Have skills to offer value as consultant but need direction

by kevd10
24 replies
So I have been thinking for a long time about how to become successful. I currently work in sales for a ftse 100 software company (business to business). I have good knowledge of online marketing, sales techniques, Facebook ads etc.

I am looking to start a consulting business in order to help businesses get more customers/increase profits.

My question is not about generating leads (if I could not do that, I should not be starting a business like this), but more so how to package up and deliver the actual service. Things such as how to commence from the minute the lead signs on the dotted line.

I have seen a certain guy on Facebook offering a course on this kind of thing but is charging 2k and his reviews are less than favourable.

I hope this makes sense and would appreciate any advice.
#consultant #direction #offer #skills
  • Profile picture of the author Rodney Yarde
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  • Profile picture of the author kevd10
    Nobody have any input on this at all?
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  • Profile picture of the author umc
    Most of the experienced posters have left this forum as it's in a freefall. Sorry man, maybe do a search if that's working and see what you can dig up. I've bought some wsos before that had some framework in them. Maybe I can dig one up and share some nuggets, but I'll have to charge you a consultation fee, lol. Just kidding, but I may have something around.
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  • Profile picture of the author DABK
    Business growth consulting is broad, vague.

    Well, what (exactly) would your consulting entail? And, will you be doing any of the work that needs to be done to accomplish what your consulting suggests?
    Who you're targeting matters too.

    Originally Posted by kevd10 View Post

    So I have been thinking for a long time about how to become successful. I currently work in sales for a ftse 100 software company (business to business). I have good knowledge of online marketing, sales techniques, Facebook ads etc.

    I am looking to start a consulting business in order to help businesses get more customers/increase profits.

    My question is not about generating leads (if I could not do that, I should not be starting a business like this), but more so how to package up and deliver the actual service. Things such as how to commence from the minute the lead signs on the dotted line.

    I have seen a certain guy on Facebook offering a course on this kind of thing but is charging 2k and his reviews are less than favourable.

    I hope this makes sense and would appreciate any advice.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    I would recommend that you


    A: Take note of what it is that you can offer the end customer. Clearly define to yourself what it is that you can offer, and place an intrinsic value on it..

    B: Create a presentation and pricing structure for your products, or services.

    C:
    Test a few of the facebook ads and different things that you are familiar with, and get your presentation down to a predictable science... (Maybe you could do that within 2 weeks time, and have generated thousands of numbers from which to have made your distinctions.)

    D: Once you have created a successful formula, "Write the vision down, and make it clear, so that he who reads it may run with it".

    E: Take that written formula... and train others . Give them an e-book, perhaps, or training manual, , along with an opportunity to create prosperity for themselves by representing your products or services, and by utilizing your proven scientific formula for success..

    In essence... Create "success", and then "duplicate" it with others, so that you can enjoy prosperity, and so that they can as well.


    Along with prosperity, you also get to know that your idea contributed to other's prosperity and personal growth.


    Win / Win. It's perfect, and symbiotic.
    If you can prove, as an average person , through consistent results, that your science will create prosperity for an "average" person... then THOUSANDS of average people will happily create prosperity for you.


    So, do that. Create that formula!


    Make that end into your personal burning passion, for a short time...


    Accomplish it, and the world is your oyster!


    - John Durham
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  • Profile picture of the author Ron Herman
    Here's *my* expert opinion. Don't do any of the above. Creating a "pricing structure for your products, or services" boxes you (and your prospect) into a set price mentality.

    I also don't recommend writing your process down for others. I did very well my first year, nearly 2 mil. and the biggest mistake I made was hiring salespeople. At one point I had 15 employees in 3000 square feet of office space. It was a waste of time, a boost in aggravation and moving parts, and it cost a huge chunk of profit unnecessarily.

    I had the price structure for a while. That killed me. I had an hourly model too. That killed me. I learned to do a profit projection fee basing system that made me more money and a happier guy.

    What I learned was how NOT to be a commodity seller. I learned how to charge extremely high fees to actually "consult" with clients.

    I learned how to condition the absolute compliance of clients and have them respect me and my limits of availability and hold every word of advice I gave them as the gospel.

    I learned how to direct the outsourcing of any technical work and remove myself from any potential blame for their shortcomings if any.

    The result was that I learned how to make obscene money for talking to clients, consulting with them in the truest sense of the term.
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    • Profile picture of the author animal44
      Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

      I learned to do a profit projection fee basing system that made me more money and a happier guy.
      Question: How do you do a profit projection. Who's figures do you use...?
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  • Profile picture of the author animal44
    So how did the kitchen selling go...?
    How did the window selling go...?
    Where is your great success that you can pass on your skills to others...?
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    • Profile picture of the author kevd10
      It went well actually, thanks for your concern. But still working for somebody else. Is that ok with you?

      If you don't want to say anything constructive why waste any of your time? Do you really have enough spare time on your hands to come in here and flame me?

      Way to go.
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    • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
      Originally Posted by kevd10 View Post

      But my skills in marketing don't really determine and level of success because there is more to business than marketing. It is simply one aspect of it (albeit an important one).
      Without Marketing - You Don't Have a Business.

      Anybody who has ever created a successful business understands this. How is it that you don't?

      You don't understand that marketing, which includes sales and selling, is the most critical component of operating a business,, yet you want to be a business marketing consultant??


      But yes I understand what you are saying. Maybe I will need to get some clie nts under my belt and use them as success stories after implementing what I have told them (not sure how though, maybe have to do it for free at first).
      Did you give away the windows and kitchens and software that you were selling? Seems like You didn't learn much about the sales process from your sales jobs.

      Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

      So how did the kitchen selling go...?
      How did the window selling go...?
      Where is your great success that you can pass on your skills to others...?
      These are legitimate questions.
      As your posting history shows, you've had a number of sales jobs, over a short period of time.
      You've also come to this forum seeking help and advice for them. You were given some excellent advice. Doesn't seem like you followed it, though.

      Based on what you've stated here, I don't think the forum can offer much help.

      Ron
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      • Profile picture of the author kevd10
        I wish I had the energy and time to put you in your place, but I really don't. Good that you have so much spare to devote towards flaming me tho.
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  • Profile picture of the author animal44
    Is that how you'll react when a business owner asks "why should I listen to you?"

    Edit: My comment wasn't intended as a flame...
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    • Profile picture of the author kevd10
      Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

      Is that how you'll react when a business owner asks "why should I listen to you?"

      Edit: My comment wasn't intended as a flame...
      But my skills in marketing don't really determine and level of success because there is more to business than marketing. It is simply one aspect of it (albeit an important one).

      But yes I understand what you are saying. Maybe I will need to get some clients under my belt and use them as success stories after implementing what I have told them (not sure how though, maybe have to do it for free at first).
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    • Profile picture of the author Regional Warrior
      [QUOTE=animal44;10911487]Is that how you'll react when a business owner asks "why should I listen to you?"

      Edit: My comment wasn't intended as a flame...[/QUOTE

      REALLY!! could have fooled you but I guess the pic of the Ass makes up for it
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      • Profile picture of the author animal44
        [quote=Regional Warrior;10931865]
        Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

        Is that how you'll react when a business owner asks "why should I listen to you?"

        Edit: My comment wasn't intended as a flame...[/QUOTE

        REALLY!! could have fooled you but I guess the pic of the Ass makes up for it
        You admiring my Ass then...? Stop it! Reserved solely for the wimmin...!
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  • Profile picture of the author jimbo13
    Well let's just assume you can do some form of lead generation.

    I would suggest that you approach your old employers eg The Window Company or Kitchen company and propose a trial for one of them.

    You know them and their requirements for a decent sit and they know you and you presumably made them money already via sales.

    Many windows, conservatory or kitchen companies have turned into Home Improvement Companies now as to do one thing is no longer cost effective. If you can generate leads for them they will snap your arm off.

    So if you can be even moderately successful for one then you have a template with which to use on other companies in the industry.

    What method you wish to use is up to you. Personally I like anything that doesn't involve a computer

    You can do this without giving up your current sales job. Is it at Sage by any chance? FTSE 100 software company in the North East were your previous posts say you live.

    Dan
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    • Profile picture of the author savidge4
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      So, do that. Create that formula!
      Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

      Here's *my* expert opinion. Don't do any of the above.
      Originally Posted by jimbo13 View Post

      So if you can be even moderately successful for one then you have a template with which to use on other companies in the industry.
      When I read Johns response I totally saw where he was coming from ( Or I believe I understand ) Ron then replied.... I get what he is saying.. but I think there is issue in following his advice... He tried this and tried that and then came up with this. To do as Ron is suggesting would be removing the process to making YOU a better business person.

      ( Quick disclaimer... Ron I am not picking on you here.. just simply stating fact )

      The overall reality with what Ron does say.. well it its the complete 180 if you look at his signature. He does have a formula, and he is selling it for the low low price of $27.00

      There is some middle ground in all of this. I actually like the approach that jimbo presents... go with what you know to start. get your teeth into it, gain some experience ( that process Ron is wanting you to skip ) and see where it goes from there.

      Best of luck
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      Success is an ACT not an idea
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      • Profile picture of the author Ron Herman
        Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

        The overall reality with what Ron does say.. well it its the complete 180 if you look at his signature. He does have a formula, and he is selling it for the low low price of $27.00
        Yeah, that's old, like 2010. Don't buy it, as it is a great deal out of date (BTW, it was in front of $500 and $1200 upsells with a 24% conversion rate). I learned a lot since then. I did the 80/20 to every aspect of my business. I just never got around to changing my sig line. I don't waste a lot of time on forums including this one. In fact, I really don't remember how I found this thread in the first place.

        BTW savidge4, I don't feel like you were picking on me. I'm not that thin-skinned. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. Mine just happens to be based on my own experience and success in the field. I made a lot of mistakes and learned to hone my skills from them.

        The most important tips I could provide, the ones that ramped up my sales further than I really wanted, or ever envisioned, are but a few:
        • Attract, rather than chase prospects
        • Make them qualify themselves to YOU, rather than the reverse
        • Ask questions designed to get them to "sell themselves" rather than trying to convince
        • Determine a profit projection, by using their current yearly revenue/profit vs. what you believe you can increase their revenue. (if their marketing is nearly non-existent you will likely double or even triple their profits)
        • Offer a flat fee that's much more palatable than the higher 15% to 30% (or whatever) of the projected revenue "lift" would probably look like

        I hope that's all clear. Oh yeah, the $2k product? Nah...

        Also note: Re: looking for advice on forums. Lurkers and trolls love forums where they can hide behind screen names without ever revealing their real identities. Some of the advice might be good, some may be harmful. A good many of the forum trolls are there because they have a lot of idle time on their hands and get off on flaming and trying to discredit real people making real money. Their primary position is devil's advocate or agent provocateur. Consider the source and govern yourself accordingly.
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        "Pros are not born, they are created. Every successful person
        I know has at least one coach or mentor who has guided their
        journey from amateur dabbler to expert-level pro..." ~ Ron Herman

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        • Profile picture of the author animal44
          Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

          Determine a profit projection, by using their current yearly revenue/profit vs. what you believe you can increase their revenue. (if their marketing is nearly non-existent you will likely double or even triple their profits)
          An Alan Weiss follower
          Problem is that if you really know what you're doing the quote is potentially going to be very high. Which will be rejected. So you give a lower quote and end up making someone else rich at your expense...
          Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

          Offer a flat fee that's much more palatable than the higher 15% to 30% (or whatever) of the projected revenue "lift" would probably look like
          Interesting comment. I've found the opposite. I charge a retainer plus percentage. I've found people like that because their risk is low and they don't expect to be cutting huge cheques...
          Do some people dislike paying the resulting sums? Sure, however most people are honest and will abide by the agreement. And when they realise just how much extra profit they're making without any extra work, they tend to be a bit happier. Every is happy.
          Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

          Also note: Re: looking for advice on forums. Lurkers and trolls love forums where they can hide behind screen names without ever revealing their real identities. Some of the advice might be good, some may be harmful. A good many of the forum trolls are there because they have a lot of idle time on their hands and get off on flaming and trying to discredit real people making real money. Their primary position is devil's advocate or agent provocateur. Consider the source and govern yourself accordingly.
          Simple answer is ask questions and test everything. Never buy a $7 WSO
          I choose to be anonymous. I have nothing the sell And I don't want to be famous, nor do I want the attention of certain people.
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          • Profile picture of the author Ron Herman
            Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

            An Alan Weiss follower
            Problem is that if you really know what you're doing the quote is potentially going to be very high. Which will be rejected. So you give a lower quote and end up making someone else rich at your expense...
            Actually, no, I use the projection strictly for contrasting. Alan who? Just kidding. I know who he is but I only read a bit of one book and found it rambling and boring so I never finished it. The Trusted Advisor by David H. Maister and Charles H. Green is definitely worth reading, though. Also, if you haven't bought any consulting materials by Dan Kennedy or Richard Johnson I would recommend those over some Johnny-come-lately with bad reviews.

            You can find used and/or discounted coaching and consulting courses on eBay. I snatched up a horde of goodies by Jay Abraham there, and a printed manual by David Frey who I have had personal contact with on a business level, and found him to be one of the most honest and open gentlemen in the industry.

            Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

            Interesting comment. I've found the opposite. I charge a retainer plus percentage. I've found people like that because their risk is low and they don't expect to be cutting huge cheques...
            Tried that too. It's how I came up with the flat annual fee paid upfront idea. When a profit projection shows that they would end up paying $350,000 by the year's end, on top of my monthly retainer; and I propose, that, since they are at square one with their marketing paying $350k would make them resentful of me and unhappy; and that in their case I would propose a fee of less than 1/3 of that *if* they pay it upfront now, they jump at the no-brainer.

            Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

            Do some people dislike paying the resulting sums? Sure, however most people are honest and will abide by the agreement. And when they realise just how much extra profit they're making without any extra work, they tend to be a bit happier. Every is happy.
            I just found them to be happier and more malleable and compliant when I did it my way. And, for me, that's the ultimate goal, quiet, appreciative, compliant clients who pay high fees and take every word I say as the gospel; clients who appreciate that my time is precious and I am not available at their beck and call.

            Originally Posted by animal44 View Post

            Simple answer is ask questions and test everything. Never buy a $7 WSO I choose to be anonymous. I have nothing the sell And I don't want to be famous, nor do I want the attention of certain people.
            Personally, I have found golden nuggets in some $7 WSOs that were much better than, for example, the $2000 program I reviewed for a coaching client that, if followed, would likely be more harmful than helpful. Maybe that's the one you were looking at kevd10.

            Most WSOs have a refund policy. If they're garbage, or if you don't like them for one reason or another you can get a refund. The $2000 program I referenced had an ambiguous conditional guarantee that was impossible to adhere to without business suicide by following their stipulations.

            Check eBay, treasures await you there... for pennies:

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            "Pros are not born, they are created. Every successful person
            I know has at least one coach or mentor who has guided their
            journey from amateur dabbler to expert-level pro..." ~ Ron Herman

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            • Profile picture of the author kevd10
              Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

              Actually, no, I use the projection strictly for contrasting. Alan who? Just kidding. I know who he is but I only read a bit of one book and found it rambling and boring so I never finished it. The Trusted Advisor by David H. Maister and Charles H. Green is definitely worth reading, though. Also, if you haven't bought any consulting materials by Dan Kennedy or Richard Johnson I would recommend those over some Johnny-come-lately with bad reviews.

              You can find used and/or discounted coaching and consulting courses on eBay. I snatched up a horde of goodies by Jay Abraham there, and a printed manual by David Frey who I have had personal contact with on a business level, and found him to be one of the most honest and open gentlemen in the industry.



              Tried that too. It's how I came up with the flat annual fee paid upfront idea. When a profit projection shows that they would end up paying $350,000 by the year's end, on top of my monthly retainer; and I propose, that, since they are at square one with their marketing paying $350k would make them resentful of me and unhappy; and that in their case I would propose a fee of less than 1/3 of that *if* they pay it upfront now, they jump at the no-brainer.



              I just found them to be happier and more malleable and compliant when I did it my way. And, for me, that's the ultimate goal, quiet, appreciative, compliant clients who pay high fees and take every word I say as the gospel; clients who appreciate that my time is precious and I am not available at their beck and call.



              Personally, I have found golden nuggets in some $7 WSOs that were much better than, for example, the $2000 program I reviewed for a coaching client that, if followed, would likely be more harmful than helpful. Maybe that's the one you were looking at kevd10.

              Most WSOs have a refund policy. If they're garbage, or if you don't like them for one reason or another you can get a refund. The $2000 program I referenced had an ambiguous conditional guarantee that was impossible to adhere to without business suicide by following their stipulations.

              Check eBay, treasures await you there... for pennies:


              Great post! Thanks! The course I was looking at was by Sam Ovens. $2000 and by what I have heard it is re-hashed info that can be found in most books.

              I did purchase Eric Louviers Mentoring Blueprint but less than impressed. It was $97 but he claims it is normally $997. If I had paid $997 for it I would be spitting feathers.

              Can't seem to find the David Frey book anywhere online. Even eBay.
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              • Profile picture of the author Ron Herman
                Originally Posted by kevd10 View Post

                Great post! Thanks! The course I was looking at was by Sam Ovens. $2000 and by what I have heard it is re-hashed info that can be found in most books.

                I did purchase Eric Louviers Mentoring Blueprint but less than impressed. It was $97 but he claims it is normally $997. If I had paid $997 for it I would be spitting feathers.

                Can't seem to find the David Frey book anywhere online. Even eBay.
                Yeah, it's a rare bird and it's old. Maybe add David in Facebook and message him about it. He may still have a copy of it laying around. Most of the stuff that will truly help you get good at consulting is timeless anyway. You'll need to "haunt" ebay for stuff that you may want. You'll find some of this stuff listed for $500 by one seller and $25 by another for the same exact item.

                I also found a box full of Martin Howey's forms and such on eBay some time back. It was a huge pile of stuff. I sifted through and pulled out some real gems. He had a fudged order once and sold a truckload of those boxes of consulting forms. He showed a photo of his driveway full of boxes, lol... Now the only way you can get the forms is by going to his live training. It used to be $20k but I know he went up on the fee.

                You can set a search on eBay that will notify you when your search terms match newly listed items. And I knew which $2k program you were talking about, and yes, it's not only rehash, it contains a lot of just plain bad advice. Some of the bad advice is regarding selling. Real amateur flubs. You would be better off just winging it than to follow some of the obtuse blunders he suggests. I have seen SO much bad sales advice that I am working on a new product now. I will also relaunch my Offline Allstars group coaching again soon too.

                I will tell you one thing that will help you. If your only focus is on new tech, seo/internet/mobile/social stuff you're just making busy work for yourself. Most entrepreneurs are good at what they do, but they lack in basics, like systems. Most of them don't know how to handle phone calls. There's no system for it. No set system for how to handle prospects coming through their door. The don't maximize their LCV. They often have no upsells, cross-sells, customer loyalty program, referral or coreg/JV programs. There's a world of stuff they don't know jack about; most of which has nothing to do with Google.
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            • Profile picture of the author eccj
              Originally Posted by Ron Herman View Post

              Tried that too. It's how I came up with the flat annual fee paid upfront idea. When a profit projection shows that they would end up paying $350,000 by the year's end, on top of my monthly retainer; and I propose, that, since they are at square one with their marketing paying $350k would make them resentful of me and unhappy; and that in their case I would propose a fee of less than 1/3 of that *if* they pay it upfront now, they jump at the no-brainer.



              I just found them to be happier and more malleable and compliant when I did it my way. And, for me, that's the ultimate goal, quiet, appreciative, compliant clients who pay high fees and take every word I say as the gospel; clients who appreciate that my time is precious and I am not available at their beck and call.
              ]
              Are you consulting or are you creating and managing new income streams?

              I've hear Dan Kennedy say on one of his programs that he does it your way but he was just consulting And I've heard Jay Abraham say he does it the opposite because he wants to create income streams and not consult.
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              • Profile picture of the author Ron Herman
                Originally Posted by eccj View Post

                Are you consulting or are you creating and managing new income streams?

                I've hear Dan Kennedy say on one of his programs that he does it your way but he was just consulting And I've heard Jay Abraham say he does it the opposite because he wants to create income streams and not consult.
                You kind of answered your own question. I am more of the Dan Kennedy flavor. Why? First of all, Jay deals with large corporations where the decisions are made by committee. And, even though I train people to do corporate sales, I personally hate it.

                Corporate Recharge - Our Trainers

                I only want to deal with a single decision maker (or possibly partners) with a high-income, high LCV business and the potential for several times profits increase.

                I do NOT want to become an auditor, pseudo-partner, accountant, bill-collector, or anything else that complicates my life and/or business model. If they can't pay a year's worth of fees in advance, I set them up on automated billing with my merchant account.

                Between Jay's and Dan's (or my way which varies a tad from Dan's) methods, there is no right or wrong; it's a matter of choice. For most guys, my way is easier, more rewarding, and fun. I like fun.
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  • Profile picture of the author Zodiax
    Pick up the phone and dial!

    But do all that detailed planning and pricing first though!
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