EMD Penalty Recovery and Prevention (case study)

Streamline

12 years ago

Thanks Becker. I'm on your list and you always have something of value to add!

Thanks
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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Streamline

Thanks Becker. I'm on your list and you always have something of value to add!

Thanks dude, love hearing stuff like this
- Thanks
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grantatrade2011

12 years ago

Thanks for thi big sharing, i am little bit hitted with this update

Thanks

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ChrisMoon

12 years ago

Thanks Becker13 a great post. Informative and a helpful in these troubled times (just lost 20 EMD sites).

Thanks
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GreyGable

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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by ChrisMoon

Thanks Becker13 a great post. Informative and a helpful in these troubled times (just lost 20 EMD sites).

Yeah its scary stuff, I am pretty much sticking to the PR authority site pattern for now...but many of my EMDS are still going strong
- Thanks
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CletusVanDamme

12 years ago

Thanks for the info - good stuff... I've been lurking at this forum for awhile and a bunch of my sites have been hit by this update. Do you have any info on recovery time if you make any changes - for example changing the main title on the home page to something different that the domain name - also changing the home page meta info to something else without the EMD name in it?

Thanks...

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by CletusVanDamme

Thanks for the info - good stuff... I've been lurking at this forum for awhile and a bunch of my sites have been hit by this update. Do you have any info on recovery time if you make any changes - for example changing the main title on the home page to something different that the domain name - also changing the home page meta info to something else without the EMD name in it?

Thanks...

Hey I have not found a fast recovery method. I also VERY rarely try to revive sites.

I am VERY VERY good at keyword research, and rank in most of my niches in 24 hours to a week. Because of this I usually just make a new site instead of playing the "Google revival" rain dance.

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Palaecro

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Hey I have not found a fast recovery method. I also VERY rarely try to revive sites.

I am VERY VERY good at keyword research, and rank in most of my niches in 24 hours to a week. Because of this I usually just make a new site instead of playing the "Google revival" rain dance.

This actually says a lot. I've spent months since Penguin trying to save one of my sites, after the EMD revision my traffic dropped to 1/3rd and it must have been the best traffic because I haven't had a sale since!

I'll be following your video course to see how to get some new same niche sites up and running.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Palaecro

This actually says a lot. I've spent months since Penguin trying to save one of my sites, after the EMD revision my traffic dropped to 1/3rd and it must have been the best traffic because I haven't had a sale since!

I'll be following your video course to see how to get some new same niche sites up and running.

Yeah revival is no fun

Thanks

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Geekgirl01

12 years ago

Big thanks to you for the heads up......my site is new and not yet indexed so I may have to check over a few things you mentioned here.
And thannks for sharing this with us

Thanks

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Beck if Google were targeting the on page factors you claim then the effect would have been far more dramatic than what we saw. I know lots of Imers think the sky just fell but it would be far worse if Google were targeting keywords in title and H1. Thats a standardized practice in SEO and yes ton loads of sites that have that are doing fine

I know people (particularly SEOs) want to jump in after an update and think they have the skinny but no one can know what is in a algo change three days afterwards. There is no such thing as extremely extensive research in three days. Goodness you can have sites still moving around even now.

Rushing to come to conclusions before you have time to sift data will lead to dead wrong practices going forward. Plus several of the factors listed are unlikely to have much to do with it

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Beck if Google were targeting the on page factors you claim then the effect would have been far more dramatic than what we saw. I know lots of Imers think the sky just fell but it would be far worse if Google were targeting keywords in title and H1. Thats a standardized practice in SEO and yes ton loads of sites that have that are doing fine

I know people (particularly SEOs) want to jump in after an update and think they have the skinny but no one can know what is in a algo change three days afterwards. There is no such thing as extremely extensive research in three days. Goodness you can have sites still moving around even now.

Rushing to come to conclusions before you have time to sift data will lead to dead wrong practices going forward. Plus several of the factors listed are unlikely to have much to do with it

Your right

This is all of course "assumptions"

Just what I have found though. I am sure there is so many other things going on and some of these things might be totally irrelevant. But I am willing to bet a few of them play a big role in this

Thanks

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Geekgirl01

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Beck if Google were targeting the on page factors you claim then the effect would have been far more dramatic than what we saw. I know lots of Imers think the sky just fell but it would be far worse if Google were targeting keywords in title and H1. Thats a standardized practice in SEO and yes ton loads of sites that have that are doing fine

I know people (particularly SEOs) want to jump in after an update and think they have the skinny but no one can know what is in a algo change three days afterwards. There is no such thing as extremely extensive research in three days. Goodness you can have sites still moving around even now.

Rushing to come to conclusions before you have time to sift data will lead to dead wrong practices going forward. Plus several of the factors listed are unlikely to have much to do with it

I think personally what he has said makes clear sense.
There is a reason why som EMD's got hit and some didn't....those who clearly overdid it with the keyword in every aspect surely would be a target as thats not what google class as natural.

Ive seen quite a few EMD's that haven't moved from the #1 spot and going by the looks of it, they didnt over do it

Thanks

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lutherlars

12 years ago

Three days is deffo not enough time to figure this out. Look at this example Becker which debunks a lot of your theories. From the dog nich:
Glucosamine for Dogs : Reviews of Canine Glucosamine Joint Supplements
Site is not mind by the way.
Ranks well, has very high keyword density and Amazon links.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by lutherlars

Three days is deffo not enough time to figure this out. Look at this example Becker which debunks a lot of your theories. From the dog nich:
Glucosamine for Dogs : Reviews of Canine Glucosamine Joint Supplements
Site is not mind by the way.
Ranks well, has very high keyword density and Amazon links.

There are always exception to the rule

Not out to prove anything or say THIS IS HOW ITS DONE NOW

This is just what I found after looking at about 50 sites that got hit and those that survived.

I also believe that a lot of the VERY crappiest sites survived. It was was the in between sites that got tanked.

The only 2 sites of mine that got hit were in that range. Some of my most horrible sites still reign supreme though.

Thanks

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adamcm

12 years ago

So if we wanted to target a page on Zeta Clear review, would it be best to have the url structure something like this: sitename.com/zeta-clear, and name the title "Zeta Clear Review", or would it be better to keep the URL structure and then name the Title/H1/Description to not include these keywords?

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by adamcm

So if we wanted to target a page on Zeta Clear review, would it be best to have the url structure something like this: sitename.com/zeta-clear, and name the title "Zeta Clear Review", or would it be better to keep the URL structure and then name the Title/H1/Description to not include these keywords?

Ive always had tremendous success making a niche type site with a non blog home page. I then collect a bunch of very uncompetitive niche related keywords and a few competitive.

I then link to the pages on my site that snipe these keywords. That always seems to be fair play in Googles eyes.

I also make truly awesome authority type sites that get a lot of return traffic once they rank...Might also have something to do with it

Thanks
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adamcm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Ive always had tremendous success making a niche type site with a non blog home page. I then collect a bunch of very uncompetitive niche related keywords and a few competitive.

I then link to the pages on my site that snipe these keywords. That always seems to be fair play in Googles eyes.

I also make truly awesome authority type sites that get a lot of return traffic once they rank...Might also have something to do with it

Sorry don't quite follow, probably my issue

.

My thought from what I gather in the OP was that you don't want to have the exact keyword you are targeting as the URL, Title, H1, and in the description. So if you wanted to build a page on your website named "zeta clear review", would it be better to avoid optimizing in one (or more) of those 4 areas (URL, title, H1, Desc)?

I am not sure what you mean by non blog home page. I assume you just mean a static front page?

Thanks again!

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by adamcm

Sorry don't quite follow, probably my issue

.

My thought from what I gather in the OP was that you don't want to have the exact keyword you are targeting as the URL, Title, H1, and in the description. So if you wanted to build a page on your website named "zeta clear review", would it be better to avoid optimizing in one (or more) of those 4 areas (URL, title, H1, Desc)?

I am not sure what you mean by non blog home page. I assume you just mean a static front page?

Thanks again!

Yes. A static home page. The only people who should be making blogs are bloggers

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YellowGreenMedia

12 years ago

The update is only 3 days old and you have all the answers on how someone can recover... please, that is impossible as the update isn't even finished yet..

Do you work at Google, if not then your whole OP is pure speculation... (My guess is that this is a lame attempt to get yourself new readers/clients)

It was fun to read, but i wouldn't go this route just yet.

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by YellowGreenMedia

The update is only 3 days old and you have all the answers on how someone can recover... please, that is impossible as the update isn't even finished yet..

Do you work at Google, if not then your whole OP is pure speculation... (My guess is that this is a lame attempt to get yourself new readers/clients)

It was fun to read, but i wouldn't go this route just yet.

Hmm multiple times I say this is speculation on what I found. If you can highlight anywhere where I say

THIS IS FACT AND YOU WILL RECOVER 100% FOR SURE

I will give you mucho post thanks

Thanks
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YellowGreenMedia

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Hmm multiple times I say this is speculation on what I found. If you can highlight anywhere where I say

THIS IS FACT AND YOU WILL RECOVER 100% FOR SURE

I will give you mucho post thanks

I guess i keep missing that then

But lets start with your title "emd penalty recovery prevention case study" really a case study? i don't see no case study just your opinion based on your data that we all have top belief you have...

In the OP you never mention the words speculation, (at least i can't find it) just when people start telling you that it is way to early to draw any conclusions you post that indeed it is speculation.

Don't get me wrong your info makes sense but that did it also on the 30th of September, and to me it looks like you tried to sell your way off as "the" system to recovery.... which it isn't, or maybe it is but nobody knows right now....

Dave

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36burrows

12 years ago

Geez, someone is just posting his early research findings and people get all butt-hurt.

Fk them I say.

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ttomp13 12 years ago

2 of my emds were hit, 2 were not.

Like you said, I think this was just another over-optimization penalty
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nik0

Banned 12 years ago

Good point about building the site on a PR5 domain, something that I'm going to do soon.

Affiliate links are definitely a killer as well, none of my local clients have been affected by this update.

Thanks

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Make Money Ninja

12 years ago

Becker, virtually everything you say is on-point and i agree with virtually everything that comes out of your mouth.

Good to see a MMO guy who is actually teaching people what actually works and actually provides considerable value.

Take care dude!

Thanks

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brettb

12 years ago

Thanks Becker13. You're bang on in that worst affected this time are middle of the road sites. They're not authority sites, but neither are they crappy junk.

My non-EMD's were worst hit. Google has been after them for a while. I no longer even rank for my own product name (and we're talking about a real software download product that I wrote).

A couple of my 2011 niche sites were smashed. They were good sites (built post-Panda), but at the end of the day they're just review type sites. Google still hasn't got things right. Instead of the Wordpress sites and other stuff you used to see for a query I once ranked for, now you get the same membership site show up 15 times in the same 3 pages of results!

It's very hard to get your Google rankings back. You're right in that it's better to build a new site. My only comfort is that eventually Yahoo and other search engines bring in plenty of visitors.

Thanks

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salesfeed

12 years ago

Had some questions on this - from what i can understand the following is now bad in Google eyes

keyword domain + keyword title + keyword h1

now if the website had this structure as an example -

fix whatever + keyword | fix whatever | keyword by fix whatever

fix whatever in this case is the brand name

Thanks
1 reply

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by salesfeed

Had some questions on this - from what i can understand the following is now bad in Google eyes

keyword domain + keyword title + keyword h1

now if the website had this structure as an example -

fix whatever + keyword | fix whatever | keyword by fix whatever

fix whatever in this case is the brand name

The best advice I could give is that SUPER micro and Medium micro niche sites are being targeted by Google right now.

Either create a onslaught of tiny niches sites to quickly bank OR start making more broad long term sites that target keywords with inner pages and NOT the home page

Thanks
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Carl Brown 12 years ago

Microniche site heavily focused on ONE keyword onsite with thousands of backlinks using that term as the anchor text will be hit.

It'll mean more work to look as natural as possible. This type of emd is dead. I think a emd site can recover, but you'll need to add backlinks based of lots of LSI and unrelated anchor text
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adamcm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

The best advice I could give is that SUPER micro and Medium micro niche sites are being targeted by Google right now.

Either create a onslaught of tiny niches sites to quickly bank OR start making more broad long term sites that target keywords with inner pages and NOT the home page

On one of my sites, I found that a few of my inner pages were hit but the main domain was not. The 4 inner-pages all had this in common:

- keyword in domain, so sitename.com/key1-key2-key3
- keyword in title, so "key1 key2 key 3 - blah blah blah
- keyword in description, so "blah blah blah key1 key2 key3 blah blah blah"
- keyword in H1 (in my wordpress theme this is the Post title)

The inner page that seemed to survive had 0 backlinks to it. The others don't seem to be anywhere. But again the main domain was fine using the exact same format as above. It however was not an EMD.

Thanks

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yukon

Banned 12 years ago

That list is just random, especially most of that on-page stuff.

Nice imagination. :rolleyes:

Thanks

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WildGale

12 years ago

My EMDs were not hit in this update and they do fit the list provided here by Becker. Just FYI.

Thanks
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Carl Brown 12 years ago

Not hit this time after learning my lesson in April. If your site looks like an artificial creation it's built on a house of cards and will be taken down.
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Fernando1954

12 years ago

After buying these high PR sites have you had problems with google devalue the PR after the re-registration to you.

Thanks
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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Fernando1954

After buying these high PR sites have you had problems with google devalue the PR after the re-registration to you.

No..Thats why I look at the backlink profile. If it has low backlinks it usually devalues.

I also look at the trust factor (left that out)
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kiliki

12 years ago

Thanks! It's still early and a lot of inconclusive data out there. This is a great gap filler to fill in the "what about..." questions.

Appreciate the effort you put in sharing this!

Thanks
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winston

12 years ago

All my EMD's went straight to the top example: Best Atlanta Dentist "bestatlantadentist.com" (this not my site or keywords just an example) but I was targeting keywords like Atlanta Dentist, Atlanta Dentists and stayed at #1 and #2 for those keywords. But now the sites can only be found for the term Best Atlanta Dentist. They disappeared from other pages all together, not just several pages back for other the keywords.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by winston

All my EMD's went straight to the top example: Best Atlanta Dentist "bestatlantadentist.com" (this not my site or keywords just an example) but I was targeting keywords like Atlanta Dentist, Atlanta Dentists and stayed at #1 and #2 for those keywords. But now the sites can only be found for the term Best Atlanta Dentist. They disappeared from other pages all together, not just several pages back for other the keywords.

Whats that done to the traffic?

Thanks
1 reply

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winston 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Whats that done to the traffic?

The sites that had the keyword or phrase EMD I'm after the traffic have not seen much change. The site like the one I'm referring to in my post with other keywords as the main keywords targeted has dropped significantly.
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Watch Store

12 years ago

You say you buy a pr5 domain, and you then convert it to a niche site. Would you buy a domain name that has nothing to do with your niche site and then what do you do re-direct it to a new domain name or use the old domain name.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Watch Store

You say you buy a pr5 domain, and you then convert it to a niche site. Would you buy a domain name that has nothing to do with your niche site and then what do you do re-direct it to a new domain name or use the old domain name.

Honestly I just make the on page reflect it. Domain name only matters so much

Thanks

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Klondike1985

12 years ago

Cutts said this will impact 0.6% of English-US queries to a noticeable degree.

That isn't much if you ask me, but enough for some webmasters to consider what Google didn't like about their sites. Like

...the change aims to target low quality sites that might be riding on on the basis of exact matching.

Source:
searchengineland.com/low-quality-exact-match-domains-are-googles-next-target-134889

Thanks

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James-

12 years ago

1 of my 5 pager sniper sites got hit too. Difference was it wasn't an EMD, but branded.
Admittedly, the content wasn't amazing, and there wasn't much of it, but grammatically, it was certainly good enough (written by a native UK writer)

The homepage had a variety of links, the brand being the most, and the rest of the anchors varied dramatically. No idea why this one got slapped tbh.

Thanks

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roger h

12 years ago

thanks for the post, and the video series at source-wave..real good.

Thanks

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blend

12 years ago

Nice post, thanks

Thanks

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Green Moon

12 years ago

Thanks, Becker. A few of my EMDs were hit and a few were not. I don't detect the pattern that you did, but it is early and I will certainly keep your points in mind.

Despite a few others jumping all over your early observations, I love detailed posts like yours because they provide things to look for.

Thanks

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John Romaine

12 years ago

LSI is more important than ever since this update. (especially in your meta/description tags) You only have to perform some basic searches in Google to see evidence of this.

ALL of the EMD's that I've checked that are still holding in the number 1 spots have squeaky clean link profiles, and are built for humans.

Humans! Go figure. :rolleyes:

Thanks

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John34

12 years ago

About buying PR5 domain, do you buy any good PR5 domain and then set up blog on that or you look for domain related to niche?

Thanks
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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by John34

About buying PR5 domain, do you buy any good PR5 domain and then set up blog on that or you look for domain related to niche?

I set up a blog on it!
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nik0

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by John34

About buying PR5 domain, do you buy any good PR5 domain and then set up blog on that or you look for domain related to niche?

It would work better if you have a domain related to that niche but it's not necessary. It won't be easy to find PR5 domains that are relevant to your niche.

One tip I can give you though, make sure most links use the domainname or url as anchor, it makes no sense to have a domain where it's all anchor txt's about horses when your site is about pancakes.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by nik0

It would work better if you have a domain related to that niche but it's not necessary. It won't be easy to find PR5 domains that are relevant to your niche.

One tip I can give you though, make sure most links use the domainname or url as anchor, it makes no sense to have a domain where it's all anchor txt's about horses when your site is about pancakes.

Exactly, forgot to mention that! Thanks!

Thanks

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jfambrini

12 years ago

My site was hit badly on all its major keywords and i was on page 2 and 3 now am back on page 1 but on bottom while i was number 1. Have returned to top 5 on 25% of the searches. Traffic is now almost half so it hurts but it seems that Google went overboard in first attempt and is easing but not fully.

Thanks
2 replies

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STLSEO 12 years ago

Great info! Social signals are becoming more and more crucial when trying to acquire higher rankings.
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RajSrivastav 12 years ago

As I read from various site, Google penalizes only Low quality or Spammy EMD sites. If i build a site with My target keyword and posts new content also build quality links and following Google guidelines. How can Google Hit my site with EMD Update?
- Thanks
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- Nile Anderson 12 years ago
  
  Hi Becker13,
  
  First of all, I must say thanks for sharing such a wonderful case study about EMD. You are really huge ocean of SEO Marketing and I am just drop of it . Visited your website wavesource and it is massive. Very appreciate from this thread.
  
  Thanks Again!
  
  Thanks
  
  Signature
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The Oilman

12 years ago

Becker13:

At one point you said something about sniping inner pages... what did you mean by this?

Did you mean if youhave a site on dog food, and you have a page on Organic Puppy Chow, would you put an internal link as Organic Puppy Chow pointing to the Organic Puppy Chow page?

Thanks
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Valuable Solos

12 years ago

Becker, can you answer this question please?

Originally Posted by The Oilman

Becker13:

At one point you said something about sniping inner pages... what did you mean by this?

Did you mean if youhave a site on dog food, and you have a page on Organic Puppy Chow, would you put an internal link as Organic Puppy Chow pointing to the Organic Puppy Chow page?

Thanks

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gpwilson

12 years ago

Thanks for sharing such an important analysis with all of us.

Thanks

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boxoun

12 years ago

Matches my early assumptions. Great detailed post that offers some things to consider.

Thanks

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TwinCities

12 years ago

Hi Becker,

Thanks for your insight and comments regarding google latest changes.
You mentioned one of the factors that sites that did not get hit was +10 pages.
When you say +10 pages, were you referring to +10 pages of real content or +10 pages in total including about, contact, etc.?

Also if you have a really great niche that has been profitable, should I wait it out to see what kind of changes that can be made or should I start over with an aged non-EMD domain?

Thanks
Chris

Thanks
1 reply

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by TwinCities

Hi Becker,

Thanks for your insight and comments regarding google latest changes.
You mentioned one of the factors that sites that did not get hit was +10 pages.
When you say +10 pages, were you referring to +10 pages of real content or +10 pages in total including about, contact, etc.?

Also if you have a really great niche that has been profitable, should I wait it out to see what kind of changes that can be made or should I start over with an aged non-EMD domain?

Thanks
Chris

Id start a new aged domain...It is all about the long term!

Thanks

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Chucky

12 years ago

Well... there must be a complex formula behind all this that takes like 200 factors in to consideration, but I agree it's an overall over-optimization penalty that takes both on-page and off-page factors into consideration.

Thanks
1 reply

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Chucky

Well... there must be a complex formula behind all this that takes like 200 factors in to consideration, but I agree it's an overall over-optimization penalty that takes both on-page and off-page factors into consideration.

Yep...Eager to see what our people find out

Thanks
1 reply

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andrej

12 years ago

I have a question regarding the following from your website:

On Page Reward Triggers and Penalty Avoidance

-Cloaked affiliate links. This means their is a redirect placed on links. There are several ways to do this. I just download a 301 redirect plug in, place a redirect on a page, and link to that page.

Does it mean if I don't cloak the affiliate links on my website and my affiliate link looks like e.g. http://www.company.com/track/code/link1 I can get my website penalized? I don't cloak the affiliate links on my website at all. Should I rather cloak them? If yes, can I do it using the .htaccess redirect?

Thanks
1 reply

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nik0

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by andrej

I have a question regarding the following from your website:

Does it mean if I don't cloak the affiliate links on my website and my affiliate link looks like e.g. http://www.company.com/track/code/link1 I can get my website penalized? I don't cloak the affiliate links on my website at all. Should I rather cloak them? If yes, can I do it using the .htaccess redirect?

I would definitely NOT do that, just leave it as it is.

Most people with non EMD's that tanked all had those redirection scripts for their affiliate links.

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ecommercevisibility

12 years ago

@Becker13,

You have concluded very quickly and then came to say it all is assumptions. Everyone is free to assume.

There are EMD sites that are 100% opposite of what you concluded and are still ranking #1. So it proves all your assumptions are wrong.

P.S.
Have you studied mathematics? I believe you understand what I mean?

Thanks

Thanks

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StevenUK

12 years ago

Becker, I have reading up on this new Algorithm for days now, after some of my high earning sites tanked by Google.

Your posting here is by FAR the most valuable I have read on this subject.

Thank you.

Thanks
1 reply

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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by StevenUK

Becker, I have reading up on this new Algorithm for days now, after some of my high earning sites tanked by Google.

Your posting here is by FAR the most valuable I have read on this subject.

Thank you.

Ha no problem!

Thanks
1 reply

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salesfeed 12 years ago

I think the point about exact is correct especially for local geographic - example is blue widgets city

If domain name has blue widget
Title has blue widgets city and no other words in title
Meta description has blue widgets city phrase exact match

You will get hit in 5/10 cases from my research in traffic and sales made.

Some of our sites did not get hit possibly because search traffic and competition is low or not registered or the domain name was especially long

Maybe its just me but practically every 3 word geo search shows this trend.

I noticed if you search x service city you hardly ever find x service city in both title and meta
- Thanks
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illianafrazer

12 years ago

It is always good to hear when people speak with real data in hand. SEO's in fact must learn to use forums to share statistics after a major update.

Thanks

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HeadStartSEO

12 years ago

Thank you for sharing.

Thanks

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markus3000

12 years ago

Have a feeling low bounce rate and time on site seem to be factors as well.

Thanks
1 reply

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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by markus3000

Have a feeling low bounce rate and time on site seem to be factors as well.

I do too, theres no way this is not looked at now
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TigerRaging

12 years ago

Thanks for the insightful post dude, always have something good!

Thanks

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yohanaton

12 years ago

Thanks... Great info & great to hear diff approaches...
Best,
Y

Thanks

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tangosdad

12 years ago

As it turns out there was much more going on than EMDs... but then we kind of felt that anyway didn't we?

Forceful Panda Update Confirmed on September 27th

Google Panda Update 20 Released, 2.4% Of English Queries Impacted

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

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MikeFriedman

12 years ago

Originally Posted by markus3000

Have a feeling low bounce rate and time on site seem to be factors as well.

Originally Posted by Becker13

I do too, theres no way this is not looked at now

There is one big problem with that idea. Only a very small percentage of websites out there use Google Analytics.

Google does not have this information for the vast majority of websites.

Highly doubt it is playing any significant role at all. I've seen too many websites with bad bounce rates and time on site still with excellent rankings. I've seen too many websites with great bounce rates and time on site with horrible rankings.

The only bounce rate I think Google is using is when someone clicks on search result and immediately comes back to the SERP and chooses another result. This would be a signal that the first result did not necessarily meet their need or answer their query.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

There is one big problem with that idea. Only a very small percentage of websites out there use Google Analytics.

Google does not have this information for the vast majority of websites.

Highly doubt it is playing any significant role at all. I've seen too many websites with bad bounce rates and time on site still with excellent rankings. I've seen too many websites with great bounce rates and time on site with horrible rankings.

The only bounce rate I think Google is using is when someone clicks on search result and immediately comes back to the SERP and chooses another result. This would be a signal that the first result did not necessarily meet their need or answer their query.

Yes but Google can see where traffic goes

Now I am no conspiracy theorist, but they have to be watching something

Thanks
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MikeFriedman 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Yes but Google can see where traffic goes

Now I am no conspiracy theorist, but they have to be watching something

What do you mean they can see where traffic goes? Once they get to your site, Google can't see shit anymore about what they do unless you are using GA, GWT, or AdSense.
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aadi144

12 years ago

Hi Becker,
I have read about EMD reviews and lot of people are saying they were hit by this update although the percentage was not too high but i guess it was just a start of the new blame game.
You have provided a useful information about EMD update and who are affected with this and who are not.Appreciate your study on this update.

Thanks

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ashishkakran

12 years ago

nice information for sharing Becker

Thanks

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seoravi

12 years ago

Great tips, But I think latest EMD update only effects those websites that are over optimize

Thanks

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Acetztech

12 years ago

Great advice on EMD. Super Like!

Thanks

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enterscope

12 years ago

I've invested in several exact-match domains lately and have always liked to use them because I feel like Google has no choice but to give some benefit to owning that phrase.

Of course there has been some misuse of EMDs and Google has lowered there value which is unfortunate. However, I believe Google will just reward other Good SEO practices in its place like social sharing and contextual backlinks.

Thanks

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fortony

12 years ago

To say Google is penalizing is stretching it. Many companies have EMD and often those with EMD have the best info for the search. They cannot penalize for it without hurting results.

Far more likely, it is simply the fact that they are giving far less for EMD. It used to provide a nice little boost in my opinion, now its very little. Not surprisingly, this is generally killing the smaller, EMD sites.

Thanks

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Alisha1

12 years ago

Actually I have submitted a thread regarding EMD a little bit ago but you have cleared my all doubt. Highly appreciated!

Thanks

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brettb

12 years ago

Nice to see that Google have finally admitted this is more than an EMD update.

I'm struggling to work out why some of my sites were hit, but others survived. It's not really about quality - worst hit were my authority type sites, whereas sites I don't know so much about did OK.

Once again, my larger sites were worst affected. So much for building authority sites!

I'm running a new experiment by taking all the ads off one of my sites to see if that helps.

But I think content itself is the problem in my case - I've never been able to recover from one of these updates.

I think bounce rate is a factor, but they'll be benchmarking your site against competitors. This is a great way of measuring site quality. It would work brilliantly in the dating niche, because crappy blogs have a bounce rate of 70%+, but real dating sites a bounce rate of ~40% (plus much higher page views/session).

This update hasn't improved search results much though. I did one query and the same crappy site appears 15 times in the first 3 pages of results.

Thanks
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MikeFriedman

12 years ago

Originally Posted by brettb

Nice to see that Google have finally admitted this is more than an EMD update.

Actually, Matt Cutts did confirm over the weekend that there was at least one other significant update rolled out on or about the same time as the EMD update.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by MikeFriedman

Actually, Matt Cutts did confirm over the weekend that there was at least one other significant update rolled out on or about the same time as the EMD update.

yep panda 2.0

Thanks

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danilion55

12 years ago

Hey just wanted to ask if i create EMDs.blogspot.com now and work in it will eemd rule penalize it in future or not

Thanks
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Becker13 Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by danilion55

Hey just wanted to ask if i create EMDs.blogspot.com now and work in it will eemd rule penalize it in future or not

i would drop the 9 dollars and get a real website
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markwilson4074

12 years ago

Should we keep buying EMDs (long ones too) and making websites with quality content to expect page 1 SERPs.

Thanks

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SEO Haven

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Becker13

Not all of the sites that got hit were EMDs. However all of the sites that got hit had the main keyword in the domain name.

The keyword was EXACTLY in the title, description, and meta tags. It was also in the content, alt tags, and with ALL of the hit sites above a 4% density

Amen, agree with that 100%.

Originally Posted by Becker13

On top of this, I am sure some of you saw some EMDs go up in rank

The ones of mine that did this have
-Youtube, twitter, facebook pages/channels
-Social signals
-Low exact keyword onpage targeting
-More links to authority sites than to affiliate sites on page

Also think about it...There is NO authority quality site on the web that links to affiliate sites heavily on their home pages. This is because authority sites aim to keep traffic.

Some good advice right there man, I learned this stuff in a super expensive course few years ago. Always link to an authority site related to your content to provide more value to the reader (having the ability to get more info that's top quality)

Thanks
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PerformanceMan

12 years ago

Originally Posted by SEO Haven

Amen, agree with that 100%.

Some good advice right there man, I learned this stuff in a super expensive course few years ago. Always link to an authority site related to your content to provide more value to the reader (having the ability to get more info that's top quality)

This increases your exit rate and bounce rate. Wouldn't you be better served to get them to click on an additional link on your website?

Thanks

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raffiliato 12 years ago

That's basically the point of Becker13's post, providing ideas that can make on page optimization meets Google expected standards and increase your chances of ranking better overall. Thanks a lot Becker! Really appreciate.
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Yep and i am pretty sure bounce rate when your in the top plays a pretty big role now

Thanks

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raffiliato

12 years ago

I really appreciate the time and effort taken to put this together. And although it might be early to come up with a conclusive and detailed recovery strategy, keeping most of what you have said does help a lot to keep things in focus a bit.

Thanks

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Danny Woolard

12 years ago

Best Analysis So Far

They only thing I disagree with is on my EMD, I have 5 affiliate ads above the fold: 4 amazon text ads, and 1 google image ad, and I still rank #2 for two main EMD keywords.

The 3rd keyword dropped, because keyword was in URL/keyword and navigation tab, and H1 tag, and partial in H2 tag.

This site is VERY THIN as well... One 100 word article on homepage, and one 500 word article on a category page. And still going strong on those 2 main keywords.

My Review Site That Got Hit

First I used Silos. Had things like Big Widget, Small Widget, Orange Widget in category pages/navigation tabs.

Next I had about 10 reviews that had URL/product keyword in them. Product keyword was also used exactly in H1and again partial in H2, and mentioned once in 250 word article. All review pages went from 15-20 in SERP to out of top 100.

Thanks

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Danny Woolard

12 years ago

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terryd 12 years ago

Originally Posted by denutza

Wheres a good place to buy PR 5s?

go daddy auctions...
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

I use tb solutions

Thanks

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cooler1

12 years ago

@Becker13. Would you recommend using SEO Pressor when building a new site or do you not recommend using that? I already have it on my existing sites so was wondering if I should use it or not when building a new site.

Thanks
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Becker13

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by cooler1

@Becker13. Would you recommend using SEO Pressor when building a new site or do you not recommend using that? I already have it on my existing sites so was wondering if I should use it or not when building a new site.

I dont use it so no I would not suggest it

Thanks

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hadtic

12 years ago

There was the EMD but also a Panda and Penguin update rolling out at the same time and Google has already said that EMD sites affected were the ones with poor quality and thin content. Which is no real surprise to be honest.

Thanks

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Periwinkle

Banned 12 years ago

Thanks for the info - good stuff...

Thanks

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EMD Penalty Recovery and Prevention (case study)

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