Stop building backlinks..

124 replies
  • SEO
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That was easy.

Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
#backlinks #building #stop
  • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
    Well said, although sadly enough, I doubt many will listen.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by John Romaine View Post

      Well said, although sadly enough, I doubt many will listen.
      Yep.

      It's rare, but hopefully it gets to someone.

      I hate all this spamming I see so constantly and everyone's promoting it, acting like it's okay.

      Come on.. if you go in with the mindset that you are building backlinks, you aren't building a business, you are just building backlinks.

      You want to succeed, start trying to succeed.

      All these people are doing is running in place.
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      • Profile picture of the author mamadou
        Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

        Yep.

        It's rare, but hopefully it gets to someone.

        I hate all this spamming I see so constantly and everyone's promoting it, acting like it's okay.

        Come on.. if you go in with the mindset that you are building backlinks, you aren't building a business, you are just building backlinks.

        You want to succeed, start trying to succeed.

        All these people are doing is running in place.
        The problem is if you stop link building or ( spamming) you will loose the competition!. Some of our competitors use the legit way you are talking about but they are spending a lot of money and they have a full army of marketers and writers who are building what you call it "legit" links, and Yes , they are also spending a fortune each month! to buy High PR Homepage links with anchor text. The other competitors they are just spamming links all over the place.

        Think about it , if you can afford it you definitely will go for the legit way of writing and marketing on TOP quality sites but you MUST buy some high page rank homepage links to keep up with your competitors. So you will end up using some non-legit ways anyway.

        Or if you can't afford it you must build lots of links to get the ranking your site deserves.

        Take my site as an example , it's a service based , I spent 13 full months developing and testing it just to make sure it's top notch and everything is just perfect. I was spending long long boring hours and nights fixing that and tweaking this , I invested about 10,000 $ to make my site even better than the biggest competitor that I have in my niche. After the lunch of the site I discovered that I need at least 20.000 $ to advertize my site and do marketing in the legit way just to keep up with the competition! (Very competitive niche) , which I can't afford of course. The result my site and my services are better than most of my competitors but my site is in page 45 and they are using their money to get to the top 3 spots of uncle Google!.

        I bought Magic Submitter and learned it so well and I start writing articles about my business and sends it to 100's of site all over the web everyday. After 2 months I'm now in Page 1 for my main 2 keywords and most of the other keywords are in page 2 and they are improving each day.

        I would say that you just can't stop building links because if you do that you will loose your hard earned business!. And you must keep in mind that most of your competitors ( if you are in a very high competitive niche ) will buy Homepage High PR links ! very expensive ones! , and they build links as well !! , the only difference between them and me that they are using their money to write high quality articles with their links inside! , and since it's high quality articles on high quality top sites with massive visitors every day so some people engage with it and actually read it. That's why a lot of people say it's a "legit way"!. My articles/writers are not that good and most of the articles get sent to some sites that no body will read them anyway. But my services are better than theirs and even cheaper!. I hope you got my point and understand it. And sorry for the long writing! , English is not my first language as you can clearly see.
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        • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
          Originally Posted by mamadou View Post

          The problem is if you stop link building or ( spamming) you will loose the competition!. Some of our competitors use the legit way you are talking about but they are spending a lot of money and they have a full army of marketers and writers who are building what you call it "legit" links, and Yes , they are also spending a fortune each month! to buy High PR Homepage links with anchor text. The other competitors they are just spamming links all over the place.

          Think about it , if you can afford it you definitely will go for the legit way of writing and marketing on TOP quality sites but you MUST buy some high page rank homepage links to keep up with your competitors. So you will end up using some non-legit ways anyway.

          Or if you can't afford it you must build lots of links to get the ranking your site deserves.

          Take my site as an example , it's a service based , I spent 13 full months developing and testing it just to make sure it's top notch and everything is just perfect. I was spending long long boring hours and nights fixing that and tweaking this , I invested about 10,000 $ to make my site even better than the biggest competitor that I have in my niche. After the lunch of the site I discovered that I need at least 20.000 $ to advertize my site and do marketing in the legit way just to keep up with the competition! (Very competitive niche) , which I can't afford of course. The result my site and my services are better than most of my competitors but my site is in page 45 and they are using their money to get to the top 3 spots of uncle Google!.

          I bought Magic Submitter and learned it so well and I start writing articles about my business and sends it to 100's of site all over the web everyday. After 2 months I'm now in Page 1 for my main 2 keywords and most of the other keywords are in page 2 and they are improving each day.

          I would say that you just can't stop building links because if you do that you will loose your hard earned business!. And you must keep in mind that most of your competitors ( if you are in a very high competitive niche ) will buy Homepage High PR links ! very expensive ones! , and they build links as well !! , the only difference between them and me that they are using their money to write high quality articles with their links inside! , and since it's high quality articles on high quality top sites with massive visitors every day so some people engage with it and actually read it. That's why a lot of people say it's a "legit way"!. My articles/writers are not that good and most of the articles get sent to some sites that no body will read them anyway. But my services are better than theirs and even cheaper!. I hope you got my point and understand it. And sorry for the long writing! , English is not my first language as you can clearly see.
          I'm not necessarily saying "stop linking to your site all together".

          What I'm trying to say is "stop using backlinking methods to link to your site".

          In other words, get rid of the whole idea that a backlink will help you rank and focus more on sharing content where it deserves to be shared.

          If you create a good video, link to your site from it, but don't create videos specifically to link to your site and not actually provide any value.

          VALUE and REASON are important and by just building backlinks you take away value and solely focus on the false reason that your website deserves to rank.
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    • Profile picture of the author dburk
      Hi Justin,

      I salute you.

      That is truly some of the best advice ever offered on this forum.

      What many members of this forum need is nothing short a paradigm shift in how they look at promoting their website. In other words, stop building links and start building content, links within that content are simply a small part of the content. Those links are an important part, but certainly not the only import part, and in many cases, not the most important part of the content.

      Stop building links and start building a web of content!
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  • Profile picture of the author rickalek
    Love Pat Flynn's rebuttal to this point of view:

    ""I hate this spinning discussion. Let's say Pat has the cure for cancer and he posts it on his blog. Curing cancer is good. So Pat spins articles about curing cancer and posts them everywhere so he can help the most people while playing by the rules that GOOGLE has set.

    So what about security guards? Pat's site rocks. It will help people that are thinking about becoming a security guard. Security guards are a help to society. It's all good.

    So what if Pat "advertises" his site by placing similar content all over the web? It's not like the web is "full" and Pat is harming someone by taking up too much space.

    It seems acceptable for Toyota to place the same add on every TV network and run it over and over. It's OK for AP to syndicate their content everywhere. Why not Pat.

    Not to mention the fact that Pat is only doing this because Google's algorithms are too poor to tell good content from bad content. I would argue that if Pat Does not do something to rank his site, he is being unfair to all those readers out therebat NEED him but cannot find him.

    Failing to properly promote your site when there are people to help profitably is A lot bigger sin than syndicating 47 very similar but different copies of a good article.

    If you want to take a stand against someone, get mad at Google. They have an inferior product that relies on backlinks -- yet they make Billions of dollars each year from it. That's the problem, not Pat."
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    • Profile picture of the author rickalek
      Well, I realize this quote is about spinning, but still apropos to these "spamming" comments
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      • Profile picture of the author The Expert
        This whole "build a real business" type of talk is really annoying when people pair it to the idea of "niche" websites.

        I keep saying it over and over again. You might find a "niche" keyword which will convert to sales like "aftermarket truck mirrors".

        The value of a #1 ranking in google for this keyword might be $200 p/month to you. That's really not all that much but if someone was going hand me $200 every month for doing pretty much nothing I wouldn't turn it down.

        But who is going to build an "authority site" with tons of content, infographics and other types of things which lead to "natural" inbound links for a site keyword that is going to produce $200 p/month? NOBODY...that's who. It doesn't make financial sense. Especially if all you need t do is put up on 4,000 word article that is uber-optimized plus five or 10 supporting pages and then get a few backlink gigs and then manually place some PR4, PR5, or PR6 comments on do-follow blogs and be in the money?

        So it's easier to build the "aftermarket truck mirrors" site and then the "piano tuning tool" site and the "VHS to Blueray" site. All of which are unrelated and none of which make enough money to invest enough time or money in them in the manner which is being advocated today by the "forget backlinking" purists.

        The bottom line is that small-niche site building is not and never will be condusive to the "natural work of mouth on the net" type of approach to making money online.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Romaine
          Originally Posted by The Expert View Post

          This whole "build a real business" type of talk is really annoying when people pair it to the idea of "niche" websites.

          I keep saying it over and over again. You might find a "niche" keyword which will convert to sales like "aftermarket truck mirrors".

          The value of a #1 ranking in google for this keyword might be $200 p/month to you. That's really not all that much but if someone was going hand me $200 every month for doing pretty much nothing I wouldn't turn it down.

          But who is going to build an "authority site" with tons of content, infographics and other types of things which lead to "natural" inbound links for a site keyword that is going to produce $200 p/month? NOBODY...that's who. It doesn't make financial sense. Especially if all you need t do is put up on 4,000 word article that is uber-optimized plus five or 10 supporting pages and then get a few backlink gigs and then manually place some PR4, PR5, or PR6 comments on do-follow blogs and be in the money?

          So it's easier to build the "aftermarket truck mirrors" site and then the "piano tuning tool" site and the "VHS to Blueray" site. All of which are unrelated and none of which make enough money to invest enough time or money in them in the manner which is being advocated today by the "forget backlinking" purists.

          The bottom line is that small-niche site building is not and never will be condusive to the "natural work of mouth on the net" type of approach to making money online.
          You're not building a real business, that's why.

          Don't you think that the person that purchased $200 aftermarket truck mirrors might be interested in purchasing skid plates, custom lighting, tool boxes, trays, bullbars and a hundred and one other accessories?

          It might only be an initial $200 sale now, but in the back end, that same customer might be worth thousands.

          Its called "upselling", "cross selling", "down selling" and in lamens terms a "sales funnel".

          Feel like writing some content now?
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        • Profile picture of the author Cosmit
          Originally Posted by The Expert View Post

          This whole "build a real business" type of talk is really annoying when people pair it to the idea of "niche" websites.

          I keep saying it over and over again. You might find a "niche" keyword which will convert to sales like "aftermarket truck mirrors".

          The value of a #1 ranking in google for this keyword might be $200 p/month to you. That's really not all that much but if someone was going hand me $200 every month for doing pretty much nothing I wouldn't turn it down.

          But who is going to build an "authority site" with tons of content, infographics and other types of things which lead to "natural" inbound links for a site keyword that is going to produce $200 p/month? NOBODY...that's who. It doesn't make financial sense. Especially if all you need t do is put up on 4,000 word article that is uber-optimized plus five or 10 supporting pages and then get a few backlink gigs and then manually place some PR4, PR5, or PR6 comments on do-follow blogs and be in the money?

          So it's easier to build the "aftermarket truck mirrors" site and then the "piano tuning tool" site and the "VHS to Blueray" site. All of which are unrelated and none of which make enough money to invest enough time or money in them in the manner which is being advocated today by the "forget backlinking" purists.

          The bottom line is that small-niche site building is not and never will be condusive to the "natural work of mouth on the net" type of approach to making money online.
          And when google gorilla comes out and slaps your site to the ground, what are you going to do then?
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          • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
            Originally Posted by Cosmit View Post

            And when google gorilla comes out and slaps your site to the ground, what are you going to do then?
            Hahaha.

            I agree.

            Too many people rely on SEO and think it's the only thing they need to do.

            Am I saying, "hey stop working on your business"?

            No, I'm telling people to stop being in the "build backlinks, make money" mindset and start by getting into the "build a business, make money" mindset.
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            • Profile picture of the author jamesbrands
              Originally Posted by Cosmit View Post

              And when google gorilla comes out and slaps your site to the ground, what are you going to do then?
              Realize that it was a possibility with the kind of niche you were targeting and site you were building and move on?!

              Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

              Hahaha.

              I agree.

              Too many people rely on SEO and think it's the only thing they need to do.

              Am I saying, "hey stop working on your business"?

              No, I'm telling people to stop being in the "build backlinks, make money" mindset and start by getting into the "build a business, make money" mindset.
              Disagreed with some of the stuff you said in another thread, but this is a good point.
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              • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
                Originally Posted by jamesbrands View Post

                Realize that it was a possibility with the kind of niche you were targeting and site you were building and move on?!



                Disagreed with some of the stuff you said in another thread, but this is a good point.


                As per that mindset, it's not dedicated solely to a singular niche.

                SEO is relative to the entire search engine.

                No matter if you are in one niche or another, you will likely be affected by an update. And if one site falls, it's possible for other sites to fall using the same method.
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    • Profile picture of the author pdrs
      Originally Posted by rickalek View Post

      Love Pat Flynn's rebuttal to this point of view:

      ""I hate this spinning discussion. Let's say Pat has the cure for cancer and he posts it on his blog. Curing cancer is good. So Pat spins articles about curing cancer and posts them everywhere so he can help the most people while playing by the rules that GOOGLE has set.

      So what about security guards? Pat's site rocks. It will help people that are thinking about becoming a security guard. Security guards are a help to society. It's all good.

      So what if Pat "advertises" his site by placing similar content all over the web? It's not like the web is "full" and Pat is harming someone by taking up too much space.

      It seems acceptable for Toyota to place the same add on every TV network and run it over and over. It's OK for AP to syndicate their content everywhere. Why not Pat.

      Not to mention the fact that Pat is only doing this because Google's algorithms are too poor to tell good content from bad content. I would argue that if Pat Does not do something to rank his site, he is being unfair to all those readers out therebat NEED him but cannot find him.

      Failing to properly promote your site when there are people to help profitably is A lot bigger sin than syndicating 47 very similar but different copies of a good article.

      If you want to take a stand against someone, get mad at Google. They have an inferior product that relies on backlinks -- yet they make Billions of dollars each year from it. That's the problem, not Pat."
      Sorry but this is ludicrous and is just someone trying to justify spinning a bunch of articles so that he doesn't feel like a spammer. I don't know Pat and maybe he's a real standup guy or whatever but there are some major points that are wrong with this way of thinking.

      Quote - "So what if Pat "advertises" his site by placing similar content all over the web? It's not like the web is "full" and Pat is harming someone by taking up too much space."

      There is absolutely nothing wrong with advertising your site all over the place if you're doing exactly that - advertising your site with the permission of other webmasters, go ahead and article market the hell out of it - but when you're just doing it to game Google rankings that's not really what you're doing.

      Quote - "It seems acceptable for Toyota to place the same add on every TV network and run it over and over. It's OK for AP to syndicate their content everywhere. Why not Pat."

      Really? Toyota pays a HUGE sum of money to run those ads and you can do the exact same thing with your site - it's called BUYING traffic.

      And again it's fine to Syndicate content, it works very well, but when you're sending ****ty spun articles across the web just to game Google, you're making it harder on everyone else by just a little bit.

      Quote - "If you want to take a stand against someone, get mad at Google. They have an inferior product that relies on backlinks -- yet they make Billions of dollars each year from it. That's the problem, not Pat."

      Get mad at Google? They are in business to provide the best search results possible and gaming them just makes them clamp down that much harder - If you were in charge of Google what would you do? Cmon...


      I think you missed the OP's point - sure, go out and promote your site - but do it in a way that will send you traffic DIRECTLY - stop trying to game rankings and you'll build a loyal readership that actually cares what you have to say.

      And yes, you can argue that spun content when done very well doesn't pollute the web but the thing is - 99% of people don't spin content very well because when it's done well it takes as much time as just writing a new article!

      And yeah, Pat might have a great site on 'cures for cancer' but something tells me that if it was really that great - he wouldn't need to be gaming google to get people interested in what he has to say with spun content.

      Use some common sense - Google is a private entity, they set their rules, so don't "blame Google" when you try and break them and get a smack - that's a really childish mentality.

      As another guy mentioned above it's really the whole "niche site model" that breeds this sort of thinking and as long as people can rank a single site for a single keyword it definitely isn't going to stop. It's also certainly a tempting model for people just getting into the game (lord knows it was to me) but after you've been down that road and then see what you can accomplish when you actually start building something that's worthwhile your thoughts will probably change a bit on the idea.
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    Oh believe me, I still build backlinks. I just don't use that term.

    Instead I focus on building traffic and getting my stuff seen by the world.

    At the end of the day, I'm doing much better than when I focused on backlinks.
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    • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
      Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

      Oh believe me, I still build backlinks. I just don't use that term.
      Then why don't you take your own advice.

      One of my sites I hardly built any backlinks to it for years, (2009) when I built around 50 links (WOW WE), it had 20/30 FB likes per page, 20/30 comments, 3500 Facebook fans, hundreds of pages of content.

      Many people are under the impression that small crappy 2 page websites went down here. I had plenty of natural links, around 300/400, how many people can say that? and it's gone... probably because it was competing with one of Google's sites.

      Did they give any credit for the links I did manage to obtain 100% whitehat? No! either in serps, traffic or any other movement. It's not my fault Google's algo is inept. They can punish you for bad links but don't give any credit to real votes because they have lost trust with everything accept large content farms like Yahoo Answers and the New York Times.

      I don't agree with large scale spam, I do agree with providing value but I'm just a little pissed atm. I put alot of effort into those sites, making sure the visitors were happy and OK.

      I don't know how you can say stop building links when you do it yourself, it doesn't make you any different from anyone else here. Perhaps you should say, "build better links".
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      • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
        Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

        Then why don't you take your own advice.

        One of my sites I hardly built any backlinks to it for years, (2009) when I built around 50 links (WOW WE), it had 20/30 FB likes per page, 20/30 comments, 3500 Facebook fans, hundreds of pages of content.

        Many people are under the impression that small crappy 2 page websites went down here. I had plenty of natural links, around 300/400, how many people can say that? and it's gone... probably because it was competing with one of Google's sites.

        Did they give any credit for the links I did manage to obtain 100% whitehat? No! either in serps, traffic or any other movement. It's not my fault Google's algo is inept. They can punish you for bad links but don't give any credit to real votes because they have lost trust with everything accept large content farms like Yahoo Answers and the New York Times.

        I don't agree with large scale spam, I do agree with providing value but I'm just a little pissed atm. I put alot of effort into those sites, making sure the visitors were happy and OK.

        I don't know how you can say stop building links when you do it yourself, it doesn't make you any different from anyone else here. Perhaps you should say, "build better links".
        When I state I am building backlinks, it means that I am posting a link to my website somewhere else on the internet. That's ultimately what a backlink is, right?

        But, I don't go out and build backlinks specifically just to cheat the search engines. I build traffic and help people by providing solutions to their problems.
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        • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
          Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

          When I state I am building backlinks, it means that I am posting a link to my website somewhere else on the internet. That's ultimately what a backlink is, right?

          But, I don't go out and build backlinks specifically just to cheat the search engines. I build traffic and help people by providing solutions to their problems.
          Not everyone here is building crappy sites, my sites that were hit are nothing like your typical money sites, they had a purpose too. Matt Cutts saying this update removed low quality sites from Google, but he soon back tracked when the serps were left full of crap "oh no this update isn't about quality is about webspam" what a load of BS.

          I'm definately not going to put as much effort into user experience anymore, my new sites are only about money and traffic and that's it. At least with blackhat spam you know what you're getting, otherwise you could have a whitehat site and still face the same fate.
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          • Profile picture of the author Dellco
            Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

            Not everyone here is building crappy sites, my sites that were hit are nothing like your typical money sites, they had a purpose too. Matt Cutts saying this update removed low quality sites from Google, but he soon back tracked when the serps were left full of crap "oh no this update isn't about quality is about webspam" what a load of BS.

            I'm definately not going to put as much effort into user experience anymore, my new sites are only about money and traffic and that's it. At least with blackhat spam you know what you're getting, otherwise you could have a whitehat site and still face the same fate.
            Matt Cutts never back-tracked on anything. He just kept quiet.

            But anyway, you're absolutely right, Google just encouraged a lot more churn and burn with all that they are doing. Plus, nobody wants to put so much effort into their sites if it can all go down with Negative SEO.

            If that's what Google wants, that's what they will get...
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            • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
              Originally Posted by Dellco View Post

              Matt Cutts never back-tracked on anything. He just kept quiet.
              He made a statement when people were pointing out all the junk in the serps that they were fighting webspam and they didn't care about search quality but his original statement said they were improving quality by removing low quality sites, nice job 70% of their index is low quality.
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          • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
            Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

            Not everyone here is building crappy sites, my sites that were hit are nothing like your typical money sites, they had a purpose too. Matt Cutts saying this update removed low quality sites from Google, but he soon back tracked when the serps were left full of crap "oh no this update isn't about quality is about webspam" what a load of BS.

            I'm definately not going to put as much effort into user experience anymore, my new sites are only about money and traffic and that's it. At least with blackhat spam you know what you're getting, otherwise you could have a whitehat site and still face the same fate.
            Just because a website is high in quality doesn't mean that it should rank.

            I'm not saying that your sites shouldn't rank. I'm saying that people that try to cheat the SERPS shouldn't be the ones profiting.

            And I'm also not going directly at sites, I'm going at the fact that people aren't building real business's, they are just focusing on the get rich quick aspect which is going to hurt them more than it will help.

            And finally as far as the whole Google thing goes, guess what, that's their business. They've built an amazing business and they are going to make mistakes, it's inevitable. But to get mad at them.. personally we don't have to spend money on their business (except for AdWords) so.. knowing that, we don't really have a reason to hate them. They can do what they want and test what they want as they want as much as they want
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            • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
              Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

              Just because a website is high in quality doesn't mean that it should rank.
              I don't know what planet you're living on..

              Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

              I'm not saying that your sites shouldn't rank. I'm saying that people that try to cheat the SERPS shouldn't be the ones profiting.
              You are saying you offer solutions to people's problems, implying that others don't, you sound a bit stuck up your own if you ask me.. why don't you give people some real advice.

              Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

              And I'm also not going directly at sites, I'm going at the fact that people aren't building real business's, they are just focusing on the get rich quick aspect which is going to hurt them more than it will help.
              There are plenty of people out there with real business', what the hell are you talking about? Nonesense if you ask me..

              Plumbers, Builders, people that actually have a real job and haven't got the time to fanny around like you do on Facebook.. People sucked into the hope of a better future which, Google profited from. If you knew what a real business was then you would understand.

              At the end of the day it's a competitive world, business will compete, large or small. I wonder how many business' the size of JCPenney are gaming Google? more than you could possibly imagine.. I could give you the webpages of a few high profile companies that have dozens of $1000 a month link rental.

              Does it hurt them? no, you don't hear about it everyday because the New York Times doesn't blog about it everyday.

              The fact is spamming Google and paid links still wins the day, nothing has changed and until it does "business'" won't change. They will cross the line from whitehat to blackhat spam or paid links because it gives them the competitive edge, what business wouldn't want to take a competitive lead?

              Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

              And finally as far as the whole Google thing goes, guess what, that's their business. They've built an amazing business and they are going to make mistakes, it's inevitable. But to get mad at them.. personally we don't have to spend money on their business (except for AdWords) so.. knowing that, we don't really have a reason to hate them. They can do what they want and test what they want as they want as much as they want
              I don't hate Google but, every change they make it will get harder for them. I'm just saying they should not only advance their spam fighting tactics, they should also improve their signals to help people that are making a genuine effort.

              They should also be more transparent about what they do, keeping in mind they are running a monopoly.
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              • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
                Banned
                Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

                At the end of the day it's a competitive world, business will compete, large or small. I wonder how many business' the size of JCPenney are gaming Google?
                JC Penny was caught "spamming" the search engines with backlinks not too long ago. I guess that means they aren't a real business.

                And yet your profile says you have 140+ websites and counting
                Real businesses don't have 140+ websites.


                Don't you think that the person that purchased $200 aftermarket truck mirrors might be interested in purchasing skid plates, custom lighting, tool boxes, trays, bullbars and a hundred and one other accessories?
                They might want some ice cream too. What's your point?
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                • Profile picture of the author dburk
                  Originally Posted by Black Hat Cat View Post

                  Real businesses don't have 140+ websites.
                  Hi Black,

                  Really? :confused:

                  How many websites do they need to have before they are considered a real business? How about 800, is that enough websites to be considered a "real business"? Just wondering what it takes before me, or my competitors', business becomes "real".
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                  • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
                    Originally Posted by dburk View Post

                    Hi Black,

                    Really? :confused:

                    How many websites do they need to have before they are considered a real business? How about 800, is that enough websites to be considered a "real business"? Just wondering what it takes before me, or my competitors', business becomes "real".
                    OK lets put this into perspective here;

                    Whale Shark Media who I consider to be a real online business that incidentally make millions of dollars every year - they have only 6 websites.

                    CBS - Another muti-million online company has only 7 websites.

                    Matt Cutts statement saying they will de-index more than 200+ sites on a single web hosting account because they more than likely provide little to no value.

                    Some top adsense publishers get banned from Google because they have too many websites that provide little or no value.

                    So what are you saying Justin? more than likely you're a one man band with over 140+ websites, you can't really be providing as much value as you say you do? unless you are a billionaire... :rolleyes:
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                    • Profile picture of the author dburk
                      Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

                      OK lets put this into perspective here;

                      Whale Shark Media who I consider to be a real online business that incidentally make millions of dollars every year - they have only 6 websites.

                      CBS - Another muti-million online company has only 7 websites.

                      Matt Cutts statement saying they will de-index more than 200+ sites on a single web hosting account because they more than likely provide little to no value.

                      Some top adsense publishers get banned from Google because they have too many websites that provide little or no value.

                      So what are you saying Justin? more than likely you're a one man band with over 140+ websites, you can't really be providing as much value as you say you do? unless you are a billionaire... :rolleyes:
                      Hi dmtaylor247,

                      Since when does the number of websites determine the value of content they offer?

                      You do not need to be a "billionaire" to have 140 great websites. You could easily build that number with a team of 20 professionals in a single year, give or take a few months. That certainly does not put you in the realm of billionaire status, but of course it would be pocket change for a billionaire to do that, or to purchase a network of that size.

                      I do not know the OP, nor am I defending him. I am challenging the notion that having 140 websites is not a "real" business. Where do you come up with such a silly notion? I can point to many publishers that have dozens, or even hundreds of websites, all are real businesses in their own right, and collectively a seriously successful business.

                      For example, take a look at these guys: ATGStores.com

                      They started with a small team and just kept building new sites until they had over 600 sites. I would consider them a "real" business, they were "real" when they built their first website, and still very real when the were bought out by Lowe's late last year.

                      You may want to expand your vision a bit, there are "real" businesses on the web, they come in all sizes and shapes. You cannot fit every business into the same size or shape, that's just a silly notion, in my opinion.
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  • Profile picture of the author komplex
    Banned
    True, I don't build small throw-away spam sites.. I build only large sites with content people actually will want to read and send their friends too. Real websites with real business goals, not something I can just throw up a offer on and hope I make a few bucks and move on.. I can make close to $2K/sale just by generating ONE lead, and that happens every month, keep in mind I've never spammed that website out and it has a few hundred backlinks, most/all are other people who linked to us in the first place.

    At the end of the day though, there will always be a need niche sites, so ... Really can't debate this as right or wrong.
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    • Profile picture of the author wilsonm
      Originally Posted by komplex View Post

      I can make close to $2K/sale just by generating ONE lead...
      What sort of products pay that much for just genrating a lead?
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      • Profile picture of the author nik0
        Banned
        Originally Posted by wilsonm View Post

        What sort of products pay that much for just genrating a lead?
        I think he sells cruiseships
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        • Profile picture of the author computermesh
          Originally Posted by nik0 View Post

          I think he sells cruiseships

          There's some good insurance leads that I've seen ranging from $7 upwards of $40 per lead.
          Signature

          If you build it, they will come. If you write it, they will read it. If it's good, well, they will tweet it, like it, share it, stumble it, pin it, post it, copy it, click it, buy it, question it, digg it and comment on it. Let's write useful, meaningful content on our sites and clean the internet up :)

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      • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
        Originally Posted by wilsonm View Post

        What sort of products pay that much for just genrating a lead?
        There are affiliates out there that not only work with affiliate networks, but private.

        For example, I could go to a car dealership, motorcycle dealership, real estate agency, insurance company, etc.

        I could setup a deal with them and make a larger percentage than normal (20% as an example).

        $10,000 lead turns into $2,000 commission.

        Imagine getting a small commission on a house.

        1% on a $200,000 house is $2,000.

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  • Profile picture of the author jwmann2
    Easier said than done. I think if we all kept adding quality content, though, we would be much better off. Link baiting would take effect and the SEO would be done for us by our readers. You think Mark Zuckerberg spent hours commenting on blogs and creating forum posts? Heck no. He built something amazing that everyone could use and we did the SEO for him.
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  • Profile picture of the author fmac
    It really depends on what your selling I guess? Like if you have a service like mine I just need my pages on the 1st page of certain keywords. Driving traffic to my site from blog post really won't do me much good I think?
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  • Profile picture of the author computermesh
    If you build it, they will come.
    If you write it, they will read it.
    If it's good, well, they will tweet it, like it, share it, stumble it, pin it, post it, copy it, click it, buy it, and question it.
    Signature

    If you build it, they will come. If you write it, they will read it. If it's good, well, they will tweet it, like it, share it, stumble it, pin it, post it, copy it, click it, buy it, question it, digg it and comment on it. Let's write useful, meaningful content on our sites and clean the internet up :)

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    • Profile picture of the author inxie
      Originally Posted by computermesh View Post

      If you build it, they will come.
      If you write it, they will read it.
      If it's good, well, they will tweet it, like it, share it, stumble it, pin it, post it, copy it, click it, buy it, and question it.
      No, they won't without promotion.

      They need a way to get to your page...
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  • Profile picture of the author EC1
    Are you on Skype?
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by EC1 View Post

      Are you on Skype?
      Yep you can see Skype names attached to accounts via the persons profile. Click on the Skype icon if that's a method of contact you'd like to make.

      And just to clarify a bit further.

      My views aren't entirely dedicated to the fact that backlinks are bad. I just think the way that most marketers go about building them is inappropriate and a waste of time.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dellco
    Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

    That was easy.

    Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

    I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

    If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

    So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

    Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

    Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

    P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
    And yet your profile says you have 140+ websites and counting, which I am very sure, is by your definition, "spamming the internet with useless nonsense" (at least for some of them)....Or maybe that is "building a business" for you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Chrisbroholm
    I don't disagree, but why are you saying stop building backlinks? Shouldn't it be: Stop building POOR backlinks?

    If I write 10 awesome articles and make 10 awesome squidoo lenses that point to my money site, that's hardly throwing spam out there is it?

    I get your sentiment, but sometimes perhaps you ought to take a break from posting your drama linkbait style headline posts that offer little new value to the reader?

    I understand you need traffic to your signature and these headlines definitely get a lot of eyeballs to that, so kudos.

    This is awful advice - backlinking is part of your "business" so why are you completely disregarding it in the op? You tell people to give up building backlinks in favour of building a business, well...uhm...okay.

    I like your stuff Justin and you always try to help, but please, don't post stuff like this.
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    Over 800 Amazon Reviews for $1 - No way?

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  • Profile picture of the author wilsonm
    Anyway with all the recent developments, Bing has now become a better search engine then Google.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by wilsonm View Post

      Anyway with all the recent developments, Bing has now become a better search engine then Google.
      Even if it were so, on any level, the problem is that people are focusing too much on methods that just bring search results, versus long-term results.

      Yes search engines are great, but if you rely entirely on them, you'll fall under.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ben Armstrong
        Good advice.

        You'll inadvertently pick up some very high quality backlinks that google will love if you simply stick to promoting your business.
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  • Profile picture of the author adam337
    Focus more on the traffic is needed.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ed Brown
    Justin, I'm with you on this one. Offer more quality less quantity. If what's being offered is good enough, it will promote itself.
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  • Profile picture of the author LiftMyRank
    I think the most important thing now is to make sure you promoting quality content, the old saying "you can't polish a turd comes to mind" that is, no matter how good your linking is if you have a crap site don't expect sustainable rankings, I guess content marketing and social marketing will play more of a role going forward...
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    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Banned
      Originally Posted by John Moore View Post

      I think the most important thing now is to make sure you promoting quality content, the old saying "you can't polish a turd comes to mind" that is, no matter how good your linking is if you have a crap site don't expect sustainable rankings, I guess content marketing and social marketing will play more of a role going forward...
      I'm all for quality content to keep traffic returning, but a crappy page can still rank just as easily as a quality page. Just saying.
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      Hi
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  • Profile picture of the author williamsam
    Yeah man very sad but thnx for inform us as m regularly try to get back links from others
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  • Profile picture of the author Jason Lomberg
    Yes you are right, We should build our business instead of building backlinks.
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  • Profile picture of the author computermesh
    Put your content in terms of money. If you throw pennies on the ground, the homeless guys are going to pick them up and may be good for a click every now and then. If you start throwing quarters and dollar bills on the ground. More of the general public will start picking them up. Backlinking for you. Buying your products. Take what you have to say more seriously. Become a devout fan of your work/site. I wish everyone would stop going for the short term quick fix and just start focusing on the longer term. People would be able to make a lot more money. And there would be a lot less spam on the Net
    Signature

    If you build it, they will come. If you write it, they will read it. If it's good, well, they will tweet it, like it, share it, stumble it, pin it, post it, copy it, click it, buy it, question it, digg it and comment on it. Let's write useful, meaningful content on our sites and clean the internet up :)

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  • Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

    That was easy.

    Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

    I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

    If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

    So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

    Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

    Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

    P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
    how muchh money you makin?
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  • Profile picture of the author eurekapsycrille
    I've seen this guy in Tycoon Talk having a signature "links are advertising, not optimizing". He always insist that we should go straight for the moon (users) and not with links.

    - I just remember.
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  • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
    Originally Posted by dburk View Post

    You may want to expand your vision a bit, there are "real" businesses on the web, they come in all sizes and shapes. You cannot fit every business into the same size or shape, that's just a silly notion, in my opinion.
    That silly notion is based on the fact that one person couldn't own 140+ high quality websites and be a "great business" as OP is claiming that provides a good amount of value at the same time. I would really like to see these fantastic business' that offer solutions to everyone's problems. Let me guess; drop-6-ass-sizes-in-7-days.com

    However, I'm not going to argue on the fact size does or doesn't matter it doesn't, what I mean is you need a hell of a lot of resources to been able to maintain a large amount of "high quality" websites that offer true value.

    By high quality I'm talking cnet or zdnet etc.. Good solid whitehat websites that can be considered publishing business', not 140+ MFA websites.

    Beside the point the examples you are giving are ecommerce stores and not content sites that require a lot of updating.. anyway why the hell would you want 600 ecommerce websites LOL, that's crazy? The cost of maintaining these websites could far outweight the benefits??
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    • Profile picture of the author dburk
      Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

      That silly notion is based on the fact that one person couldn't own 140+ high quality websites and be a "great business" as OP is claiming that provides a good amount of value at the same time. I would really like to see these fantastic business' that offer solutions to everyone's problems. Let me guess; drop-6-ass-sizes-in-7-days.com
      Hi dmtaylor247,

      It seems that you are basing your opinion on the number of websites, claiming "one person couldn't own 140+ high quality websites and be a 'great business'." Why not?

      These 2 guys, Shah and Conine, started CSN Stores back in August 2002 in Conine's nursery. In 9 years they grew that little startup into a network of more than 200 websites with annual sales $500 million. Does that count as a "real" business?

      Again, I am not defending the OP's business in particular, just the veracity of his statements. I can point out examplse like these all day long, if I had the free time. If you have something specific to condemn the OP for, then let's here it, otherwise please lay off the unfounded slurs and innuendo.

      Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

      However, I'm not going to argue on the fact size does or doesn't matter it doesn't, what I mean is you need a hell of a lot of resources to been able to maintain a large amount of "high quality" websites that offer true value.
      I believe you only need the resources to start a single profitable website and then you can use that profit to fund a 2nd profitable website, and then a 3rd, and so on. A "real" business generally has "real" assets, "real" employees, "real" suppliers and contractors, and those resources can be marshaled to build high quality content that generates more profit, which can be applied to more resources, and so on.

      Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

      By high quality I'm talking cnet or zdnet etc.. Good solid whitehat websites that can be considered publishing business', not 140+ MFA websites.

      Beside the point the examples you are giving are ecommerce stores and not content sites that require a lot of updating.. anyway why the hell would you want 600 ecommerce websites LOL, that's crazy? The cost of maintaining these websites could far outweight the benefits??
      "why the hell would you want 600 ecommerce websites?" Well maybe it was for the 9 digit figure that they got when Lowe's bought them out.

      There are companies like Glam Media, with more than 1500 sites that publish content and make money by selling ad space. It is a viable business model and many people are successful at publishing content for many websites. Granted you need a small army of writers to create the content, but hey, writers got to eat, right?
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      • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
        Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        Hi dmtaylor247,
        It seems that you are basing your opinion on the number of websites, claiming "one person couldn't own 140+ high quality websites and be a 'great business'." Why not?
        dburk, I think it's fair to say in most cases they are low quality MFA websites, if they are not powered by Google traffic then they are powered by Facebook traffic, all fine and dandy until Facebook bans your account.

        You pointed out ecommerce, there is a big difference. Content sites need alot of updating they all need to be SEO'd and take alot of time to care for them, I couldn't manage more than 10 content sites and keep them high quality.

        Using ecommerce and paid advertising is a different kettle of fish. My ecommerce sites only took 3 hours work, otherwise it was set and forget.

        I would highly doubt that one person is running that business you have pointed out in this thread. Even though I have declared on numerous occasions that this business model was by far the best, that is the first example I've ever seen of someone with more than 100 ecommerce sites, more than likely created to gain an unfair competitive advantage over their rivals.

        Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        Again, I am not defending the OP's business in particular, just the veracity of his statements. I can point out examplse like these all day long, if I had the free time. If you have something specific to condemn the OP for, then let's here it, otherwise please lay off the unfounded slurs and innuendo.
        Trying to create a bit of publicity is more like the underlying factor of why he is stirring the pot.

        The only real gripe I have is you can't generlize in the case of Google updates. There are many different types of people affected for many different reasons and alot of them are real business'.

        Some of which haven't got a clue what is going on because they have been sucked in by jerry hat trick marketers that "provide solutions to people's problems" I would say this is what we need less of and more transparency including from Google who are destroying real business.

        "Stop building links and start building a business" is not real advice sorry, probably just a way to lure yet more vunerable people through your signature and sell them yet more rehashed BS, Veracity?

        Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        I believe you only need the resources to start a single profitable website and then you can use that profit to fund a 2nd profitable website, and then a 3rd, and so on. A "real" business generally has "real" assets, "real" employees, "real" suppliers and contractors, and those resources can be marshaled to build high quality content that generates more profit, which can be applied to more resources, and so on.
        I agree, but what has this got to do with seo? We all know how to build links for traffic don't we? social media, niche forums, niche blog commenting, I did this anyway...

        Originally Posted by dburk View Post

        "why the hell would you want 600 ecommerce websites?" Well maybe it was for the 9 digit figure that they got when Lowe's bought them out.

        There are companies like Glam Media, with more than 1500 sites that publish content and make money by selling ad space. It is a viable business model and many people are successful at publishing content for many websites. Granted you need a small army of writers to create the content, but hey, writers got to eat, right?
        Again you are comparing two completely different things.
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        • Profile picture of the author dburk
          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          dburk, I think it's fair to say in most cases they are low quality MFA websites, if they are not powered by Google traffic then they are powered by Facebook traffic, all fine and dandy until Facebook bans your account.
          Fair enough, there are many cases of low quality MFA websites, I just think it unfair to accuse someone of such tactics, based solely on the number of websites they have created. I gave you well known examples of people who have created as much or more and it would be a stretch to call any of those "low quality".

          I have simply been trying to prompt you and others on this forum to reserve your condemnation for those that truly deserve it. We shouldn't attack someone just because he has managed to accomplish more than what you are capable of.

          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          You pointed out ecommerce, there is a big difference. Content sites need alot of updating they all need to be SEO'd and take alot of time to care for them, I couldn't manage more than 10 content sites and keep them high quality.

          Using ecommerce and paid advertising is a different kettle of fish. My ecommerce sites only took 3 hours work, otherwise it was set and forget.
          Yes, I did point out eCommerce websites, but that was only because I just finished a competitive analysis for a client's new website that is competing with those guys. They were just on the top of my mind. I followed up with another example of a content publisher network (Glam Media) to demonstrate the same principals apply to the content publishing market.

          I don't know what type of eCommerce websites you have built in the past, but high quality eCommerce websites are certainly not easier to build than content sites, not even in the same league, at least not from my experience. And competitive markets generally require social promotion so there is no less updating required for serious eCommerce website marketing.

          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          I would highly doubt that one person is running that business you have pointed out in this thread. Even though I have declared on numerous occasions that this business model was by far the best, that is the first example I've ever seen of someone with more than 100 ecommerce sites, more than likely created to gain an unfair competitive advantage over their rivals.
          I agree, it is not likely one person, alone, is running any highly successful website, and much less likely if they own and operate more than 100 successful websites. It didn't see anything that indicated the OP was a one-man-band. In fact, personally I wouldn't consider any one man company to be a "real" company, at least not in the way most people think of a successful company. I would consider a one man company to be a hobbyist, not a "real" company.

          Most investors would probably not consider a business with fewer than 5 employees, a "real" business if you were trying to sell it, they would look at it as more of a job, than a business. Often it is not considered a "real" business unless it covers all labor and employee costs, without the business owners providing free labor.


          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          The only real gripe I have is you can't generlize in the case of Google updates. There are many different types of people affected for many different reasons and alot of them are real business'.
          Yes, I was referring to the over-generalization that anyone with 140 sites may not be a "real" business. There is no reason to think that a "real" company could not handle that many websites. However, if you have evidence that suggests the OP runs a network of low quality junk websites, then fine point to that. Using the broad brush of the number of websites, is not a valid indicator, and should be impugned, as I just did.

          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          "Stop building links and start building a business" is not real advice sorry, probably just a way to lure yet more vunerable people through your signature and sell them yet more rehashed BS, Veracity?
          Apparently, not everyone agrees with your opinion on this matter. The OP didn't just say "Stop building links and start building a business", which by itself wouldn't be real advice. He used that statement as part of his advice on how to build better links, which made since in the context in which he used it. I personally think it is precisely the type of advice that many on this forum need hear.

          Originally Posted by dmtaylor247 View Post

          I agree, but what has this got to do with seo? We all know how to build links for traffic don't we?
          No, it seems obvious to me that many folks posting on this forum do not know the best ways to build links, and I believe that was the whole point of this thread. Building web spam seems to have become very popular for members here, and now many are suffering due to the algorithm updates that have been devaluing their efforts.


          In a nutshell, the OP is saying "stop being a spammer and start building value". Which seems to me to be solid advice, and exactly the advice many Warriors need to hear. Not all backlinks hold the same value, and people need to think about that if they want to succeed at SEO.
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          • Profile picture of the author dmtaylor247
            Originally Posted by dburk View Post

            In a nutshell, the OP is saying "stop being a spammer and start building value". Which seems to me to be solid advice, and exactly the advice many Warriors need to hear. Not all backlinks hold the same value, and people need to think about that if they want to succeed at SEO.
            OK maybe I took it out of context so we can all agree on that, if I offended OP then I apologise, but there's no reason to be insensitive about what you're saying here and insulting people.

            It's doesn't mean link building or seo is bad or doesn't work and it doesn't mean people who build links haven't got a real business but it does probably mean most of them that got caught up in the update are spammers or who are employing spammers. Spam and link building are two different things in my opinion.

            I encourage people to keep building quality links and working on seo, here's my advice to people who build links with no relevance;

            http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...oesnt-pay.html

            It's not that I don't do whitehat seo, I do and have business websites that rank very well in Google with whitehat back linking and yes they are real business', I fully understand how to build links correctly, without spamming but you're right some people don't understand..
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  • Profile picture of the author PhilJensen
    Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

    That was easy.

    Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

    I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

    If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

    So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

    Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

    Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

    P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
    I agree 100%!
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  • Profile picture of the author toman
    Backlinks still important to get good position in the SE,the problem is there are many people not know the proper way to build backlinks.
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  • Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

    That was easy.

    Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

    I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

    If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

    So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

    Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

    Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

    P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
    You are right. One way is to do Social media like facebook fan page or twitter. There are so many people who are using facebook and twitter.
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    • Profile picture of the author lindasofia
      It is very strange. You are saying stop building backlinks and have posted links in your post. Why are doing this?? What you think that other people are mad??
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      • Profile picture of the author unitefl
        I see an online business as being no different to a brick and mortar business in many regards and thus, they key to a successful business is balance.

        When we look at successful brick and mortar businesses they usually share many of the same attributes that helped them become profitable. These include such things as a good location usually in a high traffic area, a good product or service a nice looking store or office. They also actively promote their business with solid advertising and repeat customers.

        An online business is no different except the location is where you rank in google, being page one for a related keyword is like being smack bang on the busiest street in the CBD. That being said theres no point being in a great location if ur store is ugly, messy/unorganized and uninteresting. People will stick their head into ur store and instantly walk out. Apple stores are a great example of how a store should be, clean, attractive and easy to find what you need. Your websites shouldnt be any different, if your ranking well your site needs to be clean , attractive and easy to navigate or people are going to close your site and go straight to the next.

        Last is promotion, successful stores will advertise everywhere, on TV , the radio or whatever it takes to get your brand or name out there.

        So with all this taken into consideration telling people to stop building backlinks is like asking them to stop doing one of the most fundamental things that attributes to a successful website. If you think that posting on blogs, social bookmarking or social networking is spammy, how does this vary from what brick and mortar businesses do with their advertising? i will do what ever it takes to get my brand known.

        Again it is all about balance, a good business will do what they can to get rank, to promote their brand and to provide the user a great experience and a reason to return
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      • Profile picture of the author Aarav
        Thanks a lot Justin for this useful post. I really appreciate your work on stop "backlink building" because its spammy things. Let's start to do quality & powerful backlink building because it's very effective on get relevant traffics, high page rank and higher search engine ranking.
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        • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
          Originally Posted by Aarav View Post

          Thanks a lot Justin for this useful post. I really appreciate your work on stop "backlink building" because its spammy things. Let's start to do quality & powerful backlink building because it's very effective on get relevant traffics, high page rank and higher search engine ranking.


          I hate spam just as much as everyone else.

          But to see so many people out there online spamming the web and not even thinking about what they are doing.. it's outrageous.

          How can you do something that you hate so dearly?

          If someone spammed a spammers inbox, I bet you they'd be a little ticked.
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    • Profile picture of the author anjaneyulu
      Thanks for the great information dude...
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  • Profile picture of the author styledoesmatter
    I love the "stop doing SEO because it's not a real business" threads. Less competition in the top 3 for me.

    Have fun dealing with pain in the %@$ clients and answering customer service emails. My real business of building backlinks and cashing Adsense checks is rocking and rolling.
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  • Profile picture of the author Shaun Tango
    If you promote your business using real marketing tactics, you've got a much better chance of succeeding in the long-term. When marketing, you'll naturally be leaving relevant links on related websites. Not only will these links be useful for strengthening the SEO value of your website, but it will also gain you traffic by direct click throughs from targeted prospects. This is a much better way of building links for the sake of it by automating a load of links to your website. I think this is what Justin was trying to say?


    We all know links still help, but building spammy non relevant links are starting to do less and less for your business. Get links as a by-product to real marketing, as even if you don't end up getting Google traffic (You should) you'll still have people visiting and interacting with your business.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by Shaun Tango View Post

      If you promote your business using real marketing tactics, you've got a much better chance of succeeding in the long-term. When marketing, you'll naturally be leaving relevant links on related websites. Not only will these links be useful for strengthening the SEO value of your website, but it will also gain you traffic by direct click throughs from targeted prospects. This is a much better way of building links for the sake of it by automating a load of links to your website. I think this is what Justin was trying to say?


      We all know links still help, but building spammy non relevant links are starting to do less and less for your business. Get links as a by-product to real marketing, as even if you don't end up getting Google traffic (You should) you'll still have people visiting and interacting with your business.
      I absolutely agree.

      And you understood my argument pretty clearly

      Long-term success needs to be our ultimate goal.
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    I'd rather not just create another thread.

    Does anyone feel that backlinks have lost their power now that the penguin update has taken place

    I'm not bashing anyone, but I really dislike the theory of just backlinking and not doing anything else.

    Traffic, traffic, traffic. It's king if it's targeted.
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    • Profile picture of the author retsek
      Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

      I'd rather not just create another thread.

      Does anyone feel that backlinks have lost their power now that the penguin update has taken place

      I'm not bashing anyone, but I really dislike the theory of just backlinking and not doing anything else.

      Traffic, traffic, traffic. It's king if it's targeted.
      Nope, I don't. They'll be a key piece of the puzzle for a very long time to come.

      Your thread title should have read "Stop building backlinks, Start Earning Them".
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      • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
        Originally Posted by retsek View Post

        Nope, I don't. They'll be a key piece of the puzzle for a very long time to come.

        Your thread title should have read "Stop building backlinks, Start Earning Them".
        Ha, I do agree that's a good title But controversy is also a great way to build attention. Which is similar to that of earning it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mantasmo
      Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

      I'd rather not just create another thread.

      Does anyone feel that backlinks have lost their power now that the penguin update has taken place
      Not even close. If anything, I'm finding that right now it's much easier to rank with just good quality backlinks than it has ever been (that I can remember).

      I'm not bashing anyone, but I really dislike the theory of just backlinking and not doing anything else.
      I have no idea why anyone would "just backlink" and not do anything else. In what context? Building a website, ranking it, attracting visitors, getting conversions?
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  • Profile picture of the author GeraldNitram
    I have to admit that you really reeled me in with your thread title. Good job at that, Justin. You're right about your thread starter. People should look at the techniques as more of a way to reach out to the people rather than just any method that can help them rank on the search results.
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  • Profile picture of the author dukerutherford
    I agree with all your thoughts Justin. building backlinks wisely is mush more needed, don't just spam share knowledge and good content to related niche, always remember relevancy plus authority equals visibility.
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    @Bnetwork,

    There are tons of people out there using things like forum backlinks, comment backlinks, and other MASS backlink methods without even trying to build traffic at the same time.

    Yes, building a backlink can help with rankings, I've acknowledged that and agree with it, but to those out there that think backlinks are the only thing that build traffic or help a website rank, it's just the wrong way of going about things.

    There are too many people focusing so much on backlinks and nothing else, that they are just going no where.
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  • Profile picture of the author RevSEO
    I couldn't agree more....

    Everyone quit building/buying links, and start manually doing the process by building your brand about "hemorrhoid creams".

    Or, for the rest of us that's business is ranking for a large variety of niche sites, we'll be smart and outsource the work and focus on scaling our portfolio.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nickro
    I swear i dont know what you guys talk about in the last two months i added more than half of million backlinks , from few sites that have lots of links indexed in google ( about 200.000 each ) and im allready on first page on 3 keywords with over 200.000 exact match searches .
    My organic traffic increased with 7k from 2 k a month.
    So really why should we stop doing backlins???
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by Nickro View Post

      I swear i dont know what you guys talk about in the last two months i added more than half of million backlinks , from few sites that have lots of links indexed in google ( about 200.000 each ) and im allready on first page on 3 keywords with over 200.000 exact match searches .
      My organic traffic increased with 7k from 2 k a month.
      So really why should we stop doing backlins???
      You added a half million backlinks to a site in the last 2 months?

      Just to note, we are talking about long term success, not just shots of joy and then dismal rankings.

      If you want to truly succeed, you need to think of the long term methods.
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  • Profile picture of the author farabi
    This is really valuable information for SEO specialists but as a SEO worker! i always want to make backlink for my blog. But i also concern about my blog content quality. I have doubt about some point here Justin say about these.

    Thanks
    Farabi
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  • Profile picture of the author Nickro
    I agree content quality should be very good , but why stop doing backlinks ? without backlinks you wont get high in search engines , no traffic means thats no people to share your content , even if its good quality
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  • Profile picture of the author Hasse1
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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  • Profile picture of the author TuNguyen
    Really wish that people would take time to process the message(s) inside the post rather than just reply to the headline.
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  • Profile picture of the author Nickro
    Links to Your Site
    Total links
    1,201,666
    this is how many links i have at the moment pointing to my website .
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    I had an idea of what website you were referring to so I did a bit of research into it.

    Personally, I don't mess around with junk sites. I've had them before and know that traffic can be amazing to them, but the profitability is so minimal.

    As far as I'm concerned, I was referring to building a real reputation in different industries that are more profitable.

    Nothing against your niche and I realize you've probably put a lot of time into backlinks, but you should focus on targeted traffic more than anything else.

    Why not use your current statistics for exmaple to start building a Facebook page, subscription list, product, brand, etc.

    Search engine traffic is great, but what happens when Google changes it's algorithm slightly and suddenly you have no traffic? Get where I'm going with this?

    It's about long term, not short term. If you focus so much on short term you're going to be working your tail off for the rest of your life.

    I've setup streams of traffic that flow easily from Facebook, Google, subscription lists, forums, answer sites, articles, classified networks, and so many other locations. If Google were to fall off the map with my sites, I'd be fine on most of them because of this precaution, just think about it
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  • Profile picture of the author Nickro
    1. I dont know if i get what you saying but seriously what could be more long term then doing seo & backlinks? it takes time to rank for good keywords and it takes time to do backlinks , so what could take more than doing seo and backlinking? This is the ultimate long term thing that you can do for your website .
    2. facebook , in the last 3 months i got 500 likes now a total of 1600 , i guess thats a good thing right?
    3. most of my traffic comes from social sites not search engine , like stumbleupon , twitter , facebook , pinterest , reddit ,, etc . ive only just started to get some serious traffic from search engines , till now i was just trying to rank for the keywords
    And targeted traffic? focusing to rank for some specific keywords , how come that isnt targeted? if the traffic comes from the keywords that i want means its targeted right?
    It's not junk website , its a easy website compared to others maybe , but not junk , its my first website to be honest and i learned a lot and still doing experiments , regarding seo and wordpress , i am a newbie and i learned lots of things , at least thats what i think , even if ppc dosent work for me i can start other website and i can send traffic to it from this one and maybe converts right?

    Even if search engines change algorythm , what will guide them to show best sites in the searches?
    Still backlinks ( that means very important to have them ) , maybe social media appearance ?
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  • Profile picture of the author marco005
    Hi,

    @Justin, can you explain me a bit morein detail your busines smodel? How do you get traffic when you not build backlinks or so, how you make that? Only social traffic? but social traffic does not convert with adsense or affiliate sites.

    Or dou you build lists? (I don't will do that)

    And folks please,
    this AGTStore this has most no content, only a few sentence or few sentence reviews all from amazon,its an pure non content astore. Does this big store make big bucks every month????
    How they make that? How this store build backllinks?????

    marco005
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by marco005 View Post

      Hi,

      @Justin, can you explain me a bit morein detail your busines smodel? How do you get traffic when you not build backlinks or so, how you make that? Only social traffic? but social traffic does not convert with adsense or affiliate sites.
      Great question. See if you read throughout the posts, you'll notice that just because I'm against backlinks, doesn't mean I'm against sharing a link to your site in a natural way. I'm against the "spamming" of backlinks and the abuse that most bloggers are doing.

      I use all forms of traffic whether they be via video (Youtube), forums, answer sites, classified sites, social sites, etc.

      But let's make one thing clear.

      Who in the heck said that social traffic doesn't' convert? Where do you get this argument from? Have you experienced it yourself?

      I want everyone reading this post to realize that social traffic is "REAL" traffic. They are REAL people, meaning they can convert into REAL money.

      If you haven't had experience with social on a LARGE scale like I have, then you shouldn't be expressing things like this without experience. I just don't want others to think that social is a lost cause, because it totally isn't.

      Originally Posted by marco005 View Post

      Or dou you build lists? (I don't will do that)
      I do build lists. But I noticed you stated that you won't build lists.. if you aren't going to try out different methods and be strict on what you do, you're going to fall behind.
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  • Profile picture of the author CI Carpet
    Yes you are right but... you have to play the game to win. Unfortunately we didn't make up the rules BIG "G" did.
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  • Profile picture of the author marco005
    Hi,

    Does such amazon stores like the AGTStore.com example makes big bucks?
    So many people buy on shops who have trust, more product information content than AGTStore.come and they have a shop trust seal.

    So that I wonder that this AGTStore makes huge bucks(?)

    marco005
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  • Profile picture of the author onlinemarketer23
    the point on backlinking process to our business sites is smartly diversified our seo tasks with other alternatives which lead us to rake in money as we get authority in the search engine result pages.. thx a lot for your advice mate!! good luck...
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  • Profile picture of the author marketwarrior06
    Banned
    If you have great business with products or contents you don't have to build too many links to get ranked. Because your business name will do that for you
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    I saw an excellent post by someone on Twitter last night.

    @PamMktgNut
    Have never purch a link or any black hat SEO, only focus on value in content! Have 225k backlinks & 2 Technorati top 100 lists! #getrealchat
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  • Profile picture of the author denysapu
    I got the points! SEO is growing, as well as to improve the ranking factors, the role of backlinks, the value of every backlink, and many more.
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  • Profile picture of the author freeadstime
    Google has send out many unnatural link notices in past few month. You basically need to have a wonderful site that attract the links on its own, rather than aiming for it.
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  • Profile picture of the author FIP
    Spot on Justin!
    Stop building backlinks and start building a business is excellent advice.
    Penguin and Panda got my attention.
    Build the business and the rest will look after itself if you naturally and organically look to promote your business.
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  • Profile picture of the author gearmonkey
    Go for high quality backlinks. I avoid the forum profiles and mass blog comments.

    I'm earning more money than EVER!

    It's always wise to build your brand, of course.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by gearmonkey View Post

      Go for high quality backlinks. I avoid the forum profiles and mass blog comments.

      I'm earning more money than EVER!

      It's always wise to build your brand, of course.
      Of course someone offering backlink services would say this

      I understand why backlinks can help someones business, but the fact that so many people are just building backlinks.. for search engine rankings is annoying. They should be focusing on really building a business.

      And if you do focus on backlinks, put your time into something that is more long-term beneficial and actually helps people.

      Last note... paying for backlinks? HA. That just sounds outrageous to me. I couldn't imagine having someone else control the way my business is being built on that level. Especially when most of those services just spam the internet :\
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  • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
    Ha.

    I posted this months ago and now everyones talking about how building backlinks is a waste of time.

    A bit late I'd say.

    If you want to do good, earn the links, build traffic using other sources, and do #RCS (Real Company Sh*t).

    I'm not a fan of manually (or automatically) building tons of backlinks, instead I want people to share my content with their friends and family. Get personal.
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    • Profile picture of the author retsek
      Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

      If you want to do good, earn the links, build traffic using other sources, and do #RCS (Real Company Sh*t).
      #RCS for the win. That was an exceptional presentation by Wil.
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      • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
        Originally Posted by retsek View Post

        #RCS for the win. That was an exceptional presentation by Wil.
        Absolutely.

        And good to see someone else who actually knows what the term means haha. I've been preaching #RCS since I started 2 years ago even before the term was present lol.

        But definitely a good share. Anyone wondering you can see that one here: 2012 #MozCon Videos Are Here | SEOmoz (just watch the samples)
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        • Profile picture of the author retsek
          Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

          But definitely a good share. Anyone wondering you can see that one here: 2012 #MozCon Videos Are Here | SEOmoz (just watch the samples)
          Highly recommended. No need to buy, just watch the free vid. It's about an hour long.
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  • Profile picture of the author PerformanceMan
    Justin,

    46% of the backlinks to your website say "Website Design." Those are built links.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by PerformanceMan View Post

      Justin,

      46% of the backlinks to your website say "Website Design." Those are built links.
      We've built hundreds upon hundreds of websites for clients. They aren't just tossed up on some random blogs or sites. They are earned by hard work and effort put into each individual project. It's similar to that of attribution.

      When you buy an iPhone, the logo is there. The only difference is that we are on the internet.

      Website Design/Website Creation is just in reference to what we did for them, hence why the backlink isn't just some run of the mill, tossed up backlink like you'd see on a linkfarm or any of that junk out there.



      But yes, you are right, I do include a link at the footer of every website build. Thanks for noticing

      EDIT: Here's a post from Rand at SEOMoz back in 2008. http://www.seomoz.org/blog/headsmack...-for-your-work not saying it's up-to-date but he does state " Yet, to this day, even many companies and sites that are focused on growing their search traffic don't think about optimizing the links they've earned."
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  • Profile picture of the author Make Money Ninja
    You people annoy me, seems like everyone is an expert on the warrior forum.

    Everyone please stop building backlinks... give me more profit.. thank you!!
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  • Profile picture of the author PerformanceMan
    They may be earned, but they included targeted anchor text.

    To be truly 'White Hat' you should use your brand name and not keywords for your incoming links. Using keyword-driven anchor text could be considered 'manipulative.' Using your brand name really can't.

    Just some food for thought.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by PerformanceMan View Post

      They may be earned, but they included targeted anchor text.

      To be truly 'White Hat' you should use your brand name and not keywords for your incoming links. Using keyword-driven anchor text could be considered 'manipulative.' Using your brand name really can't.

      Just some food for thought.
      And I understand your point, but the way I see it, the term Website Design or Website Creation refers to what we actually did, versus just tossing our name up there with no indication.

      Hope that makes sense.

      If you were browsing a local businesses website and didn't really know much about the internet, but wanted to see who designed the website, you'd be looking for website design/website creation somewhere.

      Hence the original thought process behind the link when we started.



      Do I believe backlinks are completely useless? Nope. Consider searching for "Click Here" in Google and you'd see Adobe comes up in the top 10, due to their massive link campaign in relation to their product.

      So, they are doing something wrong because they are using the term "click here" instead of "adobe", right?

      And if you were to say, that click here is a call to action, the same could be say regarding our own links.

      Great discussion.
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  • Profile picture of the author MaxNiche
    People wish for immediate success,Whenever they find a loophole they will use it.(Including me).

    But recent changes have changed my mind onto building a brand and business.
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  • Profile picture of the author olelar
    I completely agree with OP.
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  • Profile picture of the author MRamocsai
    I agree that mindless backlink building probably isn't the best solution right now. I still think backlinks should be pursued, however. I think the key is looking at the process as a marketing one. You should be aiming for the kinds of links that will get you places (getting published on websites in your niche, for example).

    But signing up for a forum like this one for the sole purpose of getting a backlink to your jewelry store is nonsensical. When you're building links you've got to think about whether or not it's out of place. It should be more about the relevant traffic the link will produce as opposed to the PR juice it provides.

    Just the way I view the game at the moment.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by MRamocsai View Post

      I agree that mindless backlink building probably isn't the best solution right now. I still think backlinks should be pursued, however. I think the key is looking at the process as a marketing one. You should be aiming for the kinds of links that will get you places (getting published on websites in your niche, for example).

      But signing up for a forum like this one for the sole purpose of getting a backlink to your jewelry store is nonsensical. When you're building links you've got to think about whether or not it's out of place. It should be more about the relevant traffic the link will produce as opposed to the PR juice it provides.

      Just the way I view the game at the moment.
      I agree on most of what you're saying.

      The only thing I'm all blah blah about is the whole concept of still considering it "building backlinks".

      I don't want to build backlinks, I want to build a business with people.

      I know a lot of people keep thinking I'm saying "hey stop doing stuff that's going to help your rankings" but I'm actually just trying to get across the whole mindset of "building backlinks" and instead focusing on doing something to progress yourself.

      To get rid of the term "building backlinks" and doing real $#17 that's going to progress you (even if it means gaining links) is the idea I want to express.
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      • Profile picture of the author MRamocsai
        Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

        I agree on most of what you're saying.

        The only thing I'm all blah blah about is the whole concept of still considering it "building backlinks".

        I don't want to build backlinks, I want to build a business with people.

        I know a lot of people keep thinking I'm saying "hey stop doing stuff that's going to help your rankings" but I'm actually just trying to get across the whole mindset of "building backlinks" and instead focusing on doing something to progress yourself.

        To get rid of the term "building backlinks" and doing real $#17 that's going to progress you (even if it means gaining links) is the idea I want to express.
        Yeah, I know where you're coming from. Backlinks should be an afterthought next to relevant marketing channels. It's a shift in perspective that can make all the difference. I won't lie, I build links during my marketing process but it's more about the marketing that will produce results.
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        • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
          Originally Posted by MRamocsai View Post

          Yeah, I know where you're coming from. Backlinks should be an afterthought next to relevant marketing channels. It's a shift in perspective that can make all the difference. I won't lie, I build links during my marketing process but it's more about the marketing that will produce results.
          Even companies like SEOMoz are pushing away from backlinks more than ever.

          It only makes sense though.

          Social signals are having such a huge impact now.
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          • Profile picture of the author danparks
            Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

            Social signals are having such a huge impact now.
            I keep hearing this, and I have yet to hear someone offer up some real information regarding this. To me it seems like because social media is hot (Twitter, Facebook), a lot of people are just assuming that yes, Google must obviously be including social media for SERPS. Just how is Google using "social signals" in determining SERPS? I'm not looking to argue about this, just curious to hear some real success stories of ranking sites using, what, Facebook Likes? Lots of Twitter followers? Or .... ?
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            • Profile picture of the author retsek
              Originally Posted by danparks View Post

              I'm not looking to argue about this, just curious to hear some real success stories of ranking sites using, what, Facebook Likes? Lots of Twitter followers? Or .... ?
              You aren't going to find any. Sites cannot compete on social alone. Google says they use social signals, but there's also another 199~ signals that come into play. Some weighted alot more heavier than others PLUS the balance is always being tweaked.

              Because of that, you can find sites that completely dominate their industry without having a single social media account. It's not a major search engine factor now, but it may be in the distant future (if ever).

              There's other reasons to do social besides search engine rankings -- traffic for example. People are so caught up with the idea that they can manufacture their way to #1, that they miss the whole point.
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              • Profile picture of the author danparks
                Originally Posted by retsek View Post

                You aren't going to find any. Sites cannot compete on social alone. Google says they use social signals, but there's also another 199~ signals that come into play. Some weighted alot more heavier than others PLUS the balance is always being tweaked.

                Because of that, you can find sites that completely dominate their industry without having a single social media account. It's not a major search engine factor now, but it may be in the distant future (if ever).

                There's other reasons to do social besides search engine rankings -- traffic for example. People are so caught up with the idea that they can manufacture their way to #1, that they miss the whole point.
                This pretty much matches my thinking. Probably not using social signals. Maybe a little. Quite possible more or a lot in the future, but not there yet. And yes, social media can be quite useful for getting traffic outside of search engines.

                If anyone has anything other than the standard "yes social signals are very Google important rank site high use them much" kind of reply that I typically see, I'd love to hear it.
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            • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
              Originally Posted by danparks View Post

              I keep hearing this, and I have yet to hear someone offer up some real information regarding this. To me it seems like because social media is hot (Twitter, Facebook), a lot of people are just assuming that yes, Google must obviously be including social media for SERPS. Just how is Google using "social signals" in determining SERPS? I'm not looking to argue about this, just curious to hear some real success stories of ranking sites using, what, Facebook Likes? Lots of Twitter followers? Or .... ?
              Who said I was focusing on "social sites" only?

              I'm saying, focus on directing people to your site via other sites relative to your niche.

              This could mean...
              • Yahoo Answers
              • Related Forums
              • Guest Posting
              • Blog Commenting (on legit blogs)
              • Craigslist
              • Article Directories
              • And.. if you'd like go ahead and use Facebook and Twitter as well

              Among just a few methods.

              But I never stated, "Hey social is the only good thing, only focus on that".

              BUT..... (again)

              Here are some bits of helpful info for ya's.

              Matt Cutts on Social Signals


              Links Are Better Than Social (duh)

              Google's Matt Cutts On Links vs. Social Signals

              But guess what, that's why you use the many traffic methods (which build backlinks as well) and stop putting your primary focus on a "backlink".

              Guide to Social Signals

              In two years, companies playing in competitive niches that don’t have a robust social strategy will be left in the dust by those that do; Social signals are becoming the new “link” in terms of overall importance in the ranking algorithm. While I don’t believe the value of links as a ranking signal will ever completely disappear, I do believe that direct and indirect impacts of social signals will eventually surpass links as the most valuable ranking factor.

              Why? Several reasons:
              http://www.seomoz.org/blog/your-guid...ignals-for-seo
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              • Profile picture of the author danparks
                I read this...

                Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

                Even companies like SEOMoz are pushing away from backlinks more than ever.

                It only makes sense though.

                Social signals are having such a huge impact now.
                ... as you implying that social signals were more important for SEO than backlinks are. I see from your latest post that's not what you're saying. Okay, I get you now. You're talking more about social media for direct traffic rather than for SERPs ranking. Makes sense.

                I'm one of those people who is a little hesitant to fully believe Matt, because it's not his job to pass on information that will help SEO people. The video you showed was informative, but it does include statements such as Google is using social signals "relatively lightly" and "I would caution people not to..." and "we're looking into it more broadly". So even here he's not defending it much for SEO (granted the video is from 2010, so things could have changed though).

                and:

                "I do believe that direct and indirect impacts of social signals will eventually surpass links as the most valuable ranking factor"

                The word eventually is pretty meaningful. It goes with my belief that social signals might become important for SERPs, but are not at this time.

                What I said previously then isn't directed at you. It's directed at the many, many people who comment about how you must put the emphasis on social media (mostly Facebook Likes and Twitter tweets) to rank in SERPs. My previous question still stands then. Those of you who believe that to be true, what makes you think Facebook and Twitter can boost a site in SERPs, and what are you doing with those social media sites, and most importantly, why do you believe they're helping sites rank in SERPs (I mean from experience, not just because "it's obvious" or "because of course it's true"?
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  • Originally Posted by Justin Lewis View Post

    That was easy.

    Now stop "building backlinks" and start progressing your business.

    I'm not saying that you should stop the actual backlink building process entirely. I'm telling you to change the way you look at it.

    If all you are doing is "building backlinks" then you are most likely just spamming the internet with more useless nonsense.

    So, how about instead of "building backlinks", you actually put effort into building a real business. Whether that be with a niche website, your primary business, a product, service, whatever it is that you have to offer.

    Go out there and promote your business in a way where you are actually doing something that seems.. legit.

    Stop building backlinks and start building a future.

    P.S. I understand there will be comments about how backlinks help rank websites, but seriously.. think about what you're doing. Most likely you are spamming the internet with more junk. The time is yours.. how are you going to spend it?
    Or you could just outsource your backlink building, and focus on expanding your business.
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by strategic seo services View Post

      Or you could just outsource your backlink building, and focus on expanding your business.
      Ha.

      That seems like a direct statement to push your own product Rather than pushing a product, shouldn't we try to really enlighten people?

      Expanding your business could relate directly to building traffic, which in turn is building a backlink. Why not tell people to stop focusing on the backlink side and focus more on the traffic side
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  • Profile picture of the author Dentist
    Build backlinks a little smarter. That's what everything is about.
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  • Profile picture of the author DPM70
    Hey danparks got it! Yay! Give him the answers!
    Signature
    I don't build in order to have clients. I have clients in order to build. - Ayn Rand
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  • Profile picture of the author RyanLB
    Instead of just attempting to get backlinks from anywhere and everywhere, I would recommend focusing on links that will actually send traffic to your site.

    Not only do those links tend to be better for SEO purposes, but at the same time you are diversifying your traffic sources.
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    I'm a Freelance Copywriter that helps Agencies, Startups and Businesses Educate Their Audience and Grow Sales
    Skype Me: r.boze
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    • Profile picture of the author Justin Says
      Originally Posted by RyanLB View Post

      Instead of just attempting to get backlinks from anywhere and everywhere, I would recommend focusing on links that will actually send traffic to your site.

      Not only do those links tend to be better for SEO purposes, but at the same time you are diversifying your traffic sources.
      Precisely my point here

      All these "gurus" are just throwing product after product out about "backlink builders" and "backlink strategies" but they keep forgetting to even say.. hey and while you're at it, build traffic at the same time!

      Yes, search engine traffic, is traffic. But why waste your time on something that's only going to give you a short term success? Instead invest more time into traffic building, which in turn builds backlinks at the same time
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