Google Update - Where to Go From Here?

41 replies
  • SEO
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I'm sure we all know by now that Google have released an update which has effected many of us. But where are we meant to go from here? Wait a few days to see if our rankings go back to usual? Remove links? What?

I'm not sure why my main site was hit. It wasn't an EMD, no blackhat techniques, unique content, 100 + posts. It was an Amazon affiliate site, though. Maybe that has something to do with it. I also signed up to five web 2.0 sites and added 5 posts to each. But this was only yesterday, so I doubt that they've even been indexed yet. I pretty much did no backlinking, as the KWs were very low competition.

Anyone without an EMD experienced the same thing? What's your plan?
#google #update
  • Profile picture of the author Geekgirl01
    Make your own unique plan!

    Look at your competitors for the keyword, see what they are doing and ask yourself how you can do better.....then do better!

    There must be a reason other than affiliate amazon as to why you got crushed. There are plenty of websites that focus on amazon afffiliate that are still in #1 spot.
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  • Profile picture of the author nmb
    I would give it a week or so to let things settle down and then see where you stand. A lot of my sites have been hit but now is not the time to panic.
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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by nmb View Post

      I would give it a week or so to let things settle down and then see where you stand. A lot of my sites have been hit but now is not the time to panic.
      This is exactly what folks should be doing. Take a breath, sit tight, and see what shakes out.

      One of my lesser-quality sites (very, very little content) took a major hit. My two larger, higher-quality sites look like they may surpass their average daily traffic by a long shot today. Everything else in between seems pretty static.
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      • Profile picture of the author milliondream
        Yes, I'm very surprise, after recheck ranking of my keywords.
        Shocking, 60% of my site down from 1st page. I'm gray hat, but after penguin update I'm never effect like today. (60% of my site unique content and back link from high authority site. )

        But don't worries, I things something dance from Google. Wait a few days to see if our rankings go back to usual?
        If rankings not go back. I'm would be make a new site by urgently, cause of competitor same problem. It easy if start to new site by white hat.

        Today, I'm lucky, more traffic came from social network. Don't care Google.
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        • Profile picture of the author joshpat2
          most of mine plummeted ..... what now
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          • Profile picture of the author Carl Brown
            FINALLY! An update that was GOOD for me! My ONE site has moved WAY up. I attribute it to making everything at least LOOK as natural as possible, and building your site FOR THE VISITOR.

            I do have one EMD that hasn't been penalized in any way--YET (it still owns the top 5 spots in Google for one keyword.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
    Those who didn't get hit simply got lucky or somehow have worked out the exact types of backlinks google wants.

    You can have a quality site
    You can NOT have a exact match domain

    I wouldn't be feeling smart, it could of happened to anyone.
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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

      Those who didn't get hit simply got lucky
      Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. It's not a lottery. Give Google what it wants and you will have fewer problems.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
        Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

        Luck has absolutely nothing to do with it. It's not a lottery. Give Google what it wants and you will have fewer problems.
        Nobody knows what Google wants specifically.

        You need to do SEO to rank, and if you do it in a way that they don't like you get hit, yet they don't tell you exactly what they want, it's a big grey area.

        Perhaps you have a better understanding? I guess thats possible.

        Anyway I understand peoples pain I've had this happen to me too in the past, but when I see high quality sites get penalised too, it's quite scary.
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        • Profile picture of the author Carl Brown
          Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

          Nobody knows what Google wants specifically.

          You need to do SEO to rank, and if you do it in a way that they don't like you get hit, yet they don't tell you exactly what they want, it's a big grey area.

          Perhaps you have a better understanding? I guess thats possible.

          Anyway I understand peoples pain I've had this happen to me too in the past, but when I see high quality sites get penalised too, it's quite scary.
          They pretty much tell you. They're just getting better at enforcing it. If you do SEO, it has to look NATURAL.
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        • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
          Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

          Nobody knows what Google wants specifically.
          Yes they do. Google has made it clear. It's just that people are too busy with their tinfoil hats.

          Google has made it clear:
          • Build sites for visitors, not bots.
          • Produce quality content (quality according to a neutral third party, not your own biased opinion).
          • Gain natural backlinks (not "natural" backlinks that you build yourself).
          • Build a brand (underwatercamerasunder300.info isn't a brand).

          Will innocent bystanders get caught in the crossfire even when following these guidelines? Sure, but you are far less susceptible to the crossfire when you give Google what it asks for.

          It's not Google's fault people flat out ignore their guidelines and put on their tinfoil hats when Cutts talks.
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          • Profile picture of the author Ernie Lo
            Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

            • Gain natural backlinks (not "natural" backlinks that you build yourself).
            and how is a new unknown site that perhaps is in a small/boring/unviral type niche suppose to do that and compete with all the webmasters who do all the greyhay/blackhat stuff and get rewarded (even if temporarily until an update like this happens)
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            • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
              Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

              [/LIST]and how is a new unknown site that perhaps is in a small/boring/unviral type niche suppose to do that and compete with all the webmasters who do all the greyhay/blackhat stuff and get rewarded (even if temporarily until an update like this happens)
              You advertise it. Look, I have a few larger sites that I did nothing but socially bookmark. Know what? One of them semi-regularly gets referenced by mega-sites like slickdeals, woot, etc.

              It's no different from any other brick and mortar business. To get traffic, you need to advertise.

              By doing the other three things I mentioned, the backlinks will often times sort themselves out. I know this from experience.
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          • Profile picture of the author remodeler
            Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

            Yes they do. Google has made it clear. It's just that people are too busy with their tinfoil hats.

            Google has made it clear:
            • Build sites for visitors, not bots.
            • Produce quality content (quality according to a neutral third party, not your own biased opinion).
            • Gain natural backlinks (not "natural" backlinks that you build yourself).
            • Build a brand (underwatercamerasunder300.info isn't a brand).

            Will innocent bystanders get caught in the crossfire even when following these guidelines? Sure, but you are far less susceptible to the crossfire when you give Google what it asks for.

            It's not Google's fault people flat out ignore their guidelines and put on their tinfoil hats when Cutts talks.
            Excellent post.

            You know, I started looking at Google differently after spending years trying to game them. I got hit HARD with the update from Oct 13th of a year ago. Had a 5 figure a month income go to a few hundred dollars. Had to change my thinking completely or simply give up and go try to get a job.

            I did an experiment of sorts in building out a new site with a new brandable domain name. Added 1-2 new pages of content every day. NO "artificial" backlinking of ANY sort has ever been done, nor will ever be done. The results? Success beyond what I thought possible. And none of these animal updates or this latest EMD one has had any affect. In fact, traffic the last 2 days is up over 20%.

            This business is changing, and you have to treat it as a business if you want to earn a full-time income. The good news is that it really is simple for most anyone. Make a plan, get a brandable domain, build your brand, avoid the gimmick backlinking crap and shortcuts, add new content consistently and treat it like a real business. Help your visitors and customers get what they are looking for.

            It's really no different than a retail store at the mall. In fact, I've spent time in the past getting a mental image of a physical store in my mind and what attracts people, what they are looking for, what info they are seeking, and then translating that into how I can develop my online site to best help my visitors. It may seem tiresome and boring to write and post up new content every day, answer occasional emails, etc., but it pays off. I feel for the people here that have lost their sites and their income. I wish you the best in future and hope this might help spark a new idea or two.
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            • Profile picture of the author CatherineMay
              Originally Posted by remodeler View Post

              Excellent post.

              You know, I started looking at Google differently after spending years trying to game them. I got hit HARD with the update from Oct 13th of a year ago. Had a 5 figure a month income go to a few hundred dollars. Had to change my thinking completely or simply give up and go try to get a job.

              I did an experiment of sorts in building out a new site with a new brandable domain name. Added 1-2 new pages of content every day. NO "artificial" backlinking of ANY sort has ever been done, nor will ever be done. The results? Success beyond what I thought possible. And none of these animal updates or this latest EMD one has had any affect. In fact, traffic the last 2 days is up over 20%.

              This business is changing, and you have to treat it as a business if you want to earn a full-time income. The good news is that it really is simple for most anyone. Make a plan, get a brandable domain, build your brand, avoid the gimmick backlinking crap and shortcuts, add new content consistently and treat it like a real business. Help your visitors and customers get what they are looking for.

              It's really no different than a retail store at the mall. In fact, I've spent time in the past getting a mental image of a physical store in my mind and what attracts people, what they are looking for, what info they are seeking, and then translating that into how I can develop my online site to best help my visitors. It may seem tiresome and boring to write and post up new content every day, answer occasional emails, etc., but it pays off. I feel for the people here that have lost their sites and their income. I wish you the best in future and hope this might help spark a new idea or two.
              Okay, all of this sounds very admirable, but can you or Wolfi explain what exactly is a brandable domain name? Do you just mean a name that is catchy, that maybe doesn't even have the main keyword in it at all? If the keyword isn't even in the name, then do you make sure the titles of posts have the keyword?

              For instance, if I wanted to do an Amazon site about the best bread machines, would "bestbreadmachinereviews" be okay or not okay? Or is it now necessary to get more creative?
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              • Profile picture of the author remodeler
                Originally Posted by CatherineMay View Post

                Okay, all of this sounds very admirable, but can you or Wolfi explain what exactly is a brandable domain name? Do you just mean a name that is catchy, that maybe doesn't even have the main keyword in it at all? If the keyword isn't even in the name, then do you make sure the titles of posts have the keyword?

                For instance, if I wanted to do an Amazon site about the best bread machines, would "bestbreadmachinereviews" be okay or not okay? Or is it now necessary to get more creative?
                Hi Catherine

                What I would recommend is taking a little time and drive through your retail district or walk around the mall. (You could even look in the Yellow Pages to make it quicker if you like. For me, getting away from the computer and taking a walk around helps me clear my mind better.)

                What are the names of the businesses you see? Forget keyword domains. Look at the biggest name of all ONLINE... Amazon. If you had never heard of them before, you would have no idea who or what they are. Others that just come to mind real quick that have nothing to do with the niche in their name; Old Navy, Zappos, and even something like Victoria's Secret. Hopefully you get the idea of what I mean.

                Now let's say you want to at least have the general idea of your niche in the domain. How about Toys-R-Us? Petco? Bed, Bath and Beyond, etc.? For the most part everyone here knows what these stores offer. They know what to expect when they go into them. They remember them when they need to go shopping for items related to the niche. That doesn't mean they will buy there every time, but they do come to mind immediately in most cases.

                I know that these are retail stores or ecommerce stores, and you may be building a site that is not about retail products, but that's not the point here. The point is building a brand, an identity that your visitors will remember, will recognize and eventually will come to trust. It doesn't matter if you are pushing affiliate products or building an adsense site for an educational niche...you want to be memorable.

                I'd argue that once you have established the niche market you want to build a site in, the next biggest step is getting a brandable domain name so that you can then start building an identity that sets you apart. I hope that helps.
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          • Profile picture of the author imer2012
            Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

            Yes they do. Google has made it clear. It's just that people are too busy with their tinfoil hats.

            Google has made it clear:
            • Build sites for visitors, not bots.
            • Produce quality content (quality according to a neutral third party, not your own biased opinion).
            • Gain natural backlinks (not "natural" backlinks that you build yourself).
            • Build a brand (underwatercamerasunder300.info isn't a brand).

            Will innocent bystanders get caught in the crossfire even when following these guidelines? Sure, but you are far less susceptible to the crossfire when you give Google what it asks for.

            It's not Google's fault people flat out ignore their guidelines and put on their tinfoil hats when Cutts talks.
            Hi wolfmmiii,
            Is there any tutorial/guide on how to get an brandable domain?
            Thanks,
            Tony
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            • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
              Originally Posted by imer2012 View Post

              Hi wolfmmiii,
              Is there any tutorial/guide on how to get an brandable domain?
              Thanks,
              Tony
              I've already been vilified by several folks for "pimping my stuff" so I'd rather not provide any more reason for them to vilify me.
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              • Profile picture of the author imer2012
                Originally Posted by wolfmmiii View Post

                I've already been vilified by several folks for "pimping my stuff" so I'd rather not provide any more reason for them to vilify me.
                It's OK. I will take a research on it. Thank you for your reply!
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          • Profile picture of the author mjzivko
            DELETED.
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        • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
          Originally Posted by mjzivko View Post

          Your pimpin the same old White Hat shit you can find on any post Penguin and Panda thread. DUH. Everyone knows what Google says they "want".
          Apparently they don't:

          Originally Posted by Ernie Lo View Post

          Nobody knows what Google wants specifically.

          You are arguing every point with me and talking about how I am pimping white hat rhetoric.

          I'm not pimping anything - I was answering a specific question.
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  • Profile picture of the author Dumkist
    Do you think this will effect rankings of pages that contain the keyword in the url ?
    Example: http://mysite.com/keyword
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    • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
      Originally Posted by Dumkist View Post

      Do you think this will effect rankings of pages that contain the keyword in the url ?
      Example: http://mysite.com/keyword
      It has on one of my lower quality sites. I'm testing now. My better sites have been unaffected.
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    • Profile picture of the author jimkirk1943
      Originally Posted by Dumkist View Post

      Do you think this will effect rankings of pages that contain the keyword in the url ?
      Example: http://mysite.com/keyword
      Thats a pretty impotant question not an EMD but a exact match keyword in the url
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      • Profile picture of the author Intrepreneur
        Let's be wise about all this.

        The results ARE NOT going to stay like this.

        Last time this happened it resolved eventually.

        Don't forget there are millions (I believe) of Google servers that updates need to be pushed to so calm down for now.

        That takes a long time to settle.

        It's only affecting 6% of queries so we're talking just EMDS.

        The rest will surface again soon.

        I said this last time and was right and will be right again.

        SO RELAX AND MAKE SOME TEA!
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        Started in 2009 now working on the above project.

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  • Profile picture of the author retsek
    wolfmmii, is on the money. If you're looking to make money, you need to treat it like a business. What would you do if search engines never existed ?

    You certainly wouldn't waste your time submitting crap to article directories, or doing a press release, or "building" a web2 page that no one will ever read.

    You'd do REAL shit so people know who you are and where to find you. You'd do things that get you traffic!
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    • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
      Originally Posted by retsek View Post

      You certainly wouldn't waste your time submitting crap to article directories, or doing a press release, or "building" a web2 page that no one will ever read.

      You'd do REAL shit so people know who you are and where to find you. You'd do things that get you traffic!
      You can do all of those that people will read if you put the quality in. They are all real depending in how you do them,
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  • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
    Thanks remodeler...

    That's the stuff I've been telling people about for months now. It's really not difficult. People just have to take the tinfoil hats off.
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  • Profile picture of the author daddykool
    Quality, age, no crap = no google issues!
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  • Profile picture of the author linkbuildr
    It's pretty simple even after seeing sites hit by other updates...you're making crappy websites with reviews on products you've never used inflated by spam backlinks. Make better websites that are actually useful.
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    • Profile picture of the author cooler1
      Originally Posted by linkbuildr View Post

      It's pretty simple even after seeing sites hit by other updates...you're making crappy websites with reviews on products you've never used inflated by spam backlinks. Make better websites that are actually useful.
      What has the fact whether someone has used a product they're reviewing got to do with whether they were affected by an update? Those two things are non related.

      The OP said he added web 2.0 backlinks. How are they spam? If you can't even do that to build links that are not deemed as spam, then what can you do.
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  • Profile picture of the author martinacastro
    @dreamtoreality

    you mean the last Panda update or you see other updates last week?

    I see changes in some of my site last week (thursday/friday)

    Regards

    Martin
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    • Profile picture of the author edgarallen
      "Google has made it clear:
      • Build sites for visitors, not bots.
      • Produce quality content (quality according to a neutral third party, not your own biased opinion).
      • Gain natural backlinks (not "natural" backlinks that you build yourself).
      • Build a brand (underwatercamerasunder300.info isn't a brand)."
      What a bunch of vague hooey! This is not advice that anyone can implement. "Produce quality content..." what is that? What exactly is your definition of quality content? "Gain natural backlinks"...Oh Brother!


      Look, be for real here on the warrior forum! Fellow readers, please do this quick search now; Google this: seo company. Do you see what I see? Greencowseo.com is ranked #1. They shot up to the top overnight about a couple of months ago. Now check out their link profile. What do you see? A natural link profile? Nope! We see hacked pages with hidden links. All of their pr6 links are viewable only by viewing the source code. They have implemented many other blackhat tricks too - yet they sit comfortable at the top of the serps for a query that I'm sure Matt Cutts and team is quite familiar with: seo company.



      Please now google this: buy viagra. What do we see? SPAM!



      Look, no one wants to hear this crap about "building sites for visitors and not bots". That's a mantra that really helps nobody. All the competitive niches are dominated by sites that don't do that. I gave only two examples.



      Here's some REAL advice for my suffering friends out there in the SEO world:


      1. Add some new content to your site. Don't go overboard. Just a new page every week or so for the next 8 weeks. Don't keyword stuff the new content.



      2. Keep on building links but don't use spun content. Try building just a handful of links per week over the next two months. Web2.0's are perfect for this - just use real content and not dupe or spun content.



      3. Don't buy links. Why? Because link brokers pimp their networks out until they are completely spammed out. Then your links won't count at all and you'll have just wasted your money.



      4. Don't go to fiverr.com and buy those crappy SEO packages.



      5. Teach Google that people are looking for your site. How? Like this: hire some REALLY CHEAP overseas labor to first search your main keyword, then to browse from serp page 1 to, say, page 3 or 4, then do a direct query for your domain name. This behavior shows google that people were looking for your site and didn't find it - so they went back and search for your domain specifically.



      6. Get some facebook likes for your company page.
      7. Get some google plus one's for your domain. Please do this slowly and consistently over a month or two. You only need a few of these. I would keep it under 40.



      They key thing to remember here is NOT to OVER CORRECT. Don't go crazy just because your site is on page 119 when it used to be at position 2. Just take it easy and do this slowly but consistently.



      Just ask yourselves what visitors would do if they suddenly couldn't find a site they frequented after making a query.



      Good luck friends!
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      • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
        Originally Posted by edgarallen View Post

        What a bunch of vague hooey! This is not advice that anyone can implement. "Produce quality content..." what is that? What exactly is your definition of quality content? "Gain natural backlinks"...Oh Brother!
        And this is why I mentioned the tinfoil hats. It's also why people fail. Stop making it so difficult on yourself. Google has repeatedly told you what it wants.

        Sure, their algorithm may get it wrong sometimes but when all is said and done, they know what they are after and they have told you as much. It's nothing complicated.

        Someone mentioned in another thread to someone else that you need to "stop swimming upstream". Why do you think many of the more experienced members here very rarely have problems when these updates roll around?
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      • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
        Originally Posted by edgarallen View Post

        Just ask yourselves what visitors would do if they suddenly couldn't find a site they frequented after making a query.


        Or just build a site that they want to come back to and a site that they will reference later (with backlinks).

        Oh, but first, take your tinfoil hat off so you can see what you are doing.
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        • Profile picture of the author mjzivko
          DELETED.
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          • Profile picture of the author wolfmmiii
            Originally Posted by mjzivko View Post


            End of conversation.
            Sorry. You don't get to dictate when the conversation ends. It's not rhetoric. My point is that people cry and whine about not having any idea what Google wants. In fact, Google has stated exactly what they want and I posted that earlier in the thread.

            I've also made it clear that Google's algorithm will not always jive with what they are asking for and there is a reason for that - and it's not a conspiracy. The algorithm is exactly that. It will make mistakes.

            Whether they get it right with the algorithm or not, Google has made it clear many, many times what they want. Choosing to ignore them or putting on the tinfoil hat doesn't change that fact.
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            • Profile picture of the author mjzivko
              DELETED.
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              • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
                Originally Posted by mjzivko View Post

                This is thread should be about what THIS Google Update was and how it effected websites. Your pimpin the same old White Hat shit you can find on any post Penguin and Panda thread. DUH. Everyone knows what Google says they "want". Just because your sites didn't get hit doesn't make you an authority on cracking THIS UPDATE. LOL.
                When I read the OP title it said where do we go forom here not how to do we crack THIS update. the whole thing is short sighted. Trying to fix one update to the other without looking at the overall trend is futile.

                As for any ones expertise to speak on this based on them having hundreds of sites - sorry - that by itself is no recommendation. People who reproduce hundreds of sites actually have a very small data set working with because they are often times just duplicating the sites on another domain using the same level of content. Just because in your case all the sites had the same level of quality and only the emd part kicked in does not mean that sites with different quality content indicators (and I agree that thats strictly from Google's standpoint and no one knows it) were not affected beyond the EMD status. Updates are seldom one dimensional and different things in the algo change affect sites differently. In programming conditional logic plays a larger role (If....then) and an algo can have things that kick in on some sites based on conditions and switch off based on not finding them.
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      • Profile picture of the author DidierEv
        Originally Posted by edgarallen View Post

        5. Teach Google that people are looking for your site. How? Like this: hire some REALLY CHEAP overseas labor to first search your main keyword, then to browse from serp page 1 to, say, page 3 or 4, then do a direct query for your domain name. This behavior shows google that people were looking for your site and didn't find it - so they went back and search for your domain specifically.
        I laughed so hard I almost cried
        You got some mad SEO skills dude, please don't stop teaching Google!
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      • Profile picture of the author retsek
        Originally Posted by edgarallen View Post

        Here's some REAL advice for my suffering friends out there in the SEO world:


        1. Add some new content to your site. Don't go overboard. Just a new page every week or so for the next 8 weeks. Don't keyword stuff the new content.

        2. Keep on building links but don't use spun content. Try building just a handful of links per week over the next two months. Web2.0's are perfect for this - just use real content and not dupe or spun content.

        3. Don't buy links. Why? Because link brokers pimp their networks out until they are completely spammed out. Then your links won't count at all and you'll have just wasted your money.

        4. Don't go to fiverr.com and buy those crappy SEO packages.

        5. Teach Google that people are looking for your site. How? Like this: hire some REALLY CHEAP overseas labor to first search your main keyword, then to browse from serp page 1 to, say, page 3 or 4, then do a direct query for your domain name. This behavior shows google that people were looking for your site and didn't find it - so they went back and search for your domain specifically.

        6. Get some facebook likes for your company page.
        7. Get some google plus one's for your domain. Please do this slowly and consistently over a month or two. You only need a few of these. I would keep it under 40.

        They key thing to remember here is NOT to OVER CORRECT. Don't go crazy just because your site is on page 119 when it used to be at position 2. Just take it easy and do this slowly but consistently.

        Just ask yourselves what visitors would do if they suddenly couldn't find a site they frequented after making a query.

        Good luck friends!
        Sorry but you and your friends will continue to suffer in the SEO world. If that's your advice, you'll ALWAYS be in the position where you are reacting to a Google update and are forced to make changes after the fact.

        And no one says black hat SEO doesn't work. It does. Those guys you cited that are ranking for seo company and viagra are in it for the short-term. If that's your game, then by all means go ahead.
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