quality content 5 and more years old and updated are GONE too in the serps.
                    Sure, sure...... only "natural" backlinks. Let me ask you something. Was that quality content referenced in some research paper or used as a lecture material by some hight school/college/ professor? Was it linked behind the scene on blackboard?

                    I guess it had low bounce rate and it was never printed
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                  • Profile picture of the author mosthost
                    Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

                    You are also one of those which DON'T understand that exactly such sites with quality content 5 and more years old and updated are GONE too in the serps.

                    Maybe just because they used longtale keywords as permanent URLs and titles. Tests will figure out this.

                    Instead there are now privacy and contact sites in the serps.. and tons of squidoo lenses and hubs.

                    But what this update shows clearly again - no website is save from loosing all traffic over night. Doesnt matter how good your quality is and how white hat you followed googles guideline.
                    I agree with the guynextdoor. It's easy to assume you're been rewarded for your righteousness, but all SEO victories tend to be short lived. Quality IS NOT the main concern for Google. That's just a big lie they perpetrate and people who identify as 'White Hats' eat it up.

                    Truth is, Google has their own agenda for these updates and there are no guarantee that doing things in the way you consider to be 'the right way' will keep you safe.

                    Really, everyone's goal has to be to DIVERSIFY away from Google into as many other sources as possible.
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        • Profile picture of the author situ08
          Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

          Not a victory lap, just a knock back to reality for all the people freaking out over lost rankings. Good. You lost rankings. Now, get over it and start doing things the right way, either on new sites or by fixing the issues with your old sites.

          In other words - SEO for the future landscape, not what works to game the system now. If you do that, then every update is going to get you and you are going to repeat the cycle of highs and lows. I do not like ups and downs. So, I stay in the middle of the road.

          I had a client once that had a horrible backlink portfolio. The first thing I did was spent 6 months removing links from his previous SEO. 6 months, I did not build one link. I actually caused him less links. But during those six months, his site kept climbing in the SERPS. That site is now number one for most all keywords in their niche.

          Being at the top wasnt completely because of me. It had a lot to do with his branding efforts. But what was happening was, bad links were holding his site down.

          His rankings were also unaffected by the recent algo change.

          I tell you that to tell you to start getting rid of some of those links you were building! I did a lot of DMCA requests to remove links and it took a lot of work, but paid off. And yes, I did go to the extreme.
          If bad links can hold the site down. Then I am going to buy cheap fiverr spammy links for my competitors. I know your website and now you will not be able to rank in Google. Bye bye
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          • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
            Originally Posted by situ08 View Post

            If bad links can hold the site down. Then I am going to buy cheap fiverr spammy links for my competitors. I know your website and now you will not be able to rank in Google. Bye bye
            LOL. You obviously didnt read the whole thread. I hate to repost, but this is very important with all the negative SEO talk that is going around.

            Will negative SEO be big in the near future? YES! Are you protected? YES!

            Sorry if this is repetitive, but this might be the most important thing in this thread. There was a case study done on another forum last week by a guy on an automotive website.

            That was one of the best case studies ever, and was also one of the most instructive. What EVERYONE seemed to miss in his post was one little line. He said that he looked for sites above his clients that had poor structure and duplicate content issues. He did his negative SEO against the site that was poor (onsite).

            He didnt mess with the sites with proper architecture! That is the main thing to take away from this. That guy, who is obviously a great Negative SEOer admitted the weakness to negative SEO.

            That is what google has been preparing us for with Panda. Panda was all about fixing on site issues with the site. IF you do that, you are shielded from negative SEO.

            Do you know the other thing the negative SEO guy said? Even when he found a target that had poor structure... IT TOOK A YEAR TO HURT ITS RANKINGS!

            Do you realize how expensive that was?

            To situ08, that is a crappy thing to say even if you are joking. You are giving people the idea to go try to hurt other people out of what, jealousy, anger?

            I think at some point anyone making statements like yours should be banned. But instead of asking your post be removed, I wanted to respond to help other people out.
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      • Profile picture of the author shayman
        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony View Post

        Good post and am with you on a lot of things. However it much too early to be doing victory laps. It will be at least a few days before things settle out and we know what is what.
        Agreed.

        No one can have a problem with Google having a sort out from time to time and clearly just being able to get any old site to #1 Google by dubious backlinking can't be a good thing either, but equally just because a website has a domain name the 6 years old with no spinning, linking etc.. can't guarantee it's any more useful than one that's a few months old.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

    I submit sites to the Yahoo directory $499.
    $299 .......
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    • Profile picture of the author mrultra
      Banned
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by mrultra View Post

        Still, it's nice to know that FINALLY, after who knows how many years, he has finally gotten rewarded for doing things "the right way", lol.
        No. My rankings have been good... forever. The point was, no Panda update or revision hurt me. This algo update also didnt hurt me. In fact, all Panda revisions and this update helped my sites.

        I didnt get rewarded with this update... I survived, just like with all the other updates.

        Once you people get over being mad and focus on what I am telling you, you will see that I am trying to help.

        I dont build websites. I build real businesses! That is my mindset with every task I do. I am building a business! And because of that, my websites have staying power because they are built on the principles laid out by google.

        Those principals never changed, just people figured out a work around. And then a whole bunch of marketers started playing follow the leader for the next greatest thing.

        Those of us who do not fall for short term fads, dont get caught up in this mess. If we do, we adapt and fix the issues. Then, we come back stronger from learning. I had to do that with some new clients after the 1st Panda update.
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  • Profile picture of the author Londonista
    Wow, a lot to think about here. I wish I could do nothing but SEO, but sadly Ive got a lot of other things I need to do as well...
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  • Profile picture of the author Rukshan
    Good strategy. Except private blog networks and paid directory submission, I deal with other methods as you described for high competitive keywords. For MNS, I use 5-10 keywords and use all inner pages, Home page to rotate anchor text in every backlinks campaigns. This help me to rank micro niche sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ashera
    I do everything that the OP doesn't, yet all my sites increased in ranking yesterday.

    "No link wheels (got a few of them)
    No articles (use some of these)
    No blog commenting (do tons of great manual blog commenting)
    No "Public" blog networks (i've used one of these)
    No Forum Profiles (got plenty of web 2.0 profiles)
    No Wikis (i use these)
    No Web 2.0's (use lots of these)
    No spun content whatsoever (use these to my tier 1s)
    No over optimized anchor text (don't do this)
    No EMD's" (almost all my sites are EMD's or close)"


    Just saying, you can't pinpoint these as the reason why you saw improvements since I did them and saw improvements as well.
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    • Profile picture of the author JSProjects
      Originally Posted by Ashera View Post

      I do everything that the OP doesn't, yet all my sites increased in ranking yesterday.

      "No link wheels (got a few of them)
      No articles (use some of these)
      No blog commenting (do tons of great manual blog commenting)
      No "Public" blog networks (i've used one of these)
      No Forum Profiles (got plenty of web 2.0 profiles)
      No Wikis (i use these)
      No Web 2.0's (use lots of these)
      No spun content whatsoever (use these to my tier 1s)
      No over optimized anchor text (don't do this)
      No EMD's" (almost all my sites are EMD's or close)"


      Just saying, you can't pinpoint these as the reason why you saw improvements since I did them and saw improvements as well.
      Just shows that Google is pretty unpredictable and that there's PLENTY of methods that still work just fine. Despite the panic here and elsewhere.
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  • Profile picture of the author Zibblu
    What if one of your competitors decides to link to your site with 50,000 blog comments and your site gets knocked off the top 10? Are you still going to be so happy with the way Google is doing this? If you can get punished for bad links then it won't be long before everyone is linking to everyone else. This is obvious.... which is why I can't believe that Google would really do that. It's so dumb it hurts.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by Zibblu View Post

      What if one of your competitors decides to link to your site with 50,000 blog comments and your site gets knocked off the top 10? Are you still going to be so happy with the way Google is doing this? If you can get punished for bad links then it won't be long before everyone is linking to everyone else. This is obvious.... which is why I can't believe that Google would really do that. It's so dumb it hurts.
      Doesnt bother me. I said this earlier, not sure if it was this thread.

      One thing that flew over everyone's head with the Negative SEO stories from last week was the fact that the negative SEO guy with the case study on the auto site said, he looked for sites with poor quality or structure problems. He skipped sites that were structurally sound. That was the big story!

      A great, dedicated Negative SEO (took a year to bring that site down) admitted it wasnt profitable to go after sites with good architecture.

      My sites are perfect little architectural wonders, so I am not worried about negative SEO on them.
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    • Profile picture of the author inter123
      Originally Posted by Zibblu View Post

      What if one of your competitors decides to link to your site with 50,000 blog comments and your site gets knocked off the top 10? Are you still going to be so happy with the way Google is doing this? If you can get punished for bad links then it won't be long before everyone is linking to everyone else. This is obvious.... which is why I can't believe that Google would really do that. It's so dumb it hurts.
      Google, I would assume don't give a monkeys about you doing something to damage a competitor. It only becomes a problem to them, if the problem is so widespread that it starts to effect the quality of search results. They will do something about it then as it will effect share prices.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
    You guys are so negative and whiny. All this talk of SEO and inthe internet being dead. That is so sad. This could be a learning experience or a wakeup call, if you make the decision to accept the challenge.

    By giving up, what good does that do you? You dont think brick and mortar stores ever have obstacles to overcome? You dont think they have to compete with brands coming to their areas? Some of them fail, others find a way to work around the problem and succeed. Which one are you going to be?
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    • Profile picture of the author inter123
      Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

      You dont think brick and mortar stores ever have obstacles to overcome? You dont think they have to compete with brands coming to their areas? Some of them fail, others find a way to work around the problem and succeed. Which one are you going to be?
      lol...in my neck of the woods, big brands are taking over more and more, there is little in the way of individuality. Shopping centres and malls look alike in every town because it is pretty much the same stores. The individual motar store that survive is in the minority.

      Negativity aside, you are right, a glass half full is always better then half empty.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by inter123 View Post

        lol...in my neck of the woods, big brands are taking over more and more, there is little in the way of individuality. Shopping centres and malls look alike in every town because it is pretty much the same stores. The individual motar store that survive is in the minority.

        Negativity aside, you are right, a glass half full is always better then half empty.
        Good post! They are taking over in my neck of the woods, too. Three years ago a big Walmart came to town. All the local store owners did everything they could to stop it but failed. Today, the Walmart is there... and so are most of those businesses.

        Have you ever noticed that in a lot of Walmart shopping centers, there are also smaller niche related stores? The internet is no different.
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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    The thing about negative seo is that when it doesn't work, you only make the site stronger.

    A competing site of mine (site X) has been around for years. And for many of those years spammers in this industry have been linking to them (in addition to their own sites), because they feel doing so will somehow help them. For example, if they build a crappy web2 or if they fill up a spammy profile, or blast forum posts ...they'll leave a link to their site and site X.

    I'd say about 60% of Site X's backlinks come from the spammy links. The other 40% are high quality and are what's keeping them afloat. I'm not convinced that Google is ignoring that 60%, either.

    See how much harder that makes it for someone to legitimately compete with Site X.
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  • google is all the place
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  • Profile picture of the author Theeban
    I can't belive it, you guess what, I had got success with many high competitive keywords almost with 90% of contextual links using Web 2.0, forum profiles and blog comments. May be, SEO cannot be FRAMED into certain circle , it has to be versatile along with Google rules.... Anyway, even SEO & webmaster guys (they too real people, they are not automated programs like BMR) are using multiple anchor text and url links...It is not good to blame them for making more backlinks and get success......also note, making backlinks are not only for Google for helps to get referral traffic too...
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  • Profile picture of the author BigNorm
    I agree with Mark, don't start doing your happy dance just yet because the way the results are skewed to show some waaay out results will have Google running around to sort it out. I'm starting to see results which remind me of the old days where you could rank Web 2.0 and article sites. If this doesn't change, think of how many buffer sites used in two and three tiered linking structures are going to start dominating Google again.

    If it stays this way for the next week to 10 days then you may have struck on Gold and congrats, but if not, your going to feeling the short sharp slap of Google PMS.
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  • Profile picture of the author Benjamin Ehinger
    My guess is you didn't set up your marketing plan to cater to Google, like so many others. I also am getting more traffic from all my traffic sources and see search traffic on sites I never tried to rank with.

    I have always set up my websites/blogs to gain traffic from other sources and if I get Google traffic great, if not, who cares. Very smart strategy and very similar to mine.

    Benjamin
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  • Profile picture of the author ELVISTHEPELVIS
    I love this, today there are a bunch of posts all over from smug site owners who feel that just because their site hasn't dropped in rankings they are safe. First of all, don't get too comfortable because if you take a look at the SERPS everything is juggling, so you may end up in a bad place yet, and secondly just because you are looking pretty right now it doesn't necessarily mean that anything you have done is the cause of it. I have six sites and one has taken a dive, and all of the others have increased in rank. Everything as of now seems random, which is why everyone is left scratching their heads instead of making posts titled, "I Saw This Coming a Mile Away, and Because I am Smart, I Am Better Than You."
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  • Profile picture of the author OneManSEO
    We used "standard" SEO practices, which did not include any of your expensive methods and none of our client websites have dropped. Yet.

    I predict this update will be rolled back quite soon.
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  • Profile picture of the author perpetualdream
    I believe there is no such thing as "the way to do SEO" . This update is still very new and it is too early to assume that this or that SEO mechanism is right or wrong. What are you currently suggesting that we are back in 2005 where the factors that you have mentioned played the major role in ranking, we are in 2012 and I believe there are other factors that became important since then. From my early analysis, I believe that Google has hit the sites which their manipulation for the system was too obvious . Getting hundreds of thousands of back links and social bookmarks in a boring and anti-social niches would definitely get someone caught.
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    • Profile picture of the author retsek
      Originally Posted by perpetualdream View Post

      I believe there is no such thing as "the way to do SEO" . This update is still very new and it is too early to assume that this or that SEO mechanism is right or wrong. What are you currently suggesting that we are back in 2005 where the factors that you have mentioned played the major role in ranking, we are in 2012 and I believe there are other factors that became important since then. From my early analysis, I believe that Google has hit the sites which their manipulation for the system was too obvious . Getting hundreds of thousands of back links and social bookmarks in a boring and anti-social niches would definitely get someone caught.
      Listen ..real whitehat strategies STILL work as they do 5-10 years ago. You really don't have to wait for an algo update to propagate before you know what is right or wrong. Yeah social is new and important, but not that important!
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  • Profile picture of the author Ben Armstrong
    Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

    Man, I got all kind of google love with this latest update. Of all my sites, not one lost a single ranking for a single keyword. Interestingly, the sites around me bounced around.

    I now have one site where I rank #1 for a single word keyword that gets 200K searches a month. I was #9, so I was competitive, but I am now #1.

    Am I lucky? Am I a master SEO? NO!!! I simply do things according to the way google wants them done.

    Here is what google taught us last year. Fix you on page issues. They were nice in doing this. They new that a link based algo change would do damage to well meaning webmasters with bad site structure.

    So, they gave us an opportunity to fix those issues with Panda. Panda wasnt a bad thing. It forced us to create good sites from a content and architecture perspective.

    After Panda was finished running its course, they switched to a link based algo change. Remember last week with the Negative SEO stuff? Remember the guy with the neg. SEO on the auto website? A lot of people missed the key point in that thread. This amazing Negative SEO admitted he only goes after sites with bad structure and on page issues. In other words, google prepared us for this a year ago!

    As far as link building. Here is what I do not do:
    No link wheels
    No articles
    No blog commenting
    No "Public" blog networks
    No Forum Profiles
    No Wikis
    No Web 2.0's
    No spun content whatsoever
    No over optimized anchor text
    No EMD's

    Basically, any service you can buy off Fiverr or WF, I do not use. If it can be automated or done cheap, then it is spam! You might not like that but it is true.

    Here is what I do do

    I vary my anchor text, and do most of my links with no anchor text. Lets face it. Google knows the only people who use anchor text are webmasters and SEOs. Real people dont use anchor text. Crap, I run a forum and link to other sites with the URL and no anchor text cause I am too lazy to use anchor text.

    Guest Blogging
    Yup. I take the time to contact bloggers and offer to write content for them. Takes a lot of time. But it works GREAT!

    Private Networks
    One thing I like to do is create my own network of sites. These arent in the fashion of BMR or ALN. These sites have tons of GREAT content, every one of them is branded, uses social media (only engaging social media) and have active readers and RSS subscribers.

    These sites link to my money sites.

    Branding
    I use this one a lot. I brand everything! Create brand signals through social media - even offline promotion. Build branding through other webmasters, whatever. Just send strong signals that you area a brand.

    Directories
    I do use directories, but only niche and paid directories. I submit sites to the Yahoo directory $499. I submit my sites to Best of the Web $299. I submit my sites to other more niche directories where there is the possibility of the directory not taking my submission.

    A lot of people say you have to have all those different backlinks to have a diverse backlink portfolio. That is a lie and misinterpretation. What you need is backlinks from multiple sites, not different types of backlinks.

    Build links by hand. Build authority sites, not thin affiliate sites.

    Google is now forcing people to do SEO the right way, and it is only going to get harder to spam and game the system. For a lot of you, it was a great ride. This new algo change is going to test all of us and weed out a lot of internet marketers who only know how to game a system instead of working within it.
    I completely agree.

    I have 1 website that I started building early last year, my first ever website. Some of the backlinking I did to it would be considered black hat, a fair bit of white hat as well though. This site has dropped off the rankings dramatically.

    Another site I built late last year has really only had guest blogging and a few web 2.0 properties built for it. That site shot from number 7 to number 1 for my main keyword overnight. It was getting around 70-80 UV's a day, today it's up to 100 UV's at 10am.

    Sadly the site that dropped off dramatically was my main earner. Hopefully the other site can start to bring in enough to make up the difference, while I work on restoring rankings for the other site.

    Overall, I'm happy with this update. Because I'd much rather be rewarded for doing a few guest blogs each week and building quality links, than have to submit crap and spam all over the web.
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  • Profile picture of the author OmarNegron
    Cool post, and I agree with what you said about the anchor text. I guess the more natural way to do things would be just the www link because most people don't even know HOW to put an anchor text so this is a pretty natural way to get a link.

    Happy your seeing good results dude.

    -Omar
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  • Profile picture of the author TamilYoung
    Celebration time for you? Cool. I guess the strategy you are following has pleased Google! Good that you shared those for the warriors out here. Thank you!
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  • Profile picture of the author zaco
    One of my testing sites lost all the rankings but the others got better rankings, I am happy because I was not hit but I feel bad for the people who got hit badly....

    I see alot of people saying we did it the right way and we have seen this coming bla bla bla. Lets be honest, whatever backlinks we build are blackhat and I know alot of people will come and start saying no its not blackhat and we do guestposts and non spammy links..etc..

    If you have an authority site that is very unique and people love it then they will link back to it! GREAT! but if you have an affiliate site or a review site then how the hell you are going to build backlinks? who will backlink to your affiliate site? don't tell me white hat and greyhat BS.. whatever links you do build are considered blackhat and I am not saying don't do it because this is how Google ranks site..backlinks..it is what is! just fake it to make sure it looks natural
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    • Profile picture of the author Ben Armstrong
      Originally Posted by zaco View Post

      One of my testing sites lost all the rankings but the others got better rankings, I am happy because I was not hit but I feel bad for the people who got hit badly....

      I see alot of people saying we did it the right way and we have seen this coming bla bla bla. Lets be honest, whatever backlinks we build are blackhat and I know alot of people will come and start saying no its not blackhat and we do guestposts and non spammy links..etc..

      If you have an authority site that is very unique and people love it then they will link back to it! GREAT! but if you have an affiliate site or a review site then how the hell you are going to build backlinks? who will backlink to your affiliate site? don't tell me white hat and greyhat BS.. whatever links you do build are considered blackhat and I am not saying don't do it because this is how Google ranks site..backlinks..it is what is! just fake it to make sure it looks natural
      I tend to agree with most of what you're saying. However, I don't think guest blogging, Press releases or even some forms of video marketing and article marketing can be considered black hat. I think if you're genuinely promoting your business or website with these methods then it should be okay in the eyes of google.

      Forum profiles and social bookmarking (done by you, not by your visitors) etc can be considered black hat as it serves no purpose other than to manipulate the rankings.
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  • Profile picture of the author Beats4Legends
    God I REALLY hope this is just a simple turn of events... I hope that Google changes back and I receive my rightful rankings again, that I spent years working for...

    This just a bad dream.. wake up.. wake up..

    All my sites offer great content.. I play by the rules.. Yet I lost all my rankings..

    Thusly losing everything else in the process..

    Jesus christ.. Help me be strong.

    I really hope this is a glitch that Google is fixing right now... if not this is widely irresponsible of Google, and I will not ever do SEO again... screw that

    Thanks
    Kyle
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    • Profile picture of the author Ben Armstrong
      Originally Posted by Beats4Legends View Post

      God I REALLY hope this is just a simple turn of events... I hope that Google changes back and I receive my rightful rankings again, that I spent years working for...

      This just a bad dream.. wake up.. wake up..

      All my sites offer great content.. I play by the rules.. Yet I lost all my rankings..

      Thusly losing everything else in the process..

      Jesus christ.. Help me be strong.

      I really hope this is a glitch that Google is fixing right now... if not this is widely irresponsible of Google, and I will not ever do SEO again... screw that

      Thanks
      Kyle
      Hi Kyle,

      Could you share with us what kind of SEO methods you used. The more honest information people provide about their backlinking efforts, the more helpful it will be in figuring out what to avoid.
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  • Profile picture of the author GMT
    I don't get the difference between guest blogging with a backlink to your site vs posting a comment on a manually approved blog that has a backlink to your site...in terms of when you really break it down, short of you're writing less content for them... it's still fair exchange either way IMHO so if Google really punishes for the latter, that's unfortunate.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by GMT View Post

      I don't get the difference between guest blogging with a backlink to your site vs posting a comment on a manually approved blog that has a backlink to your site...in terms of when you really break it down, short of you're writing less content for them... it's still fair exchange either way IMHO so if Google really punishes for the latter, that's unfortunate.
      Guest blogging gives you the ability to control all the content surrounding your link. It also gives you t he ability to target niche specific blogs in your industry. This ties in relevancy to your post, link and site.

      Blog commenting used to be just as good, but so many link spammers starting using that as a tool. So, people start looking for non-nofollow blog comment opportunities and every marketer finds the same blogs (cause they are limited). So a blog comment is probably one of hundreds of blog comments on the the same post, with a lot of those comments linking to casinos, payday loans and those type of sites.

      A Blog post can be done on a site where links in comments are moderated out, so your link is the only link on the page, so no other spammer gets to play in your playground.

      What happened to a lot of you guys is, you had links in the same spaces as link spammers. So by association, you were deemed a link spammer. I am not saying you were one. I am saying you were hanging around the same places as link spammers and got taken down with them.

      Here is my secret for backlinks. Any site where there is a service in the Warrior for Hire section to build backlinks to, I NEVER post a link on those sites.

      In other words, I do not build a link where service providers offer to build links. Because of this, I have no association to link spam in my portfolio.

      The best thing you can do in terms of link strategy now is, look at the services offered by link builders on the forum, and dont build links where they do.
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  • Profile picture of the author madison75074
    I'm curious to see how all of this will play out. This morning the "how to make money online" Google search featured a blank Blogger page in the number 1 position. So much for the great user experience Google is going for.
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  • Profile picture of the author owenlee
    congrats...hope this result will last as google is hard to predict nowadays
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  • Profile picture of the author twilightofidols
    It was a great day for you, but the relevancy of some of the search results is totally off. A few edu domain home pages were ranking for viagra... I mean c'mon?
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  • Profile picture of the author redstanford
    hopefully google re-thinks this update and either tweaks the heck out of it or undo's it. things seem very random and screwed up.

    hopefully this is just another google "mis-step".

    a lot of high quality sites are being nailed - including mine
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    • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
      Re: Yesterday was a GREAT Day for SEO... and me! Its About Time!
      Yesterday was the worsest DAY ever for white hat SEO sites!


      JUst that you know... There are OHTER sites with real value for searchers then sites writing 1000 words up articles...

      Example: donwloadsites of all kind... i have one in the Engineer Architect Niche.. offering > 1000 drawings...

      Authorithy Site.. ranked natural for tons of related keywords... Had more then 100k pageviews... The visitors stayed 4 minutes in average!

      Is down to 100 pageviews!

      NOW i do also typical IM information sites.. Another example.. for a keyword which i am targeting with a 20 Page, 700 words article site.. i see now a EMPTY Wordpress Blog ranking with HELLO WORLD...

      THIS IS THE WORSEST DAY FOR WHITE HAT SEO.. And the worsest SERPS since Altavista.

      Google put Quality authority sites in the same pot with MFAs and single page sale letters...

      G is proving with this update that they DONT HAVE A CLUE about on-site content and relevance.

      They SHOW that with devaluing Target Anchors they don't know anymore what the sites content is about!

      tons of examples in the serps.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
        Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

        Yesterday was the worsest DAY ever for white hat SEO sites!


        JUst that you know... There are OHTER sites with real value for searchers then sites writing 1000 words up articles...

        Example: donwloadsites of all kind... i have one in the Engineer Architect Niche.. offering > 1000 drawings...

        Authorithy Site.. ranked natural for tons of related keywords... Had more then 100k pageviews... The visitors stayed 4 minutes in average!

        Is down to 100 pageviews!

        NOW i do also typical IM information sites.. Another example.. for a keyword which i am targeting with a 20 Page, 700 words article site.. i see now a EMPTY Wordpress Blog ranking with HELLO WORLD...

        THIS IS THE WORSEST DAY FOR SEO.. And the worsest SERPS since Altavista.
        Lets see this site and see if we can find out what went wrong.

        The number of words in itself is irrelevant. For instance, does a product page for a pair of high heel shoes need 1000 words? No! I have ecommerce sites that have maybe 50 words on the product page, and they rank just fine because I am targeting transactional queries.

        Number of words are only relevant to the type of search query a user makes, and then only relevant by the quality and on site factors of the site.
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      • Profile picture of the author Intrepreneur
        Yesterday was the first day of a few days..

        It was not the whole picture.

        I'm gonna keep this up until someone creates a thread that actually tells everyone to stop crying until the algorithm is actually updated fully.


        Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

        Yesterday was the worsest DAY ever for white hat SEO sites!


        JUst that you know... There are OHTER sites with real value for searchers then sites writing 1000 words up articles...

        Example: donwloadsites of all kind... i have one in the Engineer Architect Niche.. offering > 1000 drawings...

        Authorithy Site.. ranked natural for tons of related keywords... Had more then 100k pageviews... The visitors stayed 4 minutes in average!

        Is down to 100 pageviews!

        NOW i do also typical IM information sites.. Another example.. for a keyword which i am targeting with a 20 Page, 700 words article site.. i see now a EMPTY Wordpress Blog ranking with HELLO WORLD...

        THIS IS THE WORSEST DAY FOR SEO.. And the worsest SERPS since Altavista.
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        • Profile picture of the author redstanford
          Originally Posted by Intrepreneur View Post

          Yesterday was the first day of a few days..

          It was not the whole picture.

          I'm gonna keep this up until someone creates a thread that actually tells everyone to stop crying until the algorithm is actually updated fully.

          i know yesterday was only day 1 but that just means more sites are going to be nailed - but good sites that were nailed are not going to somehow be miraculously un-nailed.

          I'd like to pimp slap Matt Cutts right in the mouth
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          • Profile picture of the author Intrepreneur
            Originally Posted by redstanford View Post

            i know yesterday was only day 1 but that just means more sites are going to be nailed - but good sites that were nailed are not going to somehow be miraculously un-nailed.

            I'd like to pimp slap Matt Cutts right in the mouth
            You base your assumptions on what?

            Can you not see the results are flawed right now and were better before the update?

            Do you not assume that this isn't even part of the update and Google are rummaging around what's going on to use the results to improve the latest change?

            Assuming based on what's going on rather than what has happened to sites, you will assume better.

            Assume nothing they say, but at least use some of your logic to think clearly.

            And clearly the results won't stay like this.

            Maybe the latest algorithm is offline, and they will put it up when they've finished it.

            You don't know..
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      • Profile picture of the author Rndmals
        Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

        They SHOW that with devaluing Target Anchors they don't know anymore what the sites content is about!

        tons of examples in the serps.
        This is an excellent point and has been the most egregious outcome of the "update" so far.

        Let's just wait and see how it pans out over the next few days. I don't even want to think of a possibility of it being the final product.
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  • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
    Yesterday was the first day of a few days..

    It was not the whole picture.

    I'm gonna keep this up until someone creates a thread that actually tells everyone to stop crying until the algorithm is actually updated fully.
    I am agree that it is to early to say something - but the tendency of the algo update is to see allready now...

    And the quality in the serps is WAY worser then ever.

    I could now list tons of examples but this doesent make sense right now


    -----------------------------
    Here some observations

    Donwloadsites are databases, in my case a autocad drawing is the content - and to see as a preview.. so every description doesnt make sense (would be again only for SEO)...

    I am using keywords and tags as description which is the natural way how visitors searching in a database...

    Drawing Name in the URL and Title.. and nearly no text content.. plus advertising (somehow my 20k investment to provide this drawings must be financed)

    So my site will trigger the over optimization filter now. After 7 years providing the best content and beeing in the TOP 3 sites for AEC related details.
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  • Profile picture of the author RevSEO
    While you have good intentions, what you posted isn't fact.

    Sure, one or two of your websites may have moved up in rankings, but you can't come in and start spouting that stuff off as fact.

    I'm seeing a ton more garbage in the SERPs, heck, I've never seen so many EMD parked domains ranking for keywords than ever before. If that doesn't refute your claim about EMD's than I don't know what does.

    The fact is, like Mike pointed out, is that this Panda "refresh" isn't fully "refreshed" yet. While Google may label their new algorithm updates with pretty terms like "over optimization", "webspam", the truth is that this wasn't the answer.

    I'm seeing sites that have nothing but pure Scrapebox spam ranking higher than before. I'm seeing autoblogs ranking higher than before. Heck, I even have some low quality sites that I haven't touched in YEARS, with spun content (all my own) ranking higher than ever before.

    Don't start celebrating yet, the ride isn't over.
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  • Profile picture of the author SeoKnightsInc
    Thanks @mister rex

    Got some really good stuff after a long time here else most of the people here knows only to blame Google they can make Google responsible even for there High weight Your methods are difficult i use many of them but i DO NOT use many of them i have EMD a small private network and less social engaement. I hope to make my sites a bit more social friendly. Thanks for few points which i think i failed to crack.
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  • Profile picture of the author Spooky007
    Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

    As far as link building. Here is what I do not do:
    No link wheels
    No articles
    No blog commenting
    No "Public" blog networks
    No Forum Profiles
    No Wikis
    No Web 2.0's
    No spun content whatsoever
    No over optimized anchor text
    No EMD's

    Basically, any service you can buy off Fiverr or WF, I do not use. If it can be automated or done cheap, then it is spam! You might not like that but it is true.
    Congrats on your survival, but I am a little confused. Why would manual blog commenting, articles and Web 2.0s be considered spam? I wouldn't even consider EMDs spammy as long as the content is quality and the link profile is solid.

    I am really new at this whole SEO thing, but I don't get how using a private blog network is less spammy than public blog networks. Maybe you mean it LOOKS less spammy, but their purpose is pretty much the same, right?
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  • Profile picture of the author JeanneLynn
    Mr.Rex, you should post your site, so we can see a good example of what Google wants. I'd love to take a peek.
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    • Profile picture of the author mosthost
      Originally Posted by JeanneLynn View Post

      Mr.Rex, you should post your site, so we can see a good example of what Google wants. I'd love to take a peek.
      It's not just a website, don't forget. He 'builds businesses.' How many people hide their business? Unless he's AFRAID
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      • Profile picture of the author JeanneLynn
        Originally Posted by mosthost View Post

        It's not just a website, don't forget. He 'builds businesses.' How many people hide their business? Unless he's AFRAID
        Why would he be afraid? He should just post it. I'm honestly curious to see his business.
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        • Profile picture of the author mosthost
          Originally Posted by JeanneLynn View Post

          Why would he be afraid? He should just post it. I'm honestly curious to see his business.
          Me too. I wish to emulate his success.
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  • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
    I vary my anchor text, and do most of my links with no anchor text. Lets face it. Google knows the only people who use anchor text are webmasters and SEOs. Real people dont use anchor text.
    I say that for a long time already, and i think you are correct in terms of this last google change. Likelihood is that ANY "targeted" anchor text (keywords etc.) are now more damaging than actually doing anything good.

    However, it would be a matter of experimentation. I *assume* right now that many sites got slapped since a percentage (30%? 50%? 70%???) of all the links are keywords..and you are right, anchor-keywords in this sense do really not exists outside the SEO world. Normal people don't use them.

    The solution to the current problem with the recent change, trying to "simulate" and emulate "natural" link building as good as possible.
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  • Profile picture of the author colourofspring
    OP:-
    Basically, any service you can buy off Fiverr or WF, I do not use. If it can be automated or done cheap, then it is spam! You might not like that but it is true.
    ...so it would only cost an unscrupulous SEOer $5 to change your clean backlink profile to something much dirtier....
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  • Profile picture of the author Chelam
    haha to be honest you are just bored like me.
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  • Profile picture of the author Texjd
    Last year when Google started rolling out the infamous Panda updates I had 6 webistes shoot straight to the top, not just one page, but the majority of pages. Most have about 75 to 100 pages. They were designed to be authority sites and had quality content and low bounce rate.

    Two of the websites popped from 3/4K a day to three times that. They ran strong from April until the end of June. Then the next phase rolled out and sent them to an average of page 4 or 5 in serps. Bummer, but that's the Internet.

    Since then I have never been at the bottom, but never at the top. Most of my links are pretty white hat but I did use BMR sparingly on new pages between July and January.

    So we all know about what happened last month. No where near as bad as some stories I've heard but they are all jumping around like spit on a hot skillet right now. Who knows when they will settle down, if ever.

    My point is it's never over. Yes, you may get a few months of heaven or hell, but the only constant is change. It ain't over until its over and I'm not sure it will ever be over.

    I gave up getting angry back in 2005 =8~). I just figure out the latest strategy and start back at it again.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by colourofspring View Post

      OP:-
      ...so it would only cost an unscrupulous SEOer $5 to change your clean backlink profile to something much dirtier....
      Not if the site has proper structure and a good backlink portfolio. Then, you are just building up the competitor site for them.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ashera
    Lot of opinions here that are wrongly stated as facts.
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    If you don't change direction, you'll end up where you're going.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by Ashera View Post

      Lot of opinions here that are wrongly stated as facts.
      Feel free to elaborate.
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  • Profile picture of the author hdavies
    Hi,

    Interesting thread. I just thought I'd share my experience with the new updates.

    I had 2 sites, both targeting the same keywords in the UK.

    One site is about a year old and I had optimized the content, keywords in bold, H1 tags etc. Keyword density is about 3%. I had also built backlinks from video submission, article submission, ALN and ArticleRanks.

    The second site is about 6 months old. There is only about 50 words on the home page and the keyword is repeated only 2 times. No on-page SEO. That is, no keywords in bold, no H1 tags. The only link building I have done ever for that site is article marketing. I used AMR only twice.

    Both sites were on the first page last week, 2 and 3 spot for quite competative keywords.

    The first site, that was totally optimized and has about 3,000 backlinks, has dropped from the first 20 pages of Google.

    The second site has shot to #1 on the first page for a number of searches.

    Both sites are actual businesses that provide conservatories within the UK and aren't EMDs.

    However, I do believe that the recent changes are far from over and many people will notice their site's position in the SERPS change a lot before it's finished.

    In regards to the opinion that negative (spam) linkbuilding can hurt a site, I'm 100% convinced. I think Google are smarter than that. In my opinion, which I know doesn't count for much, those types of links will just be ignored when it comes to ranking a website. I don't think it will have a negative effect, or get your site 'banned'.

    Anyway, I just thought I'd throw in my honest experience so far with those 2 sites.

    Regards.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gaston Wolf
    Haha you guys should google make money online and see who's top
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by Dofollowshop View Post

      Haha you guys should google make money online and see who's top
      Make Money Online With The Kidblogger

      Is that your site or something? If so, congrats.
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      • Profile picture of the author Gaston Wolf
        Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

        Make Money Online With The Kidblogger

        Is that your site or something? If so, congrats.
        Sorry i wasn't very specific. Use google.co.uk and you'll find an almost blank wordpress page currently sitting #1 for make money online.
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        • Profile picture of the author situ08
          Originally Posted by Dofollowshop View Post

          Sorry i wasn't very specific. Use google.co.uk and you'll find an almost blank wordpress page currently sitting #1 for make money online.
          yes mister rex, search for make money online in google.co.uk. Where is the quality of Google.
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          • Profile picture of the author SeoKnightsInc
            Originally Posted by situ08 View Post

            yes mister rex, search for make money online in google.co.uk. Where is the quality of Google.
            One of the most childish response i ever heard in SEO.

            You will find a few wrong results its not Human its just a Algo and these results will be sorted out soon. Its tooo easy to blame others try finding your own mistake what wrong you did to tank your site. I think you made more than 10 posts complaining about Google if this much time you had put in reading there Guidelines you may have known the reason why your sites tanked.
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  • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
    Mister Rex
    Give me one of your URLS and i will bring it down in two weeks.. the current update and the last january update does clearly filter out sites with to much target anchors in the backlink profile!

    I did a lot of backlink testing - and it is ALL about a natural exact match / variation /generic backlink RATIO profile now...

    If you trigger, your site is gone! and this means we can trigger each other now.

    negative SEO is working since january! what this guy did is outdated and ONE or more years ago.


    The serps are still terrible.. and i think google MUST reverse some filters... BUT they reached ONE GOAL.. many firms will never trust SEO guys anymore.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
      Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

      Give me one of your URLS and i will bring it down in two weeks.. the current update and the last january update does clearly filter out sites with to much target anchors in the backlink profile!

      I did a lot of backlink testing - and it is ALL about a natural exact match / variation /generic backlink RATIO profile now...

      If you trigger, your site is gone! and this means we can trigger each other now.

      negative SEO is working since january! what dis guy did is outdated and ONE or more years ago.
      Why not focus on building your own business instead of trying to bring down others?

      Why do you need one of my URLs to do this. Go after Home Depot, CNN or some other big brand if you are so sure of your negative SEO. Tell me how it works out for you.
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      • Profile picture of the author JeanneLynn
        Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

        Why not focus on building your own business instead of trying to bring down others?

        Why do you need one of my URLs to do this. Go after Home Depot, CNN or some other big brand if you are so sure of your negative SEO. Tell me how it works out for you.
        I don't think negative seo would work with the big brands. I think that Google would make an exception for them. I do think negative SEO would probably work on a website like yours or mine. Most people's websites aren't big brands.

        I'm building a new website now. I don't want someone to be able to nuke it with negative SEO.
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        • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
          Originally Posted by JeanneLynn View Post

          I don't think negative seo would work with the big brands. I think that Google would make an exception for them. I do think negative SEO would probably work on a website like yours or mine. Most people's websites aren't big brands.

          I'm building a new website now. I don't want someone to be able to nuke it with negative SEO.

          You guys need to get over this wanting to try negative SEO on people just to prove a point. It is sad this is what things have come too.
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          • Profile picture of the author JeanneLynn
            Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

            You guys need to get over this wanting to try negative SEO on people just to prove a point. It is sad this is what things have come too.
            I certainly don't want to do negative SEO on anyone. I just want to be sure that it isn't possible for a competitor to do it on my site. I think it is terrible that there is even a possibility that negative SEO would work. I have never stated that I want to do negative SEO on anyone's site.
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          • Profile picture of the author Zibblu
            Originally Posted by Mister Rex View Post

            You guys need to get over this wanting to try negative SEO on people just to prove a point. It is sad this is what things have come too.
            The point is an important one to make. If negative SEO is possible to do at very little cost then you are very naive to think that many people will not be doing it to their competition.

            At the same time I find it impossible to believe that Google didn't see this coming... so I'm still a bit skeptical about how easy negative SEO is... but I think we're going to be seeing a lot of people trying it in the coming weeks... we'll see what happens.
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  • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
    Why not focus on building your own business instead of trying to bring down others?
    Did i say that i keep my focus on bringing other sites down?

    Fact is that you are not up to date - because all you do is guestposts and private network...

    While me and others did tests doing ALL kind of backlinks and diversity over the last 4 months..

    If i can trigger my OLD sites, with PR 4 and 7 or more years older and zero black hat.. i can also trigger yours. Logic right ?

    and if you don't see that a ONE year old test about negative SEO is nothing worth anymore after January/February/April Google update.. then you are not really smart..

    I hoped on a constructive tread with you - you said " A great day for SEO ".. because YOUR sites hold all number 1 spots... So nothing has changed for you... Your private network is strong.. What has this to do with the current Terrible Serps ?

    I outranked quality sites with my SEO testsites doing old style backlinks, blogcomments and social bookmarks and the correct anchor ratio.. I am sorry for the quality sites which are now gone.. because my testsites are really not worth to rank in top 5 now...

    But i know also that the sites which are NOW gone(they may come back soon again, because the serps ARE A JOKE).. ALL triggered the exact match anchor ratio! easy to do on your sites.

    While at the same time my > 5 years old authority sites are down to 1/3 or lesser traffic.

    Really a great day for SEO right ?
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    • Profile picture of the author inter123
      Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

      I outranked quality sites with my SEO testsites doing old style backlinks, blogcomments and social bookmarks and the correct anchor ratio.. I am sorry for the quality sites which are now gone.. because my testsites are really not worth to rank in top 5 now...
      What sort of anchor ratio do you recommend?
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      • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
        1/3 em anchors 1/3 mixed and phrases 1/3 generic and noise..

        no more then 50% links to the homepage / 50% deeplinking


        After Googles JANUARY update we had suddenly sites penalized where we builded agressive backlinks using more then 50 different anchors but all more or less keyword variations. High competition keywords - we talk here 10k backlinks NOT done with scrapebox or xrumer.. extrem diversity... NO PUBLIC BLOGNETWORKS. But for sure we use small private networks too.

        The site faced a penalty and we had a problem, because what did work before did not anymore..

        So we started tests and backlinked 3 - 6 months old, nearly new sites till we triggered the anchor penality.... then builded tons of unique generics and noise links.. to figure out the ratios...The site popped back and ranked ... AND DO STILL and gained now TOP spots.

        Then we upscaled the tests on older sites which had the same problems..and we had the same results.


        And to come back to the negative SEO example - this guy worked one year.. but i BET the sites dropped AFTER the january updates. The reason is simple.. since then negative SEO is working.
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        • Profile picture of the author bcruan
          Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

          And to come back to the negative SEO example - this guy worked one year.. but i BET the sites dropped AFTER the january updates. The reason is simple.. since then negative SEO is working.
          I agree. Negative SEO has been around for a few years, but it has usually been easier and more productive to work on your own site. With the latest updates its looking like negative SEO may actually be a cost effective way of moving up the ranks now. Im sure if this is the case google will address it in future updates, but in the short term its going to be interesting to see what happens.
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  • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
    Sure, sure...... only "natural" backlinks. Let me ask you something. Was that quality content referenced in some research paper or used as a lecture material by some hight school/college/ professor? Was it linked behind the scene on blackboard?

    I guess it had low bounce rate and it was never printed
    People like you are the reasons why such treads never give any real value back.

    To tell you:

    YES (content made by USA engineers and architects), NO (average visitors duration > 4 minutes), YES our content got printed in BOOKS and used as reference for material which is actually teaching material for students.

    Such sites dont have NATURAL much backlinks, but some strong ones - believe me.

    And NO i wont show my sites here.

    I am in doubt that you really track more then some cheap IM minisites - right ?
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    • Profile picture of the author iobeek
      Originally Posted by guynextdoor View Post

      People like you are the reasons why such treads never give any real value back.

      To tell you:

      YES (content made by USA engineers and architects), NO (average visitors duration > 4 minutes), YES our content got printed in BOOKS and used as reference for material which is actually teaching material for students.

      Such sites dont have NATURAL much backlinks, but some strong ones - believe me.

      And NO i wont show my sites here.

      I am in doubt that you really track more then some cheap IM minisites - right ?
      riiiight
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  • Profile picture of the author ian a birch
    I class it as a learning curve,as the old saying goes"you cant please everyone all of the time"i have took one hell of a knock and watched my 2 big sites vanish and its heart breaking.but we have to pick ourselves up and work out what we did wrong in googles eyes...it could be somethink simple...who knows,i dont agree with what google have done,and i think they have screwed up big time,but its done..so know we need to figure out the best way we can recover..and help each other instead of arguing and snipping at what was and what should be.....life goes on
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    • Profile picture of the author iobeek
      Originally Posted by ian a birch View Post

      I class it as a learning curve,as the old saying goes"you cant please everyone all of the time"i have took one hell of a knock and watched my 2 big sites vanish and its heart breaking.but we have to pick ourselves up and work out what we did wrong in googles eyes...it could be somethink simple...who knows,i dont agree with what google have done,and i think they have screwed up big time,but its done..so know we need to figure out the best way we can recover..and help each other instead of arguing and snipping at what was and what should be.....life goes on
      We all know what seo is. It's serp manipulation.

      All of you that lost rankings. Ask yourself this. If you search for your keywords do you find relevant content ? Be honest with yourself. Sure, there might be some glitches but at the end of the day your pages were just replaced. For the end user of google results are the same.
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      • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
        Originally Posted by iobeek View Post

        We all know what seo is. It's serp manipulation.

        All of you that lost rankings. Ask yourself this. If you search for your keywords do you find relevant content ? Be honest with yourself. Sure, there might be some glitches but at the end of the day your pages were just replaced. For the end user of google results are the same.
        I am agree for typical everygreen info niches where in fact many sites are interchangeable...


        But do a search for technical problems or something extrem specific where you know the serps before and after Penguine.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stuart william
    According to my point of view it doesn't matter what you do, the thing matters is how you can do your job. If you are doing all work in genuine way then there is no reason of penalty or spamming. Just do all of your work in most genuine way. Try to increase your brand reputation, you can use anchor text but your anchor text must contain diversity
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  • Profile picture of the author guynextdoor
    For those which still don't believe negative SEO is possible: UNFORTUNATELY it is. Here is a case study...

    CASE STUDY: Negative SEO - Results - Main Backlinks/SEO Discussion - Traffic Planet
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  • Profile picture of the author sackboy127
    I have a feeling that guest posting is going to be the next big thing in SEO...
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    • Profile picture of the author mosthost
      Originally Posted by sackboy127 View Post

      I have a feeling that guest posting is going to be the next big thing in SEO...
      For sure. That will render it useless as a tactic within a few months. I'd suggest looking for the next, next, next, big thing and not the current 'next big thing'
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