A Special Request To All Warriors Here...

51 replies
Hello there..

I've a special request to make to fellow WARRIORS and here it is...

If you find a thread, ideas or questions asked by NEWBIES or WARRIORS are "not up to standard" and if you think that you can contribute by helping them with suggestions on what they're doing WRONG and HOW they can improve in something,

PLEAAASEE say it in a respectable manner.

They're humans as well and some of them are older than you. Just because you're veteran in IM world or very very "skillful", it doesn't mean that you can simply TEAR someone down with harsh comments. In another word, you're insulting them. Some of them tend to laugh off other WARRIORS' ideas or comments and let me tell you, that's a very nasty thing that you SHOULD never do to anyone.

Certainly you'll break their CONFIDENCE to be part of this forum

Guess what'll happen next to them?

They might be AFRAID to write in a new post here because their mind will remind them of their bad experience in their previous post.

Then they'd shy away from this community and even if they've questions to ask, they'd just KEEP shut because of the humiliation that they've received in their previous thread.

This is just unfair..

You're certainly going to chase away the new WARRIORS here with this kind of attitude.

If they're WRONG or MISGUIDING, explain to them nicely why they're wrong and HOW you can help them modify their ideas or tips.

If you don't like their THREAD and IDEAS, just IGNORE it. No 1 is BEGGING you to answer or comment on it.

I'm not saying that YOU shouldn't comment, but there are some good ways to explain things to others so that you can create a WIN-A-WIN situation.

I'm not saying that I'm perfect (I've learned my lesson) either but certainly insulting or giving harsh comments publicly is not my cup of tea.

We should respect their dignity as well as give and take respect from them.

I hope that this attitude can be improvised for the benefits of other members here.

PS: There's nothing personal here. Cheers
#request #special #warriors
  • Profile picture of the author Lou Diamond
    Hello,
    the newbies can and will teach the oldies a new lesson here and there.
    There is a lot to discover out there in the internet.

    Someone once said the meek shall inherit the earth.

    Let's all be friends and learn from each other.
    Lou
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    Something new soon.

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    • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
      Originally Posted by Lou Diamond View Post

      Let's all be friends and learn from each other.
      Lou
      This is what I call "unity" but unfortunately, there're some "EXPERTS" with different mindset.
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      • Profile picture of the author talfighel
        Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

        This is what I call "unity" but unfortunately, there're some "EXPERTS" with different mindset.
        Yeah, making money off them and giving them BAD info. I have seen that before.

        Tal
        Signature
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        • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
          Originally Posted by talfighel View Post

          Yeah, making money off them and giving them BAD info. I have seen that before.

          Tal
          Yes,I've also seen how the newbies are being treated HARSHLY without respect.

          If he's WRONG, you can say it out nicely so that he can understand what's wrong with his post and may correct it. But certainly NOT embarrass him publicly.
          Signature
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          • Profile picture of the author John Taylor
            Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

            Yes,I've also seen how the newbies are being treated HARSHLY without respect.

            If he's WRONG, you can say it out nicely so that he can understand what's wrong with his post and may correct it. But certainly NOT embarrass him publicly.
            So who appointed you as the newbie representative?

            You started the thread to assert your point of view.

            That's been accomplished. Reiterating and repeating
            yourself is not participating in the discussion.

            Business can be cutthroat and ruthless. This is a business
            forum. If people aren't willing to accept that their opinions
            and statements can be questioned and challenged then
            maybe this isn't the enviroment for them.

            Reality check:

            Respect has to be earned around here. There is no
            automatic entitlement. Far too many people come here in
            the mistaken belief they they are entitled to something.


            John
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            • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
              Originally Posted by John Taylor View Post

              So who appointed you as the newbie representative?

              John
              No one did appoint me and all I was doing here is make people realize how they're TREATING other people here.

              Nothing personal.Cheers
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  • Profile picture of the author redfoxseo
    I also want to make a point o that some of us are newbies to this forum but not newbies to IM or SEO.
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  • Profile picture of the author RGallowitz
    I agree Ebizman87. I always try and helping a newbie. Many times I have helped newbies with only 1 or 2 posts. I find it DISGUSTING that some of these frequent posters do nothing but ****ing moan and bitch at newcomers.
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    • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
      Originally Posted by RGallowitz View Post

      I find it DISGUSTING that some of these frequent posters do nothing but ****ing moan and bitch at newcomers.
      Not only NEWCOMERS, other senior WARRIORS are not being RESPECTED here as well.

      What's this?

      Where were they when they initially started out? Who taught them all those tips and ideas? and finally who gave them the AUTHORITY to be an expert and comment HARSHLY on others?

      I just can't take it.This is the forum with great marketing minds and you won't go anywhere with this kind of attitude.
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      • Profile picture of the author Heuristic
        Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

        Not only NEWCOMERS, other senior WARRIORS are not being RESPECTED here as well.

        What's this?

        Where were they when they initially started out? Who taught them all those tips and ideas? and finally who gave them the AUTHORITY to be an expert and comment HARSHLY on others?

        I just can't take it.This is the forum with great marketing minds and you won't go anywhere with this kind of attitude.
        Who says they are experts anyway? Because they say so? Because they have a high post count? Hopefully the new people have more sense than that.

        More often than not, it is someone dealing with their own insecurities and the need to be right all the time.

        When someone tells me that this is the way things are because they have proven it, and everyone else is an idiot for suggesting otherwise, it take it with a very big grain of salt.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Taylor

    There is already a system in place.


    The answer is very simple. If you believe
    a post to be outside of the rules or going
    beyond good manners or good taste..

    Use the report button.

    If enough people agree with you, the post
    in question will go into automatic moderation.

    It will then be reviewed by the forum Admin
    team and the appropriate action taken.

    John
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  • Profile picture of the author cypherslock
    Agreed. I think the only thing that might irritate some are the "I want to quit within x months" type threads that we sometimes see. In that case, a pep talk is good thing. But don't personally attack the poor guy either. I think we can all agree that the WF is an awesome place to learn and teach.
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    • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
      While I agree that you should never be nasty to people just for asking
      questions, no matter what the question is, there are people who come in
      here with attitudes right out of the gate. They start bashing IM, bashing
      gurus, people of this forum, and on and on ad nauseam.

      Eventually, it gets to the point where somebody has to put a stop to it and
      unfortunately, many times, there is no nice way to do it.

      If people come in here and are insulting, especially to me personally, I will
      give it right back. No man or woman should sit back and take abuse.

      My point is, each incident has to be handled according to the situation
      itself.

      In other words, play nice with me and I'll play nice with you.
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      • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
        Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim View Post


        If people come in here and are insulting, especially to me personally, I will
        give it right back. No man or woman should sit back and take abuse.
        Hey there Steve..

        Unfortunately NEWBIES who are insulted here don't have the power to go against some of the "veteran/expert members" here.If they fought back, then they'll be TEARED down like nobody's business.

        You've written several good points here and hopefully someone will learn something from a senior member like you.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Taylor
          This generalisation and others like it really
          annoy me..

          Originally Posted by ebizman87 View Post

          Unfortunately NEWBIES who are insulted here don't have the power to go against some of the "veteran/expert members" here.If they fought back, then they'll be TEARED down like nobody's business.
          Unless you can show specific examples of
          such behaviour, and have a record of
          reporting them, you'd be well advised to
          resist provoking uneccessary disunity within
          the forum.

          John
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          • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
            Originally Posted by John Taylor View Post

            This generalisation and others like it really
            annoy me..


            Unless you can show specific examples of
            such behaviour, and have a record of
            reporting them, you'd be well advised to
            resist provoking uneccessary disunity within
            the forum.

            John
            You may want to check out some recent THREADS by some expert WARRIORS.And of course they were REPORTED
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            • Profile picture of the author Kay King
              ebizman87 -

              Let's cut to the chase. A new member started a thread one day after joining and gave definitive advice on article marketing.

              His advice contained many pieces of bad information and that was pointed out. The person's defense was that he earned $250 doing what he posted about so therefore it was good information.

              He said he's worked in IM for 3 years, only made money this past year - and he earned $250. That is not an INCOME for most of us here.

              He advised not worrying about keyword research - not worrying about building a site or blog - blah blah blah. Many newbies thanked him for the post - because it told them what they wanted to hear..."You don't have to do much or learn the basics to make money".

              Unless someone with experience pointed out the problems in that thread, those newbies would proceed with that info as "truth" and be disappointed.

              You jumped into the thread complaining that those who pointed out the problems with his advice were impolite. Do you personally know that new member? Would you prefer that wrong advice be treated with respect even though it might hurt other newbies?

              I think it's better to worry less about saying it wrong and more about getting it right.

              kay
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              Saving one dog will not save the world....but will forever change the world for one dog.
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              • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
                Originally Posted by Kay King View Post


                You jumped into the thread complaining that those who pointed out the problems with his advice were impolite. Do you personally know that new member? Would you prefer that wrong advice be treated with respect even though it might hurt other newbies?

                I think it's better to worry less about saying it wrong and more about getting it right.

                kay
                I don't know him(the OP) and have never heard of him.But just look at some of the replies given to him? You think that's called RESPECT?

                How would you like to be TREATED the way he was treated in that thread?

                I'm not saying that the OP was right either,but he's NEWBIE here and should have been treated in a better manner.
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                • Profile picture of the author Keith Boisvert
                  I'm not saying that the OP was right either,but he's NEWBIE here and should have been treated in a better manner.
                  Maybe so. I don't know the thread you are referring to, so I can't speak on it directly, but respect goes two ways. Mr Mayo also gave an example of him getting slammed for trying to help. This thread was started on the "us" vs "them" mentality of newbies deserve respect.

                  However, I think that for every "newbie" getting "bashed"(and these are subjective terms), there is an equal amount of crap an "experienced" Warrior receives as well. So, really, respect doesn't just have to flow down, and can flow up as well.

                  If you don't like their THREAD and IDEAS, just IGNORE it. No 1 is BEGGING you to answer or comment on it.
                  No one is begging, but by posting in a public forum you open yourself up. If someone is giving bad advice, and commenting on that bad advice is then considered "slamming on someone", then should others just shut up and let others follow that advice?

                  Don't get me wrong, there are those who come across harsh and abrasive, even downright rude, and I make no excuses for them. But as stated, use the damn infraction button if you feel that way... even experienced Warriors will call out rude posts on other "experienced" warriors.

                  This is not about "newbies" and "experienced" warriors.

                  Respect is universal and doesn't care how many posts you have.

                  ~keith
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                  • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
                    True story. Take it for what it's worth to you.

                    A long time ago, a new member started a thread about generating traffic
                    that was CLEARLY about spamming and breaking all kinds of TOS of a
                    number of sites.

                    I pointed out the problems with the post.

                    The responses I got, from other new members, ranged from...

                    "Why do you have to be so $%$ negative?"

                    to

                    "Hey, if you don't $^$ like it, stay the %^% out of the thread."

                    I was slammed to no end just for trying to protect people from doing
                    something that would most likely get them into a lot of trouble. And yes,
                    I specifically told the OP in my reply that he was giving bad advice.

                    He jumped on my case as well with words that I can't print here.

                    As Keith pointed out, it's a two way street.

                    Now granted, after being slammed, I didn't handle things very well from
                    that point and let out my own diatribe of 4 letter words, which only
                    brought me down to their level.

                    Point is, I have no problem with you if you treat me with the respect that
                    any human being on this planet deserves. Once you don't do that, I then
                    have no respect for you.

                    It's that simple.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Heuristic
                      Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim View Post

                      Point is, I have no problem with you if you treat me with the respect that
                      any human being on this planet deserves. Once you don't do that, I then
                      have no respect for you.
                      Well said, Steven. And, really, there are many ways to get your point across without being downright rude about it.
                      Signature

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                • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                  How would you like to be TREATED the way he was treated in that thread?
                  I don't worry about how I'm "treated" here. If I give incorrect information, it's a mistake and I appreciate having it pointed out. If I see BS, I'm not always polite when I point it out. I'm the same on a forum as I am in real life. Deal with it. I learned a lot here over the years and I'm not here to be stroked - but to learn and share info.

                  When someone joins the WF one day, posts as an expert the next and mentions plans to run multiple WSO's - many of us see red flags. This is especially true when the info posted is incomplete or incorrect and the poster argues with anyone who points out the discrepancies in the "method". Not saying anything is wrong here. Time will tell - it always does.

                  kay
                  Signature
                  Every child needs a pet because every family needs an optimist

                  Saving one dog will not save the world....but will forever change the world for one dog.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Kay King
                    If I had continued to be the frickin know it all that I was, I'd still be working 14 hour days.
                    LOL Steven - do you remember how hard you argued when John and Paul and others said you shouldn't have to work those 14 hour days?

                    For those who don't know - Steven was slapped up side of the head and kicked in the behind more than any newbie who posts here now (and as he admits, sometimes he deserved it). He was called out and criticized and banned and called a drama queen....and he took it and apologized until people were screaming "stop the mea culpa already".

                    It happened more than once and went on for some time...but...

                    Steven adjusted. He found his sense of humor and his place in the pack that is the WF. He gained respect because he earned it - not because he demanded it. He put in the effort to change his approach to the forum and his response to critiques and that made all the difference.


                    kay
                    Signature
                    Every child needs a pet because every family needs an optimist

                    Saving one dog will not save the world....but will forever change the world for one dog.
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              • Profile picture of the author TheRichJerksNet
                It's amazing Kay how he started this thread due the the fact that some people was protecting others from bad advice. When you try to explain why it is bad advice then the OP gets thier panties in a twist wondering why you are bashing them.

                If newbies are not going to listen when helpful information is posted and pass on bad advice then it is our responsibility to do what it takes to protect other newbies from making drastic mistakes that can cost them dearly.

                According to the OP here we are to ignore people posting bad advice and sorry but that is not the way I do things. If the OP wants to follow that bad advice then that is his choice to do so but that does not mean other should suffer.

                James

                Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

                ebizman87 -

                Let's cut to the chase. A new member started a thread one day after joining and gave definitive advice on article marketing.

                His advice contained many pieces of bad information and that was pointed out. The person's defense was that he earned $250 doing what he posted about so therefore it was good information.

                He said he's worked in IM for 3 years, only made money this past year - and he earned $250. That is not an INCOME for most of us here.

                He advised not worrying about keyword research - not worrying about building a site or blog - blah blah blah. Many newbies thanked him for the post - because it told them what they wanted to hear..."You don't have to do much or learn the basics to make money".

                Unless someone with experience pointed out the problems in that thread, those newbies would proceed with that info as "truth" and be disappointed.

                You jumped into the thread complaining that those who pointed out the problems with his advice were impolite. Do you personally know that new member? Would you prefer that wrong advice be treated with respect even though it might hurt other newbies?

                I think it's better to worry less about saying it wrong and more about getting it right.

                kay
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                • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
                  Side note to Kay (sorry if this is OT)

                  If I ever have a serious problem that I just don't know how to handle, I
                  am going to come to you for advice.

                  I know very few people here at this forum who are as logical and
                  clear headed when it comes to dealing with issues as you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Mayo
    Hey, The bashing works both ways and neither is productive.

    I recently replied to a post titled: http://www.warriorforum.com/adsense-...nder-hour.html only to get dissed for answering the OP's question.

    So on the other side of the fence, It also makes senior members not want to
    answer posts for help.

    Lose/Lose...

    Have a Great Day!
    Michael
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve Powers
    Well,man,just as you said,it's a kind of manner and respect.I can't agree with you more.It may easier for one to do well in some area than to make progress with guys around him.
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  • Profile picture of the author Gail Sober
    Apparently, this thread was started with a specific post in mind but in the overall grander scale of things. I do hate seeing the "use the search box" replies to people asking for help.

    Mr. Mayo also has a very valid point as does Mrs. King.

    In the end it all comes down to...

    "darned if you do, darned if you don't."
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  • Profile picture of the author netwiseprofits
    Here's my 2 cents, I joined the WF because of the vast knowledge that is gathered here. I have been in IM for a long time, but I still learn every day.

    I've been article marketing for some time now and I learnt new stuff just yesterday. And once again thanks.

    My point is we are all here to learn, if you come across someone you don't agree with you have 2 options, ignore it or state your views but do it with respect.

    Many people are new, if you have experience you were once new and just looking for advice and direction. Don't forget where you once were.

    Let's use something that I think has been lost for a long time... Common Sense. Before you respond to any post, be mindful that there is a person on the other end looking for constructive help, not destructive help.

    And for those self appointed "gurus" and so called "experts" give them enough rope and they will eventually hang themselves.

    Yes the truth will set you free, but it may piss you off first. Sometimes it takes a hard-line to point out the wrong or mis-guided. Absolutely you can be straight forward and blunt with anyone but still do it will respect.

    Aretha Franklin had it right R.E.S.P.E.C.T... It's a simple concept.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Taylor
    I'll take hurt feelings over plain bad advice any
    day.

    This is a business forum it is not a kindergarten.

    When someone posts something in a discussion
    forum then they are inviting discussion.

    Looking at the thread you are alluding to, I suspect
    then it was posted with an agenda of establishing
    credibility as an "expert".

    Self proclaimed experts are a very dangerous beast.
    They can mislead people into following bad advice.
    Advice that, if it goes unchallenged, can cost many
    people a lot of their valuable time and hard won
    earnings.

    As I said earlier.. if you see anything that goes over
    the line of acceptable behaviour, report it.

    However, understand that sometimes it's better to
    leave posts that prevent people following bad advice.

    Yes, perhaps some folks have a "harsh" style. But I
    can put up with harsh when the advice is good.

    What I cannot countenance is bad advice delivered
    politely or harshly.


    John
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    • Profile picture of the author TheRichJerksNet
      Very well said John ... Could not have said it better myself...

      James

      Originally Posted by John Taylor View Post

      I'll take hurt feelings over plain bad advice any
      day.

      This is a business forum it is not a kindergarten.

      When someone posts something in a discussion
      forum then they are inviting discussion.

      Looking at the thread you are alluding to, I suspect
      then it was posted with an agenda of establishing
      credibility as an "expert".

      Self proclaimed experts are a very dangerous beast.
      They can mislead people into following bad advice.
      Advice that, if it goes unchallenged, can cost many
      people a lot of their valuable time and hard won
      earnings.

      As I said earlier.. if you see anything that goes over
      the line of acceptable behaviour, report it.

      However, understand that sometimes it's better to
      leave posts that prevent people following bad advice.

      Yes, perhaps some folks have a "harsh" style. But I
      can put up with harsh when the advice is good.

      What I cannot countenance is bad advice delivered
      politely or harshly.


      John
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      • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
        Here's another true story, and this one is on me. I am sure many of the
        old timers will back this up.

        When I first came to this forum I thought I was hot sh*t because I was
        making a few bucks online. So I started threads about all this stuff that I
        knew and how this was the way to do it...like I fricken had all the answers.

        Well, folks like John Taylor and Paul Myers and countless others really put
        me in my place and I got very defensive.

        Fast forward 3 years. Yes, I am celebrating my 3 year anniversary here.

        I now realize that there are NO absolutes when it comes to this business
        and everything has to be tested...no matter what it is and no matter who
        says it.

        I have been very humbled by this place and have learned a lot from it.

        I've also become a lot more successful because of it because I left my
        overinflated ego at the front door and started listening to some of the
        folks here who are a hell of a lot smarter than I am.

        As a result, I spent less time working in 2009. No more 14 hour days.

        If I had continued to be the frickin know it all that I was, I'd still be
        working 14 hour days.

        We don't have all the answers.

        None of us do.
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      • Profile picture of the author John Taylor
        James,

        Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet View Post

        Could not have said it better myself...

        I know. ;-)

        John
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    • Profile picture of the author Jag82
      Originally Posted by John Taylor View Post

      Yes, perhaps some folks have a "harsh" style. But I
      can put up with harsh when the advice is good.

      Hi John,

      Spot on. That said, it will be ideal if the good advice
      can be delivered in a tactful non-personal manner.

      If not, it will just lead to long, unnecessary, drawn out debate.

      When emotions get heated, it takes the attention
      away from the truly valuable stuff where the
      focus really should be on - the good advice.

      That don't do anyone any good.

      Jag
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    • Profile picture of the author Troy_Phillips
      Kay received my last available thank you for the day .

      So THANK YOU For this reply



      Originally Posted by John Taylor View Post

      I'll take hurt feelings over plain bad advice any
      day.

      This is a business forum it is not a kindergarten.

      When someone posts something in a discussion
      forum then they are inviting discussion.

      Looking at the thread you are alluding to, I suspect
      then it was posted with an agenda of establishing
      credibility as an "expert".

      Self proclaimed experts are a very dangerous beast.
      They can mislead people into following bad advice.
      Advice that, if it goes unchallenged, can cost many
      people a lot of their valuable time and hard won
      earnings.

      As I said earlier.. if you see anything that goes over
      the line of acceptable behaviour, report it.

      However, understand that sometimes it's better to
      leave posts that prevent people following bad advice.

      Yes, perhaps some folks have a "harsh" style. But I
      can put up with harsh when the advice is good.

      What I cannot countenance is bad advice delivered
      politely or harshly.


      John
      Signature

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  • Profile picture of the author Cecille20
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author Kevin Marshall
      Yeah I try to help people wherever I can. I've seen some attitudes here that are despicable.

      We've all been in the newbie position. I encouraged a friend of mine to join the other day, but after joining, she didn't know what to think. She didn't understand all of the talk about Adsense, CPA, PPC, Ezine, WSOs, and all of the other jargon we use here. It is easy to forget that for a newbie coming in here, it can be almost like learning a foreign language the first few visits.

      We are so used to all of the jargon that we forget that most of the general public would have no idea what we're talking about here.
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    • Profile picture of the author Istvan Horvath
      Originally Posted by Cecille20 View Post

      A forum community needs participation and helping others.
      "participation" - is a buzzword...

      "helping others" - YES! And pointing out that the information given by somebody is just plain wrong is exactly that: helping others. Preventing them (the others) from making big, costly mistakes.

      It amazes me that some members are more concerned about "hurting the self-esteem" of a poster who gives wrong advice than about the correctness of the information.

      Let's not forget: this is not a Freudian sofa where we care about your wounded soul. It is a business oriented discussion forum. The business world is harsh, better get used to it.

      If I come up with an "idea" or untested theory... and ten knowledgeable IMers tell me I am wrong - it's time to re-think my 'method'. And to thank them
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      • Profile picture of the author ExRat
        Hi,

        There's lots of talk about 'ego' and stuff like this -

        And for those self appointed "gurus" and so called "experts" give them enough rope and they will eventually hang themselves.
        I don't recall any of the people who participate regularly and have been here a while from appointing themselves as either of those things. But you presume it's helpful to throw that cuss in here, aimed broadly at anyone who is not a newbie.

        Here's an example -

        http://www.warriorforum.com/main-int...ou-preach.html

        It was an unusual thread because the OP had failed after trying for so long.

        So I used my toughest tough-love approach. Why? Ego?

        No, because it was what was required to help the person.

        If someone has been doing this for 6 years and barely earnt anything, you might as well make them feel quite bad about it, while also giving them the nudge in the right direction. The only thing that will get that person out of the habit of failing is to feel humiliated and angry with themselves.

        Otherwise they will stay in denial.

        And the OP came to the forum with the facts, but was trying to transfer the blame onto others, rather than themselves. They were fooling themselves by doing this.

        So I was as harsh as I'll ever be (when trying to help someone) in that thread. There was no point beating around the bush.

        Was it about my ego? No, why would it be? I don't sell anything here. I took time away from my business to try and help someone.

        This is the forum that helped me, and that's the kind of stuff that was delivered to me, and that I appreciate. Uncompromising, to the point advice. It's what's required in this fickle business.

        There are tons of forums that will treat you with kid gloves. We make winners here.

        So, was I out of order?

        There's nothing forcing me to help people here, and I have plenty to get on with. If necessary, I can leave others to fool themselves and it won't affect me one bit.

        I don't think my approach worked because the person seemed to be finding any excuse they could to justify what they claimed in the OP, and to avoid taking a long hard look at themselves.

        They weren't a newbie either - 6 years trying, and two years or so here in the forum. For all the newbies around dictating how things should be here, perhaps you should consider that many of us who have been here longer stayed here because we noticed valuable elements that were missing elsewhere - and perhaps we would like to preserve those traditions, regardless of others bleating that they don't have the required intestinal fortitude for a bit of straight talk.

        Life is short, so keep it real.
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        Roger Davis

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  • Profile picture of the author Troy_Phillips
    I have done some stupid stuff on here . Got raked over the coals, stood up . put my butt out , and learned from the process.

    Could it happen again .... would just about bet on it .

    If you, I , or anyone else (regardless of post count) gives information that is completely wrong , we need to be called down before we take someone down with us .

    And for the record ... I did say pretty please .
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  • Profile picture of the author Ken Leatherman
    Being an Old Geezer I was brought up in the "old school" way of respecting other people until they prove them self undeserving of the respect .

    But in turn, I was also taught to recognize incorrect information or just plain BS and in a situation where it can hurt someone, I should do what I can to rectify the situation if at all possible. That means providing accurate and straight forward information if I have it. However, if I didn't have the accurate information or know the answer:
    "Keep My Big Mouth Shut". (not so easy to do some of the time )

    The words (use common sense) were mentioned in an above post and frankly I can't agree more. As a matter of fact, if you will read the comments from John, Kay, Steve, Istvan, just to mention a few, there was an awful lot of common sense being used in their post.

    Disrespect to be just disrespectful "No". To be straight forward and call it what it is, "You Bet"

    Ken Leatherman


    The Old Geezer
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    • Profile picture of the author ExRat
      Hi ebizman87,

      If he's WRONG, you can say it out nicely so that he can understand what's wrong with his post and may correct it. But certainly NOT embarrass him publicly
      If you're too nice about things, the person concerned doesn't learn the lesson and nor does anyone else - so people carry on making the exact same mistakes, whatever they are.

      On a forum this can mean continually breaking the rules, continually giving bad information, continually starting unhelpful/unnecessary threads etc. This impacts everyone else.

      You don't seem to be considering that a lot of senior warriors are spending time uncovering liars and scammers for the benefit of everyone else by using tough questions and their experience.

      Quite often, some of the people doing dumb things appear to be those scammers at first - hence they get the same tough questions.
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      Roger Davis

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  • Profile picture of the author Istvan Horvath
    Despite the fact that some people want to make this thread a "newbies vs. veterans" discussion... it seems the better description would be

    ignorance vs. knowledge and experience

    Well, I say "ignorance" because I wouldn't dare to think about anybody that they come to the forum to deliberately post wrong advice...
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  • Profile picture of the author Steve Peters Benn
    Steven, Roger, Kay and John, Ken etc know what they are on about. WF has a very different feel to some other similar topic forums. It might not tolerate someone claiming to be rich and asking for handouts in the same thread, and you might find yourself put down for having been a member for two weeks and lecturing others on article marketing - but it is worth it.

    Put ego to the side and accept that there is almost always someone who knows more than you on a topic. Say something stupid and get a slap. What that means is a lot less misinformation for new people...

    It really is worth it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Lambert Klein
    ebizman87 is right.

    I have seen this many times. Of course it goes both ways.

    I remember some nasty people here when I first joined. I almost didn't return.

    However, that's how the world is. There're nice people, mean people and those in-between.

    Lambert
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    WordPress Domination: from Beginner to Ninja in 7 Days http://www.amazon.com/dp/B007LS0TLE

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  • Profile picture of the author lcard
    Hey there! I'm one of the noobs to this site, but thought I'd chime in anyway. A lot of good points have been made that I don't need to cover again. Suffice it to say, I appreciate the appeal for polite consideration. I also understand the stance that you've got to speak to people's level of understanding. I can only speak for myself when I say that I don't care what treatment I'm receiving from whom; it is up to me to present myself in the most positive light, and it is ultimately my image of myself that I effect whenever I act out in an aggressive, impolite manner no matter the stimuli.

    So, in my humble opinion: Here's to those who hold themselves to a higher level of interaction, and may the WF continue to prosper (and bring prosperity to all warriors).
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    • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
      There's a difference between "showing respect" and coddling.

      Look at kids' athletics. Showing respect is both teams meeting in the middle of the field, the losers congratulating the winners and the winners acknowledging the losers efforts. Coddling is not keeping score so no one could be labeled a 'loser' and damage their fragile self-image. To me, that is disrespecting the kids. After the game, both sides know who won and who lost and by what score.

      Calling out someone who gives bad information in a direct manner, and challenging the bad information, is showing respect for every other person reading a thread.

      Sometimes I can be a bit on the blunt side, but I won't deliberately disrespect someone because of their join date or post count. On the other hand, sometimes a poster earns the disrespect and contempt they are shown - again, without reference to join date or post count.

      There's a difference between being a newbie and an idiot. Ignorance can be cured. Stupidity is forever.
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      • Profile picture of the author Istvan Horvath
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post

        There's a difference between being a newbie and an idiot. Ignorance can be cured. Stupidity is forever.
        Amen to that
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      • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
        Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe View Post


        There's a difference between being a newbie and an idiot. Ignorance can be cured. Stupidity is forever.
        Now I just have to figure out which one is me.
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        • Profile picture of the author Rod Cortez
          Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim View Post

          Now I just have to figure out which one is me.
          Weeeelllllllllllll.........................
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          "Your personal philosophy is the greatest determining factor in how your life works out."
          - Jim Rohn
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  • Profile picture of the author Allen Graves
    Here's yet another angle on things...

    I read the thread that promted this one.

    And I ain't gonna touch it with a 10 foot pole. Nor would dozens of others who would normally be participating in an article marketing thread. No doubt why.

    Respect is an earned thing - but I hear in some of these responses that people believe earned respect comes from longevity, experience and a bunch of fancy words.

    Bull crap.

    A huge part of earning respect comes from creating win-win situations and doing it with a level head and a bit of kindness and understanding (among other things). If only everyone could understand that!

    I see rudeness and bashing.

    I see people bestowing respect upon themselves until it sticks.

    I see fake it till you make it.

    I see attention whoring, self-promotion, and egos so big you can't tell who the real person is.

    And the whole while, the lack of integrity I see in some of the people that have all of this "respect" is frightening indeed. But I have kept my mouth shut and I will continue to do so - except this post, of course.

    Of course, this is all just my opinion and is not aimed at anyone specifically (unless the shoe fits - LOL).

    Allen
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    Every day I check the obituaries. If I don't see my name there, then I know it's going to be a good day!
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    • Profile picture of the author ebizman87
      Originally Posted by Allen Graves View Post

      Here's yet another angle on things...

      I read the thread that promted this one.

      And I ain't gonna touch it with a 10 foot pole. Nor would dozens of others who would normally be participating in an article marketing thread. No doubt why.

      Respect is an earned thing - but I hear in some of these responses that people believe earned respect comes from longevity, experience and a bunch of fancy words.

      Bull crap.

      A huge part of earning respect comes from creating win-win situations and doing it with a level head and a bit of kindness and understanding (among other things). If only everyone could understand that!

      I see rudeness and bashing.

      I see people bestowing respect upon themselves until it sticks.

      I see fake it till you make it.

      I see attention whoring, self-promotion, and egos so big you can't tell who the real person is.

      And the whole while, the lack of integrity I see in some of the people that have all of this "respect" is frightening indeed. But I have kept my mouth shut and I will continue to do so - except this post, of course.

      Of course, this is all just my opinion and is not aimed at anyone specifically (unless the shoe fits - LOL).

      Allen
      You explained well here in plain ENGLISH without dragging much and straight to the point.

      Did I ever told you that you're 1 smart dude?
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